Setting up the Sentinel- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Setting up the Sentinel

    Hi guys. I have an extremely difficult time setting up the Sentinel so I will need your help. I have a Fox 36 Grip 2017 & the stock DPX2 and if I follow the Fox recommended settings for my weight ( 95 kilos / 210 lbs) the bike is way too harsh for me especially in rocky trails.

    Regarding the 36 I have one orange spacer installed and in order to make it supple enough I had to go down to 55 psi (!) and 8 rebound clicks from full closed and still don't get full travel.

    As for the DPX2 to also make it supple enough I have removed all spacers and dropped down to 200 psi (!) and 4 rebound clicks from closed and I almost get full travel in every ride but I only get minimum air in terms for jumps & drops.

    I understand that the Sentinel isn't a supple bike to start with but is there any way to make it less poppy and more supple and ground hugging?

  2. #2
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    I think you have done exactly the same fault I did, when setting up the Sentinel. going down in pressure to get plusher and softer feel. In opposite you actually need to go up. Since your shocks are ending up hitting too fast the compressed end of the stroke. My Sentinel felt like crap until I understood that going up in air pressure, did the trick.

    You need to forget sag and recommendation from both Fox and Transition. I needed to go up in air pressure to get the DPX2 not ramping up, in addition I went down to 0.4 spacer. I am 110-112 kg riding weight. I used 295 psi in my DPX2. Because everyone, including me wants to go down in pressure to get softer suspension, you ramp up, low in the stroke. So forget sag, and just search for the best spring feel. I would believe you should have around 250 psi in rear shock, compared to my setting at 295psi. Use as little LSC as possible, try 1-2 click from fully open, and as fast rebound setting as possible, maybe 6-8 from fully closed.

    Your fork should be around 86 psi compared +/- 2 psi. If your shock is serviced and all good with it, you should try to go at 12 clicks from open on LSC and half way on HSC, and try to adjust to the best air spring feel from that setting. You are all to low on 50 psi, and you have like the rear shock, so much sag, that you ramp up really quick. Try to use 1 token only. The LSC and HSC settings is a kind of sweet spot setting recommended by Transition.

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    Thanks for the feedback. It definitely makes sense so Ι will give it a try and see how it works.

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    Another thing, check all pivot bearings, including the 2 on the trunnion mount on swingarm. It can cause harshness and bad suspension feel. You also will need to have serviced your fork too.

  5. #5
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    The 0.4 spacer made my bike feel so much more plush. I'm 225 +/- with gear, run 255-260 psi in the can. Rebound is fast and LSC is 1 click from open. Try this set up, it does make a huge difference, especially on rocky terrain.

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    Thank you. How many clicks from fully closed or fully open is your rebound? Also what about your fork? Is it equally fast or even faster than the shock?

  7. #7
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    I use an MRP Ramp Control on my fork and it makes a big difference in how my Sentinel rides. I run around 115 psi in my fork and I weigh 250 pounds. I also run around 260 psi on the shock and typically ride trails on the middle knob setting.

    I also use this guide to set my baseline on my suspension and dial it from there:
    https://youtu.be/xhnKTZu2AKs


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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    Thank you. How many clicks from fully closed or fully open is your rebound? Also what about your fork? Is it equally fast or even faster than the shock?
    Rebound is 3 clicks from fully open/fast.

    I have a Lyrik w/ a DSD Runt. I run 65 psi in the low chamber (crazy for my weight huh?) and 160 in the high chamber. Rebound is 5 clicks from fully open/fast.

    I think the front and back match up pretty well. I like how it feels. The DSD runt was a game changer for the fork. The fork is now more supple, has mid stroke support and a smooth bottom out.

  9. #9
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    Excellent guys! Thank you very much!

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    Just came back from a quick ride and I feel quite happy with the new setup.

    As a reminder I am around 220 lbs (ready to ride) and for the new setup I have put 85 psi, 0 spacers and 8 clicks from fully closed rebound in my Grip 1 Fox 36 and 240 psi, 0 spacers and 6 clicks from fully closed rebound in the DPX2. The ride was good and supple and I was staying higher in the travel but I had the feeling that the rebound was just a bit faster that I would like front and back so I dropped down to 6 clicks in the 36 and 4 clicks in the DPX2 and the bike become a bit more stable and ground hugging. Finally I dropped down to 3 clicks in the DPX2 and called it a day.

