Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc

    So it seemed wrong to have the main thread where everyone is talking about the Epic HT titled "production problem"

    So here we go with a new thread. I'll post up the sneak peak pics my LBS sent me:

    I can't wait to see it in person, but I already think it looks better than I anticipated. It has some large glitter flakes in it, ala "bass boat" style.







    Fork will be a Fox SC. I'm still debating remote lock out or crown mounted. I've been on Fox Terralogic for the last 4-5 years. Some hate them, but I loved mine. So any manual lockout will be a change. I'm thinking of just getting the crown mounted model and leaving it in the middle setting all the time.

    XX1 Eagle, XTR brakes for the rest of the build. I've got some of the new Control SL wheels ordered too, hope they don't take too long to come in.

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    "bass boat" style glitter...LOL. Frame looks great.

    IMO, I'd recommend going remote lockout versus crown. I ran bar-mounted in the past. It's so nice to hit that lever quickly right from the handlebar

  3. #3
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    Nice bike, let us know the weight when u finish building it

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

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    Picked up the frame from my shop. Man, it looks awesome in person. The metal flake/glitter is throughout the paint on the entire frame.

    Weight on the frame was a bit disappointing at first, 1050g. But all that paint on this model is going to add a bit (and it's a size L). I'm sure the raw frames will be ~100grams lighter. I'm fine with it being heavier if it doesn't break!

    That weight was with the seatpost collar, cable guides, etc, but rear axle removed.

  5. #5
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    What is your part list you're planning to put on it?
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
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    1st off, I LOVE they are selling these without forks for a change. I am not a RS fan.

    Fox SC fork with remote. REALLY want to try the orange one to push the obnoxious factor. But will probably go with black with a decal kit to match one of the frame colors.

    New Roval SL wheels (waiting on these still, eta May)
    Racing Ralph 2.35 SS for now, but I switch tires up a lot over the year.

    Probably XX1 eagle for the drive train (maybe a Next sl crank). I really have no use for the 50T though, so I might save some weight and money and just put xx1 on there.

    Shimano XTR race brakes (sorry Sram... can't do it).
    Shimano XTR race pedals

    Enve sweep bar or a Syntace Vector 5mm rise 12 degree. Not sure yet. I already have both laying around.

    Esi Chinky grips

    Syntace P6 hiflex sseat post
    Thomson X4 0 deg stem, 100mm
    S-works Phenom saddle

    King Ti cages

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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    1st off, I LOVE they are selling these without forks for a change. I am not a RS fan.

    Fox SC fork with remote. REALLY want to try the orange one to push the obnoxious factor. But will probably go with black with a decal kit to match one of the frame colors.

    New Roval SL wheels (waiting on these still, eta May)
    Racing Ralph 2.35 SS for now, but I switch tires up a lot over the year.

    Probably XX1 eagle for the drive train (maybe a Next sl crank). I really have no use for the 50T though, so I might save some weight and money and just put xx1 on there.

    Shimano XTR race brakes (sorry Sram... can't do it).
    Shimano XTR race pedals

    Enve sweep bar or a Syntace Vector 5mm rise 12 degree. Not sure yet. I already have both laying around.

    Esi Chinky grips

    Syntace P6 hiflex sseat post
    Thomson X4 0 deg stem, 100mm
    S-works Phenom saddle

    King Ti cages
    Do some research on the roval hub and fox forks, i read somewhere in dealer stuff that they don't work together.

  9. #9
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    Holy cow.. that purple. Love.

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    Thx for starting the new thread with a somewhat more positive vibe. Subscribed.

  11. #11
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    I'm anxious to see this build come together. Also anxious to hear some ride reports. The low weight of this bike has almost made me reconsider going full suspension for my next bike. a 17-18lb race bike would be a lot of fun.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    ...

    Weight on the frame was a bit disappointing at first, 1050g. But all that paint on this model is going to add a bit (and it's a size L). I'm sure the raw frames will be ~100grams lighter. I'm fine with it being heavier if it doesn't break!

    That weight was with the seatpost collar, cable guides, etc, but rear axle removed.
    It's still solid progress: the 2013 Stumpy HT frame was ~1180g (size L):

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    Yep, and the more basic painted bikes will weigh much less.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MichaelHumpal View Post
    Do some research on the roval hub and fox forks, i read somewhere in dealer stuff that they don't work together.
    Do you have any links where this is being discussed? I have some small, faint memory of that but can't recall. The new wheels aren't even really out in the wild though, so I might just be remembering wrong.

    I know the previous generation roval sl would rub on a non boost SC fork.

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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    Do you have any links where this is being discussed? I have some small, faint memory of that but can't recall. The new wheels aren't even really out in the wild though, so I might just be remembering wrong.

    I know the previous generation roval sl would rub on a non boost SC fork.
    What could rub on the current sl 15mm to an SC fork? The new ones come with both 19mm and 31mm end caps to mate up to std forks or the new rock shox oversized dropouts.

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    The actual hub flange is very wide and tall on the last gen (ie not 2017) control SL wheels. So, they will rub slightly on the leg of a non-boost fox step cast fork.

    You can get around that by running a boost fork and the spacer kit on the wheels. You can also shave a bit of material off the hub.

    Those wheels rub on Niner 15mm forks as well and come VERY close to rubbing on Crux quick release cx bike forks.

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    You would think Specialized would want to use the Fox SC forks on their 2018 bikes. So it would make sense for them to make the new wheels compatible with them.
    But what do i know?
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    Rumor mill is that specialized is going to a RS rear shock with brain in the 2018 Epics... so they might be moving away from Fox completely.

    I think the new Control SL will work with the SC forks though. I've asked Specialized for clarification.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by phlegm View Post
    It's still solid progress: the 2013 Stumpy HT frame was ~1180g (size L).
    And when you take a step back and realize that your two tires in all likelihood will outweigh the frame, the initial disappointment may fade quickly if it already hasn't disappeared.

    This looks like one beautiful bike!
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

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    OK, so I heard back from Specialized. The wheels and fork will be fine assuming I go Boost. Which I have.

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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    Rumor mill is that specialized is going to a RS rear shock with brain in the 2018 Epics... so they might be moving away from Fox completely.

    I think the new Control SL will work with the SC forks though. I've asked Specialized for clarification.
    Nice! I'm not too upset about that, i like RS just fine. Do you know anything else about the new one? I'm going to be selling my current epic this summer to fund a new race bike purchase, so i'm curious.
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  22. #22
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    What is the headset standard on this frame? Not listed on any spec I could find on Spesh site.
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    Tapered, drop in integrated, "campy" standard. Seems exactly like my previous Epics and Stumpjumpers.

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    Thx!
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    Finally got eyes on the frame at LBS. The satin charcoal model...beautiful. Medium weighed 890g with two inner cable sleeves, bb cable guide, and six bottle cage bolts, seat clamp, and rear der hanger.

    One thing I found slightly curious was why they stopped the internal cable routing for rear shift cable at the bb...why have an exposed cable along the drive side chainstay? Many if not most other ht frames at this level are chainstay internal. Would've been a cleaner stealthier look. I suspect is has to do with the supposedly all-new non-composite carbon approach and possible loss of stiffness and or strength. Just a guess.

    And/or...

    It does make the inevitable re-cabling a snap though, which all-internal certainly isn't and often requires pulling the bb or at least the cranks, depending on how the cable guiding inserts are handled.

    PS: scale pic not allowed unless I buy it! Which I just may do, it's that purdy...
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    Any ride reports so far on this bad boy?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattMay View Post
    Finally got eyes on the frame at LBS. The satin charcoal model...beautiful. Medium weighed 890g with two inner cable sleeves, bb cable guide, and six bottle cage bolts, seat clamp, and rear der hanger.

    ...

    PS: scale pic not allowed unless I buy it! Which I just may do, it's that purdy...
    Thx for the weight, but the shop is a bit strange [insert other word of your choice here] to not allow a photo. (?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by phlegm View Post
    Thx for the weight, but the shop is a bit strange [insert other word of your choice here] to not allow a photo. (?)
    Yeah don't buy from that shop. As a shop owner this is upsetting. All I hear is how the bike industry is dying, hmm wonder why? Find a shop that still loves bikes and support them.

  29. #29
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    Interestingly, one of the biggest shops in my area closed its doors recently...they carried Trek, Santa Cruz...

