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  1. #1
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    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for <$75/pair

    I found a dedicated hub factory which makes quality, premium hubs and is willing to sell aftermarket.

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-1.jpg

    There is remarkable attention to detail in the design. Notice the anti-bite on the HG driver:

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-2.jpg

    Each freehub has six pawls powered by robust leaf springs. I have a collective 2000 miles on 4 sets of hubs and have never had an issue or needed to perform maintenance once.

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-3b.jpg

    Axle ends are threaded to retain the end caps and keep everything tight. This is a major limitation with Koozer hubs (which are manufactured by ZTTO, not ECC-Tech):

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_1783.jpg

    The 72 points of engagement built into the hub shell are awesome:

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_1781.jpg

    The bearings used are nothing exceptional, but also no different in quality than stock Hope and DT 350 bearings. A full ceramic upgrade costs $120 for both hubs. Everything is sealed excellently:

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_1773.jpg

    I have them on all my bikes except my ultralight wheelset. The wheelset in this picture had 1300 miles on it, 200 of which was singletrack on a rigid CX bike, and when I took the driver off the pawls looked like new:

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-7.jpg

    I just built up this bike and am still loving the hubs and the superfast 72 POE engagement.

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_1637.jpg

    The factory behind this all is ECC-Tech. This is the hub listing (E-603 MTB – ECC-TECH) and my contact is Echo (echo@dgecc.com).

    More than a year ago I bought 20 pairs, used what I wanted, and gradually sold the rest off on eBay pretty much at cost. I had two repeat customers who were small wheel builders and were very impressed with the hubs as well.

    Now I'm out of hubs, and since I wanted more I asked Echo if I could get just a few pairs instead of 20 (the MOQ). I learned that they have significant OEM sales and were willing to sell off leftovers from production runs and stale inventory basically at cost (<$50/pair). Colors and options were limited, but freight (UPS) per pair was $20 and I got my hubs in 3 days! Customer service is incredible! I paid $65 for my last pair, including shipping. Drivers cost $15 each, QR and thru-axle caps can be added for $10. Custom anodizing MOQ is 20.

    I am completely impressed by the quality of these hubs, and will never buy aftermarket again.

    Weight for a pair is 433g, within 20g of DT 350s. These are non-boost, there are other options available.

    You may not be able to get a single pair, but you can ask and see what they say.

    I have no affiliation with the factory and was not paid to post this (for the haters out there). But I will take this opportunity to plug a $375 29er carbon wheelset and a $250 27.5+ Mulefut 50SL wheelset built to these hubs that need to go. I had extra rims that needed a home.

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_9862.jpg

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-2.jpg

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    There is remarkable attention to detail in the design. Notice the anti-bite on the HG driver:
    What anti-bite? What am I looking at? It looks like a machined aluminum spline?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  3. #3
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    Jayem, half of that spline is steel.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    (...)Click image for larger version. 

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    The 72 points of engagement built into the hub shell are awesome.(...)
    What do you mean by "built into the hub shell"?
    Are you telling us that the ratchet ring is machined directly into de aluminum shell?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schulze View Post
    Jayem, half of that spline is steel.
    Ive been staring at that photo for ten minutes trying to see what you and the OP are talking about. I cant tell what material the HG freehub is made of, but I just dont see any anti-bite inserts on the splines.

    As for the rest of the hub, the pawls, pawl retainer, seals, ratchet ring, and almost everything else look identical to the koozers. The only difference jumping out at me is the threaded endcaps. That's a great upgrade, but certainly not the only issue the koozers had. The koozers bearings were suspect at best. The axles were weak and flexy causing the freehub to deflect into the ratchet ring. The freehub body deformed at the pawl seats. My biggest concern is that blue plastic ring holding the pawls in place. Those are so brittle I'm surprised the camera flash didn't shatter it when you took the picture. There are so many similarities, I'm having a tough time believing these weren't both made next to each other at the same factory.

