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  1. #1
    you go ahead
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    Full Suspension SS

    Anyone do this?

    Pics?

    thanks
    rustyb

  2. #2
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    too hard. Chain length changes with suspension travel. Could do it with a spring tensioner but, SS is about simplicity.

    - Joel
    Cycling is Serious Business.

  3. #3
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    Yeah my initial intention was to build an SS from an old gearie frame. But there were complications and budgets (to put it mildly ), so I thought about SSing my NRS, just for some fun.

    I'd be using a gusset kit and singleator I think... I'm not to sure about the idea though.

  4. #4
    brother on a mission
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    There are a couple of old threads about full suspension single speeds. Most of them have the URT design (old Kleins I think). There is also a guy on the NEMBA forums that has his sugar set up as a single speed. If you want to, there is no reason not to try it. You could always use something like the discos to keep the chain from jumping off. I built my own with old 24 tooth sprockets.

  5. #5
    Let me ask my wife
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    ... and if we just ...

    You'll need a Melvin from Paul Components or a Rohloff Chain Tensioner to SS an NRS. My friend had success with it. Good luck and post a pic when your done.
    “Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of riding a bike.” John F. Kennedy

  6. #6
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    Been riding this SS Spider well over a year, no problems, use a Melvin, not a Singulator, you need the chain wrap the Melvin supplies. Bike now has Fox suspenders front and rear.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #7
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    An NRS would make a good FS/SS, but you'll need a good chain tensioner. The early NRS had ~12mm of chain growth, which is probably more than a Singulator can handle, so a 2-pulley tensioner is recomended (Paul's Melvin, Rohloff, old derailleur).

    I've been riding a sweet-spot URT FS/SS fo overr a year, works great. URT's allow you to go tensionerless, but it's best to use a FS frame that sprints well, which the low pivot URTs don't. However, any FS frame that sprints well (like the NRS) works fine with a tensioner.

    If you search this site, you'll find pictures of various sweetspots (Ibis, Shwinn, Catamount), Trek-Y and old high pivots, K2/Proflexes, Klein Mantras, Turners, Santa Cruz, Intense, softails etc... that have been successfully SS'ed - including an NRS.

    Cheers,

    Tom
    Last edited by itsdoable; 06-17-2005 at 07:31 AM.

  8. #8
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    heh. Just above this post was my Franken-singlespeed thread from last night. Here is Trek's pre-Y bike full suspension frame. The year of this frame they used a Risse airshock, though previous years it had rubber donuts and was universally disliked.

    I used a real derailleur for a tensioner due to the amount of take-up I needed. When the shock is fully compressed the derailleur is close to being stretched to its max. I may never bottom out the shock, but I'd rather have the buffer than have the chain be the limiting factor.

    For simplicity/looks sake it sure would be nice not to have the derailleur, but so-far so-good and its a lot plusher than a rigid frame with big tires.


  9. #9
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    fun stuff

    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBearings
    Anyone do this?

    Pics?

    thanks
    rustyb
    Quick answer, Yes. Search old threads for pictures. Basically I took at GT I-drive and removed the link that rotated the bottom bracket shell when the suspension was active.

    With that out the bike was then a full suspension bike (URT) with an EBB!
    No tensioner needed. Learned about the tremendous forces on the drive train parts.
    Final solution was to counter-sink bolts to provide locking for the EBB.

    I rode it until the seat tube cracked one day.

  10. #10
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    Kona makes the "A", a 3.5" singlespeed full suspension frame.
    There is also talk of a Cowan dually FS frame for next year.

    Cheers,
    Joe.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoSS
    You'll need a Melvin from Paul Components or a Rohloff Chain Tensioner to SS an NRS. My friend had success with it. Good luck and post a pic when your done.
    Old derailleurs work fine. No need to buy something new and more costly.
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  12. #12
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  13. #13
    gentle like
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    Wasn't the Catamount frame a URT, and ss-able?

    I think that Cambria was clearing them out cheap cheap cheap a few weeks ago.

  14. #14
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    These double pulley tensioners are really expensive

    Would an ENO hub work with the NRS?
    I suppose it won't, but if it does, I was thinking about lacing it into my rear wheel.
    Or else I guess I'll have to go with the Gusset Kit and Melvin Tensioner.

    Thanks for all of the responses

  15. #15
    brother on a mission
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBearings
    These double pulley tensioners are really expensive

    Would an ENO hub work with the NRS?
    I suppose it won't, but if it does, I was thinking about lacing it into my rear wheel.
    Or else I guess I'll have to go with the Gusset Kit and Melvin Tensioner.

