X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!

    You may remember the bikes of the Santa Cruz Syndicate Team....they were using during this year a special modified X0 Trigger with a X0 Short RD and a SRAM RED cassette (Pic 1)

    A small spanish company is doing a similar thing but with a GripShift....all the guys that are waiting for the SRAM XX groupset should consider this innovation. Basically, the main improvement is removing the need of using a SRAM XX or Road 10s (with a smaller max cog) RD. Using a Flat-bar shifter is actually not an option WWs and those who like the GripShift

    and SRAM haven`t released its 10sp GripShift yet...

    Where is the innovation?
    They modified a GripShift adding one more gear but with the ability to still work with the X0 RD....much cheaper than buying all the XX groupset

    They say that they can study the modification for other RDs

    Link:
    http://www.blackcatbonebikes.com/bla...locidades.html
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-rearder.jpg  

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  2. #2
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    Looks like it costs 120 euro's. I'm guessing that doesn't include the shifter itself. This looks like something I'd really be interested in. Now if I could just speak spanish.

  3. #3
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    Gripshift 10 velocidades

    Necesitas un click más para montar tu cassette de 10 velocidades? No lo dudes, si eres tan amante del gripshift como lo somos nosotros, abrirás un nuevo mundo de posibilidades con el 2x10 sin abandonar tus mandos de cambio favoritos. Modificación disponible para SRAM X.0, consúltanos otras alternativas.

    10 speed Gripshift

    Do you need one more click to install your 10 speed cassette? Don't hesitate, if you love gripshift as much as we do, you will open a new world of oportunities with 2x10 without abandoning your favorite shifters. Modification available for SRAM X.0, ask about other alternatives.

  4. #4
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    120 euros?!
    guess I won't be doing that..

  5. #5
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    do you have to ship your right gripshift in Spain + 120 euro tuning ?

    or in 120 euro is it included a new gripshifter ?

  6. #6
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    Eli, the price only includes the tuning...

    I know that it isn't cheap at all but assuming that you already have a SRAM XO+GripShift groupset and you want to upgrade to 10s, there are three options:

    Get a SRAM XX RD+XX Triggers (506€ in ChainReactionCyles.com!!)

    Road 10s paired with Paul Thumbies or 10s flat-bar shifters....but you are limited to 32t cassetes

    BlackCatBone Bikes GripShift tuning....120€

    I think that right now is the best way to upgrade to 10s....expensive but much cheaper than the other options

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    Eli, the price only includes the tuning...

    I know that it isn't cheap at all but assuming that you already have a SRAM XO+GripShift groupset and you want to upgrade to 10s, there are three options:

    Get a SRAM XX RD+XX Triggers (506€ in ChainReactionCyles.com!!)

    Road 10s paired with Paul Thumbies or 10s flat-bar shifters....but you are limited to 32t cassetes

    BlackCatBone Bikes GripShift tuning....120€

    I think that right now is the best way to upgrade to 10s....expensive but much cheaper than the other options
    WRONG !

    You don't need a specific derailleur to be able to run 10s ! Every derailleur can do this: Alivio, Deore, LX,XT,XTR...every SRAM as well.

    Still nice to see someone has a way to tune grip-shifters to 10s though.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    WRONG !

    You don't need a specific derailleur to be able to run 10s ! Every derailleur can do this: Alivio, Deore, LX,XT,XTR...every SRAM as well.

    Still nice to see someone has a way to tune grip-shifters to 10s though.
    I know....

    But you need a heavy flat-bar shifter....not the WW choice at all

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    I know....

    But you need a heavy flat-bar shifter....not the WW choice at all
    BUT you can use a MUCH lighter Shimano DA derailleur instead of the heavy XX...my DA is 143g.

  10. #10
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    DA wont work with a 11-36 cassette though... no?

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    so does that mean you can use an X0/X9 rear mech with a 10spd XX shifter?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    BUT you can use a MUCH lighter Shimano DA derailleur instead of the heavy XX...my DA is 143g.
    BUT the Shimano DA 7900 can´t handle properly 34t cogs...and it wasn´t designed for mountain bike purpose. You say that it is strong enough and I trust you but it´s not the perfect setup

    1x10 with Shimano DuraAce 7900....nearly impossible

    They say that they can study the modification for other RDs...Shimano XTR or maybe a 2x11 groupset with Campagnolo SuperRecord 11s RD

    Great posibilities!!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockStarRacing
    so does that mean you can use an X0/X9 rear mech with a 10spd XX shifter?
    With that GripShift you can use any 1:1 SRAM RD (X0, X9, X7...) with 10speeds

  14. #14
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    Do they also make that rigid Carbon Lefty fork? Looks like it on the pic?
    If You want Plush, Buy a Couch...
    If you want to go Fast, Buy a 29er

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    DA wont work with a 11-36 cassette though... no?
    I used a Da rear derail with a 11-34 cassette on my road bike at a mountain tt.
    It worked fine....although everyone said it wouldn't ( just make sure your chain, limit screws and cables are dialed)
    Don't know what would happen with mud and dirt or full suspension thrown in, though.

