Do You Like Utah? (relocation)- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Do You Like Utah? (relocation)

    I just got back from an interview over the weekend (from Michigan). It looks like I would either be working downtown SLC, Centerville or Ogden. Any opinions or feedback would be great.

    I know it's dominate LDS, which I am not. However, West Michigan is dominate Christian so I am use to seeing a church on every corner. Doesn't really bother me as long as they don't oppose their beliefs on to me (which I'm told they don't).

    Guess I'm just looking for overrall opinion. I can do all the research I want, but really would like the common folk opinion.

    Thanks.

  2. #2
    Chris Bling
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    move here

    first off, i wouldnt call it lds dominated. its maybe 25%, maybe. second of all, there is no better place to live if you love mountain biking. depending on where you live, you can ride year round on some of the best trails in the world. come out and check it out.

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  3. #3
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    Naw, mountain biking is ok there. Not 'the best in the world', but pretty good. It ain't BC, thats for sure. But I see it improving over the next few years. Maybe you could contribute something to the scene.

  4. #4
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    The area I am looking at is Centerville. Any thoughts on that area. Utah seems to get very high remarks from other people I ask.

    According to Sperling (city comparision site), 78% of population is LDS and it's heavy Republican. Non of that bothers me at all since 70%+ of population is Christian where I live and they are all Republicans.

    Oh, Rocky, your the first to say MTBIng is just okay. I understand you like BC and I don't blame you. I am a avid snowboarder as well. Nothing compares to Whistler.

  5. #5
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    What I mean is that Utah has lots of potential that hasn't been realized. Yes it has great scenery etc. but most trails are very easy. In comparison, the scene has quite a bit growing up to do. Utah needs more challenging diverse trails and more people need to pitch in doing trail maintenance. Attitudes need to change. More and more people are becoming aware of this and things are headed in the right direction. Good things are happening. You'll like it I think.

  6. #6
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    I lived in SLC twice for a total of 9 years, and it's one of the few places in the country I'd consider looking for a job in the future.

    Regarding Centerville, yes - it'll have a higher %. You could consider living in the north end of SLC (in the "Avenues" or slightly west of there but still east of I-80). When I was there the Avenues were one of the least conservative areas, plus some places have great views of the valley. & access to some trails.

    What I liked best is that I could have a regular job and be 20 minutes from skiing, biking, climbing,... amazing access to the outdoors. & then there's southern Utah - deserts, rivers, ... !

  7. #7
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    Hi there,

    I'm a fellow native Mid-westerner (Indiana). I moved out to Utah in 1999 to do an internship with the forest service right after I graduated college. While it was a major culture shock (moved from Bloomington, UT to Roosevelt, UT), I ended up staying in Utah after my internship eneded and moved to Logan (a bigger town). I met my husband the very first day I arrived in Utah. He is from the East coast.

    The culture is just part of life now. I have some great LDS neighbors who are very accepting of us. They'd rather hang out with us than people in their own ward! We were solicited a few times in the early years, but that has gone away as I asked them to remove me from their list or whatever. Not sure if that did the trick.

    I wish Utah had the progressiveness of a town like Madison, WI but keep the scenery of Utah.

    It was a tough first year. We didn't really have friends, we were pretty poor. But I loved the west - mountains, blue skies, dry air. I was hooked. Slowly we made a life here with friends and were able to buy more "toys" (bikes, skis, canoe, etc). Now I really really love it here. I don't know if I'll die in Logan, but the small town feel with very close mountains near by is ideal for us. Logan is only a 5 hour or less drive from the Utah desert, Jackson, Yellowstone, Wind Rivers, Ketchum, Great Basin, etc. Great for a weekend get away.

  8. #8
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    I think you'd like it here, Centerville is a nice area and close to just about everything

  9. #9
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    Just moved here 3 months ago. It's a killer place to live, snowboarding, mt biking, climbing, all good. Being non-LDS doesn't seem to matter.

    And I agree, BC has the best trails I've ever ridden but it's darn good riding here.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Guppie58
    I am a avid snowboarder as well. Nothing compares to Whistler.
    Well there is another reason you will love living in Utah. We have just as good of terrain as whistler does, and the alta/bird pass makes one huge ski area(although that wont work quite as well for you....But yes utah is great, and after a year or two living here you tend to forget all about that mormon thing. Its never as big of a problem as people say..

    And the best part is is how centrally located utah seems to be. There are sooo many great outdoor places within a 4-6 hour drive from here, utah is a great place if youre into the outdoors.

