I have seen the light... Vassago convert - Page 2- Mtbr.com
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  1. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    An old Jabber monstercross would be rad indeed.

    FWIW, I wanted to put drop bars on a rigid mountain bike for a while. It was not worth it in the end because putting some narrow bars with comfy bar ends accomplished the same thing, for my purposes, and I didn't have a screw around with different brake levers, brakes, shifters, etc. The main reason I like drop bars is for multiple hand positions on roads (dirt or paved) for long rides. There are many multi-hand position bars out there that are not drop bars. Jones?

    If you want dirt drops, look into the Soma (fixed, not a Salsa product) Gator bar. Flared drops, but the bottom of the hooks are flat bar standard 22.2mm instead of road standard 23.8, so you can use mtn brakes, trigger or twist shifters, etc with minimal hassle.
    Great info! That's exactly why I need a lot,of research b/4 buying anything. I'm not sure I'd like bar end shifters but if I find a cheap 9 so set, it may be worth a try. But I'm thinking of some sort of Franken-bike with mountain shifters on the top of the bar. That way it's minimal cost to try.

    Know what drop bar levers work with BB7 disc brakes? I've read the Tektro RL520 or something like that works but....

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  2. #202
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    Tektro and Cane Creek make levers that work with "mountain" brakes. There are also some "road" mechanical disc brakes that with with road brake/ shift levers.

  3. #203
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    Can anyone tell me about their recent warranty experiences with Vassago? I recently discovered that I will need to persue that route.

  4. #204
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    I got my Jabberwocky fixed and Vassago added stealth dropper routing and a new paint job. Looks amazing!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails I have seen the light... Vassago convert-screenshot_20190205-105820_gallery.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-screenshot_20190205-105824_gallery.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-screenshot_20190205-105822_gallery.jpg  

    Last edited by mack_turtle; 02-06-2019 at 11:11 AM.

  5. #205
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    Back to the Light!

    Just wanted to remind everyone of how great these bike are! My 2017 JaberWocky is the most versatile bike that I have ever owned. I regularly swap it back and forth from SS to geared depending on what I am doing with it at the time. Sometimes I even choose between a 2.4 tire or 3.0... Go enjoy your Vassago!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails I have seen the light... Vassago convert-20170904_110003.jpg  


  6. #206
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    My Vassago Optimus TI ...Super Sport model

    Quote Originally Posted by kustomz View Post
    Just wanted to remind everyone of how great these bike are! My 2017 JaberWocky is the most versatile bike that I have ever owned. I regularly swap it back and forth from SS to geared depending on what I am doing with it at the time. Sometimes I even choose between a 2.4 tire or 3.0... Go enjoy your Vassago!
    My Optimus SS 29+boost frame using carbon 27.5+Atomic wheels with 3.0 F/R. love it to death!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0053.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0054.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0062.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0101.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0107.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0157.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0180.jpg  

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-img_0181.jpg  


  7. #207
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    Optical illusion or are those some long ass cables?
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  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    I got my Jabberwocky fixed and Vassago added stealth dropper routing and a new paint job. Looks amazing!
    That looks super slick! I like it a lot.
    Also pretty jealous of the dropper cable port. Wonder if I could take my VerHauen in and get that done.
    Donít modify the trail to match your skills, modify your skills to match the trails.

  9. #209
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    Long ass cables. I here ya.
    They came of an XL frame. Iíve shortened the shift cable/wire, and I only need to shorten the rear brake hose now. Iíve been putting it off though because I am selling the XL frame, and could use the cash to get new brakes. Those Guide Rís are loud. Iím leaning towards getting new instead of shortening those. Iíll sell those also...get something nice! Hope are on my top choice list. XTR...or even just the XT. Maybe I need to check out some of the other companies out there.

  10. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    I got my Jabberwocky fixed and Vassago added stealth dropper routing and a new paint job. Looks amazing!
    hell yes it does!
    Yeah I only carry cans cause I'm a weight weenie.

  11. #211
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    Just convert my Verhauen to 29x2.6

    Love this bike.

