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  1. #1
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    Forum improvements - feedback?

    Hey all, fc here and back from my travels. A lot of old school Mtbr folks have been contacting me and expressed concern that so many threads are being moved out of Passion.

    I chatted with Klurejr and he said this place was being converted to 'riding experiences only'. I'm not sure this is is the finest idea I've heard since Passion is about riding experiences, lifestyle and people getting to know each other. It's the soul of mtbr since it's our first forum.

    Anyway... it's under discussion.

    Any feedback/input? Good news is nothing is set in stone. We want to make mtbr forums better organized but don't want to kill it or over-police either. Key thing is we want to grow it.
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  2. #2
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    Klurejr specializes in overmoderation. This is just the most recent expression of it.

  3. #3
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    IMO, among those that have recently been moved, the follow should be in Passion:

    Animal encounters
    Stairs
    Bike and trail marker pics
    Ridiculous story
    Head badges
    Do the math.

  4. #4
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    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.

    IMHumbleO, I think beginner's corner should be at the very top.

    Some of the picture threads that were moved to Gen should be back in Passion. "Latest purchase" thread was there for ever.
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  5. #5
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    Passion

    : intense, driving, or overmastering feeling or conviction

    The Passion Thread to me, reflects the passion that one encounters and reflects within and throughout this thread. It is greater than an interest, it is all encompassing and comes with a zeal-like infatuation.
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.

    IMHumbleO, I think beginner's corner should be at the very top.

    Some of the picture threads that were moved to Gen should be back in Passion. "Latest purchase" thread was there for ever.
    i respectfully second this opinion.

  7. #7
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    IMO, among those that have recently been moved, the follow should be in Passion:

    Animal encounters
    Stairs
    Bike and trail marker pics
    Ridiculous story
    Head badges
    love it!

    Lifestyle. Beer!
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  8. #8
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.

    IMHumbleO, I think beginner's corner should be at the very top.

    Some of the picture threads that were moved to Gen should be back in Passion. "Latest purchase" thread was there for ever.
    Agree!!! Passion should not be on top. Alphabetical should suffice.
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  9. #9
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    I almost always hit "new posts" but for someone who visits specific forums looking for threads, doesn't make sense to move threads that have lived in passion for years.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Hey all, fc here and back from my travels. A lot of old school Mtbr folks have been contacting me and expressed concern that so many threads are being moved out of Passion.

    I chatted with Klurejr and he said this place was being converted to 'riding experiences only'. I'm not sure this is is the finest idea I've heard since Passion is about riding experiences, lifestyle and people getting to know each other. It's the soul of mtbr since it's our first forum.

    Anyway... it's under discussion.

    Any feedback/input? Good news is nothing is set in stone. We want to make mtbr forums better organized but don't want to kill it or over-police either. Key thing is we want to grow it.
    Frankly, a lot of it is your fault. You've let areas on this forum become dumping grounds for years. If the point of having a bazillion forums is to organize discussions, then organize them for crying out loud. If you're not going to organize them, then get rid of the chaff. The way you've run this place for a long time creates a lot of confusion in this regard. The NorCal forum is a perfect example. THE VAST MAJORITY of the content there belongs elsewhere, as it has absolutely nothing to do with NorCal.

    If you want to be honest, Passion was "converted" to a riding experiences forum many years ago. Look at the description of the forum, which has been the same for as long as I can remember. Maybe it's been that way since this particular forum software has been installed - my join date should give you an idea how long that's been. It says, "Share riding experiences" which makes it pretty clear what the forum is "supposed" to be about. Because it's been at the top for that long, it HAS been a dumping ground for all kinds of crap, too. Not quite as bad as NorCal, but bad enough. I may not agree with all of the moves that Klurejr has made, but most of them I do.

    Another part of the problem is related to the moderation in general. It's not consistent. A lot of the mods don't even log in very often. I can't tell you how many times I've reported threads that OBVIOUSLY don't belong in Passion, as they had nothing to do with bikes. Like carbon fiber knives. Or threads that are bike-related, but obviously belong elsewhere on the site. Bitching about bike shops, for example. When it comes down to it, I am the reason that Klurejr took an interest in the Passion forum in the first place. I felt like the moderators were ignoring the place, and ignoring my legitimate reports. The mods "in charge" of the forum need to be reexamined. Gregg hasn't been here in a year and a half. crisillo and MTBAlabama don't show up all that often. BikinBric is around more, and appears to have been the one ignoring my reports. I started causing a little trouble, and FINALLY got someone's (Klurejr's) attention.

    I do feel like picture threads are entirely appropriate for Passion. "Riding experiences" doesn't have to mean ride reports as long stories ONLY. That would be a sure way for the Passion forum to die. But I do feel like mtbr as a whole is an ungainly mess and that is a major contributor.

    1. There are too many damn forums that split discussions. The place needs to be pared down into a more logical arrangement with less overlap.
    2. If there's going to be ANY kind of organization at all, then moderators need to be able to put things where they belong. This means that the forums need clear direction as to what belongs there. If you're not going to establish that clear direction, then you might as well just have only one forum and throw everything in it.
    3. This place is busy enough that requests for moderation need to not be held up because of moderators (or admins) who aren't here all the time, or who are on vacation, or out for a ride, or whatever. But it seems like when a moderation report goes out, it is most likely going to receive a very limited audience.
    4. Moderation needs to be more consistent. Why in the hell is NorCal your little litter box that gets to be a dumping ground for content that belongs elsewhere in the forum? Moderation policies that apply EVERYWHERE else on the forum don't apply there. Why is that?

  11. #11
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    #LeaveNorCalAlone.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by alexbn921 View Post
    #LeaveNorCalAlone.



    Everyone should just post all the shit in norcal.
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    IMO, among those that have recently been moved, the follow should be in Passion:

    Animal encounters
    Stairs
    Bike and trail marker pics
    Ridiculous story
    Head badges
    Two of those are mine. Stairs and rediculous story.