    Thanks for all of the responses
    I do not think the Eno will work because you need to change the chain tension while you are riding.

    If you are worried about the cost of the conversion, you can save some money in a couple of places.

    1. Use an old derailleur like shiggy suggests. That Melvin looks an awful lot like a short cage road derailleur.

    2.Ditch the gusset kit. Use old cassette spacers or some PVC pipe for the rear hub. You can even paint the PVC pipe if you want it to look nicer.

    Be sure to post pictures of what you settle on. Happy building.

    GF

  16. #16
    ballbuster
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    You can do it...

    Quote Originally Posted by tomacropod
    too hard. Chain length changes with suspension travel. Could do it with a spring tensioner but, SS is about simplicity.

    - Joel
    but yeah, you need a tensioner that lets the chain grow. An old derailleur (short cage road is best) fixed in place with a short scrap of cable (with ball end in the barrel adjuster) works great. The downside of this rig is that your chain will still wanna hop off the front chainring unless you find some way of controlling it there. Maybe with a ring in the middle position, a bash guard in the outer ring position, and one of those seat tube mounted chain keepers.

    Then again, why a fully?

    I ride a rigid SS, and I can say it beats the living tar out of my body, so I can understand that arguement, but it may just eat into your momentum enough to make it kinda suck. Makes it kinda suck when you get out of the saddle to hammer.

  17. #17
    ballbuster
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    Nope

    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBearings
    These double pulley tensioners are really expensive

    Would an ENO hub work with the NRS?
    I suppose it won't, but if it does, I was thinking about lacing it into my rear wheel.
    Or else I guess I'll have to go with the Gusset Kit and Melvin Tensioner.

    Thanks for all of the responses
    The problem is that as the suspension moves, the distance between the BB and the rear axle changes. THat is, the chain length will need to grow during as you hit bumps. If your chain was tight with no tensioner, as soon as you hit a bump, your chain would snap.

    Dude, just use an old derailleur. Who wants to experiment with a $60 part when the old derailleur works just fine. If you decide you like it, then go bling.

  18. #18
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    forced ss

    Carnage many miles out forced this SS conversion. Thanks to the pivot being around the BB I had a non-planned SS with no chain tension issues due to rear suspension movement..


  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot
    The problem is that as the suspension moves, the distance between the BB and the rear axle changes. THat is, the chain length will need to grow during as you hit bumps. If your chain was tight with no tensioner, as soon as you hit a bump, your chain would snap.

    Dude, just use an old derailleur. Who wants to experiment with a $60 part when the old derailleur works just fine. If you decide you like it, then go bling.
    point taken

    Greenfix, where do I buy/find casset spacers?

    I'll do anything to save the $$.

    Thanks again for all the input, it's been really helpful...

    rustyb

  20. #20
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    There are a few frames...

    I am currently riding a Lenzsport and used to ride a Schwinn Homegrown FS. Some other frames that you can get away without a tensioner are the Klein Mantras, Trek Y-frames, Fisher Joshuas, some of the Coves with concentric BB pivots, Catamounts and some others I can't think about right now.

  21. #21
    Uncle
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    How did your Homegrown work out as a SS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockin
    I am currently riding a Lenzsport and used to ride a Schwinn Homegrown FS. Some other frames that you can get away without a tensioner are the Klein Mantras, Trek Y-frames, Fisher Joshuas, some of the Coves with concentric BB pivots, Catamounts and some others I can't think about right now.
    I've got a Homegrown frame -- '97 I think, with a Fox Alps shock. Can't find a local buyer for it (not interested in shipping it), so I'm thinkin' SS. Were you pogoin' everywhere, or were you able to make it somewhat efficient?

  22. #22
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    It was a great bike. Had the back setup pretty stiff. The key to that style of URT with the high pivot is that when you are climbing you need to shift your weight forward whether you are standing or seated. This makes the rear suspension inactive and will help keep you from bobbing.

  23. #23
    Uncle
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    That's convinient, because if it's a single speed...

    I'll be standing every climb anyway -- hard to build stamina when one rides hills only once a week, not to mention my incredibly fat diet.

    Yeah, no issues moving forward here

    Glad to know this frame's going to get some use.
    Thanks for the feedback.

  24. #24
    brother on a mission
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    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBearings
    point taken

    Greenfix, where do I buy/find casset spacers?

