"Relative" weight decrease help....- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    "Relative" weight decrease help....

    Not going for a weight weenie build for sure so what I am looking at here is weight weenie makeover advice in terms of salvaging an existing bike to get it where I want as opposed to the undoubtedly more expensive route of taking a huge loss (ie, selling) and starting over......which I will do if it makes sense however.

    Situation is that my current trailbike (subject of makeover) is too much frankly for this girly man. Another problem is that I like to stand and pedal much more now which got me thinking about replacing my Ventana with another FS bike that would resist bobbing more....which I am open to if that makes sense.

    Goal is to get a trailworthy FS bike in the mid to high 20s such that I will have a FS bike (~4 - 5 inches) at my disposal and can climb...

    Way I see it, options are (1) sell complete bike and start over (Moto-lite, Hammerhead, Flux, 575, 5.5, etc.), (2) sell frame and replace with more appropriate frame as well as part out brakes, wheels, fork, at a minimum or (3) get air shock for current frame and part out some stuff as in (2).

    Cost of course is a factor and as you all probably know, it is tough to estimate total cost after selling off stuff but the idea of a more user-friendly frame for standing climbing appeals to me though I love Ventana as a company.

    Any words of wisdom? Bike is currently in low 30s right now.

    * 2004 Large blue X-5 w/ quad bearings with 6" rockers
    * newly PUSHed Vanilla RC (7.875"x2.25")
    * 2005 Marzocchi All Mountain 1 fork
    * Syncros DS28 rims with Gold Hope Bulb hubs and DT Competition spokes/brass nipples (built by Larry Mettler of course)
    * Kenda Cortez 2.4 tires
    * Hope gold wheel skewers
    * Magura Louise FR brakes w/ 210mm front/190mm rear rotors
    * Thomson stem
    * Thomson post
    * WTB Laser V Stealth Saddle
    * DGC seatpost clamp
    * Easton EA70 riser bars
    * new SRAM X.0 shifters
    * new X.9 rear der
    * XT front der
    * XT 752 cranks with Race Face bashguard
    * Shimano 545 pedals
    * ODI lock-on Rogue shorty grips
    * XT Cassette
    * SRAM 9-speed chain (cant remember model)
    * Cane Creek S-2 headset

    Thanks in advance!

    Cheers

    (note: picture has old Romic and not new PUSHed Vanilla RC)<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
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  2. #2
    Don't be a sheep
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    It seems you need to look at a completely different style of bike. If you like to stand and climb I'd consider a s-path frame, Blur LT, 5.5, Ironhorse MKIII or Giant Trance/Reign. However no current full suspension really works well for extended standing climbing (the Giant NRS was the exception) so that's something to consider. I'd probably run something like a Manitou Minute 2 or 3, they're light with stable platform which will help when standing. To get a 5" bike into the 20's your really gonna have to deviate from your current bikes build mentality. Lighter wheelset, smaller rotors, lighter tires, different pedals. It's gonna be a compromise from your current bike but 28 lbs shouldn't be a stretch. Also, I don't consider it a 'true" trailbike unless it has three chainrings up front but that just me.

    Here is a Wrench Science build of a 5.5 at 27.5 lbs. Probaly more like 28.5 in the real world. Kinda pricey though.
    Intense 5.5 EVP Ball Burnished Ball Burnished 6.5lbs
    Frame Size :: 18in Center-to-Top