    In defense of the shop, the frame was special order for another customer...maybe wanting him/her to have the photo opp glory?
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  30. #30
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    Just ordered the frame last night. Only 1 charcoal/black medium available in the whole country!
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattMay View Post
    Just ordered the frame last night. Only 1 charcoal/black medium available in the whole country!
    Nice! What are your plans for the build?
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    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc

    Basically moving parts over from another bike. Someone wanted to buy my current frame from me so I saw it as an opportunity (excuse?) to check out the Epic's attractive geo (slacker hta, shorter stays, longer reach). I'll post pics and build when complete. Couple things to do while waiting: get a new bottom bracket (Raceface PF30) and swap uppers in my Fox 32 boost, as my current bike is designed around a 44mm offset, and the Epic with its slacker hta is designed around a 51mm offset. Good news is it's a $195 part, don't need a whole new fork, and Fox forks are easy to work with. I was about to do a quick seals/oil service anyway.
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    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc

    Note to anyone building up an Epic HT frame set on their own: the frame ships with the derailleur hanger installed. Do not attempt to index your gears without checking the alignment...mine was so bad it was visually obvious. Upon using the Park alignment tool, it was so bad the tool cleared the chainstay! This of course is only an issue if your LBS is not building up your bike...it's standard operating procedure for the shop to check it because half the time they're nowhere near straight. I've just never seen a hanger so badly out of whack. It's a very thin hanger, one of the thinnest I've seen...clearly meant to break if you crash long before the frame is in danger. Just thought I'd mention it as a reminder.

    Frame weight with all bits (seat collar, hanger/bolt, bottom cable guide/bolt, frame bolts [7]: 890g.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-.jpg

    Bits removed (internal plastic cable routing left in...maybe 5g of weight): 850g.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-w-out.jpg
    Last edited by MattMay; 04-12-2017 at 07:28 AM. Reason: pics/weights
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    Full Build

    Full build as shown, 19.25lb/8.73kg.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-epicht.jpg

    Frame: Epic S-Works HT medium (890g).
    Front Wheel: NOX Skyline 29 | I9 12x148 | Sapim CX-Ray
    Rear Wheel: NOX Skyline 29 | I9 15x110 | Sapim CX-Ray
    Tires: Kenda Saber Pro 2.2
    Rotors: Formula Al Cr 2-Piece 160mm f/r
    Cassette: SRAM X01 10-42
    Fork: '17 Fox Float 32 boost 51mm rake
    Cranks: Raceface NEXT SL 175mm
    Chainring: Absolute Black Oval 32, boost
    BB: Raceface PF30
    Seatpost: Specialized Command Post xcp 50mm (418g w/out cable)
    Brake Levers: Shimano XTR M9000
    Shifter: SRAM X01
    Dropper Remote: Wolftooth REmote (integrated w brake lever)
    Rear Derailleur: SRAM xx1
    Chain: XMC X11SL
    Bars: Extralite Hyberbar UL 710mm
    Bars: Extralite Hyperstem stealth 80mm
    Pedals: Crank Bros Candy 11
    Grips: Crank Bros bolt on
    Saddle: 612 Ergowave Carbon
    Bolts: Titanium and Carbon-Ti alu throughout
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

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    Anybody know if the rims on the aluminum Epic HT can be set up tubeless with just tape and sealant? They are not listed on specialized's website as being tubeless. I called Specialized and spoke with my local Specialized dealer and nobody knows.

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    Yes they can. Pretty much all Spec wheels can be, short of maybe the bottom of the barrel entry Stout stuff. I've sealed different higher end Stout rims successfully. Used Stans tape FWIW. Take your time and size the tape correctly.

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    So, my bike is more or less together and I've ridden it a few times.

    Things to note:

    1. I'm still waiting on the new Specialized Roval wheels. So, I had to reuse some old Roval carbon wheels that I still had laying around. Simple Boost conversion kits made these work for now. The color isn't the best match, but it will do until the new ones show up.

    2. I hate RockShox forks. They are just short of garbage. I ordered a Fox SC 51mm offset boost fork, months ago. They were backordered and I kept waiting. Then 3 days before I was slated to leave on a MTB trip, it was still not at the shop. Latest news said I would have to wait for a "2018" model, due out in June.

    So, I had to get a SID World Cup in order to get rolling. Got a black one... seemed good. Second ride on the bike it perma-sagged itself 10 miles form the car in Moab.



    Not good. Took it to OTE in Fruita, hoping it was a simple air seal. Nope, inside of the stanchions were gouged, letting air pass from the + to - chamber. Needed new uppers. Rochshox overnighted uppers to the shop. Which would have been great, but they sent NON BOOST uppers. Morons.

    Come to find out no Boost uppers were available, so they overnight a new fork. But, there were no black ones in the USA according to Sram. So I get a white fork. Ugh... So now I've paid $300 more for a RockShox fork that I didn't even want and now it's also in a color I don't like. At least I was rolling again though.

    But, the bike is great. It descends well for a HT and the slacker head tube angle is instantly noticeable. I'm still trying to get all the little details dialed in and the fork settings figured out. Resisting the urge to sell the basically new Sid and get another Fox on order.




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    Keep us posted as to progress.

    I'll say that with the frame, fork, wheel, and Eagle colours, you've got quite the combo!

  39. #39
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    I bought a 2018 Fox SC fork directly from Fox two weeks ago. Little known fact: call them and they'll sell direct. 2 day delivery. How I found out: no LBS knew when they'd get '18 forks with the new neg chamber and Evol spring, so I just called Fox. "We have some, which one do you want?" My bike shown above is now 18.55 lbs.
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  40. #40
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    Yea, 2 weeks ago they finally came in stock. That didn't work with my trip. Had to get it ordered by a certain date and couldn't wait any longer. Such is life. My LBS was great the whole time and was hounding Fox weekly on stock updates.

  41. #41
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    That's crazy to hear about your fork! I'm enjoying mine so far, not ridden a fox but I went with a complete bike. Will SRAM send the right color back at least? Curious about the customer service


  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    So, my bike is more or less together and I've ridden it a few times.

    Things to note:

    1. I'm still waiting on the new Specialized Roval wheels. So, I had to reuse some old Roval carbon wheels that I still had laying around. Simple Boost conversion kits made these work for now. The color isn't the best match, but it will do until the new ones show up.

    2. I hate RockShox forks. They are just short of garbage. I ordered a Fox SC 51mm offset boost fork, months ago. They were backordered and I kept waiting. Then 3 days before I was slated to leave on a MTB trip, it was still not at the shop. Latest news said I would have to wait for a "2018" model, due out in June.

    So, I had to get a SID World Cup in order to get rolling. Got a black one... seemed good. Second ride on the bike it perma-sagged itself 10 miles form the car in Moab.



    Not good. Took it to OTE in Fruita, hoping it was a simple air seal. Nope, inside of the stanchions were gouged, letting air pass from the + to - chamber. Needed new uppers. Rochshox overnighted uppers to the shop. Which would have been great, but they sent NON BOOST uppers. Morons.

    Come to find out no Boost uppers were available, so they overnight a new fork. But, there were no black ones in the USA according to Sram. So I get a white fork. Ugh... So now I've paid $300 more for a RockShox fork that I didn't even want and now it's also in a color I don't like. At least I was rolling again though.

    But, the bike is great. It descends well for a HT and the slacker head tube angle is instantly noticeable. I'm still trying to get all the little details dialed in and the fork settings figured out. Resisting the urge to sell the basically new Sid and get another Fox on order.



    FWIW I actually like the color combo...i think the white fork goes well..i have a black epic HT alum with a white fork and white seat to match.

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    Yea, the white has grown on me. It's more the red wheels that's bothering me. Wouldn't be an issue if Specialized ever starts shipping the new Roval Control wheels. I've had a set on backorder for months.

    I still prefer Fox forks though. Just used to them. The Sid is great though. Small bump compliance is really nice with the charger damper.

  44. #44
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    the charge damper is a big improvement..maybe stikrd can make you some cool stealth custom decals for your roval?

  45. #45
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    briscoelab - Can you please add how much frame clearance you are seeing for your rear Racing Ralph 2.35? (I read on mtbr that the RaRa 2.35 actually measures 60mm on a 29mm internal width rim, so pretty much right on the money size - wise) Niner reports up to 2.4 rear tire clearance on the current Air 9 RDO, but cannot find any similar info from Specialized. Thank you!

  46. #46
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    When looking at the bottom bracket area, I noticed there is an open slot where the derailleur cables exit the downtube.

    Have you plugged this, or how to prevent dirt entering the frame?

    How does the Epic HT ride comfort wise? Harsh or forgiving?

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-9f16a3a94484461fe0bf93c5192c0a47146859669723.jpg
    Last edited by madskatingcow; 06-15-2017 at 02:02 AM.

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  48. #48
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    Not plugged it.

    The Epic HT is a great bike, I'm inpressed at how well it rides even in shatter and rocks. Love it so much I decided to sell of my Epic FSR as I can ride the HT until the new Epic FSR are in stores.

