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  1. #1
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    Surly Troll

    So the new Troll is looking pretty nice. I guess it's a 26" and appears to have braze-ons and attachment points for racks front and back. Sweet. I'll be curious to see what the geometry is. Sure would be nice if it could sport a Woodchipper h-bar. For so long I've been threatening to sell my CC frame and replace it with an LHT but now...

    I wonder if it'll be frame only or available as a complete.

    If people have more photos or info, post it here.

    --Leaf S.

  2. #2
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    Waiting to see photos . It seems that running a Niner carbon fork or other aftermarket forks on the Troll wouldnt alter the geometry much. A minor plus point I consider .

  3. #3
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    New Surly Pics

    Check the surly blog http://www.surlybikes.com/blog/ to see the latest Surly goodies. Our friends have been busy….

    P

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    Sure would be nice if it could sport a Woodchipper h-bar.
    Is there a Salsa Woodchipper H-bar now? I thought it was just the dirt drop style.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    So the new Troll is looking pretty nice. I guess it's a 26" and appears to have braze-ons and attachment points for racks front and back. Sweet. I'll be curious to see what the geometry is. Sure would be nice if it could sport a Woodchipper h-bar. For so long I've been threatening to sell my CC frame and replace it with an LHT but now...

    I wonder if it'll be frame only or available as a complete.

    If people have more photos or info, post it here.

    --Leaf S.
    Have you seen the blog on the Surly webpage? http://www.surlybikes.com/blog/ Geo is the same as the 1x1 (which is a great thing). Looks like its just a frameset for now, but they are contemplating a complete in the future.

  6. #6
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    If the Troll has the same tire clearance as the current 1x1, Surly just introduced my ideal mountain bike.

  7. #7
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    It's always something with Surly

    Quote Originally Posted by bolandjd
    Have you seen the blog on the Surly webpage? http://www.surlybikes.com/blog/ Geo is the same as the 1x1 (which is a great thing). Looks like its just a frameset for now, but they are contemplating a complete in the future.
    Every year at this time of year I'm contemplating something with Surly. I get caught up in the hype of new stuff. Their products are solid and very affordable. Same with Salsa. I have a couple of bikes but nothing for heavy duty touring. Not that I plan on riding to Tierra Del Fuego or anything in the near future but I'd just like to have a sturdier bike for bike-camping. I'm heading out for a couple of days in Gifford Pinchot NF for a few days and am kind of kicking myself for not being more proactive with replacing my CC with an LHT...

    Salsa has some nice offerings also which further complicate my bike lust.

    --leaf

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by XJaredX
    Is there a Salsa Woodchipper H-bar now? I thought it was just the dirt drop style.
    I'm pretty sure he was just abbreviating 'handlebar', not inferring a new shape to the 'chipper.

    Plum
    This post is in 3B, three beers and it looks good eh!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    Every year at this time of year I'm contemplating something with Surly. I get caught up in the hype of new stuff. Their products are solid and very affordable. Same with Salsa. I have a couple of bikes but nothing for heavy duty touring. Not that I plan on riding to Tierra Del Fuego or anything in the near future but I'd just like to have a sturdier bike for bike-camping. I'm heading out for a couple of days in Gifford Pinchot NF for a few days and am kind of kicking myself for not being more proactive with replacing my CC with an LHT...

    Salsa has some nice offerings also which further complicate my bike lust.

    --leaf
    Don't kick yourself - the Crosscheck is 90% as good a touring bike as the LHT and is more fun to ride than an LHT when not loaded down with gear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thor29
    Don't kick yourself - the Crosscheck is 90% as good a touring bike as the LHT and is more fun to ride than an LHT when not loaded down with gear.
    For a two day trip, the crosscheck would be just as capable a steed as the LHT. If you're gonna be gone for months at a time, then maybe the LHT would be a better choice. That said, I've owned an LHT and it's a really nice ride, but it's best for road touring and as a reasonable commuter. Having ridden it offroad, I would say that it's definitely not the strongest choice for anything not paved.

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    Bingo

    Quote Originally Posted by FTMN
    If the Troll has the same tire clearance as the current 1x1, Surly just introduced my ideal mountain bike.
    I sent Surly an email over the weekend regarding tire clearance. Got a reply today... "should run the same as a 1x1."

    Heck yeah!

  12. #12
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    Looks like fun

    Troll

    The idea behind this sucker is a commuter, tractor, off-roader, tourer, dethmachine.

    Features:

    1x1 geometry with 100mm suspension-corrected fork

    Multi-use dropout – horizontal rear track-end type with der hanger, fender/rack eyelets, AND trailer specific mounts that will work with Surly trailer nuts (10x1mm thread)

    Disc on chainstay for rack and fender friendlieness

    Rohloff compliant

    Frameset MSRP: $495 Complete bike? Maybe.

    ETA: November



    https://surlybikes.com/blog/

  13. #13
    CS2
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    That's such a nice looking bike. Plus it's not black or gray. I especially like the blue CC.




  14. #14
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    this would be one of the better post-apocalypse bikes out there. of course, it would depend on the type of apocalypse.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by aljee
    this would be one of the better post-apocalypse bikes out there. of course, it would depend on the type of apocalypse.
    Ya for zombie apocalypse clearly the Big Dummy with a front mounted flame thrower and a passenger sporting twin chainsaws is the way to go.

    For a nuclear winter apocalypse I'd go with a Pugsley for floatation over the fall out.

    I think the Troll + trailer would be my killer virus hide in the woods till it's over apocalypse bike.
    Safe riding,

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  16. #16
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    ha ha HA

    dummy would be a good choice, don't get me wrong. the 26in wheels are the most important aspect, if you are thinking long term. the horizon will be littered with shite magnas. ripe for the scavenge. the only thing that would take away from the dummy would be the long cables, though that could be easily solved with a diy coupler.
    as for the weapons choice....i think flame would be less effective...chainsaws would be heavy, but potentially effective, though they need fuel. the dummy has a good advantage with different brake choices as well.

    i have considered the nuclear winter aspect as well. though the pugsley would be ideal, i would have to also consider availability of tires, etc.

    i agree on troll + trailer, as long as the trailer could take 26in, or be made to take them. full racks would be good too. i like that it could be very maneuverable if you ditched the trailer, if need be.

    frankly, i think the best bet would be to proactively build a rohloff chupacabra. keep it under wraps. keep a couple spare endos or larrys. but make the bb height somewhere between 26/29in average. there could be a lot of built-in flexibility. like derailleur hanger, etc.

  17. #17
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    All good points...there ain't no easy apocalypse!...
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  18. #18
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    Anyone know what bars are on that mocked up Troll?

    As a sidenote:

    I wish Surly would stop putting brake posts on their frames...a disc-only CC would be awesome. And the 1x1 (and now the Troll) would look a lot cleaner when running 650b and 700c wheels and discs.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockhound
    I wish Surly would stop putting brake posts on their frames...a disc-only CC would be awesome. And the 1x1 (and now the Troll) would look a lot cleaner when running 650b and 700c wheels and discs.
    a crosscheck without a canti option??!!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aljee
    this would be one of the better post-apocalypse bikes out there. of course, it would depend on the type of apocalypse.

    That's why it has the trailer attachment points.

    Buy the trailer too?

    Partially to stow your provisions, but more so to mount your defenses..


    ROFL..maybe I should post that in the Surly Marketing Thread, they could say..

    Our New Surly Trailer is: "100% Anti-Zombie Related" in both functionality as well as durability! Additionally it's guaranteed to Haul 4 Kegs for the party after the end of the world.


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    Quote Originally Posted by rockhound
    Anyone know what bars are on that mocked up Troll?

    ...the 1x1 (and now the Troll) would look a lot cleaner when running 650b and 700c wheels and discs.
    The Troll pic from the Surly blog (shown in this thread) looks to have the Surly Open Bar. The pics from Eurobike? I don't know.

    As for brake posts, they are easy to cut off.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockhound
    Anyone know what bars are on that mocked up Troll?

    As a sidenote:

    I wish Surly would stop putting brake posts on their frames...a disc-only CC would be awesome. And the 1x1 (and now the Troll) would look a lot cleaner when running 650b and 700c wheels and discs.
    You know the posts can be removed? The lack on canti posts really limits what brakes you can run...not everybody wants to use disc brakes. It seems silly to limit the choice of brakes so significantly so you can achieve a cleaner "look".



