2010 Fox RP23 w/Boost Valve Worth the $ over 09?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    2010 Fox RP23 w/Boost Valve Worth the $ over 09?

    I am upgrading my 07 Stumpy with an RP23 7.785x2.0. So my question is it it worth the extra $100-125 to get a 2010 with the Boost Valve or should I save that money and go with a discounted 09 model? What exactly is Boost Valve and how does it improve the shock over the normal propedal? I looked on their website but just couldn't quite understand what it does. I am no expert in shocks and terminology so I'm sure thats why. I guess I need layman's terms.
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  2. #2
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    Using a DHX 5 air and coil which have boost valve, and having ridden Floats as well, i say save the money and get the float with the boost valve.

    The boost valve allows you to tune the progressiveness of the shock, more air in the boost valve makes the shock more progressive, less air makes it less progressive. If you plan to use the bike for AM riding with drops and a few jumps and want not, then the boost valve float will be a worthy choice

  3. #3
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    I'm still up in the air about the 2010 shock.
    I guess it depends on what you're looking for.
    It is very plush...but, the pedal platform feels too light to me.
    I have an 09 coming to compare....

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick_M2R
    Using a DHX 5 air and coil which have boost valve, and having ridden Floats as well, i say save the money and get the float with the boost valve.

    The boost valve allows you to tune the progressiveness of the shock, more air in the boost valve makes the shock more progressive, less air makes it less progressive. If you plan to use the bike for AM riding with drops and a few jumps and want not, then the boost valve float will be a worthy choice
    What do you mean by progressiveness of the shock?

    "the pedal platform feels too light to me."

    What exactly does this mean?

    Also, just to make sure I am thinking correctly, what exactly does "plush" mean? I assume it means smooth over bumps but I really have no idea.

    Sorry for these questions, but I am a newb with most of these terms.
    If it helps, I do mostly XC riding and am looking for a more efficient shock than my Triad. I want a shock that will eat up all the rocks and roots but will also climb more efficiently. I don't do many drops and jumps except when I am riding away from home turf. Its more technical roots. As I said, I really want a more efficient climber that will not have as much pedal bob as the Triad while still soaking up all the bumps. It seems the Propedal on the Triad use to do a better job. I guess it needs to be rebuilt but I would rather upgrade if I am putting money into it. In addition, the upgrade will increase my travel from 120 to 140. Thanks for the help.
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  5. #5
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    Plush does mean it soaks up bumps great.
    Platform is the pro pedal....I think it needs to be a little stiffer( I tend to stand and sprint out of corners). The 2010 does react to bumps better in pro pedal mode....no harsh feeling.
    I race xc and trail ride on a Lenz Leviathan.

    You may want to check with Push Ind(they are a sponsor of the forum)....they do great work with your current shock.I had a Fox /Specialized Septune that did not have very good pro pedal that they did a great job on...much cheaper than a new shock.Unfortunately for me, they aren't working on the 2010 Fox yet.

  6. #6
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    Progressiveness means how the shock seems to "harden" as it goes through its travel

    OK, in newb terms that means as the shock goes through its travel, it feels as if its gettin stiffer or harder to move. This is Progressiveness, and its purpose is to help prevent bottom out.

    Plush can mean how smooth and supple the shock may feel as it goes through its travel, it can be a bit hard to explain. Think of when you jump on a cushiony sofa, that "plush" feeling you get as you land on it? well this is what the plushness of a shock may feel like

    Pedal Platform is a form of dampening that affects the first small part of the shocks travel, and it is designed to help reduce pedal bob which plagues dual suspension bikes. Propedal is fox's version of a pedal platform damper. when "the mayor" said that the pedal platform feels to light, i assume he means that even when the propedal is turned on full, there is still a fair amount of pedal induce suspension bob.

    These are as simple as i can put them and i hope it helps.

    If you have anymore questions dont hesitate to ask!

  7. #7
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    I hate to add to your confusion...but if you go with a new shock, keep in mind that they come in different "tune" levels.
    They have different base settings for rebound, velocity and boost.( they are found on the sticker on the shock) These are usually spec'd by the bike manufacturer.
    One of the beneifts of having Push ( or another suspension company) valve your shock is that it is valved for you ( your weight,bike and riding style)...as opposed to a generic number.

