Cane Creek IL coil on '18 Smuggler- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Cane Creek IL coil on '18 Smuggler

    Hey folks,

    I was thinking about trying a coil shock on my smuggler. Does anyone have experience with the Cane Creek inline coil?

    I am not a shuttler and prefer to pedal to the top, so I am a little concerned it will be too bouncy, even with the climb switch. Also, with the relatively small amount of travel, im worried going with a linear shock, will result in a ride that is overly mushy.

    Any feedback would be appreciated!

    cheers
    Some great sets for the trainer:
    https://www.mixcloud.com/djfeelgood/

  2. #2
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    I had one on my '17 and loved it. I have a Topaz right now and am considering swapping to the Coil IL soon.

    On the 2017, I didn't feel like it made climbing worse, if anything it improved technical climbing a lot. I didn't feel like it was mushy either. Both of those things should be handled by damping, not necessarily the spring. I'd just be sure to experiment with the cheaper CC steel springs before investing in a lightweight one, I found their weight calculator to be off by a size.

    I'd love to hear from others that have one for the 2018 models, though.

  3. #3
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    Awesome, thanks for the feedback. I've decided to make this Smuggler my 'aggressive, get myself in trouble' bike.. as such im less concerned with weight if it helps traction and descending.
    Some great sets for the trainer:
    https://www.mixcloud.com/djfeelgood/

  4. #4
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    Can't say if it will work well on the Smuggler but the IL coil is the best damper I've had on a trail bike yet. And it climbs very well.

    It does not wallow into the middle of travel on the steep uphills like an air shock is prone to do.

    "Bouncy" comes from an improperly damped shock, not from being coil or air. The damper adjustments on the IL are great.

    The climb switch, which can be applied incrementally, is excellent. It controls not just LSC, but also slows downs LSR as well.

    And CC is excellent to deal with.

  5. #5
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    So I decided to go ahead and get one of these, I'll let you know how it works out.

    I have a Topaz on there right now, so it'll be an interesting comparison.

  6. #6
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    I'd agree with what MikerJ has said. I've just put the original CC Inline (air) back on my Endo to do a bit of comparison after riding the coil for close to a year. One thing to consider is you may well want/need a coil fork to get the front and rear suspension feeling "balanced". Despite having 20mm more travel I've never been able to get my Pike feeling anywhere near as supple and sensitive as the CoilIL rear. The rear end just feels so much more plush and capable with the coil, at the expense of a little bit of the poppy-playfulness which is why I'm trying the air shock on the rear again.

  7. #7
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    Has anyone considered the new MRP Hazzard? Looks like it fits the bill.

  8. #8
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    I do like MRP a lot, but I'm not really sure it's comparable here given the DBCoil IL is inline and considerably lighter. The Hazzard is also fairly expensive in comparison and the piggyback may not fit on all Smuggler frame sizes.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adodero View Post
    I do like MRP a lot, but I'm not really sure it's comparable here given the DBCoil IL is inline and considerably lighter. The Hazzard is also fairly expensive in comparison and the piggyback may not fit on all Smuggler frame sizes.
    Yeah thatís a good point. The DBCoil IL is definitely a good amount lighter. I was a little bummed when I saw the weight of the Hazzard, but Iím sure itís a great shock. I am a day away from pulling the trigger on the carbon smuggler, so I too am trying to figure out what to do with my rear shock. DPS will be off from day 1.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpolism View Post
    Yeah thatís a good point. The DBCoil IL is definitely a good amount lighter. I was a little bummed when I saw the weight of the Hazzard, but Iím sure itís a great shock. I am a day away from pulling the trigger on the carbon smuggler, so I too am trying to figure out what to do with my rear shock. DPS will be off from day 1.
    I've been running a Topaz for the last few months on it, I recently put the DPS back on to see how it worked out.

