Recent liquor law changes?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Recent liquor law changes?

    I heard that the "private club" system is dead, that you don't need "membership" for the real booze anymore.

    True?

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    This past session of the legislature passed a bill which did away with the "Private Club" system. You don't have to become a "member" to drink in bars anymore . However, along with this change come harsher penalties for public intoxication and drunk driving . Powers that be felt that the arcane liquor laws here were having a negative impact on tourism.

    CJ

  3. #3
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    Public Intoxication is illegal? Sheesh. Better stay home.

    So, does this make full strength booze available to bars that were previously "non-private"?

    What about indoor smoking at establishments that were previously "private"?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrack
    I heard that the "private club" system is dead, that you don't need "membership" for the real booze anymore.
    True?
    The guy above touched on it a bit, but the changes don't go into effect until July 1st. Some 'private clubs' have expressed the desire to still remain a private club to keep undesireable people from getting in, like people from the Orem/Provo area. And like was mentioned, harsher penalties for thinking you're mental faculties are up to par after ten 3.2 beers.

    I also heard on the news right when this was announced, that some chump in the legislature joked about implementing a caffeine tax and subsequently they are now studying that possibility. Wonder how well that's going to go over with the Normans owning stock in soft drink companies.

    I think a tax on people who put 'The' in front of everything like is so common in this state, would yield a higher tax base than taxing caffeine. "I'm going to the Smiths, I'll be right back." Or perhaps a tax on those who sit in the outer, non-HOV lane on 1-15 and don't yield to faster drivers should also be studied. Between the two, we could get the state back into the black by 2010.

    No need to add to my laundry list of complaints. Rumor has it spring is coming, albeit a few weeks late.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider


    I think a tax on people who put 'The' in front of everything like is so common in this state, would yield a higher tax base than taxing caffeine. "I'm going to the Smiths, I'll be right back." Or perhaps a tax on those who sit in the outer, non-HOV lane on 1-15 and don't yield to faster drivers should also be studied. Between the two, we could get the state back into the black by 2010.
    I would like a tax on people who add an "s" to Zion. Zions is the bank, not the park.
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  6. #6
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    The best thing about this thread is all the "quotes". Or at least that's how it looks from 38 miles to the East.

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    I know enough full blown alcoholics who live around here, (in Zion,) to know that the alcohol rules only slow down the least ambitious...... I've never had a hard time tying one on...... unless one tries to buy whiskey or such on a sunday mornin'. The rules were dumb but anyone who says they cant get drunk in Utah either isn't drinkin' or lack the foresight to stock up when the liquor store is open. Seems to me the rules give peeps one more thing to complain about opposed to slowing down inebriation or consumption.

  8. #8
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    Im a transplant from SoCal..I live in orem but I am moving down to St. George at the end of summer and all I can say is this place is a different planet. Im not complaining, I love it here but I have never been to a place where morals are so highly legislated. These new rules may sound good but with the removal of the club system they are going to be Scanning your ID when you come into the bar and keeping records. Now most people may say so what but there is a privacy issue here. Outside of me being a drunk retard in public or driving drunk it is no ones business what I or anyone else does with there free time. The thing that I find most hipacritical is that the LDS laws in this state that regulate alcohol consumption are designed to make money for the state. If something is so morally objectionable is it okay to make revenue off of it??

  9. #9
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    It's spelled "hypocritical," I think it's good to do away with the "private club," law. I don't want this to become a mormon vs non-mormon thread (people love those), I love the notion that mormons own Coca-Cola, cracks me up everytime I hear it. It's a fact that DUI's are a serious problem, why not try to legislate to avoid unnecessary death and injury, furthermore while I'm on my soapbox, I agree with the revenue for "morally objectionable" practices such as smoking and drinking, it's expensive to treat the medical side effects (smoking in particular), and since I'm footing part of the bill via taxation I can feel a little miffed.........let's not even start down the road of illegals running gov't healthcare into the ground........Long story short, a little tolerance will go along way, (don't worry tolerance by definition is not acceptance) Both parties need to exercise some. I've never run into trouble with people about beliefs, or standards, or any of that because I can agree to disagree and respect others, I'm pretty easy to get along with, but when people have a bad attitude they'll have bad results in any endeavor........and when they beetch it drives me nuts!