    How about these? Dead ringer for the koozer if I ever saw one.
    E-601 MTB – ECC-TECH

    That said, for the price, they may be a reasonable option. But I'd be concerned theyll suffer a similar fate to the koozers.

  6. #6
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    I believe he's referring to the ratchet ring having 32 teeth with offset pawl sets providing 72 POE. I don't think he means the ratchet ring is machined into the hub.
    Do the math.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schulze View Post
    Jayem, half of that spline is steel.
    Is it? Where did you get that information?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  8. #8
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    By squinting at the spline and seeing that it's two different hues, meaning two different materials, and by deduction one of them must be steel.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schulze View Post
    By squinting at the spline and seeing that it's two different hues, meaning two different materials, and by deduction one of them must be steel.
    Ummm, yeah. I'd be nice if they had a steel insert in there, but I see no evidence of this whatsoever. There are some hues due to reflection, but without any other information it seems this is what you want to see? On any other hub that has had inserts, it's been pretty easily discernible.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  10. #10
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    Their road hubs look interesting. Thinking about building a set of carbon clinchers for my road bike.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    I found a dedicated hub factory which makes quality, premium hubs and is willing to sell aftermarket.
    You found the same damn hubs that 100 other vendors sell. $75 retail... $40 wholesale... $15 manufacturer cost. Yeah, they'll be great.

    I apologize for attacking you. It's just humorous that everyone keeps trying to chase this dream of a decent $50 rear hub and they are always the same hub with very minor differences. (Note that I didn't say anything about front hubs, because they don't matter).

  12. #12
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    Soooooooo..... Novatec hubs.
    Bicycles dont have motors or batteries.

    Ebikes are not bicycles

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by 92gli View Post
    You found the same damn hubs that 100 other vendors sell. $75 retail... $40 wholesale... $15 manufacturer cost. Yeah, they'll be great.

    I apologize for attacking you. It's just humorous that everyone keeps trying to chase this dream of a decent $50 rear hub and they are always the same hub with very minor differences. (Note that I didn't say anything about front hubs, because they don't matter).
    I don't really understand why there isn't a good hub that costs <100$, but that's reality. Combine that with the fact that when a hub craps out they're a nuisance to swap out, and there's a good chance you'll have to buy ~100$ worth of spokes... i don't see any value in taking a risk with hubs. Especially when you can get a dt350 rear for 150$ that will last for decades.

    Pay a marginal upcharge up front and save money in the long run. The boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
    Mikhail Kalashnikov

  14. #14
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    So all I'm saying is that I have busted two Novatec hubs within ~500 miles and ~750 miles, and these held up to 1300 miles with no issues and no signs of going out.

    I also have DT 350s and really could care less which hub I'm riding. These hubs have even better engagement and are within 20g, so who cares.

    I can't see the anti-bite inserts on the splines in the pictures I posted, I'll have to take a better picture. They aren't super-obvious.

    The axles on these hubs are not flexy, they are quite a bit thicker than the Koozers.

    After studying the specs a bit more, I think ECC-Tech may actually make Koozers, ZTTO either bought out Koozer or owned it all along, and ZTTO now sells Koozer hubs on AliExpress, among other places. I may be wrong, but that's the impression I get just looking at AliExpress and Alibaba.

    The pawl mechanism is NOT like the Koozer hubs. Koozers used springs, these use leaf springs. Leaf springs are a lot more robust.

    No, the ratchet ring is obviously not machined into the shell, sorry if I gave that impression.

    Here's a magnetic version that they make. I don't have as many miles on this but it's really solid.

    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_6849.jpg

    Good aftermarket hubs should cost just $100. There are so many brands that build their own wheels and have their own branded hubs, all they're doing is hiring a factory like this to build their hubs to specs and throwing in their own bearings or seals or whatever. I hate buying a hub when I know they slapped a 60% markup on it between manufacturing and retail price.

