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  1. #1
    "THE RIDE IS MY CHURCH"
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    Virginia Key Excessive Charges- Everyone Join In !!!

    There is a new fee policy imposed by the City of Miami on Virginia Key Mountain Bike Park.
    The new fee Schedule is as follows:
    $6 per vehicle plus $1 dollar for each additional bicycle per vehicle..

    If you agree this is abusive, post your grievance on this thread...
    Together we can change things...

    This is from another thread:

    Which don't you like and why? Virginia Key - because of the politics they just implemented with the $1 surchage per rider. So its the smallest, and youngest track, no restroom or bike wash, and its the most expensive. For 4 miles you have to pay $1.50 toll per car, $6 at the gate, and $1 per rider, so to take my family its $11.50 for the track that has the least to offer. I will go elsewhere. This was my home track, but no more.

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    I was at quiet waters and there were a bunch of people talking about this problem today

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    I was there Saturday and payed $6 like usual except I had to wear a band like if I was in the VIP section of the club. So if my friend is with me he has to pay $1 for himself?

    I'm OK with the surcharge so long as the extra revenue is used to add amenities to the park such as bathrooms and/or a bike wash. If the extra $1 is used just to pay the ranger to sit by the gate entrance to only check for the bands and ignore those not wearing helmets then it's total BS. Truth is the $1 charge won't affect me much since I usually go alone and I will still pay $6.

  4. #4
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    Wow! that's crazy. $8.50 for two people to ride 4 miles of trail. Oak mountain cost $6,00 for two people and you get to ride 25 miles of trail,bmx track.lake,beach,tons of hiking trails and much more. what does Markham park charge these days? I think It was a $1.00 when I lived there 15 years ago.
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  5. #5
    "THE RIDE IS MY CHURCH"
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    Hello Everyone:
    I was in formed today by "Frenchi" that the extra revenue is going to be used to add amenities to the park such as bathrooms and a bike wash.
    In addition to this, the attorney for the "Virginia Key Bike Club" is "trying" to work with the city to have an annual pass for the park.

    In the meantime keep posting your opinions and any recommendations...
    How do you feel about the availability of an annual pass? I think it's good, How about you?

    We need to show the city how many people are involved with the mountain bike park.
    I will keep posting any additional information as I get it, and if you hear anything please also post it, as the better informed we are, the quicker we can resolve any issues.
    Last edited by torque29er; 03-05-2012 at 11:07 PM.

  6. #6
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by saviour machine View Post
    Wow! that's crazy. $8.50 for two people to ride 4 miles of trail. Oak mountain cost $6,00 for two people and you get to ride 25 miles of trail,bmx track.lake,beach,tons of hiking trails and much more. what does Markham park charge these days? I think It was a $1.00 when I lived there 15 years ago.
    That's the price you pay for having a park in that part of town... In essence all your paying is a dollor more. It's $6 bucks to get in just about in any park now. You can't escape the toll, it's been there for years. I am not going to cry spilled milk for a $1. I go to Virginia about 1-2 a month. It's not a big deal for me. I am not saying it's not worth a complaint... I am just saying it doesn't bother me.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by LazyRid3r View Post
    That's the price you pay for having a park in that part of town... In essence all your paying is a dollor more. It's $6 bucks to get in just about in any park now. You can't escape the toll, it's been there for years. I am not going to cry spilled milk for a $1. I go to Virginia about 1-2 a month. It's not a big deal for me. I am not saying it's not worth a complaint... I am just saying it doesn't bother me.
    The price I had to pay for living in Miami is the reason I moved. 99% of the trails I ride now are free.
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    Florida State parks have a similar fee. $4 flat + $2 for each additional person in the vehicle I believe. Oleta River and Jonathan Dickenson are the two local state parks. Markham and Quiet Waters charged $1.50 only on the weekends the last time I checked - they are both Broward County parks.

    I haven't ridden Virginia Key yet, but it's the distance from my house + the lack of mileage that prevent me from getting there. I gotta tell ya, a $6 fee to ride my $1200 bike isn't going to stop me...

  9. #9
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by saviour machine View Post
    The price I had to pay for living in Miami is the reason I moved. 99% of the trails I ride now are free.
    Where did you move too ?