    You guessed it I'm a mormon.
    I like bikes.

  10. #10
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    First off...Im not anti mormon...My wife is former LDS and Im married into a mormon family. They know my views on things and dont push the issue, and they are all great people and I love all of them. That being said I totally disagree with your assessment of my post. Yes, drunk driving is a problem but do you really think taxing and making it harder for grown adults to acquire alcohol lessens the frequency of drunk driving? Do the harsh penalties for possesion and distibution of drugs in this country deter people from buying, selling, and using drugs?? If you look back in history to the 1920's during prohibition it didnt keep people from drinking. In fact crime nearly tripled because of it. In this country we have something called separation of church and state. And for good reason. When governments are ran on theological principles you are asking for trouble. I.E. the middle east (I know from experience) you remove sound rational thinking from descision making. It is no secret that most of the legislative body in utah is LDS and that the LDS church has a huge influence over policy in this state. But to say the only reason we have the alcohol laws that we have here are because the legislators are just looking out for everybody?? Im sorry but I dont buy that for one minute. And politically speaking this is a republican state and if you know anything about conservative principles it is the belief that less government is better. Seems to me that alot of the laws that we have in this state are counter to basic conservative principles. Andwhen you say the word "tolerate" it sounds snide. Tolerance is not having people who is not of your religious sect follow the rules which you live by. And tolerance is not penalizing people for not falling in line with your belief system. Tolerance is you do your thing and Ill do mine and we can live together without stepping on each others toes. I know I tend to ramble on but it just irks me when elected officials try to impose their religious beliefs on the rest of us. By the way Im mildly dislexic so give me a break on the spelling and typing.

  11. #11
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    mormons dont own coca-cola.

  12. #12
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    No worries on spelling.....

    Quote Originally Posted by darkslide18
    First off...Im not anti mormon...My wife is former LDS and Im married into a mormon family. They know my views on things and dont push the issue, and they are all great people and I love all of them. That being said I totally disagree with your assessment of my post. Yes, drunk driving is a problem but do you really think taxing and making it harder for grown adults to acquire alcohol lessens the frequency of drunk driving? Do the harsh penalties for possesion and distibution of drugs in this country deter people from buying, selling, and using drugs?? If you look back in history to the 1920's during prohibition it didnt keep people from drinking. In fact crime nearly tripled because of it. In this country we have something called separation of church and state. And for good reason. When governments are ran on theological principles you are asking for trouble. I.E. the middle east (I know from experience) you remove sound rational thinking from descision making. It is no secret that most of the legislative body in utah is LDS and that the LDS church has a huge influence over policy in this state. But to say the only reason we have the alcohol laws that we have here are because the legislators are just looking out for everybody?? Im sorry but I dont buy that for one minute. And politically speaking this is a republican state and if you know anything about conservative principles it is the belief that less government is better. Seems to me that alot of the laws that we have in this state are counter to basic conservative principles. Andwhen you say the word "tolerate" it sounds snide. Tolerance is not having people who is not of your religious sect follow the rules which you live by. And tolerance is not penalizing people for not falling in line with your belief system. Tolerance is you do your thing and Ill do mine and we can live together without stepping on each others toes. I know I tend to ramble on but it just irks me when elected officials try to impose their religious beliefs on the rest of us. By the way Im mildly dislexic so give me a break on the spelling and typing.
    I agree with what you said concerning laws and the breaking of them, prohibition was a mess, and I never meant to imply you were anti-mormon. I saw a very funny/profound political comic the other day; it had two guys discussing the terrible drug wars on the border and what could be done to stop them, then they both lit up joints. Demand is demand and will be supplied, just because there's a demand doesn't mean it's ok necessarily. I specified that tolerance was not acceptance, both sides want acceptance, to have their lifestyle condoned, that's a definite impossibility. Tolerance (said in my snide english accent) is being able to disagree but to do so respectfully, we go about things differently and that's that. Another impossibility is to take religion out of anything..........our culture is based on judeo-christian ideology, the founding fathers were Deists themselves. Extremism/radicalism is dangerous in any religion, as you identified in the middle east, but don't toss out the baby with the bath water. As far as the laws in Utah go, the laws reflect what the majority of the population would like, democracy at work, yeah it sucks that everyone's agenda can't be met, that's just how it is. In other states mormons feel as you feel here in Utah. Historically speaking Utah has been a place where we could have laws that reflect our beliefs, mormons left the east to to do just that.....they dealt with some really hard times to settle here, just look at Grafton Mesa.....built by pioneers.....crazy! I really feel bad that many people view religion as divisive, it really gets to me, some of my best friends are quite polarized on both sides of the issue, so tolerance really is the answer. The bottom line is I hope I haven't injured anyone's feelings, and that we can get back to common ground; our passion for riding
    I like bikes.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    And like was mentioned, harsher penalties for thinking you're mental faculties are up to par after ten 3.2 beers.
    If you drink 10 near beers you should punch yourself in the face repeatedly and have your man card revoked. Near beer is a waste of my time.