  16. #16
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    So I've contacted the company. It is 120 with you supplying the shifter. 165 euro's including the shifter. So about $236. Steep, but look at how many posts with people complaining about no xx GripShift. Nows your chance

  17. #17
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    Interesting idea, I have thought about to modify a gripshift to work with 10 or 11 cassette.

    I would investigate it anyone would need a such setup, I´m no gripshift rider though.
    Experimental Prototype

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    BUT the Shimano DA 7900 can´t handle properly 34t cogs...and it wasn´t designed for mountain bike purpose. You say that it is strong enough and I trust you but it´s not the perfect setup

    1x10 with Shimano DuraAce 7900....nearly impossible

    They say that they can study the modification for other RDs...Shimano XTR or maybe a 2x11 groupset with Campagnolo SuperRecord 11s RD

    Great posibilities!!
    DA on a 10s titanium cassette...both items lighter and cheaper than XX and not a single problem.
    DA is the same quality than XTR...not a single issue in many,many years i use themThe shorter cages are also much less likely to get caught by brankces or bushes or in a crash.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-10-montiert.jpg  


  19. #19
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    Nino....You are WRONG

    ChainReaction prices:

    Shimano DuraAce 7900 164gr 135€
    Shimano SL-R770 10s 244gr 118€ Total 408gr/253€

    SRAM X9 Medium 227gr 67€
    SRAM XO BCB Tuned 166gr 165€ Total 393gr/232€


    Stronger RD, 15gr less, 21€ cheaper, you can run 11-36 cassetes if you want and you have GripShifts

    Paul Thumbies are not an option for the 98% of the riders...and the SEC GripShift that you mounted with your 10s drivetrain can´t be bought...

    What do you have to say now?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    DA on a 10s titanium cassette...both items lighter and cheaper than XX and not a single problem.
    DA is the same quality than XTR...not a single issue in many,many years i use themThe shorter cages are also much less likely to get caught by brankces or bushes or in a crash.
    Nino,
    what size is that cassete...and is it one of yours?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    Nino....You are WRONG

    ChainReaction prices:

    Shimano DuraAce 7900 164gr 135€
    Shimano SL-R770 10s 244gr 118€ Total 408gr/253€

    SRAM X9 Medium 227gr 67€
    SRAM XO BCB Tuned 166gr 165€ Total 393gr/232€


    Stronger RD, 15gr less, 21€ cheaper, you can run 11-36 cassetes if you want and you have GripShifts

    Paul Thumbies are not an option for the 98% of the riders...and the SEC GripShift that you mounted with your 10s drivetrain can´t be bought...

    What do you have to say now?
    Oh yeah prepare for a duel.

    This started out sounding like a great option but I am poor so I will wait a while and get laughed at for only having 9spd on my bike
    Last edited by Slim83; 12-22-2009 at 01:08 PM.

  22. #22
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    What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.

    Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:

    11-13-15-17-20-23-26-30-33-36

    This would also work:

    11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36
    Last edited by BlownCivic; 12-22-2009 at 02:12 PM.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.

    Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:

    11-13-15-17-20-23-26-30-33-36

    This would also work:

    11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36
    I'd buy a few if they were cheaper OR lighter than XX

  24. #24
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    Hi all,

    I've been a bit bussy and after receiving some questions coming from people from overseas, I imagined that someone from the spanish forum had posted something here...

    Just as an explanation of the tuning:

    We take a gripshift, open it, clean it and smooth machine the rachet area where the "clicks" are located. Then we insert a new machined rachet with the new 9 clicks = 10 speeds. It is needed a proper equipment to do so (you know the meaning of CNC I guess), I say that because some naďve people think they maybe would manage with a dremel... And that's maybe possible if you are brain-surgeon in your spare time. Otherwise, I can not imagine other way to do it.

    The reason of the high cost, is that it cost a lot, pretty obvious, (due mainly to preparation time and a lot of manual labor). So I it is a nonsense to compare it with any shifter in the market, just because what you are actually doing is artisan tuning in a gripshift that costs maybe 10$ to produce as máximun. The way of approaching it is that you are buying a specific performance, if you like gripshift and want to go 10 speed, there is no other way, unless SRAM put in the LBS the XX gripshift (that should cost similar than the X.0).