  10. #10
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by bclagge View Post
    Florida State parks have a similar fee. $4 flat + $2 for each additional person in the vehicle I believe. Oleta River and Jonathan Dickenson are the two local state parks. Markham and Quiet Waters charged $1.50 only on the weekends the last time I checked - they are both Broward County parks.

    I haven't ridden Virginia Key yet, but it's the distance from my house + the lack of mileage that prevent me from getting there. I gotta tell ya, a $6 fee to ride my $1200 bike isn't going to stop me...
    I agree, I understand it's a matter of principal and over the course of the year to the average person it's not a lot of money but to the city it's big bucks, all that said $1 more is not going to stop me.

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    Yeah, but what about the folks who take a family of four?? Besides, its the principal of the issue, we already get amenities, miles, and a bike wash for less at other parks. VK was my home park, but now its banned until something fair and equitable is resolved. If I really have a need to ride there, I will figure out some way to ride in just in spite, so they dont get to count my dollar.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    Yeah, but what about the folks who take a family of four?? Besides, its the principal of the issue, we already get amenities, miles, and a bike wash for less at other parks. VK was my home park, but now its banned until something fair and equitable is resolved. If I really have a need to ride there, I will figure out some way to ride in just in spite, so they dont get to count my dollar.
    I was in formed by "Frenchi" that the extra revenue is going to be used to add amenities to the park such as bathrooms and a bike wash.
    In addition to this, the attorney for the "Virginia Key Bike Club" is "trying" to work with the city to have an annual pass for the park.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by torque29er View Post
    I was in formed by "Frenchi" that the extra revenue is going to be used to add amenities to the park such as bathrooms and a bike wash.
    In addition to this, the attorney for the "Virginia Key Bike Club" is "trying" to work with the city to have an annual pass for the park.
    I was extremely upset when I was told about the additional cost for riders bringing bikes into the park. After I found out where the money is "supposed" to go to, I understood the reason for the additional cost. Now we need to police the city to make sure the funds go to the park and are not diverted elsewhere. I'm sure the VKBC ("Virginia Key Bike Club") attorney is keeping on eye on this.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by LazyRid3r View Post
    Where did you move too ?
    Redneckville :-) Alabama.
    I'm poor, broke,busted,disgusted and can't be trusted!




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    I wonder how Markham, Oleta, and Amelia survived all this time without such a fee?? Its BS that they are going to put in a surcharge for something that should already be there...

    So today we got a reply to our letters from a very polished PR woman. They basically told us in very polite terms to take it or leave it, fees are here to stay. So as far as I am concerned the ban is in full effect. The only to make this go away is to make it to hurt their pockets. Why does it cost so much to the city compared to a baseball, soccer, or basketball park which needs, gates, lights, constant manicuring, and fertilizer, a groundskeeper, security, etc. Tons of those parks everywhere, people get to use them for free every day. Our trails are self maintained remote parts of the county which was wasteland before we started using it, and bringing revenue with our gate fees. Now they want to gouge. They can keep it. Its wrong. I wont ride there unless every other park is closed or has a race.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    I wonder how Markham, Oleta, and Amelia survived all this time without such a fee?? Its BS that they are going to put in a surcharge for something that should already be there...

    So today we got a reply to our letters from a very polished PR woman. They basically told us in very polite terms to take it or leave it, fees are here to stay. So as far as I am concerned the ban is in full effect. The only to make this go away is to make it to hurt their pockets. Why does it cost so much to the city compared to a baseball, soccer, or basketball park which needs, gates, lights, constant manicuring, and fertilizer, a groundskeeper, security, etc. Tons of those parks everywhere, people get to use them for free every day. Our trails are self maintained remote parts of the county which was wasteland before we started using it, and bringing revenue with our gate fees. Now they want to gouge. They can keep it. Its wrong. I wont ride there unless every other park is closed or has a race.
    Can you post the reply letter for all to see... Thx

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    Ah, $2 to get in, those were the days.....
    Some days I pay to park, other days I'll park outside and get my 5-minute warm-up and ride in.

