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  1. #1
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    FIXED gear offroad chainring slippage issues

    OK, I have been on (2) rides offraod on my Il Pompino.
    both have resulted in the chainring bolts coming loose, or noticeable movement of the CR itself.

    I use the right length bolts, with blue loctite, and a 5mm hex and CR bolt tool to tighten.

    anybody else have this issue, or am i just really lucky?

    what setups are people using for their rides.

    (KMC ZX610 36T Blackspire CR, FSA V-Drive Extreme 104bcd 175mm, 18T Surly cog on 135mm Surly flip-flop)
    Last edited by mrsalty; 09-20-2007 at 12:21 PM.

  2. #2
    I am the owl
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    Duuuuuuuuuuuuuude, not again!
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  3. #3
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    yeah, tell me about it.

    you have something to contribute, or are you just feeling the need to add a useless post?

  4. #4
    I am the owl
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsalty
    yeah, tell me about it.

    you have something to contribute, or are you just feeling the need to add a useless post?
    Yeah, I've contributed plenty in the other thread. Go to a shop, you obviously need expert advise because you can't solve this on your own.

    "Useless" is creating another thread in a second forum where you are going to be asked the same questions and given the same advise.
    SingleSpeedOutlaw .com
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by riderx
    Yeah, I've contributed plenty in the other thread. Go to a shop, you obviously need expert advise because you can't solve this on your own.

    "Useless" is creating another thread in a second forum where you are going to be asked the same questions and given the same advise.
    I cannot ask for other peoples setup specifications, because you deemed it won't matter?

    no, useless is saying "we've done all we could".
    who voted you the bike forum spokesman exactly?
    and why do you think you are the only person on the board with knowledge and info of the subject matter?

    how do you know what advice I would get asking it in another forum?
    clearly there are more FG offroad riders present in this venue.
    I asked the folks who seem to ride mostly on the road (Bike Forum).
    now I am trying what I perceive to be a different demographic, ie: MTB centric people.
    just because you appointed yourself Internet forum police, does not mean that it matters to anybody else.

    if you have a problem with me asking this question in this forum, then DON"T RESPOND.
    FFS, go find a dog to kick and move on.

  6. #6
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    Boo Hoo, don't get upset because you can't properly install a chainring.

    I posted here because your initial post in this forum glossed over your trials and tribulations you posted over on BikeForums. If you are looking for a solution to your problem it's best to give the down and dirty details.

    I'll sit back now and enjoy the show.
    SingleSpeedOutlaw .com
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  7. #7
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    bad crank / bad chainring

    Some combos of cranks and chainrings just dont play well together.

    You want a sung fit - or at least more snug than you currently have. In addition to it being snug you also want a combo that's round so there is less variation in chain tension.

    Try another chainring, try another crank. Given your current position there's not much else to try.

  8. #8
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    chain line? chain tension?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by riderx
    Boo Hoo, don't get upset because you can't properly install a chainring.

    I posted here because your initial post in this forum glossed over your trials and tribulations you posted over on BikeForums. If you are looking for a solution to your problem it's best to give the down and dirty details.

    I'll sit back now and enjoy the show.
    gee, that must be it. chainring bolt challenged!

    trails and tribulations? melodramatic much?

    you are all over the map here.
    either be sober when you post, or know when to refill the meds.
    sheesh
    best of luck.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by happygofun
    Some combos of cranks and chainrings just dont play well together.

    You want a sung fit - or at least more snug than you currently have. In addition to it being snug you also want a combo that's round so there is less variation in chain tension.

    Try another chainring, try another crank. Given your current position there's not much else to try.
    I think that I have always had a bit of play on my SS setup, but the chainring just settles once it slips the first time.
    with no backpressure, it basically becomes a non issue.

    my opinion (at this point) is that any slack is not well tolerated by a drivetrain that sees dramatic loading in both directions.

    when I bought the bike, it was originally set up as a regular cyclocross ride (drops, canti's, and a set of profile designs carbon cranks 110bcd with a 42t sugino cr).
    I had a problem with the crank spider coming loose from the skid stop torque.
    I ended up having to loc tite the spider lockring to keep the ring from slipping on skid stops.

    that combined with the fact that I ride very rock terrain, necessitated a crank change.
    I took the V-Drive extreme set off my MTB SS, and started to experiment with bar, brake, and cog/FW/CR combos.

