Anyone know anything about MP3 players?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
    "Mr. Britannica"
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    Anyone know anything about MP3 players?

    Looking for something small (128-156MB) and cheap for solo rides. No FM, no CD needed. What to get (or not) and why? Don't even say ipod; am considering Creative Labs MUVO NX and iRiver iFP-180T.
    Last edited by roadiegonebad; 03-14-2004 at 06:55 AM.

  2. #2
    The man who fell to earth
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    I've got the Muvo (128Mb), and it works great. It doesn't have the fancy features, just song indexing (Fwd/Rvs), volume, on/off. But it's nice, super small, super light, one AAA powers it for several hours. I've used it quite a bit and haven't had any problems with it. Another thing that's kind of cool is you can use the USB memory stick to store any kind of files you want, not just mp3's (in case you wanted to swap files between your computers).

    The only bummer I've experienced is it seems if I leave the unit around for a few weeks without using it, the battery is dead when I break it out again (and it was good to go last time I used it). Apparently it will draw a small amount of juice even when its off, at least it seems that way (still kind getting used to it). But it's no big deal to simply pop the battery out if your going to put it in storage for a while. Otherwise, it rocks. (and NO moving parts!)

  3. #3
    Trail rider and racer
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadiegonebad
    Looking for something small (128-156MB) and cheap for solo rides. No FM, no CD needed. What to get (or not) and why? Don't even say ipod; am considering Creative Labs MUVO NX.


    The iPod really is good...

    Trevor!

  4. #4
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    check out I-river stuff. I got the 1 gig model and it really rocks. the music clarity is excelent. Plus 1 gig is over 6 hours of music. Great for centuries on the road bike.


    Oh yeah it has an internal battery and comes with a wall charger. It will last 12 hours on full charge.

  5. #5
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    Ipod

    I second that

  6. #6
    34N 118W
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    playa

    I started out with a fairly cheap one from Radio Shack... branded with the MTV logo, made by Evolution I think? Maybe $100-150.

    has expandable card slot + internal memory and rechargeable battery w/charger. It's only 192k but that's enough tunes (30+) for a commute or bike path jaunt. Random play keeps it kinda new, too.

    But if all goes well with my winning eBay bid, I'll have a new 10gb "i word" next week.

    maybe I'll toss ya my old one cheap if ya want it. e me.

    HW



    Quote Originally Posted by roadiegonebad
    Looking for something small (128-156MB) and cheap for solo rides. No FM, no CD needed. What to get (or not) and why? Don't even say ipod; am considering Creative Labs MUVO NX and iRiver iFP-180T.

  7. #7
    get down!
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    I have a mindisc player that records and it's the coolest thing.

    minidiscs are cheap (5 for $10) and can hold about 4 cds on one disc, plus mine records so I can plug it into anything (as long as you have the right cords, which I got from radio shack cheap) and record....dvd, tv, radio, computer streams from internet radio etc....

    one of the coolest things I"ve ever bought, better than my dads I pod too which end up costing him around a G or so after all the accessories
    Rudy Projects look ridiculous

    visit my blog, BEATS, BIKES & LIFE

  8. #8
    Eric the Red
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    iPod

    Quote Originally Posted by psychojylo
    I second that
    make mine a third. iPods rule!

  9. #9
    Jed Peters
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    Spend the money, get an ipod.

  10. #10
    dutchie
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    iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod
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    iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod iPod

    get an iPod you'll be a happier person in the long run. If you don't want the gigs
    of music get the new mini Ipod, same features less capacity. And available in
    pink, matches the HFR jersey nicely .

    I have an iPod for about half a year now and I love it, I run about 7 gigs of music
    and use the rest for storage andtransfer of data to and from school.

    Use it on roadrides and commutes (bike and train) holds up okay, no skipping at
    all. Even when I have to run to catch my train, wich is about everyday.

    And Apple is the computer equivalant of the singlespeed.

    stzr.

  11. #11
    newbie boobie.
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    Just drop the dime.

    IPOD!

    The others cannot compare in size, function and beauty.

    Come on...

    You know you want it.

  12. #12
    zeebot
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    My experiences

    I had an ipod for about 4 months. It got destroyed while mountain biking. I no longer have an ipod. I tried to return it but they looked at it for about 10 seconds and asked what the hell i did to it...the big scuff marks from the concrete may have been the giveaway. I'm not sure.

    Anyways, i spent 400 dollars on the 15gb thing back when it first came out. I *liked* it but didnt love it. It looks cool, etc, has great software and the sound quality is *good* not great. I was using high end headphones by etymotic that cost more than most other mp3 players under 256mb. I had all my mp3s in 256k and up quality. My main beef was the bass was terrible on the ipod...everything else sounded great. It simply got distorted when lots of different ranges of bass were hitting. They seemed to have improved it after a few patches but it still wasnt as good as other systems i had heard.

    The battery life sucks with the ipod. Around 6hrs without the fancy lights(they say 8 hours) i would say although i never actually timed it. Suffice to say, i was charging the thing every night so it wouldnt die on me. I used it a lot...45min commute back and forth to work and an hour at the gym plus on and off at different points of the day. When the battery dies...it's dead. Theres no hope for it other than recharging it which can be very inconvienent sometimes!