    Fork :: Manitou Minute Two 130mm 2005 Black 3.8lbs

    Rear Shock :: Manitou Swinger 4-Way
    Front Brake :: Hayes HFX Mag Disc 6" Black - Hydraulic 836g
    Shifter :: SRAM X.9 Twist Silver 160g
    Crank :: Shimano XT M760 Silver/Black - 22-32-44 - 175mm 870g
    Bottom Bracket :: Shimano Shimano Integrated Silver 73mm - 117mm 0g
    Front Derailleur :: Shimano XT M760 Top Swing Silver 123g
    Cassette :: Shimano XT M760 Silver - 11-34 264g
    Rear Derailleur :: SRAM X.9 Silver 256g
    Chain :: SRAM PC-99 Silver 294g
    Pedals :: Crank Brothers Candy SL Grey 294g
    Headset :: Cane Creek S-6 Silver - Threadless - 1 1/8in 119g
    Stem :: Ritchey New Pro Black - Threadless - 6° 155g
    Handlebar :: Answer ProTaper Alu 2.0" rise Black - 2in 250g
    Grip :: Pedro's Slimwalls Black 55g
    Cables :: Shimano Stainless Silver 120g
    Housing :: Shimano Housing Gray 160g
    Seatpost :: Thomson Elite Black 230g
    Saddle :: WTB Pure V Stealth Black - Male - Anatomic 235g
    Front Tire :: Continental Vertical Pro UST (K) Black/Black - 2.3in - Tubeless 750g
    Rear Tire :: Continental Vertical Pro UST (K) Black/Black - 2.3in - Tubeless 750g
    Factory Wheel :: Mavic CrossMax XL Disc Black 1805g
    Skewers :: Mavic Composite QR Black 110g
    Last edited by Rivet; 08-08-2005 at 12:37 AM.
    "Do not touch the trim"

  3. #3
    Retrograde Customs
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    I'm thinkin smaller rotor in the rear and different pedals. maybe a lighter bashring and tires. i'm sure that marzocchi weighs a ton too. personally i wouldnt be overly concerned with the weight on a rig like that, i'd want to be fully confident that it'll hold up.
    Retrograde Customs

  4. #4
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    thanks guys....the build really is perfect as is since after all, I planned it this way. Plus, looks like I need the money anyhow and may have not choice but to sell the bike....

    as for the fork, it is actually not heavy...at least not for a 6" travel fork. with the steerer tube cut it weight just under 5 pounds. It is the best fork I have every ridden for a trailbike and is coil/air to help keep the weight down.

    anyway, thanks again

  5. #5
    Get your freak on!
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    I'm confused. First you say that you will never sell the ventanna. Then you go ahead and sell your dream light weight full susser.

    Now you want something in between.... hmmm.

    How about a 5 spot? Built nice and light... you know you want to...


  6. #6
    JmZ
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    Fo, man I've seen your dilemma flowing across the Titus, Ventana, and now the Weenies board. By time ya make a decision... it might be time for the Retro and Vintage board.

    The Ventana is plenty cabable of making a fairly light trailbike. My Ventana is in at 25.5 on a scale. It's a decided XC build El Feugo, but even if the X-5 is a pound heavier in the frame, it' shouldn't be too difficult to get a 27 pound bike.

    My build is as follows. Take what you can from it, if anything.

    Frame - El Feugo 2004, Fox Float R Shock.
    Fork - 2003 Zozzi Marathon (85mm)
    HS - King No Threadset
    Stem - Syntace 135mm
    Bar - Scott AT-2 LF
    Shifters - Paul's Bar Cons
    Brake Levers - Cane Creek
    Brakes - Avid Cable Disc 160 F, 140 R
    Front Mech - LX
    Crank - RF Next - Square Taper
    BB - RF Taperloc
    Post - Ritchey WCS
    Seat - Vetta Tri Shock
    Tires - Racing Ralph 2.1
    Wheels
    Front - WTB Front Hub, WS DB Spokes, Sun Sub IV Rim
    Rear - Hügi Rear Hub, WS DB Spokes, Bonti Mustang Rim, XT Cassette
    Skewers - Steel Bolt On.

    I'd look into a set of the 4" Rockers and then maybe start moving towards a XC build. It can be done.

    JmZ


    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle
    Not going for a weight weenie build for sure so what I am looking at here is weight weenie makeover advice in terms of salvaging an existing bike to get it where I want as opposed to the undoubtedly more expensive route of taking a huge loss (ie, selling) and starting over......which I will do if it makes sense however.

    Situation is that my current trailbike (subject of makeover) is too much frankly for this girly man. Another problem is that I like to stand and pedal much more now which got me thinking about replacing my Ventana with another FS bike that would resist bobbing more....which I am open to if that makes sense.

    Goal is to get a trailworthy FS bike in the mid to high 20s such that I will have a FS bike (~4 - 5 inches) at my disposal and can climb...