    I understand that this setup maybe a bit slower than what most people would prefer but I feel more comfortable with a more stable and less poppy bike but I will need a couple more rides in order to decide.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    Just came back from a quick ride and I feel quite happy with the new setup.

    As a reminder I am around 220 lbs (ready to ride) and for the new setup I have put 85 psi, 0 spacers and 8 clicks from fully closed rebound in my Grip 1 Fox 36 and 240 psi, 0 spacers and 6 clicks from fully closed rebound in the DPX2. The ride was good and supple and I was staying higher in the travel but I had the feeling that the rebound was just a bit faster that I would like front and back so I dropped down to 6 clicks in the 36 and 4 clicks in the DPX2 and the bike become a bit more stable and ground hugging. Finally I dropped down to 3 clicks in the DPX2 and called it a day.

    I understand that this setup maybe a bit slower than what most people would prefer but I feel more comfortable with a more stable and less poppy bike but I will need a couple more rides in order to decide.
    At your weight I'd still suggest going even a bit higher on shock pressure. I'm surprised you're using 0 spacers in the DPX2...keep in mind that bottom out on that shock is not actually at the end of the shaft, it's 7.5mm (I think) higher than the end of the shaft. If you aren't feeling any harsh bottom outs you're probably fine, but most guys end up sticking with the stock spacer at the very least.

  12. #12
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    Thanks for the feedback.

    I am aware that the actual stroke is reduced but still I didn't manage to get full travel but to be fair I don't do any big jumps or drops. Once I returned from the ride I have measured the travel used and it was 11 cm in the fork and 4.4 cm of stroke in the shock which roughly translates also to 11 cm of rear travel.

    I was considering increasing the pressure in the DPX2 but then I will have to further increase the pressure in the fork in order to keep the bike balanced and I think that the fork is already good enough.

    Anyway I think that it is an improvement vs. my previous setup but there is still some fine tuning left to be made. Nothing too much, most probably 5-10 psi up and down and 1-2 clicks of rebound.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    I am aware that the actual stroke is reduced but still I didn't manage to get full travel but to be fair I don't do any big jumps or drops. Once I returned from the ride I have measured the travel used and it was 11 cm in the fork and 4.4 cm of stroke in the shock which roughly translates also to 11 cm of rear travel.

    I was considering increasing the pressure in the DPX2 but then I will have to further increase the pressure in the fork in order to keep the bike balanced and I think that the fork is already good enough.

    Anyway I think that it is an improvement vs. my previous setup but there is still some fine tuning left to be made. Nothing too much, most probably 5-10 psi up and down and 1-2 clicks of rebound.
    Seems to be better setup anyway. But it is not dangerous to even put 20 psi more in the shock, just to see how it rides. There should not be any need to have bott out when you ride, since it is the feel of the spring that is the most important. A lot of people use a lot of time on sag, and bottom measurement, that is just waist of time. Focus on spring feel and how the bike feels front and rear. You can not do so much wrong with the rear shock of the sentinel, since you have already 20mm more travel in front and a really slack head angel. You will be even more surprised when the rear gets even plusher when increasing the shock pressure. Force yourself to do it :-)

  14. #14
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    Out of curiosity I have just added 5 psi to the fork (90 total) and 10 psi to the shock (250 total) and it feels balanced bouncing around but unfortunately I will have to wait until next weekend in order to properly test it on the trails.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    Out of curiosity I have just added 5 psi to the fork (90 total) and 10 psi to the shock (250 total) and it feels balanced bouncing around but unfortunately I will have to wait until next weekend in order to properly test it on the trails.
    5 psi is too much in the fork. Your sweet spot should be adjusted around +-2 psi until you find the initial plush feeling. What is LSC on the rear shock? Leave it open is my suggestion (all the way out).

  16. #16
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    It is all the way open. As for the fork I will take the pump with me and experiment.

    To be honest I am a bit spectical about not using full or most of the travel but I will go against my impulse and keep the psi high instead of lowering them and give myself some time to adjust.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    It is all the way open. As for the fork I will take the pump with me and experiment.

