Mill F- Crest Trail, Big Cottonwood Canyon- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Mill F- Crest Trail, Big Cottonwood Canyon

    I posted this a week ago, and got no hits. I'll try to edit and make my question clearer.

    For those of you who actually ride the crest trail as a loop from Mill D in big cottonwood:

    (maybe that's the problem - real riders are too busy to read forums...this forum must be full of car shuttlers who think they are mtbikers...I may not get a good answer but at least I can start a flame war... )

    Anyway, if you wanted to ride the loop (and not do the whole thing on the road), you might have taken an old dirt road up a drainage called Mill F (starts across from Solitude). A few years ago, a bunch of "no trespassing" signs went up. Last year, I had a run-in with the land owner and he made it pretty clear that he didn't want anyone on his road. The signs says something like "silver king mining company". There seems be some mining activity, but its pretty small time. Just curious if anyone knows about these people, the status of that road (can they really own it?), or any other info. I should probably just contact the Forest Service, they would probably know more.
    Last edited by slcpunk; 07-10-2007 at 12:27 PM. Reason: no responses

  2. #2
    Zak
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    I don't know anything about the mining - other than it looks like closure/cleanup work to me. We rode through it maybe a month ago and didn't see anyone, just a trackhoe (it was a sunday). I would just avoid it and take an alternate route up - sucks...

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    Yeah - the alternates are just no good. I have to stop being lazy and call the FS and see if there is anything to be done. It wouldn't be too hard to put in a short amount of trail to get around that mining spot. I rode through about a week ago and saw no one, but don't want to have any more run-ins. I mean, they spent all that money widening the already wide and smooth pipeline trail, and drove the trail cat up the bottom of the mill-D trail....why not use that time/money for something that makes a difference?

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    I don't think the mining company could own the land since most of the area is a national forest. It probably leases it from the forest service. You should check with the forest service to see if it retained any rights for the public to use the road. If not, you could just continue on up Guardsman's Pass to where the shuttlers park.

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    i ran into another guy who likes to ride that way - I guess there is an okay alternate route ( and maybe if more of us rode it, it would improve ). Go right at the closed gate, left near the bottom of the next hill, then hard left back up. Should put you right at the "normal/shuttler" trail head. I haven't done it yet, but will try soon. I guess its pretty rough right now...

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    I think that's the way I used to ride it. I would take the gate at the first hairpin turn on Guardsman and it would take me right to the parking area of the shuttlers.

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    wow dude you ride the crest as a loop!!??? you must be like a totally hardcore slc punk rocker dude!! Thats like 2,500 feet of climbing, how on earth do you ever do that.... you must ride pro?

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    Quote Originally Posted by RockyPoint
    wow dude you ride the crest as a loop!!??? you must be like a totally hardcore slc punk rocker dude!! Thats like 2,500 feet of climbing, how on earth do you ever do that.... you must ride pro?
    "I EARN MY VERT, *****ES, TEH HARDCORE IS PRASENT HEAR!!!!!!!"

    I shuttled Mill D/Crest yesterday with peoples. It was fun. I do not know of the Mill F road you speak of, however.
    It's just frustrating sometimes being an Athena...

  9. #9
    SMR
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    i ran into another guy who likes to ride that way - I guess there is an okay alternate route ( and maybe if more of us rode it, it would improve ). Go right at the closed gate, left near the bottom of the next hill, then hard left back up. Should put you right at the "normal/shuttler" trail head. I haven't done it yet, but will try soon. I guess its pretty rough right now...
    I believe I rode it this way about a month ago, it was my first time. Not the greatest "trail" but better then taking the road. I think all of it was legal though. I wish there was a better trail along the road up to Guardsman.

  10. #10
    JMH
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    Superhardcore

    I ride from home all the way to Guardsman on my road bike, with a second pair of shoes and my mountain bike in a backpack. I lock my road bike at Guardsman, ride the loop on my MTB, then climb back up and retrieve my road bike for the return journey. Total climbing is only around 7500ft, but it takes almost 9 hours because its a struggle to carry the MTB. But that's the price I am willing to pay to earn my descents.



    JMH

  11. #11
    Err
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMH
    I ride from home all the way to Guardsman on my road bike, with a second pair of shoes and my mountain bike in a backpack. I lock my road bike at Guardsman, ride the loop on my MTB, then climb back up and retrieve my road bike for the return journey. Total climbing is only around 7500ft, but it takes almost 9 hours because its a struggle to carry the MTB. But that's the price I am willing to pay to earn my descents.