    I have to try real hard to even notice what's left of the brake posts on my 1x1 fork once you unbolt the posts.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
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  23. #23
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    there are better pics of the troll's dropouts in the "changes to KM" thread... but since this is the thread for trolls I'll ask here.
    the nice big (apparently tapped) holes above the axle, are they not mounts specifically made to accept the new HD trailer?
    pics show it on a bob-style "spools on the QR rod" mount, which doesn't make sense if the frame has tailor-made drilled and tapped holes for a proprietary mount
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by byknuts
    there are better pics of the troll's dropouts in the "changes to KM" thread... but since this is the thread for trolls I'll ask here.
    the nice big (apparently tapped) holes above the axle, are they not mounts specifically made to accept the new HD trailer?
    pics show it on a bob-style "spools on the QR rod" mount, which doesn't make sense if the frame has tailor-made drilled and tapped holes for a proprietary mount
    I noticed that too. I figured Surly just wanted to show that their new trailer can work on (almost) any bike, and not just the Troll that has a special mount built into the dropout.

    That's what I'm guessing...

  25. #25
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    Hey Vikb,
    Did you have to heat the brake bosses to get them loose? The one time I tried wrenching the brake post out of a Surly fork (no heat), I REALLY cranked on it and it still wouldn't crack loose.

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    Like the look of the new Troll......I assume this is an answer to the Fargo. I am contemplating a Fargo at the moment but I may have to look into the Troll a little more first. I would like to see 29" wheels though.

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    Thank you, thank you! This is what I've been looking for. Key features for me: steel, canti/v brake mounts ( to those who say they're useless), IGH friendly, 100mm fork compatible, etc, etc.

  28. #28
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    surly's site now has the troll and the trailer (along with the rest of the new stuff) posted.
    those ARE heavy-duty trailer-specific tapped holes on the dropouts!
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  29. #29
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    will the troll take 29" wheels ?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by glass69
    will the troll take 29" wheels ?
    It doesn't appear meant to, and from the pictures doesn't look like there's clearance, at least for the rear wheel. Why not just a KM or a CC?

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    Quote Originally Posted by FTMN
    Hey Vikb,
    Did you have to heat the brake bosses to get them loose? The one time I tried wrenching the brake post out of a Surly fork (no heat), I REALLY cranked on it and it still wouldn't crack loose.
    Brake bosses should have threadlocker of some sort on them, so yes, you may need a little heat. I'd try a longer lever first, though.

  32. #32
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    Mistake...

    Glass69,

    The Troll might fit 29ers like the 1x1 does, but I don't recommend it. Those frames are designed for 26" wheels and even though bigger wheels will fit, the bikes geo gets convoluted and they just don't ride like they should. This is coming from experience.

    I'd recommend 650b wheels in the Troll/1x1 if you want bigger hoops, but if you want 29" wheels then just get a frame designed for them.

    I have 2 1x1 frames converted to 29ers and I wish I hadn't butchered perfectly good frames to get my 29"/1x1 fix. My KMonk works just fine.

    Just my thoughts before you lay down cash for a bike that's not really what you want

    Pat

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by fixed1313
    Like the look of the new Troll......I assume this is an answer to the Fargo. I am contemplating a Fargo at the moment but I may have to look into the Troll a little more first. I would like to see 29" wheels though.
    I'm a little curious. Why would you compare the Troll to the Fargo? They don't seem to be very similar to me.
    My outdoor blog: www.yetirides.com

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outsider
    I'm a little curious. Why would you compare the Troll to the Fargo? They don't seem to be very similar to me.
    My guess is that it's because they are both true mountain bikes that have rack mounts front and back. The question is, does the Troll handle as well as the Fargo with full packs front and back.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outsider
    I'm a little curious. Why would you compare the Troll to the Fargo? They don't seem to be very similar to me.
    As stated above, the Fargo is a mtb designed for long distance touring, lots of mounts for waterbottles, racks and fenders. If you look at the Troll it kinda looks like that is what Surly is going for also with the rack mounts, the frames even look similar. I have not compared specs at all (not sure Surly even has them up yet). If this is Surly's intent I am surprised that they don't have more mount options, I can rationalize the 26" wheels but 29" wheels would be nice also. I will be in the market for just such a bike in a little while and will have to keep an eye on this one. I have seen the new Fargo in pics and I am not keen on the new color and the Sram/STI shifters package. I am a big fan of the XT/ bar end setup. Just my 2 cents.........looking forward to see how Surly markets this new model.

  36. #36
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    Ok, I guess I just saw the differences: The Fargo is designed for a drop bar and has 29" wheels.
    My outdoor blog: www.yetirides.com

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    The 2011 line, including the Troll, is up on Surly's website... specs, frame highlights, pics, geometry, etc. Check it out.

  38. #38
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    When I saw the pics and read that the Troll is based on a 100mm fork, I figured it was simply an Instigator fork with rack mounts. Just noticed today that it's a completely new fork. In fact Surly now has three 100mm equivalent forks... the Troll, the Instigator, and the 100mm version of the 1x1 fork. All three have different rake measurements and axle-to-crown lengths. Interesting...

    I wonder how different the Troll will ride, compared to the new 1x1, given that they have different rakes and a-c lengths. I thought I read somewhere that they tried to keep the new 1x1's handling similar to the old 1x1, just with a taller front end.

    Plenty of Surly options out there for people looking for a 26er rigid fork.

  39. #39
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    One of my customers wants his to be in a black color and the wife's left orange. I figured why not share this pic with you all in case anyone else would like to see this as a production color. Reminder, Surly is cool with re-powdering your frame any color in the spectrum, just as they say "No pizza ovens for the curing" that way the frame quality and structure aren't jeopardized.


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    Rockhound, go check out Salsa's stuff. They're seriously hating on rim brakes these days. I actually had Canti mounts ADDED to my Fargo! So glad to see that Surly still has a mind for versatility, and as it has been stated the bosses are removable.

    If the Troll were a 29er it'd be in danger of making me loose faith in my Fargo.

    The track end + der hanger should be industry standard. Not sure about everything else though, all useful but it's getting mighty crowded back there. How long until they start messing with Paragon style sliding dropouts?

    The full cable guides are excellent, and routed under the top tube? it's starting to look like one of those lifted Jeeps with the snorkel exhaust deal. In other words- intense.

    What I want to know is what's with the through-blade rack mount at the bottom of the fork? Should we be expecting something new that'll utilize that thing? I hope so.

    I guess they must've been afraid of making it a blatant response to the Fargo. Why else leave it at two bottle bosses? Sure six is ridiculous but if this thing is supposed to be touring ready three or four isn't impractical. I'd like to see somebody put a bottle boss on top of the top tube, right down by the seat tube.

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    I think 2 bosses makes sense; if someone wants 4 or 6, they should just get a camelbak.

    I do wonder about adding a petcock to the through-blade eyelets at the bottom though, so you could use a funnel to fill the fork with fuel from the upper eyelets and then drain it to your stove from the lower...

  42. #42
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    I have three Camelbaks. One has only a small bladder, one a 100 oz. bladder with a small pocket, one a 100 oz. bladder and lotsa room for gear.

    Last august I ran with the second one and two bottles and ran dry in rural WV. That was at the bottom of an eleven mile hill.

    A month ago I ran with the big one and no bottles. I was delivering a bike to a friend 200 miles away so I figured I'd just pack all my gear into the pack and be golden. I quickly decided that riding with the pack on the rear rack was a much better idea and suddenly I had to stop and dismount every time I wanted a drink.

    Camelbaks are useful but they aren't the holy grail. Plus you can always leave the bottle bosses cageless if you don't need them. It's far more difficult to retrofit more if they are needed. The Troll, in my mind, is all about ability and versatility. So why not go for it?

    The idea of using the frame cavity itself is interesting. I store spokes in the seattube but fuel in the fork? It would have to be sealed at the steerer and have no drain holes, and there would have to be NO chance of it somehow igniting in there. Seems like it might be more work than it's worth. Then again there were more than a few old mopeds that used their frames as gas tanks. So maybe it's not that unprecedented. I still think the racks they're likely prototyping right now will likely be more exciting though!