    To be honest I am a bit spectical about not using full or most of the travel but I will go against my impulse and keep the psi high instead of lowering them and give myself some time to adjust.
    I think focusing on sag and travel used, is wrong. The sag is only a indicator where to start. After that you should just find the spring rate that gives the good feel. if that is avoiding you to use all travel, so what? Would you compromise the good spring sensation, because you think you need to use the whole travel? No, it might only mean that you will not actually need that amount of travel on that particular trail in that speed. Of course if you get so aggressive set up that you will have hard time hanging on to the bike, you have to progressive set up. So conclusion is to have the correct spring first, then you will probably use the travel in the way it needs to be, for your ride. Next you will have the greatest influence on use of travel by the rebound damping. If you go faster you use less travel too.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    Out of curiosity I have just added 5 psi to the fork (90 total) and 10 psi to the shock (250 total) and it feels balanced bouncing around but unfortunately I will have to wait until next weekend in order to properly test it on the trails.
    I had the chance to try the new setup today and it was quite good overall and even better the faster I was going but it was also a bit hard on the hands so I think that the sweet spot is somewhere in the middle.

  19. #19
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    Just want to say that the Sentinel with coil rear and front is a really capable bike. Had my first ride on my XL carbon with EXT Storia V3 (550 lbs spring) and the Vorsprung Smashpot (75 lbs spring) on the Fox36. My riding weight is 255 (115 kg).

    Only had a parking lot test to dial in, before I went for the steepest and gnarliest sections we have in my area. A bit exited to do this without a dialed set up, because the section is demanding enough with a familiar set up.

    From the trail head I felt after a few seconds that my concerns disappeared and I just got confident. It is not like a impressiv feeling it feels just so normal. The front and rear feels like glued to the ground.
    What was even more impressing was the support and ability to climb with the shock in open mode, even with the soft spring that I used on the rear shock. I have a 600lbs spring too, but the 550 is actually giving me the correct sag recommended by Transition, at 18-20mm.

    So for those who miss the small bump sensitivity especially on the rear end of the Sentinel, I can warmly recommend to try a coil. The EXT Storia V3 is specific tuned for the Sentinel frame and suspension kinematis, and for rider weight and riding style. I cannot say if it is the same success for stock coil shocks.

    I do not regret spending the extra money for a EXT Storia V3, getting a custom shock, it can be rebuilt and tuned for whatever bike frame in the future. It is not as expensive like people believe, since it comes with 2 light weight coil springs too (and the ability to be rebuild for any future bikes).

    The Vorsprung Smashpot is making the Fox 36 Grip 2 even a better fork. I was happy with the air set up, but at my weight I had a really progressive set up, that was demanding to ride for longer sections. I hope that I get less pain in arms and shoulders from now on. My concern about support from the coil set up is not anything to worry about at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    I had the chance to try the new setup today and it was quite good overall and even better the faster I was going but it was also a bit hard on the hands so I think that the sweet spot is somewhere in the middle.

  20. #20
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    Nice! Thank you for the feedback!

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    So coming back to this thread I have to admit that I am still struggling with my setup since the firmer approach seems to work quite well for some trails but not for most of them.

    Today I have tried a softer approach with 30% sag front & 35% back with a bit faster rebound and it was plush enough but it pedalled like crap so honestly I am a bit frustrated overall since I can't find the happy medium and I don't know of it has to do with the unbalanced travel front & back or the DPX2 shock that I really start to hate.

    Of course it may have to do with me being unfit and blaming the bike rather than myself!

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    So coming back to this thread I have to admit that I am still struggling with my setup since the firmer approach seems to work quite well for some trails but not for most of them.

    Today I have tried a softer approach with 30% sag front & 35% back with a bit faster rebound and it was plush enough but it pedalled like crap so honestly I am a bit frustrated overall since I can't find the happy medium and I don't know of it has to do with the unbalanced travel front & back or the DPX2 shock that I really start to hate.

    Of course it may have to do with me being unfit and blaming the bike rather than myself!
    It is a compromise, but if you just try more with rear shock possibly without any volume reducer and without no low speed compression. And add air just so much you need to get it plush and supportive at the same time, this is how far you will come with the DPX2. Anyhow you need to run the rebound has fast as possible.

    To me it was a game changer when I got a specific tuned EXT Storia V3. It is just all that I missed with the DPX2 and possible the greatest rear shock ever owned and ridden. So plush, still supportive and agile. Runs it at a ridicoulus high sag, at 20-21mm. Now the rear wheel is glued to ground, and you will not imagine what it does to keep the super fast bike in even going at higher speed accurate as h...