    It's too bad they don't/won't offer an annual pass.
    That said, if the "extra" really goes towards the trail, then that's cool.
    Last edited by Surfdog93; 03-07-2012 at 05:28 AM.

  18. #18
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    Yeah, but what about the folks who take a family of four?? Besides, its the principal of the issue, we already get amenities, miles, and a bike wash for less at other parks. VK was my home park, but now its banned until something fair and equitable is resolved. If I really have a need to ride there, I will figure out some way to ride in just in spite, so they dont get to count my dollar.
    What is the typical family? 3 let's say 4 people ? How often do you think a typical family will take a bike tour? 1 time maybe 2 times every 4-5 months if that. Do you really think an extra $3 dollars will stop them? The overall cost is still very low compared to other activities in the area. It's very fair to say the typical mountain bike rider will be more effected who would ride maybe 2-3 times a month in that trail. I am not on either side I am just playing devil's advocate here. If the additional sucharge really bothers you just park in one of the spot along side the beach and ride into the park no ?

  19. #19
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    Here is a copy of the letter:

    First, we would like to thank you for your continue support and interest in the Virginia Key Mountain Bike Trail. Many of you have spent countless hours volunteering, and in partnership with the City of Miami in planning, developing and maintaining the trails. The City of Miami, specifically, the Parks and Recreation Department has and continues to dedicate resources (equipment, materials, supplies, and manpower) to these efforts. As stakeholders, it is our goal to continue to enhance, expand and improve both the Mountain Bike Trails as well as its infrastructure, in order to provide an outstanding quality of life experience for all our patrons.



    The City has approved and set aside funding ($377,000) of Park Capital Funds for the development and construction of a dedicated Mountain Bike Trail facility that will provide restrooms, bike wash and racks, small picnic area, and concessions. A Request For Quotation (RFQ) will be issued for the concessions that is proposed to include bike rentals, sales of accessories, and snacks and refreshments. Construction plans are being finalized, and construction will commence within the year. Staff is assigned to provide supervision, information, and safety to both the facilities and patrons.



    A nominal one dollar (1$) per bicyclist fee has been established to help defray some of expenses directly related to the operations of the trail. The fee is being charged on weekends only until the Memorial Day Weekend when it will be effective seven (7) days a week. We HAVE NOT implemented any other fee. In fact, we have taken steps to include one (1) bicycle to the existing Virginia Key vehicular access fee. Our department was in communications with the club representative in late January, the fee with various options were discussed, and the implementation date was scheduled for March 1st. In early February signage was posted at the entrance gate to Virginia Key advising patrons of the proposal. In finalizing our plan, we took into consideration and implemented most of the recommendations that were provided by the club representative. We will be reviewing the complete operations of trail once the infrastructure is in place, and at that time we will evaluate the offering of an annual pass.



    As any new facility, it is a learning process for all. We welcome your input, and cherish your continued support.



    Respectfully,

    City of Miami Parks and Recreation Department









    Lara de Souza - Hamwey

    Public Relations Specialist

    City of Miami Parks And Recreation

    "Where Magic Happens"



    City of Miami Parks is proud to be:

    NRPA's 2011 Excellence in Inclusion Winner

    and an accredited agency

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    My family rides much more than that, at least 2-3 time per month. We also ride 3-5 times per week in groups of several riders. Stop looking at it only from your perspective and realize that there are others affected, and that we can currently go ride elsewhere for less money and better trails, so thats what I am going to do and recommend everyone do as well. You can choose whatever works for you, but dont be surprised when you are paying $7-8 to ride there, and dont complain.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    My family rides much more than that, at least 2-3 time per month. We also ride 3-5 times per week in groups of several riders. Stop looking at it only from your perspective and realize that there are others affected, and that we can currently go ride elsewhere for less money and better trails, so thats what I am going to do and recommend everyone do as well. You can choose whatever works for you, but dont be surprised when you are paying $7-8 to ride there, and dont complain.
    Hello kaptkaos... I've sent u some messsages. If you can kindly respond...
    Thanks.

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    I just did, you should have them.