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by HardyWeinberg
    I think 2 bosses makes sense; if someone wants 4 or 6, they should just get a camelbak.
    ...
    I find it much more comfortable to ride without a backpack or camelback and if you use a full sized frame bag, the extra bottle holders on the fork come in real handy.
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  44. #44
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    I don't see the Troll as in the same category as the Fargo - the Fargo looks like something I'd need to ride through Appalachia, the Troll looks like something I'd want to ride to the gas station for charcoal briquettes and then down to the woods for the weekend. There's overlap, but I still see them as pretty different, so I can't really fault two bottle mounts.

  45. #45
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    They're totally different. Flat bar to drop bar, 26 to 29, etc.

    But they're both prominent examples of the burgeoning "everything" bike. They're both designed as touring capable mountain bikes (or perhaps ATB has become a useful term again?).

    They both inspire conversation of post-apocalyptic living-off-the-bike type goodness.

    That's why I compare them, and what I compare them on.

  46. #46
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    [/arguing] mmmmmkay...let's not get all feisty over this.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manzanita
    Rockhound, go check out Salsa's stuff. They're seriously hating on rim brakes these days. I actually had Canti mounts ADDED to my Fargo! So glad to see that Surly still has a mind for versatility, and as it has been stated the bosses are removable.
    I know you can do it just the same with or without canti posts, but I like the versatility of running 26 and 700c wheels (or 650b, if I had some) on a single frame...which is why disc brakes are great.

    A wheel change can instantly change your bike from a mtb, to a gravel road cruiser to an asphalt machine...and it can be done and still have the same diameter wheel and tire, thus keeping the handling relatively the same.

    Think 26x2.35 mtb = 700x32, not 26x2.35 mtb > 26x1 slicks.

    That and your rims no longer serve as wear items.

    Granted you don't have to use the canti posts, I'd just prefer they not be there...that's all. Unless of course you made a rack that utilized them (like the Salsa Casseroll does this year).

  48. #48
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    Some of you know that I've had some seriously torrid affairs with some Surly frames the past few years, and seeing this Troll makes me curious...

    ...but I'm leaning towards a Ti El Mariachi mated to a 2011 Fargo fork. Granted, it's not a direct comparison...

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by mangoman
    Some of you know that I've had some seriously torrid affairs with some Surly frames the past few years, and seeing this Troll makes me curious...

    ...but I'm leaning towards a Ti El Mariachi mated to a 2011 Fargo fork. Granted, it's not a direct comparison...
    nice, i am saving for a complete steel El Mar. hopefully it will happen with the next batch this spring. i am sure you saw the new Ti Fargo, ay?

  50. #50
    Lighten up.
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    I did see that. And in this spoiled American life, I've been 'struggling' with whether to go Fargo or El Mar. Looking for a do-it-all bike, which is why I'm trolling the Troll thread. It's a tough decision since I'd have to sell my Trucker to finance a Ti version of either frame.

  51. #51
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    I'm really liking the troll. Went down to talk with my local dealer today.Can't get my hands on one til mid-December. Time to start saving some cash and scoring some new cheap parts..
    Here is a video I found on one of my many troll searches..
    Troll and Trailer

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockhound
    Anyone know what bars are on that mocked up Troll?

    As a sidenote:

    I wish Surly would stop putting brake posts on their frames...a disc-only CC would be awesome. And the 1x1 (and now the Troll) would look a lot cleaner when running 650b and 700c wheels and discs.
    Hey, on the Surly website it says you can remove the brake posts! You can get that clean look

  53. #53
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    On a MTB like the 1x1, it probably makes sense to go disc only. On something clearly designed with touring in mind, like the Troll, more options seems to make sense, as every one will be built up fairly differently. Not sure I'd want to deal with disc brakes and a trailer, for instance.

    The Cross Check should always keep it's canti posts. The type of riding it is primarily designed for (disregarding niche 'monstercross' use) generally uses canti or v-brakes, not disc. I'm ambivalent about them adding discs to the frame, but I would definitely want the canti posts to stay.

  54. #54
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    I think surly has made a name for themselves by offering very adaptable frames.........going disc only would limit the build options too much in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, I like disc brakes and would like the option on their frames but don't take off the canti mounts completely. I am looking forward to building up a Troll and I can tell you it won't have discs in the first build phase..........times are tight and I will need to use parts I have around till I can upgrade.

  55. #55
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    Troll is a perfect 'clean out the parts garage frame'
    This will be my everyday bike, but I do plan to see how well it compares to my yeti575 at Pisgah.

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi
    That's why it has the trailer attachment points.

    Buy the trailer too?

    Partially to stow your provisions, but more so to mount your defenses..


    ROFL..maybe I should post that in the Surly Marketing Thread, they could say..

    Our New Surly Trailer is: "100% Anti-Zombie Related" in both functionality as well as durability! Additionally it's guaranteed to Haul 4 Kegs for the party after the end of the world.


    Sweet, cuz my Battle Ass broke its leg. i had to unmount the gun to shoot it.......messy....
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  57. #57
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    Don't forget Surly and Salso are QBP brands. Notice they don't copy each others designs. While they may be run independently, I'm sure QPB makes sure they each don't produce the same frame to compete directly.

    Salsa's are disc heavy. Surly's are cantilever heavy.

    The Troll looks great. I've been waiting for a low cost frame like this that has a long 63cm. TT , high head tube and cantilevers for a tall rider. The Fargo fell short in the TT and canti dept.

    Anyone know what the uncut steer tube length is?

  58. #58
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    I just realized this bike doesn't look like it's fits tall guys too well if you like higher bars. Surly's really offers only offers a couple of geometries for all their bikes when I look at them.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garthr
    I just realized this bike doesn't look like it's fits tall guys too well if you like higher bars. Surly's really offers only offers a couple of geometries for all their bikes when I look at them.
    The Troll's front end is definitely lower than a Fargo, but it looks as though the XL Troll will have a slightly taller front end than the current XL 1x1. My current XL 1x1 fits me well enough (I'm 2m tall), for an off-road bike. I don't think I'd want to put a lot of road miles on it though.

    The 260mm uncut steerer definitely helps.

  60. #60
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    I just recently setup my old Mongoose IBOC mtn bike as a hybrd/comfort bike and it is very similar to the new Troll except for my high rise stem and the old RS-2 forks. I just put the Surly open bar on it and reinstalled my old thumb shifters and Dia comp canti brake levers.

  61. #61
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    Thanks for the info FTMN.

    I was thinking of a low cost non suspension frame as dedicated winter off-road bike. It seems the sizing and design mentality hasn't changed much in mass produced bikes from the 80's, when I bought a Stumpjumper in '83. Tall riders still have to live with lurching over the bars. The old Fargo comes soo close, but the TT is 2cm shorter than I use and is designed for drop bars, which I don't use. A long stem doesn't make up for a short frame, I tried that a hundred times. The new Fargo is even shorter with it's new sizing.

    If Surly would just make one size bigger in their frames. .... just one size. I've been saying that for 30 years though about a lot of frames!

    Basically, I need the bars(at the top of the stem) at least 3cm. above my 82cm saddle height. This is easy on shorter frames, but taller frames don't keep that proportion.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garthr
    Basically, I need the bars(at the top of the stem) at least 3cm. above my 82cm saddle height. This is easy on shorter frames, but taller frames don't keep that proportion.
    Have you considered a custom frame?

    Gunnar is relatively inexpensive and makes really nice stuff.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockhound
    Have you considered a custom frame?

    Gunnar is relatively inexpensive and makes really nice stuff.


    I have a custom road frame and another costly on/off road frame, so I was hoping to get one that didn't cost another 1-2 grand. But, when you fit outside the box, there are few stock options, if any. I'd like to be able to put together a whole winter "beater" bike for a grand, but it doesn't look like it's happening. I recently sold my '83 Stumpumper, which was a fine beater bike for winter in theory, but it was so ill fitting I never rode it anymore.

    There's a builder here in Ohio who can build me frames for less than the Gunnar customs, but oh well, what's another $1200 for a frame?! If I had the time, skill and confidence, I'd really like to make my own though.

    Before I rule out the Troll though, I'll give Surly a buzz and confirm the steer tube length.
    Last edited by Garthr; 10-18-2010 at 11:14 AM.

  64. #64
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    No custom frames for me... yet. Tall stems, uncut steerers and riser bars have worked well enough so far.

