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  1. #1
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    I9 vs dt 350????

    I am picking wheels for my next bike and am trying to decide if I9 hubs are worth an extra $200CDN over the 350. I do LOVE the I9 buzzzzz, but love reliability more.

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    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  2. #2
    Oh, So Interesting!
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    I'd consider Project 321... very quiet, very low drag, quick engagement.

  3. #3
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    I9 vs dt 350????

    I have the I9ís on my Switchblade and the DT with a 54T conversion on my Gravel bike. I like both hubs as much as the other, Iíd say the I9ís engage maybe a little bit more quickly, the DTís are definitely quieter but they also look awesome.

    I have Hope Pro 4ís on my Waltworksí wheelsets and theyíre nowhere near as quick to engage but theyíll last forever.

  4. #4
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    I'm sort of a DT fanboy, have 4 sets of wheels all 350's, I also have a set of I9's that came on my Pivot. Not sure I can tell much of a difference with engagement. I9's are sure blingy and buzzy but I like the fact when I service the free hub on the DT's that I'm not concerned with the 6 little pawls & springs rolling around on the floor, lol, DT's are simplistic and durable.

  5. #5
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    I will add that with the DTís you get that whole Swiss precision thing, they are a work of art and I agree, they are simple to service with no pawls to lose which is a very good thing.

  6. #6
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    I have a set of I9s and DT1501 (240). I like everything about the I9, but am wondering how I will feel 5+ years from now. With the wheel company these are my only 2 real options.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  7. #7
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    I have DT 350's, I love them like everyone. The new shimano XTR got me thinking a silent hub would be cool. I'm not getting new wheels anytime soon though.

  8. #8
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    DT. Simple, reliable, and just noisy enough.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    I have a set of I9s and DT1501 (240). I like everything about the I9, but am wondering how I will feel 5+ years from now. With the wheel company these are my only 2 real options.

    I'm a DT guy my own bikes, but I build lots of I9 too. Honestly, what a great conundrum to have.

  10. #10
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    another vote for DT. have 240's or 350's on all my bikes and never a lick of problems. DT is the best.

  11. #11
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    I think people got a little too bonery about DT hubs lately. I would and did choose Hope's over 350s. I'd take Hadley's over 240s. I'd take white industries xmr/cld over all of those.

    DT's are alright, but so boring. It's not the only reliable hub anyway. It's not like buying another option sacrifices reliability or maintenance, most hubs are extremely easy to live with these days.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    I would and did choose Hope's over 350s.
    Currently have both in service with high mileage... i can't follow your logic. In every way they're different i prefer the DTs. What do you like about hope over 350s?
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
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  13. #13
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    These two brands are the only hubs that I currently own. Three sets of each (I think) unless I missed a set hiding somewhere. I really like the I9 engagement best and I quiet them some with a lube cocktail Dumond free hub oil and synthetic grease. Just loud enough.
    Function in disaster, finish in style.

  14. #14
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    There are some trade offs like color, weight and engagement, but I give the DT 350's the edge in durability.

  15. #15
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    Every time one of these hub threads pops up I can't help but wonder why, on Long Island, I build wheels with Hope and Bike Hub Store hubs. NO ONE ever asks for DT Swiss hubs.
    I've seen em apart and I think they're great. Easy to carry spare parts, no tools for emergency trailside repairs...
    Only thing that comes to mind is I build a lot of wheels for guys with families so I do a lot of alloy rims and BHS hubs. I get a little carbon here and there. I have one friend with I9 hubs on his bike.
    One of my riding buddies is very frugal and has Shimano M529s on two of his bikes. His next wheelset is at least getting BHS so he makes SOME noise when he coasts. We have some two way trails here and he's way too quiet.
    Hopes and DT cost the same too so it isn't a money thing.
    I like turtles

  16. #16
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    I see a trend moving toward the star ratchet or a variant thereof, even Shimano. Excellent design. Has my vote. I've always skipped I9 because "why?". White Ind are just as pretty but with better materials.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottzg View Post
    Currently have both in service with high mileage... i can't follow your logic. In every way they're different i prefer the DTs. What do you like about hope over 350s?
    They both work fine, but I get colors and more than double the engagement with hope for about the same price.

    They're both simple to service. Sure DT is easier, but it feels like splitting hairs at that point.

  18. #18
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    DT 350 for ease of maintenance, bearings, etc. Simple, dependable and they just work. No bling colors so if that's your deal...take a good look at White Industries hubs. They've added a higher engagement, not as easy to convert axle setups though. However, they are a quality hub and i'd go with them long before I9.