  8. #8
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    Thanks for your help guys. I really appreciate it. I knew about the different tunes. I am thinking a low compression(meaning it will take more force to make the shock compress correct?) tune will be the most efficient climber while it may not be quite as smooth over bumps. I will probably go with a medium rebound since it has a wide range of adjustability anyway. Given my type of riding, I don't think Boost will really benefit me that much. I am not too worried about bottoming out. I think I can get the same benefit with a low or medium compression shock and adjusting the Propedal settings accordingly given I don't do any drops over 2' on a regular basis and even those are rare.

    Mayor, on the 2010 with the light pedal platform, what compression setting do you have? Just curious, if I am thinking right, a low compression shock will have a much heavier pedal platform than a high compression shock will.

    Will a low rebound setting have a slow rebound or a fast rebound? I know that it is adjustable but what about the actual factory setting as high, medium or low?
    Last edited by chuckie33; 06-26-2009 at 09:09 AM.
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    chuckie,
    don't take this the wrong way...but you have it all backwards.
    Here's a reply from Darren at Push Ind from another thread on the same topic:
    [COLOR="Blue"]The medium on rebound refers to the high speed shim stack on the piston of the shock. Generally set by the bike mfg and FOX as an ideal setting for a certain air pressure range. Light for lower air pressure settings, medum for mid level air pressure settings, firm for higher air pressure settings.

    The Velocity rating is for the speed sensitivity of the compression damping, while the boost setting refers to the amount of Propedal and position sensitivity built into the compression damping force curve. Higher velocity ratings and boost ratings indicate increased levels of compression, while lower ratings indicate less.

    Darren/COLOR]


    Even for people with experience in suspension...it's easy to get this stuff wrong and end up with wasted money.
    I would suggest giving Push a call...they have always been helpful to me

    And...I am still playing with the shock settings.....between air,sag and rebound there are a lot of combos that effect and over lap each other.
    Last edited by the mayor; 06-26-2009 at 09:49 AM.

  10. #10
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    If it helps, all "boost valve" Fox shocks I have tried are super plush but have lackluster propedal and are heavier. I like my air shocks light and efficient, and my coil shocks plush and consistent ... so that's my opinion. If you put most emphasis on plushness, weight and platform would determine what I would want. I could be completely retarded, since I haven't tried the RP23 with this valve, but I have tried the DHXAir, DHX coil, RP23, RP3, Float R, and lots of other iterations and those are my observations ... I doubt the new RP23 is a big deviation.

  11. #11
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    ettore,
    That is what I'm finding. I run the pro pedal in 3 and it could use a little more platform( and I mean just a little more to be perfect)...but there is zero harshness.
    When I compare it to the RP23 on a Fisher Hifi29 ( I know, different linkage ratio and valving), the 2010 #3 propedal setting feels like #1 setting on the 08 version( I usually ran #2 on the 08). But on the 08, you could feel the initial harshness of propedal...that is completely gone on the new shock.So it is a give/take scenario.

    It is still better than the Septune that was on my Specialized FSR...that had 7 settings that did almost nothing...until I sent it to Push.I hated that bike ( for the way I ride)until I had the shock done.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by ettore
    If it helps, all "boost valve" Fox shocks I have tried are super plush but have lackluster propedal and are heavier. I like my air shocks light and efficient, and my coil shocks plush and consistent ... so that's my opinion. If you put most emphasis on plushness, weight and platform would determine what I would want. I could be completely retarded, since I haven't tried the RP23 with this valve, but I have tried the DHXAir, DHX coil, RP23, RP3, Float R, and lots of other iterations and those are my observations ... I doubt the new RP23 is a big deviation.
    That being said, I would rather have one without Boost Valve. I am willing to sacrifice plushness for pedal efficiency such as a better propedal system.

    As far as rebound and compression. Weighing 145 and running low air pressure, low rebound should work.
    Will a low compression/velocity setting not take more pressure to compress and a high compression takes less pressure to compress? That is a high compression tune compresses faster and easier than a low or is it just faster with the amount of force needed to compress the same with all settings? That is how I read what Push said.
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  13. #13
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    You still have it backwards.
    Low compression setting means the shock will compress quicker /easier.
    Low rebound setting means the shock will extend easier/quicker.