  23. #23
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    The EXT is in my wishlist but unfortunately there isn't a budget for it, at least for now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    The EXT is in my wishlist but unfortunately there isn't a budget for it, at least for now.
    Yes you will come off with a totally different bike. Not that taking a path on a stock shock, for example MRP, Cane Creek or a Ohlins does not make it any cheaper, at least by maybe 50-80 USD. People forget to take into account that EXT has included 2 light weight coil springs in their price, and that costs a lot to buy separately with the stock shocks. Since EXT is specifically tuned for your riding weight/style and for your bike frame, I think it is no doubt.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    So coming back to this thread I have to admit that I am still struggling with my setup since the firmer approach seems to work quite well for some trails but not for most of them.

    Today I have tried a softer approach with 30% sag front & 35% back with a bit faster rebound and it was plush enough but it pedalled like crap so honestly I am a bit frustrated overall since I can't find the happy medium and I don't know of it has to do with the unbalanced travel front & back or the DPX2 shock that I really start to hate.

    Of course it may have to do with me being unfit and blaming the bike rather than myself!
    If you're running a 36 EVOL up front, I'd highly recommend the Luftkappe upgrade. Makes a massive difference in how plush the fork feels.

    IMO, 30% sag up front is far too much - I'm running 10-15%, but sag isn't a great indicator of how a fork will feel. It probably feels harsh because you're running into the midstroke and end stroke quicker with how much sag you have, and probably also running too much LSC to compensate for the low ride height. Try upping air pressure by 5-10 PSI, but reduce compression damping to nothing. From there, if the fork feels like its diving under braking, add LSC...if it feels like its blowing through its travel on hard hits, add HSC.

    For the rear shock, I still stand by the "more pressure, less rebound" mantra outlined earlier in this thread. I'm running closer to 20-25% sag on my shock, rebound fairly fast, and 4-5 clicks of LSC. Use LSC to help with chassis stability while pedaling, but know that too much LSC will make it feel harsh.

    I ultimately threw in the towel on the stock DPX2 valving and shipped it off to DirtLabs for a rebuild and revalve. They did an awesome job - bumped up my high speed compression a decent amount to help with bigger hits, but also bumped up my air pressure to keep the shock riding high in its travel. They dropped my volume spacer from 0.6 to 0.4, which was fine for winter riding but now that I'm hitting things faster in dry conditions I'm back up at 0.6 (stock).

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    So coming back to this thread I have to admit that I am still struggling with my setup since the firmer approach seems to work quite well for some trails but not for most of them.

    Today I have tried a softer approach with 30% sag front & 35% back... I don't know of it has to do with the unbalanced travel front & back or the DPX2 shock that I really start to hate.
    As Zhendo said below, ďmore pressure, less reboundĒ.

    Try not to think about higher pressure in the rear shock as ďfirmerĒ. That way thinking kept me from trying it for quite a while, lol. Think of it as more pressure = more support.. and more plush. Yes, the idea of more pressure = plusher ride is counterintuitive and I struggled with it until I actually tried it.

    We weigh about the same (Iím usually 225 w/ gear) try this- ( Based on your posts, I donít think youíve gone this high in psi.)

    260 psi (no less than 255)
    .4 spacer (maybe no spacer is the problem?)
    One or two clicks LSC from open.
    3-4 clicks rebound from open.

    Take a shock pump with you when you try it.

    Also, if youíre happy with the fork, just leave it. You donít have to increase fork air pressure just because you increased air pressure in the rear shock as you mentioned in an earlier post.
    Iím fact, with more travel up front, I feel you can run the fork a little softer than the rear, as long as the fork has enough end stroke support.
    The only time I felt the front and rear ďunbalancedĒ was the harsh ramp up with the larger spacer.

    Yeah, it seems thereís something funny about the dpx and this bike. Based on what Iíve read/heard, it seems like the heavier riders have struggled the most with the dpx on the sentinel. I would love to try an ext, push or even x2, but canít swing it right now. But the set up Iím using works for me.
    Most of the time when Iím riding I donít even think about it, so yeah, itís definitely working!
    Last edited by solar_evolution; 3 Weeks Ago at 11:38 PM.

