Missed you Phil....- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Missed you Phil....

    Got back out on the Phil wood after about 3 weeks of not riding it. Recently purchased a 29er single speed as well and with a break from riding and vacation....it had been a while.

    Dont get me wrong; I absolutely the 29er I bought and probably would have ridden it today if not for the friggin reservoir leaking fluid. No worries....that is one reason I have more than one bike (yay! finally got to use an excuse I have been using with my wife to justify my purchases).

    Hit it kind a hard today or so I thought it would be hard. Got a later start than I had wanted but really wanted to test the Phil (and my legs) on a long climb. The ride started with an approx. 8.5 mile long climb which has a gain of 3450' so not pain free and with the heat and lack of riding partner, I brought the handy MP3 to keep me company.

    A few observations:

    * My 29er I believe to have perfect geometry for me which before I got it, I thought the Phil Wood was setup spot-on but I think I may put a 120mm stem instead of the 110mm which will be perfect now that I know better.

    * I hate my rear tire more than ever. When I first got the Phil, I disliked the Jimmy Light 2.1 UST tire and did decrease the PSI as suggested by Prof. Shiggy but after riding my 29er with Exiwolfs....it was just crap in traction for my conditions so buh bye Jimmy Light.....

    * I could not believe how quick my Phil Wood felt. Keep in mind my 29er feels quick as shitt as well (intentionally built that way) especially for a 29er. But the Phil just felt like it was so friggin flickable. I love my 29er and I think I may be spoiled with its quick spot on geometry but I sure like the way the Phil felt.

    * I spent way more time seated than I thought I would. One apparent (ie, TBD until I do same ride on 29er) big advantage of the Phil was that my accleration was right there when I needed it. In particular, I was so impressed with how much better it seemed I could accelerate while seated on the Phil versus the 29er. In fairness, I have to do this same ride on the 29er next week but the sensation of quickness both in terms of handling and acceleration were definitely sensed big time. My 29er feels quick as heck too so I am anxious to riding it on this same trail but I just dont remember feeling the definite ability to stay seated as much and be able to acclerate so easily.

    The bottom line for me is that perhaps unlike some folks, I definitely realize now that I value acceleration as perhaps my top priority and as such, am stoked to have my 26" SS as well as my 29er built as is....

    Anyway, I am actually very happy to see how much I enjoyed my Phil Wood SS cause after all, I did spend $600 recently to put it together (the wife version of the story )

    I am also doing a 24 hour race in October and would like to bring my front suspended Phil Wood SS, fully rigid light 29er single speed, and geared bike to see how it goes. Of course fatigue will be a counfounding factor since only one bike gets to be ridden while I am completely fresh but it will be interesting nonetheless.

    Cheers

  2. #2
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    w?

    You did Sisar alone? Now tell us about the downhill.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by pacman
    You did Sisar alone? Now tell us about the downhill.
    C'mon Pacman.....I was not alone...there were plenty of bugs on the ride with me. Sisar is really tough to do on your own cause it REALLY play a mind trip since unless you have done it a lot (which I have not), you feel as if each turn is the last and of course, it never is and you just keep going up, and up, and up......

    Whiteledge was fun but I forgot how loose and tough it is in sections. Last time I did it was on my FS bike with big tires and it sure felt squirrely (sp?) in some parts, but fun nonetheless, and frankly would have felt iffy on my FS bike as well.

    I originally wanted to try the 50 miler (49.6 to be precise) but wanted to see how my legs would handle Sisar first and not commit until then.....plus, i got a late start and it was rather hot and zero breeze.

  4. #4
    Waiting to exhale.
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    With the amount of money you throw at these pimp-ass bikes and with the constant buying and selling and building of new bikes... I'm surprised that you are still married!

    You must be hung like a horse.
    Quite possibly the slowest single speeder on earth.
    Now skating 'cause its cheaper.

  5. #5
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    if only i could be so lucky Smokey.....

    truth is, i have a system that seems to work where i buy my wife stuff often that she loves as much as my bike stuff....be it a 6 massage gift certificate at the country club, weekend away from my and kids in Santa Barbara, etc.....and I actually just bought here a very sweet Santa Cruz Superlight since she wants to get into biking which is cool and she is stoked. Only problem is I need to be careful about not letting her buy bike stuff cause if she starts doing that, she will find out how much it really costs!!!!