  11. #11
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    Terrible place to live. Bitterly cold winters. Blazing hot summers. Mountain biking isn't that great. I'd look somewhere else ;-)

  12. #12
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    I've been looking at housing, wow is it costly there (compared to Michigan). SLC has yet to experience the RE bubble pop. In Michigan we were going just as strong, but now we have builders crashing everywhere.

    The positions we either in Ogden or Centerville. I'm going to push for Centerville because Ogden seemed so dreary. I know they are going through some great improvements with the mall, etc. but..still, just seemed dreary.

    Opinions or thoughts on Ogden. Also, what is a good affordable community to live in if I work in either Centerville or Ogden?

    Thanks for all your feedback. Big decision to make so getting real answers is very beneficial.

  13. #13
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    Houses are way too expensive around here. I think you'll see a downward housing spiral soon and all these construction workers and companies will be looking for new jobs.

    You're right about Ogden, it doesn't seem to be the greatest location although there are some nicer homes up on the bench. Clearfield is find of close to Ogden and so is Harrisville which is a nice area and has less expensive homes. Woodscross is pretty close to Centerville and has more affordable housing, a lot of younger couples living in that area.

  14. #14
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    Expense is relative. The housing seems downright cheap to me, compared to LA and Seattle, and I am not the only West Coast economic refugee in SLC.

    Ogden is experiencing a bit of a relocation boom right now. They have been offering tax incentives to tons of outdoor comapnies and have received quite a response. Salomon, Atomic, Suunto and Rossignol's warehouse are all moving there, and supossedly, Scott Bikes is making the Utah move, too (http://www.ogdencity.com/index.php?m...=press.pr_224). I think that the city will continue to evolve into a place that reflects the outdoor demographic.

    On a related note, check this article:
    http://www.sltrib.com/search/ci_5580444

    Rossignol is moving most of its brands to Park City - Rossignol, Dynastar, Roxy, Lange, Gnu and Lib Tech. As I doubt most of their employees will be able to afford places in PC, something tells me that Sugarhouse property will continue to appreciate.
    Last edited by chuky; 04-18-2007 at 08:36 AM.
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  15. #15
    Ridin in UT
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    Hey Guppie, my wife and I moved here from Ann Arbor 2 1/2 years ago and quite honestly to this day it feels like we are on a permanent vacation in paradise Granted, we live in the southern end of the valley with biking out our door and in close proximity to the main canyons... But Centerville is still close to all of these activities, and

    1) religion/culture doesn't have to affect you if you find your niche, like in skiing/biking/hiking outdoor groups like we have.

    2) as mentioned before - we are close to everything! CA, OR, WA...etc..

    3) The desert. It has grown on me and now is my favorite thing in the whole world. I love the wide open spaces, solitude, cactus and lizards. Plus, Moab/Fruita/St. George are all within 4.5 hours.

    Ok now the bad news - it isn't anything like Ann Arbor (except for the SugarHouse/Avenues area)

    Good luck in your decision! Let us know if we can help at all.
    Ride on!

  16. #16
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    I am a CT transplant, and I love it. I also live in Ogden, on the east bench. If you stay above Harrison Blvd., the homes are quite nice-very old/charismatic. The trails are right outside my door, and the neighborhood is actually fairly liberal. Good luck!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by RockyWanderer
    Naw, mountain biking is ok there. Not 'the best in the world', but pretty good. It ain't BC, thats for sure. But I see it improving over the next few years. Maybe you could contribute something to the scene.
    I think the whole Utah vs BC debate is a matter of what you are used to. I am a Canadian living here in Utah and all of my family is from BC and Alberta. They prefer to come down every year and ride the trails in Logan Canyon and Moab. They say they like Moab over Whistler but I think it's just because they are used to the BC and Alberta mountains and Moab is something new. Same reason some of my favourite rides are in Canada.

    They didn't care much for Antelope Island though.

    Slow and steady gets you...7th place.


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  18. #18
    The Sentinel
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    I've lived here all my life...

    ...and I can't stand Antelope Island either. Pay $10 to destroy my drivetrain with sand and get eaten alive by midges...wheeeeeeee!