    If these hubs crap out, I'd suspect the problem would be in the freehub. You can simply order another set for $50 and swap out the internals.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-img_1788.jpg  


  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    The pawl mechanism is NOT like the Koozer hubs. Koozers used springs, these use leaf springs. Leaf springs are a lot more robust.
    You speak with such conviction as if you are 1,000% positive that you know what you're talking about.

    Here is what a koozer freehub looks like:
    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-s-l640.jpg

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Here is what a koozer freehub looks like:
    Well you just taught me something!

    Still, a reinforced axle might help overcome issues that the Koozer's faced in terms of freehub flex and torsional stress on the pawls.

    Also, their magnetic pawl mechanism is very different, see the cut-out video in this listing:

    https://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...1e126c8cA3kO37

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    Still, a reinforced axle might help overcome issues that the Koozer's faced in terms of freehub flex and torsional stress on the pawls.
    Just for [civilized] argument's sake, how do you suppose the axles have been reinforced when both brand hubs use the same size bearings, and 12mm thru axles haven't gotten any smaller? Aside from the threaded endcaps, what leads you to believe the axles are any different at all from the koozers?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Just for [civilized] argument's sake, how do you suppose the axles have been reinforced when both brand hubs use the same size bearings, and 12mm thru axles haven't gotten any smaller? Aside from the threaded endcaps, what leads you to believe the axles are any different at all from the koozers?
    Different material? I'm just going based on what the factory told me. They were even willing to do a Ti axle for an extra $15 per hub (for 20 pairs).

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    Different material? I'm just going based on what the factory told me. They were even willing to do a Ti axle for an extra $15 per hub (for 20 pairs).
    Ahhh, direct communication. Well, if you happen to have a loose axle, I'd love to compare it to the old Koozer axles to see where the improvements have been made. As for the Ti option, thats downright awesome! I'd even be happy with a steel option, despite the weight. I wonder if these are available separately? If these hubs share many of the same specs with the koozers, it might be a way to breathe new life into forgotten hubs. It wont really fix the deformed freehub bodies, but theyre cheap enough as to be considered a wear item.

    Thanks for the info, and for keeping up your end of the argument.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    Ahhh, direct communication. Well, if you happen to have a loose axle, I'd love to compare it to the old Koozer axles to see where the improvements have been made. As for the Ti option, thats downright awesome! I'd even be happy with a steel option, despite the weight. I wonder if these are available separately? If these hubs share many of the same specs with the koozers, it might be a way to breathe new life into forgotten hubs. It wont really fix the deformed freehub bodies, but theyre cheap enough as to be considered a wear item.

    Thanks for the info, and for keeping up your end of the argument.
    Well hang on, I appreciate this criticism. My contact at the factory has been very willing to make a custom hub with all the improvements I'd want, as long as I proposed a reasonable and feasible checklist. There'd be an up-front cost to it, sure, but at the end of the day how cool would $70-80 hubs be that actually do rival the best players on the market?

    If you had a Koozer, what specific changes would you make?

    Rumor has it the Shimano Scylence mechanism isn't sooo patent-proof either...

  21. #21
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    If I had full reign over design starting with the koozer or similar?

    Steel or considerably thicker alloy axle.
    Oversize higher quality bearings.
    Snap ring pawl retainer.
    Larger pawls and leaf springs, both wider and taller.
    Stronger alloy free hub body.

    I'm sure I can come up with more after thinking about it for a bit. But that would address the bulk of the known issues. I know making a super light product sells more hubs, but I'd gladly add 50g to the read hub for bulletproof durability.

  22. #22
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    Since their ti axles are so cheap, I'd do a ti axle and dt style ratchet. You can only go so large on the bearings because of the freehub diameter.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuitsBoy View Post
    If I had full reign over design starting with the koozer or similar?

    Steel or considerably thicker alloy axle.
    Oversize higher quality bearings.
    Snap ring pawl retainer.
    Larger pawls and leaf springs, both wider and taller.
    Stronger alloy free hub body.