    To be honest, I would prefer XX gripshift than my tuning, then I would go for the new XX group.

    I understand nino in some concepts, but for me, shimano (either road or mtb) is not an option... I am too used to sram feeling and gripshift.

  25. #25
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    by the way, it is obviously working quite fine...

    http://www.foromtb.com/8632183-post103.html

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    What about a Ti 10 speed cassette with a 36t ring on it (like the XX cassette)? I know there are 10 speed Ti cassettes with 34 as the large cog, but I'm looking at this as an opportunity to gain that 36t to go with my 26/40 front setup. There's some big hills here.

    Ideally, this is what I'd like to see:

    11-13-15-17-20-23-26-30-33-36

    This would also work:

    11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36
    why don't you go with a 25t instead?

    A 36 cassette has the gears wider apart,is heavier and needs a heavier long cage derailleur as well. I don't see the benefit.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    Nino....You are WRONG

    ChainReaction prices:

    Shimano DuraAce 7900 164gr 135€
    Shimano SL-R770 10s 244gr 118€ Total 408gr/253€

    SRAM X9 Medium 227gr 67€
    SRAM XO BCB Tuned 166gr 165€ Total 393gr/232€


    Stronger RD, 15gr less, 21€ cheaper, you can run 11-36 cassetes if you want and you have GripShifts

    Paul Thumbies are not an option for the 98% of the riders...and the SEC GripShift that you mounted with your 10s drivetrain can´t be bought...

    What do you have to say now?
    i'm not:
    -you don't need both sides of the shifters.just the right side (115g).On the left you can take whatever shifter you like:light or cheap or both.
    -Why do you compare DA to a X9?? Sure the X9 is cheaper.
    -who says the XX is any stronger? Sorry - I personally haven't seen any SRAM derailleur beeing stronger than DA.
    -And in your calculation you forgot the titanium cassettes which are cheaper and lighter than XX.

    Anyway -the most expensive part is still the XX cassette. All i tried to say is you don't need any XX part to be able to run 10s! If those spaniards can modify SRAM compatible grip-shifters they can sure do the same with Shimano compatible grip-shifters. This would be what i want as i personally don't like SRAM rear derailleurs at all.
    Last edited by nino; 12-22-2009 at 04:01 PM.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    why don't you go with a 25t instead?

    A 36 cassette has the gears wider apart,is heavier and needs a heavier long cage derailleur as well. I don't see the benefit.
    I'm using a tuned X0 medium cage derailleur as it stands, and have no plans to change any time soon. I am confident that the medium will handle a 36t no problem.

    I don't want to go 25/40, as I already have reservations about the 26/40. I'm currently running 27/40 (my 26 is on the way from Mattias as we speak) and feel that even that is approaching the limits of the Record FD that I'm using.

    I guess if you have no plans for comissioning an 11-36, then I'll just go for the slightly heavier SRAM part for the same cost ($239 US on Ebay right now).

  29. #29
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    tubeglower,

    will you just sell the new machined ratchet? I'd pay a premium to not send my shifter to you and just do the work myself.

    I too would like to run a 36 rear cog. As it is i'm running a 1x9 on my 29er race bike with a 32 up front and a 11-34 out back. I'd like to run a 32 or 34 front with a 11-36 cassette. 1x10 would be really nice.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by tubeglower
    by the way, it is obviously working quite fine...

    http://www.foromtb.com/8632183-post103.html
    Have to register to see the pics, can you upload them somewhere else for us to see? Thanks.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortechcoupe
    tubeglower,

    will you just sell the new machined ratchet? I'd pay a premium to not send my shifter to you and just do the work myself.

    I too would like to run a 36 rear cog. As it is i'm running a 1x9 on my 29er race bike with a 32 up front and a 11-34 out back. I'd like to run a 32 or 34 front with a 11-36 cassette. 1x10 would be really nice.
    +1.

  32. #32
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    I need to learn Spanish.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-p1000151.jpg  

    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-p1000152.jpg  

    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-p1000154.jpg  


  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    I need to learn Spanish.
    That is a sick looking bike. How does the X.0 + XX RD/cassette shift?

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    With that GripShift you can use any 1:1 SRAM RD (X0, X9, X7...) with 10speeds
    Thats not what i asked......... ;0)

    i asked.............. "can you use an XX 10spd shifter with an X0/X9 rear mech"

  35. #35
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    No, you can't.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by amillmtb
    That is a sick looking bike. How does the X.0 + XX RD/cassette shift?
    Im sure thats an XO rear Mech, not XX

  37. #37
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    different ratios in shifting , so a XX Rear der not work with X.0 gripshifters

    but HERE there are a X.0 gripshifters ( TUNED at 10 speeds)

    a X.0 rear derailleur

    an XX cassette ( only 10 speeds ...but A cassette )

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    I need to learn Spanish.
    Yes...6.9kg w/ Tubulars


  39. #39
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    if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockStarRacing
    if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....
    different ratios !