    I'm not too fussed if its moved. But out of courtesy the mod should contact the op and inform them of the move and reasons why.


    Its slightly rude to move stuff without consultation.



    Also each sub forum has different members viewing. You may want he opinuion of those in that particular sub forum. By moving to a different subforum then the original intention/audiance may be lost.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    IMO, among those that have recently been moved, the follow should be in Passion:

    Animal encounters
    Stairs
    Bike and trail marker pics
    Ridiculous story
    Head badges
    Totally agree here.

    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.

    IMHumbleO, I think beginner's corner should be at the very top.

    Some of the picture threads that were moved to Gen should be back in Passion. "Latest purchase" thread was there for ever.
    And here.

    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Agree!!! Passion should not be on top. Alphabetical should suffice.
    I pushed for this on several occasions over the years and was ignored.

    Quote Originally Posted by alexbn921 View Post
    #LeaveNorCalAlone.
    I agree with this as well. Nothing wrong with having their own little OC over there. If you don’t like it don’t go there.

    As far as Passion: The threads above that Lone Ranger mentioned should be moved back to Passion. Also the thread “Post a photo of your recent purchase, bike related only” that thread was started in 2011 by none other than CHUM a super moderator for years. He placed it in Passion, it lived active in Passion for 7 years. Active almost daily for that length of time. In fact one of the most if not the most active threads in there all these years. In one swipe it went to General Discussion after 7 years, really? It will live it’s remaining short life. We all know that any thread started or moved to General is doomed a short exisistance. A short attention span of an the audience there. Nothing against that forum, it’s just the nature of the beast.

    The Passion forum in my opinion should not only be to share ride experiences but also to share passions that exist within a ride. Such as animals and nature. Sharing and getting to know one another in all forums. As long as it has to do with passions with riding it should be allowed in Passion. Granted, many threads shouldn’t be there but going on a thread moving binge in my opinion is a very childish action to take. Move the good ones back to Passion and back off on power tripping childish behavior. All you’re doing is pushing old members away from the site and disenchanting new ones. Who wants to frequent a site where one is treated like a child with everything you post? Not many.

    In other words, got a question about a thread in a forum, let it ride. Isn’t that what we are here for? Sharing our passions, forming friendships and riding.
    Last edited by DIRTJUNKIE; 10-14-2018 at 01:01 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.

    IMHumbleO, I think beginner's corner should be at the very top.

    Some of the picture threads that were moved to Gen should be back in Passion. "Latest purchase" thread was there for ever.
    This, passion is at the top, so thats where people just start stuff up. I think a lot of people don't realise because it's not labeled wheels/drivertain/aframes/"manufacturer" and it named something odd (passion doesn't usually get a forum on ye oldie forums) then it must be just general for anything.

    Put beginner first, then general, then off camber...then everything else. And get rid of a BUNCH of forums, there are so many half the people have no idea where to post.
    All the gear and no idea.

  16. #16
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    Even "riding experience" threads like the bikes with bridges and trail marker threads have been moved. Latest purchase may not be a riding experience, but sharing your joy and cool stuff is definitely part of the passion for this hobby-as this IS a very gear-intensive hobby, and a lot of us are passionate about our bikes, too, not just the act of riding them.
    There's some stupid "LBS annoying me" thread at the top as I post this. Rationalize that.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by OwenM View Post
    There's some stupid "LBS annoying me" thread at the top as I post this. Rationalize that.
    No shit.

    The fact is that fc has set the tone in these forums (since the beginning) that led to this situation. That tone is inconsistency.

    Sure, Passion may have once been the original forum that amounted to a "General" or catch-all discussion where people talked about everything and organized rides and all. But it hasn't been that for YEARS. The proliferation of a multitude of subforums left nothing but trip reports and picture threads as relevant. And even then, people post those all over the place.

    I vote to split up the "Classic Mountain Bike Forums" grouping. At the top, the grouping should be something like simple discussions and should include Beginners Corner and General at the top, followed by an alphabetical list of others including Passion, General, Bikepacking, Classifieds, the riding style forums, 50+, OC, Photography, Rider Down, Trailbuilding, Women's Lounge, etc. There should be a second grouping that should be exclusively the technical/gear forums. This is where the majority of grouping should happen. Get rid of the wheel size forums and put ALL of those discussions into their relevant categories. This is where the primary mess/confusion exists. Why on earth do we have a 29er components board and a components board? Doesn't make any damn sense.

    The regional forums and the brand forums mostly make sense. They SHOULD be maintained as pretty focused discussions, though. REGIONAL discussions only. Trail conditions, local group rides, local events, local equipment preferences, etc. Other content should be moved. Bike brand specific discussions only. Other content should be moved.

  18. #18
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    In my opinion, if a thread is in the top 5-10 most recent commented in a particular forum, it should stay there were the OP put it. Let nature take it's course. If, after it drops lower, AND it may be more appreciated in another forum, then move it. Passion and General Discussion are natural catch alls. Don't over think it. Just keep the Korean spam cleaned up in a timely manner.
    How can anyone who's been riding as long as I have, be so slow???

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock View Post
    In my opinion, if a thread is in the top 5-10 most recent commented in a particular forum, it should stay there ....
    Disagree. It may a be a great post and get a lot of comments, but it's still in the wrong forum and would likely do better, have more staying power, and be more useful to others in the long run if it were in the correct forum.
    Do the math.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock View Post
    In my opinion, if a thread is in the top 5-10 most recent commented in a particular forum, it should stay there were the OP put it. Let nature take it's course. If, after it drops lower, AND it may be more appreciated in another forum, then move it. Passion and General Discussion are natural catch alls. Don't over think it. Just keep the Korean spam cleaned up in a timely manner.
    Bingo! Give that man a stuffed animal.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rock View Post
    In my opinion, if a thread is in the top 5-10 most recent commented in a particular forum, it should stay there were the OP put it. Let nature take it's course. If, after it drops lower, AND it may be more appreciated in another forum, then move it. Passion and General Discussion are natural catch alls. Don't over think it. Just keep the Korean spam cleaned up in a timely manner.
    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Bingo! Give that man a stuffed animal.
    Nope. Just because it's being responded to doesn't mean it belongs there. Might as well just merge ALL the forums together and say f*ck it at that point. If these suggestions get adopted, we might as well just ignore forum headings/descriptions altogether. Post 29er topics in the 26er forum. Post apparel questions in tooltime. Post trip reports in suspension. Post Norcal drivel in the Europe forum. Where does it stop?

