Finally, a functional superlight disc brake rotor- Mtbr.com
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 100 of 240
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46

    Finally, a functional superlight disc brake rotor

    I have always seen posts on this and other forums promising light rotors. Some are gimmicky. Some sacrifice performance or safety in the name of gram-shaving. Others come with all kinds of restrictions. Most just never actually become an available product.

    We are about to launch Scrub Components, www.scrubcomponents.com. I would like to invite everyone to check out our site, and am hoping to use this thread as a place where you can ask questions directly to the manufacturers of Scrub rotors, as well as give us feedback about what you like, don't like, would like to see, etc. Here is a brief bullet list about these rotors:


    • Target weight (160mm) - 57 grams
    • Transfers heat 7 times more efficiently than steel
    • Matrix material is 5 times stronger than aluminum alloy, with almost zero weight penalty
    • Great wear resistance - Our material does not require a coating to provide a durable and high performance friction surface, so there is nothing to wear off!
    • Precision machined braking surface to ensure flatness
    • Made in the USA


    Thanks everyone for checking out the post, and let's hear those questions and comments!

    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    Looks interresting, i'll agree with you on these light weight rotors that give up perforance and safety for loss of weight its not right.

    Will anyone get prototypes to try out and test?

  3. #3
    Hack Racer
    Reputation: Cheers!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,559
    Interesting. Metal Matrix Aluminum brake rotors.
    Are they made from casting DURALCAN into sheet and then water jet cutting them?

    What run out can you guarantee with these rotors?

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    113
    my only question is will the rotors 'cup' with use like the stans rotors do?

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Davide's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,914
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    I have always seen posts on this and other forums promising light rotors. Some are gimmicky. Some sacrifice performance or safety in the name of gram-shaving. Others come with all kinds of restrictions. Most just never actually become an available product.


    www.scrubcomponents.com
    neat, what is the target weight of the 180 and will it be compatible with Magura Marta?

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Hand/of/Midas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    2,676
    heres the first" what people want to see".

    exactly what Boone used to make, and now you cant get. those things are in demand like none other.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hey everyone,
    Thanks for all the questions and comments, this is exactly what we were hoping for with this thread! I'll try and run through all the above questions as best as I can:

    Tiffster: We have been testing our rotors for about a year now, so we aren't handing out any prototypes at the moment. Thanks for the interest though, and of course we plan to introduce more products as things get rolling!

    Cheers!: While the technology and "MMC" label are similar, our material is not Duralcan exactly. Of course I am not going to give all of our secrets away yet! I don't have any run-out specs right in front of me, but we've been testing for quite a while without any problems. The rotors are really flat to begin with, but we've gone an extra step to machine the braking surface to ensure that they run flat and straight.

    onespeedfreak: I'm assuming when you say "cupping," the braking surface wears unevenly in the middle? At the risk of sounding repetitive here, we've done a lot of testing on different bikes, different riding styles, and different climates. We have been very excited about the durability of our rotors over the past year. We have not seen any out of the ordinary problems, and feel that they wear very similarly to stainless. Of course this is assuming they are broken in properly and the correct pads are used (organic/resin pads only).

    Davide: I should have a weight to within a gram or so in the next week for the 180mm disc. I'll be sure to post it here when I have a more reliable figure. The 160mm rotors come in at right about 57g, and as a safe assumption the 180mm discs will be about half of an "average" stainless steel rotor.

    Hand/of/Midas: What product from Boone are you talking about exactly? Forgive me if that is an ignorant question...

    Again, thanks everyone for checking us out, we are very excited to get input from the folks at this forum! Happy Trails,

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  8. #8
    illuminator82
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    251
    simply can you use these with avid or hayes in stock brake form??
    thnx

  9. #9
    A Real Winner.
    Reputation: sonyisdope's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    863
    Of course I gotta ask. . .Any plans for a centerlock version?
    www.cycletofitness.com It's only a super-awesome website for a super-awesome store. Just click it. I dare you.

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    582
    When can I buy a pair?

  11. #11
    No. Just No.
    Reputation: Circlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    5,156
    This thread is worthless without pictures. Cough it up and show us the goods.

  12. #12
    Hack Racer
    Reputation: Cheers!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,559
    Does anyone remember the canadian company that was making metal matrix aluminum bicycle disc brake rotors? I think they were selling them a while back (3 to 4 years ago?)

    http://www.gokinetix.com/home.html

    Anyone know why these guys are no longer in business?

    I wasn't into cycling back then. But I was into formula SAE and we ran metal matrix aluminum brake rotors for our race car. We were sponsored by Alcan at the time and we had them cast us brake rotors from Duralcan and we waterjet cut them.

    If I remember correctly there are different types of metal matrix aluminums, where hte reinforcement can be continuous and particulate. How much ceramic that gets added to the alloy also changes it's final properties. Typically you run soft organic pads. Only two production cars used metal matrix aluminum brake rotors that come to mind. One is the Plymouth prowler and the series 1 Lotus Elise. For the formula SAE car we purchased plymouth prowler pads (sponsored by Chrysler at the time) and machined the pad to the same size as our wilwood pads for our wilwood calipers.

    For experience I can tell you two things with Metal Matrix Aluminum brake rotors.
    1.) Typically the coefficient of friction is lower than steel. Meaning when you apply the brakes the intial bite or grab from the pads is low. Brake pressure needed to be somewhat higher than a metallic pad and steel rotor to achieve the same braking force.

    2.) Thermal expansion is quite high and is a problem at high temperatures. The failure point of the rotors was at the mounting holes. Where in the rotor fails by creep at the pointing point and cracks.

    In the end I guess if people are using Stan's Notube aluminum brake rotors with a ceramic coating without dieing than this should work no problems at all. Personally I think aluminum (even if it has a metal matrix) is the worse possible material to make brake rotors with.

    edit: Here is an old thread talking about the Kinetix brakes and pads. http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.ph...hlight=KINETIX
    Last edited by Cheers!; 03-10-2008 at 09:22 PM.

