Results 1 to 88 of 88
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358

    Denver to Bellingham move

    Anyone else made the move? I understand the weather is a lot different but we're from Chicago initially which on paper is more rainy than Bellingham. We spent 16 days out there this fall and it was amazing compared to our local stuff in Denver. It rained everyday but it didn't bother us, even living out of a van for the trip. Rode Galbraith, Squamish, Whistler and I felt like I died and ended up in mountain bike heaven. I'm decidedly not an XC guy and that's all most of the front range is... What's the vibe like living there though? My current commute is 35 miles and it takes me 90 minutes. My wife is flying out there for an interview and we're strongly considering the move. I'd be giving up my career and going back to school for a different field in healthcare most likely. We're both mid 30s, no kids. We both ride a lot. Don't mind the rain if the trade off is loam and legit Enduro / DH trails. Anyone else made the move care to comment on anything besides the weather? Neighborhoods to avoid when buying a house? Looking to get as close to Galbraith as possible, most likely south and west of Whatcom Falls park since the prices seem right (<400k).

    Our pro/con list:

    Pros
    -no traffic
    -smaller town living
    -best mountain bike trails in the country
    -proximity to whistler, squamish, north shore stuff
    -an ocean
    -land managers who seem to "get it"
    -awesome MTB community (we've already donated to WMBC)
    -mild winters
    -year round riding
    -cheaper cost of living
    -GREEN vegetation

    Cons
    -dropping to a single income
    -not as much sunshine
    -further from family in Chicago


    Thanks!
    Denver, CO

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    HAH, just noticed the duplicate post... sorry. Looking for some different answers though maybe.. #flatsforlife
    Denver, CO

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andrew8404's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    820
    Medic life?? Howís Colorado EMS? Iím down in Albuquerque and would love to love to Bellingham too.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew8404 View Post
    Medic life?? Howís Colorado EMS? Iím down in Albuquerque and would love to love to Bellingham too.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Itís not bad, Iíve been doing it for about 15 years now, with a recent back injury I may be making a career move anyways into nursing.
    Denver, CO

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andrew8404's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    820
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    Itís not bad, Iíve been doing it for about 15 years now, with a recent back injury I may be making a career move anyways into nursing.
    Ya, I think this will be my 17th year. Iíd love to do nursing but canít stomach the thought of being in a hospital all day.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew8404 View Post
    Ya, I think this will be my 17th year. Iíd love to do nursing but canít stomach the thought of being in a hospital all day.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Totally agree but 3 12ís and the freedom to move anywhere thereís a hospital
    Denver, CO

  7. #7
    FM
    FM is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: FM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    9,443
    No doubt you'll love it! I'll just comment on the housing market here, it's super competitive and supply is limited. Consider most buyers seem to be paying cash and houses are often going for way over asking price.

    Jason Loeb is your guy for realty. He's awesome to work with and a substantial chunk of his commissions go to WMBC. Plus he knows all the neighborhood access trails.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    No doubt you'll love it! I'll just comment on the housing market here, it's super competitive and supply is limited. Consider most buyers seem to be paying cash and houses are often going for way over asking price.

    Jason Loeb is your guy for realty. He's awesome to work with and a substantial chunk of his commissions go to WMBC. Plus he knows all the neighborhood access trails.
    Awesome thank you!
    Denver, CO

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ironbrewer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    338
    I moved here from Broomfield a bit over 4 years ago. Our house here has increased in value more than our house there in that time. I think most things are more expensive here including food, gas, energy, water, trash etc. You can definitely ride all year long here. the trails are ridable during and after rains, not like the clay trails in Colorado. Traffic is way better unless you go south towards Seattle. Vancouver BC is an awesome alternative for city stuff. You can get to salt water easily, but the Ocean is tough to get to. It is definitely greener here, but being a long time Colorado resident I sometimes feel claustrophobic here. You don't get the constant vistas here like you do in Colorado. You are usually in a tunnel of trees. Bellingham is a great town, and I don't regret the move at all.


    Oh and if you are from Colorado people wont be angry you moved here. Don't be from California.

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by ironbrewer View Post
    I moved here from Broomfield a bit over 4 years ago. Our house here has increased in value more than our house there in that time. I think most things are more expensive here including food, gas, energy, water, trash etc. You can definitely ride all year long here. the trails are ridable during and after rains, not like the clay trails in Colorado. Traffic is way better unless you go south towards Seattle. Vancouver BC is an awesome alternative for city stuff. You can get to salt water easily, but the Ocean is tough to get to. It is definitely greener here, but being a long time Colorado resident I sometimes feel claustrophobic here. You don't get the constant vistas here like you do in Colorado. You are usually in a tunnel of trees. Bellingham is a great town, and I don't regret the move at all.