    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-29with2-6andfork.jpg

    Also runs 29x3.0 rigid
    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-29plus.jpg

    and with regular 29
    I have seen the light... Vassago convert-29ss.jpg
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  12. #212
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    If anyone is looking to sell a large Jabber or VerHauen let me know. Looking for frame mainly, but would take complete bike if price is right. Preferably a '17 or '18.

  13. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    Just convert my Verhauen to 29x2.6

    Love this bike.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Also runs 29x3.0 rigid
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    and with regular 29
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    is that a first or 2nd gen? Considering picking up a first gen frame and wonder about rear tire clearance...

  14. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    is that a first or 2nd gen? Considering picking up a first gen frame and wonder about rear tire clearance...
    This is a 29 Plus verhauen. There is metal plate at the chainstay to provide extra clearance for the 29+ tires and the chainring. The normal version was just tubing. You can see it clearly in the photos.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    is that a first or 2nd gen? Considering picking up a first gen frame and wonder about rear tire clearance...
    I believe my Verhauen is the same as Joes, but black. It fits Ďalmost allí 29+ tires. Sadly itís not a true Ďplus bikeí.

    I can fit any 29x3.0, but the sliders have to be in the Ďlong-halfí. A 3.0 will rub that fancy plate if slammed. I currently have a29x2.8 Terrene McFly on an i40 rim- measures exactly 2.8 wide at the knobs; that fits with the sliders slammed, but itís tight. I could probably get a little rub under the right circumstances. Maybe.
    On a geared setup thatís probably not a big deal- just put it where it doesnít rub but on an SS it meant I could run certain ratios with a 3.0

    34x20 is my favorite ďall-aroundĒ ratio. It fits with the sliders full-stop forward, but you have to have a 2.8 or narrower tire.
    Still a great bike, IMO and works well for the desert trails I ride , and the way I do it.

    Iíve heard second-hand that the boost version has a little more clearance and will fit most, maybe all 3.0s. Mine is a 142.
    Donít modify the trail to match your skills, modify your skills to match the trails.

  16. #216
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    mine is 135/142 and currently running 135 QR drop outs. I don't worry about CS length much. I just want to keep it in good spot to run multiple cogs. Run 34 chainring with 20,19,18 cogs. Most of the time I run the 19t. Now that I have started running 2.6 my plan is keep the 19t on that, but on my 2.3's put a 18t cog for a more racy setup. Since both fit under my fork I can swap wheels to change up the bike feel.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  17. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    mine is 135/142 and currently running 135 QR drop outs. I don't worry about CS length much. I just want to keep it in good spot to run multiple cogs. Run 34 chainring with 20,19,18 cogs. Most of the time I run the 19t. Now that I have started running 2.6 my plan is keep the 19t on that, but on my 2.3's put a 18t cog for a more racy setup. Since both fit under my fork I can swap wheels to change up the bike feel.
    Thanks! thinking 2.6 would be perfect for the rear.

  18. #218
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    I have a 2010 Jabberwocky, single speed. In the last few rides, my rear wheel has slipped in the horizontal dropouts, "tilting" to the left (meaning the tire hits my non-driveside chain stay). I adjusted the chain tensioners and tightened everything but it has still slipped.

    I use Halo hex bolts for skewers. I remember reading cautionary posts when I first got my bike, recommending not to tighten the hell out of them to prevent anything from breaking.

    I brought it to a shop and the mechanic tried putting a washer on the skewer, thinking the Halo skewers weren't biting well-enough into the dropouts. That helped a little, but after a 1.5 hour ride, my tire was sitting a bit crooked (though less so than before).

    I have been nervous about tightening the Halo skewers too much because I recall reading that too much force could cause them to break. The mechanic at the shop told me I should tighten them as much as I can.

    So, all of the introduction aside, I came to ask:

    What bolt/skewers are you all using on your Jabberwocky builds?

  19. #219
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    I had a hex bolt skewer like that and stripped the nut on one.

    Most people seem to like good Shimano skewers and Salsa. DT Swiss perhaps?

    Are the chain tension adjusters coming loose? Can you lock those down better so they don't move?

    What hub is this? Can it be converted to 135x10 thru- bolt or something more secure? I had Stan's hub with a Hadley 10mm thru-bolt for a long time, then bought a Hadley hub with the same setup before moving to 142x12 when I got a new frame.