  13. #13
    banned
    Reputation: nino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    5,770

    well...

    as CHEERS! already summed it up quite well i just ask the question if anyone knows of a racecar, mororcycle or big manufacturer doing such "matrix"-rotors.

    you have to look at motorsports racing to see what works and what doesn't and i don't think that people have been sleeping over the last coule of decades so that a small bike "company" can show up and tell them how it's done

    "matrix" sounds oh-so cool....i don't like gimmicks regardless of their sophisticated names.
    i remember Specialized had those Metal Matrix aluminium frames.M3...M4..M5...those things were such tanks and had no special numbers at all. but people would be like "oooohhhh,Matrix aluminium, awesome stuff"

    we will see. i personally don't eat it.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    288
    Is that because you don't sell it? Shut up, nino, if its light and it works hooray. They are expensive ($135 per rotor) so it will be a niche market even inside the market for rotors, and even then, some will take steel by choice. Give them a chance.

  15. #15
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    I think they are too expensive
    just compare with stans, at $95

    BUT great they will make it in 180mm

    Do you have any plans to make them also in 203mm?

    Then I would consider them for my light enduro bike

    thanks

  16. #16
    Hack Racer
    Reputation: Cheers!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,559
    Quote Originally Posted by nino
    as CHEERS! already summed it up quite well i just ask the question if anyone knows of a racecar, mororcycle or big manufacturer doing such "matrix"-rotors.

    you have to look at motorsports racing to see what works and what doesn't and i don't think that people have been sleeping over the last coule of decades so that a small bike "company" can show up and tell them how it's done

    "matrix" sounds oh-so cool....i don't like gimmicks regardless of their sophisticated names.
    i remember Specialized had those Metal Matrix aluminium frames.M3...M4..M5...those things were such tanks and had no special numbers at all. but people would be like "oooohhhh,Matrix aluminium, awesome stuff"

    we will see. i personally don't eat it.
    HEY! Don't mock my M4 Stumpjumper hardtail. It's one of my favorite bikes that I ride all the time.

    Btw since the coefficient of friction is so low with MMC rotors you can't/shouldn't run them in the wet. You can kiss braking performance goodbye in teh wet.

  17. #17
    banned
    Reputation: nino's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    5,770
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheers!
    HEY! Don't mock my M4 Stumpjumper hardtail. It's one of my favorite bikes that I ride all the time.

    Btw since the coefficient of friction is so low with MMC rotors you can't/shouldn't run them in the wet. You can kiss braking performance goodbye in teh wet.
    My wife still has a A2 (or was it A3?) "Metal Matrix" Stumpj and i was also raving about my M4 S-Works BACK THEN...but that was about 7 years ago and those frames weighed 1500g when Scott offered the Scandium Team Issue at 1150g with better stiffness and much better handling anyway....not that the S-works was bad, not at all. i loved it until i rode the Scott the 1st time....the Scott just raised the bar

    ahh--the good old times:
    http://light-bikes.com/bikegallery/B...ting.asp?id=94

    http://light-bikes.com/bikegallery/B...ing.asp?id=125

    and with v-brakes i don't care about any wondermatrix rotors anyway

  18. #18
    himom!
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    684
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheers!
    HEY! Don't mock my M4 Stumpjumper hardtail. It's one of my favorite bikes that I ride all the time.

    Btw since the coefficient of friction is so low with MMC rotors you can't/shouldn't run them in the wet. You can kiss braking performance goodbye in teh wet.
    Really? So there goes one of the main reasons to use disc over cantilever brakes.....

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hey everyone,

    Looks like we had a busy and at times heated evening! As usual, I will try and go through and answer any questions along the way.

    brook_63@yahoo.com: There is nothing abnormal about the dimensions of our rotor. While I'm not going to get myself in trouble with a blanket statement about every brake available, we have tested the prototypes in most of the common brakesets with no clearance or compatibility issues. The only requirement at this time is that you use an organic or resin brake pad, as the metallic types will destroy your rotor in a hurry.

    sonyisdope: We are definitely planning to include a centerlock version, but probably not until the 6-bolt versions gain some interest among mountain bikers. The more people who email or post demanding a centerlock version, the more quickly they will become a reality! Also, STS asked about 203mm rotors, and they fall in the same boat. We would like to build some, but initially they are on the wish list until we get enough support and requests for them.

    elephant: That's the spirit! We are expecting the first run of 160mm and 180mm discs to be available sometime in April. I will of course keep you all updated as we get closer.

    Circlip: I was waiting for someone to ask for pics. I will not have the final product pics for a few weeks, but I will post a nice shot of one of our final prototypes for you. The design will be identical, the real thing will just be a bit more polished aesthetically. Let me know what you think!

    Cheers!/nino: Finally we get to the strong opinions. I'm not going to get all defensive, as we welcome all feedback and expected some critics. It sounds like you guys have a little background about the material, and you are correct that there are MANY different formulas, methods of producing, and applications for MMC's. The whole point of a "composite" material at all is to have the ability to tweak the properties slightly for each application. For example, if there is too much SiC, the material becomes brittle. Different production methods also make some MMC's unsuitable for brake rotors.

    We did not invent this stuff, and will not claim to have done so. The same product is used on sport bikes. You can get them as aftermarket bling for your Harley. Our engineer/machinist was recently asked to build some for a snowmobile manufacturer for their racing sleds. I also know that one of the big boys in mountain bike disc brakes was testing the material at the same time as we were, built prototypes, and determined that it was a great material for rotors. It has been shelved for the time being purely because they are too expensive for a large company to take a chance on.

    We have run these rotors in wet/muddy conditions. The drop in performance is not any different than a drop in performance using stainless equipment. Yes, in a lab the friction coefficient is slightly lower than stainless, mainly due to the requirement of organic pads. Once broken in properly, I think the difference is undetectable on the trail. I've been running a pair hard on my Epiphany for over a year and have not once been unable to stop quickly enough.

    Thanks everyone, keep it coming! We value everyone's input, and just hope that our fellow riders will give us a chance to prove that this is not a gimmick. Happy Trails,

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  20. #20
    banned
    Reputation: Jerk_Chicken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    16,457
    Why am I not surprised that nino is now bashing someone who might be moving in on his territory?

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    I almost forgot, here are a few pics for you all to enjoy. As I said, the final product will be dolled up a bit, but the design is identical to these. How about some fierce discussion over what color they should be! Happy Trails,

    Chris



    This one is prior to the braking surfaces getting machined:
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    Would you/could you make a centrelock version?

    How do they hold up in gritty wet riding conditions like i ride in?