  27. #27
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    Yes the best plushness is actually obtained by rising pressure. I was not willing to think or do that myself. It is counteractive as said here. I was having 40 psi added to my weight. So I had 295 psi as my sweet spot. With 0.4 volume reducer, 2 clicks from open on LSC and 7 clicks from closed on rebound. That worked best for me. I do not remember exactly what sag I had, but it is not important what sag is at all, since you should focus on the ride feel. I think riders overthink to much about sag and travel used. It is more about how it rides.

    In opposite to others, I want my bike have a balance between front and back, and I need to dial my fork so it behaves more with the rear. If front is to soft it will also dive to much if you cannot keep it high in its travel by using more HSC.

  28. #28
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    Great feedback guys. Thank you very much.

    As a personal preference I want my bikes to be a bit softer, forgiving and slower in the back compared to the front so whenever I make changes to the shock I also make changes to the fork.

    Regarding air I have gone up to 250 psi in the DPX2 and it was OK in terms of pedaling etc but it was a bit harsh overall. Then I have opened the rebound and it was a bit better but as a result of this the fork felt softer and slower so I had to add more air to it and that resulted to a bike preforming really harsh.

    Based on the above (and I know that it may not be the best approach) I will set up my fork first and then I will adjust the shock to match it.

  29. #29
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    Yes, I am still in doubt if you have gone high enough in pressure? If you are weighing about 225 lbs you should go to 265 psi. Do not be afraid, it can take the pressure up to 350 psi ;-).
    I know it is really opposite of what you think, but it works with more of the first soft part of the travel of the shock. Think of a syringe, if you put a finger on to stop the air, it will be soft first, and when you come further and further in you will compress air more and more further in.
    To little air in the shock, you will end up sitting in the part where the air is compressed and from there it is harsh. If you add air, until it makes you sit higher up in the stroke, you will work your shock in the area where it is softer, and it acts more plush.

    More air, and less volume reducer can then give you a wider range of softer stroke.

  30. #30
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    I've built my Sentinel back up again after starting the season on my hardtail.

    I came across this thread last week and it definitely has helped in setting up my DPX2.

    I picked my Sentinel up at the end of last summer and I couldn't get the shock to feel good. I also didn't really commit to running a lot more pressure and faster rebound. I've been experimenting over the last week and seemed to have figured it out.

    I'm around 111kg (245lbs) and have my DPX2 up to ~310psi. The rebound is 4 clicks from open. I've reinstalled the .6 spacer to start from the beginning again with the setup.

    It's crazy how much better the bike rides now!
    Although, I've had to adjust my jumping technique a bit because I have to manage how fast the back end of the bike wants to come up. I've also had to speed the rebound up on the fork to balance the bike out.

    The ride is smoother and has no wallow like I had previously. There's also no harsh feeling at the end of the stroke like I had with the other setup.
    The suspension is much more active. However, I now have a lot of pedal bob riding up dirt/access roads when in the Open or the Trail setting. It's not that big of a deal as most of the time for climbs like that I run the shock in the firmest setting.

    The info in this thread that really made the understanding click was the comment about how running higher pressure has you being supported in the middle of the stroke rather than being supported in the bottom progressive part of the stroke. Along with the "counter-intuitive" idea that more pressure equals a plusher ride.

    Thanks!


  31. #31
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    Nice to hear you have "committed", and found the higher pressure better.
    I think it is so much opposite of what to do, so people does not consider it to be possible to get less harsh behavior when adding pressure.



    Quote Originally Posted by RideEverything View Post
    I've built my Sentinel back up again after starting the season on my hardtail.

    I came across this thread last week and it definitely has helped in setting up my DPX2.

    I picked my Sentinel up at the end of last summer and I couldn't get the shock to feel good. I also didn't really commit to running a lot more pressure and faster rebound. I've been experimenting over the last week and seemed to have figured it out.

    I'm around 111kg (245lbs) and have my DPX2 up to ~310psi. The rebound is 4 clicks from open. I've reinstalled the .6 spacer to start from the beginning again with the setup.

    It's crazy how much better the bike rides now!
    Although, I've had to adjust my jumping technique a bit because I have to manage how fast the back end of the bike wants to come up. I've also had to speed the rebound up on the fork to balance the bike out.

    The ride is smoother and has no wallow like I had previously. There's also no harsh feeling at the end of the stroke like I had with the other setup.
    The suspension is much more active. However, I now have a lot of pedal bob riding up dirt/access roads when in the Open or the Trail setting. It's not that big of a deal as most of the time for climbs like that I run the shock in the firmest setting.