    Now...to really confuse you: Your bike has shock linkage that has a ratio that effects the speed of shock travel(velocity)...which effects what your shock needs for base settings.

  14. #14
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    Haha, Yep, I am thoroughly lost. I just going to have to call Fox or Push and see what they say. If they can't help with the ratio, I will have to call Spec I guess. Thanks guys.

    So I called Push and Fox and got everything straight. I was totally backwards like you said on the low vs. high compression. Low compression means a much more active shock with Propedal being less noticeable. After discussing everything with both companies, I am going with a high/firm compression setting and medium rebound (Fox's normal aftermarket tune according to the rep). I will probably send it to Push in time but I can't afford a new shock and Push service right now as I just invested in a 650B front wheel setup. Push also said they don't believe their factory tuning for 2010 shocks will utilize Boost Valve, though they haven't gotten their 2010 tuning kit fully setup yet. Thus, if I am going to get it Push tuned, there is no point in paying extra for a 2010 with boost valve when a Pushed 2010 will be exactly the same as a Pushed 2009. Thanks for all the help.
    Last edited by chuckie33; 06-26-2009 at 11:08 AM.
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    Glad you got it sorted out.
    ride it for the season...then send it to Push in the off season. You'll be glad you did

  16. #16
    Ole
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    '10 (how do you say that? One-oh?) has a much lower pressure behind the IFP, resulting in a lower overall preload. On my 19lb Spider FRO, the rear wheel now barely bounces when I drop the rear end from a foot. With the 09, the wheel would bounce and bounce because the IFP preloaded the shock a lot. The '10 doesn't lift the rear end as much during foward weight shifts, and seems to make it easier to stay seated through rougher sections. As a racing shock for a bike with an efficient suspension system, it seems like a step in the right direction.

    On my trail bikes (Original Tracer, Uzzi SLX, 5.5, 6.6 and now Tracer VP) , I've always used a coil shox, but I must admit, the '10 RP23 seems so promising that I'm temted to give it a try.

    Ole.

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    just to note the 2010 does have boost valve but it doesnt appear it is tunable like the DHX series. So the pressure behind the IFP is factory set like it or not I guess is the only option.

  18. #18
    Ole
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    If Fox wanted, they could make the IFP valve a Schrader instead of the syringe type. I'm looking into having a Schrader installed.

    The IFP-pressure is printed at the end of the air can, along with the shim stack configuration.


    Ole.

  19. #19
    arc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole
    If Fox wanted, they could make the IFP valve a Schrader instead of the syringe type. I'm looking into having a Schrader installed.

    The IFP-pressure is printed at the end of the air can, along with the shim stack configuration.


    Ole.
    I was able to re-thread a Schraeder valve from an old float (5/16-28 IIRC) and thread it in there on my old RP23.

    It held pressure for a couple days but there wasn't enough room in my frame to try riding it. The dust wiper looks like it would have ran into the Schraeder valve if my 7.875x2.25 shock ever bottomed hard. There's not much space down there, the hex nut part of the valve overhangs the shock shaft a little.

    How much IFP pressure is in your shock and do they state the IFP depth?

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Hill
    just to note the 2010 does have boost valve but it doesnt appear it is tunable like the DHX series. So the pressure behind the IFP is factory set like it or not I guess is the only option.
    Umm..... That would mean it isnt a boost valve wouldnt it?



    EDIT: seems your right, after checking on the fox website they still got that white plug over the valve hoel, aka no air valve

  21. #21
    Ole
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    Quote Originally Posted by arc
    How much IFP pressure is in your shock and do they state the IFP depth?
    I bought one aftermarket for my Spider FRO, and it had Rebound Tune M, High Speed L (compression shim stack) and IFP 225, which I assume is 225psi. It didn't say what the volume is. I don't know if the volume is the same on all models, or if it's changed with different PSI-settings.


    Ole.

