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Thread: Tallboy 4

  1. #1201
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    Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by MaksK View Post
    My thoughts as I was demo'ing the new tb4. I have a tb3 and as much as I wanted to like new one, it felt so different and definitely aimed for going down. The tb3 is awesome for ups & downs ad it feels more playful and wants to pop from every small obstacles. I also feel more "in-the-bike" on tb3 as opposed "on-the-bike" on new one. Both L frames (I am 5.11)

    The new Tallboy lost all of its "XCishness". There is now to much of a gap between blur and tallboy now, the blur tr should get the tb3 frame.

    Its so different that I would build it as second bike now (with my current tb3) with 140mm Fox 36 Grip2, Reserve 30 wheels, DH brakes & tyres, etc.. It would make sick trail shuttle bike for Alps.
    I was on a TB3 prior to being warrantied to the TB4. I was very skeptical of the new bikes numbers and geometry, aside from the STA. I thought it would be too slack, too long, and too plush. I have 500 miles on it now, vs 4000 on the 3. All my fears were unrealized. The 4 climbs better than the 3. It maintains traction better and has not gotten light/wandery even on very steep climbs. I cleaned a very steep tricky straight up hill climb that I had never cleaned before just last week. Iíve PRd many XC segments on the 4 that I had put many hard efforts on with the 3. I raced the Ashland CES and PRd every segment in Ashland that I put in effort in on.

    I think the 3 holds a very slight edge with out of the saddle straight line sprinting. Like a start sprint. Once up to speed the 4 is as efficient as the 3.

    The traction/tracking of the rear end on the 4 is amazing. So much less chattery while pedaling while maintaining its efficiency.

  2. #1202
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    Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by Panttaani View Post
    Hey gerard29er, it would be cool if you can share your thoughts after your test rides. Any info would be appreciated
    Meanwhile I have done the testrides the previous weekend.
    It was very close for me between the TREK Fuel EX (in XL with 500mm reach) and the Santa Cruz Tallboy (in XL with 490mm but I would go for the XXL with 515mm reach).
    Also it took me some rides to get used to the Tallboy, after two rides and one ride on the TREK I was not yet convinced on the Tallboy, but partly simply because of the smaller size I guess. Then I did a ride on the Hightower and it was as if it felt bigger/better. I thought this can not be, so then I had to do a third ride on the Tallboy after of course also getting more used to track and paid more attention. The Tallboy was especially climbing and jumping very well and feeling really poppy, which feeling the TREK did not have. Also steep climbs doing standing on the pedals felt great, I actually did not try that the rides before. The steep seat tube angle feels very good and I think it also needs it because it also helps you have more weight towards the front already without having to move much on your saddle. Of course also descending with the slack head tube angle feels very good. But personally I would be helped even more with more reach as the XXL will give.
    To be sure I also did another go on the TREK Fuel EX and wanted also to try climbing standing on the pedals but the TREK really was not inviting me to really do that, also partly because I was a bit more fatigued in the legs but still it was clear the the Fuel EX was less optimal for that.

    In the end the confidence especially the XXL will give me, which I think more than an XL TREK, already made me prefer the Tallboy and the way climbing feels even out of the saddle really helps.

    But I must say that on very twisty singletrack with the TREK it was so easy to make the turn while with the Tallboy you at least had to work more, looked like with the Tallboy you had to dive lower and drive a bit more aggressively to have it feeling well.

    So I am not sure it is bad at very twisty singletrack but at least without adjusting your riding style it is easier with the TREK and for me that difference could become even bigger having the XXL but I will take that risk and still think the Tallboy is also not too bad in quick turns.
    Also spoke to another guy, but also smaller and lighter person, he was also more in favour of the Tallboy but even also because of the way it handled turning in twisty single track, he also mentioned you had to dive more into the turns but that he liked that riding style.
    Just mentioned that because your focus seems to be on slow twisty singletrack.
    Think the Ibis Ripley has similar HTA as the TREK and STA similar to the Tallboy and you always hear how great the Ibis Ripley climbs, my guess would be that it will do twisty singletrack also very well similar to the TREK.

    Think the Tallboy is a bit more focussing the descending side and the Fuel EX (and even more the Ripley) bit more on the cross country feel and more forgiving and probably a lot of help for the less experienced riders. Also of course the Fuel EX has a more supple and bigger suspension so it will do the descending more comfortably.
    Well these are more or less my thoughts.

    My choice in the end is the XXL Santa Cruz Tallboy.
    Now I just have to decide on the colour, so difficult ;-) Also looking at the pictures the purple can look very good and probably a bit more elegant and neutral while rocksteady yellow is more apparent but still the base colour also has some nice greenish in it which is more or less visible depending on the light.
    Last edited by gerard29er; 11-06-2019 at 06:23 AM.

  3. #1203
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    Thanks gerard29er! Nice report


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    Quote Originally Posted by mestapho View Post
    The traction/tracking of the rear end on the 4 is amazing. So much less chattery while pedaling while maintaining its efficiency.
    Interesting. While the frame design does matter, I'm curious, what shocks are on each bike? Is the TB3 shock still stock or has it been tuned?

  5. #1205
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    Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    Interesting. While the frame design does matter, I'm curious, what shocks are on each bike? Is the TB3 shock still stock or has it been tuned?
    Stock on both.

    TB 3 fox performance elite
    TB4 fox factory

    Both set with sag near 25%

  6. #1206
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    Could anyone tell me max insert length on a large for a dropper post. About to order a 180 or 210 oneup v2 for my upcoming build but will be a while until frame arrives so I am getting parts for now

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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Could anyone tell me max insert length on a large for a dropper post. About to order a 180 or 210 oneup v2 for my upcoming build but will be a while until frame arrives so I am getting parts for now
    Not exactly sure on a large, but on the XL, the 210mm One Up post goes all the way in.

    One Up has a super short stack height, so if ANY 200+ is gonna fit, it'll probably be the One Up.

    That said, it almost feels TOO low. Can't run a small saddlebag anymore, and repeatedly going from fully down to fully standing feels like you're going from squatting on the ground to standing. Never thought there would be a "too low" but this is right on the limit for me.
    Tallboy 4 (coming soon!)
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  8. #1208
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    Tallboy 4

    Ordered an XL carbon C S-build yesterday. Can anybody tell me are the Reverbs on those bikes next yearís or this yearís models?

    This is going to be one looooong winter, as the ETA for my bike is the end of March
    Last edited by Panttaani; 11-06-2019 at 07:20 AM.

  9. #1209
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimsantos View Post
    Not exactly sure on a large, but on the XL, the 210mm One Up post goes all the way in.

    One Up has a super short stack height, so if ANY 200+ is gonna fit, it'll probably be the One Up.

    That said, it almost feels TOO low. Can't run a small saddlebag anymore, and repeatedly going from fully down to fully standing feels like you're going from squatting on the ground to standing. Never thought there would be a "too low" but this is right on the limit for me.
    I was on the list for a 200mm 9point8 dropper when they first came out and it took awhile to get used to that much drop. I'm 6'4" and feel it's right on the limit of too much drop. I wouldn't want more as the seat is basically gone and sitting on it when all the way down is very low. 150mm posts definitely feel like not enough though.
    Making shit harder than it needs to be isn't awesome, it's just...harder.

  10. #1210
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    Finally made a choice on the color so today my plan was to order an XXL Stormbringer Purple Tallboy frame but it turns out the delivery date (for Europe) became unknown :-/ while the xx1 AXS complete build is in stock.
    The Rocksteady Yellow does show one, week 18 2020
    Now trying to see whether maybe Santa Cruz UK has them since I did run into it on the internet.
    Unfortunately I could not make my decision earlier, really needed the testrides first, bit frustrating but lets see if its solvable ...

  11. #1211
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    Mine is due week 13 2020. I wonder how well the Santa Cruz ETAs hold true? Week 13 would be ok as Iím in Scandinavia but I hope itís not gonna be much longer than that. Preferably sooner

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    Quote Originally Posted by Panttaani View Post
    Ordered an XL carbon C S-build yesterday. Can anybody tell me are the Reverbs on those bikes next yearís or this yearís models?

    This is going to be one looooong winter, as the ETA for my bike is the end of March
    Was told reverb was this years model.

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    Sure hope it doesn't turn into Ripmo logistics all over again. Waited for 5 months last year....alltough one was almost entirely the bike shops fault.

  14. #1214
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    Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by Panttaani View Post
    Ordered an XL carbon C S-build yesterday. Can anybody tell me are the Reverbs on those bikes next yearís or this yearís models?

    This is going to be one looooong winter, as the ETA for my bike is the end of March
    Very nice!
    Well thats at least better than what I got to hear ;-)
    Still looking into other possibilities for example UK but is starting to look like I have to go to the Rocksteady Yellow one and then also be patient until at least week 18.
    Hope I know more soon.

  15. #1215
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    Tallboy 4

    All Iím going to say is you owe it to yourself to try the chain stay flip chip in the long position. Changed the bike for the better, up, down, let right and all around! So much more traction on climbing and so much more stable on the downs. Do it! Itís free!!


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  16. #1216
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    Thanks for posting as I was wondering how longer stay would ride

  17. #1217
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    Unless you have an aluminum frame which does not include the chain stay flip chip.

    When I asked SC if 2.6 tires would fit the al frame without the chip (information on the SC website said you had to extend the chain stay with the flip chip to fit the 2.6), they referred me to a drawing which described how to manually change the length so the 2.6 would fit the al frame.

    At least I think that is what the schematic was trying to tell me with little lines and drawings all over the place.

  18. #1218
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    Tallboy 4

    Decision made/changed, I will have an XXL Rocksteady Yellow Tallboy frameset ordered ETA week 18.

    Plan was to order a XXL Stormbringer Purple frameset but since Santa Cruz (Europe) currently can not guarantee the delivery I had to make the switch to Rocksteady Yellow. Luckily I had much trouble in deciding on the colour so I can live with switching back
    Unfortunately it does mean it will be a long wait, ETA is week 18 so end of April, at least I hope that still is the case when they order the frameset next tuesday ...
    I am in the luxurious position that I am also keeping my Cannondale Scalpel which through guarantee is now switched into a matte and glossy black Cannondale Scalpel Si (with Sour Apple Chris King hubs), so I think a Rocksteady Yellow Tallboy will go along well I will also make the difference between the bikes a bit bigger, by giving the Scalpel some more racy tires (Swalbe racing ray/ralph), maybe remove the dropper, and the Tallboy some bit beefier Maxxis tires (probably Rekon 2.4 WT and 2.35 Ardent Race).
    I just hope that the Tallboy is not too good and wins everywhere But since I live in the Netherlands I think I can switch between the two often enough. But until April it will be the Cannondale, hopefully soon in April I can go all the way with the Tallboy, really looking forward to it.
    Probably by that time I will ride it with the chainstay flipped to 440 and not sure yet on the other flip/chip, will just start in high.

  19. #1219
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    Tallboy 4



    This Is my baby! Frame up.. that's how I roll!


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    Rode the TB4 for a couple days in Sedona. Loved it coming from the Hightower LT. The TB lost nothing on descents with shorter travel and surpassed the climbing. The longer geo and HA felt a bit weird but got used to it right away. 👍🏽 btw the purple is really dark even in the sun and almost looks brown when it gets dirty.