    Oh and if you are from Colorado people wont be angry you moved here. Don't be from California.
    LOL that seems like a common theme. I don't know how long you've been gone but Denver has blown up. I think the average price of a single family home is around 500k now and it's the same thing- lots of california people buying with cash. Funny, I'm in Westminster about 2 blocks outside of Broomfield.
    Denver, CO

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ironbrewer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    338
    If you have any specific questions you can pm me of post here. I moved 4 years ago. It was when they were finishing up 36 and selling it to Australia.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by ironbrewer View Post
    If you have any specific questions you can pm me of post here. I moved 4 years ago. It was when they were finishing up 36 and selling it to Australia.
    awesome thanks! I think the wife is flying out next week, probably have more questions afterwards.
    Denver, CO

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Moved here from the Springs 4.5 years ago. Happy to answer any questions, just PM them.

    What position is your wife interviewing for?

    I live near the area you described, near Whatcom Falls Park, too, though more east, towards the lake. I can ride from my house and access Galbraith.

    The cost of living here is significantly more than the Springs was, but probably comparable to Denver. No income tax, but property taxes are higher. And sales tax is very high, too. And housing prices are high. Now is a better time to buy than early summer, if you can time things that way.

    We have 4 bike companies here in town (Transition, Kona, Lost and now Evil), plus Canfield. The riding scene is pretty amazing, as you experienced. You're likely to run into pros, retired pros, YouTube stars and world class coaches.

    Town is small, but you can get anything you want an hour + either north or south, Or via Amazon. We have a Whole Foods and Trader Joes, if that matters. But no Chick-fil-A, sadly.

    If you're a skier or boarder, too, you'll have ample choice there. Baker, the local mountain about an hour and a half, or less. Most snow annually of any North American ski area pretty consistently. This year isn't a great snow year. Last year Baker had 866". Whistler about 3 hours north. Stevens about 2 to 2.5 south east. Both have bike parks. And both are on the Epic Pass if you get those. Baker is not, though.

    It is green here. Funny thing, though... you will miss the desert. I'm from a green state, too (Maine) and never thought I'd miss the desert, but I do.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    440
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    We have 4 bike companies here in town (Transition, Kona, Lost and now Evil), plus Canfield.
    I agree with everything you said minus this. Canfield Brothers pulled up stakes and left town last summer

    Also, the beer scene here is awesome and getting better all the time.

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by jminus View Post
    I agree with everything you said minus this. Canfield Brothers pulled up stakes and left town last summer

    Also, the beer scene here is awesome and getting better all the time.
    Odd. Just saw a web article on them and their web page still lists Bellingham as their location.

    [edit] The web article was about High Above bags, made by JC Canfield, also here in Bellingham.

    But Canfield Bros website still does list Bellingham as their address. Where did they go?

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Moved here from the Springs 4.5 years ago. Happy to answer any questions, just PM them.

    What position is your wife interviewing for?

    I live near the area you described, near Whatcom Falls Park, too, though more east, towards the lake. I can ride from my house and access Galbraith.

    The cost of living here is significantly more than the Springs was, but probably comparable to Denver. No income tax, but property taxes are higher. And sales tax is very high, too. And housing prices are high. Now is a better time to buy than early summer, if you can time things that way.

    We have 4 bike companies here in town (Transition, Kona, Lost and now Evil), plus Canfield. The riding scene is pretty amazing, as you experienced. You're likely to run into pros, retired pros, YouTube stars and world class coaches.

    Town is small, but you can get anything you want an hour + either north or south, Or via Amazon. We have a Whole Foods and Trader Joes, if that matters. But no Chick-fil-A, sadly.

    If you're a skier or boarder, too, you'll have ample choice there. Baker, the local mountain about an hour and a half, or less. Most snow annually of any North American ski area pretty consistently. This year isn't a great snow year. Last year Baker had 866". Whistler about 3 hours north. Stevens about 2 to 2.5 south east. Both have bike parks. And both are on the Epic Pass if you get those. Baker is not, though.

    It is green here. Funny thing, though... you will miss the desert. I'm from a green state, too (Maine) and never thought I'd miss the desert, but I do.
    Sent you a PM. Everything is sounding really good... Denver has gotten really expensive, far as I can tell aside from utilities being slightly higher everything is comparable (sales tax is 1% higher, property taxes are now almost identical). Denver metro is out of control... thanks again!
    Denver, CO

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    440
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Odd. Just saw a web article on them and their web page still lists Bellingham as their location.

    [edit] The web article was about High Above bags, made by JC Canfield, also here in Bellingham.

    But Canfield Bros website still does list Bellingham as their address. Where did they go?
    Something happened (I really donít know what) to disrupt their business and they moved down to Moab and sort of went dormant. Their webpage hasnít been updated in a long time and they never released any products in 2018. Lots of speculation about what is going on with them but no official statements.

    I have a Canfield Balance in my stable so I used to go to their office once in awhile. Happened to be there on the day they were moving out which was the first time I heard about it.

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Huh, strange.