    The info in this thread that really made the understanding click was the comment about how running higher pressure has you being supported in the middle of the stroke rather than being supported in the bottom progressive part of the stroke. Along with the "counter-intuitive" idea that more pressure equals a plusher ride.

    Thanks!


  32. #32
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    Be aware of that it is not all shock pumps that is accurate. So my analog shock pump was far off when I got my digital shock pump. It might be up to 5% off. So that is why it is even more important only to focus on ride feel not the given measured pressure on the gauge. Just try 10 psi more each time until you feel the supported in the middle of the stroke instead of in the bottom out part. You will probably be able to run smaller volume reducer, some like 0.2 or no at all, some like 0.4 or 0.6. I am in doubt if you will need to use 0.86, but probably some that rides really hard and take really big hits can use it???

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    With the added psi how do you like the bike when you do through really chunky terrain with a lot of rocks, roots and generally many repeated hits?

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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    With the added psi how do you like the bike when you do through really chunky terrain with a lot of rocks, roots and generally many repeated hits?
    For me it was the exactly the repeatable hits that was the pain in the a..., and it got much better with higher pressure than lower. Since the shock ramps up so much when it hits time after time, with low pressure and to much sag, this was no go for me. It probably works with smoother surface and bike parks, but the compressed air you hit time after time, is giving the shock a hard time to work like it should. So when I just added so much air that the shock did not reach the firm part of the stroke, it acted like it should. I did not bother any more with sag, or pressure for that matter. (The only thing I was using the air gauge was to calibrate and compensate with colder or warmer temperatures that is giving different pressure.)

  35. #35
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    I agree. I have also stopped paying attention to sag & clicks and I adjust my bike based on performance.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    With the added psi how do you like the bike when you do through really chunky terrain with a lot of rocks, roots and generally many repeated hits?
    It rides rides better through chunky terrain with the higher psi. It's supported through the middle of the stroke better and I'm not getting the harsh feeling that I used to have because it was only using the lower progressive part of the stroke.
    The faster rebound also has a big effect because it allows the shock to extend faster and not get packed up towards the bottom of the stroke.

    It is taking a bit to get adjusted to because I have the bike's rebound settings faster front and rear than I've ever run them before. The bike, at times, feels skittish. Especially through loose choppy corners.
    I can probably solve this through technique.

    My Sentinel is still relatively new to me and I've found that I have had to adjust years of ingrained habits of how to ride a bike to be able to ride this bike well.
    I'm tall and the vast majority of bikes I've been on weren't really big enough so I've generated habits to keep myself balanced over the bike that don't translate well to the Sentinel because it's long enough and actually fits well.

  37. #37
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    I wouldn't say to completely ignore the sag settings and suspension clicks as they are a good starting reference point.
    But we can slowly back away from the Set In Stone Sag Measurements alter!

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    Quote Originally Posted by RideEverything View Post
    I wouldn't say to completely ignore the sag settings and suspension clicks as they are a good starting reference point.
    But we can slowly back away from the Set In Stone Sag Measurements alter!
    We are not talking totally here, I believe my static sag point was only off with a few mm. Since it may alter the static sag more then we like to think it is the dynamic sag we are aiming at. In the way the bike was behaving with the correct spring feel, I did not bother checking actual static sag either. It felt good, did not bottom out harshly, not so bad in repeatedly bumps and it was balanced with the fork too.

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by RideEverything View Post


    Glad this worked out for you.
    This is a great image. Where is this?

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    Same with me. I initially set my bike according to the recommended settings and then adjust as I ride. Once I am happy I check again the settings and write then down for future reference.

    What I would like to mention is that the same fork (Fox 36 Grip 1) has a completely different behaviour and requires different settings in my Sentinel that has 63.5 head angle vs. my Crafty that had a 66.5 head angle.

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    I do not want to sound negative about the DPX2, but just to tell about the potential of the Sentinel and a great way to upgrade it.
    All said about getting the DPX2 set up to work the best it could do. Not to disappoint you, just to tell that the Sentinel has way more potential than with the DPX2. That was the reason I was so curious about how it could work with a coil. Would it give descent mid stroke support but my biggest concern with coil was the bottom out control. I knew the initial ride characteristic of a coil should be good, and I thought the Sentinel was probably designed to have something less progressive than my DPX2 set up.