  21. #1221
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    Anyone know if the alloy frame has iscg tabs? The TB3 alloy didn't.

  22. #1222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkman3371 View Post


    This Is my baby! Frame up.. that's how I roll!


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    Wow, what a beauty! And you already have it, jealous ;-)

  23. #1223
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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Anyone know if the alloy frame has iscg tabs? The TB3 alloy didn't.
    I think that none of the Santa Cruz alloy frames have had ISCG05 tabs since 2013, maybe 2014. sucks.

    EDIT: I'm thrilled to be wrong! Looking at a TB4 AL for my son's next bike.

  24. #1224
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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Anyone know if the alloy frame has iscg tabs? The TB3 alloy didn't.
    Yes

    Tallboy 4-20191114_092503.jpg

  25. #1225
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkman3371 View Post

    This Is my baby! Frame up.. that's how I roll!


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    Where did you source those sweet Ti bolts for the brakes and Matchmakers?

  26. #1226
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    Iíve got a demo Tallboy v4 CC dor thr next 2 days, shout if you have any questions.

  27. #1227
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    Quote Originally Posted by richt2000 View Post
    Iíve got a demo Tallboy v4 CC dor thr next 2 days, shout if you have any questions.
    Would be great to get your feedback. Also, what's your current ride, TB3?

    Enjoy!!! I'm looking forward to a future demo as well.

  28. #1228
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikericci View Post
    Where did you source those sweet Ti bolts for the brakes and Matchmakers?
    Thanks for the compliments!

    Those are the new G2 Ultimates offered with rainbow hardware. I have a small mobile bike repair business and I am a SRAM warranty center. This allows me to be part of the ambassador program with them for my personal bikes. I happened to catch the rainbow hardware brakes on the dealer sheets right as it was released, so I ordered them!

    I have a new Hightower as well. These bikes are similar in feeling in the cockpit but pedal much much differently.




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  29. #1229
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milkman3371 View Post
    I have a new Hightower as well. These bikes are similar in feeling in the cockpit but pedal much much differently.
    You mean the TB4 pedal better or just differently ?

  30. #1230
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerard29er View Post
    Wow, what a beauty! And you already have it, jealous ;-)
    Geez.... what a build. Very nice.


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    Got tired of pedaling my enduro bike everywhere and I was over hardtails. This thing dropped at the perfect time.


    MRP Ribbon, Saint brakes, and real tires w/ inserts. This one goes to 11...might make it to 12 when I get around to putting a real shock on it.

    East coast ripper.

    EDIT: Also, this bike (and probably all lower linkage bikes) needs moto foam bad. Random stuff like leaves get caught and make noises while riding. It's annoying.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tallboy 4-img_0276.jpg  


  32. #1232
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    Thanks Taildragger. Is that yours? Would you mind measuring the seat clamp? For the carbon it says 36.4, just wanted to know its the same for the alloy before I order the wrong sized bling

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    Coming from a Fuel EX which only had the single mino link to flip for a high/low setting. On the TB4, is it necessary to flip both the lower link flip chip AND the chain stay flip chip to change from high to low?

  34. #1234
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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Thanks Taildragger. Is that yours? Would you mind measuring the seat clamp? For the carbon it says 36.4, just wanted to know its the same for the alloy before I order the wrong sized bling
    Can't answer that, I'm just playing shop rat.

  35. #1235
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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Thanks Taildragger. Is that yours? Would you mind measuring the seat clamp? For the carbon it says 36.4, just wanted to know its the same for the alloy before I order the wrong sized bling
    For what itís worth, my Chameleon alloy used the same size clamp as my carbon Santa Cruz bikes.

  36. #1236
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    Santa Cruz website says 36.4 for aluminum and carbon Tallboys.

  37. #1237
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    Anyone know how the stock retail Fox DPX2 tune compares to the shock that comes on the Tallboy? The tallboy dps shock is tune id: DPXF (2020, FLOAT DPS, F-S, K, 3pos-Adj, Evol LV, Santa Cruz, Tallboy, 190, 45, 0.4 Spacer, LCM, LRL01, CML, Neutral Logo)

    I want to get a DPX2 online, but worry the tune won't be right.

  38. #1238
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhino View Post
    Anyone know how the stock retail Fox DPX2 tune compares to the shock that comes on the Tallboy? The tallboy dps shock is tune id: DPXF (2020, FLOAT DPS, F-S, K, 3pos-Adj, Evol LV, Santa Cruz, Tallboy, 190, 45, 0.4 Spacer, LCM, LRL01, CML, Neutral Logo)

    I want to get a DPX2 online, but worry the tune won't be right.
    You should call Fox; the stock versions may require a tuning change to accommodate low shock position. That is the case with the HT2, which is an $100 charge to modify the factory shock to a LL tune because they aren't making it as an aftermarket option (yet).

  39. #1239
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tedh View Post
    You should call Fox; the stock versions may require a tuning change to accommodate low shock position. That is the case with the HT2, which is an $100 charge to modify the factory shock to a LL tune because they aren't making it as an aftermarket option (yet).
    The problem is Fox doesn't have a DPX2 that fits.
    I'm the problem....

  40. #1240
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    From what I've read in this thread, it sounds like the 7.5x2 DPX2 would probably fit. The longer stroke would give you a little over 130mm of rear travel, but if you don't want that, you could just set up the shock with more air pressure or volume spacers to give you ~120mm of usable travel. I wouldn't be surprised if Fox may also be able to shim the stroke down to 45mm for you if you have them custom valve it.

  41. #1241
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    The 190x45mm size is found on many current ~120mm bikes. Tallboy4, Pivot Trail 429, Devinci Django, etc. The dpx2 is offered for at least the Pivot as OEM on some builds. On top of that, I personally saw a dpx2 on a TB4 at Snowshoe on Jordi's personal bike. When I asked him, he gave a corp answer on potential availability.

    I wouldn't be surprised to find the shock turn up as an aftermarket option in due time, esp since it is specially called out on Santa Cruz own website as a shock that fits.

  42. #1242
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    How do you think the TB4 would fare for a trip in Whistler/Pemberton ?

    I think the Tallboy make more sense for 90% of my riding, but then I think about the few mtb trip in FInale Ligure, potentially BC, local enduro... and I'm hesitating with the Hightower.

  43. #1243
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    How do you think the TB4 would fare for a trip in Whistler/Pemberton ?

    I think the Tallboy make more sense for 90% of my riding, but then I think about the few mtb trip in FInale Ligure, potentially BC, local enduro... and I'm hesitating with the Hightower.
    The tallboy is a very stiff short travel bike. It beat me up on some rocky red graded trails here in UK (red is between blue and black, donít think you have them in the americas). I am wincing now at the thought of whistler bike pike braking bumps on a tallboy - yelp!

  44. #1244
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    How do you think the TB4 would fare for a trip in Whistler/Pemberton ?

    I think the Tallboy make more sense for 90% of my riding, but then I think about the few mtb trip in FInale Ligure, potentially BC, local enduro... and I'm hesitating with the Hightower.
    I wouldn't buy a TB4 based on what you said there. Hightower is a better fit. Now, if you do a lot of XC racing and you don't want both an XC bike and an enduro bike... that's a reason to consider the TB4.

  45. #1245
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    Anyone know if a KS lev 150mm dropper or another 150mm dropper can fully insert to collar on a medium carbon tallboy?

  46. #1246
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuenstock View Post
    Anyone know if a KS lev 150mm dropper or another 150mm dropper can fully insert to collar on a medium carbon tallboy?
    I was able to slam the dropper on the medium demo I rode. It was a race face 150mm

  47. #1247
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    I am close to getting a TB4, but even after demoing both M and L on the same day, I am having a hard time deciding on the size. 5.8 /173cm/ with 31"inseam.
    Both felt good, M was definitely more fun on DH, but since it had a narrower bar, hard to say exactly how a L with the same bar would handle.
    L felt just a bit better on the ups, but a narrower bar and maybe a 40mm (instead of the stock 50) would be preferred.
    I am also planning to use a 140mm Pike (instead of 130) which will shorten the reach a bit more as well.
    My current bike is a L Nomad 3 which has about 1cm shorter reach than a M TB4.
    The M TB4 feels just like my Nomad (fit wise). The only difference is the steeper ST , which I appreciate, since I am sitting to the front of the saddle most of the time (even with the seat pushed all the way forward)

    I have asked this before, but would still like to hear from more people close to my height on TB4. Did you go M or L?

  48. #1248
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    Just demoed an L and an XL. Loved it.
    Thought that it felt like the chainstays were longer than the quoted 430mm. Measured them, Instinct is a wonderful thing...

    Chainstay length on tallboy is actually 435 amd 445mm depending on flip chip....

  49. #1249
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    Quote Originally Posted by richt2000 View Post
    Chainstay length on tallboy is actually 435 amd 445mm depending on flip chip....
    SCANDALOUS!!!


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  50. #1250
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    Quote Originally Posted by richt2000 View Post
    Just demoed an L and an XL. Loved it.
    Thought that it felt like the chainstays were longer than the quoted 430mm. Measured them, Instinct is a wonderful thing...

    Chainstay length on tallboy is actually 435 amd 445mm depending on flip chip....
    Interesting. How did you measure that exactly, based on the chain path? from middle axle rear to middle bottom bracket spindle?
    I wouldnít mind when it is indeed 5mm more but I am (or will be) on an XXL.

  51. #1251
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    Ill demo an L and XL

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

  52. #1252
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    Aluminum frame not rated for 2.6Ē tires

    Quote Originally Posted by Rev Bubba View Post
    Unless you have an aluminum frame which does not include the chain stay flip chip.

    When I asked SC if 2.6 tires would fit the al frame without the chip (information on the SC website said you had to extend the chain stay with the flip chip to fit the 2.6), they referred me to a drawing which described how to manually change the length so the 2.6 would fit the al frame.
    Santa Cruzís website has an error. The Aluminum frame has a max tire clearance of 2.5 and NOT 2.6 as the website currently states. A Santa Cruz tech I communicated with confirmed this and said heís been asking the web guys to correct the error.

  53. #1253
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    Anyone knows which Chris King Dropset headset should I use? Dropset 1 or 3 (which replaces 1).
    The upper bearing is the same for both: 41mm 45x45 upper
    The lower bearing is 52mm 45x45 (dropset 1) and 36x45 on (dropset 3)
    Santa Cruz recommends IS 41/28 IS 52/40

  54. #1254
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    My tallboy came with one in a king box, it's a Dropset 3, DS41 and DS52. Hope this helps.

