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  1. #1
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    Fatter tires to Replace 2.3 DHFs on Hardtail

    Ok. Sincere apologies right off the bat. I know that there is lots of useful info smattered throughout numerous similar threads. I need to pull the pin soon on some tires (i.e.; next few days). If someone can make a quick recommendation or two, I sure would appreciate it.

    • Bike: 2018 steel Honzo hardtail. Stock tires: 2.3 3C DHF front, 2.3 DHF DC rear.


    • Mods: lots. Drivetrain, brakes, cockpit, dropper. Most significantly for this tire issue, awaiting arrival of a Fox Factory 34 at 140mm (replacing the stock 120mm Revelation), which should give me a little more squish.


    • Wheels: stock alloy low level WTBs - 29er, 30 mm id. Avoiding carbon for now, for fear of harshness (I own/have owned Enves, E*13s, and We Are Ones). Intentionally sticking with alloy for now.


    • Terrain: Calgary area - mostly Rocky Mountain foothills - mostly West Bragg, for those familiar with the area - pretty gentle, buff and flowy, dry, some roots and rock.


    • Rider: 185 lbs out of the shower, 6 feet. 25+ years of riding, many of those year round through the winter. Much more enthusiastic than skilled, but game for anything. Increasingly ailing body. Advil now a staple.


    • Primary Objective: more cush.


    2.5 DHF/2.4 DHR2? 2.6 Rekons? 2.6 NNs?

    Always been a 2.3 or 2.5 DHF/2.3 DHR2 guy, but this is the first hardtail I have owned in over a decade. I am a little concerned it is going to eventually beat the shit out of me. Hopefully a well chosen tire may reduce the retina detaching ill effects somewhat.

    Thanks guys.

  2. #2
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    If it were me I would go DHF 2.5 front and rear with a set of cushcores so I could run a bigger volume DHF at 20psi and below to get a bit of cush without having my wheels get killed or rolling tires over. The DHF 2.5 is quite a bit fatter than the 2.4 DHR2. Get a DC rear and a 3c front and call it done. The cush core will really help smooth out those chatter sections that would normally beat you up. Honestly the cushcore is pretty much as big a game changer as a dropper post. Once people get used to the weight I have never seen anyone go back to riding without them.

  3. #3
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    Tough call because of the sidewall cutting terrain you have in your area. But if you're staying away from that on flowy stuff you can try small knob/low knob front and rear Bontrager XR2 Team 29 x 2.6 on a 40mm inner rim. On your 30mm rims when you drop the pressure below 14 front and 18 rear(lower until rim hits) the 2.6 may squirm some. 30 works perfectly for the 2.2 and 35 for the 2.35. The Bontragers are high volume with a more rounded tread profile than some other tires. The wider rims give the sidewalls support. They won't fold over just crinkle some for more footprint.
    https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/e...olorCode=black

    CarbonFan asym rims with Sapim Laser spokes build up without harshness. They build themselves because of carbon.

    More 2.8 tires are coming.
    https://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-p...g-1091075.html

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Ok. Sincere apologies right off the bat. I know that there is lots of useful info smattered throughout numerous similar threads. I need to pull the pin soon on some tires (i.e.; next few days). If someone can make a quick recommendation or two, I sure would appreciate it.

    • Bike: 2018 steel Honzo hardtail. Stock tires: 2.3 3C DHF front, 2.3 DHF DC rear.


    • Mods: lots. Drivetrain, brakes, cockpit, dropper. Most significantly for this tire issue, awaiting arrival of a Fox Factory 34 at 140mm (replacing the stock 120mm Revelation), which should give me a little more squish.


    • Wheels: stock alloy low level WTBs - 29er, 30 mm id. Avoiding carbon for now, for fear of harshness (I own/have owned Enves, E*13s, and We Are Ones). Intentionally sticking with alloy for now.


    • Terrain: Calgary area - mostly Rocky Mountain foothills - mostly West Bragg, for those familiar with the area - pretty gentle, buff and flowy, dry, some roots and rock.


    • Rider: 185 lbs out of the shower, 6 feet. 25+ years of riding, many of those year round through the winter. Much more enthusiastic than skilled, but game for anything. Increasingly ailing body. Advil now a staple.


    • Primary Objective: more cush.