  19. #19
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    I've had 240s before and it was nice to be able to quickly service them...but, my Hope and Hadley hubs I've had since have been rock solid. So I can't really say that hub service is a driving factor in my purchase decision. I'd assume I9 would be similar. To me, the better engagement with I9 would be high on my purchase criteria as I really dislike pedal slop. For some it isn't an issue. That said, I'd be happy with either!

  20. #20
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    My only picks are I9 and DT 350. Hubs will be black, or maybe silver if I go I9. Not sure why I would want to quite them . Will decide this week so I can order them as the frame should be here in 4 weeks.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  21. #21
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    Santa Cruz Reserves?
    Do the math.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    My only picks are I9 and DT 350. Hubs will be black, or maybe silver if I go I9. Not sure why I would want to quiet them . Will decide this week so I can order them as the frame should be here in 4 weeks.
    LOL, quiet is a relative term.

  23. #23
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    "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Travis Bickle again."

    Keep telling them it's only between I9 and DT 350...maybe by the fifth time (in addition to the thread title) they will get it!

    Couple reasons I prefer I9 other than the engagement and rattlesnake buzz (eliminates need for a bell on bike!) is I can actually call someone on the phone in my region (So Cal) and get my question answered by a real person, real time. (Maybe that's the case with DT, I don't know.) I also like all their documentation for service...changing bearings, etc. And the variety of blingy colors is awesome.
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    They both work fine, but I get colors and more than double the engagement with hope for about the same price.

    They're both simple to service. Sure DT is easier, but it feels like splitting hairs at that point.
    Ah that makes sense, and i'd agree except i've cracked the hope freehub and popped a bearing while the DT has seen nothing more than very occasional servicing.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
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  25. #25
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    As an expert. 350's are the best hubs out there money wise.

    If you are on a budget 240's, better machining and bearing units. Hadleys or Chris King (obvious) are even better as someone pointed out.

    Hope's and I9 are hubs built with much lower sealing features and both receive Enduro cheap bearings.

    Honestly, if you look for something new, low engagement (60 POE), and great construction (only hub I know with real seals) try hubs from an ukrainian brand called Trailmech. I can help if you wish in Europe.

    Cheers.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattMay View Post

    Keep telling them it's only between I9 and DT 350...maybe by the fifth time (in addition to the thread title) they will get it!
    Once Scylence is released, it will be the only hub worth buying. Unless you want noise. Or those sram cassettes.

  27. #27
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    I've had issues putting nicks and chips in the outer race on 350's on my road bike. I'm a big dude and guess that combined with the small bearing doesn't work in my favor. I've never run them on an mtb.

    I9's have been the most reliable hub I've ever run for mtb. I'd also say it's the most postive (not to be interchanged with fastest) engaging hub I've ever felt. I quite like that. My latest set are a tad quieter than previous sets.
    It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

  28. #28
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    I9 vs dt 350????

    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    I have a set of I9s and DT1501 (240). I like everything about the I9, but am wondering how I will feel 5+ years from now. With the wheel company these are my only 2 real options.
    I'm three years into my Torch hubs and still love them. I've only had to degrease the pawls on the rear hub once; no issues with the front. Bearings are still rockin' like new.
    Last edited by Wacha Wacha Wacha; 07-12-2018 at 02:29 AM.

  29. #29
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    My Hugi/DT rear hub is 20+ years old and going strong, just rode it home a couple hours ago. Forged hub shell FTW. 2 out 2 Chris King hubs I have of same vintage, exploded hub flanges.

  30. #30
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    You can't go wrong with either choice.

    I would be happy so address any concerns with reliability you could have. I touch pretty much every part that goes into the hubs, every part, every pawl, all of them. I have put a lot of work into eliminating the problems of the past. If you ever have any questions or concerns please don't hesitate to hit me up any time at Ricky@industrynine.com. I'm always happy to talk about bikes!!

  31. #31
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    Have had both (currently own 3 - i9 wheelsets), if in the budget i9, if on a budget cant beat reliability of a 350.

    I will say i9 cutomer service is amazing the one time I had an issue. That one case bought them a long time customer. If I buy or build a bike I plan to keep for the long haul I go i9s.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by shaquille_o'wheel View Post
    You can't go wrong with either choice.

    I would be happy so address any concerns with reliability you could have. I touch pretty much every part that goes into the hubs, every part, every pawl, all of them. I have put a lot of work into eliminating the problems of the past. If you ever have any questions or concerns please don't hesitate to hit me up any time at Ricky@industrynine.com. I'm always happy to talk about bikes!!
    Perfect example of excellent I9 service!
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  33. #33
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    I have 350s on my gravel bike and they are just fine. I have I9s on my mountain bike and I freakin' love them. The color, the sound, the precision, the USA-made factor.