  55. #1255
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    I finally got the medium TB4 XTR Reserve built up after a two-month wait and of course it is raining. Can't wait to break this thing in once it dries up. Happy to see it came with XTR cranks vs the advertised EThirteen.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tallboy 4-tallboy4.jpg  


  56. #1256
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnymotox11 View Post
    I finally got the medium TB4 XTR Reserve built up after a two-month wait and of course it is raining. Can't wait to break this thing in once it dries up. Happy to see it came with XTR cranks vs the advertised EThirteen.
    Beautiful! Good indeed that they could and did go with the XTR cranks now.
    I was also thinking about the XTR Reserve TB but made the switch to SRAM AXS and build up from frame, but I have to be patient for 5 months unfortunately.
    Hope you have good weather for a break in ride soon ;-)

  57. #1257
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    DVO Topaz 3 190x50. Anyone tried this or know if it would fit? I could put a reduced to limit it to 45mm stroke. But I think there is room for 50mm which would give it 133mm travel. Not to mention the Topaz is super supple off the top which would feel closer to the time on the HT2 Super deluxe
    Last edited by aappling72; 12-02-2019 at 06:30 PM. Reason: Add text

  58. #1258
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    I am close to getting a TB4, but even after demoing both M and L on the same day, I am having a hard time deciding on the size. 5.8 /173cm/ with 31"inseam.
    Both felt good, M was definitely more fun on DH, but since it had a narrower bar, hard to say exactly how a L with the same bar would handle.
    L felt just a bit better on the ups, but a narrower bar and maybe a 40mm (instead of the stock 50) would be preferred.
    I am also planning to use a 140mm Pike (instead of 130) which will shorten the reach a bit more as well.
    My current bike is a L Nomad 3 which has about 1cm shorter reach than a M TB4.
    The M TB4 feels just like my Nomad (fit wise). The only difference is the steeper ST , which I appreciate, since I am sitting to the front of the saddle most of the time (even with the seat pushed all the way forward)

    I have asked this before, but would still like to hear from more people close to my height on TB4. Did you go M or L?
    I'm a bit taller than you at 5'10", but I demo'ed the Medium and it felt great. I currently have a Medium HT and TB3, and the fit was about the same. I'm old school, and like tight technical riding, so I usually downsize when I'm on the fence. If most of my preferred riding was wide open high speed then I could see going large. Interestingly, I also rode the Medium Megatower, and it felt small, but there could be something else going on there with bike setup, I didn't look into it much.

  59. #1259
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    I recently added the Cane Creek DB Coil IL shock(190x45) to my Tallboy 4. Tallboy 4-img_3563.jpg

  60. #1260
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I recently added the Cane Creek DB Coil IL shock(190x45) to my Tallboy 4. Click image for larger version. 

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    Have you tried to remove the travel limiter and run it as 190x50?

  61. #1261
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Have you tried to remove the travel limiter and run it as 190x50?
    I just removed the spacer(travel limiter) and checked clearance at full bottom out without the spring installed. Seems that there is plenty of clearance.

  62. #1262
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I just removed the spacer(travel limiter) and checked clearance at full bottom out without the spring installed. Seems that there is plenty of clearance.
    Great!
    134mm rear/140mm front Tallboy will be sweet.

  63. #1263
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    Iíve had my size L XO1 Reserve for about a month now. Itís replaced a L Tallboy2 and L Bronson1. Weirdly it didnít feel much longer than them and the 800mm bars have felt natural, I donít feel a need to cut them down. Iím 5í10Ē and relatively normal proportions and all my riding is on natural trails. The LBS organized 170 cranks, which make a big difference to pedal strikes for little effect on efficiency in my view.
    Iíve beaten uphill PRs that were on the T2 and one steep downhill PR that was on the Bronson so Iím v happy with my T4 being the best of both my previous bikes. It definitely loves being ridden fast up or down! It feels so solid and confidence-giving whilst still being quite light and quick and grippy on the ups.
    The fork, Pike Select Plus, wasnít great, I had done a lot of work on my Mk1 Pike internally and this wasnít nearly as good. Iíve just given it a lower lube and it is waaaay better, there was oil in there but the grease on the seals was dry. The compression dial doesnít seem to have much effect, perhaps I should bleed it next time.
    The G2 brakes needed some servicing to reduce the throw and they still squeal but otherwise Iím liking them.
    The XO mech needed some adjustment, which is a pain when you canít see the sag but Iíve come up with a hack that works and I now have it shifting almost as well as my 10 speed XT.
    The DHR2 on the back doesnít grip as well as others that Iíve had, the compound feels hard but the DHF is excellent as usual.
    I sound a bit critical but I love the bike, just come off a fantastic ride on it this evening and still on a high!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tallboy 4-712632fd-5d98-482d-91aa-5dd0aa6ace6b.jpg  


  64. #1264
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    Is that a 140mm pike ultimate up front?
    2020 Yeti SB150
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  65. #1265
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryano4u View Post
    Is that a 140mm pike ultimate up front?
    My Pike Ultimate is currently set at 130mm. I do have a 140mm air shaft, I will probably swap in.

  66. #1266
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    I currently have a TB4 on order(coming off a 2018 OGHT) but just concerned with the travel drop. Riding is mainly SoCal with a lot of pedaling up for short(er) rockier downhills.

    Anybody have have any experience with that transition that can share some insight? Was able to demo the TB4 on a trail, but only got to give the HT2 a parking lot ride. The TB4 is a fun bike to ride for sure....just can't figure out if the 15mm travel drop is going to be noticeable given the new lowerlink VPP.

    Been through both HT2 and TB4 forums, doesn't seem that there is too much out there on a comparison between the 2 bikes.
    Last edited by NDnavy21; 12-03-2019 at 02:34 PM. Reason: grammar

  67. #1267
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    Iím going from OGHT as well. I think the T4 is going to be a more capable trail bike. Focus not on The drop of travel but more on geometry

  68. #1268
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I just removed the spacer(travel limiter) and checked clearance at full bottom out without the spring installed. Seems that there is plenty of clearance.
    How do you like the CC? Tempted to add one to my TB4 as well.
    I'm the problem....

  69. #1269
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDnavy21 View Post
    I currently have a TB4 on order(coming off a 2018 OGHT) but just concerned with the travel drop. Riding is mainly SoCal with a lot of pedaling up for short(er) rockier downhills.

    Anybody have have any experience with that transition that can share some insight? Was able to demo the TB4 on a trail, but only got to give the HT2 a parking lot ride. The TB4 is a fun bike to ride for sure....just can't figure out if the 15mm travel drop is going to be noticeable given the new lowerlink VPP.

    Been through both HT2 and TB4 forums, doesn't seem that there is too much out there on a comparison between the 2 bikes.
    Here ya go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKGG7BXnkBA

    ... and this one is a good one too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulPviM8Cddw
    2020 SC Hightower v2
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  70. #1270
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    I'm really thinking about swapping this fox 34 out for a Pike Ultimate 140 or a Fox 36 grip 2. I'm heavier than most riders at 240lbs and the fork isn't cutting it.. What do you suggest?
    2020 Yeti SB150
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  71. #1271
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryano4u View Post
    I'm really thinking about swapping this fox 34 out for a Pike Ultimate 140 or a Fox 36 grip 2. I'm heavier than most riders at 240lbs and the fork isn't cutting it.. What do you suggest?
    Defo go fox 36 at 240lb. It wonít seem so beefy when fox 38 comes out!

  72. #1272
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    Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I recently added the Cane Creek DB Coil IL shock(190x45) to my Tallboy 4. Click image for larger version. 

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    Thinking to do the same in my Tallboy. Hesitating between the 45 or 50m stroke, though I guess the 45 gives me the option to just remove the spacer.

    Do you mind sharing your weight and selected spring rate?

  73. #1273
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikericci View Post
    Thinking to do the same in my Tallboy. Hesitating between the 45 or 50m stroke, though I guess the 45 gives me the option to just remove the spacer.

    Do you mind sharing your weight and selected spring rate?

    I'd go 190x45mm and just remove the spacer. As far as spring rate, I went with a 500lb spring and I weight between 190-195lbs. The shock feels good now, but I might order a 550lb spring to try out. The new progressive wound coil that Cane Creek just came out with looks interesting too. Not sure if its needed on this bike though...

  74. #1274
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryano4u View Post
    I'm really thinking about swapping this fox 34 out for a Pike Ultimate 140 or a Fox 36 grip 2. I'm heavier than most riders at 240lbs and the fork isn't cutting it.. What do you suggest?
    Fox also has the advantage of 4mm less high axle to crown (547mm vs 551 for a Pike 140mm) which makes headtube angle not reduced too much.

  75. #1275
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    Tallboy 4-img_1de3eeec0aae-1.jpg

    Loosedog's new TB4. Check out the shock.....

  76. #1276
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    Quote Originally Posted by RxBike View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Loosedog's new TB4. Check out the shock.....
    I can't tell what it is from this pic other than an air shock with a piggyback. and?

  77. #1277
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    I can't tell what it is from this pic other than an air shock with a piggyback. and?
    Itís a rockshox Super deluxe. The first time Iíve seen it on this bike. I was under the impression that it didnít fit

  78. #1278
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    Quote Originally Posted by RxBike View Post
    Itís a rockshox Super deluxe. The first time Iíve seen it on this bike. I was under the impression that it didnít fit
    They make one that fits but you need to be connected to get one.
    I'm the problem....

  79. #1279
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    Fox 36 140mm for Tallboy 4

    Quote Originally Posted by rscecil007 View Post
    Great, thanks for the info. I'd def go for the 36 then, I'd also would want it for the Grip2 damper.
    Did you go for the TB4 with the Fox 36 using 140mm? If so how do you like it?

  80. #1280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I recently added the Cane Creek DB Coil IL shock(190x45) to my Tallboy 4. Click image for larger version. 

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    Holy shit! Fantastic to see a coil fit so well!

    Big question, does it feel better than the DPS? Anyone chime in with a Super Delux?

    I'm between a Super Delux RCT and the DBc Coil...

  81. #1281
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    DPX2 and Super Deluxe are listed as compatible on SC website.
    I understood the challenging part was finding the Super Deluxe in 190x45.

  82. #1282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simann View Post
    Holy shit! Fantastic to see a coil fit so well!

    Big question, does it feel better than the DPS? Anyone chime in with a Super Delux?

    I'm between a Super Delux RCT and the DBc Coil...
    I think it definitely feels better than the DPS that comes stock on the bike. Its way more active over small to medium sized bumps.

  83. #1283
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    How much extra travel are people getting by removing the spacer in the shock? Can this be accomplished on the stock DPS?

  84. #1284
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDnavy21 View Post
    How much extra travel are people getting by removing the spacer in the shock? Can this be accomplished on the stock DPS?
    1. that seems unlikely to work given that the frame will mechanically bottom out shortly after the shock bottoms out. you'd have to change the link to increase travel but that will have consequences as well. frame designers don't do things just for the hell of it, so it's wise to consider what the bike was built to do and what it will do well.

    2. if you want more travel buy a hightower or a megatower. I know this is little help if you already bought a TB4, but it's true. buy the right bike, or multiple right bikes, or try to improve the quality of the travel that the bike already has, to fit your riding needs and preferences.

  85. #1285
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    Right. That was the way I understood things....that geometry of the linkage limits the amount of travel.

    However, I was asking because there are a few posts in this thread discussing bumps in travel achieved with shock changes and adjustments....posted by some much more knowledgeable people than myself.