  20. #220
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    Do you have a tug nut or similar tensioner installed?

    I had an On-One frame with horizontal track-end dropouts and the wheel would 100% not stay in place without one. I actually put one on both the drive and non-drive side.



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    Donít modify the trail to match your skills, modify your skills to match the trails.

  21. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Impetus View Post
    Do you have a tug nut or similar tensioner installed?

    I had an On-One frame with horizontal track-end dropouts and the wheel would 100% not stay in place without one. I actually put one on both the drive and non-drive side.



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    I'm honestly surprised that you've needed to resort to the tuggnut even with a threaded axle and nut. I've only ever needed them with a QR, even shimano skewers. I do see the hood on the dropout would inhibit using a crescent wrench potentially. Do you use a torque wrench or long handled 1/4" socket wrench to tighten the nuts?
    I don't know why,... it's just MUSS easier to pedal than the other ones.

  22. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbhammercycle View Post
    I'm honestly surprised that you've needed to resort to the tuggnut even with a threaded axle and nut. I've only ever needed them with a QR, even shimano skewers. I do see the hood on the dropout would inhibit using a crescent wrench potentially. Do you use a torque wrench or long handled 1/4" socket wrench to tighten the nuts?
    I borrowed this pic from the internet to show what a tuggnut is, to illustrate its function. I was using a 135 QR.


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  23. #223
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    gotcha.

    One nice thing about the Surly tuggnuts is that they come with an adapter piece for the QR skewer as the main body fits a 10mm threaded axle. There are other options, MKS makes a nice tuggnut too.
    I don't know why,... it's just MUSS easier to pedal than the other ones.

  24. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    I had a hex bolt skewer like that and stripped the nut on one.

    Most people seem to like good Shimano skewers and Salsa. DT Swiss perhaps?

    Are the chain tension adjusters coming loose? Can you lock those down better so they don't move?

    What hub is this? Can it be converted to 135x10 thru- bolt or something more secure? I had Stan's hub with a Hadley 10mm thru-bolt for a long time, then bought a Hadley hub with the same setup before moving to 142x12 when I got a new frame.
    As far as I can tell, the tensioners are not moving but I haven't done any scientific tests to make sure. The Halo skewer bolts are not noticeably looser when I go to adjust the wheel back into position.

    The hub is a Stan's 3.30 hub that came with a Flow wheel set. I'm not sure how it could be modified.


    Quote Originally Posted by Impetus View Post
    Do you have a tug nut or similar tensioner installed?

    I had an On-One frame with horizontal track-end dropouts and the wheel would 100% not stay in place without one. I actually put one on both the drive and non-drive side.
    [Photo of tugnut]
    I'm using the tensioners that came with the frame (see pic below). You can see the washer that the mechanic added.



    The mechanic at the shop tried throwing on a Surly Tugnut but she was having trouble figuring out how it would offer an improvement.

  25. #225
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    Unfortunately, your pic seems to be missing.

    That aside, the axle is definitely moving, if the drive side isnít moving forward, the non drive side is moving backward.
    Personally, put some tape on both dropouts, mark the position of the axle and go ride. See what moves. At least youíll know which side of the bike to address.
    Donít modify the trail to match your skills, modify your skills to match the trails.

  26. #226
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    Get some 135x10 endcaps for that hub and buy a Hadley 10mm bolt from Balle racing.

    I think you could do it with these: https://www.notubes.com/10x135-thru-...-disc-rear-hub

    https://www.balleracing.com/hadley-r...t-135mm-x-10mm

    Or this https://www.jensonusa.com/DT-Swiss-R...-Quick-Release

  27. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by Impetus View Post
    Unfortunately, your pic seems to be missing.

    That aside, the axle is definitely moving, if the drive side isnít moving forward, the non drive side is moving backward.
    Personally, put some tape on both dropouts, mark the position of the axle and go ride. See what moves. At least youíll know which side of the bike to address.
    Strange. It was appearing at first. Here's the URL https://i.imgur.com/t5u0HwT.jpg

    Quote Originally Posted by mack_turtle View Post
    Get some 135x10 endcaps for that hub and buy a Hadley 10mm bolt from Balle racing.