  23. #23
    A Real Winner.
    Reputation: sonyisdope's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    863
    Oh, please add a centerlock version. No one is making a good, light aftermarket centerlock rotor. If you make them, I can guarantee you will sell at least 2 rotors

    Also, I didn't really look at the website, but is there a 140mm version as well?
    www.cycletofitness.com It's only a super-awesome website for a super-awesome store. Just click it. I dare you.

  24. #24
    go chase the sunset
    Reputation: Ardent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    425
    Hmm. I have to say it does look promising, but I would like to hear many more test ride reports.

    As one of very few people in this world who have ever been willing to pay & commission Carbon-Ti custom rotors, the rotors I would be most interested in would be true ceramic rotors, the same as used in supercars & F1. I gave this a preliminary look, and to have some commissioned by an automotive supplier would be circa $5-8k for the pair, which is too much for me to pay. I'd be happy paying up to $2k for a pair of true ceramics, if someone could bring some to market.

  25. #25
    Ole
    Ole is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    1,104
    Shimano owns the Centerlock patent, and they won't let anybody else make Centerlock rotors.


    Ole.

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    2k for some rotors?

    The trouble with the centrelock (which i would LOVE) is its a shimano patent, to use it you would have to license it from Shimano - do you think there going to let that happen easily - no i dont think they will.

  27. #27
    Doesntplaywellwithmorons!
    Reputation: DeeEight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,861
    Making an MMC centerlock adapter however would be perfectly fine and in fact many centerlock to 6-bolt adapters already exist anyways.

    As to ceramic/mmc rotors in the motorsports world, EVERY Ferrari model in 2008 will feature them as standard equipment. Porsche, Audi and VW also make extensive use of them. The fact that cheers was modifying MMC-compatible pads from one sponsor (intended for their OWN MMC rotors and brake systems) to work with MMC rotors from another sponsor which no doubt didn't make their MMC the same way and then says that because they didn't work well for their Formula SAE race car that they won't work well for anyone is just an apples and oranges comparison. Its the kind of absence of common sense / outright stupidity we'd expect in statements from Nino. Plymouth wouldn't be using MMC rotors on production cars if they had problems stopping when wet. They also wouldn't be using them if they were prone to structural failures. That could lead to accidents, fatalities, lawsuits and recalls. That's pretty common sense thinking there.
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    113
    i to would love a lightweight centerlock rotor option.

    i could be wrong but i believe that any brake maker can make centerlock rotors (magura does as well). i think shimano only controls the patent on centerlock hub manufacturers.

  29. #29
    Hack Racer
    Reputation: Cheers!'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    2,559
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeEight
    Making an MMC centerlock adapter however would be perfectly fine and in fact many centerlock to 6-bolt adapters already exist anyways.

    As to ceramic/mmc rotors in the motorsports world, EVERY Ferrari model in 2008 will feature them as standard equipment. Porsche, Audi and VW also make extensive use of them. The fact that cheers was modifying MMC-compatible pads from one sponsor (intended for their OWN MMC rotors and brake systems) to work with MMC rotors from another sponsor which no doubt didn't make their MMC the same way and then says that because they didn't work well for their Formula SAE race car that they won't work well for anyone is just an apples and oranges comparison. Its the kind of absence of common sense / outright stupidity we'd expect in statements from Nino. Plymouth wouldn't be using MMC rotors on production cars if they had problems stopping when wet. They also wouldn't be using them if they were prone to structural failures. That could lead to accidents, fatalities, lawsuits and recalls. That's pretty common sense thinking there.
    That is an interesting post you have made. I find it quite amusing how a person who has no experience working with MMC and probably doesn't even hold an engineering degree is commenting as if he/she is an expert in the field of braking technology and design. Exactly how much knowledge and/or experience do you have designing braking systems? Please enlighten me, I'm curious to know and I'm sure many here are curious to know too. You keep popping into threads trying to pass your opinions off as facts.

    Unfortunately your common sense is not very good at all. You are making the same argument I'm making without any facts to back up your claim with the only difference being you believe they work fine and I do not. Exactly what bearing does your point have when you say “EVERY Ferrari model in 2008 will feature them as standard equipment”? So what if Ferrari uses them on their cars? To use your own words comparing Ferraris and bicycles is really “just an apples and oranges comparison.”

    The only thing I can agree with you on your poorly constructed posting is that Chrysler did make MMC brake rotors work on the Plymouth prowler.

    Do you know why it worked? Have you held a Prowler's brake rotors in your hands? Can you explain to me why they work? Do you understand why it was designed in that way and exactly what features allows them to work?

    You can not copy a standard rotors dimensions and features and make it out of MMC aluminum and pretend it will work.

    The design of the prowler’s brake rotor is vastly different than what bicycle disc brake rotor is. The brake rotors we had designed for the formula SAE race car mimicked what a traditional 6 bolt flat disc brake for bicycles are, completely flat and secured to the hub via bolts. In our case we relied on the clamp force between the wheel and the hub with the wheel studs locating the disc brake rotor. This design does not work in elevated temperatures. You get cracking along the PCD of the mounting holes due to creep from thermal expansion. We had not understood what was happening until we had a failure. If you look at a Plymouth prowler's brake rotor design you can see a deep relief cut into the brake rotor just before the hat of the rotor. Without this relief the prowler's brake rotors will meet the same fate as what we have found. The Hat will crack. The relief is cut into the rotor to relieve stress due to the creep on the hat from thermal expansion of the rotor. No such relief was done on our FSAE race car, and none that I can see on the gokinetix brake rotors, and none I can see from the original poster's product.

    Now let's talk about why Plymouth prowler brake pads worked and how we figured out they would work. You make it seem like all we did was order parts from one supplier and ordered another set of parts from another. You couldn’t be more wrong.

    Typical braking systems comprised of organic compound, semi-metallic, to ceramic based brake pads have a coefficient of friction of 0.20 to 0.68 between the pad and steel. We obtained said brake pads from a Plymouth prowler and tested the pads with the Duralcan rotors. We spun the disc up and varied the applied force until the disc stalled. By knowing the torque on the rotor that spun it, and the amount of applied force required to stall the disc we were able to calculate the coefficient of friction to be 0.43, quite acceptable for use in my opinion.

    As to the wetness concern. The braking system needs to be designed to provide greater hydraulic pressure to exert greater normal force on the braking pad. In the wet conditions this greater normal force quickly increases temperature of the pads and rotor surfaces to remove the moisture. You standards Hayes, Avid, Hope calipers and master cylinders were not designed to provide this extra normal force. Hence why performance will drop quickly when you get the system wet.