    If you're going to create subforums for specific threads, then moderators need to move threads to the appropriate locations. There's really no middle ground.

  22. #22
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    Comes down to control freaks basically. If a thread doesn't belong in a certain forum folks won’t reply to it. Guess where it ends up pretty quick? Two pages back. If it’s a worthy thread and people enjoy it then they reply. That's what this site should be all about, entertainment and enjoyment. Controlling what others post is, well I don’t want to get political but I think you know what I’m referring to.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Comes down to control freaks basically. If a thread doesn't belong in a certain forum folks won’t reply to it. Guess where it ends up pretty quick? Two pages back. If it’s a worthy thread and people enjoy it then they reply. That's what this site should be all about, entertainment and enjoyment. Controlling what others post is, well I don’t want to get political but I think you know what I’m referring to.
    No, that isn't how it works.

    Create a structure for the website, then mods need to ensure that structure is maintained. Currently, it is a confusing mess for new users, who often don't know where to post stuff. But there is still a structure to it.

    Your suggestion is to create an anarchic free for all. That works fine for small forums, but it became untenable here a long time ago because content would be on page 2 within 10 min of posting and on page 5 by the end of the day.

    This is reinforced by the fact that searching this website sucks ass. Content that is misplaced is likely to never be found by someone attempting to search. If it goes into the correct subforum, it at least increases the chances of it being found. Also because the site is so huge, many people (including myself) are unlikely to see a topic we might be able to answer well, because it doesn't get put into the correct forum. In my case, for example, I am unlikely to answer a gps question placed in the norcal forum because I rarely ever go there.

    I will say this - if this place swirls the shitter and is allowed to become what dj wants, I am gone. I am increasingly frustrated with how site leadership runs the place (above the mods mostly).

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

  24. #24
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    Harold, I’m not here to argue about it. Many have left because of so much policing. In fact I had a couple long time respectable ride contributing members contact me after this recent Passion thread moving, they left the site, fed up of being policed. Threads that members obviously enjoyed for many YEARS were suddenly moved. If a thread doesn’t appeal simply click another one. The ones worthy of being there will survive and the ones that aren’t will soon be out of sight. There’s enough for all to find the ones they enjoy. There’s a lot more to the term Passion that pertains to riding than actual ride reports.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  25. #25
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    For me, Mtbr is losing it’s relevancy. Over moderation and 100 separate forums don’t seem to help. I still occasionally check in, but have other places to go and things to do. This is life. Ever changing. Best of luck figuring it out!
    baker

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    The mods "in charge" of the forum need to be reexamined. Gregg hasn't been here in a year and a half. crisillo and MTBAlabama don't show up all that often. BikinBric is around more, and appears to have been the one ignoring my reports. I started causing a little trouble, and FINALLY got someone's (Klurejr's) attention.
    You’re right, I have. Probably has to do with the fact that I get inundated with reports everyday of increasingly nettlesome people going out of their way to be assholes, as well as people who hit the report button simply because they do not agree with someone’s point of view. Mopping up the crap around here for free is not on my list of daily priorities and as of late my interest in this forum and the people on it has worn very thin.

    So, I’m done... since you’re on here so often Harold, I invite you to apply for my position, let’s see how long it takes for you before you divert all forum reports to your junk mail. I quit.



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    Last edited by Bikin' Bric; 10-15-2018 at 05:00 AM.

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    With a better organized website, the mods wouldn't need to be involved as much. The disorganization and inconsistency that fc has allowed for too long creates this problem.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    With a better organized website, the mods wouldn't need to be involved as much. The disorganization and inconsistency that fc has allowed for too long creates this problem.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
    You mean the world according to Harold?

    You've got a lot of whines and complaints in your several posts in this thread. It certainly seems like you know how to do it better and more successfully than the very long history of this forum/site has done so far, so rather than trying to impose your vision of mtbr on, well, everyone else here, why don't you go start your own mountain biking forum site and run it the way you feel one should be run?

    Remember, this is a free service to you. Sure, they're marketing us and making money off members, but if this site isn't to your tastes (and by your description, its failing, sucks, not the way you want it or would do it, etc etc), you can always find another. Most of us just deal with it and ignore the crap that doesn't belong in the forum in which it's posted rather than make everyone else conform to the way we each, individually, want things to be. My join date is the same as yours; but that's because of the reset back then; I've been around here longer than that and other than some "head scratchers", haven't had any issue with the way Francis has run this site. Before or after the sale.

    Your indictment of the moderators has some validity; those that haven't been around in a while should be replaced. But your attack on them for "not doing their jobs" is way off base and unfair. As far as I know, the mods here are unpaid volunteers and do what they can in their spare time. I'd say that since you appear to have so much time on your hands to decide how this place should be run, you should volunteer to be a mod, but I suspect your approach wouldn't make the general population here happy.

  29. #29
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    Lot's of passion regarding Passion. I haven't been around as long as some of you, but I do waste lots of time here. Personally, I don't much mind the messiness or lack of rigid organization. Some forums can't be nailed down, especially one as subjective and amorphous as Passion. It's a judgement call by the mods and admins - hopefully informed by the preferences of the user community. Which is what this thread is about, right? A lot of threads are being moved - feedback?