    X.0 rear der works with X.0 triggers or gripshifts

    XX works with XX triggers

    XTR works with XTR triggers and Sram Attack or Rocket gripshifts


    3 categories of rear der , each a different ratio cable movement / rear der movement

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epic-o
    Yes...6.9kg w/ Tubulars


    why you have on your R1 brakes different colors in caliper body and cup , front and rear ?

    custom assembly ?

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockStarRacing
    Thats not what i asked......... ;0)

    i asked.............. "can you use an XX 10spd shifter with an X0/X9 rear mech"
    Although I have not tried it...XX shifters are supposed to be 1:1 pull....so I would say yes, it will work.
    I used a XO rear derailer with Dura Ace shifters on a friend's cross bike this year after the DA derailuer broke....it worked fine.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor
    Although I have not tried it...XX shifters are supposed to be 1:1 pull....so I would say yes, it will work.

    it's 1:1.3 ... not 1:1

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    it's 1:1.3 ... not 1:1
    Hmmm...I got the XO rear to work with the Dura Ace 10 speed shifters shifters with no problem....have you actually tried the XX shifter with a XO rear?

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockStarRacing
    if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....
    This is from Bike Magazine it is a good explanation

    "The basis of SRAM’s entire drivetrain philosophy is the 1:1 actuation ratio. The amount of cable pulled by the shifter is exactly the same as the distance that the derailleur moves for each jab of the thumb. Shimano, by contrast, utilizes a 2:1 ratio where the rear derailleur moves twice as far as the cable pull for every click on the shifter"


    That being said, Sram labeled their mountain and road/XX 1:1 but from what I was told only their road and XX are true 1:1 where the XO, X9, etc, mountain derailleur moves a little more than the actual cable pull.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockStarRacing
    if a gripshift converted to 10spd will work with a 9spd Sram rear mech, i dont understand why a 9spd rear mech wont work with a dedicated 10 spd shifter? doesnt make sense....
    It sounds like everyone is guessing...and haven't actually tried it.
    I have the XX groupo coming....I'll have to give it a try.
    I have been told that a lot of stuff won't work together over the years...and found out it was often far from true ( sometimes the mismatched stuff worked better!)

  47. #47
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    As far as I know:

    SH: 1:2 (1mm pulled cable is 2mm movement darreleur cage), that's the reason it is so smooth and so "weak" on keeping the synchronism
    SRAM (X.N): 1:1 (1mm pilled cable is 1mm movement darreleur cage), that's the reason they are "tougher" feeling and more reliable keeping synchronism
    SRAM XX: 1:1.3 (so they have changed the ratio, but still quite close to the original 1:1). To me there is no technical reason, but an important commercial and marketing one, it is the number 1 gruppo today, "let's keep it isolated!" so who want it must pay for it...

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor
    It sounds like everyone is guessing...and haven't actually tried it.
    I have the XX groupo coming....I'll have to give it a try.
    I have been told that a lot of stuff won't work together over the years...and found out it was often far from true ( sometimes the mismatched stuff worked better!)
    That would be great, and your second statement is so true! hopefully your right again.....

  49. #49
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    top work tubeglower

    ...did you change the gripshifter to display 10 in the window?

  50. #50
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    Are you planning on modifying the X0 pod shifter as well? id like to run 10 speed with a x0 short (? 1x10) rear cage mech and not have to run the xx shfter and associated xx rear derailleur.
    Last edited by vikingboy; 12-23-2009 at 06:36 PM.

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingboy
    Are you planning on modifying the X0 pod shifter as well? id like to run 10 speed with a x0 short (? 1x10) rear cage mech and not have to run the xx shfter and associated xx rear derailleur.
    X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by culturesponge
    top work tubeglower

    ...did you change the gripshifter to display 10 in the window?
    not on the "normal production", it is already a hassle...

    Now we are puting efforts on SH and XX versions, hopefully very soon available.

    Regarding display, I am thinking on a solution, but it will take some time....

  53. #53
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    Again, will you just sell me the machined part to convert my 9 speed xo grip shift to 10 speed?

    I just want to convert it myself as much as poss. I'd rather pay you a fair price for the 10 speed click part and install it myself.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie_yeti
    X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.
    Any idea on max cog size a red/force derailleur can handle? Sram says ~28 but i bet it can take more in a 1x10 setup, maybe 32?? But I doubt it would take a 36 rear cog, which i want to run, also 1x10.