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    Hi everyone!
    I'm a bit late to the party and this is my first post on these forums. I recently built up a medium S-Works HT with XTR 1x11. Fork is a 2017 SID WC...and like many of you I am now eagerly waiting for the new Roval SL's. Running a 34t XTR chainring on standard M9020 cranks (i.e. not boost) and the chain line is perfect. Currently using the alloy Rovals that come on the HT Comp. Even with these wheels the bike feels amazing. Raced 5 local XCO's so far. Oh, and the frame weighed in at 970g including all hardware/bumper.
    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-epic-ht-s-works.jpg

  50. #50
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    The holes are not really at any sort of angle to get stuff inside unless you decide to ford water or a serious mud pit on your 10000 dollar rig. The holes sort of face towards the back of the bike and aren't as large as they look in that photo.

    The new Roval Control SL wheel set is really amazing, super light and stiff. I really can't complain about anything on the bike, the bars, seatpost, saddle, raceface cranks and OFC Di2 are all amazing. I bought the complete bike, I wasn't aware the wheel set was on back order.

    I'm really impressed with the super fast handling and speed of the bike. The geometry is very confidence inspiring.

    No issues with the SID WC fork, it's really an amazing fork and the brain is a feature I don't want to go without.
    Quote Originally Posted by madskatingcow View Post
    When looking at the bottom bracket area, I noticed there is an open slot where the derailleur cables exit the downtube.

    Have you plugged this, or how to prevent dirt entering the frame?

    How does the Epic HT ride comfort wise? Harsh or forgiving?

    Click image for larger version. 

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  51. #51
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    Serious creaking/ clicking sound started emulated on my bike after around 100 miles.

    At first I thought it was my BB. I have a Praxis unit in there now to run a GXP XX1 crank.

    I tightened that down (it actually was loose - go figure), but the noise persisted.

    I finally determined it was coming from the chainstay/ seatstay / axle area. When I initially loosened the axle, the bike seemed to offer a sigh of relief with a lot of cracks and grones.

    However, the sound continued. I then tightened the rear axle much more than it was previously and the sound went away.

    It almost seemed like my riding the bike caused this junction point in the frame to bind over time until I loosened it and then tightened it.

    Hopefully it stays away.

    So for anyone who may have this frame - if you hear noises, check this area first.
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  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerort View Post
    Serious creaking/ clicking sound started emulated on my bike after around 100 miles.

    At first I thought it was my BB. I have a Praxis unit in there now to run a GXP XX1 crank.

    I tightened that down (it actually was loose - go figure), but the noise persisted.

    I finally determined it was coming from the chainstay/ seatstay / axle area. When I initially loosened the axle, the bike seemed to offer a sigh of relief with a lot of cracks and grones.

    However, the sound continued. I then tightened the rear axle much more than it was previously and the sound went away.

    It almost seemed like my riding the bike caused this junction point in the frame to bind over time until I loosened it and then tightened it.

    Hopefully it stays away.

    So for anyone who may have this frame - if you hear noises, check this area first.
    If you're running a sram cassette on an XD driver. Try greasing the threads on the XD driver and reinstalling the cassette. I had a similar creaking on my last Epic and that completely fixed the issue.
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  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    If you're running a sram cassette on an XD driver. Try greasing the threads on the XD driver and reinstalling the cassette. I had a similar creaking on my last Epic and that completely fixed the issue.
    I'm running it as a single speed with a shimano style hub.
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  54. #54
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    2018 Epic

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_1023.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_0959.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_0942.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_0943.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_0940.jpg

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-Works Boy View Post
    Hi everyone!
    I'm a bit late to the party and this is my first post on these forums. I recently built up a medium S-Works HT with XTR 1x11. Fork is a 2017 SID WC...and like many of you I am now eagerly waiting for the new Roval SL's. Running a 34t XTR chainring on standard M9020 cranks (i.e. not boost) and the chain line is perfect. Currently using the alloy Rovals that come on the HT Comp. Even with these wheels the bike feels amazing. Raced 5 local XCO's so far. Oh, and the frame weighed in at 970g including all hardware/bumper.
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Hey about those wheels you're currently using. Do you know about what the weight is on those?
    Curious how much can be dropped from switching between those and the Control SLs.
    If i remember correctly the hubs on those wheels are pretty heavy.
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  56. #56
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    New Control SL wheels in Boost (and non-boost) no shipping! Mine are at the LBS. Only been a 5 month wait, lol. Glad to try them out though, they should work awesome with 2.35" tires.

  57. #57
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    *now (hopefully)

  58. #58
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    AWESOME!!!!! Guess I need to run to the shop and order mine!
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  59. #59
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    Anyone got information if we will see new paint options for frameset for 2018?

    Cant find any info!

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by plupp View Post
    Anyone got information if we will see new paint options for frameset for 2018?

    Cant find any info!
    I am pretty sure there will be, but they wont be released until september probably.

    I only say that because i've seen some of the same colorways that the epic FS comes in on the lower levels, but haven't seen them on the B2B website for dealers.
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  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    I am pretty sure there will be, but they wont be released until september probably.

    I only say that because i've seen some of the same colorways that the epic FS comes in on the lower levels, but haven't seen them on the B2B website for dealers.
    Then same info as me. I'm sure the regular once will get new looks, but as the S-Works was delayed for such long time and release as 2018 I'm not sure. Thinking of ordering a frame now or wait as I'm not in hurry with replacing the existing once I ordered instead of the S-Works.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by plupp View Post
    Then same info as me. I'm sure the regular once will get new looks, but as the S-Works was delayed for such long time and release as 2018 I'm not sure. Thinking of ordering a frame now or wait as I'm not in hurry with replacing the existing once I ordered instead of the S-Works.
    Yeah the sworks colorways should be staying the same. They are consistent with the FS colorways. The others were consistent with the 2017 epic FSR colorways and it seems the new ones will share colorways with the new epic FS colors for 2018.
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  63. #63
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    Quick question. Will the fork crown bumpers work with a step cast fork. Specifically the non boost model. Thanks.
    I don't want to mess with adaptors or a new wheel set for that matter.

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  64. #64
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    Just to confirm - the '18's are using a different offset fork (42mm vs. 51mm), so anyone with a Fox StepCast, can't really run it on the new HT's properly, correct?

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    Fox offers a 44mm offset...it's the epic fs that's 42mm anyways.

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by peabody View Post
    Fox offers a 44mm offset...it's the epic fs that's 42mm anyways.
    Good info, thanks. FS only. Hardtail remains 51mm.

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    Hey about those wheels you're currently using. Do you know about what the weight is on those?
    Curious how much can be dropped from switching between those and the Control SLs.
    If i remember correctly the hubs on those wheels are pretty heavy.
    Thanks for the question. I just picked up the new SL's today. Out of the box (XD driver) with rim tapes and valves installed:
    FR = 658g
    R = 785g
    Using the rim plugs will drop another 20g off each wheel.

    The alloy Rovals I've been using (Shimano freehub) weigh 852g and 1041g. 450g difference.

    Does anyone know a good technique to pull the XD driver off without using DT tools?

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-Works Boy View Post
    ...

    Does anyone know a good technique to pull the XD driver off without using DT tools?
    Can you not pull off the end cap, then slide off the driver? I wrap the end cap in a towel if I need pliers, although it still can mar the cap a bit.

    Or maybe the new wheelset is entirely different.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    So it seemed wrong to have the main thread where everyone is talking about the Epic HT titled "production problem"

    So here we go with a new thread. I'll post up the sneak peak pics my LBS sent me:

    I can't wait to see it in person, but I already think it looks better than I anticipated. It has some large glitter flakes in it, ala "bass boat" style.







    Fork will be a Fox SC. I'm still debating remote lock out or crown mounted. I've been on Fox Terralogic for the last 4-5 years. Some hate them, but I loved mine. So any manual lockout will be a change. I'm thinking of just getting the crown mounted model and leaving it in the middle setting all the time.

    XX1 Eagle, XTR brakes for the rest of the build. I've got some of the new Control SL wheels ordered too, hope they don't take too long to come in.
    Does the frame come with headset bearings?

  70. #70
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    Thanks. I was being pathetic. End cap easily pulled off with a firm grip. I was able to easily switch the Shimano freehub body off my '17 SL's. Add 10g for the Shimano freehub! But I dropped a pound of weight off the bike. The wheels are sweeeet.

  71. #71
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    Does anyone know if there are any significant changes in the frame for the Epic Hardtail Comp Carbon World Cup from 2017 to 2018? I know there was some news about how light the 2018 S-works frames are but I am wondering if any revolutionary changes were made for the lower end Epic hardtail frames.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by ekraft84 View Post
    Hardtail remains 51mm.
    Correct.
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  73. #73
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    The frame comes with a headset. I ditched the o-ring on the top bearing cover as it slows the movement.