    I do think that moving Passion off the top would help keep it from being a catch-all, which is really what General Discussion is supposed to be, yes? Why not put that ahead of Passion? Then followed by my favorite threads.
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    Get rid of the wheel size forums and put ALL of those discussions into their relevant categories. This is where the primary mess/confusion exists. Why on earth do we have a 29er components board and a components board? Doesn't make any damn sense.
    This.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gasp4Air View Post
    I do think that moving Passion off the top would help keep it from being a catch-all, which is really what General Discussion is supposed to be, yes? Why not put that ahead of Passion? Then followed by my favorite threads.
    General should be at the top for sure!

    It's way down past where most newbs stop searching for a suitable forum to post in.
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  32. #32
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    Working on a forum consolidation plan now with Harold and others. More organization, less policing, more posts, stoked moderators is the goal.


    fc
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Working on a forum consolidation plan now with Harold and others. More organization, less policing, more posts, stoked moderators is the goal.


    fc
    Ya, that's good. Harold seems to have plenty of passion!

    P.S. I've always respected Harold's opinions and judgement. Not suckin' up, just stating it as it is.
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  34. #34
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    And move the e-bike forum to the trash where it belongs! Yeah I know they're not going away but this is a MTB site not a motorized bicycle site.

    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    The problem is Passion is at the very top, so it ends up with a bunch of bs threads.
    Over the years I've started a couple threads suggesting Passion be moved down or re-named the General forum to eliminate all the crap that gets posted here, but those threads got moved

    Agree there are way too many subforums though - consolidate all the different wheel size subforums, consolidate most of the different bike subforums, consolidate the different wheel and tire forums. Keep separate some that are too different or specialized like gravel grinding, bikepacking, fat biking and a separate category for each major type of components - suspension, brakes, drivetrain.

    Having a lot of general discussion in forums like Norcal doesn't bother me as much. That's their local subforum and part of that community is being able to discuss whatever they want with people they know. Maybe they don't want riders from Kansas or wherever butting in their conversation about dropper posts.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by evdog View Post

    Having a lot of general discussion in forums like Norcal doesn't bother me as much. That's their local subforum and part of that community is being able to discuss whatever they want with people they know. Maybe they don't want riders from Kansas or wherever butting in their conversation about dropper posts.
    Sure, if it actually just pertains to Norcal. But then you get fc creating a thread in Norcal "Be careful of deer and then going and starting the same thread somewhere else. Was he really interested in just creating a conversation of his Norcal buddies without "riders from Kansas or wherever butting in"? And then also wanted to warn people outside of Norcal in a separate thread? Seems like purposely creating a mess and this isn't too uncommon. It is then a pain when you search "new posts" and have to try to then figure out which thread is the one you participated in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oh My Sack! View Post
    Remember, there's always quilting and knitting if pedalling becomes too tough.

  36. #36
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    While we're at it, the 29er Components forums is pretty worthless. Virtually everything posted there is not 29er specific, and there aren't many things that are. Wheels/Tires and Forks belong in those forums.

    Maybe a few other inconsistencies:

    We have XC Racing and Training, Enduro racing, All Mountain, and a few others.

    IMO,
    Training, Fitness, Nutrition and Hydration could be one forum as these apply to all riding disciplines.

    Discipline categories should be: XC, Trail, Enduro/All mountain, DH/Freeride, CX, Bike packing/Touring, (maybe Gravel)...
    Do the math.

  37. #37
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    Harold, I agree that there is a problem with reported posts being ignored and mods not around when needed. I have reported maybe 2 posts, ever. One was a guy captioning this pic, “fish taco, anyone?”

    Forum improvements - feedback?-8c9c95c1-c990-4057-ad7b-cbe3959d6328.jpeg

    It happened while some of the women here were complaining about sexism. Reporting it went totally ignored, and the classy post is still there. I wonder why they are turned off by this place. I volunteered to help with Korean spam, since zero mods seem to be around when it is at its worst, in the morning. Klurejr told me to contact fc, since they always needed help. PM to fc went totally ignored. Zero response. Not even a “thanks, but no thanks.” Probably for the best. FWIW, klurejr has always responded and been helpful.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowpoker View Post
    FWIW, klurejr has always responded and been helpful.
    Really? I sent him a nice polite PM recently regarding the threads being moved out of Passion. Instead of responding to my PM minutes later he moved 5 other threads out of Passion. One being mine just out of spite. Not a very impartial attitude a mod is supposed to have. I never did get a pm back from him and it’s been a week.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  39. #39
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    I come to Passion for passion about stuff that happened during rides and positivity, not the vague "culture" dumping ground that makes sense for General.

    I felt these fit here: Animal encounters, Ridiculous story
    I didn't read these, but if they are passion about stuff that happened during a ride, then I feel they would fit here: Stairs, Head badges

  40. #40
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    Never really understood this Passion forum. Riding experiences? Hell after you’ve ridden for so long is there really that many “new” experiences? And for me, if there was, they’d be told post ride at the pub with your riding friends or in their shop or something. Then boom, it’s over... next.
    Peace sells, but who’s buying..

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Really? I sent him a nice polite PM recently regarding the threads being moved out of Passion. Instead of responding to my PM minutes later he moved 5 other threads out of Passion. One being mine just out of spite. Not a very impartial attitude a mod is supposed to have. I never did get a pm back from him and it’s been a week.
    I've had a few experiences with him and hes always been very polite and helpful. Granted, every dog has its day, for sure.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by R_Pierce View Post
    I've had a few experiences with him and hes always been very polite and helpful. Granted, every dog has its day, for sure.



    This, all of my interactions with kjr have been pleasant and civil.
    "These things are very fancy commuter bikes or really bad dirt bikes, but they are not mountain bikes." - J. Mac

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by life behind bars View Post
    This, all of my interactions with kjr have been pleasant and civil.
    Same for me. But let's face it, you can't please all the riders all of the time.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oh My Sack! View Post
    Remember, there's always quilting and knitting if pedalling becomes too tough.