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortechcoupe
    Any idea on max cog size a red/force derailleur can handle? Sram says ~28 but i bet it can take more in a 1x10 setup, maybe 32?? But I doubt it would take a 36 rear cog, which i want to run, also 1x10.
    The derailleur just hits the cog... So it has nothing to do with the ability to handle the different in chain length...
    The angle of the parallelogram is different than at a mtb derrailleur. So it won't work... I believe with a 10T upper pulley you can take a 30T cog?
    If You want Plush, Buy a Couch...
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  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vortechcoupe
    Again, will you just sell me the machined part to convert my 9 speed xo grip shift to 10 speed?

    I just want to convert it myself as much as poss. I'd rather pay you a fair price for the 10 speed click part and install it myself.
    It sounds like there is more involved than simply opening up the shifter body and dropping in the new ratchet, from tubeglower's original note I've copied below. Unless you can accurately machine away the stock ratchet material to allow the new ratchet to seat itself in the proper position and alignment, then it probably won't work, or at least won't work very well. They probably have their CNC machine all programmed up to just pop the existing shifter in and let it go to work removing the existing ratchet material. Trial and error could be expensive.

    Quote Originally Posted by tubeglower
    ...We take a gripshift, open it, clean it and smooth machine the rachet area where the "clicks" are located. Then we insert a new machined rachet with the new 9 clicks = 10 speeds. It is needed a proper equipment to do so (you know the meaning of CNC I guess), I say that because some naďve people think they maybe would manage with a dremel...

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Circlip
    It sounds like there is more involved than simply opening up the shifter body and dropping in the new ratchet, from tubeglower's original note I've copied below. Unless you can accurately machine away the stock ratchet material to allow the new ratchet to seat itself in the proper position and alignment, then it probably won't work, or at least won't work very well. They probably have their CNC machine all programmed up to just pop the existing shifter in and let it go to work removing the existing ratchet material. Trial and error could be expensive.

    yep, I see you have got it... We have tried and "errored" destroying some shifters here... It is no no for dremel enthusiasts or diy people. It is 99.9% possibilities to fail. Sorry for that. We do the job, tune the shifter and make sure it works before send it back to the owner, There is no new parts involved, we modify the case of the shifter, where the ratchet is located. By the way, case and ratchet is the same part and material (to make it easier...)

  58. #58
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    I was afraid of that. I guess i'll just pay the $140 for a XX rear trigger shifter or wait for the XX grip shift which hopefully will cost less then the trigger shifter. Dang, then i'll have to buy the rear derailleur too! versus using my current XO. doh!

  59. #59
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    I just thinked of a way to CNC some new parts to a X.0 gripshifter but if BCB did it good, so why should I do it?
    Experimental Prototype

  60. #60
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    Maybe an obvious answer on this, but will a standard front X.0 gripshifter work on the XX front der?

    If so, I spend $175 US to get gripshift XX...that's good! New XX gripshift display windows (10 and 2) would be the final touch.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie_yeti
    X.X and SRAM road series use the same cable pull, run an X.X shifter pod with SRAM Red rear derailleur. Nice short cage. Will have a couple loop to enter the derailleur though.
    im sure i have seen an X0 pod working with a Red rear mech, so if that works, surely a XX pod works with an X0 rear mech...........

  62. #62
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    arrived mine
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-fotografie-0047.jpg  


  63. #63
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    nice

    that's only slightly much more than standard spec weight (with cables), not sure about those alloy adjusters though

    is the BCB graphic a lighter shade of green now, also how does the blacked out window look?

    ...finally how different does it look inside?

  64. #64
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    oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...
    Get those puppies tested

  66. #66
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    Naaah - too much money!

    I should get 10s Grip-shifters soon

  67. #67
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    medium cage XO RD works fine with XX 11-36

    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    oh , too busy to open it ... keep its secrets for next months ...
    ...meaning you've already installed it? (!!)
    Last edited by culturesponge; 02-18-2010 at 02:08 PM.

  68. #68
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    installed today !!

    on my Flash 29er

    11-36T cassette Sram XX

    right gripshift from Blackcatbonebikes
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-hpim0068.jpg  

    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-hpim0070.jpg  


  69. #69
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    TubeGlower, What's the turnaround time for the mod if you supply the shifter?

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    installed today !!

    on my Flash 29er

    11-36T cassette Sram XX

    right gripshift from Blackcatbonebikes

    How does your transmission work? I have a BCB shifter as well, but I'm facing some problems outlining the RD. I can see the RD moving up a little too much toward the higher cogs, which eventually causes the chain to always skip the second largest cog...