    After i destroyed my ipod i got an Iriver 256mb stick thing. I like it about 100 times more than the ipod. its WAY WAY lighter. you dont even notice it in your pocket. It takes one AA battery and the battery lasts me atleast a week with major usage but usually two or so weeks. The sound quality is far superior to that of the ipod. I was surprised the little thing was able to produce the quality it does! It has FM when i get terribly bored of my songs or at the gym i can watch the tv channels with it.

    finally, it's about 250 dollars cheaper. Save the money and buy the irver and get some killer headphones that block out most sounds like my etymotics or sony has a decent set for about 40 to 50 bucks but they have pretty hard hitting bass so be wary.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spookykinkajou
    I had an ipod for about 4 months. It got destroyed while mountain biking. I no longer have an ipod. I tried to return it but they looked at it for about 10 seconds and asked what the hell i did to it...the big scuff marks from the concrete may have been the giveaway. I'm not sure.

    Anyways, i spent 400 dollars on the 15gb thing back when it first came out. I *liked* it but didnt love it. It looks cool, etc, has great software and the sound quality is *good* not great. I was using high end headphones by etymotic that cost more than most other mp3 players under 256mb. I had all my mp3s in 256k and up quality. My main beef was the bass was terrible on the ipod...everything else sounded great. It simply got distorted when lots of different ranges of bass were hitting. They seemed to have improved it after a few patches but it still wasnt as good as other systems i had heard.

    The battery life sucks with the ipod. Around 6hrs without the fancy lights(they say 8 hours) i would say although i never actually timed it. Suffice to say, i was charging the thing every night so it wouldnt die on me. I used it a lot...45min commute back and forth to work and an hour at the gym plus on and off at different points of the day. When the battery dies...it's dead. Theres no hope for it other than recharging it which can be very inconvienent sometimes!

    After i destroyed my ipod i got an Iriver 256mb stick thing. I like it about 100 times more than the ipod. its WAY WAY lighter. you dont even notice it in your pocket. It takes one AA battery and the battery lasts me atleast a week with major usage but usually two or so weeks. The sound quality is far superior to that of the ipod. I was surprised the little thing was able to produce the quality it does! It has FM when i get terribly bored of my songs or at the gym i can watch the tv channels with it.

    finally, it's about 250 dollars cheaper. Save the money and buy the irver and get some killer headphones that block out most sounds like my etymotics or sony has a decent set for about 40 to 50 bucks but they have pretty hard hitting bass so be wary.

    Spook, almost entirely the sound quality is from the headphones.
    Also, the headphones and the volume you listen to dictates the life of the battery. But, I do agree that propietary batteries can be a pain in the arse when they die.

    Basically, the IPOD is the BEST Mp3 player out there

    Get a pair of BOSE headphones or Sennheisers...

    If you're worried about weight/size the new one is friggin tiny and light.

    and the new new one is on it's way... basically think the new aluminum one mixed with the larger white plastic ones... they're going to be nice.



    --Personally, I think that if you're willing to spend around $110 for the tiny 128MB for the iRiver you should save an extra bill and get the Apple Ipod Mini at $240 with 4GB of memory. That is twice as much money, but 40 times as much space.

    Won't you get tired of having to load/unload from the iRiver once you get tired of the 30+ songs you can fit on it? Whereas the Ipod Mini can fit 1000+ songs...

    Size, you say?
    iRiver = 80mm x 32mm x 25mm
    iPod = 91mm x 50 x 12.7

    Weight?
    iRiver = 32 grams
    iPod = 100 grams

    Hmm...
    The only thing is the weight... but honestly in the pack or on your arm, or whatever I don't think 70 grams will be noticeable.

    Jeez, I think I just sold *myself* on the Ipod Mini
    Last edited by donkekus; 03-14-2004 at 02:41 PM.

  14. #14
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    I disagree

    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    Spook, almost entirely the sound quality is from the headphones.
    Also, the headphones and the volume you listen to dictates the life of the battery. But, I do agree that propietary batteries can be a pain in the arse when they die.

    Basically, the IPOD is the BEST Mp3 player out there

    Get a pair of BOSE headphones or Sennheisers...

    If you're worried about weight/size the new one is friggin tiny and light.

    and the new new one is on it's way... basically think the new aluminum one mixed with the larger white plastic ones... they're going to be nice.

    I have what are considered some of the best earplug style headphones available in the world. Read the reviews about etymotic er-4p if curious. Sennheiser are great but many require an amp to get the full sound production so be careful when picking them out. Never tried bose, but if they are like their speakers i'll pass Yes, i'm a sound whore i admit it...

    I'll also admit i'm a bit sour after the darn thing went flying off my waist going down a set of stairs at a high speed

  15. #15
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    Dont Get An Ipod!!!

    I have an iPod, and I truly believe it's the best MP3 player out there... but any tech-savy person (computer geeks like me) will tell you that you should never use a hard drive based MP3 player for jarring physical activities (and if riding isn't a jarring physical activity, then you're not doing it right). The hard drive in the iPod (or archos, dell, samsung/napster, etc.) has a number of very intricate moving parts that will damage over repeated impacts. Riding with an iPod will drastically shorten the lifespan of the hard drive, and thus the player itself.

    You should stick with a solid state (RAM) based MP3 player, of which the Movu is one of the best. The interface and simplicity are top notch. I've messed around with my friends Movu, and it's quite nice (however, I wanted alot more storage then 512Megs).