    I'm sure I can come up with more after thinking about it for a bit. But that would address the bulk of the known issues. I know making a super light product sells more hubs, but I'd gladly add 50g to the read hub for bulletproof durability.
    Definitely agree on the axle, better pawl retainer, larger pawls and leaf springs, and an alloy free hub body.

    I'm not sure about the larger bearings part of it. As Schulze points out you're limited by the freehub diameter, and this bearing size is standard. Bearing upgrades get hugely expensive, and these bearings haven't been problematic (to my knowledge). I'd almost advocate for going with smaller bearings like a DT Swiss 240. There are more commercially available choices in this smaller size anyway, including ceramic options.

  24. #24
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    By larger bearings, I mean mainly to accommodate a larger axle. Maybe something like a 6903 which would allow up to 17mm axle while only increasing the OD from 28 to 30mm, which should still easily fit within the hub shell. The freehub could use a 63803 deep groove bearing to fit a 17mm ID but keep the same 26mm OD with the same 7mm width (as opposed to the 5mm wide 6803). Take a look at how SRAM uses a half external bearing on the outside of their XD driver, rather than a smaller fully captive bearing. This allows them to use the absolute largest bearing as far outboard as possible for maximum stability.
    High-quality factory-direct hubs (ECC-Tech) for &lt;/pair-54ca3a873ed05.jpg

  25. #25
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    We were deforming the aluminum itself on the koozer freehubs. It's cheap garbage metal with poorly designed pawls that smash out the hub... At best.

    Others were stripping the ratchet ring straight out. I think everyone broke the blue "retainer". The axles flex so much the bearings fail.

    They were always ecc hubs. That's the same old garbage koozer a ton of us broke last year or so. They're not premium hubs. I'd actually say they're the worst of the worst. Bitex is great, novatec is pretty good, chosen is alright, ecc are hot steamy garbage!

    If you want cheap, Shimano hubs are under $100 for the set, and they're waaaaay nicer.

  26. #26
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    The threaded endcap is a critical difference between Koozers and these hubs. When properly tightened, the endcap pushes the freehub body tightly against the hub shell. To test how much I could get the freehub to flex I mounted the hub shell to a vise, then used a pliers to yank on the freehub as hard as I could. I could not get the freehub to move.

    I read through the entire Koozer thread carefully and it seems that as long as the freehub cannot be torqued relative to the hub body, the pawls will be just fine. Yes, the axle is still flexy and the pawl retainer ring is still cheap junk and the bearings are still poor quality, but if the freehub and the hub shell are always aligned, the pawls shouldn't have issues.

    ECC-Tech still make axles from Alloy 7075-T6 and NBK bearings, and uses them on their entire line-up, unfortunately.

    I would still support a steel axle, higher quality bearings, and a steel pawl retainer. Steel components are heavier but still economical to manufacture.

  27. #27
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    Guys did all that, then the ratchet ring strips out of the hub itself.

    These really are bad hubs.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissypants View Post
    The threaded endcap is a critical difference between Koozers and these hubs. When properly tightened, the endcap pushes the freehub body tightly against the hub shell. .
    Oi...
    The threaded cap doesn't make any damn difference. If the through-axle is tightened properly there is no side to side deflection with a snap on cap either. When it bottoms out it bottoms out. If anything, the threaded cap could lead to quicker failure if it was to come loose a few threads while someone was removing/installing the wheel frequently.

    And a steel axle may not be the magic fix you want it to be - it could bend and stay bent instead of just flexing. Why bother making a LIGHT cheap hub a HEAVY cheap hub? Can't you just leave it alone and come to grips with the fact that lighter/gentler riders may have good luck with them but heavier/agressive riders should probably invest in something better?
    Last edited by 92gli; 3 Weeks Ago at 03:48 PM.

  29. #29
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    No boost option- sucks

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ehfour View Post
    No boost option- sucks
    It's available, not on their website though. Check Alibaba or contact directly. I have a pair, took it completely apart and plan to replace bearings with SKF, and blue plastic pawl ring with steel washer.

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