  30. #30
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Hand/of/Midas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    2,676
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker


    Hand/of/Midas: What product from Boone are you talking about exactly? Forgive me if that is an ignorant question...

    Again, thanks everyone for checking us out, we are very excited to get input from the folks at this forum! Happy Trails,

    Chris

    the Boone Ti SS cassette cogs, and the TI SS chainrings that are one piece and take the place of the spider.

    https://i8.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/c4/f6/1154_1.JPG

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Davide's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,914

    La bicicletta e' la bicicletta!

    Quote Originally Posted by nino

    you have to look at motorsports racing to see what works and what doesn't and i don't think that people have been sleeping over the last coule of decades so that a small bike "company" can show up and tell them how it's done
    No not really, motorsports applications and cycling application are a universe different. If you could just take motorsports applications and transfer them to bycicling we will all be riding carbon fiber disks. They are lighter (about half the weight), stronger, great braking surface but unfortunately with temperature operating ranges in the stratosphere ... that is 400C to 1200C ... in about 0.5 seconds

    as far as small company ... I think to remember you produce a MTB titanium cassette that is supposed to show Shimano (!) how it is done
    Attached Images Attached Images

  32. #32
    TranceX Rider
    Reputation: Onie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    948

    Then let it rip!

    The NoTubes rotors wouldn't do any good for my application, i.e. riding style & conditions... I'm in for a CL version to0! So, no more adapters needed! As promising as it looks like, this has to be another waiting game. LoL! Well, just hope they'd come up with it real quick!
    Quote Originally Posted by jcatienza
    There was no need to scare potential buyers and burn bridges "buddy"
    Tell me now, what's Product testing all bout then?

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hello everyone,
    Well another day of discussion, some of which seems to be getting a little nasty. I will hit on a few key points that I feel I should. We are glad to see that there is something happening on this thread though, thanks to all!

    Centerlock: I have said that we would like to produce a Centerlock version. That being said, if we got past the "wish list" stage, we of course would look closely at our options legally (if any). I do not believe that using MMC to build the adapter would be of any benefit, except to make it more expensive than necessary. I'm glad everyone is chiming in though, and at least we're finding out that there is some interest when the time comes.

    Kinetix: I have seen this site before, haven't heard much about the company or product. From the old thread that was pasted here, it looks like their unavailability has nothing to do with the rotor or material. We'll leave it at that.

    I'm not going to get into a heated battle about the material, and we are not naive enough to think that we're going to show up somewhere like MTBR and win everyone over without question. Let's face it, there will always be skeptics and critics, and that is OK.

    Do I believe our product is perfect? No, of course not. If manufacturers waited around and only released perfect products, no progress would ever be made. We are quite aware of the benefits and drawbacks of such an exotic material. I also know that we have done our due diligence and designed a solid rotor which is super light, performs admirably under nearly all conditions, and is quite robust. We have addressed stress points and hotspots using Finite Element Analysis, and are finally comfortable releasing a product to let real mountain bikers decide for themselves. I continue to encourage all questions and comments!

    Enough of all of that, what did everyone think of the design? I was hoping to get a couple "Hey those are cool" posts after uploading a few pics. What colors does everyone like for their bikes? We're still finalizing the look, so I'd love to hear what everyone thinks.

    Thanks again for making this an exciting thread, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    5
    not true. Magura makes a centerlock rotor, ventidisc

  35. #35
    Doesntplaywellwithmorons!
    Reputation: DeeEight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,861
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheers!
    That is an interesting post you have made. I find it quite amusing how a person who has no experience working with MMC and probably doesn't even hold an engineering degree is commenting as if he/she is an expert in the field of braking technology and design.
    I've worked with MMC's thanks. I've been saying for a good ten years now that they're the way to go for bicycle disc brake rotors if not for the expense of manufacturing them.

    SNIP YOUR RANTING AND RAVINGS.... I don't put up with them from nino, why would I put up with them from less credibility than he has. You are trying to translate the fact that you couldn't get them to work properly in your attempts at mix-matching rotors and pad as proof that NOBODY else can either (much as Nino will put down other's products which compete with his own). Well just because you were too stupid to adapt the technology properly for one application, doesn't mean everyone else will be for adapting them for other applications. I mentioned other auto makers because for THEIR specific applications, they made the stuff work properly and reliably. They're not marketing the things to be bolted onto Fords or Chevies though, or to use pads from their brakes with rotors made by someone else and put onto chassis of something else altogether. If you'd had even a mediocum of common sense you'd have gone with complete pads and rotors from ONE maker. Then again, if you'd had any common sense left you'd not have posted in this thread at all.
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  36. #36
    mbtr member
    Reputation: scottzg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    5,318
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    Enough of all of that, what did everyone think of the design? I was hoping to get a couple "Hey those are cool" posts after uploading a few pics. What colors does everyone like for their bikes? We're still finalizing the look, so I'd love to hear what everyone thinks.
    Those ARE cool. The shark fins that extend into the brake track looks really neat.

    don't mind dee8, he just likes to argue on the internet, and knows enough to really get people going.
    "Things that are complex are not useful, Things that are useful are simple."
    Mikhail Kalashnikov

  37. #37
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    I like the design!!

    for the color, I would choose GOLD

    please post 180mm rotor weight when available
    thanks

  38. #38
    go chase the sunset
    Reputation: Ardent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    425
    For me, a rotor is a rotor designwise, I don't really care about its look or colour. What I care about is the weight, heat dissipation, and the decceleration. Magura publishes its decceleration numbers with the stock rotors and systems, and if you would publish the comparison numbers of decceleration for the same system using your rotors, along with a thermal dissipation comparison, you would go a long way to win the WW crowd over.

    Edit: I also look for companies that are willing & flexible enough to do one-off custom bespoke work. The above points are pretty much the mainstay of the high-dollar WW crowd. While some give some give more preference to aesthetics, the predominant focus is on the weight and the performance delta incurred by spending more on fancy parts. There have been plenty of companies who have promised the earth but turned out to have been pedalling junk / never arrived to market. We're all naturally wary of hype for things that there are no numbers/trusted rider reports for. If you would release your numbers or send your product to some test riders & bike review sites/journals, you'd find your welcome much more enthusiastic, I have to say.

