Is this the RFX 09?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Is this the RFX 09?

    Just got an email from Sram about the new Hammershmidt, this all looks very clever.

    I'm watching the video about installing the Hammershmidt and to me that looks like a Turner frame.

    Now is it the 09RFX with ISCG tabs?


  2. #2
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    hmmm, doesn't look like the same bike from NSMB's coverage, close.
    http://nsmb.com/page/s/2585/truvativ...dt-first-look/

  3. #3
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    That's definately a Turner frame, but as far as what it is, I couldn't tell ya. Nothing has been released, and I'm not one to speculate.

    Now the HammerSchidt has got my attention, I totally dig the concept and like the fact that it gets rid of the biggest pain in the butt on the bike. Now, I'm interested in seeing weights and long term durability reports.

    happy trails...

    squish
    Get out and ride!

  4. #4
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    it can't be the '09 RFX.
    Look at it!
    The BB is waaaaaaaay to high.
    ****

  5. #5
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    The hammertime defo looks interesting.

  6. #6
    FM
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    Looks just like an '08, except for the tabs.

    Nothing to see here, move along

  7. #7
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    can't be the '09 RFX; the new RFX is a fire-breathing dragon highline slayer. That pic looks like a weenie-bike.
    ****

  8. #8
    Roy
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    Looks slightly less aggressive than the Flux. But close, though.

  9. #9
    FM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roy
    Looks slightly less aggressive than the Flux. But close, though.
    yeaaaah um, they're going to beef that thing way up, if people are going to ride it someplace technical like downieville!


  10. #10
    MK_
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    It's a neat looking device. It looks to be heavier than what it replaces. In addition, they provided an upper chain guide, while removing the lower one. That's weird as most people run the lower one only and it seems that you can't add one. It's also too bad for those who run longer or shorter cranks than the 170s or 175s.

    _MK

  11. #11
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    With an RP23, it has to be at least a '12, because in 2011.5 turner will scale back the RFX and release a new lightweight RFX with an airshock and more upright seating position.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  12. #12
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    Looks like a RS shock, I think its the new Sultan ISCG tabs for the WB135 riders or the new Spot for the 36 riders the wheels look pretty light and its an air shock can't be the 09 RFX

    No chian guide either, one thing I hate is under downtube cabe routing, how could the inventers of a clean rear cable route on a mtb mech come up with that, hopefully sorted for production! Great concept though, look forward to you guys testing it
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  13. #13
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    Interesting how the main pivot is dead nuts in line with the drive ring too. Is that the standard main pivot location or does it look a little higher to anyone else?

    B
    When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro....

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bortis Yelltzen
    Interesting how the main pivot is dead nuts in line with the drive ring too. Is that the standard main pivot location or does it look a little higher to anyone else?

    B
    I'm sure it has alot to do with it being a 22T
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  15. #15
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    DT said yesterday the 09 RFX was still being designed. Its just a 08 with ISGS tabs.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bortis Yelltzen
    Interesting how the main pivot is dead nuts in line with the drive ring too. Is that the standard main pivot location or does it look a little higher to anyone else?

    B
    funny you should mention that. I've got a collection of main pivot photos started, I'll post them soon.

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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by airwreck
    funny you should mention that. I've got a collection of main pivot photos started, I'll post them soon.
    have you got graphs I mean we like graphs

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  18. #18
    MK_
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    Quote Originally Posted by jncarpenter
    I'm sure it has alot to do with it being a 22T
    So the BB is one side ISIS and one side X-type (howitzer)? The ISIS is on the bad side, for sure.

    _MK

  19. #19
    Yes, that's fonetic
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    Quote Originally Posted by airwreck
    funny you should mention that. I've got a collection of main pivot photos started, I'll post them soon.
    HEY!!! I recognotice that bike.

  20. #20
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    Greg H ball cracks me up NO PROBLEMO haha cool vid!
    getting more intrigued by thisrthing!