    And yeah, I'm glad I picked up an XXL Fargo before they redesigned it.

  65. #65
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    Any news on the troll? Has anyone talk with there LBS about ETA?

  66. #66
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    Surly told me around Thanksgiving, late November for the Troll.
    Give 'em a call.

  67. #67
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    question for the surly design rats

    can we expect to see a "travellin' troll"?
    I know I'm probably in the minority, but when I get the chance to travel with a bike, I won't be needing a road bike, I want to bring a real mountain bike with me!

    Rright now there's the ibis tranny, recently there was the now defunct ritchey ti breakaway and then touring bikes like the lht deluxe and traveller's check etc. (and custom of course)
    But considering the troll's versatile design, I think it'd be the perfect candidate to become a breakdown bike.
    Could be a heavy hauler, single speed, geared, near-fat bike, whatever!
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  68. #68
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    Wow! This could be the perfect frameset, I love the 1x1 geometry, and the ride quality is pretty great too.

    I wonder if the troll uses the same tubes as the 1x1, or if it is getting beefed up for load carrying.

  69. #69
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    The estimated arrival date for the Troll framesets is 12/15/10.

  70. #70
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    it seems pretty obvious that Surly is trying to provide a frame with similar characteristics to the Fargo and Inbreb - i like the Troll because unlike the Fargo, its made for 26" wheels and has track-style dropouts, and it has double seatstays, as opposed to the wishbone design on the Inbred.

    im wondering though - does anyone yet know if the Troll is BB7 friendly? Inbreds obviously are not...not sure about Fargos

  71. #71
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    not quite sure where your parameters for comparison are; fargo's designed for drop bar touring, inbred's a regular mountain bike. but I'd say the troll falls between them.
    mostly regular geo, but touring capable, just not drop-bar specific.

    troll's definitely bb7 friendly, fargo comes with bb7's on it.

    take a peek on the disc side drop, HUGE amount of space there

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/jjatssd...n/photostream/
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  72. #72
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    the only parameter i was using was the incredible amount of versatility designed into those 3 invidual frames. mainly, the ability to run gears/discs/rack and fenders simultaneously, with the Inbred being slightly less compliant than the Troll and Fargo, because as you pointed out, its primary purpose is to be a mountain bike.

    i for one cannot wait to get my Troll! thanks for answering my question

  73. #73
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    My brother told me about the Troll and I can't wait to check it out. I'm finding a lot of comparisons to the Salsa Fargo. I have that bike and now I want the Troll too! The Fargo is incredible, but lacks canti brakes and 29ers wheels can't be found in developing countries. They are certainly two different beasts.
    I have waited so long for some U.S. company to come out with a world tourer (steel, 26 inch, and old school canti brakes). Europe is way ahead of us and I applaud Surly for finally filling this much needed market. It's about time!
    The options on the Troll seem amazing. Rholff hub compatible (they thought of almost everything)! My only suggestions would be a down tube bottle mount and a frame color that doesn't draw so much attention (tourist perspective, not mtb). Also extending the chainstays for more heel clearance and ride stability would be nice too.
    Honestly I don't know if I can wait for them to implement these suggestions.

  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by lifebybike
    My only suggestions would be a down tube bottle mount and a frame color that doesn't draw so much attention (tourist perspective, not mtb). Also extending the chainstays for more heel clearance and ride stability would be nice too.
    Honestly I don't know if I can wait for them to implement these suggestions.
    I doubt they'll make any of those changes... except maybe the color.

  75. #75
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    Surly would not make such changes,as this frame is a modified 1X1. These are budget frames, meant for a certain price point.

    As much as you and I can say ..... hey .... why not change this or that? . . . It doesn't work with low cost mass produced frame vendors. That's why there are custom frame builders.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by FTMN
    I doubt they'll make any of those changes... except maybe the color.
    Especially since they're not marketing it as a world tourer at all. They still make the LHT in 26", don't they?

  77. #77
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    Well, one could hope; I mean they do market the Troll as an all-utility bike and why mess with rholff box attachments and rack braze-ons if not for touring. I don't believe extending the chainstays and adding braze-ons for a third water bottle cage would really cost that much more. If anything it would increase the versatility of this bike. Reading Surly's description it most certainly seems that they are partly going after the off-road expedition touring market.
    This is only my opinion, of course, after years spent being jealous of the Europeans and their vast selection of bikes quite similiar to the Troll. Will this change anything? One can only hope.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by lifebybike
    If anything it would increase the versatility of this bike. Reading Surly's description it most certainly seems that they are partly going after the off-road expedition touring market.
    Well, they say "Use it as a mountain bike, as a cruiser, commuter or touring rig. Use it as your go-to utility tractor. . . . Add some racks and gears or strip it down to a singlespeed drivetrain. Take it camping, ride it to the grocery store or session on your favorite single-track."

    Sounds like something to ride into the woods for the weekend. I really think you're reading what you want into the description. I suppose it's too bad it doesn't do everything you want it to, but I think your understanding of what it is is misplaced. I doubt longer stays and a third bottle mount are going to make or break this for the vast majority of its users. I can't see how, between the Troll, the Fargo, and the LHT (both 26 and 29 versions) that there isn't something for most people. For the very few who have very specific needs, going custom or sourcing a niche product (among already-niche products) from Europe seems reasonable.

  79. #79
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    troll's not a touring bike, the geometry and design brief were mountain first, but still touring-capable.
    I hear what you're saying, I just think the LHT with 26 x 2.0's is the bike for you.

    I still think a SnS'd "travellin' troll" would hit a great mark with those of us who'd like a REAL mountain bike for travel purposes, not a tourer with chubbyish tires.
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  80. #80
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    this thread is useless without build pics...Come on people

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by huevos
    this thread is useless without build pics...Come on people
    you'll need frames to do that ... Come on Surly!

  82. #82
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    "be like fonzie"
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  83. #83
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    Fresh from the oven

  84. #84
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    Dhana, if that is SS, why not go with a 1x1?

  85. #85
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    That thing looks AWESOME dhana!!! I love the orange. Congrats!

    I'm jealous...

  86. #86
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    Thanks

  87. #87
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    awesome dhana! congrats!

    when did those came out!?

    @riiz...there are some ways to express jealousy and yours!

  88. #88
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    When Did they become available? I will order very soon.

  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsillo
    awesome dhana! congrats!

    when did those came out!?

    @riiz...there are some ways to express jealousy and yours!
    I'm not being negative, I want one too, but isnt the troll meant for peeps that want gears, hehe?

  90. #90
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    I thought the troll was for peeps that want versatility.

  91. #91
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    visited my lbs today, the troll is available and i have one on the way
    Alea Jacta Est

  92. #92
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    ditto - and i cant wait

  93. #93
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    for those who aren't subscribed to the surly blog yet
    one trolly good post from yesterday

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsillo
    for those who aren't subscribed to the surly blog yet
    one trolly good post from yesterday
    Those pics of the decked out Troll on Surly's blog are REALLY cool...

  95. #95
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    I rode an orange Troll today. Looked and rode great!

  96. #96
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    So the Troll is EXACTLY like the 1x1 minus the rear end? If so, I'm going with the Troll instead. Wish they had it in black.

  97. #97
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    my troll is in, now to build it
    Alea Jacta Est

  98. #98
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    Hey guys new to the site. Considering building up a Troll, and need some advice on sizing. I am 5,7" with a 32" inseam, and ride a 54cm road bike. Stuck trying to decide between the 16 and the 18. Any advice?

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomhink
    Hey guys new to the site. Considering building up a Troll, and need some advice on sizing. I am 5,7" with a 32" inseam, and ride a 54cm road bike. Stuck trying to decide between the 16 and the 18. Any advice?
    I'm 5'10" same inseam, bought a 18", for me its ok but I reckon a 16" would fit too.

  100. #100
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    some pics

    only iphone pics, but here it is on its first test, rides nice but I don't have much to compare it too, I last bought a mountain bike in 1990!:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Surly Troll-img_0992.jpg  

    Surly Troll-img_0991.jpg  

    Surly Troll-img_0995.jpg  

    Last edited by stroller; 02-09-2011 at 02:41 PM.

  101. #101
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    congrats stroller!