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    113
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    Hello everyone,

    Enough of all of that, what did everyone think of the design? I was hoping to get a couple "Hey those are cool" posts after uploading a few pics. What colors does everyone like for their bikes? We're still finalizing the look, so I'd love to hear what everyone thinks.


    Chris
    i think as long as design works well, it looks good. as far as color, it's hard to beat black.

  40. #40
    pedal pusher
    Reputation: f3rg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    2,712
    $135 for rotors and pads? No thanks.

  41. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    149
    Chris,

    Are you planning to sell the rotors individually so that we can run different sizes front and rear?

    Are you still on track for April availability?

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hey everyone,
    A much more civilized day today, I'm glad to see that. Not a lot that I need to comment on today, but here it is:

    Ardent: Thank you for a thoughtful post, I agree with many of the points that you have made. The reason I ask about the look and color is that while some may not care, personally if I was going to buy a high-end item I would want it to work great and look great as well. Please do not mistake our questions on this thread about the looks as a ploy to sell a garbage product with a fancy finish. We absolutely want form to follow function, and have stated on our website that our goal is to provide the best components money can buy. I just thought it would be fun to let other riders voice an opinion on how that component might look in the end.

    Second, I am right there with you wishing that we had some reviews in all the top bike magazines. That would be fantastic! We are working on that, and hopefully you'll start seeing our name mentioned more and more. Besides the design work that has gone into building a sturdy product, we have had a lot of riders pushing them in different climates, on different bikes and with different riding styles for over a year. There is no arguing that this ride testing has not been terribly public up to this point. However, the responses from these riders is a large part of what we've used to tweak the design and finally feel confident to take the leap into production.

    Finally, I have spent enough time on this and other forums, and I know there is always someone claiming they have found the holy grail, only to vanish back into cyberspace. We knew this would be a tough crowd to please, which is why I am here answering questions on this thread!

    Thanks again everyone, I look forward to keeping this thread alive and encourage all comments and questions! Happy Trails,

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by erringtonnc
    Chris,

    Are you planning to sell the rotors individually so that we can run different sizes front and rear?

    Are you still on track for April availability?
    Hey erringtonnc,
    The rotors are going to be sold per wheel, so running a 160 and 180 will not be a problem. As of now we are still shooting for April, hopefully earlier than later! Thanks!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  44. #44
    go chase the sunset
    Reputation: Ardent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    425
    Well, you're certainly saying all the right words, and I'm to some extent preliminarially interested in your product. I'd like to wish you the best of luck with getting your designs to the final hurdle of mass manufacture, and I hope that you put what you're saying into action. If you want to talk & answer questions from a much larger dedicated community of WW guys (mostly roadies however), check out the weightweenies forums on Starbike. As one last question, do you actually have hard numbers, or if not, do you plan to obtain some?

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hey everyone,

    Ardent: Thanks for the encouragement, we would like nothing more than to live up to the hype and even exceed it! I will keep everyone posted here as we get closer. It looks like we should still be on track to have rotors available sometime in early to mid-April. I will also post a reliable weight for the 180mm disc in the next few days. If anyone has any more questions or comments, I'd be happy to hear them. Thanks again, and happy trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Motomatt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    172

    Good job!

    I like the look of these rotors, as far as color my vote would be blue,black, or gold.in that order

    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    I almost forgot, here are a few pics for you all to enjoy. As I said, the final product will be dolled up a bit, but the design is identical to these. How about some fierce discussion over what color they should be! Happy Trails,

    Chris



    This one is prior to the braking surfaces getting machined:

  47. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Motomatt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    172

    Good job!

    I want 160/140 set up please.
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    Hey everyone,

    Ardent: Thanks for the encouragement, we would like nothing more than to live up to the hype and even exceed it! I will keep everyone posted here as we get closer. It looks like we should still be on track to have rotors available sometime in early to mid-April. I will also post a reliable weight for the 180mm disc in the next few days. If anyone has any more questions or comments, I'd be happy to hear them. Thanks again, and happy trails!

    Chris

  48. #48
    The MTB Lab
    Reputation: pastajet's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    2,439
    Good luck with the endeavour, looks promising, pushing the limits is always fun! But waaaay to expensive for my blood. I am still using my good old Marta SL rotors and the Alligator are like $18 - $19, yes not as light but affordable, haven't tested the heat issues much with any rotors. Along the lines of the Titanium cassettes.

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hello everyone,
    I just wanted to chime in before the weekend arrives. It looks like there is only a couple things I can comment on:

    The 140mm disc size in the same boat as the 203mm and Centerlock versions we've discussed here before. We are definitely interested in making them, and the more people who ask for them the quicker they will become a reality! For our initial "pilot" run, we will be offering a 160mm and 180mm option, but would like to continue adding if we get continued requests for other sizes.

    I want to thank everyone again who has contributed to this thread. We are taking all praise and criticism and hoping to use it to provide a product that people want. I hope everyone has a great weekend, and we'll hopefully be back here next week! Happy Trails,

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  50. #50
    fella
    Reputation: slyboots's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    272
    I'd buy them if they really work as advertised. I like the looks.
    member of the World Conspiracy against Paranoia

  51. #51
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    any update in the 180mm info?

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    STS: Thanks for staying on me about this, I will get a ballpark weight (within a gram or two) before the weekend and post it here.

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    56
    I would like a 140 centerlock version
    good luck guys!

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    Yup - i'd LOVE 160 & 180mm centrelock ones

    Fingers crossed - hope it works out guys.

  55. #55
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    184
    Any updates on when these will be available? I am ready to start riding....

  56. #56
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hey everyone,

    Thank you so much for the continued interest in our rotors. We are scheduled to have our first batch of 160mm rotors available in the next few weeks. Very soon, the website will be updated so that they can be purchased directly through www.scrubcomponents.com. When that change is made, I will be sure to leave a message on this thread to let you guys know!

    Also, I am still working on a weight for the 180mm, as we had a small setback for that size during manufacturing. As soon as we get a better handle on when those will finally be available, I will let everyone know. Thanks again, and feel free to keep those questions coming! Happy Trails,

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  57. #57
    TranceX Rider
    Reputation: Onie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    948
    Neat! Hope you've got CL rotors coming up as well!

    Kudos!

    ...awaiting....
    Quote Originally Posted by jcatienza
    There was no need to scare potential buyers and burn bridges "buddy"
    Tell me now, what's Product testing all bout then?