  74. #74
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    So they ditched the Shimano for the 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon?
    They now come with SRAM Level TLs. Anybody know anything about these brakes?
    I was counting on the Shimano as I kind of prefer them.

  75. #75
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    Does anyone know if the Epic hardtail in size [small] comes with one or two water bottle mounts?

  76. #76
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    Pretty sure they all have two. My bike has a front derailleur and I don't have one attached to the seat tube. But that would push it out slightly. And witg the shape of the Di2 unit I'm not sure the cage can even fit without hitting it.

    Quote Originally Posted by guvna View Post
    Does anyone know if the Epic hardtail in size [small] comes with one or two water bottle mounts?

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    New Control SL wheels in Boost (and non-boost) no shipping! Mine are at the LBS. Only been a 5 month wait, lol. Glad to try them out though, they should work awesome with 2.35" tires.
    Did you get these mounted up?

    I'm still waiting on my chisel frame to ship so i haven't gotten to use my wheels yet.
    Wondering how they ride compared to the old SL's. They're pretty stinking light.
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  78. #78
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    Mounted up with Ikon 2.35 TR (non-exo). The wide rims made those tires HUGE!

    I've since changed the rear to a 2.2 Ikon, but kept the big guy up front.

    They are great, I guess. Seem to support the wide tires well. Not that the old ones sucked. Stiffness seems adequate as well.

  79. #79
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    Mine wouldn't even turn with the O-ring installed. Thew it away... problem solved.

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    Mounted up with Ikon 2.35 TR (non-exo). The wide rims made those tires HUGE!

    I've since changed the rear to a 2.2 Ikon, but kept the big guy up front.

    They are great, I guess. Seem to support the wide tires well. Not that the old ones sucked. Stiffness seems adequate as well.
    Nice. I was thinking of running 2.3 fast trak/ renegade combo on mine.
    Did you stick with rim strips or run the plugs?
    I've never had rims with plugs so i thought i might run them just because... unless they suck lol
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  81. #81
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    The strips suck. Sealant can get under them eventually and I've had significant nipple corrosion issues in the past because of this.

    I don't trust the plugs... they are probably fine. But I just put a wrap of Stan's tape like I always do.

  82. #82
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    I put the plugs in yesterday. If they suck i'll just tape mine too... the rim strips are too hard to get on anyways and stans tape is always reliable.

    What kind of complete bike weights does everyone have going right now?

    I've only seen a couple people post weights on this thread, which is surprising with how light these frames are.

    LETS SEE THEM!

    Curious how light some of you have built these up.
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  83. #83
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    Yes! I'm about to pick up an '18 Comp Carbon! Let's see some weight/pics!

  84. #84
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    Shop sent me this today. Large size, with the new Boost SL's Wheels. No Pedals or Cages yet.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-resized_20170816_153631.jpg

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pjthom22 View Post
    Shop sent me this today. Large size, with the new Boost SL's Wheels. No Pedals or Cages yet.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Thats real nice! Is that yours?
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  86. #86
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    This is one spoiled 12 year old.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

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    How does it ride??

    Looks like you've slacked it out a bit with the shorter stem and taller fork (??). How do you like the ride? Still climb OK?

    Quote Originally Posted by MattMay View Post
    Full build as shown, 19.25lb/8.73kg.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Frame: Epic S-Works HT medium (890g).
    Front Wheel: NOX Skyline 29 | I9 12x148 | Sapim CX-Ray
    Rear Wheel: NOX Skyline 29 | I9 15x110 | Sapim CX-Ray
    Tires: Kenda Saber Pro 2.2
    Rotors: Formula Al Cr 2-Piece 160mm f/r
    Cassette: SRAM X01 10-42
    Fork: '17 Fox Float 32 boost 51mm rake
    Cranks: Raceface NEXT SL 175mm
    Chainring: Absolute Black Oval 32, boost
    BB: Raceface PF30
    Seatpost: Specialized Command Post xcp 50mm (418g w/out cable)
    Brake Levers: Shimano XTR M9000
    Shifter: SRAM X01
    Dropper Remote: Wolftooth REmote (integrated w brake lever)
    Rear Derailleur: SRAM xx1
    Chain: XMC X11SL
    Bars: Extralite Hyberbar UL 710mm
    Bars: Extralite Hyperstem stealth 80mm
    Pedals: Crank Bros Candy 11
    Grips: Crank Bros bolt on
    Saddle: 612 Ergowave Carbon
    Bolts: Titanium and Carbon-Ti alu throughout

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    Thats real nice! Is that yours?
    Yes that will be mine. Probably picking it up today or tomorrow. Then I can get out some more pics

  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by emptyjones View Post
    Looks like you've slacked it out a bit with the shorter stem and taller fork (??). How do you like the ride? Still climb OK?
    Climbs great! I've since replaced the fork tho with a Stepcast (100mm only) and dropped a couple hundred grams. I have two wheelsets, one 23mm internal and one 26mm. When I run the 26mm I use the 120mm fork and 2.3 tires...better combo for chunkier trails...wee bit slacker too as you mention. Bike weight varies about a pound.
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  90. #90
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    My 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon should be in, end of this week. Super excited!!
    Have wanted one since they came out in late '16, but blew my wad on a carbon Stumpy at the time. Ordered a ton of parts for it - all my GX and X0 Eagle parts are on their way, along with brake upgrades and a Next SL G4 crank, ENVE bar etc.
    I decided on a 2.1 Fast Track Gripton/2.1 Renegade Gripton combo as this will rarely see anything rough. Hopefully will be a fast combo.
    Going to be a long week! LOL!

    I cannot bring myself to order the 2017 Roval Control SL wheelset yet. That's a big chunk - almost as much as the bike!
    May do a Light Bicycle compromise instead.

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    My 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon should be in, end of this week. Super excited!!
    Have wanted one since they came out in late '16, but blew my wad on a carbon Stumpy at the time. Ordered a ton of parts for it - all my GX and X0 Eagle parts are on their way, along with brake upgrades and a Next SL G4 crank, ENVE bar etc.
    I decided on a 2.1 Fast Track Gripton/2.1 Renegade Gripton combo as this will rarely see anything rough. Hopefully will be a fast combo.
    Going to be a long week! LOL!

    I cannot bring myself to order the 2017 Roval Control SL wheelset yet. That's a big chunk - almost as much as the bike!
    May do a Light Bicycle compromise instead.
    Nice! looking forward to seeing the build!
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  92. #92
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    The new Roval control SL wheels are really top notch, I'm loving mine.

  93. #93
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    ^^ Doesn't get much better than those. I think even ENVE would agree.

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    ^^ Doesn't get much better than those. I think even ENVE would agree.
    The enve wheels have no spoke holes, I always thought that was the ultimate

  95. #95
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    Question to those who have a Medium Epic HT 2017>up with a factory Eagle:
    Would you mind counting your chain links (include the Powerlock) please?
    I've got all my GX/X01 Eagle gear ready n waiting for my bike that gets here tmrw!

  96. #96
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    Wheels installed. 8.6kg. Happy!Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3748.jpg

  97. #97
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    Just finish the build on my son's xc race bike. 18.2 complete.
    I have a quick question why are the Sworks Frameset coming with a 0 offest seatpost?
    Non Sworks are offset.

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  98. #98
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    Such a lucky boy!

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by ejreyes6 View Post
    I have a quick question why are the Sworks Frameset coming with a 0 offest seatpost?
    Non Sworks are offset.
    My guess is because the S-Works Phenom saddle rails are about 20mm more forward than the rails on Phenom ti/cromo railed saddles, so the zero offset post is optimal to work with this saddle on an Epic. I also have a ti railed saddle on my Epic comp and need to use a 20mm offset post because of the different rail position.

  100. #100
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    Specialized says they corrected the angle so I guess they think it's perfect now. I love the geometry on it.

  101. #101
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    Got my 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon yesterday. It's freakin awesome. I need more saddle time but I'm really digging it. So fast and nimble. Got an ENVE Sweep bar, Eagle and some other stuff for it. Lots of work to do!

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3554.jpg
    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3552.jpg
    Last edited by COMTBR; 08-26-2017 at 06:00 AM.

  102. #102
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    Interesting thanks.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

  103. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Got my 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon yesterday. It's freakin awesome. I need more saddle time but I'm really digging it. So fast and nimble. Got an ENVE Sweep bar, Eagle and some other stuff for it. Lots of work to do!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Stunning. Visited a couple bike stores in the Bay Area today and not in stock. Really wanted to test ride.