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    You guys are way too spoiled with all of the other cheap and/or free trails around. My two other main hobbies besides riding are cars and guns, both of which cost a hell of a lot more than paying to ride at Virginia Key. Hell even when I used to skate as a teenager we would have to pay $8-15 to go to skateparks and half of them were in the ghetto.

    I have no problem paying to ride a nice trail on a tropical island and I drive down from Boca Raton to do it. Yeah it sucks they're squeezing money out of it but it is Miami...

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    I have done both and add in Remote Control planes, helis, and on/off road racing. Karting, martial arts, ATVs, motocross, offshore fishing and 2 boats. Its not the money...said it many times. Its the principle.

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    Sometimes things need to be put into perspective. I feel strongly about the inequity of this new policy, but I really care about humanity.

    Invisible Children | Kony2012

    Please take the time to watch this video, its 28 minutes, yes it is a long video, but please make some time and watch.
    Sign the pledge, its free, spread the word, its free.
    If you are so inclined, buy the action kit.
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  26. #26
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    My family rides much more than that, at least 2-3 time per month. We also ride 3-5 times per week in groups of several riders. Stop looking at it only from your perspective and realize that there are others affected, and that we can currently go ride elsewhere for less money and better trails, so thats what I am going to do and recommend everyone do as well. You can choose whatever works for you, but dont be surprised when you are paying $7-8 to ride there, and dont complain.
    Sorry buddy but just because you and your family ride the trail on a more consistent basis does not mean everyone one else in the surrounding counties do as well. Statistics will show you are in the minority in what you’re trying to dispute. There are many more activities that would occupy citizens time other than bike riding in this city, that is not including the night life and other extra curricular activities. Like I mentioned before, I am looking at this objectively. Not from (my point of view) as you claim because I have no interest in what happens. I spend more money in other hobbies: Softball, Fishing & Guns.
    Like I said I am playing devil’s advocate. I admire your passion and dedication but maybe you’re the one looking at things from “your point of view” not me.

  27. #27
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaptkaos View Post
    Sometimes things need to be put into perspective. I feel strongly about the inequity of this new policy, but I really care about humanity.

    Invisible Children | Kony2012

    Please take the time to watch this video, its 28 minutes, yes it is a long video, but please make some time and watch.
    Sign the pledge, its free, spread the word, its free.
    If you are so inclined, buy the action kit.
    Thanks for your time.
    +1 rep for the video
    +1 rep for passion for the park

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    The additional fee is still upsetting compared to what you get at other parks for the same $$$. Just with the additional influx the trail bring to VK should help with paying for some additional ammenities.

    This just opens the door for more fees to come.

    We have bathrooms on the other side of Jimbo's by the beach...

    Let's see where the money really goes...

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    At least allow 2 bikes per vehicle....

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    Glad to see someone else shares the sentiment.

    I hope this works itself out. i love riding there.

  31. #31
    El Gorrrriiii
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    Since you help out there a lot. Any news on expanding the trail into the BMX section?

  32. #32
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    I dont' mind paying the extra dollar if there is going to be a ranger/person at the trailhead to watch my car. Unfortunately I haven't seen anyone or anything different after paying the extra fees.

    If you ride in on the left hand side, they usually don't even realize your there and you ride right through. Since there is no ranger nobody says a word.

    Oh and don't forget the $1.50 toll just to get to KB

  33. #33
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    Everyone b1tched and moaned for the Virginia Key park to happen a couple years ago and now everyone is complaining that its an extra dollar? C'mon people! lol I mean you have always known about the toll. Nothing new there. And if that extra dollar will help then so be it. An extra dollar it is. Now if the park starts going to sh1t with no improvements then id see a reason to blab about the dollar. But since it opened i have seen many upgrades to the trails there.
    Ride

  34. #34
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    Never been there.

    This is one of the problems of purpose built urban trails.

    Often the trails may be fun but are short distance.
    These same trails reside in areas often close enough to lessen drive times or cost to get there.
    Also, the agencies that oversee them often are under scrutiny of the local governing people.

    Is there a right or wrong answer. NO.

    It is correct that most times these trails are built on scraps of land that is often not slated for other uses. Almost always, these trails are built via the dedicated effort of gaining approval, then actually constructing the trails, the money end arises most times on account of bean counters.