    JMH

    Yeah and you need to quit being such a ***** and carry your road bike on your back on the DH. The rest of us manage just fine

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    I posted this a week ago, and got no hits. I'll try to edit and make my question clearer.

    For those of you who actually ride the crest trail as a loop from Mill D in big cottonwood:

    (maybe that's the problem - real riders are too busy to read forums...this forum must be full of car shuttlers who think they are mtbikers...I may not get a good answer but at least I can start a flame war... )

    Anyway, if you wanted to ride the loop (and not do the whole thing on the road), you might have taken an old dirt road up a drainage called Mill F (starts across from Solitude). A few years ago, a bunch of "no trespassing" signs went up. Last year, I had a run-in with the land owner and he made it pretty clear that he didn't want anyone on his road. The signs says something like "silver king mining company". There seems be some mining activity, but its pretty small time. Just curious if anyone knows about these people, the status of that road (can they really own it?), or any other info. I should probably just contact the Forest Service, they would probably know more.
    They're not mining there, I'm sure of that. I was up there a little while ago and they're doing some low-level remediation and dirt moving. That means they're almost certainly under the eye of the mining safety authorities, which would explain why the owner was pissy with you; he's liable for a fine if you're caught. Mineral rights / surface rights can be very different depending on how old the mine is, but i think at the very least the owner / operator would have the right to restrict access if the lease was current. I wouldn;t hesitate to go through on a sunday, but I'd avoid it if there's work going on. It won't be forever.

    When i was up there with Zak we came to a fork in the road right around where the pavement (first climb) ended. We went left, changed our minds, came down and went right through the mine. However, the left looked like it might have dumped you right around the beginning of puke hill. Nothing like a gnarly climb to warm you up. And by "warm up", I mean "collapse a lung". Maybe i'll try that this weekend....Zak?

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    Cool - thanks for the info. I sort of agree - although at first I suspected that they were hanging out on Saturdays to catch people. When I ran into the guy, he said the reason that they didn't want people going through there was because of vandalism and littering. No shiite. Too many clif bar wrappers or something... I mean, I DO see some MTBiker litter out there every now and then (hopefully accidental), but I can't believe we were causing that much trouble. Seems like maybe local teens finding a place to sneak a few beers or something would be the real trouble. He didn't mention liability. Of course, I still haven't called the FS...that would take some actual thought and time...not like posting on the i-net.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockyPoint
    wow dude you ride the crest as a loop!!??? you must be like a totally hardcore slc punk rocker dude!! Thats like 2,500 feet of climbing, how on earth do you ever do that.... you must ride pro?
    Finally some reaction and good ole sarcasm - that's what I was looking for!

  15. #15
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    It is private property and those signs have been there a long time....we just always ignored them and went around the gate.

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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    Cool - thanks for the info. I sort of agree - although at first I suspected that they were hanging out on Saturdays to catch people. When I ran into the guy, he said the reason that they didn't want people going through there was because of vandalism and littering. No shiite. Too many clif bar wrappers or something... I mean, I DO see some MTBiker litter out there every now and then (hopefully accidental), but I can't believe we were causing that much trouble. Seems like maybe local teens finding a place to sneak a few beers or something would be the real trouble. He didn't mention liability. Of course, I still haven't called the FS...that would take some actual thought and time...not like posting on the i-net.
    Let's not rule out the possibility that the guy is a douchehat. To have a silver miner complain about littering is pretty rich.

    If i get the chance I'll take the left route and let you know if it avoids the private property. It'll be nice to loop that thing without spending miles on pavement.

  17. #17
    JMH
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    Rode up this way last week... maybe I missed them somehow, but I didn't see any "no trespassing" signs on the entire climb. We ascended the pavement (across from Solitude) and took the first gate on the right (we could see a second gate about 20 yards up the road) and headed across a meadow, took the two left turns up the hill to end at the bathroom by the top trailhead.

    I don't mind climbing at all and I am plenty fit, but this route feels exactly like what it is: a steep, boring, event-free slog to avoid a road to avoid a shuttle. I probably won't be doing it again, but at least now I know what I'm not missing!