  104. #104
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    So I removed my wheelset (2018 Roval Control 29 Alloy), which Specialized lists as 22mm IW vs the older 21mm IW.

    https://www.bellscycling.co.za/produ...hardtail-comp/

    vs.

    https://www.specialized.com/us/en/eq...trol-29/118028

    My wheelset completely stripped (no rotor or cassette) weghs 1,934 grams!
    879 F / 1055 R / 1,934 S

    This is a whole lot different than the advertised 1,550 grams from Specialized for the Roval Control Alloy 29 wheels!

    What gives? First of all, are these really a newer, wider (22mm IW) version of those wheels, for the 2018 bikes?

    This is really pushing me towards the Roval Control SL carbon wheels, unless Specialized got creative with those weight estimates as well. Has anybody actually weighed their Roval Control SL carbon wheelsets? If they are actually 1,330 grams like Specialized says they are, that would be a HUGE weight reduction on the bike!

    Ugh, $1,900 is a chunk of change.

  105. #105
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    You got the Alloy Control rim, not the conplete wheelset.

    Different hub and spokes on the bike compare to the wheelset.

  106. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by plupp View Post
    You got the Alloy Control rim, not the conplete wheelset.

    Different hub and spokes on the bike compare to the wheelset.
    I knew there were differences in the hubs/internals, I had no idea there was that wide of a weight gap.

  107. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    I knew there were differences in the hubs/internals, I had no idea there was that wide of a weight gap.
    It's about 450g difference compared to the SLs, more if you use the rim plugs. See my previous post, #67. The SLs are great though - the ride feel is totally different (better) to the alloy rim, but yes, they are a significant $ investment. I did it, love them, but now worry about rock strikes every ride...eep!

  108. #108
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    ^^ Completely missed your earlier post. Thanks for the great info!
    Pretty much an exact 1.1lb drop from my stockers.
    Decisions, decisions. My LBS has 3 sets of the SLs right now and let me handle them. I think I got some drool on one of them.
    Silly question - does anybody know if there are Roval stickers that would fit on the rim profile? Particularly in red? There were none in the box. LBS guy is checking to see if they're available.

  109. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    ^^ Completely missed your earlier post. Thanks for the great info!
    Pretty much an exact 1.1lb drop from my stockers.
    Decisions, decisions. My LBS has 3 sets of the SLs right now and let me handle them. I think I got some drool on one of them.
    Silly question - does anybody know if there are Roval stickers that would fit on the rim profile? Particularly in red? There were none in the box. LBS guy is checking to see if they're available.
    If they arent available you can get some from "Stickrd"
    I have the control SL's and they're pretty phenomenal. I like them better than the old control SL's. The wider rim is way better.

    Mine with rim plugs and valve stems weighed 1383.
    The 1330 weight they advertise might be without valve stems and plugs... not sure.
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
    [Niner Air 9 Alloy - Rigid SS]

  110. #110
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    Bought the SLs! Ouch! Time to find some red stickers now...
    Thanks for the helpful input Tyrich88..

  111. #111
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    the red roval stickers are good looking but one of mine is already slightly peeling.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_0971.jpg  


  112. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by 04 F2000SL View Post
    the red roval stickers are good looking but one of mine is already slightly peeling.
    Yes they will peel off the ones on my 2018 S-Works Epic FSR lasted less than a month. I didn't care one way or the other the wheels look good all blacked out IMOHO, however if you have to have the decals this https://www.stikrd.com/ seems to be your best bet as Specialized does NOT have replacement decals for the 2018 Roval Control SL's

  113. #113
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    Nice SWorks.

    $75 for some wheel stickers. Good grief.

  114. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Bought the SLs! Ouch! Time to find some red stickers now...
    Thanks for the helpful input Tyrich88..
    Not a problem! You'll love them. I love mine!
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
    [Niner Air 9 Alloy - Rigid SS]

  115. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    Not a problem! You'll love them. I love mine!
    PM'd you in case you hadn't seen. Having some Torque Cap issues with my new wheels.
    Trying to get correct part #s...

  116. #116
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    Just got my frame, but I'm stumped on a couple of parts that came with it - see photo.

    The bottom part is obviously for frame protection (adhesive backing), and it appears to fit the chainstay area. Is it maybe to protect the bottom of the driveside chainstay given that cable routing is external for that portion? (The top of the chainstay has a longer version of the same thing, pre-applied.)

    As for the top piece, it is rubber, and the underside is completely smooth. Maybe fits in the under BB area to protect cable routing? Totally stumped on this one.

    Cheers!

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-20170907_111631-756x1008.jpg

  117. #117
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    I forget what the shop said that rubber was for. I do know it's not for external use.

    The short chain stay is for the bottom, you don't need it.

  118. #118
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    The rubber goes under a SWAT box to protect the frame. I got one with my frame too. Seems to be an odd inclusion.

  119. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by S-Works Boy View Post
    The rubber goes under a SWAT box to protect the frame. I got one with my frame too. Seems to be an odd inclusion.
    Cheers, thx for the reply!

  120. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    So I removed my wheelset (2018 Roval Control 29 Alloy), which Specialized lists as 22mm IW vs the older 21mm IW.

    https://www.bellscycling.co.za/produ...hardtail-comp/

    vs.

    https://www.specialized.com/us/en/eq...trol-29/118028

    My wheelset completely stripped (no rotor or cassette) weghs 1,934 grams!
    879 F / 1055 R / 1,934 S

    This is a whole lot different than the advertised 1,550 grams from Specialized for the Roval Control Alloy 29 wheels!

    What gives? First of all, are these really a newer, wider (22mm IW) version of those wheels, for the 2018 bikes?

    This is really pushing me towards the Roval Control SL carbon wheels, unless Specialized got creative with those weight estimates as well. Has anybody actually weighed their Roval Control SL carbon wheelsets? If they are actually 1,330 grams like Specialized says they are, that would be a HUGE weight reduction on the bike!

    Ugh, $1,900 is a chunk of change.
    I am also thinking about purchasing 2018 Epic HT Comp Carbon, but 1,934 grams is very hard to accept for a wheelset, considering the price of the bicycle. Really disappointed.

    Basically we are talking about sub $ 200 wheelset, for a $ 2500.00 bike!

  121. #121
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    Well, the Expert and Pro come with Carbon wheels, but they're not even the 2017 SLs. They're the older thinner IW style with cheaper hubs (Pro less so.) That's why I just bit the bullet.
    These 2017 SLs are awesome wheels. Highly recommended. Got all my gear installed. I'll post some more pics hopefully today.

  122. #122
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    Here's some pics.
    Total weight as pictured 21.49lbs.
    Some of the upgrades:
    ENVE SWP Bar
    XT Brakes (No SRAM for me, personal preference)
    160 > 180 Front Rotor Size Upgrade
    GX Eagle RD/Shifter
    X01 Eagle Cassette/Chain
    Roval Control SL (2107) Wheels (Stikrd Decals, matte to match matte Carbon)
    Race Face Next SL G4 Crank
    Race Face PF30
    RF Chester Pedals
    Ti Bolts

    It rides amazing now - WOW
    Eagle is pretty freakin' awesome too.
    Time to go ride!

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht1s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht2s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht3s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht4s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht5s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht6s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht7s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht8s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht9s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht10s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht11s.jpg

  123. #123
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    Looks great!

  124. #124
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    ^^ Thanks!
    Anybody spinning out their 32T Eagle?
    I did on 2 familiar fast descents today. I think I need a 34T!

  125. #125
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    yeah 32 is crazy small i want a 36 minimum

  126. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    ^^ Thanks!
    Anybody spinning out their 32T Eagle?
    I did on 2 familiar fast descents today. I think I need a 34T!
    I'm running a 34t xtr and have ordered a 36t ring but I'm not sure if it will fit as I'm not running boost cranks. We shall see...

  127. #127
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    Anyone tried to fit 40t chainring or 38t oval?

  128. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    PM'd you in case you hadn't seen. Having some Torque Cap issues with my new wheels.
    Trying to get correct part #s...
    Hey COMTBR - Could you elaborate on the issue? Is there another thread about it? I have the new wheels en route, and was considering the torque caps for my SID.

  129. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    ...

    What kind of complete bike weights does everyone have going right now?

    I've only seen a couple people post weights on this thread, which is surprising with how light these frames are.

    LETS SEE THEM!

    Curious how light some of you have built these up.
    I'm starting a WW build on this frame now:
    http://forums.mtbr.com/weight-weenie...2-1055515.html

    Quick calculations in my head tell me that it might actually be sub-17 lbs with a Di2 battery stuffed in. We'll see.

  130. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by phlegm View Post
    Hey COMTBR - Could you elaborate on the issue? Is there another thread about it? I have the new wheels en route, and was considering the torque caps for my SID.
    Issue was resolved - my LBS lost (then found) the pack that had the 31mm Torque Caps in it. The wheels come with everything you'll need! Lovely wheels!