    Interesting riding braking into that corner tut tut, liked the ride over the stump though very cool, man that thing is compact!
    RFX looks good huh

    All the cool vids here quite interesting seeing it all go together

    <embed width="448" height="361" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" src="https://i145.photobucket.com/player.swf?file=https://vid145.photobucket.com/albums/r211/trailadvent/Misc/Mtb%20misc/Hammerschmidt.flv">
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  21. #21
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    aside from the fact that it looks like a '08 with iscg wings to me, im diggin the hammershmidt concept. ive said for many years that the f der is the achilles heel of the modern bike and this could fix that, at least in a dbl ring setup. it does look bulky and that could mean its a brick. will the trade-off be worth it? my guess is a guarded "yes".

    now if the '09 turners are still just paper dreams as we dive into mid aug, id be worried. production seems to take about a month from sapa to the lbs and thats with tooling and materials in place.

    thanx for cluein us in ta!
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  22. #22
    the refurbished one
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    the Q-Factor of the hammershmidt would be nice to know.
    the whole setup looks extremly wide!
    Sokrates is dead, Galilei is dead, Newton is dead, Einstein is dead, Pantani is dead and i am feeling sick too.

  23. #23
    RaD
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    I say that is a Spot not RFX.
    ICGS 05 tabs seems to be necessary to use the Hammerschmidt system

    Some more pictures:




    Source:https://bikemag.com/news/freshproduc...hammerschmidt/
    Last edited by RaD; 08-13-2008 at 08:16 AM.

  24. #24
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    Definitely NOT a Spot. The BB section is clearly the currrent rfx.


  25. #25
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    I'm guessing it's an RFX with the tabs just welded on for the sake of testing the product.
    Those involved have enough clout, resources, skills to do so...no?
    Seems pretty obvious to me but.....my snow guns don't always point up hill.
    Egg

  26. #26
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    I know 40% of you will be proud early adopters.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by cactuscorn
    aside from the fact that it looks like a '08 with iscg wings to me, im diggin the hammershmidt concept. ive said for many years that the f der is the achilles heel of the modern bike and this could fix that, at least in a dbl ring setup. it does look bulky and that could mean its a brick. will the trade-off be worth it? my guess is a guarded "yes".

    now if the '09 turners are still just paper dreams as we dive into mid aug, id be worried. production seems to take about a month from sapa to the lbs and thats with tooling and materials in place.

    thanx for cluein us in ta!
    chur CC

    Do you think its bulky or perception, that was my initial thoughts as well, I agree with all ya other assessments though, though I like the skills needed to use normal derailleurs and the challenges but that's old school!

    After watching all the vids I'm hooked and want more, the thing looks tiny in the guys hands during the install phase, and Hballs vid looks like it works quite slick! Hes a cool guy what a job and a place to live oh to be a Sram tester

    I'mliking it for one definitely not gone knock it till Ive tried it, no need for anything else no new wheels etc, I can see how there's operational benefits but also maintenance and wear benefits then there's gearing options while maintaining chain line, I think I just talked myself into it again, once ya had a single ring ya wonder at times why the hell ya want triples or doubles, people should check out all the vids if they haven't its pretty cool!

    Better than talking about what fork today for a change, just saying, my only downside at this point would be proprietary BB, Truvative cranks only and cable route but if it works as well as it looks like it might I could live with all 3, I'd definitely try it first before knocking it, I see real potential beyond this! and even with my negs its first generation it can only get better lighter more options and improved, well that's mo anyways! quite excited.

    There's too options a weight weenie one and FR one sheesh even got a carbon bash on the WW one for all the light weight RFX, 09 Spot ISCG and Sultan ISCG riders owners

    I'm sold sign me up, bikes ready, just need test pilot role and lots of drugs and I'm off

    Q factor as someone else has said would be interesting! Weight of system!
    Cost is up there seems everything is aiming for the USD 1k mark but I guess ya weigh that up over time if it proves is saves in wear to multiple rings chains even rear clusters and RDs as these can be damaged or increased wear from bad front setups chain length etc, time will tell, I see it on the Homer must have list in the future!


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  28. #28
    Surfin' da mountain
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    My Sceptical Side:
    I'm gonna wait for the reviews. The Rohloff hub seemed like the future of shifting at one point. The guys who ride it like it, but there is something in it - weight, efficiency, I don't know - that didn't prove to be better than the derailer system.

    This could hamper the entry into service of the new BB30 system.

    My Optimist Side:
    I shift the rear several cogs just before a short power climb. The only time I shift the front is before a long grind or long decent. Otherwize middle chain ring (in a triple) does most of the work. If as efficient as the current front derailer, this could potentially change how I ride. This may be the key shift before a short power climb and the rear cogs would be use more for the minor shifts.

    If heavier (hence the introduction as All Mountain or Free Ride - not XC) the weight is actually added to the least affected point on the bike - low and center.

    I'm optimistic this has the best potential, so far, to replace the dreaded derailer. But I'm gonna wait and see. I also hope the inustry will pick a standard front axle and come to a standard in the rear too.