    By the way, I understand you asked people NOT to recommend the iPod, which I appreciate... this reply was simply for everyone else who replied to this post suggesting the iPod for an application it isn't suited for. I use my iPod for just about everything else, but given my investment (I actually only paid $199 for it... just braggin) I'm not about to contribute to killing the thing prematurely.

    So, umm, yeah... Movu it is.

    Sean

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by shizzle
    I have an iPod, and I truly believe it's the best MP3 player out there... but any tech-savy person (computer geeks like me) will tell you that you should never use a hard drive based MP3 player for jarring physical activities (and if riding isn't a jarring physical activity, then you're not doing it right). The hard drive in the iPod (or archos, dell, samsung/napster, etc.) has a number of very intricate moving parts that will damage over repeated impacts. Riding with an iPod will drastically shorten the lifespan of the hard drive, and thus the player itself.

    You should stick with a solid state (RAM) based MP3 player, of which the Movu is one of the best. The interface and simplicity are top notch. I've messed around with my friends Movu, and it's quite nice (however, I wanted alot more storage then 512Megs).

    By the way, I understand you asked people NOT to recommend the iPod, which I appreciate... this reply was simply for everyone else who replied to this post suggesting the iPod for an application it isn't suited for. I use my iPod for just about everything else, but given my investment (I actually only paid $199 for it... just braggin) I'm not about to contribute to killing the thing prematurely.

    So, umm, yeah... Movu it is.

    Sean
    IPOD = NO MOVING PARTS, basically. The hard drive does have tiny barely moving parts, however the only time this will become a problem with increased fatigue is if you ride with in on your knee or something. I assume you would carry any MP3 player in your pack or in a pocket not on your legs...

    Hmm...

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spookykinkajou
    I have what are considered some of the best earplug style headphones available in the world. Read the reviews about etymotic er-4p if curious. Sennheiser are great but many require an amp to get the full sound production so be careful when picking them out. Never tried bose, but if they are like their speakers i'll pass Yes, i'm a sound whore i admit it...

    I'll also admit i'm a bit sour after the darn thing went flying off my waist going down a set of stairs at a high speed
    No, I am a sound **** too... But, you don't like Bose?! What?!
    Damn, those Etymotics are steep. The best in ear headphone out there? Is it a noice canceller?

    I must admit I am a lot more knowledgeable about monitor headphones... not the tiny guys...

    But, Spook, tell me about them , cuz I am thinking about getting a pair of awesome in the ear headys.

    Also, you gotta know most people won't be able to hear some of your complaints about the Ipod... the soundwhore you are.

  18. #18
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    Actually forget I said anything:

    The iRiver can be had for $80 and with a AA battery, makes it easy....

    but 128MB might not be enough...

    the Muvo can be had for $100, and $130 for the 256MB... on a AAA.

    Hmmm...
    I say iRiver. I guess.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    IPOD = NO MOVING PARTS, basically. The hard drive does have tiny barely moving parts, however the only time this will become a problem with increased fatigue is if you ride with in on your knee or something. I assume you would carry any MP3 player in your pack or in a pocket not on your legs...

    Hmm...
    It doesn't matter where you carry it, it's still going to be jolted during the average mountain bike ride (you could probably get away with it on the road, but that's not why we're here). The "barely moving" tiny parts are still moving, and the read/write head of the hard drive is constantly in contact with the platters of the hard disk. You banging it around while these two parts are in contact are going to decrease the lifespan of the drive, no question. Additionally, let's say you create a playlist from you're library (a pretty common practice) that features songs from a number of albums. The files are likely located on entirely different sectors of the drive, so the read/write head has to jump around to find each new song to play (that's why certain songs in your playlist don't instantly come on when you play them). So as the read/write head is moving, your slamming into roots and rocks, and your iPod is slowly dying.

    I'm not saying that the iPod will burst into flames on your first ride, but you are causing damage, which decreases lifespan. And given how much they cost, why not just pick up a solid state MP3 player that is MADE for this type of activity? Like I said, I love my iPod, and I'd like to keep it working for as long as possible...

    Sean

  20. #20
    Breathus Hardus
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    Etymotics

    The Etymotic ER-4S are awesome but need an amp to really do the job (try an Airhead from www.headphone.com) or I might part with my surplus Supreme. I have never heard the 4P but when the ER-6 came out bought a pair and now seldom listen to the ER-4S unless I am using the “Big Rig”. I have found that the ER-6 to sound very close to the ER-4S at about half the price and are much more comfortable to boot.

    According to long time MP3 user (PJB 100), and owner of Headroom, the Creative players sound better than the Ipods. That said, the Ipod is the preferred choice of many due to ergonomics, size, coolness, and many other more intangible factors.
    Being more parsimonious, I bought the Creative Zen NX and suffer with the criminally bad ergonomics.
    But as Shizzle said using a hard drive player while riding off road (or jogging) is asking for a damaged hard drive.

    Oh and Bose, If you gotta ask……….

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by A:42
    The Etymotic ER-4S are awesome but need an amp to really do the job (try an Airhead from www.headphone.com) or I might part with my surplus Supreme. I have never heard the 4P but when the ER-6 came out bought a pair and now seldom listen to the ER-4S unless I am using the “Big Rig”. I have found that the ER-6 to sound very close to the ER-4S at about half the price and are much more comfortable to boot.