    JMH

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    Quote Originally Posted by JMH
    Rode up this way last week... maybe I missed them somehow, but I didn't see any "no trespassing" signs on the entire climb. We ascended the pavement (across from Solitude) and took the first gate on the right (we could see a second gate about 20 yards up the road) and headed across a meadow, took the two left turns up the hill to end at the bathroom by the top trailhead.

    I don't mind climbing at all and I am plenty fit, but this route feels exactly like what it is: a steep, boring, event-free slog to avoid a road to avoid a shuttle. I probably won't be doing it again, but at least now I know what I'm not missing!

    JMH
    Go through second gate - that's where the 'no tresspassing' BS starts. This route is much better than the crappy roads that take you to the bathrooms. (puts you out maybe a third of the way between the shitters and puke-hill) Well, to be honest, its still steep, but the dirt is good quality and even turns into something approaching single track. Also, for what its worth, there is a short piece of single track if you start across the street from the LOWER solitude lot that you can do at the start. (50 yards on dirt road, then turn right over a chain)

    I don't think anyone will say its amazing riding, but comparing the entire route up Mill F vs riding the pavement makes a big difference in the feel of the ride. Of course, shuttling is certainly easier, but I think we can all agree that going to Lagoon and riding "the monster" is also easier. Its all in what you find worth doing....

  19. #19
    JMH
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    [QUOTE=slcpunk}but I think we can all agree that going to Lagoon and riding "the monster" is also easier. Its all in what you find worth doing....[/QUOTE]

    LAGOON! That sounds nice right now.

    I may try out the route changes you suggested. Is the "singletrack" across from the lower Solitude entrance signed at all? I saw a few different spots that kinda looked like trail.

    JMH

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    I posted this a week ago, and got no hits. I'll try to edit and make my question clearer.

    For those of you who actually ride the crest trail as a loop from Mill D in big cottonwood:

    (maybe that's the problem - real riders are too busy to read forums...this forum must be full of car shuttlers who think they are mtbikers...I may not get a good answer but at least I can start a flame war... )

    Anyway, if you wanted to ride the loop (and not do the whole thing on the road), you might have taken an old dirt road up a drainage called Mill F (starts across from Solitude). A few years ago, a bunch of "no trespassing" signs went up. Last year, I had a run-in with the land owner and he made it pretty clear that he didn't want anyone on his road. The signs says something like "silver king mining company". There seems be some mining activity, but its pretty small time. Just curious if anyone knows about these people, the status of that road (can they really own it?), or any other info. I should probably just contact the Forest Service, they would probably know more.
    slcpunk, a group of us were 'caught' by surprise by some guy with a camera while riding up Mill F to the Crest last summer. We were all pretty spread out and I know he took a picture of me and the gal riding a ways behind me. He went so far as to walk up to her and make some verbal threats. Once another male friend caught up to her he backed off and started taking more pictures.
    I normally ride the Crest as a loop from the Mill D trailhead up the road to the entrance in Guardsman, but after that female road rider was killed by Solitude we decided to try a safer route up the dirt. Like some people have posted on here, I don't believe they are mining anything but probably trying to do anything to hold on to any rights that come with outdated mining claims. We contacted Save Our Canyons and I guess there are legal ways around them denying access to Mill F based on old right of ways, etc.....but no one has taken the Silver Fork Mining Company to task-if that company even exists.
    A friend now takes a spur somewhere before you get to the gate will all the posted no tresspassing signs that spits you out somewhere along the dirt road before Puke Hill. I haven't taken it yet just for the sake of having a peaceful ride and not dealing with the pig that has a trailer up there.

    Regardless, the Crest to Mill D is great this year as the downed trees were left fallen over the trail and make for great kickers. I don't know who decided to jackhammer the left side of the Spine down ? Pretty lame. I wish people would leave the challenging stuff alone and not turn it into a sidewalk. Keep your speed up, lay off the brakes and go up and over the top. If you can't ride it, walk it and leave it for others who can.

    See you up there!

  21. #21
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    hmmm

    rode mill f last sat and the mine is covered, the signs are there, never seen a land owner there but it sure is a grunt of a climb, better than the rode for sure though..

  22. #22
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    From what I know the guy is usually just up there on weekends. A few years back I rode Mill F in the evening and there was someone in the trailer having a lonely man BBQ, but he never came out to bug me. I guess he couldn't get his pants up quickly enough.

