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  1. #1
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    Im gonna see what all this hype is about.

    *EDIT* Pics on post 23.

    Well im finally gonna try out this SS idea and see what you all are hyping about. My friend, who can ride up a hill faster than i can go down, has an extra SS rigid fork hes gonna lend to me on tuesday to test it out and see if i like it. So now i can see what he swears by, lol, anyways ill post pics of the bike and a little review of how i like it this week.
    Last edited by Jacobman; 09-23-2007 at 07:00 PM.

  2. #2
    Nightriding rules SuperModerator
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    good luck!

    (I wonder what an SS fork is though )

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by crisillo
    good luck!

    (I wonder what an SS fork is though )
    What, doesn't everybody have a couple extra SS rigid forks laying around their garage?

    Caz

    (I'm thinking jacobman ment ss rigid frame but just in case he did mean fork, I'll keep checking back to see if he post photos.)
    I am a Mountain Biker therefore I am late

  4. #4
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    I meant single speed bike with a rigid fork, as in no shock. Will have pics tomorrow around 8.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacobman
    I meant single speed bike with a rigid fork, as in no shock. Will have pics tomorrow around 8.
    I know what he you are talking about when you say SS fork. That means a rigid fork.
    Sure you can go downhill faster with a suspension fork but SS to me is all about having the bike squirt forward with every pedal stoke. A suspension fork,even the Rock Shox Reba 'locked out", makes the bike feel like mush when you stand.

  6. #6
    Nightriding rules SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    A suspension fork,even the Rock Shox Reba 'locked out", makes the bike feel like mush when you stand.
    matter of taste... I have a Revelation on mine...and have been thinking about putting my Pike on the SS

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by crisillo
    matter of taste... I have a Revelation on mine...and have been thinking about putting my Pike on the SS
    +1

    I ride a rigid SS right now. A susp. front fork won't rob you of that much forward momentum, unless it is set up way too soft or something like that. If I found a sweet deal on a marz z.1 I'd slap it on in a heartbeat.

    Also, a geared rigid hardtail will accelerate just as fast as a rigid singlespeed. There's so little difference in the two that any difference you'd feel would be in your head. It's the difference between hardtail and full sus. where you get the most energy robbing going on.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by keeb
    +1

    I ride a rigid SS right now. A susp. front fork won't rob you of that much forward momentum, unless it is set up way too soft or something like that. If I found a sweet deal on a marz z.1 I'd slap it on in a heartbeat.

    Also, a geared rigid hardtail will accelerate just as fast as a rigid singlespeed. There's so little difference in the two that any difference you'd feel would be in your head. It's the difference between hardtail and full sus. where you get the most energy robbing going on.

    -1

    I disagree. In my opinion any time you introduce bob into the system you hurt forward momentum. I feel a front shock creates the most bob with a FS bike. On my Canzo I can lock out the front and rear and I feel the most difference in locking out the front.

    Also with a rear derailluer you introduce more power robbing gear into the equation.

    A bike is powered by a very small engine. Most riders don't put out more than 150 watts continuous. Even if you loose 15 watts efficiency between a fork and your drivetrain that is 10 percent.

    But to each their own. There is a lot to be said about comfort too and your terrain may dictate some form of suspension. I run rigid up front and use a thudbuster in the back. That way I can pedal through the rough stuff and keep my weight back and use a light touch on the bars.

  9. #9
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    The drivetrain losses of your chain running over the jockey wheels on a derailleur is pretty small. Nowhere near 15 watts. I've seen the figure 3% quoted online, or around 5 watts.

    As for suspension, if running a front shock or full suspension allows you to run a smaller tire at higher pressure without compromising your control on the descents and rough stuff, you can actually come out ahead overall in terms of rolling resistance (an advantage on the flats and downhill, offset by losses through bobbing uphill).

    It's all tradeoffs. To say one is outright better than the other from a 'performance' standpoint denotes a blinkered, prejudiced view of the technologies. It all depends how you define performance.

    That being said, the simplicity of running single speed, and rigid on top of that has cut and dried advantages in terms of maintenance, as well as having a reductionist feel which appeals to, well, a lot of single speed, rigid and fixie riders.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jinker
    The drivetrain losses of your chain running over the jockey wheels on a derailleur is pretty small. Nowhere near 15 watts. I've seen the figure 3% quoted online, or around 5 watts.

    As for suspension, if running a front shock or full suspension allows you to run a smaller tire at higher pressure without compromising your control on the descents and rough stuff, you can actually come out ahead overall in terms of rolling resistance (an advantage on the flats and downhill, offset by losses through bobbing uphill).

    It's all tradeoffs. To say one is outright better than the other from a 'performance' standpoint denotes a blinkered, prejudiced view of the technologies. It all depends how you define performance.

    That being said, the simplicity of running single speed, and rigid on top of that has cut and dried advantages in terms of maintenance, as well as having a reductionist feel which appeals to, well, a lot of single speed, rigid and fixie riders.
    I never claimed jockey pully wheels counted for 15% loss. Go back and read my post. I speculated that "IF" you lose 15 watts between the drivetrain and fork it would be 10 percent. If you say 5 percent on the jockey pulleys then I would imagine a fork could easily cost you another 5 percent on standing climbs. Unless you can achieve total lockout, which you cannot do with a reba and many other forks have no lockout feature at all.

    And tires will make a difference too as you noted. I would run the same tires regardless of suspension, in fact you might find heavier, burlier, less efficient tires on a bike with suspension since the suspension allows you to go faster.

    I do concede that suspension will make you faster on downhills and through real bumpy areas but to me SS is about being efficient and fast on the climbs.