  22. #22
    arc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole
    I bought one aftermarket for my Spider FRO, and it had Rebound Tune M, High Speed L (compression shim stack) and IFP 225, which I assume is 225psi. It didn't say what the volume is. I don't know if the volume is the same on all models, or if it's changed with different PSI-settings.


    Ole.

    The 225 could indicate an IFP depth of 2.25 inches and all the floats would then get the same pressure. This way the tech's would know how to tune/rebuild the shock if it ever went to one of their custom tuning centers.

    Or they could be using IFP pressure to somehow choke down compression oil flow as the shock gets deeper into its travel. But 225 PSI seems too high, I can't imagine running that much pressure on my bike without a major reduction of air can pressure.

    It would be nice to see an exploded diagram or a picture of all the parts inside one of these shocks, or at least an accurate description of how the boost valve actually works.

  23. #23
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    Iím going to upgrade my 07 Stumpy also with 2010 RP23. As far as the factory rebound and compression settings go, the more you weigh and the higher the air pressure you run in the shock, the higher the factory tune you should get? So I weigh 200 with gear and run 200psi in the shock so at least a M, M setting or higher. Are my assumptions correct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by steveccnv
    Iím going to upgrade my 07 Stumpy also with 2010 RP23. As far as the factory rebound and compression settings go, the more you weigh and the higher the air pressure you run in the shock, the higher the factory tune you should get? So I weigh 200 with gear and run 200psi in the shock so at least a M, M setting or higher. Are my assumptions correct?
    I'm thinking of going to a 2010 RP23. I'm 230 with gear. What did you go with and how is so far?

  25. #25
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    Looks from another post that you went with on 09. How does it ride?

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    Quote Originally Posted by attaboy
    Looks from another post that you went with on 09. How does it ride?
    I went with a 2009. If all the reviews for the 2010 were positive I would have paid the extra $150-$200 or so that it would have cost. I have not ridden the bike since I swapped shocks so a review will have to wait until after the ski season.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole
    I bought one aftermarket for my Spider FRO, and it had Rebound Tune M, High Speed L (compression shim stack) and IFP 225, which I assume is 225psi. It didn't say what the volume is. I don't know if the volume is the same on all models, or if it's changed with different PSI-settings.


    Ole.
    225 psi is not uncommon... Floats are usually happy at 250-300psi in the IFP. Not Boost-Valve thingies, though.

    IIRC, the 5th Elements and Swingers (yup, the Boost Valve is the same thing with a few tweaks for the good) used somewhere in the 50-150psi.

    Volume is more probably set by the IFP depth, but there is not much room for error on an in-line shock like the Float and you get better/more dramatic results by changing the pressure in the IFP as indeed, as pressure in the damper increases, the Boost Valve "chokes" oil flow.

    I agree that Fox should make the Boost Valve adjustable on the Float.

    But most probably their market research showed them that the average user for a Float is a rahter set and forget guy and then the warranty claims and such coming from people running too low or too high pressures as well as people wrenching at home would put too much cost into a shock that it's their bread and butter.

    For that they have the DHX Air and Coil.
    Check my Site

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by steveccnv
    I went with a 2009. If all the reviews for the 2010 were positive I would have paid the extra $150-$200 or so that it would have cost. I have not ridden the bike since I swapped shocks so a review will have to wait until after the ski season.

    Thanks,

    I'm trying to decide between having my RP2 Push'd, getting an 09 and Push'ng it, or going with 2010 RP23 with boost valve. I'll post when I decide and have time to check it out.

  29. #29
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    I'm sending my rp23 in for service tomorrow. It has a medium rebound tune and a low velocity tune with a 200 boost valve. That said, my propedal does nothing. I ride a 2010 diamondback mission and I absolutely love the plushness of the ride, but the lack of adjustability leaves me feeling cheated. I let almost all of the pressure out of the shock and found I could feel the platform when I compressed it with my hands, but I could still overcome it.
    I'm sure they'll send it back telling me there is nothing wrong.
    This is frustrating.
    If I were to get it Pushed what would I tell them to do? Would I just have to ask them to increase the platform and they would? Does that fall under the big hit kit? The shock is expensive enough without having to pay another $180 to make it work right.

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