    The DPS definitely blows through it's travel really quickly. I feel like the Smuggler is a bike you are just going to bottom out with some frequency, but it feels a lot more controlled and damped with the Topaz than the DPS. I actually dropped a chain a few times running the DPS because I think the undamped deep compressions caused it to fall off. The Topaz is a lot more damped and controlled, but I find I have trouble reaching full travel on it, it seems really progressive as you reach the end of the stroke, even with various airspring spacer configurations. I think I've yet to get past 47mm of stroke on it.

    I'm gonna get the DBCoil IL I have on my bike in the next week or so, I had good luck with it on my 2017 Smuggler and I'm hoping for the same here. I think my only concern is bottoming too much, but I never had that problem with my last coil or the one before that, so I doubt it'll be an issue.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpolism View Post
    Yeah thatís a good point. The DBCoil IL is definitely a good amount lighter. I was a little bummed when I saw the weight of the Hazzard, but Iím sure itís a great shock. I am a day away from pulling the trigger on the carbon smuggler, so I too am trying to figure out what to do with my rear shock. DPS will be off from day 1.
    If you want a more progressive smuggler maybe look at the GT sensor itís designed to work with air and coil with a slightly more progressive leverage ratio. I really wanted a smuggler, but I saw the sensor was almost an exact copy and I could get one at discount. I only have one ride on it but I donít think bottoming out a lot will be an issue. Itís probably heavier than the smuggler by a bit, but damn Iíve never felt such a stiff rear assembly. It is seriously overbuilt.

  12. #12
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    I got the DBCoil IL on today for one ride.

    It feels about as I expected it to, definitely tracks better on chunky stuff and uses the travel more "effectively" than an air shock. I didn't do anything with any huge drops although there was one I drilled pretty hard and it didn't bottom out harshly.

    It feels like the 2018 Smuggler needs a bit more compression damping than the 2017 models did. I don't know much about suspension kinematics but it seems like it feels like it has a bit more leverage off the top and more ramp up at the end. I think with my last one I ran the HSC most of the way open and the LSC about halfway in, but I ran a bit more this round and it felt needed.

    I haven't done a tuning session with it yet, I probably won't have much of one for a little bit, but I've got a few more rides planned over the next 4 days, so I should get an idea of how well it works vs the air shocks I've tried.

  13. #13
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    I've ordered the IL coil. I will report back on how it performs vs the outgoing RS deluxe.
    Some great sets for the trainer:
    https://www.mixcloud.com/djfeelgood/

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by superlightracer View Post
    I've ordered the IL coil. I will report back on how it performs vs the outgoing RS deluxe.
    I'd love to hear your settings, too.

    I'm on a 2.0x550 spring, I think I'm around a half turn out on the HSR (from closed), 1 turn HSC, 8 clicks LSR, and 10 clicks LSC.

  15. #15
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    Yeah for sure, we should exchange notes. I'll be on the same spring- I opted for a heavier spring im 185lbs geared up and ride Squamish/Whistler/North shore.. so CC recommended a little more spring rate.

    I don't think i'll have it for another couple weeks, but Ill definitely post my results here.
    Some great sets for the trainer:
    https://www.mixcloud.com/djfeelgood/

  16. #16
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    So I made some adjustments to the tune that made it feel a lot closer to what I'd expect. I don't have exact figures, but I think I ended up at 1.5 HSC, 1.5 HSR, 9 clicks LSR, and 9 clicks LSC.

    The previous setting was a bit wallowy for a short travel bike and tended to get swallowed up in holes, that made it a bit more responsive.

  17. #17
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    Finally got some serious time on this shock...

    After a way too busy October I finally got a few good rides on this shock.




    I took it on my usual evening loop here in Vancouver. A good mix of everything. A 30 minute climb with some techy bits, some fireroad, and a long descent with a mix of berms, chunky rocks and roots, some drops and pops and some slab rolls. Add in the fact it was wet and you have the perfect testing grounds.




    Right off the get go the shock was over damped. I backed off HSR and LSC a few clicks and it felt much better. I can see why people like this damper. Its good. Real good. It felt well supported, not too wallowy, and nowhere near as mushy as I thought a coil would feel. The 550 spring is a touch over sprung for my 185lb weight, Ill grab a 500 sometime soon.