  19. #19
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Everyone keep coming so we can be California

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Everyone keep coming so we can be California
    Do they make ďNativeĒ bumper stickers for people who live in Washington too? 😜
    Denver, CO

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation: OldHouseMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    3,951
    Iím sure youíll love it here, and I probably wouldnít live anywhere outside of the PNW, but itís definitely not what it used to be.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: k2rider1964's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    3,227
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Everyone keep coming so we can be California
    Says a guy with Asheville in his name. I would guess California has more transplants from other states than Washington has total residents.
    2019 Yeti SB5C
    2018 Intense Tracer
    2017 Intense Primer

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60

    ... and if we just ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    Do they make ďNativeĒ bumper stickers for people who live in Washington too? 
    They do have those bumper stickers! I dont have one, even though my wife is a native here. I have only lived here for 22 years. which is not long enough to be a local around here, by the way. but you do see those bumper stickers around. one of my co-workers transferred up from california, and people would yell "Go Home" to him until he got his Washington plates. the way, my comment was mostly in jest.

    I recently met a young couple who had moved here from Asheville, because Asheville was "too expensive". they were living in their Subaru Impreza at a local park. couldn't find a place to live or a job. like many others here. the diaspora from Cali and other places like even Seattle is the major factor in our local housing situation. thus my mostly tounge in cheek comment

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    guess I can name myself whatever I want. I visit Asheville every chance I get, my family members were among the original settlers of Buncombe County.

    not to dispute your observation, haven't done detailed research, but seems like the trend is that people are leaving Cali, not moving in. emigrating, not immigrating. at least from other US states, anyway. read an article the other day that 10 percent of the people who live in Utah now were born in California. you can poke fun at Washington's population, but by my definition, having less people is a good thing. we are trying our best to be a backwater, lonely place where it rains every day!

  25. #25
    FM
    FM is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: FM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    9,443
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    thus my mostly tounge in cheek comment
    It did get me thinking so I checked: the North American population is projected to double in the next 30yrs

    With that in mind, let's welcome the potential WMBC supporters moving here. We're gonna have more new neighbors either way, at least we can hope they'll contribute to the trails.

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    I'm a fourth generation Washingtonian. Y'all get the hell outta here!
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    They do have those bumper stickers! I dont have one, even though my wife is a native here. I have only lived here for 22 years. which is not long enough to be a local around here, by the way. but you do see those bumper stickers around. one of my co-workers transferred up from california, and people would yell "Go Home" to him until he got his Washington plates. the way, my comment was mostly in jest.

    I recently met a young couple who had moved here from Asheville, because Asheville was "too expensive". they were living in their Subaru Impreza at a local park. couldn't find a place to live or a job. like many others here. the diaspora from Cali and other places like even Seattle is the major factor in our local housing situation. thus my mostly tounge in cheek comment
    I was just kidding anyways Denver is horrible with it though... every 10th car has a "native" sticker. We won't be living in our car! (We have a promaster camper anyways hahaha). I'm already talking with a realtor.... My wife doesn't even have the job yet. After looking more into it, Bellingham appears expensive for their job market but I think the Denver area is still worse. If you want a house within riding distance from a trailhead here you better have 700k+ and be happy with early 90's interior. You also better have cash and maybe forgo that inspection if you really want it Oh... and there's bumper to bumper traffic every day at all hours on I-25. Luckily working in healthcare has it's perks as well as far as job availability. Everyone is always getting older....
    Denver, CO

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by FM View Post
    It did get me thinking so I checked: the North American population is projected to double in the next 30yrs

    With that in mind, let's welcome the potential WMBC supporters moving here. We're gonna have more new neighbors either way, at least we can hope they'll contribute to the trails.

    Already own the hat and the t-shirt I'll be going back to school with this move while my wife works so plenty of time for trail work psyched to actually be able to build cool stuff.
    Last edited by Streetdoctor; 2 Weeks Ago at 11:14 AM.
    Denver, CO

  29. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    How hard is it to get a bike shop job in Bellingham? I can turn a wrench or do sales... would only be interested in part time. Iím pretty familiar with the industry with local shop sponsorships for enduro racing and ties with industry reps here in CO
    Denver, CO

  30. #30
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    There are numerous local bike shops here. 7 or 8 I can think of, off hand. For MTB the biggest is Fanatik. Check their website.

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    There are few places where you see islands that are really mountains sticking up 1800/feet out of the inland waters of the Pacific Northwest, yet go 30 miles inland and have a few hundred inches of snow to play on. Now about that rain ....