    If you seriously are expecting the money to go towards the projects mentioned (bike wash and others) or someone watching your vehicle, ultimately you may be disappointed. If this happens that is great.

    For us, we often ride a variety of places, many are free and also are not groomed or purpose built. Other times they trails are free and purpose built.

    In all my years of dealing with PBC about trails, they kept us very restricted about trail construction, but also said the trails would be open to all, as are all parks in PBC.

    Everything is a compromise. We have 1000's of miles riding free less technical purpose built stuff, but when we want to ride purpose built technical trails, we drive north.

    I have grown less and less a fan of urban purpose built trails and all the politics between riders and / or the governing agency. There is a lot more riding available when you look outside the purpose built trails.

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    I don't mind the extra money, because they do continually improve the trail. Maybe having a an annual pass to the park would be a better option or something like that. I hate having to carry cash around all the time.

    It is hard to be a cheapskate when your a cycling road or mtb, so many expensive things to buy.

  36. #36
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    An annual pass would not be a bad idea. However, for those that really want to beat the system it's just a matter of parking your car outside of the park and just riding to the trails too... Just a thought 0.02 cents

  37. #37
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    I thought about this thread this week. My girlfriend and I and her friend rode Key Biscayne from one side of the island all the way to other without going into the Mountain Bike Park.

    I did my part this week. lol

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by LazyRid3r View Post
    I thought about this thread this week. My girlfriend and I and her friend rode Key Biscayne from one side of the island all the way to other without going into the Mountain Bike Park.

    I did my part this week. lol
    WOW !!! Oleta and Key Biscayne all in one day... NICE !!!

  39. #39
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    did the Scott demo ride yesterday, noticed the trailhead and each trail now has a sign so there is some improvements being done. let's hope it keeps up.

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    This response is sooo S. Florida........

    Quote Originally Posted by JonMX5 View Post
    You guys are way too spoiled with all of the other cheap and/or free trails around. My two other main hobbies besides riding are cars and guns, both of which cost a hell of a lot more than paying to ride at Virginia Key. Hell even when I used to skate as a teenager we would have to pay $8-15 to go to skateparks and half of them were in the ghetto.

    I have no problem paying to ride a nice trail on a tropical island and I drive down from Boca Raton to do it. Yeah it sucks they're squeezing money out of it but it is Miami...
    Bet you ride a SPECIALIZED.....

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by torque29er View Post
    WOW !!! Oleta and Key Biscayne all in one day... NICE !!!
    Actually Key Biscayne was on Sat and Oleta on Sunday.

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    I missed VK and rode this Wed evening. I knew I could get in with only the Rickenbacker toll, so I felt good about that. I saw that they are making a killing with the parking on all of Virginia Key for the Sony-Ericsson Tennis match for 2 weeks. They will make a fortune these two weeks, and the cars and persons coming into the key in that volume will do more harm to the environment and property in two weeks than we could ever do in years.

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    None of the money charged at the gate (Including this extra dollar) has ever been used for improvements of the trails. Everything is done by volunteers with donations. It's funny when I read people saying: well I have noticed some improvements lately so if this dollar is going to help then that's awesome. Those improvements that you have noticed have not been furnished in any way by the city. They are done by volunteers and donations from riders, some bike shops, ect....

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    So who do you contact if you want to donate or volunteer?

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    Bernard Riviere or John Voss. Look for the Virginia Key Bicycle Club on Facebook and you will find all the info there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LazyRid3r View Post
    Actually Key Biscayne was on Sat and Oleta on Sunday.
    Still nice...Any weekend you get to ride back to back days is a AWESOME!!!

  47. #47
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    BTW...Bernard Riviere is also known as "Frenchi"...

    Welcome to the "Twilight Zone"...

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    Are the trails open this weekend?

  49. #49
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    They are using the money to pay for Marlins Park
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  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    35
    they really should offer a year pass like the broward county parks do (for Locals) let us Boca people pay at the gate to support the park but let the locals ride the hell out of it, the locals are the voulenteers that put sweat and time into the trail.
    FIVE MORE MIUNTIES,JUST HOLD STILL !!!!

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