    According to long time MP3 user (PJB 100), and owner of Headroom, the Creative players sound better than the Ipods. That said, the Ipod is the preferred choice of many due to ergonomics, size, coolness, and many other more intangible factors.
    Being more parsimonious, I bought the Creative Zen NX and suffer with the criminally bad ergonomics.
    But as Shizzle said using a hard drive player while riding off road (or jogging) is asking for a damaged hard drive.

    Oh and Bose, If you gotta ask……….
    the er-4p are basically the same thing as the 4s model except they have a lower impedance making them much easier to drive on a portable player. you can actually get a conversion kit for the 4s to make them much easier to drive on weaker sources.

    i have a set of the er-6 as well. I REALLY like them a lot. i would highly recommend those to anyone before the er-4p mainly because they cost a ton less and they have less microphonic effects while moving...with them i dont even bother to use the clip in most situations unless i know i'm not going to be changing position(riding a bike for example although i would never actually use these for biking) for awhile. you plug them in and the world disappears...obviously this is the same for the other models too...the 4s and 4p.

    etymotics take some getting used to and they are for the canal and not just like a normal ear bud. you have to shove them way in so if you dont feel comfortable doing this dont even bother trying them out...maybe try buying some cheap ear plugs first and make sure they dont bother you(and really put them in properly.) it's a similar feeling.

    to describe what etymotics sound like maybe consider this if it were possible...implant a cd directly in your head or a live concert if thats what you happen to be listening to...

    big note though: don't buy these for just bike riding...you CAN NOT hear anything. you will most likely seriously injure yourself or someone else by using these while biking i live in manhattan and it's a really great isolated feeling walking down a crowded avenue and not hearing anything but your music and maybe your hearbeat and footsteps

    for real headphones that dont suck goto www.headphone.com. they even let you try them and return them with full refund if you odnt like them.

  22. #22
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    do you work for Apple?

    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    Basically, the IPOD is the BEST Mp3 player out there
    Sheesh, I guess "out there" must be someplace that carries only Apple.

    I know of at least 5 .mp3 players that are equal in sonics and SUPERIOR in portability and anti-skip (no HDD to malfunction)

    Flash memory players are far superior, for many reasons, and especially if you are ACTIVE when you use your player. The HDD models can't hang with DH riding or FR riding or anywhere the thing is subject to stutter bumps or large impact results.

    Why would someone want more than 256 MB for a player? Are you riding for over 8 hours at a time?

    Why would 20 GB be necessary? Or for that matter, the new "mini-iPod" 4 GB? That is a ton of music and way too unwieldy for in-ride use.

    I'd prefer to make a 4-hour to 8-hour mix on a 256 MB flash player, use that, and then re-flash the memory with a new mix when it gets tired. I don't want my .mp3 player to hold my whole music collection. So what if it has huge capacity? I don't use mine as a portable data transfer unit, as I don't need such a thing.

    Gadgets, gadgets, gadgets. To me the iPod is "the most overloaded with features," but for something as simple as a portable music player, "features" are pretty fargin' irrelevant.

    The iPod is like a Humvee - a big showoff and a waste of money.

    This little .mp3 player is all anyone needs for musical accompaniment on a ride/hike/whatever. And it costs HUNDREDS less than the Humvee... uh, I mean iPod.

  23. #23
    Jed Peters
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    The iPod is like a Humvee - a big showoff and a waste of money.
    Not really. I'm not emotionally attached to my ipod, but I can say that it's really nice to "set and forget", not having to constantly fiddle with playlists and what not, to have a HUGE music library on there...and the ability to hook it into your stereo at home with a $5 cable from radio shack and have a HUGE music library at your fingertips.

    FWIW, i've dropped it, ridden hundreds of on and off road miles with the ipod, blah blah blah, and it's not ever once skipped, missed a beat, or otherwise been flawed.

    I got my 3g 10gb new for $240/shipped when the 15gb came out.

    For the functionality, size, and portability, it's simply the best deal out there.

    Oh yeah, and the "sonics" come from the headphones, not the player.....try sony ES-71 earbuds.

  24. #24
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    not really true..

    Quote Originally Posted by Zonic Man
    Not really. I'm not emotionally attached to my ipod, but I can say that it's really nice to "set and forget", not having to constantly fiddle with playlists and what not, to have a HUGE music library on there...and the ability to hook it into your stereo at home with a $5 cable from radio shack and have a HUGE music library at your fingertips.

    FWIW, i've dropped it, ridden hundreds of on and off road miles with the ipod, blah blah blah, and it's not ever once skipped, missed a beat, or otherwise been flawed.

    I got my 3g 10gb new for $240/shipped when the 15gb came out.

    For the functionality, size, and portability, it's simply the best deal out there.

    Oh yeah, and the "sonics" come from the headphones, not the player.....try sony ES-71 earbuds.
    Sound is driven by the player and some players have better amps than others. the ipods is 'good' but not great. like someone mentioned, creative's HDD portables have a MUCH stronger amp for driving good headphones.

    the sony's are ok and do a good job of covering up the poor sound quality of the ipod since they have so much thundering bass. they semi-block sounds out which is also nice. for the money you can get far superior headphones but they dont look as cool as the sony's and arent as small. i have a pair of the sony's myself and like them. they are great for gym use...sorta ok for jogging but the heartbeat can become annoying. i've never tried them with biking since i can't hear very well with them on.