    2.5 DHF/2.4 DHR2? 2.6 Rekons? 2.6 NNs?

    Always been a 2.3 or 2.5 DHF/2.3 DHR2 guy, but this is the first hardtail I have owned in over a decade. I am a little concerned it is going to eventually beat the shit out of me. Hopefully a well chosen tire may reduce the retina detaching ill effects somewhat.

    Thanks guys.
    How much clearance does the rear have? Riding bud's Kona doesn't have too much clearance (probably depends on what year frame tho), you might want to think about the Honzo st heft before switching to climbing on lower pressure rear w/ tire insert and go with a 165-170mm bead to bead tire to take off some sting..first tire that comes to mind that fits a frame w/ lower clearance is the Breakout, comes in couple diff casings..of course this is depending on how much beef you want for your hardtail trails, you already went with the I-beam HT frame so maybe the heft of a tire insert in a HT isn't out of the question
    video=youtube;][/video]...

  5. #5
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    Depending on how far back you can get the wheel relative to the fattest part of the stays, you might be able to fit something like the new 2.6" Rekon in there, that would definitely give you lots more cush. Alternately if you can't go that wide (I can fit a 29x3" into my Unit with stays slammed all the way back, only sposed to fit 3" B+) you could go the B+ route and most likely be able to run a 3" B+ tyre outback. On all of my older 29er rigid/HT, I moved to a B+ rear setup to help with getting more cush, worked with all of them, even only going to a B+ 2.8" over a 29x2.4".
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  6. #6
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    Replace your rims with a 27.5 x 35-40mm and run a 2.8" tire. Done.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by hitechredneck View Post
    ...The cush core will really help smooth out those chatter sections that would normally beat you up. Honestly the cushcore is pretty much as big a game changer as a dropper post. Once people get used to the weight I have never seen anyone go back to riding without them.
    Wow. Is this true? I need to read more about cushcore I suppose. I had thought its use was primarily intended to reduce flats. Is the addition of plushness a side benefit?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Depending on how far back you can get the wheel relative to the fattest part of the stays, you might be able to fit something like the new 2.6" Rekon in there, that would definitely give you lots more cush...
    2.6 Rekons will fit the steel Honzo front and rear. The issue is whether they will be too floppy to run at lower pressures to try to achieve more cush over, say, 2.5 DHFs front and rear. I have since thrown down on We Are One Agents at 30 mm id if that matters. No more stock wheel set on this bike.

    I have tried to read up on a 2.6 Rekon combo and either MY search abilities suck, or the search abilities of this site suck. I didn't come up with much apart from random comments about the Rekon in a smattering of threads.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Wow. Is this true? I need to read more about cushcore I suppose. I had thought its use was primarily intended to reduce flats. Is the addition of plushness a side benefit?
    Think of it like adding volume spacers to your fork. You can make it softer off the bat but wont have rim bottom outs since the cushcore acts like a bottom out bumper on a coil shock.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by hitechredneck View Post
    Think of it like adding volume spacers to your fork. You can make it softer off the bat but wont have rim bottom outs since the cushcore acts like a bottom out bumper on a coil shock.
    I found with with my 2015 Pike RC that additional tokens only made a shitty fork shitter. But I digress...

    I am going to go 2.5 DHF 3c front, DC rear unless I have a last minute urge to take a chance on 2.6 Rekons front and rear. The latter option seems tempting but sketchy, for all the obvious reasons.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    I found with with my 2015 Pike RC that additional tokens only made a shitty fork shitter. But I digress...

    I am going to go 2.5 DHF 3c front, DC rear unless I have a last minute urge to take a chance on 2.6 Rekons front and rear. The latter option seems tempting but sketchy, for all the obvious reasons.
    Yeah that RC had a pretty beefy LSC shim stack a lot of folks did not like.
    Good choice on the tires, that is what I am running right now and I like it.

  12. #12
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    I guess it all depends on how low you like to go and the width rims. To me, I'd say 30mm internal should be pretty good, but to go for really low pressures, would more be looking to a i35 myself.

    They just released a 2.6" DHF ya know Have to go to the Maxxis web store to see them, but the 650B is listed and weights are only slightly different to the 2.5", so might be worth a shot, guessing the 29ers will have similar weights compareed to the 29x2.5" version.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    I found with with my 2015 Pike RC that additional tokens only made a shitty fork shitter. But I digress...