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkan
    They didn't care much for Antelope Island though.
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  19. #19
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    howdy, not sure if this will help, but im in salt lake city right now working, and i must say that slc is the most bizzare city ive ever experienced... not bad, just wierd. the booze laws are whacky, the people dont seem to know how to drive, but are generaly friendly and helpful. the riding is very good, great views from every trail ive been on, though the lower elevation stuff tends to be pretty crowded (im used to this, as im from northern california) having worked here for about a month and a half, i can say that should the opertunity arise, i would be willing to move here... ok, thats my two pennies, have a good one
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  20. #20
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    I live in bountiful, which is just north of Centerville and love it. I can ride 3 sweet trails right from my house. Any part of Davis county is nice, if you are looking for affordable housing that isn't too far away Kaysville or Syracuse would be a good option.

  21. #21
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    anybody here of Garbett Builders? Looks like they have a decent development in Farmington.

  22. #22
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    The real estate market boomed in the last 18 months some areas saw an 10-18% increase in value, unfortunately the market cannot sustain that rate of growth, as a rule of thumb 5% is seen as good in most markets. NY just had a downturn, my folks lost about 100,000.00 in value. I ran a title insurance company for about 8 months (hated it) what I did learn is that on average there are 300 notices of default per month, 190 go to foreclosure. Guppie depending on your credit rating and available cash you can find some incredible deals if you are willing to shop around. Most short-sells go quickly, don't be afraid to low ball most sellers in this market, everyone is overpriced by 15,000 to 25,000, that's a low estimate. Regardless it's a great place to live just don't tell your friends or family okay, you are allowed to invite one person per 10 years to live here. any more tan that and we send some nice people to save you...

  23. #23
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    Lived there 10 years, now live in Colorado...Utah is great place for outdoor activities; however, the LDS influence is very prevalent. Just couldn't get used to it even in 10 years time. Skiing is king there, it is the best in the world. The mountain biking is good, but not as good as Colorado IMO, specifically along the Wasatch Front. Expect a completely different dynamic in the workplace then you are currently used to.

  24. #24

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    Hey Guppie,

    There is at least one post on this board regarding air quality along the Wasatch Front which may be a factor for you to consider. If don't know which part of Michigan you are in, but make no mistake, Salt Lake City is no small town and it is growing very rapidly. This means lots of opportunity and many other postives, but you must be willing to endure crowded freeways along with lots of pollution, crime and so on. This is true to some degree in my opinion no matter which area you choose.

    However, there are incredible opportunites for cross country riding here, and they are very easily accesible. You often don't even need to drive at all to reach the trailheads. Park city is a mountain biking paradise and it is only about 20-40 minutes away. New trails are being built all the time all over the place and I think you can find plenty of downhill and freeriding opportunities as well.

    The LDS people are generally cordial, but often won't actually be your friend. Just don't hope for anything other than a very shallow, impersonal relationship and you can get along with them fine. The population is becoming more and more diverse however as others have said and there is a huge population of cyclists.

    Its a very cool place to live all in all. Anyone and everyone on this board will certainly be excited to show you the trails and you will not be disappointed in this department.

    Good luck.

  25. #25
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    I live in W.Mich. Michigan is the boat anchor of America. We have the wose economy and the highest number of foreclosures. I just met with somebody who built their house in 1989 for $150,000, not incuded landscaping or finished basement. 3100 sq feet in a VERY nice area. Today professional landscaped and a finished basement. Appraised value today, which assumes the depressed values, was $265,000. He's had the house on the market for two years with not one offer. Finally sold it two weeks ago for $190,000. Owning a home for 17 years and you lose money. Three years ago, he would have sold it above appraised value.

    When the real estate market pops, it pops HARD. I live in a four year old subdivision and homes are selling for the same price they sold for four years ago. Almost like owning a car. Michigan blows.

    Thanks for all advice, I'm thinking I should hear on a job offer next week.

  26. #26
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    Hey Guppie, the only developement in Farmington that I know of-is locked between a freeway and highway 89. I don't know if it is by Garret builders, but if it is-I would not want to live there. With that being said, Farmington is very nice, but it is also very expensive. Centerville, Kaysville, and Bountiful are also quite nice/expensive; you are looking at a minimum price of $250,000.00. It may help if you post a price range. The closer you live to the mountains, the more expensive it is, usually.

  27. #27
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    ...

    Is Michigan is the boat anchor, Houston is a close second. My parents bought their house 20 years ago for $140K. Been on the market for a year, still not sold. Originally listed at $239K, now $175K. 3000 sq feet, nice area, on golf course, wooded lot, huge deck, spa, etc. Terrible market for sellers.

