New Fox Igus Bushings. Not so impressed- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    New Fox Igus Bushings. Not so impressed

    My new Fox CTD shock came with the new improved white Igus bushings (I think that's what they're called).

    I went to remove them to install needle bearings, but my bushing removal tool doesn't seem to work an them. So figured I'd just try them. Well, there is a lot of sideways movement in the bushings from new (maybe not a problem but odd), and some slop in the suspension as well (same feeling as you get with worn DU bushings).

    So questions are:

    What are other people's experiences with these bushings?

    How do you remove them?

    Cheers

  2. #2
    Big Gulps, Alright!
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    Rear Shock Reducer Maintenance

    I had a set installed on one end of my RP23 and it seemed to have a little bit of play as well.
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  3. #3
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    Thanks Berkley. I should have found that. So great, you answered the first question. I'm also curious if others have issues with these new flanged bushings. The fact that the shock wiggles so much when tightened down doesn't feel right. On the positive side they rotate a lot more freely than the old DU bushings

  4. #4
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    You do not need any special tools to remove them... They can be removed with a pencil.

  5. #5
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    I use the 3-piece aluminum stuff for all rear shock hardware. That is unless I can't get the right size and have to order the stuff from Fox. Usually not a problem. I'm not a fan of the plastic stuff.

    mk
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  6. #6
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    I really like the newer Fox mounting hardware.
    No need for tools to remove and replace is a big plus.
    The hardware is lasting as long as or longer than any traditional DU set ups I have used.
    I've got the hardware on 2 Floats, 3 Vivid Airs, and I'll be drilling a CCDBA to accept the Fox Hardware as well.
    I prefer the ease of install to traditional set ups and there's noticeably less friction than most DU + pin set ups I have tried.

  7. #7
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    Have to agree with Norman. This new igus hardware is actually pretty good for me. I have no slop, less friction, and it has lasted about 2x longer than the standard aluminum reducer+Du bushing system ever did for me before and everything still feels quite good.

  8. #8
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    My new Heckler came with them, so far they do not show any play but I also just riding for a month or so.

  9. #9
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    The problem is, the machining tolerances on shock eyelets are all over the place. They should all be the same, but in reality the pins that work well on some are a heavy press-fit on others and will fall straight out of some.

    To get the best performance and longevity from shock hardware it needs to be custom fitted to each shock eyelet. It is more common to find each end of the same shock require a different tolerance pin than them both fitting exactly the same.
    Owner of www.shockcraft.co.nz, Mech Engineer, Tuner, Manitou, Motorex, Vorsprung EPTC, SKF, Enduro
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dougal View Post
    The problem is, the machining tolerances on shock eyelets are all over the place. They should all be the same, but in reality the pins that work well on some are a heavy press-fit on others and will fall straight out of some.

    To get the best performance and longevity from shock hardware it needs to be custom fitted to each shock eyelet. It is more common to find each end of the same shock require a different tolerance pin than them both fitting exactly the same.
    Wouldn't that issue (shock eyelet variation) be the same problem for Igus or standard DU bushings? I'm trying to understand why there would be more problems with Igus, if there really are more problems.

  11. #11
    Zaf
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    I haven't had any problems with mine, no play, they set into the eyelets beautifully. The shock is a 2014 though, not sure if that helps with the bushings fit.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by smilinsteve View Post
    Wouldn't that issue (shock eyelet variation) be the same problem for Igus or standard DU bushings? I'm trying to understand why there would be more problems with Igus, if there really are more problems.
    The two-piece fox top-hats were a press-fit that masked the problem. On some shocks they were tighter than others, but never loose.

    IGUS bushings (I've been using them for ~7 years now) hate tight press fits, so fox had to lighten up their press-fit. This I believe is where we are seeing problems. Some now will knock off the floor. Especially fitting new hardware to an older shock.

    In general terms, RS has the tightest shock eyelets, fox are in the middle, marzocchi have the loosest.
    I stock three tolerance pins and custom machine pins to suit eyelets that are tighter or looser when they are sent in for custom hardware. I also have pre-tensioned IGUS bushings which can span +/- 1 tolerance grade. I recommend these when I can't get the shock for custom fitment.

