Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217

    Howdy VRC...

    I am about to build up a period correct wheelset for my 1995 WTB Phoenix and find myself stuck on rim choice. For hubs, I will be using some silver WTB New Paradigms, spokes will be wheelsmith DB-14, and nipples will be silver alloy. For rims, I have 3 choices and keep hemming and hawing as to which makes the most sense. I have one pair of NOS Mavic 231's (silver), one pair of NOS Mavic 230's SBP (silver), and a pair of Mavic 217's SUP (silver) with blue labels that I pulled off of an unriden but mounted wheelset. My dillemna is that the 231, while being one of mavics best and most appreciated rims, was being phased out in 1995. The Mavic 230 was in active production in 1995, but my experiences with them previously are that they are a little soft and flexy...although the lightest of the bunch. The 217's were debuted in 1995 and I believe that was the only year of the blue labels (everything 1996 and on was a red label with the new mavic graphic), so while the 217's are technically the right year, I find they have a distinctly modern look and have read all sorts of negatives about the early ones (separating, cracking, eyelets pulling out, etc...), although I have never had a problem with the many red labeled ones I have built/ridden.

    So the question as I see it is do I:
    a) go with the tried and true 231's even though they likely predate the frame a little bit and were on their way out by 1995
    b) go with the 230's even though they are the weakest/softest of the bunch but were one of the lightest off the shelf options from 1995
    c) go with the 217's even though they are barely VRC and might prove to be problem laden but are a top end offering from Mavic in 1995

    VRC guidance is needed....and no, I don't plan on selling the ones I don't use as of right now...and yes, I do obsess too much about stuff like this.
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  2. #2
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    Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217

    I like the m231s and the wtb powerbeams with the powerbeams being my first choice on a Phoenix. Haven't seen them around lately though.

  3. #3
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    Powerbeams would be sick but I have not been able to find any for sale in the last two years (haven't looked in the last couple months though because I kind of gave up on that dream).

    Quote Originally Posted by girlonbike View Post
    I like the m231s and the wtb powerbeams with the powerbeams being my first choice on a Phoenix. Haven't seen them around lately though.
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  4. #4
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    Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217

    Two months! You...patient devil.

  5. #5
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    I agree Power Beams are the way to go (if you can happen to have a set stashed in your basement), but otherwise I like the Mavic m231 rims.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217-wp_000188.jpg  

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  6. #6
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    Power Beams are tough to find. M231's are always a great choice. I have one on my 95 Phoenix as well.

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  7. #7
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    I have 217 sunset's on my 98 Phoenix but it is a couple years newer. Haven't had any problems with them and I am pushing 200 lbs but ride like a much daintier man. Black 231s look rad though, I'd go for 231s over 230s.
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  8. #8
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    I really like 217's with the blue label and would go with them. Save the 231's for a pre '95 build. I have a set of 230's as well that will probably get built for a paved surface wheelset since they are a bit light.

    I'm similar to Nate in that I'm pushing 200 but 'ride light'. I don't do many huge drops and if I do I try to distribute weight between pedals, handlebar and seat.

    If the 217's with the blue label were only a one year run why is there two different blue labels? One has all the numbers equal size, the other has the '2' and '7' a slightly smaller font size. Did they just change the label?

  9. #9
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    I have had good luck with my 230s I have rode all summer including beating around Vegas. If the build is good and you are fairly light they work well with a 2.35 tire. WTB Speedmaster 11.3 are nice also.

  10. #10
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    Looks like the 230's are generally on the fringe....217 vs 231? New (old) school vs. old (old) school?

    edit: missed fred's post...230's aren't done yet
    Last edited by apat13; 02-07-2013 at 10:18 PM. Reason: missed post while typing
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  11. #11
    GMF
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    I'm a 217 fan myself. But let me put it this way. If you are using a suspension fork go with the 217s, if you are running rigid, 231s. I'd save the 230s for a wall hanger, myself. Another reason i'd go 217 is that in the absence of the powerbeam rims, the 217s are most similar looking.