  44. #44
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    I think it's the chemtrails causing mods to freak out and move threads.
    By continuing to browse my posts, you agree to accept my use of cookies.

  45. #45
    jl
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    I use to participate semi-regularly on this forum. But I haven't participated much in the past couple of years. This is the reason why...

    Passion(73 Viewing)
    Share riding experiences.

    26(28 Viewing)
    26" wheel size

    27.5(97 Viewing)
    27.5" wheel size

    29er Bikes(256 Viewing)
    29er specific discussion

    29er Components(80 Viewing)
    29er Wheels, Tires, Forks, etc.

    26+/27.5+/29+ Plus Bikes(146 Viewing)
    Plus size wheels - 2.8" to 3.2"

    All Mountain(147 Viewing)
    More than XC, less than FR/DH.

    Apparel and Protection(73 Viewing)
    Beer Forum(8 Viewing)
    Beginner's Corner(208 Viewing)
    Bike and Frame discussion(67 Viewing)
    Bikepacking and Bike Expedition(42 Viewing)
    Brake Time(181 Viewing)
    Cars and Bike Racks(130 Viewing)
    Cargo Bikes(8 Viewing)
    Classifieds(7 Viewing)
    Clydesdales/Tall Riders(39 Viewing)
    Commuting(29 Viewing)
    Components(76 Viewing)
    Cyclocross(29 Viewing)
    Downhill - Freeride(110 Viewing)
    Drivetrain - shifters, derailleurs, cranks(279 Viewing)
    E-Bikes(26 Viewing)
    Endurance XC Racing(26 Viewing)
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    Families and Riding with Kids(70 Viewing)
    Fat bikes(323 Viewing)
    Fifty+ Years Old(15 Viewing)
    Folding and Travel Bikes
    Frame Building(36 Viewing)
    General Discussion(322 Viewing)
    GPS, HRM and Bike Computer(17 Viewing)

    Gravel Bikes(26 Viewing)
    Gravel bike and Gravel Riding

    Internal Gear Hubs(16 Viewing)
    Lights and Night Riding(55 Viewing)
    Sponsored by Action LED Lights and Lupine

    Lights DIY - Do It Yourself(25 Viewing)
    Sponsored by Lupine

    Nutrition and Hydration(14 Viewing)
    Off Camber (off topic)(42 Viewing)
    Photography for mountain bikers(4 Viewing)
    discuss techniques, gear, tips & more

    Rider Down, injuries and recovery(64 Viewing)
    Shocks and Suspension(348 Viewing)
    Sponsored by Fluid Focus

    Singlespeed(89 Viewing)
    Tandem Mountain Bikes(7 Viewing)
    Tooltime(64 Viewing)
    Trail Building and Advocacy(48 Viewing)
    Sponsored by: IMBA

    Urban/DJ/Park(35 Viewing)
    Vacations & Destinations(7 Viewing)
    biking trips, tours, and travel related biking

    Videos and POV Cameras(8 Viewing)
    Vintage, Retro, Classic(116 Viewing)
    Classic bikes and bike restoration forum

    Weight Weenies(43 Viewing)

    Wheels and Tires(382 Viewing)

    Where are the Best Deals?(37 Viewing)
    Women's Lounge(11 Viewing)
    XC Racing and Training(74 Viewing)

    I hope you understand. Think back to the original days of EmptyBeer and think something between that and this.

    BTW, this Pyscho Penguin Vanilla Porter is pretty good.
    We don't need more to be thankful for; we just need to be more thankful.

  46. #46
    since 4/10/2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by jl View Post
    I use to participate semi-regularly on this forum. But I haven't participated much in the past couple of years. This is the reason why...

    ...

    I hope you understand. Think back to the original days of EmptyBeer and think something between that and this.

    BTW, this Pyscho Penguin Vanilla Porter is pretty good.
    It seems like management might actually be taking site organization a bit more seriously, after years of users voicing the need for it. We'll see if it actually happens smartly. Frankly, I think with more common-sense organization, users will self-moderate how DJ wants them to (mostly by just putting threads in the forums that make sense) and moderators won't need to be so involved.

    What I want most, though, are spam controls that actually work. When this forum gets hit, it isn't just one random spammer who comes in as a person. It gets hit by bots that then flood the system in just a few minutes. Cutting THOSE out will go a long way towards reducing the workload on the mods, and fewer will get fed up because of the flood of reports. Relying on mods to deal with it AFTER it's already a problem is a surefire way to burn them out. Gotta hit that stuff on the front end.

  47. #47
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    Anybody see a problem here? All these threads were moved in the last week. Check out the start dates on some. Obviously active threads if they were on the front page currently then deleted.

    Forum improvements - feedback?-0f4ef537-0824-4296-a1a4-1101f2f0e8b0.jpg
    Forum improvements - feedback?-52ae4213-9e3d-4353-8d75-780656b4ba4b.jpg
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    Forum improvements - feedback?-f34cce26-0016-4288-ac8c-79ac8449043a.jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Really? I sent him a nice polite PM recently regarding the threads being moved out of Passion. Instead of responding to my PM minutes later he moved 5 other threads out of Passion. One being mine just out of spite. Not a very impartial attitude a mod is supposed to have. I never did get a pm back from him and it’s been a week.
    Sorry DJ,
    I have a 6 week old baby at home and am not getting much sleep these days. Work has been extra busy and I have very little free time to come on mtbr and moderate at the moment.

    I stand by my moves from the passion forum to more appropriate places if the passion forum is to be specifically about riding experiences. This enforcement is something I discussed with the new Ownership, in fact they plan to change the name from "passion" to "riding experiences" once the site is moved to their servers.

    I do like a number of suggestions posted here and hope to see them as part of the new forum plan, namely:
    • Taking passion of the top of the list
    • Putting beginners corner and general at the top of the list
    • Streamlining the sections (this is something myself and a number of mods have been pushing for over the years, we drafted an early plan for this and consolidation)



    Good feedback everyone.