  58. #58
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    1,761
    don't think they actually said they'd be making centerlock rotors...

    though it would be cool if they did. Are you singltraker?

  59. #59
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Hello Everyone!

    I know this is taking a lot longer than many people hoped (including myself!) but I have a ballpark weight for the 180mm discs that I am comfortable sharing here. The finished product may be a bit off of this, but most likely lighter. The current target weights are as follows:

    160mm Scrub Components rotor - 57 grams
    180mm Scrub Components rotor - 75 grams


    As far as availability, I'm happy to announce that we should have our first 160mm discs available for sale in 2-3 weeks. The website will be updated soon to start taking pre-orders, and I will let everyone here know when that change is made! I don't have a date quite yet for the availability of the 180mm discs, but we are pushing to get them done as quickly as possible.

    I know everyone continues to ask about Centerlock, and at this time it looks like the only option is an adapter. Hopefully we will be able to introduce our own, "weight conscious," adapter in the future!

    I'm still checking in often, so if anyone has any more comments or questions, we'd love to hear them. Thanks again, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  60. #60
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    232
    if these thinks don't give up on performance, you'd be surprised how many 203mm rotors you'd sell to the DH crowd. they'd be 1/2 the weight of the lightest rotors out there

  61. #61
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    23
    Yeah that's just what I'm thinking. If their coefficient is up there with steel and they don't shatter after 15 minutes of heavy braking on an alpine track I'll be after 2 x 200mm and 2 x 180mm from you! My Oro rotors are 177/136 respectively, and whilst I know the Alligator Windcutters save a bit there's not a massive amount in it.

  62. #62
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    same here!

    my vote for 203/180mm alu rotors

    perfect for my light enduro mtb

  63. #63
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    That's sad to here about no centrelock version - are shimano Not allowing it? (im not sure how the patent on that one works?)

    I don't like using adapters for CL - i had a hassle using them!

  64. #64
    Nightriding rules SuperModerator
    Reputation: crisillo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    20,787
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffster
    That's sad to here about no centrelock version - are shimano Not allowing it? (im not sure how the patent on that one works?)

    I don't like using adapters for CL - i had a hassle using them!

    it's just a matter of paying for the patent I suppose (magura makes CL rotors), but I suppose for a small component maker the patent use cost could be too much..

  65. #65
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    Im not so sure - IIRC the hub patern is under patent but im not sure the rotors are..... They came out in 03 so the design is 5 years old already!


    Someone needs to come out with a new method like centrelock (wink, wink) that uses a 6 hole system.

  66. #66
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    5,401
    I'm likin' the 160 at that weight. Magura charges like $75 for their 160 mm at 115 gr. So another $60 for another 57 gr of rotating weight savings seems reasonable.

    I run 200 in the front, so nothing there for me yet.
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  67. #67
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46

    Major website update!

    Hello Everyone,
    I just wanted to thank everyone again for your interest in our rotors on this thread! I also wanted to announce here that we are now accepting pre-orders on our 160mm and 180mm rotors as well as our Ti hardware. I invite you to check out our website which has been updated this weekend.

    As noted on the site, the first batch of 160mm discs and the Ti hardware will be available in approximately 2-3 weeks. The 180mm discs are still a bit farther out, probably in 4-6 weeks.

    I am still checking in on this forum often, so please do not hesitate to ask any questions or leave comments here. Thanks again, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  68. #68
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,483
    I just went to pre-order a 160mm rotor. Your shipping is a little steep. Large envelope flat rate Priority shipping is $4.60 from NY, NY 10005 to my address in Blaine, Wa 98230. Your product is already borderline too expensive. Please do not try and make more profit on the shipping.

  69. #69
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    I just went to pre-order a 160mm rotor. Your shipping is a little steep. Large envelope flat rate Priority shipping is $4.60 from NY, NY 10005 to my address in Blaine, Wa 98230. Your product is already borderline too expensive. Please do not try and make more profit on the shipping.
    BlownCivic: First, thanks for checking out our site and product. We do ship USPS priority (which starts at $4.60 in the continental US) because it seems to be the quickest, most inexpensive route for everyone. We do not, however, simply drop your expensive rotors and bolts into those free Flat Rate envelopes because they are quite flimsy and offer no protection in transit. Our rotors a packed a bit more thoroughly, so the shipping charge of $6.00 covers shipping, handling, and packaging materials. I ensure you that we are definitely not making a profit on our shipping.

    I hope this clarifies things a bit, feel free to email me directly, chris at scrubcomponents dot com, if you have any more questions. Thanks everyone, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  70. #70
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    $6 shipping!?!

    Whats to complain about $6 shipping - i'd be well chuffed if shipping was that cheap here in the UK!

  71. #71
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,483
    Well there appears to be something amiss with my attempts at pre-ordering with regards to the shipping. When I try, the shipping comes up at $15, and the drop down menu has no further options.

  72. #72
    meow, meow.
    Reputation: J. Random Psycho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,482
    Something that is critical for me: what about rotor operation at sub-freezing temperatures? Like -30 Celsius?

    I also vote for the weight-conscious centerlock option in 160 and 180mm sizes. As for the color, raw material color would be nice, unless the coloring also plays a corrosion protective role, in which case black would quite suffice.

    Last but not least, in case the low-temperature operation is possible without much penalties, what is the prospect on overseas shipping, particularly to Russia?

  73. #73
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Motomatt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    172
    I've used the rotors for 5 rides, I really like these rotors alot, braking is very powerful and controlled.

  74. #74
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by J. Random Psycho
    Something that is critical for me: what about rotor operation at sub-freezing temperatures? Like -30 Celsius?
    Wow, I can't say we've tested them in such extreme temperatures! Let me ask you this, what kind of performance do you get out of a stainless steel setup in these conditions? My gut response would be that you can expect the same kind of performance from our rotors relatively. For example, if you see a significant drop in power with a stainless rotor, you will likely see a similar drop with ours.

    As far as shipping outside the US, I don't anticipate shipping to be any problem. We are currently running all of our payments through PayPal, and cannot accept other forms of payment. If you are able to have a PayPal account, you can order through the website or email to request an invoice for your order.

    Thanks everyone, keep those questions/comments coming, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  75. #75
    TranceX Rider
    Reputation: Onie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    948
    Omg! It's out already!!! And I'm digging the Shuriken style. Much better than my XTR's star...