    I thought Texas had arcane liquor laws (not being able to buy liquor on Sunday) but at least you can buy man beer and wine at the store any day of the week at any hour of the day. Utah sucks but it just takes some forward planning.

  14. #14
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    oh and BTW, the separation of church and state is one of the most misrepresented, mythical, and misquoted dogmas in history.........Jefferson wrote in a letter to a worried leader (worried that his specific christian church wouldn't be chosen) of a specific church not to worry because the gov't would not sponsor any single religion, in that respect there would be a separation of church and state..........not the same story a member of the ACLU would give you
    I like bikes.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasea04
    oh and BTW, the separation of church and state is one of the most misrepresented, mythical, and misquoted dogmas in history.........Jefferson wrote in a letter to a worried leader (worried that his specific christian church wouldn't be chosen) of a specific church not to worry because the gov't would not sponsor any single religion, in that respect there would be a separation of church and state..........not the same story a member of the ACLU would give you
    And far from the story Chris Buttars and his quorum of clowns would have you believe.
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  16. #16
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    Yeah the "separation of Church and State" thing kills me. It has nothing to do with Mormonism or any other Church saying what can and can't be law in Utah. It has everything to do with the proper functioning of a democracy. In any place where the predominance of people share the same moral values, they will vote for those values. If you don't like that, import friends of similar values or lobby to change those of the people you disagree with.

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    Removed

    nt nt
    Last edited by dusty; 04-06-2009 at 07:29 AM. Reason: Not worth the effort, arguing on the internet....

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    double post
    Last edited by dusty; 04-05-2009 at 04:11 PM. Reason: double post

  19. #19
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    The ACLU can suck D!{k; they lost their way a long time ago.

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    nt nt
    Last edited by dusty; 04-06-2009 at 07:31 AM. Reason: Same as above....

  21. #21
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    I put the big smiley by the end of the ACLU post because it was meant to be a joke, I'm not so sure about those guys these days though.........seen them do some crazy stuff up in the Seattle area when I lived there.......of course I'm no master of the Constitution, I wish I was.......but in the case of separaton of church and state I know quite a bit, I had to do my 1010 research paper on it Minorities have it tough, no matter what type (ethnicially, economically, faith, etc.)

    oh boy, I've done it this time.........the real policy should be to separate bikes and religion, unless biking is your religion
    I like bikes.