    Also, I have yet to see anyone explain why a thread should be in passion just because someone puts the word passion in the title.
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

    Know these before you post:
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  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    Sorry DJ,
    I have a 6 week old baby at home and am not getting much sleep these days. Work has been extra busy and I have very little free time to come on mtbr and moderate at the moment.
    Understandable, and sorry I was a bit put off on all these threads being moved. Mainly the very active old ones is what pissed me off.


    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    I stand by my moves from the passion forum to more appropriate places if the passion forum is to be specifically about riding experiences. This enforcement is something I discussed with the new Ownership, in fact they plan to change the name from "passion" to "riding experiences" once the site is moved to their servers.

    I do like a number of suggestions posted here and hope to see them as part of the new forum plan, namely:
    • Taking passion of the top of the list
    • Putting beginners corner and general at the top of the list
    • Streamlining the sections (this is something myself and a number of mods have been pushing for over the years, we drafted an early plan for this and consolidation)



    Good feedback everyone.
    As for all this, time will tell but I don’t like the sound of it. My input goes nowhere anyway so I’ll just sit back and watch now.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    I stand by my moves from the passion forum to more appropriate places if the passion forum is to be specifically about riding experiences. This enforcement is something I discussed with the new Ownership, in fact they plan to change the name from "passion" to "riding experiences" once the site is moved to their servers.

    ...

    Also, I have yet to see anyone explain why a thread should be in passion just because someone puts the word passion in the title.
    On this, I agree with DJ, and disagree with your moves, as well as with what you just mention as the plan for "new ownership" to rename this forum.

    I ABSOLUTELY AGREE with DJ that picture threads from rides count as "Passion" and/or "riding experiences". I also feel like the head badge thread counts as "Passion" for bikes/riding. Even though it isn't specifically a riding experience, it's more about the art of bikes themselves. Bikes + Trail Markers fits. Stairs. Animal Encounters. Ridiculous story (though I think a different title would be better, the content fits). If it is a positive story about something that happened on a ride, there should be ZERO question about it fitting. If these don't count as "riding experiences" then what does?

    I also think content related to "bikes as art" fits loosely with "Passion" as well. Better there than elsewhere on the site, IMO.

    Some other stuff in DJ's screen shot is sorta marginal. I think the Brand Ambassador thread is an example of that. I think it can be equally fine in Passion or in General. Certainly, people who sign up for a given manufacturer's brand ambassador program are passionate about riding and they want to share their experiences with others. The thread as it actually turned out suggests General content, however.

    Other stuff in that screen shot, I agree, has no place in Passion. Carbon fiber knives? Come on, not even bike related. Belongs in OC. What bike to buy threads? Don't belong in Passion. Bike & Frame. Trip planning? Ehhh, probably better in regional forums, unless it's a much more general than specific states/regions. I didn't read all of those threads, so I don't have a strong opinion on all of them. I don't think a thread's age is necessarily a good indicator of whether it should remain, either. The "how many bikes are you packing together for shuttles" thread is a good example of that. But the latest purchase thread, IMO, is fine.

    I agree with fc that "Passion" was the OG MTBR forum, and it should stay. With the proliferation of other boards, it's of course going to have reduced traffic. But keeping the name "Passion" is a nod to the history of this place. If Philip wants to piss people off and send all the old timers packing, changing the name of it is going to be a good way of accomplishing that.

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    Sorry DJ,
    I have a 6 week old baby at home and am not getting much sleep these days.
    Well, why did you tell us, you could have started a thread in Passion… congratulations.

    I'm with Harold and DJ on what Passion should be. If you took that trail and stripped away all the animals and scenery, it would definitely lose passion. And face it, a lot of us are pretty passionate about our bikes, that's why we spend so much time here and money on our gear and like showing off our head badges and the stuff we just bought.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oh My Sack! View Post
    Remember, there's always quilting and knitting if pedalling becomes too tough.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    Also, I have yet to see anyone explain why a thread should be in passion just because someone puts the word passion in the title.
    Probably because there is no justification for it. Just people trying to make an excuse to put a thread here so it will get more views. These should be the first targets for removal. Same with the "what tire should I run" threads.

    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    Good feedback everyone.
    I don't care what you call this subforum, but if you really want to make MTBR great again the forum setup needs to be changed so that photos display at full size. The way the forum currently downsizes them detracts a lot from photo threads and trip reports. It's hard to get motivated to post images here because of that.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by evdog View Post
    but if you really want to make MTBR great again the forum setup needs to be changed so that photos display at full size. The way the forum currently downsizes them detracts a lot from photo threads and trip reports. It's hard to get motivated to post images here because of that.
    You probably don't remember when full size photos blew up the site layout, screwing up navigation because there would be no horizontal scrollbars. I don't like how it works now, either, because it also increases the size of intentionally smaller posted pics, but fixing it is going to require more work behind the scenes.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    This enforcement is something I discussed with the new Ownership, in fact they plan to change the name from "passion" to "riding experiences" once the site is moved to their servers.
    Ah yes, the nail in the coffin. Not that I'm a target audience anymore, but hahahahahahahahaha!
    baker

  55. #55
    fc
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    Here is the current list of forums. We just kept adding forums as the site grew. We've never really pruned or categorized.