    I am going to go 2.5 DHF 3c front, DC rear unless I have a last minute urge to take a chance on 2.6 Rekons front and rear. The latter option seems tempting but sketchy, for all the obvious reasons.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    I guess it all depends on how low you like to go and the width rims. To me, I'd say 30mm internal should be pretty good, but to go for really low pressures, would more be looking to a i35 myself.

    They just released a 2.6" DHF ya know Have to go to the Maxxis web store to see them, but the 650B is listed and weights are only slightly different to the 2.5", so might be worth a shot, guessing the 29ers will have similar weights compareed to the 29x2.5" version.
    Yeah. I can't track down the DHF 2.6s or I would. I had understood that 29ers are only available OEM at the moment. That said, Streetdoctor commented in another thread that they are available by special order through the usual channels. I can't find them anywhere online and they are not available in Canada. If I could track down some 2.6 DHFs, I would be all over them.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    I found with with my 2015 Pike RC that additional tokens only made a shitty fork shitter. But I digress...

    I am going to go 2.5 DHF 3c front, DC rear unless I have a last minute urge to take a chance on 2.6 Rekons front and rear. The latter option seems tempting but sketchy, for all the obvious reasons.
    If the HT is mostly for West Bragg-style riding (assuming you still have a dually for Moose DH stuff), I like the earlier suggestion for a Rekon or something similar on the rear (Bontragers and others on sale this weeked too). I've never run a DHF rear but many people say it's not a fast roller, especially on the back wheel, and I haven't found climbing traction a big issue on those trails, but momentum definitely helps. Is there a reason you want the same tires front and rear?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by fsrxc View Post
    If the HT is mostly for West Bragg-style riding (assuming you still have a dually for Moose DH stuff), I like the earlier suggestion for a Rekon or something similar on the rear (Bontragers and others on sale this weeked too). I've never run a DHF rear but many people say it's not a fast roller, especially on the back wheel, and I haven't found climbing traction a big issue on those trails, but momentum definitely helps. Is there a reason you want the same tires front and rear?
    Thanks. My Sight is for Moose, Razors, Prairieview-Jewell, Jumpingpound-Cox, etc.

    Fatter tires to Replace 2.3 DHFs on Hardtail-fullsizeoutput_73.jpg

    I also have an Operator for full on shuttle riding.

    The Honzo will be primarily for West Bragg, Minnewanka, Fernie, etc.

    Both the Honzo and the Sight will be used everywhere, however, depending on how ambitious I am feeling that particular day.

    No desire to have the front and rear tires the same. I just want to have them higher volume to give my body a break. I can't get 29er 2.6 DHFs in Canada. So I am thinking about the 2.5 DHF or 2.6 Rekon combo. Just reading about the 2.6 Spesh Eliminator as well. Those look very promising (despite the questionable karma they may bring to my bike...). I am waiting for a ride report from Cerberus75 once he has them up and running.

    Do you have any suggestions? It sounds like you are very familiar with my local terrain.

  16. #16
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    Didn't actually try odering, but they're available on the Maxxis web store. Not sure if they'll ship to Canada, but don't see why not.

    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Yeah. I can't track down the DHF 2.6s or I would. I had understood that 29ers are only available OEM at the moment. That said, Streetdoctor commented in another thread that they are available by special order through the usual channels. I can't find them anywhere online and they are not available in Canada. If I could track down some 2.6 DHFs, I would be all over them.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Thanks. My Sight is for Moose, Razors, Prairieview-Jewell, Jumpingpound-Cox, etc.

    I also have an Operator for full on shuttle riding.

    The Honzo will be primarily for West Bragg, Minnewanka, Fernie, etc.

    Both the Honzo and the Sight will be used everywhere, however, depending on how ambitious I am feeling that particular day.

    No desire to have the front and rear tires the same. I just want to have them higher volume to give my body a break. I can't get 29er 2.6 DHFs in Canada. So I am thinking about the 2.5 DHF or 2.6 Rekon combo. Just reading about the 2.6 Spesh Eliminator as well. Those look very promising (despite the questionable karma they may bring to my bike...). I am waiting for a ride report from Cerberus75 once he has them up and running.