  131. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Here's some pics.
    Total weight as pictured 21.49lbs.
    Some of the upgrades:
    ENVE SWP Bar
    XT Brakes (No SRAM for me, personal preference)
    160 > 180 Front Rotor Size Upgrade
    GX Eagle RD/Shifter
    X01 Eagle Cassette/Chain
    Roval Control SL (2107) Wheels (Stikrd Decals, matte to match matte Carbon)
    Race Face Next SL G4 Crank
    Race Face PF30
    RF Chester Pedals
    Ti Bolts

    It rides amazing now - WOW
    Eagle is pretty freakin' awesome too.
    Time to go ride!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    NICE! At the rate you're going you might as well swap the seatpost for carbon and get a carbon saddle.
    It'll drop another good half pound or more depending on what you buy.
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
    [Niner Air 9 Alloy - Rigid SS]

  132. #132
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    ^^ Thanks. Yeah, haven't decided what I'm going to do yet on the saddle/seatpost.
    Need more saddle time to see if I'm going to stick with the Phenom.

  133. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    ^^ Thanks. Yeah, haven't decided what I'm going to do yet on the saddle/seatpost.
    Need more saddle time to see if I'm going to stick with the Phenom.
    I recently switched my mountain bikes over to Romin Evo saddles. Thats what i use on the road bike and what i used in training for leadville and i figure i should just stick with the same thing across the board to make it simpler.
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
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  134. #134
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    Anybody use the SPZ Power saddles? The thought of almost zero padding freaks me out - especially since I don't do any crazy long rides. Typical rides are 2-5hrs at the most.
    Wondering if a Phenom Expert/Pro/SW would be a decent upgrade. Best I can tell, until you get to the Pro and SW, nothing changes except for the sear rail types.

    Any Power vs. Phenom comparisons?

    Also, any suggestions on a carbon seat post? Something with a ton of chatter forgiveness. The more the better.
    Last edited by COMTBR; 09-13-2017 at 11:10 AM.

  135. #135
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    I've used an unpadded, solid carbon saddle for several seasons now, and its truly the shape and flex that counts most. (And yes, used it with my previous Stumpy HT.) So I wouldn't worry about the lack of padding on the SPZ Power, your only concern is if you can match your sit bones, and any required flex.

    While I've used carbon seat posts for years, I'm somewhat unsold on the chatter reducing aspect. I suppose if I went back to ALU I might notice something. From this forum I'm heard of people who like the Ritchey Flexlogic, and the Syntace HiFlex, so they may be starting points for you.

  136. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Anybody use the SPZ Power saddles? The thought of almost zero padding freaks me out - especially since I don't do any crazy long rides. Typical rides are 2-5hrs at the most.
    Wondering if a Phenom Expert/Pro/SW would be a decent upgrade. Best I can tell, until you get to the Pro and SW, nothing changes except for the sear rail types.
    Also, any suggestions on a carbon seat post? Something with a ton of chatter forgiveness. The more the better.
    I have used the phenom sworks model in the past as well as some other carbon railed saddles. I would recommend staying with metal rails of some kind.

    All of the carbon saddles i've used on the mountain bike end up either creaking, cracked or broken. Not from abuse or crashes either. I've never crashed on any of my carbon saddles, they all just wear out and either fail completely or creak so bad you'd rather just throw them in a lake.

    I ditched the carbon saddles this time around on everything but the road bike (since i had an unused one sitting around)

    In regards to padding, my sworks phenom didn't have much at all and it was still fine for hours at a time. I would just find the saddle you like best (My preference is phenom or romin evo) and run it till you either just want a change or find something better.

    Carbon seatposts... I run Easton parts more often than not and really like their EC70 stuff. It's affordable and outstanding quality. The seatpost rides well too. I have mine on my road bike and Chisel i just built a month or so ago and it's great. Ran one on my last Epic as well.
    Also the Niner RDO posts are VERY forgiving. But the one of those i own is on a rigid SS. My buddy that has one on his stumpy hardtail said it feels like a pogo stick.
    So i guess something can be too forgiving?
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
    [Niner Air 9 Alloy - Rigid SS]

  137. #137
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    My 2018 S-Works saddle and seat post don't creak or anything, knock on wood it stays that way. In the little paper booklet that comes with the bike it says the saddle has an expiration.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrich88 View Post
    I have used the phenom sworks model in the past as well as some other carbon railed saddles. I would recommend staying with metal rails of some kind.

    All of the carbon saddles i've used on the mountain bike end up either creaking, cracked or broken. Not from abuse or crashes either. I've never crashed on any of my carbon saddles, they all just wear out and either fail completely or creak so bad you'd rather just throw them in a lake.

    I ditched the carbon saddles this time around on everything but the road bike (since i had an unused one sitting around)

    In regards to padding, my sworks phenom didn't have much at all and it was still fine for hours at a time. I would just find the saddle you like best (My preference is phenom or romin evo) and run it till you either just want a change or find something better.

    Carbon seatposts... I run Easton parts more often than not and really like their EC70 stuff. It's affordable and outstanding quality. The seatpost rides well too. I have mine on my road bike and Chisel i just built a month or so ago and it's great. Ran one on my last Epic as well.
    Also the Niner RDO posts are VERY forgiving. But the one of those i own is on a rigid SS. My buddy that has one on his stumpy hardtail said it feels like a pogo stick.
    So i guess something can be too forgiving?

  138. #138
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    So LBS let me demo a Power Comp. Really liking it after multiple A/B ride comparisons against the stock Phenom Comp. I think I'll buy a Power Expert.
    Also, I'm trying to source a Ergon CF3 Carbon Flexy post. It has unanimous top reviews, but is hard to find and very pricey. We'll see.

  139. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    So LBS let me demo a Power Comp. Really liking it after multiple A/B ride comparisons against the stock Phenom Comp. I think I'll buy a Power Expert.
    Also, I'm trying to source a Ergon CF3 Carbon Flexy post. It has unanimous top reviews, but is hard to find and very pricey. We'll see.
    I had a Specialized Power Pro on my hardtail and the carbon fiber shell cracked and broke last week. I weight 180 pounds kitted up. Thankfully my LBS is going to give me a warranty replacement. I have the same saddle on my road bike and love it but I don't think it's durable enough for the mountain bike. The warranty saddle will go on my bike that stays on my trainer at home. For my MTB and CX bike I'm going to use the Shimano Pro Stealth saddle. It's similar in shape to the Power saddle but the carbon shell appears to be more robust/durable.

  140. #140
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    ^^ Thanks. Wonder if the flexy post will help a Power saddle last a little longer.
    Pulled the trigger on a Ergon CF3 post and will pick up the Expert Power today.

    I have gotten some pretty loud cracking / creaking sounds on the stock Phenom over some particularly hard hits..

  141. #141
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    Not to derail this thread, but I just got back after about 2.5hrs on the bike with the new Power Expert saddle. Wow, freakin great saddle. I'm a believer. No pain, not even slight discomfort at all.
    And I love this bike!!!

  142. #142
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    less padding. also says its polyurethane vs eva on the phenom. eva wears out fast as where pu is good forever.

    kifaru backpacks has the same approach and it works

  143. #143
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    Anybody know if there is a frame protection kit specific for the Epic HT (carbon frame)? Haven't been able to find one from frameskin.com or Invisiframe. I know that one can simply buy 3M tape or something else and cut to shape, but I'm interested in pre-cut kits specific for the Epic HT.

    Thanks in advance.
    '16 Spesh Crux
    '17 Spesh Epic HT
    '20 Yeti SB100

  144. #144
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    Good question - I looked for the same and found nothing as well. In fairness the frame is relatively new.

    BTW, did you contact either firm? If a few of us ask it might trigger them to make a design.

  145. #145
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    Already you mainly interested in the top tube top being protected?
    The finish on my 'satin' black is so rough/flat/matte, I'm not sure 3M clear bra would stick so well. Somehow the factory bottom tube protector stuck fine.

  146. #146
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    I want to try protecting other tubes, too. But definitely the top tube. I just ordered from:

    Specialized S-Works Epic Hardtail - Chameleon Skin - bicycle frame protection

    $110 Euro to be delivered to the U.S. I'm not sw but I'm hoping that it won't make a difference with other carbon epic HTs.
    '16 Spesh Crux
    '17 Spesh Epic HT
    '20 Yeti SB100

  147. #147
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    Thx for the link - no size Large right now - so I've asked about it.

  148. #148
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    Might be selling my very lightly used size Large. Would be frame, fork, and 100% unused seatpost... incase anyone is looking. Crank and brakes a possibility as well.