    Then I went the path with coiling the Sentinel. The EXT Storia V3 coil shock was also having bottom out control so I had a thought about that it could get away with not bottoming out like I experienced with other coil shocks in the past. The compromises with the DPX2 is of course that you get a super progressive ride feel, and you probably have, like pointed out by a few, to fast rebound to get it stable, especially through twisty fast sections. You will benefit from the set up, going really fast and agressive, but for my age and body, I could not be in racing mode all the time. So I will say I was a bit skeptical when going in the opposite direction to coil, and I was afraid it should be only opposite and not progressive anymore.
    The end result I can tell is not only better, I think it is how the bike should have been set up in the first place.

    The EXT is giving the bike both super plush initial feel, then it has the mid stroke support, and it handles the end stroke so good with HBO. I know it sounds weird, but the 140mm travel on the Sentinel with the EXT is as good or even better than the long travel bikes i have had. It has to do with the progressive tune, and the super soft coil the shock is set up with. An air shock will never be possible to be set up like a coil, both plush and progressive at the same time, since more air gives more resistance.
    Last edited by Rumblefish2010; 2 Weeks Ago at 03:25 AM.

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    I forgot to say about a coil set up on the Sentinel is depending a lot on a custom tune both for the frame kinematic and for the rider weight/ riding style and hydraulic bottom out control. Bottom out control allows you to run much softer coil spring then with other shocks out there. And that is the key to get as soft initial stroke as possible. That said, the EXT does also have the lowest internal pressure in the market of all shocks, by a big margin, so that contributes even more to the super soft and plush initial feeling of the shock. I have not tried other coil shocks on the Sentinel, but the EXT behaves exactly like I want it to do. So for about 1200USD I think you get the best upgrade for the Sentinel you can just dream about. I will say that with the DPX2 you get only 80% of the potential out of the awesome bike it is, compared to what the EXT shock upgrade does with it.

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    So today I have decided to go on the other side and try a much softer & faster approach both for the fork & shock and I have to admit that the bike was so much better everywhere except for stand up pedaling.

    More specifically I have dropped down to 210 psi (I weight 210) - 10 clicks from closed rebound - 35% sag in attack position in the DPX2 and 65 psi - 14 clicks from closed in the Fox 36 and it was a great compromise between plushness & support.

    I did bottom out in a drop though but it was smooth so I don't really mind and worst case scenario I will add the 0.2 spacer but not yet.

    I understand that it goes against everything that was suggested above but it does make sense to try both sides before deciding.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by solar_evolution View Post
    Glad this worked out for you.
    This is a great image. Where is this?
    Thanks!

    This is in Pemberton BC. It's on the trail Overnight Sensation and that is Mount Currie in the background.
    I used the portrait setting on my Pixel 2 to get the depth effect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post

    I understand that it goes against everything that was suggested above but it does make sense to try both sides before deciding.
    Your setup is much closer to recommendations by Transition (and Fox for that matter).


    I think that the basic formula for suspension setup is best:

    1) set sag with all knobs "open" (Transition says set the Sentinel at 18-20 mm because the anti-squat is optimized for that position, so I go with that).

    2) set rebound to be "critically damped" or just slightly faster. (google it if you don't know what "critically damped" is). This should be done with compression knobs set full open.

    3) add a little bit of compression damping to help with G-outs and bobbing, but not so much that it makes the ride harsh.

    4) if you're bottoming out a lot (after steps 1-3), then add volume reduction tokens. If you're not using full travel, then remove some tokens. (if you add/remove tokens, then start at the beginning again after add/remove)

    This tuning algorithm should result in a pretty plush ride, but uses the spring rate to manage bottom-out (by way of the volume tokens).

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by gpgalanis View Post
    So today I have decided to go on the other side and try a much softer & faster approach both for the fork & shock and I have to admit that the bike was so much better everywhere except for stand up pedaling.

    More specifically I have dropped down to 210 psi (I weight 210) - 10 clicks from closed rebound - 35% sag in attack position in the DPX2 and 65 psi - 14 clicks from closed in the Fox 36 and it was a great compromise between plushness & support.

    I did bottom out in a drop though but it was smooth so I don't really mind and worst case scenario I will add the 0.2 spacer but not yet.