    Way I see it, options are (1) sell complete bike and start over (Moto-lite, Hammerhead, Flux, 575, 5.5, etc.), (2) sell frame and replace with more appropriate frame as well as part out brakes, wheels, fork, at a minimum or (3) get air shock for current frame and part out some stuff as in (2).

    Cost of course is a factor and as you all probably know, it is tough to estimate total cost after selling off stuff but the idea of a more user-friendly frame for standing climbing appeals to me though I love Ventana as a company.

    Any words of wisdom? Bike is currently in low 30s right now.

    * 2004 Large blue X-5 w/ quad bearings with 6" rockers
    * newly PUSHed Vanilla RC (7.875"x2.25")
    * 2005 Marzocchi All Mountain 1 fork
    * Syncros DS28 rims with Gold Hope Bulb hubs and DT Competition spokes/brass nipples (built by Larry Mettler of course)
    * Kenda Cortez 2.4 tires
    * Hope gold wheel skewers
    * Magura Louise FR brakes w/ 210mm front/190mm rear rotors
    * Thomson stem
    * Thomson post
    * WTB Laser V Stealth Saddle
    * DGC seatpost clamp
    * Easton EA70 riser bars
    * new SRAM X.0 shifters
    * new X.9 rear der
    * XT front der
    * XT 752 cranks with Race Face bashguard
    * Shimano 545 pedals
    * ODI lock-on Rogue shorty grips
    * XT Cassette
    * SRAM 9-speed chain (cant remember model)
    * Cane Creek S-2 headset

    Thanks in advance!

    Cheers

    (note: picture has old Romic and not new PUSHed Vanilla RC)<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->
    JmZ

    From one flat land to another.

    Advocate as if your ride depends on it...

  7. #7
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    you may in fact be right...i know it can be done...

    i really want to demo a Blur (which I will be doing soon) to see if the VPP hype is what I hope it is (ie, awesome for standing climbing which the Ventana/Turners are not).

    I also really want to try a Racer-X/HH100.....

    I also have 2 friends with new Fluxes with PUSHed shocks so that will also be an awesome test of what can be done on a horst-link to minimize bobbing while standing.....

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by bike_freak
    I'm confused. First you say that you will never sell the ventanna. Then you go ahead and sell your dream light weight full susser.

    Now you want something in between.... hmmm.

    How about a 5 spot? Built nice and light... you know you want to...
    of course you are confused....that is because I make no sense! everything used to be so much more clear till I tried single speeding and now i got sucked into the whole 29er thing so i actually blame mtbr on all my issues!

    basically, i just dont ride the Ventana cause I simply don't need 6" travel for any of my riding anymore. i certainly could make it lighter but i need the money so i am torn what to do......

    the rocky mountain was sweet but what i really need is a FS light trailbike for when I ride with certain groups of guys where my single speed hardtail may not be the best option......if I had the Rocky, I would never use it cause I would just use the single speed for that riding since it frankly does not give me much more over the hardtail.....whereas a nice 4" travel FS would be sweet....but expensive I am afraid!

    who know....maybe I will find the money I need by some other means and can just keep the Ventana AND build the lighter more racy trailbike doubt it

    i definitely would not get the 5 spot.....i much prefer the X-5 over the spot and if I put an RP3 on the X-5 it is only 6.7 pounds which is not bad at all....

  9. #9
    Get your freak on!
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    ye, maybe a VPP is a good option for you. I know I want to get a Flux

    You will be pleased to know I'm about to convert a older bike over to SS!


  10. #10
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    it is about time you are going to do the SS thing! you will love it my friend!

    i go to check out the progress of my new SS today and hope it is done....if it is, I will let you know. The target weight is about 21 pounds or less when the new fork is ready and my guess is that now, it will be about 22 with the heavier steel fork and that is with 29" wheels and a large frame with disc brakes (green brake levers of course ).

  11. #11
    Daniel the Dog
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    See if you can find a Horst link for that bike :)

    That bike is built to be a heavy duty trail bike. I'm not sure it is a worthy effort to try and make it light. It is heavy by definition.

    Why do you like the x5 better then the Spot? If it rides better then the Spot, I have to have one because the Spot is unbelievable.

    Jaybo

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