    I have slight bike OCD, and the reverse labels on the disc 350s drive me up the wall. Front hub has a different label orientation than the rear hub. Not the case on their non-disc hubs. Easily fixed with a sticker of course, and it's a non-issue, but for some reason it irks me.
    Jason
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    I'd take white industries xmr/cld over all of those.
    yep. They don't get enough attention and praise around here.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAGI410 View Post
    I have 350s on my gravel bike and they are just fine. I have I9s on my mountain bike and I freakin' love them. The color, the sound, the precision, the USA-made factor.

    I have slight bike OCD, and the reverse labels on the disc 350s drive me up the wall. Front hub has a different label orientation than the rear hub. Not the case on their non-disc hubs. Easily fixed with a sticker of course, and it's a non-issue, but for some reason it irks me.
    How funny, as I see it the exact opposite as you. I like the 350's logo orientation as when I approach the bike from the front or the rear, the logo reads correctly...... I always thought Hope and others had theirs wrong.

  36. #36
    BOOM goes the dynamite!
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    So what are the choices again?

    My vote - DT.

    Comes down to cost, looks, noise. They're both good (but you already knew that) so there's no wrong choice here.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by davec113 View Post
    I'd consider Project 321... very quiet, very low drag, quick engagement.
    And you can put playing cards on the spokes to get the I9 buzz. I love my I9's, but really like my 350's as well. Hard to go wrong with either.

  38. #38
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    Hereís another I9 CS story for ya. Back in the very early days of I9 I had a set when there was adjustable pre-load on the bearings. Well I screwed up on the rear wheel, overloaded the non-drive side bearing with a DT RWS thru bolt and roached the bearing. I called I9 and told them what I had done and they said NP weíll send you a new set of bearings for that wheel, N/C. Customer for life!

    I currently have three sets of I9ís two sets of hubs on custom built wheel-sets one 28h with Derby 30 rims and one 32h set with Velocity Dually rims. I also have a set of their Pillar Carbon Trail wheels and theyíve all been flawless. Iíve had 6 sets of the factory built I9 wheels over the years going back to 2006 and as far as I know all of them are still going strong today.

    I also have a set of DT Hugiís on a custom 26Ē wheel set that are 25 years old and another set of DT 240 hubs on a custom wheel set. Both are still perfect. I also have a 14 YO set of Bontrager Race X Lite wheels on my road bike that are basically custom DT 240 hubs. These have also been a flawless set of wheels for me. Iíve bought rode and sold a few other sets of DT hubs/ wheels and no issues with any of them.

    Itís hard to find fault with either DT or I9ís products but I9 is definitely easier to access as far as customer service goes and they are very knowledgeable and accommodating. So kudos to I9! I personally give the nod to I9 and they are my favs.


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  39. #39
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    I've decided to go with the 350s.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  40. #40
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    What tooth star ratchet did you go with?
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by manitou2200 View Post
    What tooth star ratchet did you go with?
    Not sure, 36 vs 54?
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  42. #42
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    I've been on either I9s or Pro 4s for the last 3 years and the stock 18T 350s are such a revelation.... So freaking quiet. It has completely changed my visceral sensations when descending.

    Yea, half way through the 1st ride on the 18T I was sure I would be ordering the 36T the second I got home, but I pulled my big boy panties up and forced myself to stay with it, and now after 120ish miles, I don't give it a second thought.

    ....... and did I say the silence is amazing?

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    I am picking wheels for my next bike and am trying to decide if I9 hubs are worth an extra $200CDN over the 350. I do LOVE the I9 buzzzzz, but love reliability more.
    I've run several flavors of DT Swiss, but am currently running I9's. All have been perfectly reliable, so that's not really a factor. I love the higher points of engagement on the i9. But the springs are absurdly small. Before I service mine next time, I'll have a full set of springs on hand in case I lose one. DT's are stupidly easy to maintain, which is a HUGE plus. On the other hand, i9's are just cooler than DT's. Are they $200 cooler? That, I don't know.

  44. #44
    Gnar? I didn't see it...
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyIron View Post
    Are they $200 cooler? That, I don't know.
    What made you buy Ďem originally? Engagement sold me...


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  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Bone View Post
    I've been on either I9s or Pro 4s for the last 3 years and the stock 18T 350s are such a revelation.... So freaking quiet. It has completely changed my visceral sensations when descending.

    Yea, half way through the 1st ride on the 18T I was sure I would be ordering the 36T the second I got home, but I pulled my big boy panties up and forced myself to stay with it, and now after 120ish miles, I don't give it a second thought.