    I think you could do it with these: https://www.notubes.com/10x135-thru-...-disc-rear-hub

    https://www.balleracing.com/hadley-r...t-135mm-x-10mm

    Or this https://www.jensonusa.com/DT-Swiss-R...-Quick-Release
    I had no idea this was possible. Thanks. You think this would solve the problem?

  28. #228
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    Not sure it will solve the problem, but you can torque those big 10mm axles pretty hard and get a ton of bite on the dropout slots.

    When you use the adjusters on your frame, do they have some sort of locknut? I would rig a nylock nut on there if not, adjust the axle to just where you want it, then lock the bolts in place to make sure they are not wiggling loose while you ride. That will not prevent one side of the axle from slipping back, but it will eliminate the possibility of either side slipping forward.

  29. #229
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    OID, I wonder if the set screw flexes a bit and the rear axle on teh drive side is able to jump slightly above or below the set screw moving the axle forward when you crank down. Or is there a plate at the end of the set screw to keep the axle from moving forward? I'm not finding good pics online that show that dropout without a wheel in the frame.

    I've not used this type of dropout adjustment, but I suspect it might be why the newer frames use Paragon sliders.
    I don't know why,... it's just MUSS easier to pedal than the other ones.

  30. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by one incredible donkey View Post

    What bolt/skewers are you all using on your Jabberwocky builds?
    i used to have an older jabber...maybe the 2nd interation i believe...i used an old XT quick release and it worked perfectly. never a problem. i'm over 200lbs too.

    i have the latest jabber now. the slider bolts they come with are complete shit. swap to nice PMW ti bolts immediately.
    i will not yield to DH traffic.

  31. #231
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    I agree, the original bolts for the Jabber sliders sucked. I bought some nice stainless steel bolts at Ace for a few bucks to replace them. I think they took a big old 8mm allen too.

  32. #232
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    I'm in the tugnut and shimano skewer crowd. Rode a similar bike for years without issue.

  33. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by waltaz View Post
    Hi all...just noticing this thread, so Iíll weigh in. Longtime MTBR member, but havenít posted much in recent years. Just got a new Optimus Ti 29+, so totally restoked, and have been getting re-engaged here.

    Some background:
    - Iíve been SSíing since ~2005, on Kona Unit 29ís (cracked two), Niner SIR9ís (cracked three), and two Optimus Tiís (ďfirst genĒ from 2013, and the new OpTi)
    - I do endurance XC riding, including 12/24 hour solo stuff. Also do moderate tech, but no crazy shit. I ride it all on my SS.

    With regard to the original OpTi being a ďdeath trapĒ (or whatever was referenced), Iíve got thousands and thousands of miles on mine, including lots of sketch riding/descending, and never thought that. Yes, itís got a 71-degree HA, but itís a racy, XC geometry, and you just need to be prepared to deal with whatever the terrain presents. NBD; itís riding.

    The new OpTi has true ďtrailĒ geometry, with a 68.5-degree HA and shorter chainstays, and itís stable and fun as fvck. Iíve got a Fox 34 120 mm fork on it, and it can do it all. I actively switch between the three travel positions (open, trail, locked) constantly, depending on what is in front of me.

    My biggest question right now is the wheels and tires, since Iím new to 29+. Given my orientation (endurance XC), Iíve favored lighter tires with less rolling resistance. Iíve used Flow EXís for rims, because I hammer my wheels, and donít want issues (and Iíve broken Arches). On my first OpTi, after a ton of real-world experience and experimenting on the harsh terrain of AZ, I settled on Ikonís front and rear - 2.35 fr/2.20 r, and that proved to be the winning combo for me. On my new 29+ OpTi, I started with WTB Ranger 3.0ís on Flow MK3ís (i29mm), which was pushing it for that width on those rims. So I switched to Rekon 2.6ís, which are comfy, but draggy for my application. I will be going to an Ardent 2.4 in front and an Ikon 2.35 in back on the Flows, for races and long, ďdirt roadieĒ rides, but, and here is where it gets good for the new OpTi, I am building up a true ďplusĒ wheelset with sunRingle Duroc 40ís (i36mm) laced to I9ís, with an SS-specific rear. I plan on starting with the Ranger 3.0ís on that, and will see how it goes. I chose the Rangers over Bonti XR2ís (formerly Chupacabraís) because they perform similarly and are 1/3 the cost.