    As for Utah, I moved here ten years ago. It was a big adjustment at first, but now I love it and will never leave. I was in NYC and Chicago last month and enjoyed it, but it was not Utah. I am of the LDS faith. However, many of my friends are not LDS; especially those who ride and ski. Even still, many of my LDS friends who ride and ski are super chill and laid back. There are two types of LDS people here IMO - the ones who grew up here and are here because it is all they have known and the ones who moved here and stay here for the outdoor experience and opportunities. The latter group is far different than the former.

    My $.02.

  28. #28
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    Leave MI

    I was born and raised in West MI, 32 years. Since then, 3 years in Colorado, 2 years in Upstate NY, and 2 years in Park City, commuting to SLC each day. The move back east was a HUGE mistake. The biking, skiing, weather, lower property taxes....I could go on, is way better in either CO or UT. I miss MI because it's home and my family is there, but nothing is better than the activities out here. Plus, the economy is actually growing, so I can make a better living here. I'm not going to argue about the CO vs UT deal, but I myself prefer UT and picked it when I could go anywhere in the country. And, I'm not LDS. It's an issue, but not that big of a deal.

  29. #29
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    Why are you people being so encouraging? Don't you know the Mormons will try to convert you every second, make your life hell on earth, the winters are too cold and the summers are too hot. It sucks! Try Denver instead...

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by PC68
    I was born and raised in West MI, 32 years. Since then, 3 years in Colorado, 2 years in Upstate NY, and 2 years in Park City, commuting to SLC each day. The move back east was a HUGE mistake. The biking, skiing, weather, lower property taxes....I could go on, is way better in either CO or UT. I miss MI because it's home and my family is there, but nothing is better than the activities out here. Plus, the economy is actually growing, so I can make a better living here. I'm not going to argue about the CO vs UT deal, but I myself prefer UT and picked it when I could go anywhere in the country. And, I'm not LDS. It's an issue, but not that big of a deal.
    And a good choice living in PC....much less LDS influence and no inversions!! I would agree with others, while Utah is weird much rather live in Utah than Michigan. You can get what you want out of Utah...if you move there for the mountains you will not be disappointed, if you move there and want all the other stuff that normal city has to offer, you will be disappointed.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit
    Why are you people being so encouraging? Don't you know the Mormons will try to convert you every second, make your life hell on earth, the winters are too cold and the summers are too hot. It sucks! Try Denver instead...
    Are we protecting our state? I know it must be frustrating with so many people moving in. Colorado was my first choice but then this company started soliciting me and then flew me out for an interview. I've been snowboarding in PC and always enjoyed the area. Goofy drinking laws but I'm not much of a drinker anyways. The area I live in now is 'dry' so no alcohol sales at anytime. There are about 5 dry area's around me, two of which just voted to remove that ban. You can't buy alcohol on Sunday's in most area's. But in some areas you can buy a mixed drink but not beer. Other areas you can buy beer but not a mixed drink. The liquor isle in grocery stores is closed off on Sundays. In a 10 mile radius of my house, there are about 5 different ordinances on Sunday drinking. With the sour economy cities are starting to vote this down because alcohol brings sales and sales bring taxes.

    This last visit I had more time to travel north of SLC and really liked the area. That is what led to the post here. I'm not looking to exploit the real estate market, I'm just looking for someplace to 'start over', if that makes sense.

    The housing price I would like to stay around is $180s to 210's. That development in Farmington has this price range, as well as up to $300m. It is a townhouse development, which seems fine to me. I'll still spend some time looking at homes. The company gave me the name of their realtor so I'll try calling him soon too. Just waiting on the offer to make sure it's worth pursuing.

    As for LDS, I'm not too concerned because W.Mich is DOMINATED by Christian's. There are some Christian's who sell their faith and some who just like to share it. Other's just keep it too themselves. I would think the LDS is similar. There is a CRC on EVERY corner here, I would dare say more than LDS chruches.

    When somebody tries to push their faith on me, I turn around and try to sell them Amway. The conversations seem to end quickly. I'm sure that tactic would work in SLC.

  32. #32
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    ok, i recently moved to Utah, i live in Midway/Heber area... I do'nt care what a lot of Utah locals say about the LDS not being a big part of this state.. but it is.. first it dominates the media... no joke.. it is always a big part of the evening news..I mean they always talk about the New LDS church opening in Europe or some other area..or how someone in alaska set fire to an LDS church. . its really annoying.. Othe than that the only couple things that annoy me about living here is the DRIVERS!!!! absolutely the worst i've ever seen... secondly .. . . living where i do, we get a lot of the neighbors trying to come talk to us about the LDS church... its really annoying and i think disrespectful, oh that and people constantly asking if you are LDS or not.. I say who cares if i am or not, and apparently they do. . Thirdly, the disrespect for the land here..Its way worse than all of the other places i've lived. i'm always picking up litter and on occasion i've followed people who have chucked a wad of litter out their window and gave them a piece of my mind.
    I think the thing you have to realize when you move here is that you have to be ready for anything.. basically just think 10 years back from what you're used to and you'll be in the right mind set.