    ....... and did I say the silence is amazing?
    You and me both buddy!

    Been on mostly Hope hubs and then i9's. Decided to order some dt350s to rebuild some old rims to boost hubs and had the exact same realisation. Actually just took out my hardtail today for a spin and it's on Hope Pro4's and I'm already looking forward to going back to the silence of the DTs

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wacha Wacha Wacha View Post
    What made you buy Ďem originally? Engagement sold me...
    Engagement... and panache. My other bikes were running 350's and 240's. The only thing I don't like about the i9's is the microscopically small springs. Before I service them next time, I'll have a spare set of springs on hand. They are SO small!

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    Not sure, 36 vs 54?
    Iíve had/ have DTís with 18, 36 and 54. No issues with any of them. The 54t were on a set of Roval SL Fatties that are 350 hubs. Some say the 54t are not as durable as the 36t and that makes sense as the teeth are smaller.
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  48. #48
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    I keep some spare pawl springs on hand and a couple spare pawls as insurance. Itís a good idea to remove the cassette body slowly. I mentioned earlier that I quiet my I9ís with a mixture of Dumonde free hub oil and synthetic grease. It just tones down the sound a bit.
    Function in disaster, finish in style.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by manitou2200 View Post
    Iíve had/ have DTís with 18, 36 and 54. No issues with any of them. The 54t were on a set of Roval SL Fatties that are 350 hubs. Some say the 54t are not as durable as the 36t and that makes sense as the teeth are smaller.
    One design improvement I noticed with Scylence is they moved the ratchet ring inboard of the freehub and made it larger in diameter. This allows either more teeth or larger teeth (for the same number) compared to DT's system.

  50. #50
    Anytime. Anywhere.
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    I am hesitant about I9 now because I saw a 5 year old rear hub cracked badly. I know this can happen to almost anything, but I am cautious by nature.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  51. #51
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    Note how many people praise I-9 CS.

    Then note that DT Swiss CS is not mentioned...


    ...because you will likely never need it.


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  52. #52
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    Iíll never go I9 again. Great hubs, but the racket. I hate the 54T DTs too. My XOs sound better. 18T sound the best. Although high engagement is sweet, a skilled rider doesnít need it.
    DTs have great reliability. Freaking easy to maintain. Donít rule out XOs. I had wheel builders try to talk me out of them, but I have SuperBoost spacing so I had to give them a whirl. Easy to service, light, spin easy and 54 POE. Itís only been a year but so far, so good.
    I wish I could count on the new P321s being reliable. Ahh, the quiet.


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  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis Bickle View Post
    I am hesitant about I9 now because I saw a 5 year old rear hub cracked badly. I know this can happen to almost anything, but I am cautious by nature.
    Probably excessive tension. Sometimes less competent wheel builders don't correct their dishing errors the right way.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by D Bone View Post
    How funny, as I see it the exact opposite as you. I like the 350's logo orientation as when I approach the bike from the front or the rear, the logo reads correctly...... I always thought Hope and others had theirs wrong.
    Thatís a good perspective, now I can stop thinking about putting a new sticker on my DTís lol.

  55. #55
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    I9 vs dt 350????

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Note how many people praise I-9 CS.

    Then note that DT Swiss CS is not mentioned...


    ...because you will likely never need it.


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    I messed up the one bearing with the preload mistake and ordered extra springs and pawls for insurance, a couple end caps here and there for different axle standards but thatís the extent of CS needs for me after 12 years of I9 use. I order direct from I9 through my industry connection. Youíre not going to be able to get that kind of service from DT here in NA.

    Donít be so damned smug you come off like an elitist azz! I9 makes good shiz and does it in the US. Did you have some issues with I9 that youíre gonna whine about.

    The majority of this thread is praising both brands mentioned here. Some folks donít like the buzz of I9ís, me I like them. Back in the day when DT Hugiís were kind of new to the scene they were the noise makers with their 18t star ratchets. I still have a set of those hubs that have seen 3 or 4 sets of rims.


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  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrDon View Post
    Iíll never go I9 again. Great hubs, but the racket. I hate the 54T DTs too. My XOs sound better. 18T sound the best. Although high engagement is sweet, a skilled rider doesnít need it.
    DTs have great reliability. Freaking easy to maintain. Donít rule out XOs. I had wheel builders try to talk me out of them, but I have SuperBoost spacing so I had to give them a whirl. Easy to service, light, spin easy and 54 POE. Itís only been a year but so far, so good.
    I wish I could count on the new P321s being reliable. Ahh, the quiet.


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    You can still sneak up on other riders using I9 hubs but you need to be pedaling up on them. I like the noise when descending when overtaking other riders as they can hear you coming.