  71. #71
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    This looks like it might be a worthy mod. What's the smallest SRAM rear derailleur you can get away with using in an 11-36 and 42-28 setup?

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by JaLove
    This looks like it might be a worthy mod. What's the smallest SRAM rear derailleur you can get away with using in an 11-36 and 42-28 setup?
    I have tried both a long and a medium cage X0 derailleur in that setup. I don't see much difference and the reach of the medium cage seems to more than enough!

  73. #73
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    No one has given a clear cut answer yet to the question of if a XX shifter pod will run nicely with an X0 RD and XX cassette. I run on a 1x9 and it would be nice to get a 36T on the back for those days when my legs aren't in the mood to play. I have an X0 gripshift, X0 RD, and XTR cog and I think there's weight to be saved in having an XX cog and shifter pod (around 30-40g i guess).

  74. #74
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    It has been answered. The answer is no, you can not run the XX shifter with the old X0 RD. Old meaning 2010 and older. XX shifter pod only will work with derailleur's that are exact actuation. If it doesn't say exact actuation on the derailleur, then chances are it won't work.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by morrisgarages
    No one has given a clear cut answer yet to the question of if a XX shifter pod will run nicely with an X0 RD and XX cassette. I run on a 1x9 and it would be nice to get a 36T on the back for those days when my legs aren't in the mood to play. I have an X0 gripshift, X0 RD, and XTR cog and I think there's weight to be saved in having an XX cog and shifter pod (around 30-40g i guess).
    take an 11-32 XTR cassette, remove the 11t and lockring, get a 12t lockring and a 36t Action tec rear cog and spacer and now you have a 12-36 XTR cassette
    The actiontec cog is about $65

    http://www.actiontec.us/prices.htm
    Quote Originally Posted by thefuzzbl
    aluminium has a tendency to fail when you need it most. i.e. you end up with a bad day.

  76. #76
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    Would a short cage x.0 work with an 11-36 and 2x up front?

  77. #77
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    Thanks for the responses guys. Having an 11t cog is nice for those fireroad descents and road riding. So I guess it's XX all the way or no play.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by morrisgarages
    Thanks for the responses guys. Having an 11t cog is nice for those fireroad descents and road riding. So I guess it's XX all the way or no play.
    agreed but you could also drop your 13 or 14 and keep an 11-12-14 or 11-12-13-15
    Quote Originally Posted by thefuzzbl
    aluminium has a tendency to fail when you need it most. i.e. you end up with a bad day.

  79. #79
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    Thanks scooter. But one reason I want the XX cog too is coz of the weight savings compared to my XTR.

  80. #80
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    while we are on the topic of asking with derailleurs work or not.

    Will a Short cage X.O or DA work with an 1x 11-36t with a 34t chain ring?

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by scooter916
    take an 11-32 XTR cassette, remove the 11t and lockring, get a 12t lockring and a 36t Action tec rear cog and spacer and now you have a 12-36 XTR cassette
    The actiontec cog is about $65

    http://www.actiontec.us/prices.htm
    I guess the thin Ti cog will damage every alu freehub body. I think the FRM solution with the "thick" Alucog is the more durable choice.

  82. #82
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    I think it won't work,beacouse the biggest cassette ring for that derailleur is 28t,and full olume is 33t

    Here you have information from polish shop:

    Pojemność całkowita 33T, maksymalna koronka 28T

    In English:

    Full volume 33T max (cassette) ring 28t

  83. #83
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    I asked Nino that question before and he a DA will not work with a 36T or even a 34T cog.

    I run a DA7700 with a 34T.
    Last edited by rensho; 05-04-2010 at 09:03 AM.

  84. #84
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    I just found these photo about the troy lee flash.
    How did they get a DA to work with the 36t?




  85. #85
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    I think it's about having the b screw turned upside down or something. That's an electronic DA btw so maybe it has something to do with that too? I would really like to make a DA work with a 36t cog since the xx rd is I think too heavy. I don't understand why sram would make such a nice and light cog then go out and match it with a piggy rd.

  86. #86
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    yeah i know it is an electronic DA but how different is it to the normal DA.

    Would turning the B screw u side down on an normal DA work?

  87. #87
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    I'm not really sure if it would work. Haven't personally tried it yet or seen someone try it. I do hope someone does though! I really want to find out too. I don't want to go out and buy a DA then find it out that it doesn't work.

  88. #88
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    They used a custom hanger that is longer than normal.

  89. #89
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    Just to throw it out there, IRD offers 10speed shimano cassettes already, 11-32, 12-32 and 11-34, the 4 largest cogs are on an alloy carrier, and you can get them for about $125 shipped from ebay.