    The small bump compliance really is a treat. Ive had the fortune of riding all the new monarch/deluxe/fox factory stuff and this still blew the pants off those shocks. There really is something to be said for not having to fight all those seals in an air shock. My only other coil experience was on DH bikes so this was real nice.

    The traction is great. I felt confident crawling up mossy rocks and wet roots with much more margin for error before hitting that 'slip' point and having to dab.

    On the berms it's certainly less poppy, but as someone who isn't very sendy, I really liked this. It felt much more controlled. Although it was harder to flick the rear wheel around- likely due to the extra traction.

    Overall i'm very happy with the shock. I still have to dial in the settings a bit more so it fits like a glove... but it's pretty close after only a little bit of tuning.
    Some great sets for the trainer:
    https://www.mixcloud.com/djfeelgood/

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by NETTA170 View Post
    Hello guys,
    I ask for creating a progressive spring for my Cane Creek 190x51 on the Smuggler to manage the bottom out.

    I asked the help from small springs company which doing it for motorbikes. After accepting the challenge, they came out with this beautiful piece of spring which works like magic!

    I did few of those springs (most of the cost was for the design anyway) and sold the redundancy in eBay:

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/173612379848
    Also this

  19. #19
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    i everybody, what hardware do i need to put the DB I coil on my smuggler '18? thank you

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by superlightracer View Post
    Overall i'm very happy with the shock. I still have to dial in the settings a bit more so it fits like a glove... but it's pretty close after only a little bit of tuning.
    Keep us posted on your settings, I would love to hear what you end up with and where you are now.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by joro80 View Post
    i everybody, what hardware do i need to put the DB I coil on my smuggler '18? thank you
    30mm x 8mm Top / 25mm x 8mm Bottom

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by flowbike View Post
    30mm x 8mm Top / 25mm x 8mm Bottom
    Thank you

  23. #23
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    Just picked up a new to me 2018 alloy smuggler that came with a DB inline coil. So far the shock feels quite good on the stock settings, but I'm interested in getting a bit more of a playful/poppy characteristic out of the rear of the bike. From their tuning info it seems like back off HSR is what they recommend to get this characteristic, but curious if anyone else has played around with optimizing for this characteristic.

    Another consideration is that the bike came with a DD DHF on the rear, so I imagine I can get less of a damped feel in the rear by going to an EXO casing.

  24. #24
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    Did you run the same sag figures recommended by Transition or did you run it a little firmer?

    I'm going back to the base settings to see how it feels, here is where I was before doing that (from open this time):

    HSC 1.75
    HSR ~2.65 (between 1/2 and 3/4)
    LSR - 13
    LSC - 12

    Think I'm at 30% sag, so 15mm.

    I also have a 2.0x500 spring, if you need one. PM me if you are still looking.

  25. #25
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    Been riding the shock a bit more and getting it dialed in how I want.

    With a 450 lb spring I'm around 30% sag, and only notice bottom outs if I overshoot a transition or something, which is about where I'd like it to be.

    For getting a poppier feel I was messing around with HSR and LSR, but then watched Vorsprung tuesday tune episode on HSR/LSR tuning. They said HSR/LSR isn't really going to differentiate ride feel much, as LSR impacts rebound speed at higher speeds quite a lot. Essentially HSR sets a window LSR, so they suggest setting HSR all the way in and then speeding it up if you can't get your rebound fast enough with LSR. I took that approach and ended up about 1 turn out from full HSR and then 3 clicks of LSR (wanted to have some room to move on LSR). Curious if other folks have taken a similar approach and had success, or moved onto any other method.

    A couple other notes:

    1) I do get some oil squelching noises when compressing the shock (climb switch or not) which seem to come and go. Some folks have concern over this as it might indicate air mixing with oil. Not super annoyed by the noises, but wonder if it's cause for concern.