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  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by manitou2200 View Post
    I messed up the one bearing with the preload mistake and ordered extra springs and pawls for insurance, a couple end caps here and there for different axle standards but thatís the extent of CS needs for me after 12 years of I9 use. I order direct from I9 through my industry connection. Youíre not going to be able to get that kind of service from DT here in NA.

    Donít be so damned smug you come off like an elitist azz! I9 makes good shiz and does it in the US. Did you have some issues with I9 that youíre gonna whine about.

    The majority of this thread is praising both brands mentioned here. Some folks donít like the buzz of I9ís, me I like them. Back in the day when DT Hugiís were kind of new to the scene they were the noise makers with their 18t star ratchets. I still have a set of those hubs that have seen 3 or 4 sets of rims.


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    You can get anything you want from DT Swiss NA in Grand Junction, CO.

    Not sure why youíd think otherwise.



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  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    You can get anything you want from DT Swiss NA in Grand Junction, CO.

    Not sure why youíd think otherwise.



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    Iím sure youíre right in this. I kind of worded that wrong, Iíve always been able to get parts for my DTís. It just that I9 is or seems way more approachable or proactive as far as parts and service goes. All good stuff and happy to have them.


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  59. #59
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    I just can't take the noise of I9 hubs. The extra cost doesn't help either. If weight is a concern, go with centerlock 350 hubs. You'll save a bunch of weight for no extra money.

    DT's customer service has been stellar for me. But then again, it's only with questions regarding OEM wheels and I'm not asking for parts. Which also means that I have never needed parts. For what it's worth, I have 4 sets of 350's in my house.

    I made this up a while back. All boost hubs. CL is for centerlock.

    I9 vs dt 350????-img_4644.jpg

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by BXCc View Post
    I made this up a while back. All boost hubs. CL is for centerlock.

    Yes, CL hubs are a bit lighter. But then you have to either use a CL -> 6b adapter -- which adds back that weight -- or run a heavier CL rotor. Have you found options that allow you to keep that weight saved without adding back in rotor/adapter?

  61. #61
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    Only run a front brake?
    I like turtles

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    Yes, CL hubs are a bit lighter. But then you have to either use a CL -> 6b adapter -- which adds back that weight -- or run a heavier CL rotor. Have you found options that allow you to keep that weight saved without adding back in rotor/adapter?
    If I recall correctly, the weight between RT86 6 bolt and RT98 CL with lockring were within 10 grams or so. I measured when I went CL but I donít remember the exact weights.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    Yes, CL hubs are a bit lighter. But then you have to either use a CL -> 6b adapter -- which adds back that weight -- or run a heavier CL rotor. Have you found options that allow you to keep that weight saved without adding back in rotor/adapter?
    So I was a bit off in my numbers. I did some weighing of what I had on hand and this is what I came up with. All are 180mm rotors with required hardware.

    RT-86 6b = 144g
    RT-67 CL = 167g (non ice-tech)
    RT-98 CL = 130g

    I9 vs dt 350????-685a9dc2-1192-4d7c-a46b-95085102d392.jpg

  64. #64
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    i prefer DT350

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    My DT350 was prone to skipping when high load is applied (I'm 165 lbs btw). Start from race gate for example.
    The only solution I've found is to overstretch preload springs, which made skipping less common, but at a price of worse rolling resistance (freewheeling).

    Identical situation with 16t and 48t ratchets. No matter of lubrication type or quantity. Lubed strictly by manual or with improvisation.

    Also, ratchet upgrades are stupid expensive. Which is why my choise was 48t chinese upgrade.

    After two years bearings became stiff and in order to replace them you have to give it to bike workshop, since hub do require some (stupid expensive) proprietary tool and in no way you can change drive-side hub shell bearing overwise.

    Looks like engagement is each own's preference, but I find 16t painfully low for most applications.
    Somehow hub noise was also disgusting compared to regular pawl designs.

    For me this hub was a total disappointment and in the end my choise was Hope Pro4.
    And oh boy, I can't be happier now. Quick, crisp engagement. Bombproof reliability. No skipping, of course. Bearings spin like-new after two years.

    One year later I've bought Pro4 Trials for my 4x/pump hardtail. Best hub I've owned hands down.

    I9 might be better hubs, but mostly due to very high engagement. Still not sure if it's worth 2x price of Hope.

    Guys, I don't get this DT fanboyism, forgive me pls. Ratchets just don't work if you're putting some torque to pedals. My friend has same issue with chinese Colt hub, which in MY2018 has similar ratchet inside.

  66. #66
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    Based on what you state you want go Hadley!

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