    I've found a lot of really cool people out here.. but unlike where i came from you kind of have to look for cool folks or just get lucky and run into them.

    Needless to say the mountain biking here is good... but hot, dirty and dusty... personally don't care for desert'esq riding as much is in old growth... but its still a ton of fun.

    If i were going to move here again, the only place i'd consider is Park City, its fun and you're right at prime riding real estate... .. i found out the further south you go, the more Old LDS people there are.. and to me SLC just looks depressing. ..

    I think my 1.5 years here was enough for me.. and hopefully next month i'll be moving to the Pacific Northwest.

    There are a few other Utah Quarks .. that are pretty laughable.. but i'll let you figure those out for yourself. I'll give you a couple of hints... they involve certain rules and regulations considering alcohol making and consumption... and the absolute idea of the Utah inferiority conplex over the other states.. you'll see it.. you don't really have to look hard.
    Have you heard "the greatest snow on earth"? thats a sham.

  33. #33
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    T.J., you've got some totally valid points. I know exactly what you're talking about. I've been in Utah for 5 years and yes some of it is culturally f*cked up but what are you going to do - every place is to some extent.

    There is an interesting adjustment phase I've experienced myself, and seen in my friends. Here goes:

    Stage 1, 0-6 months: New place syndrome - you're stoked on the incredible outdoor access, meeting new people, asking questions about LDS b/c you can't ignore it in a place like Utah, just kind of experience everything and enjoying it.

    Stage 2, 7-24 months: The gloss has worn off and you realize how really really odd and not like any other place in the U.S. Utah really is. It is culturally very different, and it does affect your job, your friends, your life. You have some bad experiences with the locals and culture, and it gets frustrating and wierd. People either leave at this stage (at or before 2 years) or stick it out for the long haul.

    Stage 3, 25+ months: Acceptance and really enjoy the place. You've established some good friends, both within and outside the LDS community. You know all about the cultural oddities and roll your eyes when newcomers start asking about things like LDS garments b/c you've had the discussion so many times already. You've found a good job, good friends, and realize what a cool place this is, and thank Joseph Smith for keeping the hordes of people from moving to SLC like they have in Denver.*

    *unfortunately people seem to be getting over their fear of the Mormons for the most part and the valley is getting ridiculously crowded and polluted.

  34. #34
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    I am a Mormon and we are all really weird so you better crowd up Denver instead and move there. Alright you can come here but just don't bring too many of your friends. There are bad apples no matter where you move. There are pros and cons no matter where you live. Yes there are terrible drivers here but there are also lower number of DUIs and a lower crime rate (unless you live in West Valley ) . Missionaries may come knocking on your door; but live somewhere else and you will have Jehovah Witnesses, vacuum/newspaper/cable TV/pest control salespeople knocking on your door. My Dad is not LDS and the missionaries do not bother him anymore after he told them no a couple times.

    But to the original poster, you sound quite tolerant of other people and their views so I think you'd do fine here. Look at the pros and see if they outweigh the cons and decide from there.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Summit
    T.J., you've got some totally valid points. I know exactly what you're talking about. I've been in Utah for 5 years and yes some of it is culturally f*cked up but what are you going to do - every place is to some extent.

    There is an interesting adjustment phase I've experienced myself, and seen in my friends. Here goes:

    Stage 1, 0-6 months: New place syndrome - you're stoked on the incredible outdoor access, meeting new people, asking questions about LDS b/c you can't ignore it in a place like Utah, just kind of experience everything and enjoying it.

    Stage 2, 7-24 months: The gloss has worn off and you realize how really really odd and not like any other place in the U.S. Utah really is. It is culturally very different, and it does affect your job, your friends, your life. You have some bad experiences with the locals and culture, and it gets frustrating and wierd. People either leave at this stage (at or before 2 years) or stick it out for the long haul.

    Stage 3, 25+ months: Acceptance and really enjoy the place. You've established some good friends, both within and outside the LDS community. You know all about the cultural oddities and roll your eyes when newcomers start asking about things like LDS garments b/c you've had the discussion so many times already. You've found a good job, good friends, and realize what a cool place this is, and thank Joseph Smith for keeping the hordes of people from moving to SLC like they have in Denver.*

    *unfortunately people seem to be getting over their fear of the Mormons for the most part and the valley is getting ridiculously crowded and polluted.
    That's actually very accurate from what I've experienced.