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    There are few places where you see islands that are really mountains sticking up 1800/feet out of the inland waters of the Pacific Northwest, yet go 30 miles inland and have a few hundred inches of snow to play on. Now about that rain ....
    Initially Iím from Chicago, I get that the weather is different -lots of rain all at once vs slow drizzle allll day but Chicago gets more rain on paper. Either way we miss the green!
    Denver, CO

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    There are numerous local bike shops here. 7 or 8 I can think of, off hand. For MTB the biggest is Fanatik. Check their website.
    Cool, I figured as much I just didnít know how much competition there was. Iím mid 30ís and Iíve spent the last 14 years as a career paramedic/firefighter... Iím not banking on continuing that career but Iíll also try. Going back to school seems like the only option for a viable career but part time work in a shop would be fun.
    Denver, CO

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation: k2rider1964's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    3,227
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    not to dispute your observation, haven't done detailed research, but seems like the trend is that people are leaving Cali, not moving in. emigrating, not immigrating. at least from other US states, anyway. read an article the other day that 10 percent of the people who live in Utah now were born in California. you can poke fun at Washington's population, but by my definition, having less people is a good thing. we are trying our best to be a backwater, lonely place where it rains every day!
    My point is that people migrate all over including into CA which would also be a much better place if people would have stayed OUT. The city where I grew up (Irvine in Orange County) had 11,000 people in it when we moved in and it was a fantastic place to live and grow up. Today, the city has 276,000 and most of the residents came from other COUNTRIES much less other states. CA has 15 million people when I was born but is now pushing 40 million. All 25 million of this extra bodies weren't from births so they came from somewhere else. The entire state of Washington has less than 8 million today.

    I'm not knocking anybody in Bellingham (or any other city) wanting to remain small, control growth or whatever because I agree with you 100% and wish every town I lived in could have stayed "the way it was". I just get tired of everybody blaming Californians because most people that live in Californian are from somewhere else as well.
    2019 Yeti SB5C
    2018 Intense Tracer
    2017 Intense Primer

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Sorry I unfairly slammed your home state. Did a quick search and did see that California has had a million more people leave than arrive in the past I think it said 10 years. When I said we donít want to be California, it meant donít want to be what you described. Donít want to be Seattle either (sorry Enerald City residents). If had wanted to live there I would have moved there instead of here. Itís a nationwide phenomenon, migration from cities that have become less livable or less desirable, because of all the problems associated with rampant growth, into places like Bellingham, Bend, Asheville, St George, Utah, you name it. All that being said, I would never treat anyone badly for the above reasons. Gotta go, itís now snowing ... it usually just rains a lot😉

  36. #36
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,677
    It gets ridiculous. For some reason it was ok for you, or your parents, or their ancestors, to move somewhere, but you are going to tell someone else that they can't do what you or your family did. If you really believe in not having people move anywhere, please don't have kids, because obviously they'll have to live somewhere too. It comes down to you having no more right than anyone else when it comes to living somewhere.

    Yeah, population is kind of out of control...
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  37. #37
    mtbr member
    Reputation: k2rider1964's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    3,227
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Sorry I unfairly slammed your home state. Did a quick search and did see that California has had a million more people leave than arrive in the past I think it said 10 years. When I said we donít want to be California, it meant donít want to be what you described. Donít want to be Seattle either (sorry Enerald City residents). If had wanted to live there I would have moved there instead of here. Itís a nationwide phenomenon, migration from cities that have become less livable or less desirable, because of all the problems associated with rampant growth, into places like Bellingham, Bend, Asheville, St George, Utah, you name it. All that being said, I would never treat anyone badly for the above reasons. Gotta go, itís now snowing ... it usually just rains a lot😉
    Exactly and feel free to slam the state as a whole all you want because it's a mess. Horrendous traffic, housing prices (luckily I bought in 96 for $154K) are stupid expensive and priorities are all out of whack which is why people are fleeing. Many are actually moving with their jobs/companies that bail the state to escape oppressive business taxes/regulations....like Toyota moving to Texas.

    We're actually going to be "part of the problem" ourselves in a few years and have looked at Oregon (too much rain for my wife), Bend (too Californianized already = meaning everything is about "image" over substance), St George (not enough trees for my tastes and quirky establishment). I loved Bellingham on my visit last Summer but that might as well be Canada to us from SoCal. I'd like a small town like Ridgway, CO myself but my wife needs "civilization" so we'll end up in Prescott or Durango (was my top choice 20 years ago, it's not the same either).
    2019 Yeti SB5C
    2018 Intense Tracer
    2017 Intense Primer

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    It gets ridiculous. For some reason it was ok for you, or your parents, or their ancestors, to move somewhere, but you are going to tell someone else that they can't do what you or your family did. If you really believe in not having people move anywhere, please don't have kids, because obviously they'll have to live somewhere too. It comes down to you having no more right than anyone else when it comes to living somewhere.

    Yeah, population is kind of out of control...
    I think the problem isn't so much the people, though many want things to stay small, but that when you get a huge influx of people leaving someplace they don't like, they tend to make their new place like their old place. And that sucks.

    As for not making WA like CA, too late. That started a while ago and, at least in the Seattle metro area and most of western WA, it's already CA north.