  149. #149
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    What model and color?

    Quote Originally Posted by briscoelab View Post
    Might be selling my very lightly used size Large. Would be frame, fork, and 100% unused seatpost... incase anyone is looking. Crank and brakes a possibility as well.

  150. #150
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    The one that started the thread S-works, size large.

  151. #151
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    How aggressive is the Chameleon Skin adhesive?
    I'd need some pretty strong adhesive. The 'satin' black on my bike is more like a rough flat/matte. But yeah, nothing worse than a nice scratch or ding or nick on the top tube.
    I'm interested.

  152. #152
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    I've put wraps on flat finishes without issue, like a 2016 Epic (FSR), so it should be fine.

  153. #153
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    I don't think that paint will nick real easy I'm not even sure the satin is a paint. On my S WORKS The rocket red / black seems it could just be carbon. I can't see weave but maybe the bake / mold procedures form this finish. Either way it's tough. I ran the bike without a chain stay protectors for a while and nothing happened. It's pretty tight with the clutch on but it still hit a little bit I would think.

    The matte red is hard to keep clean but looks sexy AF.

  154. #154
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    Hey, sorry for snail pace response been super busy at work, kids, riding (fun stuff), etc. but thanks for getting back to me, loving the Epic HT for XC races and endurance rides as long as they're not too chunky. Just raced the Fools Gold 60 in Ellijay, Ga this weekend on it and brought home the bacon in my div (Clydesdale) woot woot! About that fork! The brain!?!?! It's pretty ok on gravel grinders but that's about it! It wreaks on anything but super buffed singletrack. I'm really leaning toward a Fox 34 and maybe even shortening the stem a bit like you have but I don't want to screw up the Mtn goat climber that it is. Did you notice any attitude diff when: climbing or descending when you swap out? I really don't want to have 2 set ups on the same bike.

    On another note, how do you like the absolute black chainring? Time for a new one on my Enduro and thinking about that for it 🤔

  155. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattMay View Post
    Climbs great! I've since replaced the fork tho with a Stepcast (100mm only) and dropped a couple hundred grams. I have two wheelsets, one 23mm internal and one 26mm. When I run the 26mm I use the 120mm fork and 2.3 tires...better combo for chunkier trails...wee bit slacker too as you mention. Bike weight varies about a pound.
    Hey, sorry for snail pace response been super busy at work, kids, riding (fun stuff), etc. but thanks for getting back to me, loving the Epic HT for XC races and endurance rides as long as they're not too chunky. Just raced the Fools Gold 60 in Ellijay, Ga this weekend on it and brought home the bacon in my div (Clydesdale) woot woot! About that fork! The brain!?!?! It's pretty ok on gravel grinders but that's about it! It wreaks on anything but super buffed singletrack. I'm really leaning toward a Fox 34 and maybe even shortening the stem a bit like you have but I don't want to screw up the Mtn goat climber that it is. Did you notice any attitude diff when: climbing or descending when you swap out? I really don't want to have 2 set ups on the same bike.

    On another note, how do you like the absolute black chainring? Time for a new one on my Enduro and thinking about that for it 🤔

  156. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by emptyjones View Post
    Hey, sorry for snail pace response been super busy at work, kids, riding (fun stuff), etc. but thanks for getting back to me, loving the Epic HT for XC races and endurance rides as long as they're not too chunky. Just raced the Fools Gold 60 in Ellijay, Ga this weekend on it and brought home the bacon in my div (Clydesdale) woot woot! About that fork! The brain!?!?! It's pretty ok on gravel grinders but that's about it! It wreaks on anything but super buffed singletrack. I'm really leaning toward a Fox 34 and maybe even shortening the stem a bit like you have but I don't want to screw up the Mtn goat climber that it is. Did you notice any attitude diff when: climbing or descending when you swap out? I really don't want to have 2 set ups on the same bike.

    On another note, how do you like the absolute black chainring? Time for a new one on my Enduro and thinking about that for it 🤔
    Honestly, in regards to the fork... turn the brain off. It will feel much better. Just dial it down as far as it goes.

    I did that on my last epic and it was much better.
    It actually made the brain fork a very nice addition to the bike, when it had been way too rigid before.
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
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  157. #157
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    Ok, got 3 more things in that got it under 21lbs.
    CF Rib Cage II
    Ergon CF3 Carbon Seat Post (A bit ugly heck of a lot better than a Thudbuster!)
    Xpedo Pedals
    Brought it to 20.92lbs! Not a big deal to you S-Works folks, but definitely my lightest bike!
    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht01s.jpgEpic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-eht1s.jpg

  158. #158
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    That's probably the same or lighter than most s WORKS setup. Not sure what my Large Di2 bike weighs but I know it's around that mark. I just figured 20-21. It's fast as sh!t. It simply accelerates extremely quickly, spins up to "speed" twice as fast with half the effort. Compared to a entry level xc bike. Probably all due to the Roval SL wheels.

  159. #159
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    Yes, this thing is crazy fast. So much more bike than rider, lol.
    I have already set so many PRs with it. Just unbelievable what a good job SPZ did with the geo and everything else.

  160. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Ok, got 3 more things in that got it under 21lbs.
    CF Rib Cage II
    Ergon CF3 Carbon Seat Post (A bit ugly heck of a lot better than a Thudbuster!)
    Xpedo Pedals
    Brought it to 20.92lbs! Not a big deal to you S-Works folks, but definitely my lightest bike!
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Nice! That's a fantastic build!
    These new Specialized hardtails are just impressive!
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
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  161. #161
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    Just completed a build with Di2: 17.42 lbs / 7.9 kg.

    I love the frame, but I noticed something interesting when doing the internal cable routing. In the past, the frame entry/exit points for cockpit cabling was on either side of the downtube. In current frames that's been moved forward to the head tube.

    I found that turning the assembly right tightens the shifter/brake loop as you'd expect as it has a natural curve. However left turns force a tighter bend now, which is especially hard for the rigid brake housing to achieve. I left much more slack than in past builds, but when testing it by hand I still felt a ton of force at the brake cable/shifter connection as the hydro housing resists. This pic might help you visualize it:

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-20171004_101350.jpg

    Anyone else notice this? I'm wondering if wear will be introduced at some point. Maybe Shimano has introduced a more flexible line recently. (?)


    In any event, first ride was great so far, and I'll have to tweak my setup as the geo is a bit different.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-20171003_124732.jpg
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  162. #162
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    Same here. When I put my bike in the stand, the front wheel automatically turns toward the right. Slightly annoying!
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  163. #163
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    Just like Cannondale running the cables between Lefty and frame. Turns the handlebars to the left, annoying when riding without hands.

  164. #164
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    mine does not do that. XTR brake set

  165. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by 04 F2000SL View Post
    mine does not do that. XTR brake set
    Not sure what you mean. You're running XTR, and it doesn't do that, or mine is doing it because of the XTR?

    The Shimano housing is stiff, so would be curious if you're running something else.

  166. #166
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    I'm running xtr. Maybe your line is twisted or its just how it's setup.

  167. #167
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    This isnít a Shimano vs SRAM line thing. Iíve had both types on the bike and they both did it too, UNTIL I cut both the brake and shifter lines to the proper length.
    Because weíve got the fork stop on the bottom of the frame, we can go pretty short on the lines. If you notice in my pictures above, I cut both lines pretty short and could have easily cut another 3 - 4 inches at least before running into issues.
    As soon as I shortened em, everything kinda fell into place.
    It is not fun threading that shifter line through the frame, but itís worth it to address this IMO.

  168. #168
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    Hmmm. Before doing my "final" cuts I held the brake line by hand at the end of the shifter to simulate different lengths. I found that going shorter increased the stress to the point of it being hard to hold in place at the shifter.

    It could be that my used brake housing has retained the curve from the previous, much longer routing on the FSR. A new line might not have that "memory" yet. Could also be that I've combined the Di2 etube with the brake line in shrink. That said, I'm not alone in the issue.

    Appreciate all the input - I'll post back if I find anything.

  169. #169
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    My bike is a complete so I'm not sure if the shop had to cut anything

  170. #170
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    Have anybody considered plugging up the open holes in the headtube? Or would water ingress be ok (maybe there is a drain at bottom of frame?)? I'll end up getting a dropper, so I'll still have one port open.
    '16 Spesh Crux
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  171. #171
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    Frame has holes on bottom. Not sure how to plug the holes, Mines matte finished so clear tape won't work.

  172. #172
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    The frame has several holes in the BB area.

    There are two rectangular holes for external routing, and removing the under-BB routing bracket reveals a drain hole.

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    No need to plug them.