  6. #6
    those are Rollercams...
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle

    . Only problem is I need to be careful about not letting her buy bike stuff cause if she starts doing that, she will find out how much it really costs!!!!
    You're a lucky man...for now. My wife checks the catalogs vs. what appears new in the garage and catches me every time. She usually isn't too pissed as long as I've gotten some sort of deal(she's a bargain/coupon shopper if ever there was one!)

  7. #7
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    Thanks

    Thanks for the comparison. I am currently riding a Bontrager Race with an 80mm fork, which might be close enough for comparison to your Phil Wood. I have money down with DeSalvo for a 29er SS and the geometry questions still to be decided.

    I am hoping for a 29 that steers quickly enough, but still feels super stable. Steeper STA and longer top tube/wheelbase like my Bontrager will make it right, I hope. There's no way to eliminate the acceleration problem inherent in a big wheel bike, but at least there's a pay back for that in the smooth ride and stable feel.

    What are the angles on your Phil and your 29er?
    "Welcome to my underground lair...."

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lutarious
    Thanks for the comparison. I am currently riding a Bontrager Race with an 80mm fork, which might be close enough for comparison to your Phil Wood. I have money down with DeSalvo for a 29er SS and the geometry questions still to be decided.

    I am hoping for a 29 that steers quickly enough, but still feels super stable. Steeper STA and longer top tube/wheelbase like my Bontrager will make it right, I hope. There's no way to eliminate the acceleration problem inherent in a big wheel bike, but at least there's a pay back for that in the smooth ride and stable feel.

    What are the angles on your Phil and your 29er?
    I LOVE the geometry of my 29er. I think one reason it is so friggin quick, in addition to the angles, it due to its perfectly desinged chainstay length which is spot on and once moving, feels virtually as quick as any bike i have been on. I cannot say enough by my One 9 and am SO glad I bought it as it is the perfect complement to my current bikes and since it is so quick in all regards, I feel like I get the advantage of 29er with little or no disadvantage but, there is no way it will replace the Phil Wood for my type of riding and I see them being used equally.
    Phil Wood / SS One 9

    Eff Top Tube 24.0 / 24.5
    seat tube length 18.5 / 18.5
    chainstay length dont know / 17.3
    head/seat angle 71/73 / 72/73.5
    Last edited by FoShizzle; 09-05-2005 at 06:26 AM.

  9. #9
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    Eff Top Tube 24.0 / 24.5
    seat tube length 18.5 / 18.5
    chainstay length dont know / 17.3
    head/seat angle 71/73 / 72/73.5

    Interesting, I would have though a steeper Seat tube as well. Would that have made the chainstays longer?
    "Welcome to my underground lair...."

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lutarious
    Eff Top Tube 24.0 / 24.5
    seat tube length 18.5 / 18.5
    chainstay length dont know / 17.3
    head/seat angle 71/73 / 72/73.5

    Interesting, I would have though a steeper Seat tube as well. Would that have made the chainstays longer?
    not sure....good question. i am also not sure if once you go to 29er specs, you can compare apples to apples versus the 26 numbers or perhaps you are comparing my 29er versus what you have speced for yours?

    all I know is that I could not imagine my 29er speced any better, period. if i were to buy a custom 29er, i would even use Ninerbikes exact numbers after now having ridden it.

    http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=124366

  11. #11
    illuminator82
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    nice to hear about your comparisons, but

    i would be also interested in hearing about the comfort of each bike, and the fatigue caused by longer rides. what type of trails do you ride on most? mornings afternoons or evenings?
    i had both 2, but the 29er is sooooo much smoother it is not even close. yes the 26er handles the super tight a little better, but it is far outweighed by the other attributes of the 29er.
    i also notice that if i try and stay seated during moderately rougher trails on the 26 i get bounced around a lot, whereas on the 29er just eats that stuff up.

    i do want to point out that the 29er will ALWAYS feel slower in acceleration affects, but in actuality the 29er is rolling faster if you are geared the same no matter what.


    note. i race and the 29er has always been faster no matter what the course and to me that is all that matters during the race. yes i have both a 26 ht, 26sus and a 29 gearie. unless my course is all rocky the 26 dually stays in the shed...