  11. #11
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    Hype? That's so, like, 1998, dude.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    I know what he you are talking about when you say SS fork. That means a rigid fork.
    Sure you can go downhill faster with a suspension fork but SS to me is all about having the bike squirt forward with every pedal stoke. A suspension fork,even the Rock Shox Reba 'locked out", makes the bike feel like mush when you stand.
    "Mush" depends on the damping. I like minimal damping. The rebound from the shock assists in the situation where you need to pull up on the bars for traction. Get in sync with the shock and it works for you.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by pacman
    "Mush" depends on the damping. I like minimal damping. The rebound from the shock assists in the situation where you need to pull up on the bars for traction. Get in sync with the shock and it works for you.
    I have set my Reba at full damping and no damping and very minimal damping. Doesn't matter even at lockout it moves when you get out of the saddle. The feel of a rigid front end just rocks in out of the saddle efforts IMO.

    Traction is very rarely an issue with me when I stand to climb. Even with a rigid fork you can increase rear wheel traction by pulling up on the bars in sketchy sections.

  14. #14
    Nightriding rules SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    I have set my Reba at full damping and no damping and very minimal damping. Doesn't matter even at lockout it moves when you get out of the saddle. The feel of a rigid front end just rocks in out of the saddle efforts IMO.
    have you checked the oil level on the MoCo damper on that Reba... my RVL and Pike with floodgate closed and fork locked don't move more than a couple of milimeters at most...

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by crisillo
    have you checked the oil level on the MoCo damper on that Reba... my RVL and Pike with floodgate closed and fork locked don't move more than a couple of milimeters at most...
    I did when I changed travel. Didn't seem to make any difference. Even those few mm of movement feel like mush compared to a rigid fork. The zokes XC lockout on my KHS has a much more positive lockout. Geeeeez, I am starting to sound like a zealot!!

  16. #16
    Nightriding rules SuperModerator
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    I did when I changed travel. Didn't seem to make any difference. Even those few mm of movement feel like mush compared to a rigid fork. The zokes XC lockout on my KHS has a much more positive lockout. Geeeeez, I am starting to sound like a zealot!!
    nah... no zealot... just very sure of what you like... nothing wrong with that

    in my case I don't mind a couple mms of movement, for the additional control on the descents...

  17. #17
    don't try this at home
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    -1
    But to each their own. There is a lot to be said about comfort too and your terrain may dictate some form of suspension.
    exactly. my hands get tired even now with front suspension and fat tires on most of the trails i ride. and in some ways it even helps with forward momentum even climbing. at slow speed there isn't much momentum and something like a small rock or rocks can stop you completely with a rigid fork, whereas when i went to a suspension fork, those same rocks would just get 'absorbed' and i could keep rolling through it.

    that being said, i also rode rigid for many, many years when that was the only option.
    will you rep me?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by moschika
    exactly. my hands get tired even now with front suspension and fat tires on most of the trails i ride. and in some ways it even helps with forward momentum even climbing. at slow speed there isn't much momentum and something like a small rock or rocks can stop you completely with a rigid fork, whereas when i went to a suspension fork, those same rocks would just get 'absorbed' and i could keep rolling through it.

    that being said, i also rode rigid for many, many years when that was the only option.

    What I would really like is a softride stem in a 70 to 100 MM version with a removeable faceplate. It is too bad they didn't keep up the development of the suspension stem and offer shorter sizes and removeable faceplates. It was a great product that was poorly marketed, much like their suspension beam. That is why they are out of biz.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    What I would really like is a softride stem in a 70 to 100 MM version with a removeable faceplate. It is too bad they didn't keep up the development of the suspension stem and offer shorter sizes and removeable faceplates. It was a great product that was poorly marketed, much like their suspension beam. That is why they are out of biz.

    NOT!!! Nothing like feeling like your stem just broke on every bump! I could not imagine how a 70 or 100mm version would feel.

  20. #20
    Shocks?, Pegs?... Lucky!
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    aaaaah.

    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    What I would really like is a softride stem in a 70 to 100 MM version with a removeable faceplate. It is too bad they didn't keep up the development of the suspension stem and offer shorter sizes and removeable faceplates. It was a great product that was poorly marketed, much like their suspension beam. That is why they are out of biz.
    What a Horrible idea, I'm glad they went the way of the dino's. My buddy has one on his townie for shits and giggles, and it scares me. God, those things were bloody dangerous.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by fritzaholic
    What a Horrible idea, I'm glad they went the way of the dino's. My buddy has one on his townie for shits and giggles, and it scares me. God, those things were bloody dangerous.

    I ran one for years and thought it was great. Had to learn how to ride it. Are you sure it wasn't the Girven stem you rode?

    Back in the day the world champion ran one on his Ritchey Bike.

    It is not for hucking or serious downhill but it rides really smooth and works great for cross country applications.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by richwolf
    I know what he you are talking about when you say SS fork. That means a rigid fork.
    Sure you can go downhill faster with a suspension fork but SS to me is all about having the bike squirt forward with every pedal stoke. A suspension fork,even the Rock Shox Reba 'locked out", makes the bike feel like mush when you stand.
    not enough people have tried a 1FG. Headshocks are the perfect SS solution. Too bad they stopped making a 26" version. damn 29er koolaid...
    My one says BRAP!

  23. #23
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    Alright well i finally got the bike and here are some pics.













    Im not very bike literate about parts and stuff but i believe most of these are pretty good, is this a deal for $300, i think it is but whats your opinion. I am doing this night race tonight at 10 with it which will be on the streets, then this week i will take it out to the dirt.

  24. #24
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    Is that a 26er? You won't even come close to experiencing the hype without adding 29 inch wheels to the equation!

  25. #25
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    Looks like a great deal for $300. Don't know about all the stickers on the frame but WTH it's an SS!

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