    I'm 5'9" same inseam and would love to try a 16 just in case. (I have a 18" Pugsley)

  102. #102
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    I built this to withstand the forthcoming Apocalypse 2012.


  103. #103
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    Nice, looks like my Rawland. What tires are those?
    For info on Mexico`s Copper Canyon check http://coppercanyongate.blogspot.com

    Carpe Diem

  104. #104
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    Saddle Up, very nice build. I take it those are Woodchipper bars? Have you ridden the bike with panniers yet? Any heel strike in the rear? I hope you'll post pictures of the bike in the wild at some point.

  105. #105
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    Wow, Saddle Up, wow. That thing is absolutely awesome.

  106. #106
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    oh man that troll is a beauty! you did a great job S!

  107. #107
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    I'm in love. Great build!

  108. #108
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    Impressive. Can't wait till my Stumpjumper frame breaks so I can get one of these.

  109. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up
    I built this to withstand the forthcoming Apocalypse 2012.
    Very nice! What rack is that on the back? I've never seen one like that. Looks very versatile.

  110. #110
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    The racks are by Old Man Mountain. I've noticed a few Surly posters using them--Devo and Vik. The racks, I guess, play well with disc brakes and mountain bike frames.

    http://www.oldmanmountain.com/

    I'll be curious to see how easily the Surly Nice Racks mount on the Troll. I wonder if there'll be a need for customizing the mounting process due to the disc brakes. I imagine that if you're using canti or v-brakes mounting the rack should be straight forward.

  111. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    I'll be curious to see how easily the Surly Nice Racks mount on the Troll. I wonder if there'll be a need for customizing the mounting process due to the disc brakes. I imagine that if you're using canti or v-brakes mounting the rack should be straight forward.
    Troll with Surly's Nice Racks... from http://surlybikes.com/blog/




  112. #112
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    Troll+racks

    [QUOTE=cactus]Troll with Surly's Nice Racks... from http://surlybikes.com/blog/

    Yeah, I saw that but it doesn't mean that there wasn't some customization involved in fitting the front rack. The rear rack seems to go on without any problems. The whole package is pretty impressive and very tempting.

    Seems like a lot of folks are interested in this bike and we'll be seeing a lot of interesting set-ups.

  113. #113
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    Saddle Up....let me jokingly say that I hate you. I just finished my Cross Check build and you throw something like this out there.

    Wow....that is a very nice looking ride

  114. #114
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    Thanks for the kind words everyone. The Tires are Kenda Short Tracker, I'm not sure they are what I'll end up using. Thinking about a set of Marathon Extremes.

    Yep, Woodchipper bars, I can't seem to be able to build a bike without some kind of drop bar. 15 litre panniers fit perfect, 4 of them will give me more than enough capacity.

    Yes Old man Mountain racks front and rear. I'm using them in conjuction with Tuggnuts on the rear, makes flat repairs simpler when the hub gets put back into the same location it came from. I only release the QR, I don't de-tension the tugs. I can generally put the wheel back in without needing brake caliper adjustments.

  115. #115
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    Saddle Up's drop-bar Troll is gorgeous and looks like a ton of fun. Is that a size 18 frame set up for someone around 5'11"? Gotta love that color too, it looks like a tractor. With some 24" fatties on Large Marge rims it would be a cool beach bike.

  116. #116
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    Chainring clearance question:

    It says on Surly.com that chainring clearance would be 24/36/48. Can anybody confirm this?
    I was plannig SLX 26/36/48 Crankset.
    Last edited by Hologram; 02-08-2011 at 03:05 AM.

  117. #117
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    It's a 16", I'm 5'7-8"ish. Believe what Surly tells you, lots of room for 24/36/48

  118. #118
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    some new pictures of mine... having a great time with it






    hows the ride on the regular troll forks? I was going to try them out with some brown fat franks.

  119. #119
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    What size are those tires? they look great.

    great build

  120. #120
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    That's a beautiful build

    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up
    I built this to withstand the forthcoming Apocalypse 2012.

    Just looking at it brightened my day for the nice build and the dry ground. I was looking at the Surly Blog and was depressed about not being as hardy as those Surly Minnesotans. This winter has kicked my @ss though. I want to see some snow-free ground like in your pic and stroller's pic.

  121. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by tl1
    Just looking at it brightened my day for the nice build and the dry ground. I was looking at the Surly Blog and was depressed about not being as hardy as those Surly Minnesotans. This winter has kicked my @ss though. I want to see some snow-free ground like in your pic and stroller's pic.
    I hear ya tl1.

    I love MN (and winter), but after seeing Stroller's pics I want spring to be here.

  122. #122
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    The day after I snapped that shot we were hit with a hugh snow storm. Here it is with a squishy fork.


  123. #123
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    not mine...fun Alfining Troll
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/19809112" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/19809112">2011 Surly Troll Build Timelapse</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/samh">samh</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>

  124. #124
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    Wow, that was sweet.

    Quote Originally Posted by martinsillo
    not mine...fun Alfining Troll
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/19809112" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/19809112">2011 Surly Troll Build Timelapse</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/samh">samh</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
    Nice time-lapse piece, never saw a bike build in progression like that and with such great Canyonero music.

  125. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsillo
    not mine...fun Alfining Troll
    <iframe src="http://player.vimeo.com/video/19809112" width="400" height="225" frameborder="0"></iframe><p><a href="http://vimeo.com/19809112">2011 Surly Troll Build Timelapse</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/samh">samh</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
    Thanks for posting my vid. This is a mountain biking forum but I built up my troll primarily for commuting. Alfine 8 spd internal hub in the rear and an Alfine dynamo up front (powering a Supernova E3 Pro). Glad folks are enjoying the video (and music choice).

  126. #126
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    welcome Sam! don't forget to post some pics!
    and you can post some here too
    http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=399153

  127. #127
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    Anybody heard anything about a complete? When? Specs? The 2011 Surly catalog says they are going to offer one... I'm just curious.

  128. #128
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    Did the catalogue say anything about a different color?

  129. #129
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    Good news if true.

    Quote Originally Posted by RekibTaf
    Anybody heard anything about a complete? When? Specs? The 2011 Surly catalog says they are going to offer one... I'm just curious.
    This is good news if true. I'm curious to see how it'll be spec'd and priced. I think it's smart on Surly's part to offer completes as well as frames.

    I like the orange.

  130. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    This is good news if true. I'm curious to see how it'll be spec'd and priced. I think it's smart on Surly's part to offer completes as well as frames.

    I like the orange.
    I'm starting to find that people with the money to spend, often times don't want to spend the time to build a bike, or even pick the parts.
    www.AsanaCycles.com
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  131. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by SelfPropelledDevo
    I'm starting to find that people with the money to spend, often times don't want to spend the time to build a bike, or even pick the parts.
    That was the case with the Pugsley, it is an Intimidating bike to build up without expansive bike knowledge. The complete Pugs make it easy.

    Im sure this applies to the rest of the Surly line, perhaps to a slightly lesser extent.

  132. #132
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    I seem to like this bike more so than the Fargo
    www.AsanaCycles.com
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  133. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    Every year at this time of year I'm contemplating something with Surly. I get caught up in the hype of new stuff. Their products are solid and very affordable. Same with Salsa. I have a couple of bikes but nothing for heavy duty touring. Not that I plan on riding to Tierra Del Fuego or anything in the near future but I'd just like to have a sturdier bike for bike-camping. I'm heading out for a couple of days in Gifford Pinchot NF for a few days and am kind of kicking myself for not being more proactive with replacing my CC with an LHT...

    Salsa has some nice offerings also which further complicate my bike lust.

    --leaf
    i totally think that Surly and Salsa are into a great market.
    that being... Adventure Cycling
    yes... I totally believe that Adventure Cycling and QBP make a perfect match
    further more... I believe that people are actually very much interested, and very apt to go out there and bike/camp/tour

    not only in the Adventure Cycling scope of our current bicycle world
    but I'm also seeing that people are having a hard time dealing with $60 road tyres that last less than 3k, chains every 1.5k, etc...
    www.AsanaCycles.com
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  134. #134
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    Especially since...

    Quote Originally Posted by Hand/of/Midas
    That was the case with the Pugsley, it is an Intimidating bike to build up without expansive bike knowledge. The complete Pugs make it easy.