  29. #29
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    I wonder how well it will handle direct hits.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerk_Chicken
    I wonder how well it will handle direct hits.
    Hball slams a stump in the vid, well sorta!



    I nabbed this offa Ridemonkey, qoute trancend [trancend.com]
    Posted by Transcend Spent a full day riding hammerschmidt today in pemberton (as well as Elixir CR brakes). More photos and such later, but basically, it's rad.

    Planetary gear that gets engaged/disengaged by a shift from a special XO/X9 shifter. You get instantaneous engagement, like INSTANT. Its pretty rad for those holy crap you need more gear moments
    It uses a half isis/half howitzer BB. Uses proper (up to proper spec) iscg tabs to anchor it to the frame. Its about 10-160g heavier than a standard setup (freeride or all mountain setups) It will run about $650 by the time it is all said and done (cranks/BB/Shifter + 2 chainrings and 2 guides).
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  31. #31
    trail fairy
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    Linky more info ride reports

    I asked about the RFX but so far hes not said boo other than whats in his report!
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  32. #32
    MK_
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    Linky more info ride reports
    That article gives conflicting info about the weight. It says +10g for AM and +160g for FR, whereas the other said the exact opposite. I wonder which is it?

    _MK

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    That article gives conflicting info about the weight. It says +10g for AM and +160g for FR, whereas the other said the exact opposite. I wonder which is it?

    _MK
    Which articles are you quoting, 10g for Am 160g for FR seems logical, my earlier pot was 10-160gs not specified for which is how I read his post, does it matter, 160g seems bugga all to me but then I'm not a weight weenie, I'm more interested that the Q factor is not affected which sounds like they dialed that, just wished they got the cable route better!
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  34. #34
    MK_
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    Which articles are you quoting, 10g for Am 160g for FR seems logical, my earlier pot was 10-160gs not specified for which is how I read his post, does it matter, 160g seems bugga all to me but then I'm not a weight weenie, I'm more interested that the Q factor is not affected which sounds like they dialed that, just wished they got the cable route better!
    The Bike Mag one (http://bikemag.com/news/freshproduce...t/index2.html). They say +11g for FR, +172g for AM. That's pretty vague, nevertheless, since we lack reference, but we can assume Stylo crank+X.0 trigger + X.9 FD, double ring plus bash, shorter cage on RD (who know if they're calculating a chain guide to make the numbers look better). Either way, that's close to a pound vs. say XTR. That's significant and the lack of ability to run a lower CG sucks (I really like the serenity of reduced chain slap).

    _MK

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    The Bike Mag one (http://bikemag.com/news/freshproduce/8-12-08-previewed-unveiling-truvativs-hammerschmidt/index2.html). They say +11g for FR, +172g for AM. That's pretty vague, nevertheless, since we lack reference, but we can assume Stylo crank+X.0 trigger + X.9 FD, double ring plus bash, shorter cage on RD (who know if they're calculating a chain guide to make the numbers look better). Either way, that's close to a pound vs. say XTR. That's significant and the lack of ability to run a lower CG sucks (I really like the serenity of reduced chain slap).

    _MK
    yeah its early days easy to knock stuff, no doubt there will be lots of mis info, Ive read heaps already, either way everyone to there own as usual, I will wait and see it for myself before I poo it, Ive seen some pics of it with a standard CG like a Stinger one pic of a diamondback, I would also still like to run that, so like usual I'm sure we can franken something too work!

    There's bound to be lots of different info from different reports so as you said it may mean combos, transcend is usually pretty onto it though and 198 also has a good review with some details! OMO but I think as much info and ride reports then as usual make up youre own mind if its something for you or not!

    I'm just keeping an open mind on this one!
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  36. #36
    MK_
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    I'm just keeping an open mind on this one!
    Definitely. I'd love to try one, although the price tag is somewhat prohibitive. Just noticing thing, that's all I can do being so far removed from actually spending time with one.

    _MK

  37. #37
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    Definitely. I'd love to try one, although the price tag is somewhat prohibitive. Just noticing thing, that's all I can do being so far removed from actually spending time with one.

    _MK
    Ah me too, I'm screwed for a while yet so by then, you guys would have tested it proven it any good or not the price woulda come down, my 06 has ISCG so its ready! price is up there but long term it may be savings who knows too early huh.
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  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    the lack of ability to run a lower CG sucks (I really like the serenity of reduced chain slap)._MK
    i feel ya. im sure some creative guy will come up with a bolt on aftermarket option. i can see a cpl diff ways that might work just by watchin the install vid.
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  39. #39
    Rolling
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    Herbold has me sold.