    I am in the last few days of stage 2. I posted some harsh but true (from my outsider non-LDS perspective anyway) statements in the Orem thread a while back after a few bad experiences with the locals and culture (that some Mo pansy whined to a moderator about and got them deleted). But I am now moving onto stage 3 happily.

    I still think anything south of Point of the Mountain is a nut house (except Moab and maybe Price). If you are not LDS I highly recommend living in SLC or PC.

    BY
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro....

  36. #36
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    I'm in Guppy's shoes right now. I'm in W. MI and my wife and I are pushing to move to UT. I should receive my offer for a job in Logan. Logan wasn't on our radar but after we flew out to interview it seemed like a good fit, smaller town-feel and more comfortable. I think the Logan valley is more beautiful than the others we've spent time in around SLC, but it's like saying Cindi Crawford is better looking than Heidi Klum, we're all stil winners . My cousin is LDS and lives in Riverton and we've been visiting him for many years so we have a pretty good idea what to expect. I'll make sure and tell my wife we have to stick it out for at least 2 years per Summit's post .

    Guppy, you must be in/near GR from your explaination. I hear you on the depression and housing situation, there are 4 houses for sale on our 3-block street, we're just hoping to break even.

    I can't believe someone laughed at "greatest snow on earth", I think that's fair. At the very least you could say best snow sports given the: snow quality, snow quantity, # of resorts in the area, resort proximity to the airport and low crowds. Sunday in Utah is like a weekday in CO, tough to beat.

  37. #37
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    I grew up in Logan... as a mormon, and when it came time for me to experience other things and places, I landed in Bend, OR. Similar size and climate as Logan, and 10 years ago when I moved here the cost of living was similar too (homes are in the $300K+ range here now). Having grown up in that environment I don't notice all the mormonisms, but my wife sure does.

    I like good beer, I like walking to the neighbors house with a mug filled out of my keg-erator without the paranoia I have in Logan.

    So, I like going back to visit all my buddies and family, but I sure like coming back to Bend.

    That said, I encourage you to try UT out. If you enjoy alcohol and social gatherings with alcohol, be prepared to make some adjustments. Overall, the biking is good, and the snow is awesome.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrCookie
    That said, I encourage you to try UT out. If you enjoy alcohol and social gatherings with alcohol, be prepared to make some adjustments. Overall, the biking is good, and the snow is awesome.
    It might be trickier to drink in Logan, but in SLC or PC, it's actually easier to drink than many other states with bizarre liquor laws. There are a few wierd rules, but this is mostly a myth. And besides, I've come to enjoy Utah beer - you can drink more of it and be none the worse for wear the next morning!

  39. #39
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    I'll throw my opinion in the mix here....I've lived here for over 5 years, from the Northeast. I love Utah but there are certainly things I don't like. I live in Park City so some of things that drive me nuts don't necessarily pertain to the state as a whole but then there are some that do.

    The whole LDS thing...don't much notice in Park City since this is kind of an escape from the LDS culture but honestly, it's a bit too much in this state. Just don't watch the news ( unless it's Fox 13 ) and don't read the paper and you'll keep your sanity when it comes to religion here.

    The drivers are horrible...and I'm from Boston! Seriously, I just don't get it but the people who drive in this state are idiots...big deal, you can live with it.

    Park City used to be cool...until EVERY developer in the state wanted to get their piece of pie. If you read the local paper every other page is for some dipsh!t devolpement with names like Falling Leaf or Sunset Ridge ...it's friggin' annoying as hell! However, there's no place I'd live in Utah other than here because of the location. I live in an area called Pinebrook and out the back door of my apartment I have access to an obscene amount of trails. However, this part of town is starting to get taken over by the developers as well....

    No decent sports teams....I dont' care for the Jazz personally but man, it would be nice to at least have a pro baseball team here!

    Now, all of this is outweighed by one thing...access to many many other places I love! Look at a map of Utah and you'll see all of the National Parks that are only a few hours from SLC or PC. Jackson is close...Tetons and Yellowstone...favorite place to be in the summer.

    I really live here for the summers but seriously, if you like snow....can't beat a nice Utah pow day. Really can't.

    Anyways, lots of rambling but there isn't another place that I would have rather spent my last 5 years....good luck!

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