    Im sure this applies to the rest of the Surly line, perhaps to a slightly lesser extent.
    ...the Surly completes are solid builds for good prices as are their company-mates Salsa's complete bikes. You can buy one, as I did with my 2007 El Mariachi, and ride a nice bike and upgrade stuff as finances, desires and needs dictate.

  135. #135
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    Agreed

    Quote Originally Posted by SelfPropelledDevo
    I seem to like this bike more so than the Fargo
    I think if I were looking for a production mtn/touring bike I'd go with the Troll over the Fargo.

    If Surly ends up selling a Troll complete it might overtake the LHT complete in sales. Here in Portland, OR there are so many LHTs on the road. It's great. I think the Troll would be a big hit with commuters looking for a flat barred bike.

    For myself the LHT still makes the most sense.

  136. #136
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    Adventure

    Quote Originally Posted by SelfPropelledDevo
    i totally think that Surly and Salsa are into a great market.
    that being... Adventure Cycling
    yes... I totally believe that Adventure Cycling and QBP make a perfect match
    further more... I believe that people are actually very much interested, and very apt to go out there and bike/camp/tour

    not only in the Adventure Cycling scope of our current bicycle world
    but I'm also seeing that people are having a hard time dealing with $60 road tyres that last less than 3k, chains every 1.5k, etc...
    Yesterday I watched this film 180 South: Conquerors of the Useless. I really enjoyed the film. The story seemed to be a bit too broad but the footage of Patagonia was incredible. Check it out:
    http://www.180south.com/journey.html

    Anyway, at one point Yvon Chouinard says "The word adventure has just gotten overused. For me adventures is when everything goes wrong. That's when the adventure begins." I think that's pretty true.

    I'm glad Salsa and Surly are doing what they're doing with promoting bike camping/touring. I think it's great the way they're getting people to maybe rethink or explore how and where and bicycle can take them.

  137. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by SelfPropelledDevo
    I seem to like this bike more so than the Fargo
    Just built up a small-fargo of sorts for a customer, 14" frame.

    Loving it.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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  139. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    Yesterday I watched this film 180 South: Conquerors of the Useless. I really enjoyed the film. The story seemed to be a bit too broad but the footage of Patagonia was incredible. Check it out:
    http://www.180south.com/journey.html

    Anyway, at one point Yvon Chouinard says "The word adventure has just gotten overused. For me adventures is when everything goes wrong. That's when the adventure begins." I think that's pretty true.

    I'm glad Salsa and Surly are doing what they're doing with promoting bike camping/touring. I think it's great the way they're getting people to maybe rethink or explore how and where and bicycle can take them.
    its the ultimate in "green"
    as far as buzz words go.

    I mean to say...
    its one thing to ride your bike into and out of the wilderness, camping, etc...
    its another to drive there and back

    I could only ask, and hope to have QBP and ACA make a combined effort to come to Sea Otter and pitch the niche
    www.AsanaCycles.com
    "Bicycle Lifestyle, realized." D.G.

  140. #140
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    Been car free for 10 years, the only way for me to get my bicycle into and out of the wilderness, camping, etc is to ride it. Just need winter to go away.

  141. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up
    Been car free for 10 years, the only way for me to get my bicycle into and out of the wilderness, camping, etc is to ride it. Just need winter to go away.
    Yup. It can be done. I've never owned a car and am in my 40s. That may change at some point. I kind of hope not.

  142. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up
    nice shot
    that skewer end can be dremeled off, to make it flush
    that last thing you want is for that pokey end to end in your leg
    or to pokey thru your pannier...
    dremel tool... can be your friend.
    www.AsanaCycles.com
    "Bicycle Lifestyle, realized." D.G.

  143. #143
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    I have a LHT that I love, but I ordered a Troll yesterday just to build it up with spare parts and make a hardtail mountain bike. I'm looking forward to it.

  144. #144
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    Woohoo!! I just ordered my Troll in a 16". Not a lot of them in stock that I saw ( <25 16"). I'm going to build it up as a rigid do-all to replace a Dialled Bikes Prince Albert that just fit all my needs or me.

  145. #145
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    Anyone try 650B wheels or 700c with road tires? just thinking I could use 650 or 700 for road use and 26" for off road.

    But I haven't seen one in the flesh to measure. I would take a large or extra large.

    Thank you. Tom

  146. #146
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    if the geo is the same as the 1x1 (which I think Surly said so) it wouldn't be any problem to fit 650b or 700c wheels on it....I've seen 1x1 in those configurations...problem, if there is actually one with the Troll, could be the rear...with the new 100m corrected fork there is even more clearance on front.

  147. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsillo
    if the geo is the same as the 1x1 (which I think Surly said so) it wouldn't be any problem to fit 650b or 700c wheels on it....I've seen 1x1 in those configurations...problem, if there is actually one with the Troll, could be the rear...with the new 100m corrected fork there is even more clearance on front.
    I have 700x28 Gatorskin on the rear with a fender, and still room to spare.


  148. #148
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    Looks great,
    Lets see a complete picture.
    I think I am sold on the Troll. 700C for the road and 26 with 2.7 wide for the hills. Wood Chipper Bars, I can't wait. I just need a few more parts and of course the frame. This will be my first from the ground up build.

  149. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by tommignon
    Looks great,
    Lets see a complete picture.
    I think I am sold on the Troll. 700C for the road and 26 with 2.7 wide for the hills. Wood Chipper Bars, I can't wait. I just need a few more parts and of course the frame. This will be my first from the ground up build.
    I would add that I'm currently also using 26x2.35 Big Apples that are even larger in diameter than the 700x28 Gatorskins, and there is still plenty of clearance in the rear even with fenders, and that's with the wheel all the way forward. Even more space is available if you move the wheel backwards in the rear dropouts.

    My Surly Troll build is documented here with lots of pics: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...Commuter-Build

  150. #150
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    New Troll

    My new baby Troll that popped out of the oven today

    This is version 1.0. Iterations to be determined as with any Surly ride it seems

    Oh, this is my first Surly as well. Woohoo!!!







    And if you wanted a slightly different view of the second picture:

  151. #151
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    Oh, forgot the build....

    16" frame
    RaceFace Deus XC 70mm/6deg stem
    Thompson seatpost
    Groovy Luv bars
    Shimano XT shifters
    Shimano LX rear derailleur
    Shimano XT front derailleur
    Shimano SLX double cranks (maybe adding third chainring)
    DMR hub front, Mavic 317 disc rim
    Shimano XT hub rear, Mavic 317 disc rim
    Brooks B17 saddle
    FSA Pig headset
    ODI Lock-on grips
    Pedals are MKS something / Shimano 520's
    Hayes Nine brakes, 160
    Old Kenda Kinetics 2.35 front (almost same physical size as SB8 2.1)
    Kenda Small Block Eight 2.1 rear

    Most of the parts came from a Dialled Bikes Prince Albert frame (AM type) that I just couldn't find the love for. So, it will be placed on the chopping bock now

  152. #152
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    nice... good to see the b17 complementing the overall look of the bike.

    i'm also currently on a prince albert and looking to change to the troll...

  153. #153
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    Surly wasn't joking when they said "fatties fit fine". Got a 3" wide tire up front (Duro Wildlife leapord from my cousins "Muni") and a 2.7" Bontrager Big Earl in the back. No clearance issues at all with either tire, rides great and climbs like a mountain goat.

    Alea Jacta Est

  154. #154
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    hello,

    I'm almost finished with building the (European) Troll. Up to now ver. 0.99 beta:


    ver. 1.00 pre-release:


    And more details and close-ups are in my Picasa.

    Basically I used clean_up_my_garage paradigm, only the frameset, wheels and fenders are new. The rest was just properly washed

    There would be more play about the front derrie -- it's bulky old Top Swing and it's blocking the fenders a lot; I'm going to try Ultegra triple + CX pulley; the only problem is to find them somewhere in the garage

    Bad thing: XT shadow rear derrie and horizontal dropouts make taking out the back wheel pretty tricky, going to try my old classical LX to compare.

  155. #155
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    arent those lowriders tubus taras mounted with the bottom loop facing the other way? anyway what size tires are those and whats the tire clearance on the taras?

  156. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by cactus
    arent those lowriders tubus taras mounted with the bottom loop facing the other way? anyway what size tires are those and whats the tire clearance on the taras?
    The top loop should face this way. This determines the position of the bottom loop) Anyway -- my Ortlieb bags fit it perfectly.