  173. #173
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    You mean the unused holes on the drive side? Mine came with 2 plugs in the bag of goodies. Nice clean custom-shaped/contoured plugs. Er, am I missing something.

  174. #174
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    Take a picture of them

  175. #175
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    Will do - the LBS almost threw them away and I hollered as I knew exactly what they were, given their shape.

  176. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Will do - the LBS almost threw them away and I hollered as I knew exactly what they were, given their shape.
    I'd be curious if you got something different from me as I received the frame in the unopened Spesh box - and scoured it for stuff.

    It did come installed with this rubber plug:

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-20170907_194449.jpg

    ...which inserts into the FD hole on the drive side, should you choose to not run one:

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-20170907_194458.jpg

  177. #177
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    These are 2 hard rubber plugs with a steep angled contour that fit very tightly/securely into the 2 unused head tube holes. Iíll post a pic in a few. Iím sure all of the bikes come with them, right? Hopefully the LBS builders donít toss them as mine almost did.
    Course many in this thread built frame-up.

  178. #178
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    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc

    Thanks for the info guys. I'll email Spesh to get part numbers and order em thru lbs. Always looking for a reason to stop by the lbs.

    Just got my new used bike, the one wilth alloy wheels. Practically unridden used 17 model. Interesting thing was that there were these plastic caps at the ends of the hub on the front wheel.... As the bike was packaged by a bike shop, I thought that they were for protection/shipping purposes, but couldn't take them off and the wheel fits in the fork with the plastic caps. Maybe I'm spoiled by Roval carbons that I'm used to, but it was weird to see the plastic caps there.


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  179. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    These are 2 hard rubber plugs with a steep angled contour that fit very tightly/securely into the 2 unused head tube holes. Iíll post a pic in a few. Iím sure all of the bikes come with them, right? Hopefully the LBS builders donít toss them as mine almost did.
    Course many in this thread built frame-up.
    i need 3 since I'm running Di2 i only have the brake and Di2 wire running into one port side hole.

  180. #180
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    Like Phlegm my frame came boxed and I too went through the bag of parts...no head tube plugs like described. I used one of the holes for a dropper post cable.
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  181. #181
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    Here they are:

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3944.jpg
    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3945.jpg
    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-img_3946.jpg

  182. #182
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    Damn, wish I hadn't seen those. Now I want 'em.

  183. #183
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    I'ma call spec and complain about it

  184. #184
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    Wouldnít mind one too... those forward facing open holes arenít very elegant in design.
    Never underestimate an old man with a mountain bike.

  185. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pegleg81 View Post
    I want to try protecting other tubes, too. But definitely the top tube. I just ordered from:

    Specialized S-Works Epic Hardtail - Chameleon Skin - bicycle frame protection

    $110 Euro to be delivered to the U.S. I'm not sw but I'm hoping that it won't make a difference with other carbon epic HTs.
    FYI, they contacted me saying that the Large size is now available for the Epic HT. Not listed on their site yet, but you can email them and order it "manually" via PayPal. I have one en route now.

  186. #186
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    Well specialized informed via email that they don't have part numbers nor do they have the plugs for the ports in the head tube. Going to an lbs soon and hoping that a tech will know.


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  187. #187
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    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc

    Anybody think that these won't work? Supposed to fit M5 bolt holes of bottle cage bosses; brake cable housings are 5mm in diameter.


    https://problemsolversbike.com/produ...s/bubs_-_k5431


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  188. #188
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    ^^ WOW, I didnít think the plugs were this big of a deal to find. Iím glad I was present for the build! Those wonít work as well because the head of the plugs have a pretty mean angle / contour on them as shown in the top-down view I took.
    How can Spec not have these plugs? They shouldíve gone out with every Epic hard tail they shipped? Can you email them the pic of my head tube from above?

  189. #189
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    Much thanks for your comment, COMTBR. Below is the email exchange. I wonder if I would have received a different answer if someone else at spesh would have looked into my inquiry. I think that I might send another inquiry with your pic.
    ***************
    Hello,
    There is no part number available for the Epic Headtube, we have not produced this item that you have requested before.

    Thank you for contacting us

    --------------- Original Message ---------------
    From:
    Sent: 10/6/2017 10:48 AM
    To: [email protected]
    Subject: PN for Rubber/Plastic Plugs for Ports in Headtube of Epic Hardtail

    Hi,



    I need to get the plugs to close the ports in the headtube of the Epic Hardtail (carbon frame). These would be the ports where the brake housing and the derailleur cable housing would go inside the frame.


    Could you advise on the part numbers, if there are any? If you could also let me know how many plugs come with the part number, that would be great!
    '16 Spesh Crux
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  190. #190
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    ^^ Iíve noticed that Iíve gotten drastically different answers on things, depending on who Iíve talked to, and who happened to pick up the phone that day. Including completely Wong information and part numbers.
    I remember when I was trying to find the correct Torque caps for my Roval Control SLs. Good grief. Like 20+ phones calls to Spec between my LBS and myself, 2 wrong shipments and no resolution at the end of it all. They never did end up finding the correct caps. My LBS that lost them found them again and saved the day. Donít lose Torque caps cause I donít think anybody knows the right numbers. Some areas of customer service are top notch, other are an absolute circus. Think Elephants riding little bikes around in a circle and thatís pretty close.

  191. #191
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    I just tried some silicone "tidds" that I had lying around (aimed at unused bottle cage mounts).

    While they fit and held, the heads were a bit too big and looked awkward when 2 were installed on the drive side.

    Epic Hard Tail Thread - Arrivals, Builds, Observations, etc-silicone-tidds-cxmagazine-bottle-cage-bolt-plugs-cyclocross-img_3776-e.jpg

  192. #192
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    I didnít get any plugs with my HT frameset back in March but my recently acquired Epic dually frameset came with plugs. Must be a more recent factory inclusion.

  193. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    ^^ Iíve noticed that Iíve gotten drastically different answers on things, depending on who Iíve talked to, and who happened to pick up the phone that day. Including completely Wong information and part numbers.
    I remember when I was trying to find the correct Torque caps for my Roval Control SLs. Good grief. Like 20+ phones calls to Spec between my LBS and myself, 2 wrong shipments and no resolution at the end of it all. They never did end up finding the correct caps. My LBS that lost them found them again and saved the day. Donít lose Torque caps cause I donít think anybody knows the right numbers. Some areas of customer service are top notch, other are an absolute circus. Think Elephants riding little bikes around in a circle and thatís pretty close.
    Searching after things in Spez portal when you dont know the number or exakt part description is a mess

  194. #194
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    I don't want everybody and their brother calling but I called specialized and sent photos of my bike to the guy and he sent me some plugs.

  195. #195
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    Looking clean

  196. #196
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    ^^ Nice! Itís cold and blasting wind here.

  197. #197
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    It's cold and windy here as of this morning. Yesterday was great though.

    Plugs inserted, they are a tight fit.

  198. #198
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    Yeah, one of mine took some lube to get in there. Pretty tight, which is good I guess.

    Got a good ride in yesterday -any colder and I wouldíve been miserable.

    I will say Iím blowing through PRs on this Epic by a long shot. A lot of factors at play. Lightweight, lightweight wheels, Eagle, Geo, lower rolling resistance, tire volume (wider rims).
    I love this bike!

    I definitely have noticed the Power saddle is more comfortable in certain ways, but not others. I notice my sit bones/area have a bit more pain, quicker, yet surrounding soft tissue is way happier. I wonder if itís a lack of padding? I may try that Power Arc to see if itís the flatness of the Power saddle. On my Henges, my sit bones were happier, but surrounding soft tissue wasnít as happy.

  199. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by COMTBR View Post
    Yeah, one of mine took some lube to get in there. Pretty tight, which is good I guess.

    Got a good ride in yesterday -any colder and I wouldíve been miserable.

    I will say Iím blowing through PRs on this Epic by a long shot. A lot of factors at play. Lightweight, lightweight wheels, Eagle, Geo, lower rolling resistance, tire volume (wider rims).
    I love this bike!

    I definitely have noticed the Power saddle is more comfortable in certain ways, but not others. I notice my sit bones/area have a bit more pain, quicker, yet surrounding soft tissue is way happier. I wonder if itís a lack of padding? I may try that Power Arc to see if itís the flatness of the Power saddle. On my Henges, my sit bones were happier, but surrounding soft tissue wasnít as happy.
    I have the same issue with the power saddle and that power arc is supposed to address that issue. Buddy of mine on our team just bought one of those and is supposed to let me know how it is when he gets it mounted up.
    I'm hoping it'll resolve the issue for me as well.
    [2019 Epic Expert Evo]
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  200. #200
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    ^^ Please let us know what he/you think of the Arc.
    Saddle swapping / experimenting can get expensive!

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