  86. #1286
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    Here is a picture of my bike with the spring removed and the 5mm spacer taken out. You can compress the rear shock all the way until it hits the bumpstop.
    Tallboy 4-img_3564.jpg

  87. #1287
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDnavy21 View Post
    How much extra travel are people getting by removing the spacer in the shock? Can this be accomplished on the stock DPS?
    190x50 will give 14mm more than 190x45
    TB4 works with the Cane Creek 190x50.
    Not sure if the DPS 150x45 is just a 150 x 50 with a spacer removed.

  88. #1288
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I think it definitely feels better than the DPS that comes stock on the bike. Its way more active over small to medium sized bumps.
    If you had a choice to go with either, would you pick the coil? What was the weight difference?
    Not sure if I should just go straight to coil or get the DPS Elite performance for now with the warranty frame.

    I talked to fox and they say they would need the specific part # to determine if the DPS on the TB4 is 190x50 with a spacer making it 190x45 or just a 190x45shaft.

    190x50 with a spacer inside is a most likely scenerio, but the spacer removal process isn't just a simple process. Fox says the shock would have to be sent to them. Either way, this will remove the possibility to change the travel with simply just removing/inserting the spacer like with the Cane Creek coil inline.

  89. #1289
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    If you had a choice to go with either, would you pick the coil? What was the weight difference?
    Not sure if I should just go straight to coil or get the DPS Elite performance for now with the warranty frame.
    I have extensive experience riding both of these shocks on my Intense Spider 275c. I spent about a season riding the stock DPS Elite EVOL, and now I've been riding it with a slightly longer stroke DB Coil IL for a couple seasons.

    I can say that the difference between the two shocks on that bike is night and day. The DB is much more supple, more supportive through the mid stroke, way more adjustable, and has a better feeling climb switch that doesn't sacrifice as much comfort or traction. I also like that the climb switch is infinitely adjustable if you don't want it all the way on or off. If I remember correctly, the coil shock added around half a pound with a VALT spring. Well worth it for the performance gain. The only downside is it bottoms out more easily, but it still feels much better than the DPS even after stepping up to a firmer spring rate. Bottoming may not be as much of an issue with the Tallboy's new leverage curve. Hopefully Ordinarybikes chimes in with his experience with the shock on the TB4.

  90. #1290
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    If you had a choice to go with either, would you pick the coil? What was the weight difference?
    Not sure if I should just go straight to coil or get the DPS Elite performance for now with the warranty frame.

    I talked to fox and they say they would need the specific part # to determine if the DPS on the TB4 is 190x50 with a spacer making it 190x45 or just a 190x45shaft.

    190x50 with a spacer inside is a most likely scenerio, but the spacer removal process isn't just a simple process. Fox says the shock would have to be sent to them. Either way, this will remove the possibility to change the travel with simply just removing/inserting the spacer like with the Cane Creek coil inline.
    I'd honestly go straight for the coil. If you want to buy a lightly used Fox Factory series DPS in 190x45, let me know. The coil is much better if you value downhill performance. The bike is 1/2-3/4lb heavier and its not as snappy as far as pedaling performance. I utilize the Climb Switch, where as I would just leave the Fox DPS shock open. The Coil shock moves into its travel much easier and really soaks up the small to medium sized hits much better. Bike feels more glued to the ground for sure.

  91. #1291
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlxah View Post
    I have extensive experience riding both of these shocks on my Intense Spider 275c. I spent about a season riding the stock DPS Elite EVOL, and now I've been riding it with a slightly longer stroke DB Coil IL for a couple seasons.

    I can say that the difference between the two shocks on that bike is night and day. The DB is much more supple, more supportive through the mid stroke, way more adjustable, and has a better feeling climb switch that doesn't sacrifice as much comfort or traction. I also like that the climb switch is infinitely adjustable if you don't want it all the way on or off. If I remember correctly, the coil shock added around half a pound with a VALT spring. Well worth it for the performance gain. The only downside is it bottoms out more easily, but it still feels much better than the DPS even after stepping up to a firmer spring rate. Bottoming may not be as much of an issue with the Tallboy's new leverage curve. Hopefully Ordinarybikes chimes in with his experience with the shock on the TB4.
    Thanks for the comment!
    Regarding the climb switch adjustment: is it separate from the open mode? Are these 2 different tunes for climb and open?
    My push 11-6 has two completely separate modes, where each one can be set individually (different low and high speed compression)
    How does it work with CC coil?

  92. #1292
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I'd honestly go straight for the coil. If you want to buy a lightly used Fox Factory series DPS in 190x45, let me know. The coil is much better if you value downhill performance. The bike is 1/2-3/4lb heavier and its not as snappy as far as pedaling performance. I utilize the Climb Switch, where as I would just leave the Fox DPS shock open. The Coil shock moves into its travel much easier and really soaks up the small to medium sized hits much better. Bike feels more glued to the ground for sure.
    Thanks! So more stable and less poppy...
    As long as the mid stroke support is there with the coil and it doesn't bottom out too often it sounds like the right choice.
    Any situations where the DPS could be better than the coil?

  93. #1293
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Thanks for the comment!
    Regarding the climb switch adjustment: is it separate from the open mode? Are these 2 different tunes for climb and open?
    My push 11-6 has two completely separate modes, where each one can be set individually (different low and high speed compression)
    How does it work with CC coil?
    You can think of the climb switch on DB shocks as a single knob that simultaneously increases both LSC and LSR. Most climb switches or lockouts (e.g. the DPS) only increase LSC. On the Cane Creek, I believe the high speed adjusters will affect both open and climb modes, but the climb mode bypasses the low speed adjusters with separate preset low speed circuits.

    The Cane Creek doesn't firm up quite as much as the DPS, but it has a much more damp or dead feeling to it because of the slower rebound. Cane Creek claims the slower rebound improves efficiency to help make up for the softer LSC tune, but I don't how much merit there is to that. It's definitely more comfortable in the saddle since the LSC isn't as firm and the slower LSR doesn't buck back up as quickly after hitting a bump. It also provides better traction than the DPS climb mode perhaps thanks in part to the coil spring. I think it's a perfect match for bikes that already pedal reasonably well like the Tallboy, although if you do a lot of smooth, paved road climbing or are competing for KOMs on a lot of less technical climbs, you may miss the firmer lockout of the DPS.

  94. #1294
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    Looks like I am out of luck with my warranty replacement.
    Purple med out of stock till end of July. Might have to go with the yellow.

  95. #1295
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    Has anyone built up a decked out alloy tb? Iím going to add a tallboy to compliment my megatower but am not looking to spend over 7k again. I did some quick math and can get together an alloy build with gx, pike ultimate, g2 rsc brakes, and carbon wheels for around 5k. (I have some parts already)

    The carbon S build would be great except for the 34 on it(i just sold a bike with a 34 performance elite and didnít like it). So swapping that and reserve rims puts it up to the price of the X01 and more than I want to spend. I wouldnít expect to get much selling the stock fork either so that is a sunk cost.

    Any other build ideas? My base goals are to have the pike ultimate, g2 rsc brakes and carbon wheels while staying below the 6k mark since this will be my secondary bike but still be used for some of the more pedal heavy enduros.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  96. #1296
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Looks like I am out of luck with my warranty replacement.
    Purple med out of stock till end of July. Might have to go with the yellow.
    I know the problem although for me it is not a warranty replacement. They couldnít even mention a month so I went for yellow but even for that I have to wait until end of April. Hopefully it will be there by then and should be worth the wait.
    I had a hard time deciding on the color although in the end clearly wanted Stormbringer Purple. But the Rocksteady Yellow also has its nice points its just more present but a bit strange of a color, I will just now go the more exuberant way and put also some more fluor yellow decals on the rims and handlebar, magura brakes with yellow and black makes a beautiful contrast.
    You will also like the yellow and once you ride it, it will be the bike itself which you will really like and then you also like the color certainly with some mud on it ;-) At least that is my idea.

  97. #1297
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    Wow, to me sounds like the purple is totally sold out. The new colors come out around July/August. Tallboy selling very well. Iím holding out until summer. Iím hoping they release next yearís model with the dpx2 and fingers crossed, a nice blue color. I wish they would re release the 2 toned blue 5010 combination from 2015. Best color Santa Cruz ever put out imo.

  98. #1298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mluisgr81 View Post
    Wow, to me sounds like the purple is totally sold out. The new colors come out around July/August. Tallboy selling very well. Iím holding out until summer. Iím hoping they release next yearís model with the dpx2 and fingers crossed, a nice blue color. I wish they would re release the 2 toned blue 5010 combination from 2015. Best color Santa Cruz ever put out imo.
    I don't think the new colors will be out in summer, more like the end of 2020/spring 2021.

  99. #1299
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    You may be right because they released the v4 in the fall. I was going off what SC traditionally does when they update the colors.

  100. #1300
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mluisgr81 View Post
    I wish they would re release the 2 toned blue 5010 combination from 2015. Best color Santa Cruz ever put out imo.
    I agree - I loved that blue color and wish I still had the bike!
    The Stormbringer Purple is definitely nice though.

  101. #1301
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    Just received my purple frame. All parts have arrived. Was wondering how many 5mm headset spacers come stock on the Tallboy? Also for those that are doing custom builds how many are you guys running?
    Thanks

  102. #1302
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    I donít know what stock is, but I put 15mm on mine. The XL has a 140mm head tube vs my old Bronsonís 120, so it made sense to put fewer on. Looks better at the very least.

  103. #1303
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    Quote Originally Posted by conformers View Post
    Just received my purple frame. All parts have arrived. Was wondering how many 5mm headset spacers come stock on the Tallboy? Also for those that are doing custom builds how many are you guys running?
    Thanks
    This is a fit decision, they include extra with a uncut fork new so you can dial it into you're needs. Are you coming off another bike? can you measure your bar height to the ground, start there, and see how it feels.

  104. #1304
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    Quote Originally Posted by conformers View Post
    Just received my purple frame. All parts have arrived. Was wondering how many 5mm headset spacers come stock on the Tallboy? Also for those that are doing custom builds how many are you guys running?
    Thanks

    Ride it.
    If back aches, keep adding spacers until it stops.

  105. #1305
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    Quote Originally Posted by conformers View Post
    Just received my purple frame. All parts have arrived. Was wondering how many 5mm headset spacers come stock on the Tallboy? Also for those that are doing custom builds how many are you guys running?
    Thanks
    you definitely do not want to EVER cut your fork too short on a new build. dialing in the fit is so personal and it depends on not only you, but how you ride (body position), and the bar and stem you use. I always use at least 20mm spacers and then if you go down, keep at least one 5mm on top of your stem if you can (most stems allow this but a few don't) so that you can tune it later.

    it's not cool to have 20mm above the stem, I get that, but for god's sake don't cut that steerer too short and then regret it later.

  106. #1306
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    Quote Originally Posted by conformers View Post
    Just received my purple frame. All parts have arrived. Was wondering how many 5mm headset spacers come stock on the Tallboy? Also for those that are doing custom builds how many are you guys running?
    Thanks
    If you're trying to set up your saddle to bar drop similar to a previous bike the best thing to do is measure rather than compare to what other people are doing with spacers. That said, sometimes with a new bike you might find you want your drop to be more or less depending on the geometry. If you're ordering your bike, you could also ask SC to leave the steerer uncut.