    Tires are Michelin Wild'Race 26x2.35", tara is the special version "tara big apple" (look here: http://www.tubus.com/en/lowrider/tara) There is definitely a very good clearance with these tires. I would say one may even try 2.4"-2.45" tires, but the actual clearance will depend on rims and how the manufacturer measures tire widths.

  157. #157
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    Just received my new 20" Troll frame today.

    The half-lug cradling the down tube at the connection with the head tube doesn't seem to sit flush. There is a noticeable gap visible at the top end of the oval-shaped cutout of the lug.

    Anyone else notice this? Know anything about it?

    (The photo I've posted was taken looking up, at the underside of the head tube-down tube connection)


  158. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by namelessontrail
    Just received my new 20" Troll frame today.

    The half-lug cradling the down tube at the connection with the head tube doesn't seem to sit flush. There is a noticeable gap visible at the top end of the oval-shaped cutout of the lug.

    Anyone else notice this? Know anything about it?

    (The photo I've posted was taken looking up, at the underside of the head tube-down tube connection)


    same on mine, not sure why its like that.

  159. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turtle01
    My new baby Troll that popped out of the oven today

    This is version 1.0. Iterations to be determined as with any Surly ride it seems

    Oh, this is my first Surly as well. Woohoo!!!



    very nice

  160. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by namelessontrail
    Just received my new 20" Troll frame today.

    The half-lug cradling the down tube at the connection with the head tube doesn't seem to sit flush. There is a noticeable gap visible at the top end of the oval-shaped cutout of the lug.

    Anyone else notice this? Know anything about it?

    (The photo I've posted was taken looking up, at the underside of the head tube-down tube connection)
    That's completely normal on headtube gussets, which are added as a structural reinforcement, but don't actually hold the tube in place (as a true lug does). The reinforcement is virtually identical on Niner's steel MTBs and many steel DJ frames and others.

    I certainly can't point towards any specific examples, but I remember hearing about at least one company having real problems with gussets welded all the way around. I believe the open end and welded sides better distributes stress, but someone more knowledgeable about the issue may have better intel.

  161. #161
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    IIRC, Keith Bontrager was one of the first to use the not-welded-on-all-sides gussets back in the day on his custom steel frames. Lots of BMX frames have been done like this too, and if anyone is going to break things it's those guys.

  162. #162
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    Thanks cactus and stroller. I pulled the Brooks and put a WTB on it now. The Brooks was just making my nerves around my sit bones get pretty irritated. It seems it requires a very particular position on it, and I cannot find it quite. But alas, it does look very neat.

    Oh, just received some Revelate Design bags that I really want to try with it. No frame bag though, plan to make that myself eventually. Thinking of putting a rack and grocery panniers on the rear for when the gas prices go crazy. It's great having this versatile of a bike now. Also thinking of building up some wide rim wheels to move some relatively wide tires with

  163. #163
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    update

  164. #164
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    double post

  165. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhana
    update
    Nice, dhana.

    What bars and bashguard are you using?

  166. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by ache
    Bad thing: XT shadow rear derrie and horizontal dropouts make taking out the back wheel pretty tricky, going to try my old classical LX to compare.
    Any updates on this? I am seriously considering a Troll, but I am really concerned with this. I am going to start with a rear derailluer, fenders and rack. In time, I hope to switch out the derailluer for an IGH. But, I am really concerned about not being able to get the rear tire out on the trail to fix a flat while I have the fenders on.

  167. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by edsmemberships
    Any updates on this? I am seriously considering a Troll, but I am really concerned with this. I am going to start with a rear derailluer, fenders and rack. In time, I hope to switch out the derailluer for an IGH. But, I am really concerned about not being able to get the rear tire out on the trail to fix a flat while I have the fenders on.
    I have the XT Shadow rear derailleur. All I need is a 10mm wrench to loosen the rear fender stays and the wheel slides right out. No problem even with 26x2.35 Big Apples. Park Tool MT1 is a great for this purpose, http://www.rei.com/product/639291. Also, there needs to be as much slack in the chain as possible to be able to pull the wheel back far enough, so you need to take it of the chainring in the front and shift to the smallest cog in the rear.
    Last edited by alan ss; 04-01-2011 at 06:27 AM.

  168. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by alan ss
    I have the XT Shadow rear derailleur. All I need is a 10mm wrench to loosen the rear fender stays and the wheel slides right out. No problem even with 26x2.35 Big Apples. Park Tool MT1 is a great for this purpose, http://www.rei.com/product/639291. Also, there needs to be as much slack in the chain as possible to be able to pull the wheel back far enough, so you need to take it of the chainring in the front and shift to the smallest cog in the rear.
    Great! I think that settles it for me. Thanks, for the quick reply.

  169. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by edsmemberships
    Any updates on this? I am seriously considering a Troll, but I am really concerned with this. I am going to start with a rear derailluer, fenders and rack. In time, I hope to switch out the derailluer for an IGH. But, I am really concerned about not being able to get the rear tire out on the trail to fix a flat while I have the fenders on.
    Well, I had no time to change the build. But in the meantime I wrote a letter to Surly and they admitted the horizontal dropouts and shadow derries are "a pain in the a$$" (c)

    So I am going to change it to traditional design anyway.

    It is indeed possible to take the wheel out, but 1) you need to loosen the fender stays 2) putting it back is much more tricky. I run 12x36 cassette, probably with sth like 11x28 it would be simpler. Anyway, don't expect it being so smooth and fast as with vertical dropouts.

  170. #170
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    ... and if we just ... Troll with Rohloff hub

    Has any one out there built the Troll with the Rohloff Hub? Any Pics?

  171. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hillbillybill
    Has any one out there built the Troll with the Rohloff Hub? Any Pics?
    http://whileoutriding.com/2011/02/23...in-costa-rica/

  172. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by edsmemberships
    Any updates on this? I am seriously considering a Troll, but I am really concerned with this. I am going to start with a rear derailluer, fenders and rack. In time, I hope to switch out the derailluer for an IGH. But, I am really concerned about not being able to get the rear tire out on the trail to fix a flat while I have the fenders on.
    In the meantime I changed the mech to good old LX with classical design.

    IMHO this makes significant difference when releasing the wheel compared to shadow stuff.

  173. #173
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    Hillbilly, just swapped everything over from my 1x1 a couple weeks ago.




  174. #174
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    Nice! This looks remarkably like the bike I want to build when/if I can find the $.

    Is that the Surly Tuggnut (sp?) holding the wheel in place, and did it slip without using this, even with the nutted axle? Also, is the Tuggnut likely to get in the way of fitting a rear rack? Thanks.

  175. #175
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    satanas, that is a Tuggnut. And after using one I'll never go back. Between aligning the disc rotor and slotting the Rohloff OEM2 axle plate, the Tuggnut makes for a much easier, more precise mounting with very little effort.

    Here is a quick shot of the drive side drops showing how Surly made room for all 3 rack/fender mounts and their trailer eyelet in conjunction with the Tuggnut:


  176. #176
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    Thank you, that's very helpful and just what I needed to know! Thanks for the photo too as it makes things very clear. Now I just have to find the $, mainly for the Rohloff hub...

  177. #177
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    Namlessontrail Thanks for the great pictures. It looks like you went with the threaded axel on your Rohloff Hub. I am trying to decide between quick releese V/S threade axel. I was worried about the axel threads getting beat up but I see the answer is the castel nuts. Did they come with the Rohloff Hub?

  178. #178
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    Hillbillybill, not sure if those nuts came standard. I picked my hub up directly from Neil at Cycle Monkey and just had him bundle everything I needed. He's definitely the guy to buy from, especially if you're looking for advice on which hub to go with. He builds a bomber wheel, too!

  179. #179
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    If you look at Cass Gilbert's blog (http://whileoutriding.wordpress.com/), you'll see that he is successfully using a normal (steel) Shimano Q/R skewer.

    Given the price of Rohloff hubs, I'd be inclined to invest in these myself: http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/pitlock.asp There are apparently versions for both Q/R and solid Rohloff axles (scroll down to see). Peter doesn't much like the idea of Pitlocks and horizontal dropouts, but with the Tuggnut the wheel cannot move so they should be fine.