  25. #25
    Let me ask my wife
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    Cheap fix!?

    Give the RIO S35 a look. My friend has one and really likes, sounds good. I'm considering one as well. Can be had for ~$100 and you can add memory with an SD card.
    “Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of riding a bike.” John F. Kennedy

  26. #26
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    hey Jed, you just showed why H Ford needed more colors

    Quote Originally Posted by Zonic Man
    Not really. I'm not emotionally attached to my ipod, but I can say that it's really nice to "set and forget", not having to constantly fiddle with playlists and what not, to have a HUGE music library on there...and the ability to hook it into your stereo at home with a $5 cable from radio shack and have a HUGE music library at your fingertips.
    I don't want my .mp3 player to store HUGE amounts of music. To me that sets up the old "so many choices, so little time" problem. I much prefer to use the USB cable link to program enough music for the ride's duration, and no more.

    I don't go for the "more is always better" theory of buying stuff. I'm a simplist. But I know there are LOTS of folks who aren't superficial and like the iPod straight-up for its features, etc., such as you listed.

    I would've bought a black Model T and not complained about the lack of color options.

    Many other folks would've waited to get a different color and more options of other kinds.

    so, as my brother often says, "that's why we have vanilla AND chocolate"

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    Sheesh, I guess "out there" must be someplace that carries only Apple.

    I know of at least 5 .mp3 players that are equal in sonics and SUPERIOR in portability and anti-skip (no HDD to malfunction)

    Flash memory players are far superior, for many reasons, and especially if you are ACTIVE when you use your player. The HDD models can't hang with DH riding or FR riding or anywhere the thing is subject to stutter bumps or large impact results.

    Why would someone want more than 256 MB for a player? Are you riding for over 8 hours at a time?

    Why would 20 GB be necessary? Or for that matter, the new "mini-iPod" 4 GB? That is a ton of music and way too unwieldy for in-ride use.

    I'd prefer to make a 4-hour to 8-hour mix on a 256 MB flash player, use that, and then re-flash the memory with a new mix when it gets tired. I don't want my .mp3 player to hold my whole music collection. So what if it has huge capacity? I don't use mine as a portable data transfer unit, as I don't need such a thing.

    Gadgets, gadgets, gadgets. To me the iPod is "the most overloaded with features," but for something as simple as a portable music player, "features" are pretty fargin' irrelevant.

    The iPod is like a Humvee - a big showoff and a waste of money.

    This little .mp3 player is all anyone needs for musical accompaniment on a ride/hike/whatever. And it costs HUNDREDS less than the Humvee... uh, I mean iPod.

    Hmmm... that little player costs hundreds less? Make that hundred singular my man. You can get an IPOD for $250 no sweat.

    How is an IPOD like a Hummer? That analogy makes little sense, if any. A Hummer is a 4x4 that celebrities and wannabe's use on road, it has horrible gas mileage and is definitely a show off. However, how is an Ipod a waste of money? An Ipod can be had for $250, whereas other mp3 players for that price have a lot less hd space, 1/8th the hd size.

    How do we judge "portability"? Come on now. The IPOD is freaking tiny...though you could get smaller, I suppose.

    The HD thing, with it's moveable parts is a little bit of a problem. but really it is only a little problem. I wonder who in their right mind will own an IPOD for the duration of time that they would actually see the "damage" done by active use. I mean, in 5 years the thing will be so outdated no one will care.

    Geez.

    I don't work for Apple. But, I like them a lot. There computers are top notch, and the IPOD is a great machine.

    Why would someone want more than 256mb? Because, I personally don't like having to hook up the mp3 player every time I want to hear a new album. And, if I go away for a weekend I can have everything I would want to listen to.

    Come on.

    And we can also argue the pros and cons of USB vs. FireWire. That little egg uses USB and the IPOD uses FireWire. We both know FireWire is better, more secure and faster.
    It ain't easy being human.

  28. #28
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    iriver ifp-180t

    very good player. i had the creative nomad for a long time and i like this unit better. i know you say no to FM but i wouldn't buy a player without it. the iriver has better reception than my last creative and i can skip songs and adjust volume using the little joystick without looking (leave it in the jersey).

    only ding against ipod is the proprietary battery. it is nice to just switch out the AA rechargeable and go with the iriver.

  29. #29
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    debating is fun while bored at work

    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    Hmmm... that little player costs hundreds less? Make that hundred singular my man. You can get an IPOD for $250 no sweat.

    How is an IPOD like a Hummer? That analogy makes little sense, if any. A Hummer is a 4x4 that celebrities and wannabe's use on road, it has horrible gas mileage and is definitely a show off. However, how is an Ipod a waste of money? An Ipod can be had for $250, whereas other mp3 players for that price have a lot less hd space, 1/8th the hd size.

    How do we judge "portability"? Come on now. The IPOD is freaking tiny...though you could get smaller, I suppose.

    The HD thing, with it's moveable parts is a little bit of a problem. but really it is only a little problem. I wonder who in their right mind will own an IPOD for the duration of time that they would actually see the "damage" done by active use. I mean, in 5 years the thing will be so outdated no one will care.

    Geez.

    I don't work for Apple. But, I like them a lot. There computers are top notch, and the IPOD is a great machine.