    On my own main bike I've been running my own sealed hardware with an anodised pin and pre-tensioned IGUS bushing for about 2 years now. The anodising is just starting to discolour from wear on the pre-tensioned part of the bushing.
    Almost all the hardware I supply and fit is stainless steel. Done properly once it can outlast the normal life of the bike with only bushing changes if needed.
    Owner of www.shockcraft.co.nz, Mech Engineer, Tuner, Manitou, Motorex, Vorsprung EPTC, SKF, Enduro
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by smilinsteve View Post
    Wouldn't that issue (shock eyelet variation) be the same problem for Igus or standard DU bushings? I'm trying to understand why there would be more problems with Igus, if there really are more problems.
    Different beast all together. The DU Bushings will tend to take up bad manufacturing tolerance in the eyelet but perform better with the 3-piece reducers. The fox hat style reducers are crap....toss those in the rubbish bin. If you want some more information do a search on this forum it's been talked and talked about some more. Right now I am too lazy to upchuck all technical data....but it's out there. I also concur with what Dougal stated. He knows what he's talking about.

  14. #14
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    Re: New Fox Igus Bushings. Not so impressed

    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    The fox hat style reducers are crap....toss those in the rubbish bin.
    Don't do that. Aluminium is fully recyclable.
    Owner of www.shockcraft.co.nz, Mech Engineer, Tuner, Manitou, Motorex, Vorsprung EPTC, SKF, Enduro
    www.dougal.co.nz

  15. #15
    The Fastest of Bananas
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    So, where does one get better shock bushing? Thanks

  16. #16
    MarkyMark
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    The Igus bushing on my 2013 Fox CTD Kashima shock is giving out (knocking when pedaling) in about 4 months of moderate riding. I was getting year(s) of riding on the old DU bushings.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by FastBanana View Post
    So, where does one get better shock bushing? Thanks
    I will machine up all the shock mounting hard wear that I need for customers stuff that comes in all worn out.
    That way I can control the tolerances and make them fit just nice and smooth and have no play.
    I will use "Oil Light Bronze" , the stuff wears forever and is really smooth.

    I like to use the "Needle" bearings when I can but most of my customers are "Bike Shops" and they won't spend the extra money on the bearings .
    ( FastBanana look at "Enduro seal" and get their Bearing kits for the shock eyes and you will be set )
    I run the bearings / or my machined hard wear on my bikes, no DU bushings at all, they add so much stiction and ruin the feel. ( the Igus bushing are good if you can get the right fit , but they still wear way to fast )

    Dougal is so correct on all the different tolerances , you really have to hand fit up each set up to really get them right .

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity Now View Post
    My new Fox CTD shock came with the new improved white Igus bushings (I think that's what they're called).

    I went to remove them to install needle bearings, but my bushing removal tool doesn't seem to work an them. So figured I'd just try them. Well, there is a lot of sideways movement in the bushings from new (maybe not a problem but odd), and some slop in the suspension as well (same feeling as you get with worn DU bushings).

    So questions are:

    What are other people's experiences with these bushings?

    How do you remove them?

    Cheers
    I know someone earlier in the thread said you can remove these from shock eyelet with a pencil, but does anyone else have any advice on how to remove these without destroying them? I need to reuse them since new ones are on back order.

    I'm referring specifically to the two-piece igus bushings on a Santa Cruz 5010. Here's a link:

    https://shop.santacruzbicycles.com/f...-reducers.html

    Thanks.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serenity Now View Post
    My new Fox CTD shock came with the new improved white Igus bushings (I think that's what they're called).

    I went to remove them to install needle bearings, but my bushing removal tool doesn't seem to work an them. So figured I'd just try them. Well, there is a lot of sideways movement in the bushings from new (maybe not a problem but odd), and some slop in the suspension as well (same feeling as you get with worn DU bushings).

    So questions are:

    What are other people's experiences with these bushings?

    How do you remove them?

    Cheers
    The top Fox bushing on my Turner Flux lasted less than a year. I typically get two years out of DU or DP4 Bushing. It's a costly replacement compared to just popping in a new DU or DP4 bushing........

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master Slater View Post
    I know someone earlier in the thread said you can remove these from shock eyelet with a pencil, but does anyone else have any advice on how to remove these without destroying them? I need to reuse them since new ones are on back order.

    I'm referring specifically to the two-piece igus bushings on a Santa Cruz 5010. Here's a link:

    https://shop.santacruzbicycles.com/f...-reducers.html

    Thanks.
    Use a knife to lever between the lip and shock eyelet on one side, alternate sides until it pulls out enough to grab with your fingernails and pull out.