    But no CL version! I haven't followed up closely this interesting thread but would there be a chance for a CL version in the not so distant future?

    TIA!
    Quote Originally Posted by jcatienza
    There was no need to scare potential buyers and burn bridges "buddy"
    Tell me now, what's Product testing all bout then?

  76. #76
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    85
    Quote Originally Posted by Motomatt
    I've used the rotors for 5 rides, I really like these rotors alot, braking is very powerful and controlled.
    Hi,

    Any pictures of the rotors on your bike... just to see what they look like in action?

  77. #77
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Slobberdoggy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    934
    cool rotors

    going back to the ceramic discussion. I often wonder if one could take a used ceramic disk from auto racing and machine it down to a new bike rotor? Regardless, a ceramic bike disk would probably be too brittle.

  78. #78
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    ceramic rotors only works well at very high temperatures
    and you don't get that in a bike

  79. #79
    meow, meow.
    Reputation: J. Random Psycho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,482
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    Wow, I can't say we've tested them in such extreme temperatures! Let me ask you this, what kind of performance do you get out of a stainless steel setup in these conditions? My gut response would be that you can expect the same kind of performance from our rotors relatively.
    I don't perceive a performance drop with sintered pads against steel rotors (then again, I don't brake as aggressively in the winter as I do when there's no snow). With organic pads, however, there is some penalty, but it still is bearable. Compared to other effects degrading braking performance at low temperatures, this one does not stand out; I just have to apply the brake somewhat harder. Actually, many people (but not me, thanks) ride with V's here in winter! For reference, my setup is: Formula Oro K24 front and rear with 160mm Hope floating rotors (which seem to have a life of their own ), Goodridge braided hose and Formula organic pads up front, stock hose and Goodridge sintered pads rear.

    One thing for sure, it's good to see a better alternative to Stan's aluminum rotors.

  80. #80
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Slobberdoggy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    934
    Quote Originally Posted by STS
    ceramic rotors only works well at very high temperatures
    and you don't get that in a bike
    My understanding was that this was solved with the road cars since their brakes have to work in freezing weather too.

  81. #81
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by Scalfred
    Hi,

    Any pictures of the rotors on your bike... just to see what they look like in action?
    Scalfred: I'm not sure if MotoMatt has pics of his setup but here's a couple different bikes we have in our personal fleet with prototype rotors installed.



    We're still thawing out here in Park City, so we went on a ride the other day that seemed dry at the bottom. Then we went around a corner and right in to a mud bog. This was my bike after 10 feet, then 10 feet back after realizing the trails were not ready yet!



    I have one more good one somewhere, but I can't seem to find it. I'll post it up later for everyone if it shows up.

    Thanks again for keeping this thread alive, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  82. #82
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Tiffster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,070
    Lovely rotors again, just not sure about having to use organic pads - they just dont last here in the UK Lucky to finish a ride with the pads intact with organics around here.

  83. #83
    the train keeps rollin
    Reputation: snowdrifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    3,213
    At $135 each for an unproven rotor, these are very attractive, if you're sniffing glue!
    beaver hunt

  84. #84
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Motomatt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    172
    Quote Originally Posted by Scalfred
    Hi,

    Any pictures of the rotors on your bike... just to see what they look like in action?

  85. #85
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Irrenarzt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    852
    Nice looking rotor. I'll chime in and say that 135 per 160 mm rotor is too high however.

    I think $200 for a 180F/160R set with Ti hardware and pads for both front and rear would be more fair pricing. I know you put your time and effort into the development of these rotors but you'll sell more volume at a more fair price point. Over $300 for the whole kit (which you are easily approaching now as pads have to be purchased separately) is too high for everyone except the doctor/lawyer/executive weight weenie crowd. You'll recoup your development costs with higher sales volume.

  86. #86
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    5,401
    Quote Originally Posted by snowdrifter
    At $135 each for an unproven rotor, these are very attractive, if you're sniffing glue!
    Many of the people here would try something to shed some grams. I have to pay $75-85 for Magura rotors. So, not too much of a stretch. I would only put them on the back for a while, thats where I seem to generate the most heat.
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  87. #87
    the train keeps rollin
    Reputation: snowdrifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    3,213
    Quote Originally Posted by ziscwg
    I have to pay $75-85 for Magura rotors
    Huh?

    $54 a rotor.

    http://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...ils.php?id=195

    Can I sell you some ocean front property in North Dakota?
    beaver hunt

  88. #88
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by Irrenarzt
    Nice looking rotor. I'll chime in and say that 135 per 160 mm rotor is too high however.

    I think $200 for a 180F/160R set with Ti hardware and pads for both front and rear would be more fair pricing. I know you put your time and effort into the development of these rotors but you'll sell more volume at a more fair price point. Over $300 for the whole kit (which you are easily approaching now as pads have to be purchased separately) is too high for everyone except the doctor/lawyer/executive weight weenie crowd. You'll recoup your development costs with higher sales volume.
    Irrenarzt: I appreciate your thoughts here, we want to hear the opinions of everyone on this thread, good and bad. I would like nothing more than to get to a point where we could offer a complete setup for the prices you suggested! Hopefully as our volume grows we can work towards that goal.

    I do want to point this out, however. I just logged on to my favorite mail-order site and dropped a pair of Hope floaters (160mm), two pairs of Kool-Stop pads, and two sets of Ti rotor bolts into my cart. My subtotal before shipping is $209.66. Keep in mind that these are at discounted mail-order prices as well, which we cannot currently compete with. I'm sure you can imagine what that total would be if you ordered this same package at your LBS.

    A similar order with Scrub Components rotors comes in about 66-68 grams lighter than this setup as well, based on a Hope floater weight of 90g.

    Also, I want to let everyone know that we are working on getting reviews out there so we can move past the perception of "unproven" rotors in the near future. We've got them in the hands of a few magazine testers, as well as a few interested OEM builders and have had nothing but praise about them up to this point!

    Anyway, thanks again everyone who has continued to be a part of this thread, I'm glad it has been this popular! Happy Trails!
    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  89. #89
    the train keeps rollin
    Reputation: snowdrifter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    3,213
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    and two sets of Ti rotor bolts into my cart.
    Remove those from your cart, get some lightweight grips instead
    beaver hunt

  90. #90
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    237
    Also, I want to let everyone know that we are working on getting reviews out there so we can move past the perception of "unproven" rotors in the near future
    Is there any type of guarantee? Like a staisfaction guarantee or something? I'm in the same boat as a lot of the other posters here. I'm definatly interested, but don't want to drop $300+ on something that hasn't been available to public yet.