    I'll do anything to save the $$.

    Thanks again for all the input, it's been really helpful...

    rustyb
    I just saw your post.

    I got my spacers from an old casette. I had to drill the head off the rivets to get the cassette apart, but some cassettes are held together by small bolts. It took two cassettes worth of spacres to space out my 7 speed freehub.

    Others have used 1-1/4" schedule 40 PVC pipe. I would imagine that you want ot be sure that the pipe is cut straight.

    If you have a good LBS, they may be able to hook you up with some old spacers or cassettes. New individual spacers can be a bit expensive. I would send you some, but all of mine are in use.



    I pulled this from the FAQ section:

    1 1/4" Schedule 40 white PVC pipe from any hardware, then cut two thicker spacers to the proper length (to achieve good chainline), sandwiching the BMX cog in between. Save your cassette lock ring, though; you'll need it to hold the spacers together. See the links in the "How do I convert my geared bike to single speed?" section for complete details on how to convert the rear wheel.

  25. #25
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    Wow, that is a beautiful spider, I just love the way it looks as a singlespeed. Do you find that the VPPs tendency to stiffen the rear suspension when out of the saddle makes it a good match for a single speed drive train?

    I might have to try that when I get my new bike.

    Can you still rund disc brakes when you convert to single speed? I notice you are using V-brakes.


    Quote Originally Posted by n10'sGuy
    Been riding this SS Spider well over a year, no problems, use a Melvin, not a Singulator, you need the chain wrap the Melvin supplies. Bike now has Fox suspenders front and rear.
    Last edited by GFWD; 06-20-2005 at 01:48 PM.

  26. #26
    what a joke
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    A friend of mine converted his Jekyl to a single speed using spacers out of old cassettes and and an xt derailer. He runs the chain very short to keep it tight. He claims its the best thing he has ever done as the bike is always ready to go with no shifting problems. I will try to find a photo of it.
    blah blah blah

  27. #27
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    GFWD - Do you find that the VPPs tendency to stiffen the rear suspension when out of the saddle makes it a good match for a single speed drive train?

    Absolutely, It climbs amazing, much better than my hard tail SS, the VPP technology works great as a SS.


    GFWD - Can you still rund disc brakes when you convert to single speed? I notice you are using V-brakes.

    You'd have find the right disc brake SS rear hub, but it would work fine.

  28. #28
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    my tmx in ss mode. tried it briefly for kicks.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe - Kona
    There is also talk of a Cowan dually FS frame for next year.
    This is what i'm hanging out for. I'm not deciding on a bike till the frame comes out, and if it doesn't i'm buying a Kona A.

  30. #30
    DOH!
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    Quote Originally Posted by xy9ine
    my tmx in ss mode. tried it briefly for kicks.
    Mmmmm.....polished steel goodness. Ditch the WB fork in favor of an Avy (to match the rear) and you'll be burning people retinas out in the lift line. Nice!

    ...BTW, holy slack seat angle Batman! I thought my Mountain Cycle 9.5 was bad!

  31. #31
    ballbuster
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    I got mine....

    Quote Originally Posted by RustyBearings
    point taken

    Greenfix, where do I buy/find casset spacers?

    I'll do anything to save the $$.

    Thanks again for all the input, it's been really helpful...

    rustyb
    from the LBS wrench. I told him what I wanted to do, and could he do me a favor and save 2 cruddy worn out cassettes. He hooked me up. I took them home, drilled the rivets on one and removed the tiny allen bolts on the other. You get 4 spacers per cassette, IIRC. As a bonus, you get the cogs (prolly worn, but usable) to switch around to figure out what gear ratio you like on your trails.

  32. #32
    but Diggin the 1 x 14 too
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    Melvin tensioner...

    [QUOTE=GFWD]Wow, that is a beautiful spider, I just love the way it looks as a singlespeed. Do you find that the VPPs tendency to stiffen the rear suspension when out of the saddle makes it a good match for a single speed drive train?

    ...just curious - does the Melvin Tensioner provide some additional benefit when converting a FS bike to SS vs. using an old derailleur or Singleator style tensioner?
    ...giving that the chain length Changes with MOST FS designs, i understand the need for having a longer chain installed so the rear triangle can move independent of the frame, SO, would an old derailleur or Singleator style tensioner perform the same exact function as the Melvin Tensioner?
    Last edited by 2gears=1speed; 07-05-2005 at 03:27 PM.

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