    12-32
    http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shiman...-/390190744525

    12-30
    http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shiman...-/390190744511

    11-34
    http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shiman...-/370374729847

    11-32
    http://cgi.ebay.com/IRD-Elite-Shiman...-/390190744389

    Add some DuraAce 10speed bar-end shifters on a pair of Paul's thumbies mounts and any shimano rear derailleur and you can be converting your bikes to 10 speed setups now for under $300.

  90. #90
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    but... what a weight ... double than a stock cassette

  91. #91
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    by an 10 speed Ultegra 11-28 and a deore 12-36 cassette, take the 11t cog away, strip the deore and mount the 36t cog with a spacer behind the 12-28 of the Ultegra and you have a solution like above mentioned, but for cheap and lighter and with a higher range.
    Should work at steel and titanium rotors ;-)

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    but... what a weight ... double than a stock cassette
    How exactly is 355g double a stock cassette?

  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeeEight
    How exactly is 355g double a stock cassette?
    in this way :
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-24062009-014-.jpg  

    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-hpim0104.jpg  


  94. #94
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    Agree with Eli. Those are heavy a** cogs.

  95. #95
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    In no way are Recon 9speed cassettes... STOCK. And you're comparing them to the weights of 10 speed cassettes also. Could you get it anymore apples and oranges?!?

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by eliflap
    in this way :
    oh no, these cassettes are only good on scale. shift like **** and if you put some watts on your pedal the big cogs flex and in worst case they fold like a papersheet.

  97. #97
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    I do have 10s cassettes from same source as Eliflap, they work good for me in the dirt.
    If you are a big watt guy so choose a another forum, most WW stuf don´t hold up for big watters.
    Experimental Prototype

  98. #98
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    ok, think i understand: authentic weight weenie = chicken legs (dont think so, but thats what you say).
    serious watts = not welcome in this forums because some weight weenie stuff could break down.
    But comparison between men stuff and weight weenie stuff is ok and a welcome way for argumentation ?

    please correct me if i am not right.

  99. #99
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    fastback67: It depends on how many watts you put
    Experimental Prototype

  100. #100
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    just enough to fold a cog of a recon ti cassette (never had something like this with shimano). details about my watts is a little bit foolish ;-) hope you allow me nevertheless to use some weight weenie stuff and tell about my experiences?

  101. #101
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    fastback67: you are then forbidden to use WW stuff

    WW stuff is for us chickenlegs
    Experimental Prototype

  102. #102
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    ok

    my X.0 works with XX cassette 11-36T

    and 36T oval Rotor ring in a 1 x10 set up
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-hpim0562.jpg  

    X0 RD with XX cassete? It works!!-hpim0565.jpg  


  103. #103
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    Eli you're using the modified to 10spd. sram x0 gripshifts?

  104. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by morrisgarages
    Eli you're using the modified to 10spd. sram x0 gripshifts?

    yes , since february 2010

  105. #105
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    Anyone else tried the 10 sp gripshift?

    Nino, do you have 10speed gripshift for sram yet?

  106. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by mad dog26
    Anyone else tried the 10 sp gripshift?

    Nino, do you have 10speed gripshift for sram yet?
    No - the SEC 10s at the moment are for Shimano derailleurs only. However i just got the news that SRAM compatible shifters could be available soon.

  107. #107
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    Soon = 20 or more days ? ............

  108. #108
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    any news on SRAM 10sp gripshifts?

    in any case, I'm running X0 grips, with X0 rear d, and the new XG999 cassette... think of it as a 9-speed XX cassette... SO awesome... I don't need the 36 cog, so don't need XX, at least not with current setup (running 22/34 front... If I had 26/39, then I could use the 36)... will keep on chugging with the 9-speed until they are too hard to find.... hopefully this won't happen any time soon

    Santa Cruz Tallboy 4


  109. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by MI_canuck
    any news on SRAM 10sp gripshifts?

    in any case, I'm running X0 grips, with X0 rear d, and the new XG999 cassette... think of it as a 9-speed XX cassette... SO awesome... I don't need the 36 cog, so don't need XX, at least not with current setup (running 22/34 front... If I had 26/39, then I could use the 36)... will keep on chugging with the 9-speed until they are too hard to find.... hopefully this won't happen any time soon
    Yes i looked at this option but the cost of 999 is about the same as XX.....
    With a modified grip shift one gets the best of both.

    Any reports from anyone using this setup (other than eliflap, who seems happy....)?????

  110. #110
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    Black Cat Bone bikes

    Anyone had any contact with Black cat bone bikes re 10 speed conversion in the last month or so?
    I have sent them emails and PM from here with no reply.
    I am keen to get some 10 speed shifters......