    Why would someone want more than 256mb? Because, I personally don't like having to hook up the mp3 player every time I want to hear a new album. And, if I go away for a weekend I can have everything I would want to listen to.

    Come on.

    And we can also argue the pros and cons of USB vs. FireWire. That little egg uses USB and the IPOD uses FireWire. We both know FireWire is better, more secure and faster.
    the iriver i got to replace my destroyed ipod is slightly larger than a AA battery and weighs basically what the AA weighs. that's smaller if you ask me. the normal sized ipod is huge in comparison and weighs A LOT more. the newer version is much better sized but i havent held one so cant comment on the weight. i'd consider getting it if the battery didnt suck in it as well. everything about the ipod is OKAY with me other than the terrible battery and the slightly above-avg sound quality.

    I shouldnt think security is an issue with the USB vs firewire but that may be a selling for point for some!

    I strongly disagree about apple computers being high quality though!!! The Ibook is quite possibly the cutest, most economically friendly lightweight portable out there with one huge caveat. It sucks. Lawsuits are being considered all over the place because of their tendency to just quit functioning after the warranty expires. Rumor has it the newer powerbooks are having/going to have the same problems.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spookykinkajou
    the iriver i got to replace my destroyed ipod is slightly larger than a AA battery and weighs basically what the AA weighs. that's smaller if you ask me. the normal sized ipod is huge in comparison and weighs A LOT more. the newer version is much better sized but i havent held one so cant comment on the weight. i'd consider getting it if the battery didnt suck in it as well. everything about the ipod is OKAY with me other than the terrible battery and the slightly above-avg sound quality.

    I shouldnt think security is an issue with the USB vs firewire but that may be a selling for point for some!

    I strongly disagree about apple computers being high quality though!!! The Ibook is quite possibly the cutest, most economically friendly lightweight portable out there with one huge caveat. It sucks. Lawsuits are being considered all over the place because of their tendency to just quit functioning after the warranty expires. Rumor has it the newer powerbooks are having/going to have the same problems.
    I agree about the size, but I still think it is small enough.

    Yes, proprietary batteries suck.

    There is definitely an issue with the logic board on certain iBooks. Mine had the issue, thankfull Apple fixed it for FREE! But, to give a broad sweeping statement like "tendency to just quit functioning" is slanderous. There are only issues with a certian batch, though that batch is huge. I agree that there are problems, but laptops are almost assuredly going to face some sort of problem, get the extended warranty. But, you have to praise Apple for fixing them for free (though a lawsuit would definitely be worse, I agree and they chose the only real route for them). The iBook does not suck. Come on. Give me an example of a comparable machine at a comparable price.

    And then of course we can talk about towers, Apple towers are the best out there...

    Then, last but not least, the best thing about Apples? They don't run WINDOZE!!!
    It ain't easy being human.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    I agree about the size, but I still think it is small enough.

    Yes, proprietary batteries suck.

    There is definitely an issue with the logic board on certain iBooks. Mine had the issue, thankfull Apple fixed it for FREE! But, to give a broad sweeping statement like "tendency to just quit functioning" is slanderous. There are only issues with a certian batch, though that batch is huge. I agree that there are problems, but laptops are almost assuredly going to face some sort of problem, get the extended warranty. But, you have to praise Apple for fixing them for free (though a lawsuit would definitely be worse, I agree and they chose the only real route for them). The iBook does not suck. Come on. Give me an example of a comparable machine at a comparable price.

    And then of course we can talk about towers, Apple towers are the best out there...

    Then, last but not least, the best thing about Apples? They don't run WINDOZE!!!
    os x is great, i agree...I had to chuckle at the 'huge batch' comment. Very accurate I also agree the towers are great.

    I had one for a few months. The white 900mhz version. The battery wouldnt charge while plugged in. I sent it in to have it fixed and they managed to erase my entire HDD and when it came back it didnt even turn on. i jumped the gun on the HDD. it was erased the 2nd time i got it back so i'm not sure which time it occurred. That's my last experience with apple...i went back to a Dell XP Pro machine. Works okay, not as cool looking, works with more software, and it doesnt die...yet anyways.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spookykinkajou
    os x is great, i agree...I had to chuckle at the 'huge batch' comment. Very accurate I also agree the towers are great.

    I had one for a few months. The white 900mhz version. The battery wouldnt charge while plugged in. I sent it in to have it fixed and they managed to erase my entire HDD and when it came back it didnt even turn on. i jumped the gun on the HDD. it was erased the 2nd time i got it back so i'm not sure which time it occurred. That's my last experience with apple...i went back to a Dell XP Pro machine. Works okay, not as cool looking, works with more software, and it doesnt die...yet anyways.
    Well, you should know that you should always back up your HD if you're sending your computer in to get fixed. They warn you, and ask if you want them to back it up for you - though, for an extra $ I am sure.

    Looks like you had the runt of the litter, a bad apple

    I have been on a Mac/Apple since the II and the IIce.

    That's good that your XP Pro hasn't died mechanically yet, but I am sure you have had your share of software/operating system crashes...
    It ain't easy being human.

  33. #33
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    some good points, but...

    1) which iPod can you get for $250 right now? not the mini, but the full Johnson? best prices I've seen have been $350 to $300. That's still at least DOUBLE the cost of the iRiver flash 256MB model. If you are in a position to call $100 "pocket change," I guess that's okay... me, I watch my money and where it goes when it comes to consumer items. I would NEVER say "wow, compared to the $150 iRiver 256, that iPod sure is a better bargain at twice the price!"