  22. #22
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    Well if it's any consolation, I'm starting a religion founded on polygamy and pedophilia if anyone's interested. I'm also planning on opening a University focusing on pumping out hundreds of Business Majors each year with no critical thinking skills. You can screw prior to marriage either through the backdoor or dry humping fully clothed on your parents couch in the basement. And if you DO do something really bad, I want you to come to my private office and tell me all about it so I can masturbate to it later. Lastly, no speaking other than in monotone with well placed pauses for added moral superiority.

    Oh wait, that's already been done. My bad.

    I guess I'll write out another check to the ACLU.

    14 ft of new snow in the Cottonwoods. Jesus, I guess that means we'll be beating this horse well beyond it's death for a couple more months before the high elevation trails clear out. Great.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    Well if it's any consolation, I'm starting a religion founded on polygamy and pedophilia if anyone's interested. I'm also planning on opening a University focusing on pumping out hundreds of Business Majors each year with no critical thinking skills. You can screw prior to marriage either through the backdoor or dry humping fully clothed on your parents couch in the basement. And if you DO do something really bad, I want you to come to my private office and tell me all about it so I can masturbate to it later. Lastly, no speaking other than in monotone with well placed pauses for added moral superiority.

    Oh wait, that's already been done. My bad.

    I guess I'll write out another check to the ACLU.

    14 ft of new snow in the Cottonwoods. Jesus, I guess that means we'll be beating this horse well beyond it's death for a couple more months before the high elevation trails clear out. Great.
    I lol'ed, hard . Funny stuff right there. Had to quote it for eternity.

    As for the snow, it rules, go play in it.

    B
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    I definitely spend more time per week on the bike than in church..... and that's all I'm saying.....

    Quote Originally Posted by wasea04
    the real policy should be to separate bikes and religion, unless biking is your religion

  25. #25
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    I can't take it anymore -- I'm riding this week no matter how shitty the weather!

    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    14 ft of new snow in the Cottonwoods. Jesus, I guess that means we'll be beating this horse well beyond it's death for a couple more months before the high elevation trails clear out. Great.

  26. #26
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    wow you did a 1010 paper on the constitution?? Thats like saying I know what Im talking about because I read a book on how to pilot a submarine. Saying that the mormon church has no influence over the laws in this state is totally ridiculous. And saying that is democracy in action is ludicris too. In a truly democratic society, religion is supposed to be removed from policy making. Thats the whole point of church and state. You call it democracy I call it theocracy.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bortis Yelltzen

    As for the snow, it rules, go play in it.

    B
    I know, I know. Our friend with the Merry Christmas bike tells me the same thing every time I speak to him. I now have a 'you don't ski-complex' among other things.

    There is a silver lining to this whole 'debate.' 50% of the population opts to sit indoors dressed in ties and slacks on Sunday singing and trying to one up each other spiritually. All doe-eyed.

    Which translates into an entire day to enjoy ourselves. Less people=more fun. If I recall, the same is true on the ski slopes and going to restaurants and the movies. No newly wed 21 year olds with 2.3 kids screaming and thinking it's cute because they're doing their part to over populate.

    Yay, the weekend's here! Let's wear a suit and tie and sit all day like we do at work all...week...long. I hope it's worth it.

  28. #28
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    Hmmm, nice analogy, maybe I should pilot the constitution underwater, I pointed out I'm no expert on the constitution, just the mythical section on the separation of church and state. It's already been clearly stated concerning how individuals use their democracy by silentfoe. To say the mormon church has influence over the laws is ludAcris, it would be correct to say mormon residents voting influence the laws, who/what influences them? What influences anyone ( remove religion from gov't, hahaha, gov't is people, as long as people have a religion, no matter religion it is then their gov't will reflect that), good grief, I already said that American culture is very Christian (not mormons version Christian either), even if you say you're not part of it, that's just what it is......Constituion included. A theocracy would be if the political leader was also the state backed religious leader, not seen anywhere but maybe Iran. I'm done with this, try to be cool and yes tolerant, and this is how it's going to be, insults?! Some of you are ruining it everyone here who're at least trying to get along (member, non-member relations), I'm going to walk away somewhat soured for sure.
    I like bikes.