  107. #1307
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    Well TB4 owners my delivery date was pushed out from Thanksgiving to xmas so I purchased a different bike (Evil Offering). I think after selling my sb130 in favor of riding my sb150 I realized I'm not really a short-travel rider. But I do love SC bikes. Have a great holiday season. For now, I'll just remain a SC fan instead of an owner!

  108. #1308
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    Thanks everyone for the replies. I can compare it to my old ride but the geo from a Tallboy LTC is way different. The fork is uncut, I just thought the santa cruz build kits all came with standard set of spacers.

  109. #1309
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerard29er View Post
    I know the problem although for me it is not a warranty replacement. They couldnít even mention a month so I went for yellow but even for that I have to wait until end of April. Hopefully it will be there by then and should be worth the wait.
    I had a hard time deciding on the color although in the end clearly wanted Stormbringer Purple. But the Rocksteady Yellow also has its nice points its just more present but a bit strange of a color, I will just now go the more exuberant way and put also some more fluor yellow decals on the rims and handlebar, magura brakes with yellow and black makes a beautiful contrast.
    You will also like the yellow and once you ride it, it will be the bike itself which you will really like and then you also like the color certainly with some mud on it ;-) At least that is my idea.
    So after I was told end of July for the purple M frame, it shipped today, with Monday delivery. What a pleasant surprise.

  110. #1310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I'd honestly go straight for the coil. If you want to buy a lightly used Fox Factory series DPS in 190x45, let me know. The coil is much better if you value downhill performance. The bike is 1/2-3/4lb heavier and its not as snappy as far as pedaling performance. I utilize the Climb Switch, where as I would just leave the Fox DPS shock open. The Coil shock moves into its travel much easier and really soaks up the small to medium sized hits much better. Bike feels more glued to the ground for sure.
    Are you still l liking the coil on the TB?

  111. #1311
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Are you still l liking the coil on the TB?
    Yes, I am liking the DB Coil IL.

  112. #1312
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    So after I was told end of July for the purple M frame, it shipped today, with Monday delivery. What a pleasant surprise.
    Wow that is great, congratulations!
    Hopefully soon I at least have a Cannondale Scalpel, almost completely new, to ride with, it is already long I have no mountainbike at all.

  113. #1313
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    Aluminum V4.

    Is anyone riding the alloy version? Price wise, the A/R kit seems like the most logical buying decision to me. Two lbs. over the C/S kit and the inability to run 2.6 tires are not a deal breaker. Any comments or experience?

    Thanks and Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and a Happy New Year too.

  114. #1314
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    first ride Tallboy 4-img_20191225_131803.jpg[ATTACH=CONFIG]1300971
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tallboy 4-img_20191225_140147.jpg  


  115. #1315
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    I'd go 190x45mm and just remove the spacer. As far as spring rate, I went with a 500lb spring and I weight between 190-195lbs. The shock feels good now, but I might order a 550lb spring to try out. The new progressive wound coil that Cane Creek just came out with looks interesting too. Not sure if its needed on this bike though...
    I am 140lbs. Do you think I should go with 400lbs, regular valt?

  116. #1316
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    Tallboy 4-whatsapp-image-2019-12-25-15.06.26.jpg

    mine with the 150mm FOX 36 I had laying around...still thinking if I should go for a 140mm, the rear end is so capable that is asking for more travel upfront

  117. #1317
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    I am 140lbs. Do you think I should go with 400lbs, regular valt?
    Jazzanova, I'd go with a #450 spring. Cane creek doesn't make a progressive wound spring small enough for this application. The recommended spring rate for myself came out to be 490ish so 500 was about perfect. As I said, I weigh around 190lbs....

  118. #1318
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    Quote Originally Posted by rggomez View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	WhatsApp Image 2019-12-25 at 15.06.26.jpg 
Views:	127 
Size:	284.6 KB 
ID:	1301083

    mine with the 150mm FOX 36 I had laying around...still thinking if I should go for a 140m
    m, the rear end is so capable that is asking for more travel upfront



    Looks good with the Orange 36 up front.
    Last edited by Ordinarybikes; 2 Weeks Ago at 06:09 AM.

  119. #1319
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    Really digging the new Shimano 12x drivetrain.

    Tallboy 4-tallboy.jpg

  120. #1320
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    Looking at getting a fox 36 grip 2 140mm for mine. Anyone running it? If so how do you like it. Currently riding mine with a fox 34, feels a little underwhelming with how good the rear is.

  121. #1321
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    Jazzanova, I'd go with a #450 spring. Cane creek doesn't make a progressive wound spring small enough for this application. The recommended spring rate for myself came out to be 490ish so 500 was about perfect. As I said, I weigh around 190lbs....
    I am only around 140lbs. The recomendeded spring rate is either 400 or 450lbs, depending on the desired sag, but it seems I should be ok with 400... I will try to call CC for advice.
    Are you using bearings? I am considering either Fox roller bearing shock kit or RWC needle bearing kit on the 8mm x 30mm side.
    https://www.enduroforkseals.co...u-b...EARING-30.html
    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/...er-...or-shocks.html
    https://www.ridefox.com/fox17/...id=...untinghardware

  122. #1322
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    I am only around 140lbs. The recomendeded spring rate is either 400 or 450lbs, depending on the desired sag, but it seems I should be ok with 400... I will try to call CC for advice.
    Are you using bearings? I am considering either Fox roller bearing shock kit or RWC needle bearing kit on the 8mm x 30mm side.
    https://www.enduroforkseals.co...u-b...EARING-30.html
    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/...er-...or-shocks.html
    https://www.ridefox.com/fox17/...id=...untinghardware
    Jazzanova, I no longer have the TB4. I used the Fox roller bearing off of the OE Fox DPS shock on the CC Coil shock. The stock CC mounting hardwear is okay but it offers no rotation within itself. I would probably go with the 450lb spring and run very little preload on the spring.

  123. #1323
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    Jazzanova, I no longer have the TB4. I used the Fox roller bearing off of the OE Fox DPS shock on the CC Coil shock. The stock CC mounting hardwear is okay but it offers no rotation within itself. I would probably go with the 450lb spring and run very little preload on the spring.
    Whoa, that didn't take long! May I ask why you got rid of it already? I am leaning heavily towards replacing my 3 with the 4, but seeing people already sell them makes me take pause.

    Cheers,
    -A
    Disclaimer: I'm a fan-boi for Jenson USA.

  124. #1324
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    Quote Originally Posted by onlyontwo View Post
    Whoa, that didn't take long! May I ask why you got rid of it already? I am leaning heavily towards replacing my 3 with the 4, but seeing people already sell them makes me take pause.

    Cheers,
    -A
    I work at a shop and I have the liberty to change bikes pretty often. I thoroughly enjoyed the TB4. I'm now on a Yeti SB130.

  125. #1325
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    I have a question if anyone owning one knows... whats the biggest tire you can fit on there without flipping the chainstay length to the +10 setting? Probably the only bummer I see is having to run smaller 2.3 tires if I want to keep that nice short chainstay.

  126. #1326
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    I have a question if anyone owning one knows... whats the biggest tire you can fit on there without flipping the chainstay length to the +10 setting? Probably the only bummer I see is having to run smaller 2.3 tires if I want to keep that nice short chainstay.
    Probably 2.5. I have a 2.4 onza porcupine on a reserve 30 in the back no issue.


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  127. #1327
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    Quote Originally Posted by austink26 View Post
    Probably 2.5. I have a 2.4 onza porcupine on a reserve 30 in the back no issue.


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    Hmm ok, thanks, might try 2.5 front, 2.4 back 30mm rims, Maxxis minions.

  128. #1328
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    It comes stock with 2.4WT DHR2 in the rear so no issues for clearance.

  129. #1329
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikericci View Post
    It comes stock with 2.4WT DHR2 in the rear so no issues for clearance.
    On their site it says 2.3 :\. I'd love 2.4 WT or 2.5 WT would be great .

  130. #1330
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    On their site it says 2.3 :\. I'd love 2.4 WT or 2.5 WT would be great .
    I think youíre right. I have a 2.4 WT Rekon on 30mm rims and there plenty of clearance

  131. #1331
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikericci View Post
    I think youíre right. I have a 2.4 WT Rekon on 30mm rims and there plenty of clearance
    Awesome, i'll give 2.4 WT DHR2 + WT DHF 2.5 on 30mm rims and see how it goes! Thanks, I'm pricing out builds atm! Much excite ;P.


    If anyone else has tire advice I'm all ears . What size dropper have you guys been able to get in there all the way slammed down on a large? I'd love to go bike yoke 185 but could go down obviously.

  132. #1332
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    Awesome, i'll give 2.4 WT DHR2 + WT DHF 2.5 on 30mm rims and see how it goes! Thanks, I'm pricing out builds atm! Much excite ;P.


    If anyone else has tire advice I'm all ears . What size dropper have you guys been able to get in there all the way slammed down on a large? I'd love to go bike yoke 185 but could go down obviously.
    Iím short legged and run a 170 dropper with plenty of room for more drop but I donít think Iíd want more

  133. #1333
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    Quote Originally Posted by mestapho View Post
    Iím short legged and run a 170 dropper with plenty of room for more drop but I donít think Iíd want more
    Cool, sounds like I may be in luck.

  134. #1334
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    Not in its final form, I am still waiting on my reserve 27s but I grabbed the 30s off my mega to give it a spin. It is way more poppy but the ride position is essentially the same. Exactly what I was hoping for.


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  135. #1335
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    Quote Originally Posted by austink26 View Post


    Not in its final form, I am still waiting on my reserve 27s but I grabbed the 30s off my mega to give it a spin. It is way more poppy but the ride position is essentially the same. Exactly what I was hoping for.


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    Great looking bike.
    The silver pike goes well with the purple.
    Which bars are those?

  136. #1336
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Great looking bike.
    The silver pike goes well with the purple.
    Which bars are those?
    Those are the pnw range bars. The have a comfy geo to them.


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  137. #1337
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    Been a long time Yeti rider and have enjoyed every Yeti frame I've owned (since 2005). I was looking at replacing my 2014 sb95 with the new sb100. So, I came here to mtbr to do some research...Well, the sb100 thread was a trainwreck (imo) regarding *issues*, so today I purchased a Santa Cruz TB4 AL R in Stormbringer from my LBS! I am beyond stoked to get her out on the trail. The only issues I see here were Fox DPS related. I'm right around 6'2, 230# so I'm a little concerned my F.A. might overwhelm the shock...I would hope it would be covered under warranty but will be watching here for *fixes*. Peace and Happy New Year Santa Cruz forum peeps!

  138. #1338
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    Quote Originally Posted by LCW View Post
    For anyone wondering stock spacer is a 0.4 (green). I swapped it for a 0.6 (yellow). Running 220psi. Wanted a bit more progression. Feels a little poppier.

    I'm thinking of doing this as well.(225-230# with gear) Did you order the extra spacer from Fox?

  139. #1339
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    Quote Originally Posted by keithrad View Post
    I'm thinking of doing this as well.(225-230# with gear) Did you order the extra spacer from Fox?