    2) Firewire is good only if you're set up for it. USB is the standard on most computers, with Firewire an add-on. While I hear Firewire is faster than even USB 2.0, I've never felt like crying at the slow transfer speed of USB 1.0 to my Rio 800. In fact, I'd never even think to use "slow" to describe it. But I'm not one of those "time is money!" people, I'm patient and not in a hurry.

    3) as to Apple's supposed superiority... well, I guess someone's gotta fight for the underdog. I find Apple's interface to be obnoxious and insulting to my intelligence. Haven't used the iPod, though, so they may have improved things for that item.

    4) last point, I can't say enough BAD things about S3/Diamond/Rio. My first Rio 800 died w/o warning after only 3 uses. I sent it back and got a warranty replacement. That one worked fine for about a year or two. Now it's dead unless you have the charger cord plugged in. Doesn't matter if it shows full charge on the batteries... won't play w/o the charger cord.

    I'll be getting the iRiver.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    1) which iPod can you get for $250 right now? not the mini, but the full Johnson? best prices I've seen have been $350 to $300. That's still at least DOUBLE the cost of the iRiver flash 256MB model. If you are in a position to call $100 "pocket change," I guess that's okay... me, I watch my money and where it goes when it comes to consumer items. I would NEVER say "wow, compared to the $150 iRiver 256, that iPod sure is a better bargain at twice the price!"
    The Mini is $250. The 'full johnson' is closer to $300, but found on sale could easily be $250. OK, for arguments sake let's compare the iPOD mini to the iRiver. 256mb compared to 4096mb in the mini, or 16 times more in the iPOD mini. The iRiver gives you 1.7mb for each dollar, whereas the mini gives you 27.3. The iRiver does win out in size and battery and the lack of moving parts, though the fact that the iPOD has barely moving parts is not really a negative attribute. By the time someone encounters the degradation of those parts, the iPOD 4G will already be obselete. And, just because I think spending $100 more doesn't equate to the idea of a bill being pocket change. I just feel the iPOD is worth $100 more. Easily. Though, I am unsure why you're writing with condescending tones...
    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    2) Firewire is good only if you're set up for it. USB is the standard on most computers, with Firewire an add-on. While I hear Firewire is faster than even USB 2.0, I've never felt like crying at the slow transfer speed of USB 1.0 to my Rio 800. In fact, I'd never even think to use "slow" to describe it. But I'm not one of those "time is money!" people, I'm patient and not in a hurry.
    FireWire is 75% faster at reading, and 50% faster at writing than USB 2.0. FireWire 800 is nearly double those numbers. A decent computer should have FireWire standard. Why would you not choose FireWire?
    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    3) as to Apple's supposed superiority... well, I guess someone's gotta fight for the underdog. I find Apple's interface to be obnoxious and insulting to my intelligence. Haven't used the iPod, though, so they may have improved things for that item.
    This statement confuses me. The interface is insulting to your intelligence? I would expect ease of use to be a high quality to have in regards to an operating system. Do you want a system that challenges you to figure out algorithmic equation to connect to the internet? I don't find simplistic systems insulting to my intelligence, I actually embrace one button internet connections, etc.
    It ain't easy being human.

  35. #35
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    ePod

    Quote Originally Posted by gonzostrike
    1) which iPod can you get for $250 right now? not the mini, but the full Johnson?
    I just bought a new-ish 10gb iPod on eBay for $255. It's the latest model (3rd gen.), with dock and iTrip (wireless FM transmitter) to send the tunes to car stereo or boombox. Not a bad deal. I won't use it on a mountain bike, so the skipping concerns are a non-issue for me.

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...EBWN%3AIT&rd=1

    if you search for "10gb iPod 3rd" there are some deals to be had.

  36. #36
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    I'm not a tech-head with computers, that's why

    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    I just feel the iPOD is worth $100 more. Easily. Though, I am unsure why you're writing with condescending tones...

    FireWire is 75% faster at reading, and 50% faster at writing than USB 2.0. FireWire 800 is nearly double those numbers. A decent computer should have FireWire standard. Why would you not choose FireWire?

    This statement confuses me. The interface is insulting to your intelligence? I would expect ease of use to be a high quality to have in regards to an operating system. Do you want a system that challenges you to figure out algorithmic equation to connect to the internet? I don't find simplistic systems insulting to my intelligence, I actually embrace one button internet connections, etc.
    Nothing wrong with it being worth $100 more to you. I'm saying it's not worth it to me.

    FireWire is faster. Did I dispute that? As to why I wouldn't "choose it," I built my own computer 1 year ago, and my MoBo was 2 yrs old then. USB 1.0. Why spend more $$ just to have FireWire? When do I use FireWire... hmmm... don't have a need for it. You might, your needs might be different. Not me.

    As to the interface, c'mon. Trash cans and happy dancing flowers? Shyte, I'm not a 12-year-old girl.

  37. #37
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    epilogue

    Thanks for all the input. As mentioned in the original post, I was looking for something simple, small for riding with, and cheap (just in case the big biff). Didn't want a big jukebox-type/ipod to store all my music (most is on CD anyway) and didn't feel the need for FM (never got good reception on the trails) or CD player (again, size matters).