  180. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by stroller
    some new pictures of mine... having a great time with it






    hows the ride on the regular troll forks? I was going to try them out with some brown fat franks.
    Sweet ride! Is that a Gille Berthoud saddle? How do you like it?
    //Harri

  181. #181
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  182. #182
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    some pics of my troll here, set up with q/r rohloff and BB7s.
    http://whileoutriding.com/2011/02/23...in-costa-rica/
    Over a thousands miles or so, the hub has only shifted a couple of times, and that's riding big hills with a full load. But I'm in interested in the tugnuts as I need to crank it down pretty tight.

  183. #183
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    So, does the troll have the same tubeset as the 1x1? or is it heavier for loaded riding?

  184. #184
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    Ok, this is the next version of my Troll. The Groovy Luv bars were not working out for my hands as the Brooks didn't work for my sit bones well. Changed the grips to some Ergons and pedals to SPD's. Added fenders for around town rain as well (Planet Bike Cascadia 29er).

    I also did a test run around town with some loaded Revelate Design bags on it (Pika seatbag, Gas Tank bag large, and Harness with a 20L drybag). The handling was a little different with some weight up front, but overall it was easy to get tuned into.

    This is a very fun bike.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Surly Troll-troll-v2-01.jpg  

    Surly Troll-troll-v2-02.jpg  

    Last edited by Turtle01; 04-29-2011 at 10:43 AM.

  185. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by fotu
    So, does the troll have the same tubeset as the 1x1? or is it heavier for loaded riding?
    Hey, that's a great question fotu, and one I have also been wondering about. The surly website says the troll shares the same geometry as the 1x1, but it doesn't mention the tubeset.

    I would be really interested to know if it has the same tubeset as the 1x1...or is it heavier for loaded riding? Is this frame the 1x1 with more braze-ons, or is it a touring frame with 1x1 geometry?

    Does anybody even know?

  186. #186
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    you're quoting yourself? are you ok there???

    take a good look at the two frames, if you think the troll looks just like the 1x1 only with more braze-ons then you've answered the second question.
    (hint: it doesn't look the same at all, the entire rear section is completely different)

    as for the tubeset, send them an e-mail, because the stickers all say the same "surly 4130 cromoly" so noone outside of surly themselves can answer exactly how different it may or may not be.
    BUT that being said, the main triangle doesn't have to change that much for touring, the rear triangle and the fork do (and they have) so I'm sure you're covered.

    "foutu"
    If steel is real then aluminium is supercallafragiliniun!

  187. #187
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    turtle I love the bike! looks very nice

    been lurking this thread for a while, and decided to finally post because I'm having a hard time finding owners of this bike. I've got questions on the frame sizing; about to go ahead and buy but I am a little unsure of 18'' or 20'' . at around 6 foot with a 32'' inseem < give or take> my cannondale h800 <roadbike-ish frame> is too tall for me at a 32" standover, and the 20" seems to have a little bit lower than that, but a sloping top tube... so right now Im leaning to 18", but unsure


    will post some pics of my mtb/tourer/commuter as soon as I get a chance...the parts should be here in a few days, just gotta get that frame!

  188. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by ache
    The top loop should face this way. This determines the position of the bottom loop)
    Thank you for your high quality photos. Those were very useful to me (for instance I can see that the lower rack mounts on the fork are brazed on the fork, not threaded through-blade holes like they are described on Surly web site).

    I also think that you installed the front rack incorrectly (if it is a Tubus Tara front rack). Not only the main loop is backwards (look at the mounts for fenders, those should face to the rear), but also the two horizontal bars are upside-down (left one should be on the right side and vice versa). Look at the stops for pannier hooks on the rear end of the horizontal bars - those stops should point up.

  189. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by byknuts
    you're quoting yourself? are you ok there???

    take a good look at the two frames, if you think the troll looks just like the 1x1 only with more braze-ons then you've answered the second question.
    (hint: it doesn't look the same at all, the entire rear section is completely different)

    as for the tubeset, send them an e-mail, because the stickers all say the same "surly 4130 cromoly" so noone outside of surly themselves can answer exactly how different it may or may not be.
    BUT that being said, the main triangle doesn't have to change that much for touring, the rear triangle and the fork do (and they have) so I'm sure you're covered.

    "foutu"
    Hi byknuts! I hope I can safely speak for both of us when I say thanks for the reply, I hadn't thought of emailing surly directly.

    However, while I would say the front triangle doesn't "have to" change much for touring, frame stiffness would definitely have an impact on the "noodle action" of the bike once it gets 30 pounds of gear on it. While the 1x1 is not the flexy-ist frame ever, it ain't the stiffest either. The troll is marketed as a touring frame, that's why I want to know.

    - fauxtoo

  190. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by fotu
    Hi byknuts! I hope I can safely speak for both of us when I say thanks for the reply, I hadn't thought of emailing surly directly.

    However, while I would say the front triangle doesn't "have to" change much for touring, frame stiffness would definitely have an impact on the "noodle action" of the bike once it gets 30 pounds of gear on it. While the 1x1 is not the flexy-ist frame ever, it ain't the stiffest either. The troll is marketed as a touring frame, that's why I want to know.

    - fauxtoo
    please post if you find out.

    I am very close to ordering this frame, seems like a perfect expedition tourer for the average sized wallet...would like to know

  191. #191
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    Came across this blog via the Surly blog. Lots of images of the Troll in action on touring duty. In fact, this is just a great cycle touring blog. Check it out:

    http://whileoutriding.com/2011/04/30/mud-and-mompox/

    Specific info on various bikes used for the tour including the Troll:
    http://whileoutriding.com/my-bike/

  192. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by dfltroll
    Came across this blog via the Surly blog. Lots of images of the Troll in action on touring duty. In fact, this is just a great cycle touring blog. Check it out:

    http://whileoutriding.com/2011/04/30/mud-and-mompox/

    Specific info on various bikes used for the tour including the Troll:
    http://whileoutriding.com/my-bike/
    I took another test ride on the Troll today--I think I'm going to go for it.

  193. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by fotu
    Hi byknuts! I hope I can safely speak for both of us when I say thanks for the reply, I hadn't thought of emailing surly directly.

    However, while I would say the front triangle doesn't "have to" change much for touring, frame stiffness would definitely have an impact on the "noodle action" of the bike once it gets 30 pounds of gear on it. While the 1x1 is not the flexy-ist frame ever, it ain't the stiffest either. The troll is marketed as a touring frame, that's why I want to know.

    - fauxtoo
    Quote Originally Posted by me
    Thanks for the quick replies, got another one for ya. Wondering if the tubing on the troll is exact same as the 1x1, i understand it's 4130 chromoly but is it thicker at all for load carrying?
    Exactly the same. But realize that the 1x1 is a mountain bike and is already designed to have some beef to it.

    Eric Sovern
    Surly Bikes
    877-743-3191
    [email protected]

  194. #194
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    One of the trolls we built is in here, i just laughed so hard i spit my crab dip on my keyboard.
    Pretty wild, Nuvinci hub and some cool gadgets, built another as a mini-fargo, trying to find the pics of that one.


  195. #195
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    If a LHT is capable of hauling a full load, why would there be any reason for a Troll to have heavier duty tubing than a 1x1?

  196. #196
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    just found an amazing deal, 150$ off MSRP...can't wait for mail to come :3


    trading my nevegals for commuter kenda kwiks today...got all my parts - excited!


    will post pics

  197. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by pease
    Exactly the same. But realize that the 1x1 is a mountain bike and is already designed to have some beef to it.

    Eric Sovern
    Surly Bikes
    877-743-3191
    [email protected]
    Thanks for the information. Seems like the troll could be my next mountain bike.

  198. #198
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    After the inaugural singletrack ride:

    Last edited by namelessontrail; 05-11-2011 at 10:31 AM.

  199. #199
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    =3

    http://www.greentirebikes.com/fm0092.html

    Regular price: $495.00
    Sale price: $396.00
    Last edited by pease; 05-11-2011 at 10:34 AM.

  200. #200
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    mr gilbert, ..... been looking at your blog for a while now , you're a damn inspiration. do you miss brizzol yet? keep on posting the pics. is there anywhere that the pics are high res, or are you saving them for your coffee table book!. ...geek question: is your botch welded tubus cargo the 26 inch version. i'm guessing it is and it just sits high using those high dropout holes.

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