    Congrats on the new bike keithrad! You can swap it for a DPX2 or contact Cane Creek about a DoubleBarrel Inline custom-job. The fit is "tight" but it fits
    "There's two kinds of people in this world - Walkers and Talkers." Which one are you?

  140. #1340
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    Forgot to quote.
    Disclaimer: I'm a fan-boi for Jenson USA.

  141. #1341
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    [QUOTE=austink26;14494941]Those are the pnw range bars. The have a comfy geo to them.

    Your buggy turned out great! What does it weigh built up like that?

    Cheers
    Disclaimer: I'm a fan-boi for Jenson USA.

  142. #1342
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    Quote Originally Posted by onlyontwo View Post

    Your buggy turned out great! What does it weigh built up like that?

    Cheers
    Thanks! I donít have an official weight but it is noticeably lighter than my megatower. I will try to get an official weight when I get the proper wheels on it. The current wheels are 30s with cushcores. The ones I have ordered are 27s and will have cushcore xc. So hopefully between those changes and running slightly smaller rubber I can drop even more weight!



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  143. #1343
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    Jazzanova, I no longer have the TB4. I used the Fox roller bearing off of the OE Fox DPS shock on the CC Coil shock. The stock CC mounting hardwear is okay but it offers no rotation within itself. I would probably go with the 450lb spring and run very little preload on the spring.
    Thanks!
    CC recommended 400lbs, so I ordered both to try.

  144. #1344
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rev Bubba View Post
    Aluminum V4.

    Is anyone riding the alloy version? Price wise, the A/R kit seems like the most logical buying decision to me. Two lbs. over the C/S kit and the inability to run 2.6 tires are not a deal breaker. Any comments or experience?

    Thanks and Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and a Happy New Year too.
    Hey there Rev Bubba, as I posted a couple of days ago, I just purchased an Aluminum TB4. I'm coming off a 2014 Alum. Yeti SB29. I might have tried the Carbon R version if my budget would have allowed but... I ride like a bull in a china shop in particularly rocky terrain and am 6'2 and a bit over 225#. So with all that said I went with the AL/R build over the D build because I like the Fox fork better and you get a level better drivetrain / brake / seatpost. So I agree it seems to be the better value if you can afford it. This XL TB4 feels heavier than my L Yeti understandably ( TB4 is also visibly a bigger bike than the Yeti and right at 2" longer) but hides the weight admirably well on the trail. Still, I will begin to replace parts *as needed* to shave some weight on this TB 4 as I did with my Yeti which started out as the entry level build for Yeti at the time. I say jump on it! Can't wait to get more time on the trail with this awesome bike!!

  145. #1345
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    After my first ride today on my tallboy, I cannot believe how good of a bike this is. The suspension platform feels super supportive. The O ring says I hit bottom but at no point was it harsh. Even running the same wheels/tires from my megatower, it feels so much more lively and fast pedaling. With the geo being so similar it feels just as confidence inspiring as riding my mega on downhills, albeit not nearly as plush. If the mega is like a trophy truck, the tallboy is like a rally car. The bike just wanted to pop off of everything. If I didnít race or ride park, I would probably be completely happy with just a tallboy. I am super excited to race the tallboy on some stage races and more mellow enduros.


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  146. #1346
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    Good thing you're happy with it Can't make my mind up right now since I'm in a similiar situation - MT owner - and would like to have a 2nd ride for collecting miles, but still being able to charge harder on the tech stuff (currently owning the Highball as an XC build). Worried that both the TB and the MT are too similiar...

    Quote Originally Posted by austink26 View Post
    After my first ride today on my tallboy, I cannot believe how good of a bike this is. The suspension platform feels super supportive. The O ring says I hit bottom but at no point was it harsh. Even running the same wheels/tires from my megatower, it feels so much more lively and fast pedaling. With the geo being so similar it feels just as confidence inspiring as riding my mega on downhills, albeit not nearly as plush. If the mega is like a trophy truck, the tallboy is like a rally car. The bike just wanted to pop off of everything. If I didnít race or ride park, I would probably be completely happy with just a tallboy. I am super excited to race the tallboy on some stage races and more mellow enduros.


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  147. #1347
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    Quote Originally Posted by MindPatterns View Post
    Good thing you're happy with it Can't make my mind up right now since I'm in a similiar situation - MT owner - and would like to have a 2nd ride for collecting miles, but still being able to charge harder on the tech stuff (currently owning the Highball as an XC build). Worried that both the TB and the MT are too similiar...
    It sounds like the tallboy is the bike for you. They really donít feel too similar ride wise. Just the geo keeps the riding positions similar. But it really rides like a different bike and I donít really see too many situations where I would be debating which bike to take. My take could be exaggerated by the fact that my mega is the coil version so coming back to an air shock feels way more ďpoppyĒ.


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  148. #1348
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    Anymore reviews or thoughts on overforking this bike? Iím debating building this frame up with a 140mm 36.


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  149. #1349
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickwm21 View Post
    Anymore reviews or thoughts on overforking this bike? Iím debating building this frame up with a 140mm 36.


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    it can be done, obviously, but if you're buying a new bike a Hightower is a better idea.

  150. #1350
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    it can be done, obviously, but if you're buying a new bike a Hightower is a better idea.
    Why's that?

  151. #1351
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickwm21 View Post
    Anymore reviews or thoughts on overforking this bike? Iím debating building this frame up with a 140mm 36.


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    I should know in a couple of weeks.
    Currently building a TB4 with 140mm Pike and 134mm rear shock.

  152. #1352
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    Why's that?
    ?

    let me preface this by saying that bikes are great, sc is great, and the tallboy 4 is great. it's not a question of any of that, it's what the specific bike is engineered to do.

    ...
    because the hightower is built for 140mm forks. I understand people wanting a do-it-all bike but if you buy the BEST frame for what you want to ride, how you want to ride, then it'll work out better in the end. just like 150mm fork on a hardtail. it can be done, but why? nearly always going to be better to just get a full suspension bike.

  153. #1353
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    ?

    let me preface this by saying that bikes are great, sc is great, and the tallboy 4 is great. it's not a question of any of that, it's what the specific bike is engineered to do.

    ...
    because the hightower is built for 140mm forks. I understand people wanting a do-it-all bike but if you buy the BEST frame for what you want to ride, how you want to ride, then it'll work out better in the end. just like 150mm fork on a hardtail. it can be done, but why? nearly always going to be better to just get a full suspension bike.
    Even SC says TB is ok with 140 and HT with 150mm fork. It's only 10mm difference and it won't change significantly the riding characteristics and Geo.
    TB is a slightly lighter frame, has an adjustable CS (compared to HT) and can be even run with a longer stroke shock (giving it extra of rear travel), so it makes a perfect sense to run a 140mm fork if one desires to do so. Even in it's stock 120mm rear, 140 front will be completely fine. I am not saying 140 will be ultimately better than 130, it depends on the trails...
    I guess you have never heard of aggressive HT. Plenty of them with long travel forks out there...
    https://enduro-mtb.com/en/best-hardcore-hardtail/

  154. #1354
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    Also keep in mind if you were going to run a Pike 130, the AtC is longer on the Pike than the 36*. So you can basically run a 140mm 36, keep the same geo, and have a more stout fork. This is really key for us heavier guys.

    *This was the case a year or so ago, could have changed but assuming not. IIRC, the Pike AtC was about 7mm longer for a given fork length over a 36.
    If jackasses could fly this place would be an airport.

  155. #1355
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    Doesn't it effectively making it the equivalent of a 4-5mm change if you were sticking with the pike (while still raising the BB a normal 3-5 mm for a 10mm longer fork)

    Considering going this route as I'm a 210-215 rider and think kashima could look cool with the yellow .

  156. #1356
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinL View Post
    it can be done, obviously, but if you're buying a new bike a Hightower is a better idea.
    I have a Bronson now, I love it but Iíve always wished I went 5010. 90% of the time I just donít need that much bike. In my mind, the perfect bike for my riding is a VPP lower link 29er 130rear/140fork. I believe the Tallboy is closer to that than the Hightower. The Tallboy is more of a 5010, the Hightower is more of a Bronson.


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  157. #1357
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    Quote Originally Posted by nickwm21 View Post
    I have a Bronson now, I love it but Iíve always wished I went 5010. 90% of the time I just donít need that much bike. In my mind, the perfect bike for my riding is a VPP lower link 29er 130rear/140fork. I believe the Tallboy is closer to that than the Hightower. The Tallboy is more of a 5010, the Hightower is more of a Bronson.
    I have a Bronson also, but my previous bike was a 26" Blur TR which became the Solo when it grew 27.5 wheels. Did the lifts at Keystone and Vail on both, and do the same trails closer to home.

    I don't miss the shorter travel bike at all.

    But for you - why in your mind? Demo the Tallboy and the Hightower. Buy the one that you like better. The engineers are Santa Cruz are really smart, and they offer a lot of bikes, especially 29ers. It honestly seems silly to me to think that over-forking a Tallboy will be better than just buying a Hightower.

    Now, on the other hand, if you have already bought a Tallboy 4 and you want to try a longer fork as that's cheaper than buying a Hightower... I get that. If you buy a fork that has easily adjustable travel without replacing internal parts, like a MRP Ribbon, I really get it.

  158. #1358
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    Iím building a Tallboy with my existing 36 from OGHT but I am lowering to 130. I want the geometry of the shorter fork. My feeling this is a short travel trail bike with progressive geometry so why change it. If I wanted a bigger bike I would of got a Hightower 2. I guess I just donít understand all the overbuilding of a Tallboy when the Hightower is right there and barely heavier.

  159. #1359
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    I have a question if anyone owning one knows... whats the biggest tire you can fit on there without flipping the chainstay length to the +10 setting? Probably the only bummer I see is having to run smaller 2.3 tires if I want to keep that nice short chainstay.
    I have 2.5 WT DHF up front and a 2.5 Aggressor DD out back

  160. #1360
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    I should know in a couple of weeks.
    Currently building a TB4 with 140mm Pike and 134mm rear shock.
    I get tinkering with things, it is sort of the American way, and I get running a 140 on a Tallboy. But I don't get buying a brand new Tallboy to hack front and rear and turn it into 96% of a Hightower. I would just start with a Hightower. You will have a unique bike that's for sure.

  161. #1361
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    Quote Originally Posted by ibanda View Post
    I get tinkering with things, it is sort of the American way, and I get running a 140 on a Tallboy. But I don't get buying a brand new Tallboy to hack front and rear and turn it into 96% of a Hightower. I would just start with a Hightower. You will have a unique bike that's for sure.
    Don't forget the adjustable CS, which HT doesn't have. I am looking forward to compare 430 vs 440mm on the TB.
    Another reason why I prefer TB is I can try 134mm rear, and can go back to 120mm with a simple step of adding a spacer back to the shock. The same with the fork. If I don't like the 140mm, I can always just lower it to 130.
    TB seems just a bit more versatile in the aspects I mentioned.
    + The lower weight.

