Any lightweights on a 06 Z1 Light coil?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Any lightweights on a 06 Z1 Light coil?

    I'm looking to pick up a 06 Z1 light, but I'm concerned that I may be too light for the stock coil. I weigh 140lbs. Any other light weight riders running a Z1 light or is the Z1 SL the way to go at my weight?

  2. #2
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    The Z1 Light has a coil, but your spring rate is set via air pressure. It may be a little stiff during break-in but should be good to go after a few rides.
    "If you can get both wheels sliding with no brakes, that's when you really know that you're cookin." Nathan Rennie

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by beefmagic
    I'm looking to pick up a 06 Z1 light, but I'm concerned that I may be too light for the stock coil. I weigh 140lbs. Any other light weight riders running a Z1 light or is the Z1 SL the way to go at my weight?
    That spring is pretty wimpy. I think even at 120 lbs you've got to add 30 lbs of air pressure, at least according to the manual.

    Of course it may seem a little stiff, even at low pressure, until it's broken in and the stiction's gone.

  4. #4
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    Thanks guys. I'm not sure I trust Marzocchi's manual too much. I've heard of too many people throwing marz's recommendations out the window when it comes to air pressures, (this was in regards to the 66sl).

    I read on another thread that a heavier person was running very little air pressure and it was still a little too firm. Maybe it was because the fork hadn't been broken in yet.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by beefmagic
    Thanks guys. I'm not sure I trust Marzocchi's manual too much. I've heard of too many people throwing marz's recommendations out the window when it comes to air pressures, (this was in regards to the 66sl).

    I read on another thread that a heavier person was running very little air pressure and it was still a little too firm. Maybe it was because the fork hadn't been broken in yet.
    Granted I weigh 200, I am just running about 5 lbs less than they recommend.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by beefmagic
    I'm looking to pick up a 06 Z1 light, but I'm concerned that I may be too light for the stock coil. I weigh 140lbs. Any other light weight riders running a Z1 light or is the Z1 SL the way to go at my weight?
    I'm 175 and with no air pressure I only get 22% sag. It seems to be different for a lot of people. There is a discussion on this a few topics down.

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    Quote Originally Posted by coolatt
    I'm 175 and with no air pressure I only get 22% sag. It seems to be different for a lot of people. There is a discussion on this a few topics down.
    I think from another thread I remember you mentioning yours is an OEM version? I wonder if it's got dual springs because the pressures you referred to sounded like my old Z150 with dual springs. Or maybe it's just got a significantly heavier spring.

    Here are the Z1 Light ETA pressures out of the 06 tech manual

    Rider’s weight
    Ibs 120 ÷ 155 155 ÷ 180 180 ÷ 210 210 ÷ 220+
    Positive air pressure
    psi 30 ÷ 40 35 ÷ 45 42 ÷ 52 52 ÷ 65

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by .Danno.
    I think from another thread I remember you mentioning yours is an OEM version? I wonder if it's got dual springs because the pressures you referred to sounded like my old Z150 with dual springs. Or maybe it's just got a significantly heavier spring.

    Here are the Z1 Light ETA pressures out of the 06 tech manual

    Rider’s weight
    Ibs 120 ÷ 155 155 ÷ 180 180 ÷ 210 210 ÷ 220+
    Positive air pressure
    psi 30 ÷ 40 35 ÷ 45 42 ÷ 52 52 ÷ 65
    It's only coil on one side. That side has no ETA. The other side is the RC2 damper. I wonder if there are different springs on OEM versions depending on the bike size. My coil is yellow if that's of any interest.

    To me these numbers seem to mean that the positive air numbers would be for a strictly air sprung fork. Air preload is what the coil forks have. I had to read the online PDF a few times to understand it.

    Anything over 10psi in either leg and I get no sag. Maybe if there was no oil in the legs I could see putting in that much air as there is more volume available. Which asks another question, what should the oil heights be. From the topic a few posts down it should be 60mm in each leg. Marzocchi's fork info is pretty brutal. Sram's fork manuals are much more informative

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolatt
    It's only coil on one side. That side has no ETA. The other side is the RC2 damper. I wonder if there are different springs on OEM versions depending on the bike size. My coil is yellow if that's of any interest.