    But only when the price gets down to $221.43

    Reverse the words to get schmidt hammer--concrete testing.

  40. #40
    Time flies...
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    I'd say we're looking at an introduction of the future.... just the beginning.
    It will get refined and improved.

    ...and it's about time!
    ...every day sends future to past...

  41. #41
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    The question I have is, will it come in 83mm BB spacing for the HL? If so, I'll slap down some cash now.
    Team Sanchez; "Always hittin the upper lip"

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Chingon
    The question I have is, will it come in 83mm BB spacing for the HL? If so, I'll slap down some cash now.
    Yep in all bb sizes 68/73/83 for FR and in 165mm/170mm/175mm arm lengths while AM is 170/175 68/73mmBB perfect for u big guy
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  43. #43
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    Thanks TA,

    BTW, how do you say Chur in Spanish? Churro???
    Team Sanchez; "Always hittin the upper lip"

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by El Chingon
    Thanks TA,

    BTW, how do you say Chur in Spanish? Churro???
    lol

    chur
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  45. #45
    TLL
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    glad we cleared that up

    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    I nabbed this offa Ridemonkey, qoute trancend [trancend.com]

    You get instantaneous engagement, like INSTANT.
    Best quote yet!

  46. #46
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    by that he means it comes on instantly. just in case anyone was still confused.
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  47. #47
    TLL
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    Quote Originally Posted by cactuscorn
    by that he means it comes on instantly. just in case anyone was still confused.
    Kind of like T.E. talking about standover, or how rubber is heavier than aluminum.

  48. #48
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    1 makes as much sense as the other most days but ya have to excuse the language barrier with the kiwi. and its hard not to truely like ta.
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  49. #49
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    Hay I thought you were comparing Hball with TE, don't F@#$%^&&**#$%^&$%^N compare me with that dewd ass or I'll get Stewie onto the lot of yers





    worst insult ever Im off to cry in my tea and cookies now
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  50. #50
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    I love the concept, but:-

    ISIS?

    That exposed cable end below the BB?

    Anything ISIS BBs other than the SKF ones die in under a month in the UK.

    That cable will gunge up and seize solid in about 3 rides. I'm also interested to see quite how well sealed the whole system is.

    As above, I love the idea, but might wait until gen. 2 comes out... (or at least until a few guys have ridden them solidly through a couple of winters)

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Edwards
    I love the concept, but:-

    ISIS?

    That exposed cable end below the BB?

    Anything ISIS BBs other than the SKF ones die in under a month in the UK.

    That cable will gunge up and seize solid in about 3 rides. I'm also interested to see quite how well sealed the whole system is.

    As above, I love the idea, but might wait until gen. 2 comes out... (or at least until a few guys have ridden them solidly through a couple of winters)
    Uses half and half, ISIS on the drive side and EX on non drive side weird but I guess its required for Q fact positioning etc hence the propeitry ness not thrilled about that either still if benefits outweigh the negs then its worth a look! man the internet is tough, gotta be hard skinned here imagoine being a product manager, lots of coffee anmd riding around outside the Sram plant I reckon, yup could handle it

    Arcadian has his reveiw up on PINKBIKE now


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  52. #52
    MK_
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    We've got a nice detail on weight:



    _MK

  53. #53
    MK_
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    And another shot of the 09 RFX
    (teeny, though)

    _MK
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  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    Arcadian has his reveiw up on PINKBIKE now
    who?

  55. #55
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acadian
    who?

    Originally Posted by trailadvent
    Acadian has his reveiw up on PINKBIKE now
    Sleepy eyes still and FF3 is having issues on mtbr

    my bad, I'm already on the grammar nazis lists, my humble apologies
    chur..
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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  56. #56
    M070R-M0U7H FR3NCHI3
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    Sleepy eyes still and FF3 is having issues on mtbr

    my bad, I'm already on the grammar nazis lists, my humble apologies
    chur..
    ha ha..no worries mate!

    The Grammar Nazi have been trying to hang my French Azz for years...good thing I have 9 lives

    cheers!

  57. #57
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acadian
    ha ha..no worries mate!