  91. #91
    TranceX Rider
    Reputation: Onie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    948

    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! We're all been a guinea pig in our lifetime!


    Still don't have that mo0lah to burn yet especially no CL version!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by jcatienza
    There was no need to scare potential buyers and burn bridges "buddy"
    Tell me now, what's Product testing all bout then?

  92. #92
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46

    The MTBR Guarantee

    Quote Originally Posted by adhumston
    Is there any type of guarantee? Like a staisfaction guarantee or something? I'm in the same boat as a lot of the other posters here. I'm definatly interested, but don't want to drop $300+ on something that hasn't been available to public yet.

    adhumston: I completely see where everyone is coming from, I suppose I would be hesitant as well. We are supremely confident in our product, and have not had really any negative feedback from any testers in the past 2 years. We're getting nothing but thumbs up so far from people who are riding them for reviews or testing for OEM applications.

    That being said, here is the deal on a "satisfaction guarantee" on these. If you are sincerely interested but hesitant like adhumston, send me an email through the website, or at chris at scrubcomponents dot com. Inquire about the "MTBR guarantee."

    I don't want to spell out the details on the forum, but basically if you purchase rotors from this first batch, follow our instructions, and can provide some honest, genuine feedback on why you don't want them, we'll take them back and return your money. You just need to email me first, which is really just a gesture that you are serious about our product. This offer is not open-ended, so we can stop offering it to future purchases at any time. I don't expect any of these rotors to come back.

    I think that seems quite fair. Of course we're always appreciative of everyone's input on this thread, even the cute guinea pig pictures! Thanks everyone, and Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  93. #93
    STS
    STS is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: STS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    530
    hummm, I wanted to try one of those 180mm rotors, but they are too expensive for me

    If some day price is dropped to what I consider "logic price" then I will consider

    anyway get luck with your work

  94. #94
    monster member
    Reputation: Wheelspeed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    785
    Cool item.

    But on a side-note, this thread is becoming a bit amusing. Guys, there's always going to be things on the market that some people can't afford, get used to it. For a small number of enthusiasts, it's nice to know that something is available.

    A Ferrari is illogically expensive for me. Remind me to e-mail them that when they drop their car price to $20,000 then I'll buy one.

  95. #95
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46

    160mm Scrub rotors in stock!

    Hey everyone,
    I wanted to just thank everyone who placed pre-orders in the last couple weeks! You will be happy to hear that we now have 160mm Scrub rotors available, and are shipping on all pre-orders in the next day or two.

    If you've been hesitant to pre-order, there are a still a few that have not been purchased from this first run. The next stock date is slated for late June at this time. In that batch we will also be introducing 180mm rotors and a small run of 140mm also.

    Thanks again everyone for your support, and let me know if you have any questions or comments. Happy Trails!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  96. #96
    just ride
    Reputation: chequamagon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    1,852
    Quote Originally Posted by BlownCivic
    I just went to pre-order a 160mm rotor. Your shipping is a little steep. Large envelope flat rate Priority shipping is $4.60 from NY, NY 10005 to my address in Blaine, Wa 98230. Your product is already borderline too expensive. Please do not try and make more profit on the shipping.

    Ha! I work for a company that does mail order for a different industry. We always hear whining about shipping. Do you honestly think that the shipping cost is the only cost incurred with shipping? $6 is a steal, and he is losing money on that deal. For an item that size, it would cost around $12 from most companies, and even at that cost, shipping is still a losing enterprise. People dont pack things for free, tape isnt free, computers are not free, wrapping materials are not free, getting to the post office is not free, and wasting time with whining customers about shipping rates is not free.
    Tires for real rides: www.terrenetires.com

  97. #97
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by chequamagon
    Ha! I work for a company that does mail order for a different industry. We always hear whining about shipping. Do you honestly think that the shipping cost is the only cost incurred with shipping? $6 is a steal, and he is losing money on that deal. For an item that size, it would cost around $12 from most companies, and even at that cost, shipping is still a losing enterprise. People dont pack things for free, tape isnt free, computers are not free, wrapping materials are not free, getting to the post office is not free, and wasting time with whining customers about shipping rates is not free.
    I think there was just a misunderstanding on this one particular order, and we have gotten it sorted out now so no problems!

    Chris
    Chris
    Scrub Components
    www.scrubcomponents.com

  98. #98
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,483
    Quote Originally Posted by singltraker
    I think there was just a misunderstanding on this one particular order, and we have gotten it sorted out now so no problems!

    Chris
    Yes we did. Thank you Chris for sorting that out. I look forward to getting this new rotor and trying it out. I'm currently using Kool Stop Organic pads. Do you think these will work well with this rotor?

    Quote Originally Posted by chequamagon
    Ha! I work for a company that does mail order for a different industry. We always hear whining about shipping. Do you honestly think that the shipping cost is the only cost incurred with shipping? $6 is a steal, and he is losing money on that deal. For an item that size, it would cost around $12 from most companies, and even at that cost, shipping is still a losing enterprise. People dont pack things for free, tape isnt free, computers are not free, wrapping materials are not free, getting to the post office is not free, and wasting time with whining customers about shipping rates is not free.
    Who the hell asked you for your rant? A well run comany would account for these expenses in their operating costs, and adjust their pricing accordingly. Many people get pissed to see outrageous costs for shipping when they know they can go down to the post office and ship for substantially less. I was not whining. I had a legitimate problem. It turned out to be Paypal related. STFU!

  99. #99
    Doesntplaywellwithmorons!
    Reputation: DeeEight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,861
    And who pays you to go to the post office... who puts the gasoline in your car/truck to drive these packages to the post office? He may have been ranting but he had a valid point. If you don't like the shipping price, don't order the damn part.
    I don't post to generate business for myself or make like I'm better than sliced bread

  100. #100
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,483
    Quote Originally Posted by DeeEight
    And who pays you to go to the post office... who puts the gasoline in your car/truck to drive these packages to the post office? He may have been ranting but he had a valid point. If you don't like the shipping price, don't order the damn part.
    Once again, these costs should be covered in the pricing of the item. Oh, and last time I checked, the post office will come by and pick up packages from businesses, just like UPS and FedEx.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Members who have read this thread: 1

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.