    I understand that it goes against everything that was suggested above but it does make sense to try both sides before deciding.
    The sag should be measured seated, when using up to 20mm or 35% sag at the Sentinel. I do not know the difference between seated and attack position, but I think it is some percentage.

    Yes it goes against other riders experience, but if you are not to heavy rider, it could of course do well. I have a friend who is around 80 kg and runs the shock with stock spacer and I think modest air pressure.

    The advice for more air pressure and less volume reducers is of course for those who is not satisfied with the recommended set up advice.

    As I said before I did not either go far off, maybe a tad under the recommended 18mm sag with higher pressure. The thing is that you should only find the air spring that suits you best.

  47. #47
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    Hi guys,

    Currently I'm weighting north of 80Kg when fully equipped, I have a DPX2 with the 2019 tune, meaning it has the blue spacer.
    My problem is that if I set the shock to be plush over the rough stuff, I'm bottoming out on 2m drops to flat, and if I set the shock to not bottom out on 2m drops to flat, the shock it's way too hard on the rough stuff. Can this shock work properly on this range and I'm setting it wrong, or is this asking too much from the shock?

    Thx.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aglo View Post
    Hi guys,

    Currently I'm weighting north of 80Kg when fully equipped, I have a DPX2 with the 2019 tune, meaning it has the blue spacer.
    My problem is that if I set the shock to be plush over the rough stuff, I'm bottoming out on 2m drops to flat, and if I set the shock to not bottom out on 2m drops to flat, the shock it's way too hard on the rough stuff. Can this shock work properly on this range and I'm setting it wrong, or is this asking too much from the shock?

    Thx.
    I think the compromise between handling 2 meters drops and getting soft over rough stuff, is way to much to ask.
    It will always be a compromise, so you need to choose.
    The closest to handle this will be a EXT Storia V3 or Arma with bottom out control and a pretty progressive tune. Then you will get the combination of both plushness and bottom out control.

  49. #49
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    I'd agree with Rumble that a 6-1/2 foot drop to flat without bottoming out is asking a lot.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rumblefish2010 View Post
    I think the compromise between handling 2 meters drops and getting soft over rough stuff, is way to much to ask.
    It will always be a compromise, so you need to choose.
    The closest to handle this will be a EXT Storia V3 or Arma with bottom out control and a pretty progressive tune. Then you will get the combination of both plushness and bottom out control.
    Quote Originally Posted by uberstein View Post
    I'd agree with Rumble that a 6-1/2 foot drop to flat without bottoming out is asking a lot.
    That's what I feared, not all the trails I ride have 2m drops but most of them have rock gardens and I usually plow straight thru them.
    I have been ogling the Storia V3 and I would love to get one, but I'm not a big fan of it's price .
    The HBC would be perfect to control the bottom out, but don't really want to spent 800Ä on a rear shock.

    Is there any other rear shock with hydraulic bottom out with a nicer price?

    Thx for the reply guys.

  51. #51
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    The most important thing about the EXT Storia V3 as an upgrade feature to the Sentinel, is that it transforms a super bike to complete other level.
    I mean it expands the ride quality of the bike tremendously......

    Yeah lets say it is quite a steep price for an upgrade for an EXT Storia V3, but compared to other coil shocks it is not expensive. Considered it is a light weight high end shock with custom tuning and configurable stroke and length for future bikes, it is actually not expensive at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aglo View Post
    That's what I feared, not all the trails I ride have 2m drops but most of them have rock gardens and I usually plow straight thru them.
    I have been ogling the Storia V3 and I would love to get one, but I'm not a big fan of it's price .
    The HBC would be perfect to control the bottom out, but don't really want to spent 800Ä on a rear shock.

    Is there any other rear shock with hydraulic bottom out with a nicer price?

    Thx for the reply guys.

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    Last ride was really good (I even managed to get some PRs after a long time) so I am quite happy with the overall setup but I think that I need some more progression so I have installed the smallest spacer and slowed down the rebound by a click. Hopefully this won't affect negatively the overall performance but it is an easy fix to add or remove spacers.

  53. #53
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    With 35% sag in the attack position and the 0.2 spacer installed I have just enough progression to avoid bottoming out and still a plush enough performance. It also pedals quite well except for standing up and spinning hard in some short steep climbs.

    Is it 100% perfect? Not really because suspension setup is really a compromise of different dynamics but I think I will leave it as it is for now and focus on riding more.

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