    The Grammar Nazi have been trying to hang my French Azz for years...good thing I have 9 lives

    cheers!
    LOL

    Chur
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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  58. #58
    M070R-M0U7H FR3NCHI3
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    LOL

    Chur
    and just for you, I added Q Factor info

  59. #59
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acadian
    and just for you, I added Q Factor info
    Brilliant, can't wait to test it one day, I think I'm sold, on testing ..
    chur ker chur
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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  60. #60
    Baked Alaskan
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_
    We've got a nice detail on weight:



    _MK

    What if you don't run the 308g shiftguide? Then the weight difference s pretty pronounced. There are plenty running the single roller which weighs considerable less than 300g. Just sayin...
    The red couch has moved from Alaska to Florida...

  61. #61
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by AK Chris
    What if you don't run the 308g shiftguide? Then the weight difference s pretty pronounced. There are plenty running the single roller which weighs considerable less than 300g. Just sayin...
    Well Im no weight weenie and I'm tempted to pull that card lol, but I think ya have to look further at what it will do, its still first gen no doubt there will be improvements in time the RFX wasn't always a 30-31lb XC machine either

    I don't think theyre trying to get all bikes all systems to fit, and all people, it will suit some and not others and same with frames, such is the way of things, for a HL for example weight wouldn;t be an issue for me, I run coil on the RFX so no issue there either for me, who know until we try it we all might hate it me too, but I suspect not, looking at the packages as whole and what it could do for the right type of riding!, Sure Hball is a fit bugga bit he tore up that hill just saying, and weight at the cranks is better than the wheel
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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  62. #62
    the refurbished one
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    ...Sure Hball is a fit bugga bit he tore up that hill just saying...
    i am what!?

    i was just asking because there are more people out there than you can imagine that suffer from the "wide cranks" these days. using a xt cranks compared to stylos (with a much better q factor) makes my knees screaming and you have this "cowboy feeling" sitting on your bike.
    but the measurement on the AM hammerschmidt looks right as it is in the stylo range.
    and by the way, a higher q factor can nit only cause knee problems but also with your whole upper body.

    Quote Originally Posted by AK Chris
    What if you don't run the 308g shiftguide? Then the weight difference s pretty pronounced. There are plenty running the single roller which weighs considerable less than 300g. Just sayin...


    cheers
    Sokrates is dead, Galilei is dead, Newton is dead, Einstein is dead, Pantani is dead and i am feeling sick too.

  63. #63
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by hball
    i am what!?

    i was just asking because there are more people out there than you can imagine that suffer from the "wide cranks" these days. using a xt cranks compared to stylos (with a much better q factor) makes my knees screaming and you have this "cowboy feeling" sitting on your bike.
    but the measurement on the AM hammerschmidt looks right as it is in the stylo range.
    and by the way, a higher q factor can nit only cause knee problems but also with your whole upper body.




    cheers
    urgh FF3 driving me nutz sorry, haha not you hball unless youre Greg Herbold, I was referring to the vid where he rips uphill after a few corners, meaning hes probably fit but still the crank wasn't slowing him down, didn't he use that in a recent super d there was a post with his fosters tool kit on his frame!

    hes refereed to as Hball, Harirball easier than typing Greg Herbold lol confused now I am
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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  64. #64
    the refurbished one
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailadvent
    urgh FF3 driving me nutz sorry, haha not you hball unless youre Greg Herbold, I was referring to the vid where he rips uphill after a few corners, meaning hes probably fit but still the crank wasn't slowing him down, didn't he use that in a recent super d there was a post with his fosters tool kit on his frame!

    hes refereed to as Hball, Harirball easier than typing Greg Herbold lol confused now I am
    hehe...my fault!
    actually my nic has to do with GH. in the 90s he used a sticker on his miyatas with <-- the black eight ball.

    anybody knows how to get ISCG tabs on a 08 RFX? can you just weld them one or do you have to heat treat your frame the welding?
    Sokrates is dead, Galilei is dead, Newton is dead, Einstein is dead, Pantani is dead and i am feeling sick too.

  65. #65
    trail fairy
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    Quote Originally Posted by hball
    hehe...my fault!
    actually my nic has to do with GH. in the 90s he used a sticker on his miyatas with <-- the black eight ball.

    anybody knows how to get ISCG tabs on a 08 RFX? can you just weld them one or do you have to heat treat your frame the welding?
    All good, cool handle and sticker for the bike chur..

    I'd send it back to Turner to do right if poss if they do that sort of stuff maybe not, would it void the frame?
    Just riding a muddy trail. . ..

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