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Ill let my kids know how you feel! 😆

  40. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    308
    A whole reminiscing about the way things used to be as viewed through rose tinted glasses.

    My guess is that people will really start missing a lot of what the PNW offers when they go chasing that greener grass. This place ticks nearly every box for a mountain-minded recreationalist who also works a day job and enjoys "culture". IDK anywhere else in the north america that does as well as the Seattle area. YMMV.

  41. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    1,101
    Do they make ďNativeĒ bumper stickers for people who live in Washington too?
    Yup - got one on my truck.

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    178
    B'ham is a sweet city and whatcom has great ridin; and TRANSITION HQ is in B'ham.
    Get some good stoke from Kyle or blake there.
    Cheers.
    TS

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Donít want to be Seattle either (sorry Enerald City residents).
    I work in Seattle and would cry if Bellingham became like it.

    The big problem with Bellingham is that i don't get up there nearly as often as I'd like to. I miss living there horribly.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  44. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    The entire state of Washington has less than 8 million today.
    That can't be right. There were at least 12 million cars clogging the freeway on my way home last Friday.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation: rynomx785's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    303
    Quote Originally Posted by k2rider1964 View Post
    I'd like a small town like Ridgway, CO myself but my wife needs "civilization" so we'll end up in Prescott or Durango (was my top choice 20 years ago, it's not the same either).
    AZ is full.

    I haven't done any research for exact numbers but, it sure seems like there are droves of people moving to AZ from CA. I wish it wasn't that way but I can't say that I blame them but years of poor political leadership is to blame..... I know there are a lot of Californians that hate what it has become but, as a whole, they made it the way it is. Unfortunately, AZ and and a lot of other states appear to be headed blindly down the same path.

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Good to see thread derailment here too lol. Make some room bitches!
    Denver, CO

  47. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation: rynomx785's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    303
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    Good to see thread derailment here too lol. Make some room bitches!
    My bad. lol

  48. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by rynomx785 View Post
    AZ is full.

    I haven't done any research for exact numbers but, it sure seems like there are droves of people moving to AZ from CA. I wish it wasn't that way but I can't say that I blame them but years of poor political leadership is to blame..... I know there are a lot of Californians that hate what it has become but, as a whole, they made it the way it is. Unfortunately, AZ and and a lot of other states appear to be headed blindly down the same path.
    And they'll make AZ become the same....

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    308
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    And they'll make AZ become the same....
    what a place with a coastline and culture?

  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation: rynomx785's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    303
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    And they'll make AZ become the same....
    Like I said, headed blindly down the same path.

    Quote Originally Posted by Californiagrown View Post
    what a place with a coastline and culture?
    Yeah, something like that.

  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Californiagrown View Post
    what a place with a coastline and culture?
    Suppose that depends on your definition of culture.

    If you like it so much, why not just go back?

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    308
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Suppose that depends on your definition of culture.

    If you like it so much, why not just go back?
    Cause washington has all the positives of CA, plus so many others. I love it here. CA is a 7/10, WA is a 9.5/10 in my book

    I don't have much positive to say about AZ though.

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    Quote Originally Posted by Californiagrown View Post
    I don't have much positive to say about AZ though.
    Well, you can ride there now in short sleeves and shorts. And not in snow.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Suppose that depends on your definition of culture.

    If you like it so much, why not just go back?
    Valid point. Is coastline and culture why a million Californians have moved away? I know itís a big state, and some parts are nicer than others, but people are leaving.

  55. #55
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Are you kidding? I live in Washington but love to ride in AZ. Just got back from Tucson. Open, flowy single track with sections of technical. A nice change from rooty twisty trails.

  56. #56
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    My wife will be out there the end of next week for the interview. Tips on places she should check out? She'll have a rental car and it sounds like she'll have an extra day. Sounds like trails will be shut down with recent snows? Initially she was planning on renting a bike for a day.
    Denver, CO

  57. #57
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Posts
    63
    Sounds like an exciting move. Don't blame you for wanting to get out from Denver. I've felt similarly, but the couple places I looked at last year (SLC/Park City, Boise) give up traffic and people volume but replace them with either an arguably less exciting city with pollution issues (SLC) or longer drive distances to terrain thats less technical (Boise)

    Coming from a small town in the midwest originally, Im not sure I could convince my wife to move to the least sunny city in the country after living in Denver. If it didn't have that stat, I'd already be living there.

  58. #58
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Local microbreweries: the original is Boundary Bay Brewery, food is very local and not bad. Inexpensive. Kulshan Brewery isnít bad for beer. There a several others to choose from.

    Fairhaven district is the old brick building restaurant/shops area. Just down the end of the street from Fairhaven is the ferry terminal in case you want to hop a ferry to Alaska. Next to that is a delightful beach front park where the serious surfski and sea kayak Paddlers launch year round.