    I wouldn't worry too much about the guy as he is quite portly and would be hard pressed to catch someone on a bike, even if they were in the middle of that grunt up. I would be more worried about him taking your photo and it ending up on some hillbilly porn page entitled www.xxxlycraclad****s.com or something. Or if the guy decided to pull out a gun..... I liked the comment he made to my female friend last year when he jumped in front of her to block her way up: "Looks like we've got ourselves a stand off!" Yee Haw to that!

    PS. Someone named Err has some decent helmet cam footage from the spine out to Mill D. Check it out, but don't get too depressed that you aren't up there riding it.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMH
    LAGOON! That sounds nice right now.

    I may try out the route changes you suggested. Is the "singletrack" across from the lower Solitude entrance signed at all? I saw a few different spots that kinda looked like trail.

    JMH
    negative, no signs. You should be able to spot the dirt road across the street from the lower Solitude entrance - maybe just slightly uphill. As I said, go down the DR (back down canyon) for maybe 200yards, and look for single track heading uphill to the right, over a chain.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    slcpunk, a group of us were 'caught' by surprise by some guy with a camera while riding up Mill F to the Crest last summer. We were all pretty spread out and I know he took a picture of me and the gal riding a ways behind me. He went so far as to walk up to her and make some verbal threats. Once another male friend caught up to her he backed off and started taking more pictures.
    I normally ride the Crest as a loop from the Mill D trailhead up the road to the entrance in Guardsman, but after that female road rider was killed by Solitude we decided to try a safer route up the dirt. Like some people have posted on here, I don't believe they are mining anything but probably trying to do anything to hold on to any rights that come with outdated mining claims. We contacted Save Our Canyons and I guess there are legal ways around them denying access to Mill F based on old right of ways, etc.....but no one has taken the Silver Fork Mining Company to task-if that company even exists.
    A friend now takes a spur somewhere before you get to the gate will all the posted no tresspassing signs that spits you out somewhere along the dirt road before Puke Hill. I haven't taken it yet just for the sake of having a peaceful ride and not dealing with the pig that has a trailer up there.

    Regardless, the Crest to Mill D is great this year as the downed trees were left fallen over the trail and make for great kickers. I don't know who decided to jackhammer the left side of the Spine down ? Pretty lame. I wish people would leave the challenging stuff alone and not turn it into a sidewalk. Keep your speed up, lay off the brakes and go up and over the top. If you can't ride it, walk it and leave it for others who can.

    See you up there!
    wow...i would hate to have that type of confrontation. the spur you mention is what is discussed previously in this thread. It works, but its a poor replacement for the old original route.

    I am with you 100% on the "leave the challenging stuff alone" thought. Do you remember when there was a tough spot earlier on in the middle of the fast singletrack - some white blocky chunks of rock - a few smaller ones still remain now but definitely subdued.

    Typical "make it easy" BS. Same with the cool/scary/narrow spots that used to be on the pipeline trail. That thing is a boardwalk now. Dumbing down.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    wow...i would hate to have that type of confrontation. the spur you mention is what is discussed previously in this thread. It works, but its a poor replacement for the old original route.

    I am with you 100% on the "leave the challenging stuff alone" thought. Do you remember when there was a tough spot earlier on in the middle of the fast singletrack - some white blocky chunks of rock - a few smaller ones still remain now but definitely subdued.

    Typical "make it easy" BS. Same with the cool/scary/narrow spots that used to be on the pipeline trail. That thing is a boardwalk now. Dumbing down.
    I do recall early last year after all the spring rain and snow run-off a good part of the trail from the lake down to the Mill D trailhead had a nice, deep rut that formed right down the middle of the trail. To someone's credit, they filled in the rut but in the process added a few more water bars and cleaned out some of the rocks. It's still a fun ride, especially since they've kept those trees in there as jumps.

    And I remember quite a few years back riding the Pipeline in Millcreek when they were jackhammering that one tiny little technical section right after that short/steep climb that would sneak up on you. A bunch of do-gooders were adding that wall and making that section smooth as a sidewalk. I voiced my disapproval and how the challenge of that little section made the trail interesting, but they just kept working. I've only ridden Pipeline a handfull of times since then, not just because of that, but all the hiking/running traffic that trail gets in the evening.

    Kudo's though to whomever's been spending a ton of time on the Bob Sled. A bit too hot for an afterwork ride right now, but as soon as it gets down into the 80's again I can't wait to include that back in my afterwork ride schedule.