    Do you have any suggestions? It sounds like you are very familiar with my local terrain.
    I would lean towards 2.6 Rekons, since it's a 29er HT and you already have a 6" Trail bike, why not try an "XC/momentum" setup, but, as you said it depends on whether you can run the Rekons at low enough pressures without folding.

    Last summer I ran a NN SS 27.5x2.6 on the front at 14psi, with no pinchflats or sidewall damage, and didn't notice it folding (sudden washouts) but, I'm only 145lb, so YMMV...

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Wow. Is this true? I need to read more about cushcore I suppose. I had thought its use was primarily intended to reduce flats. Is the addition of plushness a side benefit?
    I agree with Hightech. Other than its flat protection it helps a great deal with tire bounce which makes a bike feel skittish over lots of rocks and roots. The Cushcore keeps the tire planted.

  19. #19
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    Id run DHF 2.5 front and rear if they'll fit. Or DHR 2.4 if it the DHF wont fit. Most the plus tires rip easily and the nobby nicks definitely do. When riding rocky trails.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerberus75 View Post
    Id run DHF 2.5 front and rear if they'll fit. Or DHR 2.4 if it the DHF wont fit. Most the plus tires rip easily and the nobby nicks definitely do. When riding rocky trails.
    2.5 DHF front and rear will definitely fit.

    In a nutshell, apart from slightly increased volume (presumably), what are the benefits of running a 2.5 DHF over a 2.4 DHR2 in the rear?

    Would you go DC or 3C in the rear? I donít care about longevity. Rolling resistance is my main concern, although I donít want to sacrifice traction too too much.

    My current 2.3 3C DHF, 2.3 3C DHR2 combo on my Sight (WAO Insiders, 27 id, DT 240 18 tooth) can be super draggy at times. Itís odd because the same combo on my 2015 Range (Enve AMs, 24 id, DT 240 18 tooth) was lightning quick. Maybe I am just getting old and slow.

  21. #21
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    The main difference will be the DHF will roll a bit faster, but have less braking traction compared to the DHR2 with it's bigger paddle centre knobs.

    If you don't regularly ride in the wet, then DC is fine, but if your trails see wet on a regular basis for whatever reason, 3C.

    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    2.5 DHF front and rear will definitely fit.
    In a nutshell, apart from slightly increased volume (presumably), what are the benefits of running a 2.5 DHF over a 2.4 DHR2 in the rear?
    Would you go DC or 3C in the rear? I donít care about longevity. Rolling resistance is my main concern, although I donít want to sacrifice traction too too much.

    My current 2.3 3C DHF, 2.3 3C DHR2 combo on my Sight (WAO Insiders, 27 id, DT 240 18 tooth) can be super draggy at times. Itís odd because the same combo on my 2015 Range (Enve AMs, 24 id, DT 240 18 tooth) was lightning quick. Maybe I am just getting old and slow.
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    The main difference will be the DHF will roll a bit faster, but have less braking traction compared to the DHR2 with it's bigger paddle centre knobs.

    If you don't regularly ride in the wet, then DC is fine, but if your trails see wet on a regular basis for whatever reason, 3C.
    Thanks. It's generally bone dry in my area for the summer months. That said, do you see any downside to running 3C in the rear too, apart from a slight cost increase and lower longevity compared to DC, neither of which I care about? I saw another thread where the general consensus appeared to be that 3C rolled no more slowly than DC. Is that your experience as well?

  23. #23
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    Would guess you're like the average person and probably won't be able to detect much, if any difference, I'm not like that, I can feel the angles change if my rear tyre is low by a few pounds, or run a 2.4" over a 2.3", so I can definitely feel a difference, not great, but it's there, but once you hit anything wet that goes away for the extra traction you gain and on looser, you also get more as on/in the dry. I'd probably go DC just because of the wear factor, 3C definitely wears quite a bit quicker than DC if I didn't ride in/on wet slippery roots and rocks on a regular basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    Thanks. It's generally bone dry in my area for the summer months. That said, do you see any downside to running 3C in the rear too, apart from a slight cost increase and lower longevity compared to DC, neither of which I care about? I saw another thread where the general consensus appeared to be that 3C rolled no more slowly than DC. Is that your experience as well?
    One day your life will flash before your eyes, will it be worth watching??