  29. #29
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    Maybe I take this stuff too seriously............
    I like bikes.

  30. #30
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    Hey man, don't sweat it. Mormon or not you and Team Sanchez provide tons of stoke around here and I gotta get down to St.G and play on some of your handywork down there, you guys been busy digging it appears.

    I agree with much of what you are saying, in some ways I think the LDS folks are what makes UT what it is, without them this place would be slammed like CO, CA, etc.... I'm not here to drink and get cultured or find God. I'm here to play outside whether its on my bike or on my snow sliding tools, and in that regard UT is the best place I've found. And I can still get a drink when ever I want, I've come to terms with most the quirks, but I can't help but laugh and be shocked at how strange some of them are....

    To each their own.....
    B
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro....

  31. #31
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    Yeah, I do take stuff too seriously.......extends to all aspects of my personality.....I want to keep everybody happy all the time.......I care too much about what others think I guess.........ko21 where are you? I need some positive affirmation

    BTW you deliver the goods (stoke) when it's snow free up there too!
    I like bikes.

  32. #32
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    I'm blaming all this snow and hard feelings in the world on Mr. singletrack and his Thread here. Way to remind us that we still have to wait a couple more months before we can walk into a bar and buy watered down alcohol without a membership.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    I'm blaming all this snow and hard feelings in the world on Mr. singletrack and his Thread here. Way to remind us that we still have to wait a couple more months before we can walk into a bar and buy watered down alcohol without a membership.
    Wait a minute, I didn't think you drank. You've never dug into the cooler after the rides and shuttles I've done with you. I thought for sure you were LDS, except for the tatoos, what's going on here?

    B
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro....

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    Actually, I'm a disabled veteran who served in the Gulf war. And no, I will not show respect to a piece of crap organization like the ACLU.

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    Anyway...

    Can anyone tell me that if, after this new legislation goes into effect, drinking in bars and buying beer in stores will be anything like in other states, like Colorado? I guess only those who have lived in other states and experience the new changes would know.

    Will the Utah State Patrol still be pulling over drivers carrying coolers full of beer and charging them with illegal transport of alcohol (or whatever law they were charging them under, hey I read about it in a thread here last year). Will I be able to go into a liquor store and buy a six pack and not just a single bottle?

    The story I read was that Utah was passing legislation to bring their liquor laws more in line with other states but it appears that eliminating "memberships" is about it...or will that then lead to other de-facto changes?
    Who's in charge, the thinker or the thought?

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy

    Will the Utah State Patrol still be pulling over drivers carrying coolers full of beer and charging them with illegal transport of alcohol...

    YES

    Will I be able to go into a liquor store and buy a six pack and not just a single bottle?

    YOU ALWAYS COULD

    The story I read was that Utah was passing legislation to bring their liquor laws more in line with other states but it appears that eliminating "memberships" is about it...or will that then lead to other de-facto changes?
    The private clubs will be gone as of July 1, but you still have to buy regular beer from the State Liquor Store, and, as of now at least, we still can't get regular (over 3.2) beer on tap, although that may be addressed separately.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dusty
    The private clubs will be gone as of July 1, but you still have to buy regular beer from the State Liquor Store, and, as of now at least, we still can't get regular (over 3.2) beer on tap, although that may be addressed separately.

    I do drink beer but when I'm in Utah I just go without for the whole trip, just for the heck of it. Last time I was in Moab I went into a State Liquor Store and I could have sworn they only sold beer by the bottle. Yeah, I could have bought six at once (maybe?) and called it a sixer but it wasn't like they were sitting in the cooler in six packs. Or am I hallucinating?

    It seemed to be their way of reducing one's desire to walk out of the store with a bunch of beer...like I do here in Colorado. I buy what I want by the case, which usually gets me a 10-15% discount off each a single six pack, which in turn is cheaper than buying it by the bottle.
    Who's in charge, the thinker or the thought?