    If she skis, Mt Baker Ski area is 60 miles east.
    Last edited by JimmyAsheville; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:14 PM.

  59. #59
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    My wife will be out there the end of next week for the interview. Tips on places she should check out? She'll have a rental car and it sounds like she'll have an extra day. Sounds like trails will be shut down with recent snows? Initially she was planning on renting a bike for a day.
    Says who?


    Go to Transition. Their demos are $40/day and every cent goes to WMBC.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Denver to Bellingham move-p2030006_moment-3-.jpg  

    Last edited by skiahh; 2 Weeks Ago at 02:59 PM.

  60. #60
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    says who?


    Go to transition. Their demos are $40/day and every cent goes to wmbc.
    word.
    Denver, CO

  61. #61
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Says who?


    Go to Transition. Their demos are $40/day and every cent goes to WMBC.
    $60 now, still cheaper than most places.

  62. #62
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by officeboy View Post
    $60 now, still cheaper than most places.
    Huh... missed that.

    But it all still goes to WMBC, so still a great deal!

  63. #63
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    I gotta admit... Iím getting a kick out of the photos of emtpy grocery store aisles from this ďsnowĒ storm. 😂
    Denver, CO

  64. #64
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by teej83 View Post
    Sounds like an exciting move. Don't blame you for wanting to get out from Denver. I've felt similarly, but the couple places I looked at last year (SLC/Park City, Boise) give up traffic and people volume but replace them with either an arguably less exciting city with pollution issues (SLC) or longer drive distances to terrain thats less technical (Boise)

    Coming from a small town in the midwest originally, Im not sure I could convince my wife to move to the least sunny city in the country after living in Denver. If it didn't have that stat, I'd already be living there.
    I think the lack of sun is what makes the riding so good. Sure it rains a lot but it didnít stop us from riding every day when we were out there last August. Itís not a Midwest downpour type of rain but more an all day mist. The forest seemed so thick in a few places you couldnít even tell it was raining.

    Denver is getting so insane we canít handle it and weíre initially from Chicago. Weíre also contemplating a move to salida since I would only have to commute once a week or so. 285 is a nightmare on some weekends already and will soon be worse than i70 I imagine.

    If you want something close to trail access in the front range youíre looking at 550k and up, if you want something nice with trail access itís more like 700k and up. Even salida is 450+. Even with moving close the trails are still packed and the land managers resist any kind of solution that is mtb friendly. IMO if any area is turning into California itís Colorado but of course thatís cause Iím here.

    Is it worth it to buy a place for 600 and still deal with the hordes of people or is it better to drop to a single income and move somewhere away from a major metropolitan area with a budget cut in half... tough decisions.
    Denver, CO

  65. #65
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    I gotta admit... Iím getting a kick out of the photos of emtpy grocery store aisles from this ďsnowĒ storm. 😂
    I get what you say, I have lived in some very snowy places. But, in defense of locals, you would have to appreciate just how hilly Seattle (and Bellingam) are to imagine what a little snow does to drivers. I myself have to descend 300 feet in Just a few blocks to get to a main road. After all, the worlds snowiest Place is 30 miles east of Bellingham. 93 feet in one snow season.

  66. #66
    Justin Vander Pol
    Reputation: juice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    1,651
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    If you want something close to trail access in the front range youíre looking at 550k and up, if you want something nice with trail access itís more like 700k and up. Even salida is 450+.
    Whoa, thatís super cheap compared to Seattle. At least we have interesting/challenging trails here.

  67. #67
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Those prices sound about like what a place in Bellngham would be, maybe Bellingham a little higher, if you wanted to live in town.

  68. #68
    650b me
    Reputation: golden boy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    1,458
    I've been following this thread because I just made this move. Actually, I moved from Golden, CO where I lived for 18 years, to Salida, CO (actually Poncha Springs, but it's easier to just say Salida) for a year and a half and my wife and I just moved to Bellingham in December. She has family here so that's a big part of why we moved here.

    Because we just moved here, I don't actually have much input as I'm still early in forming my own opinions of the move. But, so far so good. My wife and I both found decent jobs, which ain't gonna happen in Salida unless you're in the health care profession (oh wait, you are!).

    I was able to ride the trails every weekend in January in Bellingham. That never happened in Colorado. That said, winter is here for real in February. I'm looking forward to living a full calendar year here so that I can experience the trails through all of the seasons. I've visited a few times in summer and the weather has always been superb.

    As for the city, I'm really liking it. Denver got too big, Salida was way too small for me, Bellingham fits nicely in my sweet spot of a small city. It has nearly everything you could want outside of professional sports and big name music acts and those are available in Vancouver and Seattle. The cycling culture here is fantastic. The diversity of riders I've encountered on Galbraith is unlike what you find on Front Range trails. And I love the fact that there are so many dedicated bike commuters here. I see them riding down my street just north of downtown at all times of day (and night) and in any weather, including the snow-packed streets today after a 5" dump of snow last night. You like good beer? You'll love Bellingham. Not necessarily better or worse than the options available on the Front Range, but you certainly won't miss what you left behind if you make the move.