  24. #24
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    I tried a DHF 2.5 on the rear for 1 ride, and it felt like pedaling through molasses. For me DHR 2.4 feels like a semi slick in comparison.

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    Dry and hard tends to chew up a rear 3C tire with no additional benefits. 3C shines in wet conditions for the rear. With an aggressive geo bike with less weight on the front the 3C stickyness helps. But if mostly slick rock rides I'd do 2C front and rear. The DHF grips better when leaned over. On a hardtail things get skippy and the DHF grabs back traction better than the DHR in my experience. I find the DHR2 3 to be better in wet conditions so i use it where I ride. But do fine once it looses traction it wipes out. The DHF grabs when it slips a lot more. But it needs to be leaned over more. Not a problem in dry conditions.

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    That is why if it is wet I just say F it and say highroller 2.5. It is much better in slop than DHF or DHR2

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by hitechredneck View Post
    That is why if it is wet I just say F it and say highroller 2.5. It is much better in slop than DHF or DHR2
    Shorty front HR rear if sloppy. But for most people wet equals damp roots and rocks. With some puddles here and there. Self included.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerberus75 View Post
    Shorty front HR rear if sloppy. But for most people wet equals damp roots and rocks. With some puddles here and there. Self included.
    That describes my area as well. Slippery roots are quite abundant on some of the trails. That said, it has been incredibly dry here though for the past 3 or so seasons.

    Guys - what do you think about a 2.5 Aggressor on the rear and 2.5 DHF on the front?

    Is there any news on when the trail Assguys are going to be released? If there is a 29er 2.5 version, any thoughts on that front and rear? Or a DHF front, and a trail Assguy rear?

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    That describes my area as well. Slippery roots are quite abundant on some of the trails. That said, it has been incredibly dry here though for the past 3 or so seasons.

    Guys - what do you think about a 2.5 Aggressor on the rear and 2.5 DHF on the front?

    Is there any news on when the trail Assguys are going to be released? If there is a 29er 2.5 version, any thoughts on that front and rear? Or a DHF front, and a trail Assguy rear?
    Haha I think i might be the first to jump on a trail version of the Assguy. But its not out yet. The DHF/Aggressor is probably the besy fail safe tire combo for dry trails.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerberus75 View Post
    ...The DHF/Aggressor is probably the besy fail safe tire combo for dry trails.
    I think that is where I have landed. DHF/Aggressor.

    To put this into context, this is what the terrain looks like where I am:

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/east-o...mountains.html

    All of that is within an hour of my driveway.

    I have never been to "Part 3: Blackrock". That is not a riding area for anyone local. But Jumpingpound-Cox and Razors are reasonably popular. West Bragg is by far the most popular, which was not included in the article. Moose Mountain is the shuttler's choice, again not included in the article. The choices in the article were a little random, to say the least. Nonetheless, it's a good illustrator of the type of terrain here, most of which is pretty dry most of the time from May to mid October. Some years earlier, and some years later.

    DHF has always been the best front tire for me. I think I will throw down on the Aggressor for the rear and see how that goes.

    Thanks everyone.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbkrmike View Post
    I think that is where I have landed. DHF/Aggressor.

    To put this into context, this is what the terrain looks like where I am:

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/east-o...mountains.html

    All of that is within an hour of my driveway.

    I have never been to "Part 3: Blackrock". That is not a riding area for anyone local. But Jumpingpound-Cox and Razors are reasonably popular. West Bragg is by far the most popular, which was not included in the article. Moose Mountain is the shuttler's choice, again not included in the article. The choices in the article were a little random, to say the least. Nonetheless, it's a good illustrator of the type of terrain here, most of which is pretty dry most of the time from May to mid October. Some years earlier, and some years later.

    DHF has always been the best front tire for me. I think I will throw down on the Aggressor for the rear and see how that goes.

    Thanks everyone.
    The Aggressor packes up more with mud, but i don't think it would be a problem for you. And is a bit faster rolling. Good choice.

  32. #32
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    On my 29 AM HT I run 2.6 Specialized Butcher up front & a 2.35 Michelin Wild AM out back...

    Enough cush, plus other attributes I'm looking for i.e. grip, rolling resistance, self cleaning - for my local trails. Which tend to be damp 75% of the time.

    But, I also run them out of town on dry, rocky terrain w/o any issue ^^

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