    If you haven't done so already, check out Wolf Mountain. It's an odd mountain as there are absolutely no rocks up there, but every trail is bermed . It's a great place if you just want to take it easy and have a fun day. Lots of jumps and the new skills park is great. Only real downside is that there is only really one "technical" trail up there with a double black diamond sign. It's steep and loose in places, kind of like the Sonny Bono section of the Bountiful DH race course, with a nice booter onto a soft grass transition at the end. It's good for what it is and the $15 cover isn't too bad. Add to that your wrists don't ache after a day like they can after a day at Deer Valley.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    I do recall early last year after all the spring rain and snow run-off a good part of the trail from the lake down to the Mill D trailhead had a nice, deep rut that formed right down the middle of the trail. To someone's credit, they filled in the rut but in the process added a few more water bars and cleaned out some of the rocks. It's still a fun ride, especially since they've kept those trees in there as jumps.

    And I remember quite a few years back riding the Pipeline in Millcreek when they were jackhammering that one tiny little technical section right after that short/steep climb that would sneak up on you. A bunch of do-gooders were adding that wall and making that section smooth as a sidewalk. I voiced my disapproval and how the challenge of that little section made the trail interesting, but they just kept working. I've only ridden Pipeline a handfull of times since then, not just because of that, but all the hiking/running traffic that trail gets in the evening.

    Kudo's though to whomever's been spending a ton of time on the Bob Sled. A bit too hot for an afterwork ride right now, but as soon as it gets down into the 80's again I can't wait to include that back in my afterwork ride schedule.

    If you haven't done so already, check out Wolf Mountain. It's an odd mountain as there are absolutely no rocks up there, but every trail is bermed . It's a great place if you just want to take it easy and have a fun day. Lots of jumps and the new skills park is great. Only real downside is that there is only really one "technical" trail up there with a double black diamond sign. It's steep and loose in places, kind of like the Sonny Bono section of the Bountiful DH race course, with a nice booter onto a soft grass transition at the end. It's good for what it is and the $15 cover isn't too bad. Add to that your wrists don't ache after a day like they can after a day at Deer Valley.
    yeah, its a fine line between valid trail work (like to repair the erosion as you mentioned) vs wasted trail work to widen and smooth a perfectly okay trail. since i haven't done ANY trail work myself, i really don't have much of a leg to stand on in any case.

    wolf mountain...in huntsville? interesting. any XC trails there? (i've only ridden the skyline trail above it from the reservoir to n. ogden pass)

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcpunk
    yeah, its a fine line between valid trail work (like to repair the erosion as you mentioned) vs wasted trail work to widen and smooth a perfectly okay trail. since i haven't done ANY trail work myself, i really don't have much of a leg to stand on in any case.

    wolf mountain...in huntsville? interesting. any XC trails there? (i've only ridden the skyline trail above it from the reservoir to n. ogden pass)
    I believe the city is Eden, UT. Supposedly they do have some XC trails, but I didn't see any. We spent Sunday riding the lift.

    They have a great, long Dual Slalom course. I mean, really long for a DS course, complete with rollers, doubles, step-ups, you name it. They just opened a "skills" course along side the DS track. Lots of doubles to varying degrees of difficulty, a wall hit, hip jump.
    The dirt is nice and smooth. Just about every corner is bermed, which is really nice. Only real complaint, is that the mountain is short and the lift is slow. You're down from top to bottom in a couple of minutes, if that.

    They are definitely in their infancy with lift served mtb'ing, but the place has a lot of potential. My guess is that the Utah DH Series will have a DH race and Super D there next year.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by slcrockymountainrider
    I believe the city is Eden, UT. Supposedly they do have some XC trails, but I didn't see any. We spent Sunday riding the lift.

    They have a great, long Dual Slalom course. I mean, really long for a DS course, complete with rollers, doubles, step-ups, you name it. They just opened a "skills" course along side the DS track. Lots of doubles to varying degrees of difficulty, a wall hit, hip jump.
    The dirt is nice and smooth. Just about every corner is bermed, which is really nice. Only real complaint, is that the mountain is short and the lift is slow. You're down from top to bottom in a couple of minutes, if that.

    They are definitely in their infancy with lift served mtb'ing, but the place has a lot of potential. My guess is that the Utah DH Series will have a DH race and Super D there next year.
    very interesting - and yes Eden is probably technically correct...

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