    I dig the setup, btw (i've got sunset ano 217s on new paradigm hubs, 14/15 spokes out back and 15/16s in front and brass nips all around).

  12. #12
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    Just to complicate my thought process a little bit....I was pouring over the WTB catalogs are out there from 1995-1998 and I cannot find "new paradigm" hubs that look just like the ones I have. Mine are silver, with a laset etched WTB logo with "New Paradigm" written under it (both white) on one side, and an orange(red?)/black grease guard sticker on the other. All the new paradigm hubs from the 1995-1997 catalog appear to have the wtb logo as a black sticker....sooooo...does anyone know what year these hubs might be?

    The way I am leaning now is if they are not 1995-6 hubs but rather 1997-2000 era, I think I will build them up with the 217's (both being more modern) and use them as the primary riding wheelset (my phoenix has "dress clothes" and "play clothes") while I look for an older hub set to mate up nicely to the 231's. I have a 1995 white industries front hub and was thinking of tracking down an m900 for the rear to go with the 231's. Thoughts?

    PS: I also found I have a set of NOS Specialized GX23's just to mix it up even more. Can't seem to find a ton of info on these except that they date a little older and nobody says anything bad about them. They might find their way onto my 1992 Wicked Fat Chance.

    PPS: on that note, is anyone holding onto a sweet 1995-6 140mm spaced rear hub they want to see find a home on a phoenix?
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  13. #13
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    Yeah, I think you have the newer ones that are made in Taiwan. Post up a picture. And good luck finding an older one. They do pop up every now and then. There's even one in the trade thread.

    Go with your 217 on those and suffer no more. :P

  14. #14
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    where oh where in the trade thread?!?! Search function is only returning pre-2006 posts.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by apat13 View Post
    where oh where in the trade thread?!?! Search function is only returning pre-2006 posts.....
    http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro...-a-682268.html
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  16. #16
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    mmmm....I am familiar with the trade thread....I just can't target the post
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by apat13 View Post
    mmmm....I am familiar with the trade thread....I just can't target the post
    http://forums.mtbr.com/vintage-retro...l#post10098165
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  18. #18
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    my hubs

    Here are some pics of my New Paradigm hub. From what I can tell, the white logo and grease guard sticker match the black and bluish ones I see every now and then and are different that the ones pictured in either the 1995 or 1997 catalog. Bikepro lists the hub's as coming in the three colors (assuming the info in 1995-6 MY as most of the site is) but the one they show pictured is definitely a stickered logo. As always, an info is appreciated.

    Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217-1.jpgRim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217-2.jpg

    As of now, here is the plan to build up today:
    Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217-3.jpg
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  19. #19
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    The rear hub on my '92 bike (I think that they are original) look like this. I assume that these are first version of the New Paradigm hub.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Rim Choice for my Phoenix...input/advice sought Mavic 231/230/217-wp_000204.jpg  

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  20. #20
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    Mine looks like yours, Laffeaux. Stickered, not laser etched.


  21. #21
    GMF
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    When I bought my hubs new in '95, they looked like GOB's. I am certain those are later model hubs, but clearly a very similar shape (exactly the same?)
    And IIRC, they just swapped out the spacer width on the non-drive side to fit different DO spacings.

  22. #22
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    The hubs pictured by GOB and EL would be the earliest version of the Paradigm. My understanding is that the 36h version was US made, all others (including early decal 32h) are made over seas. Eventually all made over seas.

    Halaburt can confirm.
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  23. #23
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    .. all i know is i need a silver 140mm NP rear in 36 or 32

    The front hubs also seem to come in a few varieties.
    Last edited by Stylus; 02-15-2013 at 03:13 AM.

  24. #24
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    Interesting....I didn't know that only 36h were US made; for some reason I had it in my head that all the 1995-6 ones were and then in late 1996-97 all production moved to asia. Not sure why I thought that....but regardless I wonder why they only did 36h in the US?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rumpfy View Post
    The hubs pictured by GOB and EL would be the earliest version of the Paradigm. My understanding is that the 36h version was US made, all others (including early decal 32h) are made over seas. Eventually all made over seas.

    Halaburt can confirm.
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