    To me these numbers seem to mean that the positive air numbers would be for a strictly air sprung fork. Air preload is what the coil forks have. I had to read the online PDF a few times to understand it.

    Anything over 10psi in either leg and I get no sag. Maybe if there was no oil in the legs I could see putting in that much air as there is more volume available. Which asks another question, what should the oil heights be. From the topic a few posts down it should be 60mm in each leg. Marzocchi's fork info is pretty brutal. Sram's fork manuals are much more informative
    Yeah, I agree that the manual is pretty confusing. Just from personal experience with friends that have the 66 and Z1 Light ETA the Positive Air pressure ranges seemed to apply. I know they're all running higher than 15 psi. There's no Negative air on these forks though. I know one friends 66 L ETA practically sags under its own weight without air.

    Now the dual coil 66 RC2X seems to use the Preload Air pressures that are super low. Even just a little seems to stiffen up that fork a lot. That fork has air Preload in both legs, I just adjusted one.

    Maybe somebody else can really clarify this.


    The only oil level info I've obtained is by taking directly to Marzocchi. Their website tables only show volume - at least the last time I looked...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by .Danno.

    The only oil level info I've obtained is by taking directly to Marzocchi. Their website tables only show volume - at least the last time I looked...
    What did they tell you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by coolatt
    What did they tell you?
    Don't know about that particular fork, but I just put in a request for the 66RC2X levels (a friends brand new fork that has lost rebound) and I included the Z1 L ETA too. Probably take a couple days like usual to get the answer, which is about the same as contacting them by phone

    I wish they'd just include the heights as well as volumes in their table.

  12. #12
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    Hi,
    I have a 05 Z1Fr1.
    It has 2 springs in it. A yellow one (which is medium or standard weight) and a grey one on the ETA side.

    I am 148ish and the stock setup is much too stiff for me.
    So I took one spring out, which forced me to adding air to the rebound side, which totally killed plushness and added stiction.

    Then I came to know that Marzocchi offers softer springs for their 06 lineup (these springs also fit my Z1Fr1 although only on the rebound side)
    Those SOFT springs are RED. They should help you.
    But I have to say that they´re still relatively stiff.
    I get only 15% sag and that actually sucks, because I like my fork to be ultra plush and it also doesn´t make sense, with my SPV rear shock. which has about 35-40% sag.
    So, after tinkering and messing around with oil levels and air pressures and on and on and on. I am going to sell my Z1 and get a Pike instead. They offer REAL soft springs.

    It´s a pitty though, because I like the Z1 a lot.

    Greetings Znarf

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    Bummer. that's not what I wanted to hear.

    I like to run about 30-35% sag on my rear shock and right now I'm getting about 10-12% sag on my fork. part of that is due to the geometry of my bike giving me more of a rearward positioning. I'd like to get 20-25%.

    I was considering the Pike but I really want a fork that has at least 150mm, and ideally 160mm down to 130mm since my rear shock travel switches between 5-6". I could wait for the lyrik but I can't afford to drop close to 1k for a fork.

    What kind of bike is the Z1 on? have you considered a 06 Z1 sl? I've heard they can be as plush as a coil (after an extended break in period) and you can adjust travel settings via the pos and neg air chambers.

  14. #14
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    Hi,
    my bike is a Santa Cruz Heckler.
    I too have a rather backwards riding position.
    Would like to steepen things up a bit.
    I had a 05 Pike SL, loved it, but had some quality issues with it, so got rid of it and got the Z1 for a good deal.

    The Lyric would be perfect, but I´ll never gonna buy something again, which is in its first year of production. The Pike is now top notch and fixed for 06.
    So given the circumstances, spring rate issues and all, I think I´ll get a Pike.
    I get only 110mm of travel during a rougher trail ride, on a 150mm fork!
    So I guess a 140mm fork, which actually reaches 135mm (which my last Pike did) during a decent ride, is the better solution for me.
    Besides the Pike is quite good in price/andwhatyougetforyourmoney terms.