  111. #111
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    Well i finally got a reply from black cat bones who are no longer making 10 sp GS due to a machine breakdown.

    Too bad i had just ordered 2 XX cassttes

    Anyone have 2 10sp gripshifters they want to sell me???
    If so please PM me.

    thanks

  112. #112
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    some racers asked to sram 10 speed twister and some people have seen Julien Absalon testing a pair on a race

    just wait and see .

    sorry for my poor english ....oops

  113. #113
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    Can anyone modifed gripshift to 10 sp.? And black cat bone didn't make it now?

  114. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    No - the SEC 10s at the moment are for Shimano derailleurs only. However i just got the news that SRAM compatible shifters could be available soon.
    Will those work with my current 9 speed SRAM rear derailleur, or will I need to get a new 10 speed rear to go with the cassette and the SEC when it is available?

    TIA.

    BB

  115. #115
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    here you go

    http://cgi.ebay.ph/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

    I took the liberty in asking the seller to translate his wares in english so we non german readers could understand what he is selling.

  116. #116
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    Just received this from BCB:


    Hi there,

    Yes, modified Grip Shifts have been one of the first products we developed and we still sell them.

    Our tuned GS are manufactured under tight tolerances using advanced materials to ensure a long term reliable service life. We use high strength plastic for the notch thread for a long lasting, accurate indexing, and special ABS glue plus interference attachment for a trouble free joint between the original Sram mechanism and our indexing ratchet.

    The price for a modified Sram XO set is 185€. Includes left (unmodified) and right (10 speed moded) plus the original cables and box. Payment can be done by PayPal or bank transfer.

    Lead time is a maximum of 5 working days counting from the day of the order, plus shipping time, which varies from a country to another. Usually, it takes 5 days to Europe and some 15 days to other continents.

    Best regards,
    David Díaz Blanco
    There's a feeling I get
    When I look to the West
    And my spirit is crying for leaving

  117. #117
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    Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.
    Do they modify X0 grip shifters that we can use to replace the XX 10 sp trigger shifters ( keeping the XX 10 sp rear dérailleur and 10 sp cassete)?

    Are the item sold on ebay by www*fantic26*de the same thing?

    Thank you .... JOliveira

  118. #118
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    On a related tangent, those Recon Al cassettes that came out a couple years ago, the ten speed ones that ranged 11-36 and were machined out like the XX ones, that they advertised as being 9 speed spacing (across a 10 cog range, and thus compatible with 9 speed rear derailleurs and chains) and packaged with a set of 10 speed SEC twist-shifters... turns out...they were NOT 9speed cog spacing. They were in fact ten speed spacing.

    I had setup the one I got on a super light build project but never really used it because the bike is too small for me to ride comfortably. Well I was stealing the wheelset off it this weekend to put on my gf's bike, and when I pulled the cassette off I took a set of calipers to it and the cog-center to cog center spacing is identical to 10 speed shimano/sram cassettes. That and the fact that for a supposedly wider cassette (10 cogs with 9sp spacing should be wider by the additional cog and spacer afterall) the fact than any 9 speed shifter would shift across from the biggest to smallest cogs, but never once really matching up to any cogs in between... kinda makes it obvious that they were never really nine speed spaced... and that the SEC shifters I got are also 10sp compatible (with 2:1 ratio rear derailleurs). The cassette is 160g including the lockring for the 11-36 size, and I'm putting mine on my Salsa Mukluk 2 project (going with a black/red/gold colour scheme).

    <img src="https://yoda.densan.ca/kmr/bikes/reconal1136.JPG">
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  119. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by josliver View Post
    Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.
    Do they modify X0 grip shifters that we can use to replace the XX 10 sp trigger shifters ( keeping the XX 10 sp rear dérailleur and 10 sp cassete)?

    Are the item sold on ebay by www*fantic26*de the same thing?

    Thank you .... JOliveira
    I don't think they are the same. And this is probably not the forum for this, but I have a set of *fantic26* grip shifters for XX 10sp rear derailleur and XX 10sp cassette. They have worked perfectly for me for a few months now.
    You can contact the maker, Sven, directly:
    [email protected]
    They are also cheaper than the BCB ones.

  120. #120
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    Black Cat Bone

    Quote Originally Posted by josliver View Post
    Could you please tell me how to contact David Dias Blanco.
    Black Cat Bone <[email protected]>
    There's a feeling I get
    When I look to the West
    And my spirit is crying for leaving

  121. #121
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    Thank you.
    Do you know which is better, the www*fantic26*de or the BCB convertion?

    Thanks.

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