    I have tried to do the chainring alignment trick (ala Sheldon B.) and I still have a bit of variance in the chain tension.
    my take is that a lot of chainring machining tolerances are pretty bad (hole sizing, roundness, torsional trueness after being ridden hard, etc).
    I think this is fine on a large percentage of setups (ie: geared), but becomes a problem on SS and a serious problem on FG.
    ALL of the CR's I own: Blackspire, Snap, and Bontrager (pinned/ramped) have slop in the CR hole when a CR nut is inserted into the hole. The exception is the 42t sugino.
    I have noticed this play on my SS setup, but only after the initial installation.
    once it moved, it stayed put.
    I think that the problem has been unmasked because of the heavy loading while pedaling backward is just too much for it.
    so the next question is a 110 (5 hole setup) going to work better than a 104 (4 hole setup)?
    The next experiment would be that sugino ring, except the FSA cranks are 104, not 110 bcd.

    so short of buying a new set of 110bcd cranks, I am going to try my BMX cranks/chainring.
    (which incidentally have noticeable tight and loose spots in the chain from the CR being out of round)


    I am going to put my BMX cranks on the bike, and see how that works.
    I think it is ridiculous to put a BMX crank on a cyclocross frame, but I really want to see if this will solve the issue.

    so the questions I have are:
    1. what CR brand are you using (steel CR bolts of course?)?
    2. Gear Ratio (and lockring/cog brand)?
    3. Crank brand/size (length and bcd)?
    4. Hub/wheel setup?
    5. Frame/material and tensioner type?
    6. Brake setup?
    7. Terrain type?
    8. How much do you use your levers to brake (or, how much are you using your legs to brake)?

    TIA

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by long hazy daze
    chain line? chain tension?
    chainline is @ 52.5mm hub and CR.

    chain tension is as tight as I can get without getting grinding on the BB and hub bearings.
    what that means is that I have between 1/4 and 5/8 chain deflection, depending on where the cranks are at.

  12. #12
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    Maybe too tight?

    Quote Originally Posted by mrsalty
    chainline is @ 52.5mm hub and CR.

    chain tension is as tight as I can get without getting grinding on the BB and hub bearings.
    what that means is that I have between 1/4 and 5/8 chain deflection, depending on where the cranks are at.
    Is it possible that it is so tight that the ring is getting constantly slipped around as you ride? I mean, it is rare to actually see a perfectly round evenly tensioned chainring setup. Try leaving a little more backlash slop in the chian to see if it goes away. I know this makes the fixie thing suck a bit, but so does a busted CRB/Ring/Spider.

    Does the chianring have a bevel for the CRBs? Is it facing the right way. I saw in the other post you are using a BMX ring. It might actually care about inner/outer position.

    Heck, you might even want to try some liquid loctite between the spider and ring to take up any voids in the metal there.

    Yes, 5 hole will be better.

  13. #13
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    My Pompinos have been ridden offroad quite a lot without chain problems.

    From what you have said, I think the simplest thing is to try another crankset. Yours sounds worn out.
    Last edited by Velobike; 09-22-2007 at 04:38 AM.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot
    Is it possible that it is so tight that the ring is getting constantly slipped around as you ride? I mean, it is rare to actually see a perfectly round evenly tensioned chainring setup. Try leaving a little more backlash slop in the chian to see if it goes away. I know this makes the fixie thing suck a bit, but so does a busted CRB/Ring/Spider.

    Does the chianring have a bevel for the CRBs? Is it facing the right way. I saw in the other post you are using a BMX ring. It might actually care about inner/outer position.

    Heck, you might even want to try some liquid loctite between the spider and ring to take up any voids in the metal there.

    Yes, 5 hole will be better.
    The CR does have the bevel, which is correctly installed.

    Yes, slack (which I still have a bit of )does SUCK on the FG.
    I guess I will play with another possible solution, like...............

    I have not put the BMX ring (Profile Imperial) on the setup, but I will this weekend.
    I believe this will tell me if the CR to CR Bolt 'gap' is the issue.
    If that is the case, I will either keep the Odyssey BMX cranks on the ride, or I will invest in a 5 bolt 110 bcd setup.

    thanks for the thoughts.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike
    My Pompinos have been ridden offroad quite a lot without chain problems.

    From what you have said, I think the simplest thing is to try another crankset. Yours sounds worn out.
    Pompinos......as in multiples??

    how do you have them setup?

    I have gone through several setup iterations since getting this bike.
    I am REALLY impressed with the Pomp offroad.
    I think the fork is smoother/more comfortable than the custom segmented I ride on my 29.
    obviously tire clearance is the main issue, but I have been able to ride the rockiest trails in my neck of the woods (albeit at much slower pace) with only minimal flats.

  16. #16
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    OK....I to have had the same problem with my fixies, Turned out I had the chain ring bolts in backwards. I put the bolts on with the "male" side on the inside and "female" side on the outside.........problem solved. I think the reason for the problem is that the head of the bolts have to match up with the resessed part of the crank so that the outer diameter of the bolt fits evenly with the diameter of the hole of the ring and crank.........I hope that helps.
    "Roll your own......." Smokebikes.com

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