    It sounds like there are a fair number of Colorado "expats" living here....we should all get together sometime and trade stories. Anyway, good luck with your decision, Streetdoctor.

  69. #69
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    I think the lack of sun is what makes the riding so good. Sure it rains a lot but it didnít stop us from riding every day when we were out there last August. Itís not a Midwest downpour type of rain but more an all day mist. The forest seemed so thick in a few places you couldnít even tell it was raining.
    Trying to remember last August, but I thought it was a pretty dry, hot month. Don't recall any rain and don't have any pictures with rain from riding. And I was out there more days than not!

  70. #70
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    I was thinking the same thing, we were all hoping for rain because of the wildfire smoke (thanks Canada!). Not to let the cat out of the bag, but it doesnít rain much in the summer in Bellingham, sometimes weeks with no rain at all. My curiosity got the best me, and I checked, and it sprinkled 4 times in August. Total rain, .27 inches.

  71. #71
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Nick_Rides_MTB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Posts
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Those prices sound about like what a place in Bellngham would be, maybe Bellingham a little higher, if you wanted to live in town.
    Edit: issues with other username log in, and getting a hold of admins around here is damn near impossible so this is the new but but same person as "streetdoctor".

    I think "in town" is the relative term... looks like just north of town or sudden valley ($120 isn't really a high HOA IMO) houses can be had in the 300's. Sudden Valley is 6 miles from Galbraith and probably half that as the crow flies. My current house is 25 miles away from the nearest mountain bike trail and it takes me 45 minutes to get there by car for reference. We should be able to sell for around 450k.

  72. #72
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    You are right. I am 2 miles from the north Galbraith trailhead, in the city limits, in a smallish three bedroom that Zillow says is worth $650. Luckily I bought it 20 years ago or I wouldnít be living here!

  73. #73
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    Refer to the thread started by Crawdad, just below this one for the Sudden Valley can of worms. 😁

    If you donít mind being 20 miles out, Birch Bay has a lot of new building.

  74. #74
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    Refer to the thread started by Crawdad, just below this one for the Sudden Valley can of worms. 

    If you donít mind being 20 miles out, Birch Bay has a lot of new building.
    I've read all about it being "way outside of town", extremely high HOA's (only $120), and secluded. My wife said it just took her 15 minutes to get there from Yew and Lakeway. Sounds sweet

    In all honesty though, I'm not at all interested in living anywhere near "the middle of town" anywhere. I just don't want to drive an hour to work, an hour to the grocery store, or an hour to the closest trail head!
    Denver, CO

  75. #75
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by JimmyAsheville View Post
    You are right. I am 2 miles from the north Galbraith trailhead, in the city limits, in a smallish three bedroom that Zillow says is worth $650. Luckily I bought it 20 years ago or I wouldnít be living here!
    I know Zillow isn't very accurate but here's Birch St. at the north entrance to Galbraith. This is the house literally next to the trail. It's beautiful and valued at $555k... Me thinks you're trying to downplay the area a bit Denver to Bellingham move-screen-shot-2019-02-14-6.23.40-pm.jpgDenver to Bellingham move-screen-shot-2019-02-14-6.22.40-pm.jpg
    Denver, CO

  76. #76
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by golden boy View Post
    I've been following this thread because I just made this move. Actually, I moved from Golden, CO where I lived for 18 years, to Salida, CO (actually Poncha Springs, but it's easier to just say Salida) for a year and a half and my wife and I just moved to Bellingham in December. She has family here so that's a big part of why we moved here.

    Because we just moved here, I don't actually have much input as I'm still early in forming my own opinions of the move. But, so far so good. My wife and I both found decent jobs, which ain't gonna happen in Salida unless you're in the health care profession (oh wait, you are!).

    I was able to ride the trails every weekend in January in Bellingham. That never happened in Colorado. That said, winter is here for real in February. I'm looking forward to living a full calendar year here so that I can experience the trails through all of the seasons. I've visited a few times in summer and the weather has always been superb.

    As for the city, I'm really liking it. Denver got too big, Salida was way too small for me, Bellingham fits nicely in my sweet spot of a small city. It has nearly everything you could want outside of professional sports and big name music acts and those are available in Vancouver and Seattle. The cycling culture here is fantastic. The diversity of riders I've encountered on Galbraith is unlike what you find on Front Range trails. And I love the fact that there are so many dedicated bike commuters here. I see them riding down my street just north of downtown at all times of day (and night) and in any weather, including the snow-packed streets today after a 5" dump of snow last night. You like good beer? You'll love Bellingham. Not necessarily better or worse than the options available on the Front Range, but you certainly won't miss what you left behind if you make the move.