    So last night I went to the local Circuit Sh!tty and saw the Rio Fuse. Very small, 128MB storage, and best of all only $67 after a $20 rebate. You can't beat that! Broke it open and was able to rip some riding music- 37 songs (!), which ought to be plenty. These little things are pretty amazing- good sound (although I'm using Sony earphones and not the ones that came with it) and features on par with any CD player. Display is a bit small, but I'm not really going to be looking at it (although I am amazed at the amount of data available). Also, it's got easily accesible and fairly intuitive controls. Software seems decent too- was able to manage without reading the manual, as is typical for the male species. So I'm pretty happy and if it goes sour I guess I can always return it. That's the only good thing about Circuit Sh!tty and Worst Buy, right?

    Damn, this technology stuff is pretty cool... what next, a cell phone or disc brakes?

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadiegonebad
    Thanks for all the input. As mentioned in the original post, I was looking for something simple, small for riding with, and cheap (just in case the big biff). Didn't want a big jukebox-type/ipod to store all my music (most is on CD anyway) and didn't feel the need for FM (never got good reception on the trails) or CD player (again, size matters).

    So last night I went to the local Circuit Sh!tty and saw the Rio Fuse. Very small, 128MB storage, and best of all only $67 after a $20 rebate. You can't beat that! Broke it open and was able to rip some riding music- 37 songs (!), which ought to be plenty. These little things are pretty amazing- good sound (although I'm using Sony earphones and not the ones that came with it) and features on par with any CD player. Display is a bit small, but I'm not really going to be looking at it (although I am amazed at the amount of data available). Also, it's got easily accesible and fairly intuitive controls. Software seems decent too- was able to manage without reading the manual, as is typical for the male species. So I'm pretty happy and if it goes sour I guess I can always return it. That's the only good thing about Circuit Sh!tty and Worst Buy, right?

    Damn, this technology stuff is pretty cool... what next, a cell phone or disc brakes?
    disc brakes! much more important! I just got another set of marta SL's off ebay from the same guy. great deal for the set $360. thats like 100 to 150 cheaper than retail/online stores try to charge you. also does the regular martas for around 300. o, they are brand new, etc..

  39. #39
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    Idea! Shock Effects???

    I have had two ipods (both still work fine, just upgraded in size). The first one I got right when they came out two years ago+. I have riden and ran with both, use them everyday and had no problems. I personally do not know of a hard drive failure and have seen no reports of any high failure rates due to shock (web or otherwise). If someone has some actual facts rather than conjuncture about ipods being less suited to riding then other MP3 players, that might be interesting, otherwise I suggest that the iPod is very well suited to riding and running.

    Note, the hard drive only spins every so often (since there is a minutes long buffer) and it has shock tolerances to not let it spin if the shock loading is over a certain amount. Also, I have dropped my iPod a few times (both are in neoprene cases) and they suffered not ill effects (I would note that the steel back is one tough shell).

    Just my two cents from my personal experience. Note, I am not a digital device hardware engineer and I suspect no one else here is either so we should be careful what we assume to be true.

    Geoff

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by appleSSeed
    I have a mindisc player that records and it's the coolest thing.

    minidiscs are cheap (5 for $10) and can hold about 4 cds on one disc, plus mine records so I can plug it into anything (as long as you have the right cords, which I got from radio shack cheap) and record....dvd, tv, radio, computer streams from internet radio etc....

    one of the coolest things I"ve ever bought, better than my dads I pod too which end up costing him around a G or so after all the accessories
    Do you find that you get distortion when you record streaming audio? How did you connect the recorder to do this?

  41. #41
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    gotta go with disc brakes

    while i can see some of the advantages of a cell phone, i find them about the most obnoxious things on earth. while as disc brakes are dreamy stopping things.

    all health and safety issues/urban legends about cell phones aside - i don't know enough about either, seriously - why would you want to be accessible all the time? yes, you can turn it off, but really ... i don't know. i hate seeing them in use, every where i go. especially with the mini earsets that now exist, so i feel like i'm in a crowd of crazies all talking to themselves. maybe i'm just luddite on this issue, but no contest, thinks i. go discs.

  42. #42
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    guys, that last one was a rhetorical question

    not a plea for more advice.... just poking fun at myself for being kind of a techno grouch... for still using v brakes and being the last man in the USA who does NOT have a cell phone. Heck, I just got cable tv (dish actually) last year!

  43. #43
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    oh

    ah, yes, ahem. of course i knew that ... good job then, old chap, on the cell phone thing. know that there are at least two of us who don't have them cell-you-lair phones.

    my mistake. keep fighting the old-school power.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by kept man
    ah, yes, ahem. of course i knew that ... good job then, old chap, on the cell phone thing. know that there are at least two of us who don't have them cell-you-lair phones.

    my mistake. keep fighting the old-school power.
    i dont even have a landline...i dont know how i'd function in manhattan without my cellphone.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadiegonebad
    Looking for something small (128-156MB) and cheap for solo rides. No FM, no CD needed. What to get (or not) and why? Don't even say ipod; am considering Creative Labs MUVO NX and iRiver iFP-180T.
    sorry to ressurect this thread. but i just used it to buy an mp3 player. i ended up with a rio karma. $250 20gigs. and lighter than the ipod. at least in my hands, as i have friends who have both.
    thanks for the info! love the search function!
    Only boring people get bored.

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