    An air sprung Marzocchi is a no go for me.
    I don´t like the feel of the air forks, even the more sophisticated ones feel a tad different. I don´t like messing around with pos/neg chambers and bottom out chambers and corresponding oil levels and PAR chambers and all that

    Additionally I need a travel adjustment, ON THE FLY
    At least here, where I ride it´s quite useful.
    I also ride during winter and keep my bike in a heated room, when I set air pressures inside, then go outside I´d always have to reinflate the chamber, because of the big temperature difference.

    So Pike Coil is the way to go.

    Let me know how you solve your problem!
    Looking forward to hearing some fresh new ideas

    Greetings Znarf
    Ps: Don´t bother my bad english, I am from Germany
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  15. #15
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    Nice bike Znarf. thanks for posting a pic of it. As for the solution, I'm really wanting to stay with a coil fork. Someone in another thread mentioned that the SL's tended to brake dive more than coil forks. I'm not sure if this would even be an issue with me, but it's hard to find an already broken in SL tuned to your weight to test ride and find out.

    I may have to wait and see how the 07 AM 1 performs. Although, It may end up having the same problem for me. another thing I thought of would be to put a soft pike spring with spacers into a Z1.

    has anyone done this? are the springs close to the same diameter?

  16. #16
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    I actually was thinking of something similar. But I thought about putting in the whole U-turn and spring assembly of a Pike. So I´d have a Z1 with U-turn.
    That would be quite nice. But I instead could also get a Pike Less fiddling and still warranty.

    the springs of a manitou sherman would probably be easier to install somehow.

    greetings znarf

    regarding the 07AM1. It will cost probably as much or not much less than a Lyric I think. And the ATA works with incredibly thin Kevlar wires. doesn´t sound too reliable to me.

  17. #17
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    What was wrong with your 05 Pike, Znarf?

    Post better pics of the chick across the street.

  18. #18
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    Hi,
    nothing wrong with the 05Z1. Just the springs are a bit too stiff for me and I even have the soft ones

    The chick on the street is not even average. I live next to the university I study geography and german. 90% chicks (70% are really HOT) and 10% guys(most of them are dorks, but very nice and intelligent)

    So if you´d like to come to Germany, it´s worth it.

    Greetings Znarf

  19. #19
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    What was wrong with the Pike, Znarf?

    Now - stop posting about forks and post hot chicks, dammit.

  20. #20
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    the Pike was/is a nice fork.
    Was a tad bit short for the Heckler(for freeride purposes)
    but it started leaking oil at the compression knob(known issue with the 05 first series) and had a creaking issue, sort of a loose stanchio/crown fitting.
    had problems to warranty it, because it was an OEM fork.
    German distributor is the biggest POS(here: PLACE OF SH*T) one can imagine. They messed up the fork while "repairing" it. The fork never felt as good as before. Then I came across the Z1FR1, got it for cheap and sold the Pike to a hack, who still doesn´t bother with the issues, he says he destroys everything anyway.

    I am still trying to figure wether I should keep the Z1 or not. Don´t know. A buddy is willing to pay me 300€ for it. I can get a brand new, aftermarket Pike 426 with warranty and all for 375€. Maybe in early August there will be offers for 330€ or something
    .
    But I also have a brand new, self built Saint/Mavic EX823 Tubeless rearwheel and 2 other new EX823 rims and I therefore could use a Saint front hub and spokes and of course 2 UST tires. BUT I could also sell the rims and the new built wheel, keep my Saint/singletrack wheels and buy a Pike and a nice ring for my girl .

    At least I could also NOT spend any money on my bike, cause everything works relatively fine(drivetrain needs to be replaced though), but after all I am a upgrade/parts whore.
    And it is so much fun testing new parts.

    I prefer the U-turn over the ETA, because the U-turn keeps the fork active and soft while climbing, I love technical, steep uphills. SO if I end up finding a closeout on a 06 Pike, I might give it a try, depending on my financial situation and other wishes and needs.


    greetings znarf

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