    It sounds like there are a fair number of Colorado "expats" living here....we should all get together sometime and trade stories. Anyway, good luck with your decision, Streetdoctor.

    Thanks for telling your story! My wife is out there right now, I figure if she likes it during the "worst time of the year", it's all good!
    Denver, CO

  77. #77
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ironbrewer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    338
    Your wife will be laughing about how badly Bellingham does snow.

  78. #78
    FM
    FM is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation: FM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    9,443
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    I know Zillow isn't very accurate but here's Birch St. at the north entrance to Galbraith.
    But look, it's "off market".

  79. #79
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    I know that house. Youíd have to put up with all those mountain bikers all the time!

  80. #80
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    I re-read that house listing. $555k for 1500 square feet seems up there. Trail or no trail

  81. #81
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    I know Zillow isn't very accurate but here's Birch St. at the north entrance to Galbraith. This is the house literally next to the trail. It's beautiful and valued at $555k... Me thinks you're trying to downplay the area a bit Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2019-02-14 at 6.23.40 PM.jpg 
Views:	30 
Size:	312.2 KB 
ID:	1238237Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2019-02-14 at 6.22.40 PM.jpg 
Views:	25 
Size:	97.3 KB 
ID:	1238238
    I want that house.

    I wonder how much I can get for my place in Kirkland?
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  82. #82
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    440
    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    I want that house.

    I wonder how much I can get for my place in Kirkland?
    Itís a nice house but the driveway is literally cut short by the entrance to the trailhead parking lot and it is busy. Constant car traffic all day everyday coming by very close to the property and Iím sure some of the trail users are obnoxiously loud (music, cars, Bro-ing down, etc).

    I would much rather live farther down the street or a block up the hill. I wonder if the older couple that lives there knew what they were signing up for. They seem nice but they must have Buddhist level zen to deal with the traffic.

  83. #83
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    I want that house.

    I wonder how much I can get for my place in Kirkland?
    Probably enough to buy the Birch St house and then some.

  84. #84
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Curveball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,796
    Quote Originally Posted by skiahh View Post
    Probably enough to buy the Birch St house and then some.
    My wife is always looking at houses and it appears that Bellingham prices are pretty much the same as Kirkland. The big problem would be for both of us to find jobs up there. That's why we had to move away 20 years ago.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  85. #85
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    Quote Originally Posted by ironbrewer View Post
    Your wife will be laughing about how badly Bellingham does snow.
    No shit! The first thing she commented on was how friendly everyone is and that no one must own a snow shovel. She also said we apparently each need a pair of galoshes because that's what everyone wears lol. So far her opinion on property is she likes outside of town a bit a little better. She felt like everything in town was tiny and on top of their neighbors. If everything goes well we'll probably be back out there together in a couple of weeks to look for a place and check the area out together. Would love to grab a beer with you guys if it happens!
    Denver, CO

  86. #86
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    60
    if it makes you two feel better a snow event(s) like this one is relatively rare. some winters see no snow at all. those galoshes everyone wears are a byproduct of Bellingham's formerly large fishing fleet. those high rubber boots are what all the fishermen and women wear. by fishermen, I mean boats that go up to Alaska and catch cod, crab, etc. the boots are perfect for here, waterproof but no insulation needed. get some at Lummi Fisheries Supply, down on the waterfront.

    I looked at that house today on my way back from the store. it's like a tiny house, and its really shoehorned in there! the yard in big enough for a chihuahua! (just one, though). just driving up Birch Street to the end, turning around in the driveway, it was like a mini traffic jam with two cars trying to get into the trailhead parking lot which was still snow covered. that list price shocks me.

  87. #87
    mtbr member
    Reputation: skiahh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    3,876
    Quote Originally Posted by Streetdoctor View Post
    No shit! The first thing she commented on was how friendly everyone is and that no one must own a snow shovel. She also said we apparently each need a pair of galoshes because that's what everyone wears lol. So far her opinion on property is she likes outside of town a bit a little better. She felt like everything in town was tiny and on top of their neighbors. If everything goes well we'll probably be back out there together in a couple of weeks to look for a place and check the area out together. Would love to grab a beer with you guys if it happens!
    Just let us know.

  88. #88
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Streetdoctor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    2,358
    She's supposed to get the offer today... fingers crossed!
    Denver, CO

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 03-17-2015, 08:52 AM
  2. Contemplating move to Denver area....
    By scooter808484 in forum Colorado - Front Range
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 09-27-2013, 01:08 PM
  3. OT: Planning my move back to Denver..
    By nealman1 in forum Colorado - Front Range
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 07-13-2011, 03:25 PM
  4. To move or not to move (FS -> HT)
    By blaadd in forum 29er Bikes
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 01-16-2011, 09:25 AM
  5. Move to Coil Over...a good move?
    By sleestak in forum Shocks and Suspension
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 03-14-2008, 01:35 PM

Members who have read this thread: 120

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.