  38. #38
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    Thanks for your service. I'm sorry you feel that way about the ACLU. They've pissed everybody off at some point, which I think is a sign they're doing what the set out to do: place the founding laws and ideals of this nation above any particular group's interests.

    Quote Originally Posted by wookie
    Actually, I'm a disabled veteran who served in the Gulf war. And no, I will not show respect to a piece of crap organization like the ACLU.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by dusty
    I'm sorry you feel that way about the ACLU. They've pissed everybody off at some point, which I think is a sign they're doing what the set out to do: place the founding laws and ideals of this nation above any particular group's interests.
    I have to agree here. Instead of supporting my myopic view of how things should be, they have one goal, defending civil liberties.

    Back to the original base of this thread, Utah is slowly updating their liquor laws. I have lived here most of my life, so I am used to them. Not being able to buy beer on Sunday in Cache Valley really sucked when I lived there. It also made the road to Franklin wear out faster than normal.

    I have to say that anyone that feels that the LDS church isn't pulling strings in the State Legislature is at least maintaining the state pastime of keeping their head buried in the sand. LA LA LA LA LA LA, I can't hear what you are saying.
    Riding Fat and still just as fast as I never was.

  40. #40
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    Just to reassure all our out-of-state friends that:
    a) UT law isn't influenced by the church and
    b) UT isn't crazy, doesn't suck, etc..... I share with you this little nugget:

    http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/artic...f-justice.html

    To answer more beer questions: You're right, technically it's by the bottle. I guess I just tend to buy them by the half-dozen. State Liquor stores don't chill their beer. If you want to buy cold beer (and not leave the Kingdom, ur, I mean state), you must find one of the rare licensed liquor agents (go bike the swell and/or Capitol Reef area - you can buy cold cerveza in Bicknell).



    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy
    I do drink beer but when I'm in Utah I just go without for the whole trip, just for the heck of it. Last time I was in Moab I went into a State Liquor Store and I could have sworn they only sold beer by the bottle. Yeah, I could have bought six at once (maybe?) and called it a sixer but it wasn't like they were sitting in the cooler in six packs. Or am I hallucinating?

    It seemed to be their way of reducing one's desire to walk out of the store with a bunch of beer...like I do here in Colorado. I buy what I want by the case, which usually gets me a 10-15% discount off each a single six pack, which in turn is cheaper than buying it by the bottle.

  41. #41
    Coors, the american beer.
    Reputation: Melt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcguy
    Will the Utah State Patrol still be pulling over drivers carrying coolers full of beer and charging them with illegal transport of alcohol (or whatever law they were charging them under, hey I read about it in a thread here last year). Will I be able to go into a liquor store and buy a six pack and not just a single bottle?
    sorry to bump this thread, but i had no idea this happens or was illegal. I drove thru utah with at least 4 30 packs in the bed of my truck in may of 2008. Guess i should count my lucky stars.
    AZ has the best mountain bike gathering ever

  42. #42
    Fragglepuss The Chaste
    Reputation: slcrockymountainrider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bortis Yelltzen
    Wait a minute, I didn't think you drank. You've never dug into the cooler after the rides and shuttles I've done with you. I thought for sure you were LDS, except for the tatoos, what's going on here?

    B
    I got out of sales. That's what happened. Now I go home poor but without the stress and desire to drown my work day in liquid.

    You know, I just got the same lecture from the GF today. Seriously. She can put down a pitcher before I figure out if it's a twist top or not. Apparently I can't hang and my manhood is now in question. Being from Pittsburgh originally, beer and burgers are supposedly in my blood. I guess seeing your uncles taken away by the po-po one too many times for fighting with their GF's, wives, neighbors, the dog, garden gnomes, Halloween jack-o-lanterns on the porch, grandma,what have you... takes all the desire out of drinking.

    Coffee is my cup of tea, so speak. Probably why I'm still high strung.
    This weather isn't helping either. There are only so many times a man can ride the Shoreline before he starts to crack.

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