    Then you can push out the remaining piece.
    Owner of www.shockcraft.co.nz, Mech Engineer, Tuner, Manitou, Motorex, Vorsprung EPTC, SKF, Enduro
    www.dougal.co.nz

  21. #21
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    In my experience, the majority of the time all you need to do with the FOX bushings is just replace the flanged bushing.
    $2 each= $4 per eyelet.
    Fox Shock Flanged Bushing IGUS Each
    5 minute fix after the shock is off the frame.
    You should not need to replace the entire assembly each time-black pin can last a long time.
    How long you can go between service intervals depends on many things- ride time, type of riding, frame alignment, initial hardware fitment( fit will vary a bit with almost all shock mounting hardware-some install tight, some install loose, some are just right).
    I've had bikes that eat all sorts of shock hardware.
    This summer got the entire bike park season out-60+ days riding on one set of FOX bushings on my Nomad running a Vivid Air.
    Same bike and same type of riding was requiring DU replacement on a CCDBA every month.
    My Tallboy needed FOX bushing replacement twice this summer even though it was ridden less.

    FOX= simple, easy, no special tools required. Maybe need a screwdriver or blade and socket depending on finger strength and dexterity.
    DU= simple, easy, tool required
    Longevity/durability can vary for all systems.

    How to remove=lots of videos out there.
    This one shows the use of a DU tool and small screwdriver on the FOX hardware.
    The DU tool is not needed though.
    You will need to use a small screwdriver or blade to pop the IGUS bushing out of the bore.
    The pin can usually be pushed out by hand, but if your fingers don't like that approach, a small socket or dowel works too.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 11053 View Post
    In my experience, the majority of the time all you need to do with the FOX bushings is just replace the flanged bushing.
    $2 each= $4 per eyelet.
    Fox Shock Flanged Bushing IGUS Each
    Are you running steel or aluminium pins? All the black anodised aluminium pins I see are chewed up by the time the bushings wear out. So the whole lot is scrap.

    The IGUS hardware I make uses stainless pins, so the bushings wear out (2 years plus) but the pins are good.
    Owner of www.shockcraft.co.nz, Mech Engineer, Tuner, Manitou, Motorex, Vorsprung EPTC, SKF, Enduro
    www.dougal.co.nz

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dougal View Post
    Are you running steel or aluminium pins? All the black anodised aluminium pins I see are chewed up by the time the bushings wear out. So the whole lot is scrap.

    The IGUS hardware I make uses stainless pins, so the bushings wear out (2 years plus) but the pins are good.
    Mix of steel and aluminum across several bikes.
    I'm unable to tolerate any noticeable slop or knock in the system, so I do replace the flanges more often than most riders would.
    Aluminum pins have been doing fine for me and I'm going through 3 or so sets of flange bushings before needing to replace the aluminum pins.
    When fitting used aluminum pins, if I can't get a tight fit in the new flanges then I replace the pin.
    "Problem" frames or shocks that appear to have excessive hardware consumption usually end up with a steel pin.

  24. #24
    MK_
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    Does anyone know the spec on the o-ring used in the 5-piece kit? I am missing the o-rings.

    "The things you get fired for when you’re young are the same things you get Lifetime Achievements for when you’re old."

  25. #25
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    I don't but I bet if you take the outer caps (where the o rings are seated) to a plumbing supply store they can match something up for you.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK_ View Post
    Does anyone know the spec on the o-ring used in the 5-piece kit? I am missing the o-rings.
    Metric, 12x1

  27. #27
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    For removing the white IGUS bushings, I tried the drift pin method but didn't want to mar the inside surface (and the eyelet) as they're in good shape and I'm just swapping them out for a needle bearing. I was able to remove them easily by carefully twisting with a small set of needlenose vise-grips. Didn't use the "vise" function; better feel for the pressure without. Barely a mark, and no distortion. The vise grips have flush ground sides so they're less likely to mar the eyelet, and they have ridiculously aggro teeth, meaning very little pressure is necessary to get enough bite. Ymmv depending how tight your eyelets are...

    To get the metal pins out and in, I've found nothing better than the Real World needle bearing tool with some threaded rod, nuts, and various washers and sockets. Wasn't sure if it would work when I ordered the tool, but with 4 shocks on the go it's getting a lot of use and really makes things easy. DU Bushing and Needle Bearing Shock Tool

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