  162. #1362
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Don't forget the adjustable CS, which HT doesn't have. I am looking forward to compare 430 vs 440mm on the TB.
    Another reason why I prefer TB is I can try 134mm rear, and can go back to 120mm with a simple step of adding a spacer back to the shock. The same with the fork. If I don't like the 140mm, I can always just lower it to 130.
    TB seems just a bit more versatile in the aspects I mentioned.
    + The lower weight.
    I moved my chain stay to the 440, and will never go back. I also put a 140 mm air spring in my float, haven't got a chance to ride with the 140 yet, but think it is going to be great! also a little thing me and my LBS found. if you have a "C" build, they put bushings in the the back shock mount and put bearings in the "CC" models. i changed my to bearings. HUGE difference. it was like it was binding before. so much more small bump compliance. i ended up having to put 20 more psi in to get my sag right!. but it totally freed up the rear end. check into it. best $30 you will spend. also, if you have the fox float it's only like $35 for an 140 mm air spring to try it at 140. I loved my OG Hightower, and the way i have this set up now will better that my OG. gonna be an awesome daily driver!
    SC Tallboy 4
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  163. #1363
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    Quote Originally Posted by OperatorBo View Post
    I moved my chain stay to the 440, and will never go back. I also put a 140 mm air spring in my float, haven't got a chance to ride with the 140 yet, but think it is going to be great! also a little thing me and my LBS found. if you have a "C" build, they put bushings in the the back shock mount and put bearings in the "CC" models. i changed my to bearings. HUGE difference. it was like it was binding before. so much more small bump compliance. i ended up having to put 20 more psi in to get my sag right!. but it totally freed up the rear end. check into it. best $30 you will spend. also, if you have the fox float it's only like $35 for an 140 mm air spring to try it at 140. I loved my OG Hightower, and the way i have this set up now will better that my OG. gonna be an awesome daily driver!
    Sounds good! Let us know how you like it at 140. Many like the CS at 440. Which frame size?
    I am building mine (got the frame without a shock) with a Cane Creek DB IL Coil which I can run either at 120 or 134mm. Also purchased the Fox mounting bearing kit for it.
    The pike is 140mm.

  164. #1364
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Sounds good! Let us know how you like it at 140. Many like the CS at 440. Which frame size?
    I am building mine (got the frame without a shock) with a Cane Creek DB IL Coil which I can run either at 120 or 134mm. Also purchased the Fox mounting bearing kit for it.
    The pike is 140mm.
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  165. #1365
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanadog View Post
    I have 2.5 WT DHF up front and a 2.5 Aggressor DD out back
    That's without changing the chainstay length? That's great, I think I'll do the same tire setup in that case =o.

  166. #1366
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    I just put 1/2 down payment on a new 2020 Stormbringer Purple TallBoy CC XO1 build with Reserve 30's. I will run it with either 2.5 or 2.6 tires. My LBS gave me a great deal and I super excited for a new bike! It should be here at the end of February or early March, which is a little early here in northern New Mexico because we typically get a ton of snow at that time of the year.

    Woohoo!
    Last edited by beastmaster; 1 Week Ago at 05:18 PM.

  167. #1367
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    Quote Originally Posted by NDnavy21 View Post
    I currently have a TB4 on order(coming off a 2018 OGHT) but just concerned with the travel drop. Riding is mainly SoCal with a lot of pedaling up for short(er) rockier downhills.

    Anybody have have any experience with that transition that can share some insight? Was able to demo the TB4 on a trail, but only got to give the HT2 a parking lot ride. The TB4 is a fun bike to ride for sure....just can't figure out if the 15mm travel drop is going to be noticeable given the new lowerlink VPP.

    Been through both HT2 and TB4 forums, doesn't seem that there is too much out there on a comparison between the 2 bikes.
    Here are some interesting insights about the HT2 and TB4 that may help, maybe not:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2hXVzQqnGw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ltfj8C8XhgY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpJ_jwQjNHc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGc7SrnqJG0

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxqRFncKHEY

  168. #1368
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    Building up an alloy frame, what a pita with the cable routing.
    Also I couldn't get the iscg bash to fit. The holes on thr frame are a diffetent spacing from the iscg 55.9 norm?
    Is there supposed to be an adapter plate between? If so would have been nice to send it with the frame.
    Tallboy 4-20200110_200716.jpg

  169. #1369
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    that's interesting, looks like the alloy one might have ISCG instead of ISCG-05 mounts. If you look at the complete bike images on santa cruz's site you can see pretty clearly that the lower mount is further from the BB on the carbon vs the aluminum models.

  170. #1370
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    Yeah but iscg is 47.79mm between, this is 52 ish???
    Tallboy 4-20200111_083910.jpg

  171. #1371
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    Sounds like it was incorrectly made. Like you said, it's either 47 or 55mm. And why use an adapter, that makes no sense either. You would just manufacture and use the ISCG 05. Strange.

  172. #1372
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    So I am a bit perplexed by the chainstay length...the short setting seems too short and the long seems too long (at least on paper). Recent got my Tallboy but in the midst of winter so no riding for a bit just contemplating. What setting have most settled on? From my perusing it seems most competing bikes are at 435. I will definitively be testing both but curious on others thoughts and testin.

  173. #1373
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    I settled on long chainstays. Iím the type of rider that has the front wheel in the air most of the time, and I ride with my kid a lot so I focus more on the jib game than on speed.

    So in theory, for my style I thought I should use short. And Iíve tried short and it feels good, but Iím also on an XL so I figured I should try long too.

    Initially, long felt worse. You have to pull a lot harder to get into manuals and bunnyhop. Itís no longer like the almost telepathic, ďI want the front wheel up,Ē you have to really get a lot more active to get the front end up. But then after a bit you get used to it and the more exaggerated motions become second nature. The benefit of sticking with it is once youíre in a manual for instance, you can stay there for days, itís harder to get knocked out of balance, either side to side or fore / aft.

    With both wheels on the ground, cornering traction seems improved, especially in like off camber corners where it helps to weight the front tire more.

    In terms of overall wheelbase, you can kind of notice the longer setting in switchbacks or when like getting on/off skinnies where you have to turn a bit. But I mean, the whole bike is so long in either setting you have to think about that more either way. 10mm is noticeable, but itís not a huge difference in making tight turns.

    So thatís my take. I think you really have to try both, especially if youíre tall. Put it in long and if you hate it (and I did at first) try it one more time and then if it doesnít click for you switch to short.

  174. #1374
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    Quote Originally Posted by james_howard View Post
    I settled on long chainstays. Iím the type of rider that has the front wheel in the air most of the time, and I ride with my kid a lot so I focus more on the jib game than on speed.

    So in theory, for my style I thought I should use short. And Iíve tried short and it feels good, but Iím also on an XL so I figured I should try long too.

    Initially, long felt worse. You have to pull a lot harder to get into manuals and bunnyhop. Itís no longer like the almost telepathic, ďI want the front wheel up,Ē you have to really get a lot more active to get the front end up. But then after a bit you get used to it and the more exaggerated motions become second nature. The benefit of sticking with it is once youíre in a manual for instance, you can stay there for days, itís harder to get knocked out of balance, either side to side or fore / aft.

    With both wheels on the ground, cornering traction seems improved, especially in like off camber corners where it helps to weight the front tire more.

    In terms of overall wheelbase, you can kind of notice the longer setting in switchbacks or when like getting on/off skinnies where you have to turn a bit. But I mean, the whole bike is so long in either setting you have to think about that more either way. 10mm is noticeable, but itís not a huge difference in making tight turns.

    So thatís my take. I think you really have to try both, especially if youíre tall. Put it in long and if you hate it (and I did at first) try it one more time and then if it doesnít click for you switch to short.
    I ended up in long with my XL as well and have just about the same input as this.

    I also went with a 140mm Fox 36 (after first trying a pike) and a long shocked DPX2. I wanted a shorter travel version of my MegaTower and that is what I got. You could argue I should have got a Hightower, but I'm super happy where I landed and I couldn't say if that is true without putting some time in on a Hightower to compare.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Tallboy 4-2vz06rejrlygfprjd-6tng.jpg  


  175. #1375
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhino View Post
    I ended up in long with my XL as well and have just about the same input as this.

    I also went with a 140mm Fox 36 (after first trying a pike) and a long shocked DPX2. I wanted a shorter travel version of my MegaTower and that is what I got. You could argue I should have got a Hightower, but I'm super happy where I landed and I couldn't say if that is true without putting some time in on a Hightower to compare.
    Very nice!
    I am also going for a 140mm Fox 36.
    I assume with the DPX2 you lose some poppiness compared to the DPS or not really.
    What type of DPX2 do you have exactly, what did you modify? I am not very technical but get the feeling also with the Fox 36 in front I also could use a bit more in the back.

  176. #1376
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    Alloy frame is a porker 4,25 kg haha.
    She built up to 32.4 lbs / 14.7225 kg
    Certainly rides lighter.
    Not happy with the shifts mainly downshifts. Somewhat hesitant sometimes. If I slacken the cable instead the upshifts suffer.
    I noticed when building the bike that the lid used to hold the cables in place when tightened down compresses the housing sp the cable actually wouldn't pass.
    Loosened everything and wiggled a bit and only tightened the mini bolts slightly but my guess is the kink caused in the housing gives enough friction to impac the downshifts.
    The bend up through the chain stay is also pretty crap imho so I wouldn't be surprised if its a friction issue.
    Just can't be bothered to re-run the cables for the moment as it was a real pita on the alloy frame.

    Tallboy 4-20200113_124825.jpg

    Specs:
    Xt 12 shifter
    XT 12 chain
    Slx derailleur
    Slx 165 30t cranks
    Slx 4 pot brakes with 203/180 discs
    Sum race mz903 11-51 cassette
    Cane creek something headset
    Syntace Vector 12į alloy rise 20mm
    Ragley Stubbing stem 40mm
    Dt350 hubs 54t ratchet + Newmen XA25 rims
    Spesh Eliminator 29x2.3 rear / Magic Mary 29x2.35 soft front
    Fox 34 Performance Elite Fit4
    Spesh Phenom saddle
    Oneup v2.1 dropper
    Wolftooth remote
    Oneup composite pedals

  177. #1377
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    I've had my TB4 for about a month.

    For those who are undecided about which size to purchase, please consider if you will be using a dropper post or not. The frames' have a very low top tube and, IMO, is designed for a dropper. However, I do not us a dropper--maybe I'm a retrogrouch(?) but my local trails don't require it.

    The low top tube may require you to purchase a longer than typical (rigid/static) seat post.

    FYI, I did buy a dropper. I'll have it installed for few road trips later this year. For the time being, I'm LOVING THIS BIKE!!!

  178. #1378
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    Stack is quite low, so make sure you have enough spacers / steerer when building it

  179. #1379
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    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by gerard29er View Post
    Very nice!
    I am also going for a 140mm Fox 36.
    I assume with the DPX2 you lose some poppiness compared to the DPS or not really.
    What type of DPX2 do you have exactly, what did you modify? I am not very technical but get the feeling also with the Fox 36 in front I also could use a bit more in the back.
    It is just a stock 7.5x2 DPX2, so 190x50mm instead of the stock 190x45. The extra 5mm of stroke makes it about 133mm of travel.

    I don't notice any downside in climbing or poppiness with the DPX2. And it will handle the type of riding I do better than the DPS.