  12. #12
    29 inches and Pissed Off!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle
    not sure....good question. i am also not sure if once you go to 29er specs, you can compare apples to apples versus the 26 numbers or perhaps you are comparing my 29er versus what you have speced for yours?

    all I know is that I could not imagine my 29er speced any better, period. if i were to buy a custom 29er, i would even use Ninerbikes exact numbers after now having ridden it.
    ]
    You really can only compare a Phil Wood 26incher to a Phil Wood 29incher.
    Dan C.
    CaptainKana.com
    Mountain Biking.....Cheaper than a mistress.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Kana
    You really can only compare a Phil Wood 26incher to a Phil Wood 29incher.
    Dan C.
    correct!!....and equiped comparably to boot. the ONLY thing I feel comfortable admitting in the absence of me being able to ride 2 identical 26" and 29" bikes blindfolded with order randomized for at least 3 or 4 iterations is that as a fully rigid single speed, a 29er will be the better choice. For me, I say this because I am happy to trade any supposed disadvantage in accleration/quickness for the definite benefit of more comfort up front on the rigid fork cause of the bigger wheel....but that is where it ends for me in terms of any religious differences between the two and frankly, so long as I can ride one or the other I could not be happier. Fortunately, I am able to have both and the only thing missing in my stable now is a light geared hardtail......29 or 26 TBD. I also love my FS geared bike and am remodeling it as we speak.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Kana
    You really can only compare a Phil Wood 26incher to a Phil Wood 29incher.
    Dan C.
    Give me about three weeks and I'll be able to do that Phil on Phil 26/29 comparison for you.
    You're right it would be unfair to compare anything else to one,

  15. #15
    29 inches and Pissed Off!
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    Quote Originally Posted by neville
    Give me about three weeks and I'll be able to do that Phil on Phil 26/29 comparison for you.
    You're right it would be unfair to compare anything else to one,
    We do expect a full report. Not just pictures. Pictures are okay if they are in your local riding area and accompanied by written evaluations.

    Dan C.
    CaptainKana.com
    Mountain Biking.....Cheaper than a mistress.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by neville
    Give me about three weeks and I'll be able to do that Phil on Phil 26/29 comparison for you.
    You're right it would be unfair to compare anything else to one,
    hold on a second! are you saying you have a 26 Phil already and will also be getting a 29? that is simply not right!! how dare you show off like that!

  17. #17
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    !!

    FoShizz, you have a PM. Neville. What can i say? Can't wait to drool on the next round of pictures.
    "Welcome to my underground lair...."

  18. #18
    29 inches and Pissed Off!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FoShizzle
    hold on a second! are you saying you have a 26 Phil already and will also be getting a 29? that is simply not right!! how dare you show off like that!
    Today, wandering through Phil Wood, I got to drool on Neville's new Shiney(?) Black frame. I am sure Brent will wipe the breath marks off the frame before Interbike. I still want action shots from up north.
    Dan C.
    CaptainKana.com
    Mountain Biking.....Cheaper than a mistress.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Kana
    Today, wandering through Phil Wood, I got to drool on Neville's new Shiney(?) Black frame. I am sure Brent will wipe the breath marks off the frame before Interbike. I still want action shots from up north.
    Dan C.
    Dam! I haven't even seen it yet. Did it come out well.

  20. #20
    29 inches and Pissed Off!
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    Quote Originally Posted by neville
    Dam! I haven't even seen it yet. Did it come out well.
    I have a camera, maybe I'll get back there this week and take some shots of stuff. Maybe even the frame.
    Sorry for the hijack FoShizzle.

    Dan C.
    CaptainKana.com
    Mountain Biking.....Cheaper than a mistress.

  21. #21
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    hardly a hijack my friend....any time we are talking about Phil and the good work Brent does it cant possibly be a hijack.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Kana
    I have a camera, maybe I'll get back there this week and take some shots of stuff. Maybe even the frame.
    Sorry for the hijack FoShizzle.

    Dan C.
    I think Brent is keeping it a surprise for interbike. Don't go and get me in trouble.

  23. #23
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    Hmmmm.......

    Neville - Do tell, would this be a Steel 29er???

    I'm thinkin' I need to pay Brent a visit.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DMFT
    Neville - Do tell, would this be a Steel 29er???

    I'm thinkin' I need to pay Brent a visit.
    No, not steel.

    Very Different PISSOFF Ti

  25. #25
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    you know Brent is reading this wanting to unveil it but he cant!!! he must wait....

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