    2) Sometimes after descending for a bit I notice the climb switch has moved pass the perceptible click when you push it all the way to open. It doesn't seem to have moved beyond that, and so I don't think is affecting shock settings much, but is somewhat concerning that it's moving past that click with normal riding. Anyone else have this issue?

  26. #26
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    I have CC IL Coil on an Endorphin. Once I ventured beyond the stock tune I love the shock. document settings, keep tweaking, and you'll love it. Agree with other posts above that damping is top notch.

    Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk

  27. #27
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adodero View Post
    Did you run the same sag figures recommended by Transition or did you run it a little firmer?

    I'm going back to the base settings to see how it feels, here is where I was before doing that (from open this time):

    HSC 1.75
    HSR ~2.65 (between 1/2 and 3/4)
    LSR - 13
    LSC - 12

    Think I'm at 30% sag, so 15mm.

    I also have a 2.0x500 spring, if you need one. PM me if you are still looking.
    @adodero
    @superlightracer
    @skedasticity

    Hi guys... resurrecting this one...

    I just installed a Cane Creek DB Coil IL(210x55) on my 2018 Smuggler with an offset bushing to bump travel to 132mm.

    What are the tunes you guys ended up with? This is my first coil shock and first time dealing with HSC and HSR.

    Cheers!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skedasticity View Post
    Just picked up a new to me 2018 alloy smuggler that came with a DB inline coil. So far the shock feels quite good on the stock settings, but I'm interested in getting a bit more of a playful/poppy characteristic out of the rear of the bike. From their tuning info it seems like back off HSR is what they recommend to get this characteristic, but curious if anyone else has played around with optimizing for this characteristic.

    Another consideration is that the bike came with a DD DHF on the rear, so I imagine I can get less of a damped feel in the rear by going to an EXO casing.
    @adodero
    @superlightracer
    @skedasticity

    Hi guys... resurrecting this one...

    I just installed a Cane Creek DB Coil IL(210x55) on my 2018 Smuggler with an offset bushing to bump travel to 132mm.

    What are the tunes you guys ended up with? This is my first coil shock and first time dealing with HSC and HSR.

    Cheers!

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by superlightracer View Post
    Yeah for sure, we should exchange notes. I'll be on the same spring- I opted for a heavier spring im 185lbs geared up and ride Squamish/Whistler/North shore.. so CC recommended a little more spring rate.

    I don't think i'll have it for another couple weeks, but Ill definitely post my results here.
    @adodero
    @superlightracer
    @skedasticity

    Hi guys... resurrecting this one...

    I just installed a Cane Creek DB Coil IL(210x55) on my 2018 Smuggler with an offset bushing to bump travel to 132mm.

    What are the tunes you guys ended up with? This is my first coil shock and first time dealing with HSC and HSR.

    Cheers!

  31. #31
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    It's been a while since I ran the coil or had the Smuggler, I went back to air which seemed to help the bike move along through chunk a bit better. I think running the coil made the bike want to absorb stuff like that rather than skip over it, but it lacked the travel to really effectively do so and the rear of the bike would get hung up more.

    The bike seems more suited to a shock that allows it to 'skip' over chunk and provide more support, which the coil doesn't.

    That said, I ended up keeping the HSR pretty open after a while, LSR as well. It seemed to keep the bike riding high in the travel and from feeling overly dead. I don't recall my compression settings, but I want to say they were pretty far in.

    My suggestion would be to keep the rebound adjusters more open than you normally would, run less sag, and more compression.

  32. #32
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    That was fast!

    Thanks for the feedback! Iím hoping to see a higher travel Smuggler in the new year.

    Cheers!

  33. #33
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    I've got a few rides in with a CC progressive spring and feel it has improved the ride considerably.It rides higher with out the mid-stroke wallowing I had to us a lot of damping to eliminate and haven't bottomed out yet on a loop I'd usually hit 3-4 times.

    I had been on a 400# Valt spring w/1 turn preload @ 30% sag, now with a 400-488 # spring I'm @ 28% so it must effect the spring rate early in the stroke.

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