    I'm about 210ish geared up. Santa Cruz site says that I would run 230psi air pressure in the DPS, but I found that I had to run around 285psi to get in the recommended sag range. The more air I put in that shock, the worse it began to feel. I don't think it is the best option for heavier riders looking for a slightly plush feel on this bike. Probably fine for a more Cross Country or cruisey trail oriented rider, but I still want to plow through the rough stuff a bit like I do on my Megatower.

    Two negative things I did notice on the DPX2:
    1. The angle of the inflation valve makes it really hard to get a shock pump on and off because the swingarm is in the way. This is pretty annoying when filling the shock and trying to equalize the negative chamber every 50 psi. You have to take the pump on and off and it isn't easy.

    2. As a heavier rider, you still have to run high PSI on the DPX2 (but it feels better). I'm at like 270psi with a .8 volume spacer. Once you start approaching 300psi with the stock tune, you run out of usable rebound damping. I have mine two clicks from all the way on. The max psi on the shock is 350, which there is no way you'd have enough rebound damping for without a custom tune.

  180. #1380
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    Quote Originally Posted by tr1cky_k1d View Post
    Alloy frame is a porker 4,25 kg haha.
    Same weight as an alloy Hightower frame.

  181. #1381
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    I just got my CC XL Stormbringer Purple frame !
    3018 gr + 62 gr for the rear axle. Shock is a Float performance Elite instead of the Factory, I'm not into kashima coating color...

    The frames details are class leading, now it's time to cover it up with the Invisiframe kit !

    First time I got a frame with integrated headset cup, is it normal the bearing fit but are not pressed in ? I got a Cane Creek 40 from the shop, IS41/IS52.

  182. #1382
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    I just got my CC XL Stormbringer Purple frame !
    3018 gr + 62 gr for the rear axle. Shock is a Float performance Elite instead of the Factory, I'm not into kashima coating color...

    The frames details are class leading, now it's time to cover it up with the Invisiframe kit !

    First time I got a frame with integrated headset cup, is it normal the bearing fit but are not pressed in ? I got a Cane Creek 40 from the shop, IS41/IS52.
    Congrats on the new bike! To answer your question yes the bearings just sit inside, you donít have to press anything or push hard at all, bit of grease and you lay em in and good to go 👍🏼

  183. #1383
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhino View Post
    It is just a stock 7.5x2 DPX2, so 190x50mm instead of the stock 190x45. The extra 5mm of stroke makes it about 133mm of travel.

    I don't notice any downside in climbing or poppiness with the DPX2. And it will handle the type of riding I do better than the DPS.

    I'm about 210ish geared up. Santa Cruz site says that I would run 230psi air pressure in the DPS, but I found that I had to run around 285psi to get in the recommended sag range. The more air I put in that shock, the worse it began to feel. I don't think it is the best option for heavier riders looking for a slightly plush feel on this bike. Probably fine for a more Cross Country or cruisey trail oriented rider, but I still want to plow through the rough stuff a bit like I do on my Megatower.

    Two negative things I did notice on the DPX2:
    1. The angle of the inflation valve makes it really hard to get a shock pump on and off because the swingarm is in the way. This is pretty annoying when filling the shock and trying to equalize the negative chamber every 50 psi. You have to take the pump on and off and it isn't easy.

    2. As a heavier rider, you still have to run high PSI on the DPX2 (but it feels better). I'm at like 270psi with a .8 volume spacer. Once you start approaching 300psi with the stock tune, you run out of usable rebound damping. I have mine two clicks from all the way on. The max psi on the shock is 350, which there is no way you'd have enough rebound damping for without a custom tune.
    Thanks for your detailed answer!
    I am even about 230lbs geared up so I probably can expect that also for me the recommended air pressure might not be enough and I could get similar problems. I was thinking of using the high setting on the frame but that would mean less progression in the shock. That in combination with your comments will probably make that it will bottom out quickly when just using the recommended air pressure.
    I am indeed looking for a bit sensible feel but at least have the advantage that I am not used to the very rough stuff and am not a Megatower type of rider but more coming from cross country but wanting a bit more trail worthy and steep descending stability, also for my height (6í6) and am getting the XXL frameset.

    I guess I will first give the DPS shock a shot and first check whether I can live with the low setting if that helps the shock, at least bottom out wise, although making the HTA even slacker.
    Hope with my type of riding I can still be in acceptable range for the DPS shock. And if not I will have to think of the limitations of the DPX2.

  184. #1384
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    I just got my CC XL Stormbringer Purple frame !
    3018 gr + 62 gr for the rear axle. Shock is a Float performance Elite instead of the Factory, I'm not into kashima coating color...

    The frames details are class leading, now it's time to cover it up with the Invisiframe kit !

    First time I got a frame with integrated headset cup, is it normal the bearing fit but are not pressed in ? I got a Cane Creek 40 from the shop, IS41/IS52.
    Very nice, congratulations!
    I have to weight until (planned) end of April for my CC XXL Rocksteady Yellow frameset. Actually I was hoping it would come with a Chris King headset already, like the higher end complete builds but apparently not?

  185. #1385
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    Quote Originally Posted by gerard29er View Post
    Thanks for your detailed answer!
    I am even about 230lbs geared up so I probably can expect that also for me the recommended air pressure might not be enough and I could get similar problems. I was thinking of using the high setting on the frame but that would mean less progression in the shock. That in combination with your comments will probably make that it will bottom out quickly when just using the recommended air pressure.
    I am indeed looking for a bit sensible feel but at least have the advantage that I am not used to the very rough stuff and am not a Megatower type of rider but more coming from cross country but wanting a bit more trail worthy and steep descending stability, also for my height (6í6) and am getting the XXL frameset.

    I guess I will first give the DPS shock a shot and first check whether I can live with the low setting if that helps the shock, at least bottom out wise, although making the HTA even slacker.
    Hope with my type of riding I can still be in acceptable range for the DPS shock. And if not I will have to think of the limitations of the DPX2.
    I would start off in the high setting and try to dial it in like that first. If you go off the psi settings on the Santa Cruz site, you'll definitely have issues bottoming out. If you properly measure sag and inflate to where you get 30% sag seated on the bike, you shouldn't have any issues. I would put a .8 volume spacer in the shock which should allow you to run a touch less air pressure and get more ramp at the end. Then try the low setting and see if there is a positive or negative difference. It will probably be subtle.

    This pinkbike article analyzing the Megatower was interesting and talks a bit about high vs. low settings. Different bike but I think the hi/low commentary would apply to the Tallboy as well. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/behind...-analysis.html

  186. #1386
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhino View Post
    I would start off in the high setting and try to dial it in like that first. If you go off the psi settings on the Santa Cruz site, you'll definitely have issues bottoming out. If you properly measure sag and inflate to where you get 30% sag seated on the bike, you shouldn't have any issues. I would put a .8 volume spacer in the shock which should allow you to run a touch less air pressure and get more ramp at the end. Then try the low setting and see if there is a positive or negative difference. It will probably be subtle.

    This pinkbike article analyzing the Megatower was interesting and talks a bit about high vs. low settings. Different bike but I think the hi/low commentary would apply to the Tallboy as well. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/behind...-analysis.html
    Isn't the low setting more progressive?

  187. #1387
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Isn't the low setting more progressive?
    Yes it says it is, I just don't think that going to the low setting ONLY to help bottoming out is necessary. You can also achieve that in the high setting with the right sag and maybe a volume spacer. I doubt that the low setting will make a big difference or allow you to run much different air pressure to get the target sag amount. But, I haven't experimented with that so I'm not sure what the actual result would be on paper.

  188. #1388
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    Quote Originally Posted by redrhino View Post
    I would start off in the high setting and try to dial it in like that first. If you go off the psi settings on the Santa Cruz site, you'll definitely have issues bottoming out. If you properly measure sag and inflate to where you get 30% sag seated on the bike, you shouldn't have any issues. I would put a .8 volume spacer in the shock which should allow you to run a touch less air pressure and get more ramp at the end. Then try the low setting and see if there is a positive or negative difference. It will probably be subtle.

    This pinkbike article analyzing the Megatower was interesting and talks a bit about high vs. low settings. Different bike but I think the hi/low commentary would apply to the Tallboy as well. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/behind...-analysis.html
    Ok thanks, also according to the article at least for Mike Kazimer the preferred setting is the high setting with less progression (I see about 4% difference low vs high and 1% additional more progression with a long chainstay) to reduce the amount of overall progression and have the bike dynamically higher in its travel when riding. But the time my frameset arrives ;-) I will then start off with that and try to get to 30% sag and see if I can use the .8 volume spacer (I assume standard is .4) to prevent bottoming out and but still less air pressure. Probably will also have to experiment with long and short stay and guess I will start off with the long setting since I am a tall guy ;-)
    Thanks very much for your input and info!

  189. #1389
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    Wow, my alloy large frame is more than a kg heavier than your xl CC.
    On the alloy the graphics are protruding trapping lots of air when applying protective film what is it like on the carbon?

  190. #1390
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    I have not installed the film yet, but the frame surface is smooth around the lettering, there is no difference between the letters and the downtube.
    So I don't foresee any issue applying the film.

  191. #1391
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    I just got my CC XL Stormbringer Purple frame !
    3018 gr + 62 gr for the rear axle. Shock is a Float performance Elite instead of the Factory, I'm not into kashima coating color...
    Does that weight include the shock?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  192. #1392
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    Yes it does, 3080gr with Performance Elite shock, rear axle, seat collar and rear dropout.

  193. #1393
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    Quote Originally Posted by foxone View Post
    Yes it does, 3080gr with Performance Elite shock, rear axle, seat collar and rear dropout.
    Excellent. Thanks!
    I have an XL C ordered. It should be little heavier but itís gonna be light enough.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  194. #1394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ordinarybikes View Post
    Jazzanova, I no longer have the TB4. I used the Fox roller bearing off of the OE Fox DPS shock on the CC Coil shock. The stock CC mounting hardwear is okay but it offers no rotation within itself. I would probably go with the 450lb spring and run very little preload on the spring.
    Well, I have just discovered that with the fox bearing kit on the Cane Creek DB IL Coil I can't remove the spring. The inner diameter of the spring is just too narrow to push the bearings through... This will make it a bit more difficult to swap different springs...
    This might be an advantage of RWC with CC DB IL.
    I am pissed I didn't try the clearance with the longer stroke before I installed the bearing kit. I will have to trust you guys that 190x50 will clear. This is a Medium frame.

  195. #1395
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelandk2 View Post
    That's without changing the chainstay length? That's great, I think I'll do the same tire setup in that case =o.
    yip, in the short setting.

  196. #1396
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    Quote Originally Posted by jazzanova View Post
    Well, I have just discovered that with the fox bearing kit on the Cane Creek DB IL Coil I can't remove the spring.
    I recall someone in the N4 thread saying that you'll need a special tool to press the hardware out of the shock.

  197. #1397
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twilight70 View Post
    I recall someone in the N4 thread saying that you'll need a special tool to press the hardware out of the shock.
    I have an access to a machine shop so it might not be necessary, but it would definitely make it easier. Even with the tool it's going to be a PITA to do it each time I need to remove the spring. I am hoping the one will work well for my weight and I won't need to swap them. Another option would be to get the RWC needle bearing instead.

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