    Lastly, re Vassago and Tom, Tom bought out the brand, which had gone out of business, back in late-2012/early 2013. He is one guy, who was holding down another job, at the time, while he got Vassago retooled and going. He has since quit that job an is dedicated to Vassago. That said, he is one guy, and, as ARandomBiker said above in this thread, he rides a lot, races, attends races and sets up shop to support Vassago riders and wave the flag. He is very passionate and involved, and also recently got married. Did I also mention that he is one guy? Yes, the website can be wonky and/or out of date, and Tom can be slow to reply sometimes, but you just need to stay with it. ďBut itís a businessĒ, you say, and ďYou canít run a business like thatĒ. Well, whatever; he makes it work. Just be patient, and youíll get great bikes and great support. Make sure to hit him up via e-mail ([email protected]om) and Facebook (Tom Vassago), and there is also a Facebook page for the Vassago Legion. And stay on him, as he may miss it or forget about it because...see above, and did I mention heís one guy.

    Jeezus, this got LONG! How bout some pics...Iíll post some next.


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    Not sure where to post this ? Can you compare the Optimus Ti to the new Pivot Les your on now ? I'm on an older Sir 9 and ready for something little more trail oriented with newer geometry. Which bike are you faster overall on ? Is one more fun than the other ? How has the carbon bike been on the long races that you do ?

    Thanks for your input

  34. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by ericswab View Post
    Not sure where to post this ? Can you compare the Optimus Ti to the new Pivot Les your on now ? I'm on an older Sir 9 and ready for something little more trail oriented with newer geometry. Which bike are you faster overall on ? Is one more fun than the other ? How has the carbon bike been on the long races that you do ?

    Thanks for your input
    Good questions. I love the LES, and have two of them: my new SS, and the same 2017 LES frame set up with gears. I love the ride and geometry, and it feels light and fast. You will definitely dig the geometry vs. your current SIR 9.

    I'm faster on my LES, as it's lighter, and just feels faster and more precise. I would say they are equally fun, with the added bonus for the Optimus that you can run a plus setup, if you want. The Optimus set up with 3.0 tires is ridiculously fun and comfortable. I had a wheelset for that, but rarely ran it, so it didn't end up being important to me. But if you want to run plus, Optimus is your choice.

    I've done a few long rides and races on the LES, and just did a 24 hour solo race at Enchanted Forest, in NM. A very rocky course, and I got beat up pretty good on the carbon hardtail. I did the same race and course last year on the Optimus, and don't recall getting beat up as bad. That said, I felt, as did others, that the course was rockier this year. All in all, I was much faster this year on the LES (two hours faster for the same number of laps, plus another lap this year), but I'd say the LES was not the best-suited for that course. The Optimus would have been a more compliant ride, but a bit heavier. Tradeoffs...

    Hope this helps!
    Ride more; post less...

  35. #235
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    Thanks for your response, your posts are what got me thinking about the optimus in the first place. Anytime I've tried a carbon hard tail I've thought the same thing, "gee this is fast, but it beats you up more" plus I worry about breaking it.

    I don't think plus tires are a big deal to me, maybe the mid-fat 2.6 stuff for the winter. My concern was that this may be a lateral move from the Sir, but I'm convinced it won't be. I tried a "new" Sir 9, it descended better, but it just felt heavy and slow overall.

    It definitely helps, Thanks!

  36. #236
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    5,743
    Quote Originally Posted by ericswab View Post
    Thanks for your response, your posts are what got me thinking about the optimus in the first place. Anytime I've tried a carbon hard tail I've thought the same thing, "gee this is fast, but it beats you up more" plus I worry about breaking it.

    I don't think plus tires are a big deal to me, maybe the mid-fat 2.6 stuff for the winter. My concern was that this may be a lateral move from the Sir, but I'm convinced it won't be. I tried a "new" Sir 9, it descended better, but it just felt heavy and slow overall.

    It definitely helps, Thanks!
    No problem! An Optimus Ti or a LES would be a big improvement over the SIR.


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