    Passion - (76 Viewing)
    26 - (20 Viewing)
    27.5 - (82 Viewing)
    29er Bikes - (335 Viewing)
    29er Components - (85 Viewing)
    26+/27.5+/29+ Plus Bikes - (150 Viewing)
    All Mountain - (152 Viewing)
    Apparel and Protection - (91 Viewing)
    Beer Forum - (7 Viewing)
    Beginner's Corner - (221 Viewing)
    Bike and Frame discussion - (78 Viewing)
    Bikepacking and Bike Expedition - (42 Viewing)
    Brake Time - (250 Viewing)
    Cars and Bike Racks - (90 Viewing)
    Cargo Bikes - (5 Viewing)
    Classifieds - (7 Viewing)
    Clydesdales/Tall Riders - (19 Viewing)
    Commuting - (45 Viewing)
    Components - (77 Viewing)
    Cyclocross - (41 Viewing)
    Downhill - Freeride - (106 Viewing)
    Drivetrain - shifters, derailleurs, cranks - (360 Viewing)
    E-Bikes - (17 Viewing)
    Endurance XC Racing - (34 Viewing)
    Enduro Racing - (13 Viewing)
    Families and Riding with Kids - (65 Viewing)
    Fat bikes - (301 Viewing)
    Fifty+ Years Old - (12 Viewing)
    Folding and Travel Bikes
    Frame Building - (55 Viewing)
    General Discussion - (359 Viewing)
    GPS, HRM and Bike Computer - (23 Viewing)
    Gravel Bikes - (30 Viewing)
    Internal Gear Hubs - (22 Viewing)
    Lights and Night Riding - (110 Viewing)
    Lights DIY - Do It Yourself - (24 Viewing)
    Nutrition and Hydration - (12 Viewing)
    Off Camber - (off topic) - (38 Viewing)
    Photography for mountain bikers - (5 Viewing)
    Rider Down, injuries and recovery - (59 Viewing)
    Shocks and Suspension - (443 Viewing)
    Singlespeed - (112 Viewing)
    Tandem Mountain Bikes - (6 Viewing)
    Tooltime - (87 Viewing)
    Trail Building and Advocacy - (56 Viewing)
    Urban/DJ/Park - (32 Viewing)
    Vacations & Destinations - (2 Viewing)
    Videos and POV Cameras - (12 Viewing)
    Vintage, Retro, Classic - (136 Viewing)
    Weight Weenies - (67 Viewing)
    Wheels and Tires - (478 Viewing)
    Where are the Best Deals? - (41 Viewing)
    Women's Lounge - (12 Viewing)
    XC Racing and Training - (91 Viewing)


    Regional Bike Trails and Rides ForumsThreads / Posts Last Post
    Alaska - (6 Viewing)
    Arizona - (53 Viewing)
    California - Norcal - (171 Viewing)
    California - Socal - (45 Viewing)
    Colorado - Front Range - (46 Viewing)
    Colorado - Western Slope - (5 Viewing)
    Connecticut, Rhode Island - (3 Viewing)
    Great Plains - OK, KS, NE, SD, ND - (4 Viewing)
    Hawaii - (1 Viewing)
    Idaho, Montana, Wyoming - (6 Viewing)
    Massachusetts - (5 Viewing)
    Midwest - IL, IN, OH, KY, IA, MO, MI - (9 Viewing)
    Minnesota, Wisconsin - (4 Viewing)
    Nevada - (2 Viewing)
    New Mexico - (10 Viewing)
    New York - New Jersey - (7 Viewing)
    North & South Carolina - (25 Viewing)
    Oregon - (15 Viewing)
    Pennsylvania - (14 Viewing)
    Southeast/Midsouth - GA, TN, AL, FL, MS, LA, AR - (11 Viewing)
    Texas - (6 Viewing)
    Utah - (13 Viewing)
    Vermont, New Hampshire, Maine - (7 Viewing)
    Virginia, WV, Maryland, DC, Delaware - (10 Viewing)
    Washington - (20 Viewing)
    Western Canada - (6 Viewing)
    Eastern Canada - (19 Viewing)
    Mexico - (11 Viewing)
    Australia, New Zealand - (2 Viewing)
    Europe - (2 Viewing)
    Asia + Philippines
    Other Areas - (2 Viewing)


    Mountain Bike Manufacturer ForumsThreads / Posts Last Post
    Airborne - (4 Viewing)
    Banshee Bikes - (13 Viewing)
    BMC - (4 Viewing)
    Canfield - (15 Viewing)
    Cannondale - (105 Viewing)
    Canyon - (48 Viewing)
    Commencal - (6 Viewing)
    Devinci - (10 Viewing)
    Diamondback - (36 Viewing)
    Ellsworth - (8 Viewing)
    Evil Bikes - (71 Viewing)
    Felt - (2 Viewing)
    Foes - (5 Viewing)
    Foes Bicycles
    Fuji - (3 Viewing)
    Giant - (87 Viewing)
    GT - (28 Viewing)
    Guerrilla Gravity - (30 Viewing)
    Haro - (6 Viewing)
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    Marin - (6 Viewing)
    Mongoose-Schwinn - (5 Viewing)
    Motobecane - (11 Viewing)
    Nicolai - (6 Viewing)
    Niner Bikes - (23 Viewing)
    Norco - (16 Viewing)
    Orbea - (6 Viewing)
    Pivot Cycles - (31 Viewing)
    Ritchey Design - (7 Viewing)
    Rocky Mountain - (28 Viewing)
    Salsa - (27 Viewing)
    Santa Cruz - (171 Viewing)
    Scott Sports - (56 Viewing)
    Shimano - (18 Viewing)
    Specialized - (189 Viewing)
    SRAM - (16 Viewing)
    Surly - (60 Viewing)
    Trek - (113 Viewing)
    Transition Bikes - (43 Viewing)
    Turner - (26 Viewing)
    Ventana - (5 Viewing)
    Yeti - (121 Viewing)
    YT - (35 Viewing)
    Custom Builders & Other Manufacturers - (13 Viewing)
    Canadian Bikes - (9 Viewing)
    Site Feedback/Issues - (4 Viewing)



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  56. #56
    fc
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    Here's a first cut at a re-org and categorization:

    Technical discussions
    General Discussion - (359 Viewing)
    29er Bikes - (335 Viewing)
    Apparel and Protection - (91 Viewing)
    Bike Racks and Auto Transport- (90 Viewing)
    Frame Building - (55 Viewing)
    GPS, HRM and Cameras - (23 Viewing)
    Internal Gear Hubs - (22 Viewing)
    Lights and Night Riding - (110 Viewing)
    Shocks and Suspension - (443 Viewing)
    Tooltime - (87 Viewing)
    Weight Weenies - (67 Viewing)
    Wheels and Tires - (478 Viewing)

    Bike categories
    All Mountain - (152 Viewing)
    Bikepacking - (42 Viewing)
    Cargo Bikes - (5 Viewing)
    Commuting - (45 Viewing)
    Downhill - (106 Viewing) - RENAME TO DOWNHILL
    E-Bikes - (17 Viewing)
    Fat bikes - (301 Viewing)
    Folding and Travel Bikes
    Gravel Bikes - (30 Viewing)
    Plus Bikes - (150 Viewing) - RENAME TO PLUS BIKES
    Singlespeed - (112 Viewing)
    Tandem Mountain Bikes - (6 Viewing)
    Urban/DJ/Park - (32 Viewing)
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    Nutrition and Hydration - (12 Viewing) - - MERGE INTO RACING SUBCAT
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    Foes Bicycles - DELETE
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    Comments? The regional forums with a lot of states and countries each are pretty jacked and have little hope of success, Need to separated or deleted.
    Last edited by fc; 10-16-2018 at 09:08 PM.
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  57. #57
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    6 deletions? Where is my TPS report?

    edit: actually, it has to be more than that, since I don't see all the wheel size forums on the new list (except 29er, cuz we are special). :-)
    baker

  58. #58
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    My unsolicited opinion, whack all manufacturer forums (I'm sure that'll be popular with the sponsors), the Beer, GPS, IGH, Tandem, E-bike, Cargo, Folding, Gravel, DJ, 50+ forums, Off-camber, and any regional forum that doesn't have sufficient traffic (i.e. <10 active users).
    baker

  59. #59
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    What’s this?

    Forum improvements - feedback?-5124c62d-2e54-4df2-b021-31906290fd92.jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  60. #60
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    No bikepacking forum?
    Surly Krampus
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  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    What’s this?

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	5124C62D-2E54-4DF2-B021-31906290FD92.jpg 
Views:	24 
Size:	41.1 KB 
ID:	1220973
    Riding experiences, duh

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  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by baker View Post
    Riding experiences, duh

    Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
    Lol, I don’t like it.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  63. #63
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    DJ, passion is definitely the forum for you.

  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by baker View Post
    Riding experiences, duh

    Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
    "Passion and riding experiences"

    Don't worry, we'll never whack the word Passion. That is the soul or root of mtbr.
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  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    No bikepacking forum?
    fixed. sowwy.

    No fixie though
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  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    fixed. sowwy.

    No fixie though
    Keeping the 29er bikes forum but whacking all the other wheel sizes doesn't make sense. What makes 29er bikes more special or worthy than the others? Honestly I think even that one can be closed and the threads put elsewhere like in the riding style forums. Just because lots of people are viewing it doesn't mean it isn't a category that isn't better served being addressed in another way.

    I might suggest a rename for the GPS forum. Call it "Bike Computers, Tracking, and Navigation" since any discussion of GPS inherently involves maps, mapping computer software, cell phone apps, and such. I think that title fairly concisely (in a future proof way) conveys the full breadth of navigation and tracking options (high tech or not) that exist now, and also other things that may crop up in the future. When that forum was named, smartphone mapping and tracking apps weren't a thing. Consequently, new users often post phone app questions all over the place. Even though it doesn't get a ton of traffic, it is a useful place to collect such discussions.

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  67. #67
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    FC,

    *There's a good point made about the cross duplicating of thread topics outside of NorCal, it looks like NorCal is the test or the metric for thread topics. Stop doing that. If you wanna post the topic do it either in Passion or General and then simply make a thread in [Insert Region here, ie: NorCal] referencing the main topic like we always did BITD. It brings us all together in a non-regional thread which to some of us older members was the reason MTBR's Forums appealed more to us than other places.


    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Here's a first cut at a re-org and categorization:
    ...
    So you're gonna cut out 26" and 27.Hype but keep 29"? What's your logic with that move?

    Why not then just change all three and make them one single sub category under "Wheel Size Discussions" instead? Seems shortsighted to do any less especially now that the industry is in chats about needing to diversify 26" again due to lost sales? (Yes, I'm dead serious about this bit as well as 26 possibly being resurrected. IMHO just do a better Wheelsize section, bring it all back together and make it something people want to post up in.)

  68. #68
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    So I didn't want to quote this whole post, but tapatalk is being a bitch and erases everything when I try to clip out the parts I don't want to quote.

    Edit - which it deleted anyway...lovely.

    I was trying to think of how to handle wheel size discussions, and this same thought crossed my mind. I feel like a LOT of the traffic in that forum would go elsewhere. Most of the topics aren't really ABOUT the wheel size. MOST of the discussions on the first page fall into a couple categories - which bike discussions, which can be moved into the relevant bike type forum, or threads about specific bikes - which could either go into relevant manufacturer forums (where such threads exist quite successfully already when a specific brand or model is discussed), or into the relevant bike type forums. I think if you simply left the forum for wheel size discussions only, you wouldn't have much left and you'd want to merge that with wheels & tires. I say just put wheel size discussions in wheels & tires and call it done. Close the 29er bikes forum altogether. Hell, take the super general photo threads like 'share your 29er" and put them in Passion.

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  69. #69
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    Keeping the 29er bikes forum but whacking all the other wheel sizes doesn't make sense. What makes 29er bikes more special or worthy than the others? Honestly I think even that one can be closed and the threads put elsewhere like in the riding style forums. Just because lots of people are viewing it doesn't mean it isn't a category that isn't better served being addressed in another way.

    I might suggest a rename for the GPS forum. Call it "Bike Computers, Tracking, and Navigation" since any discussion of GPS inherently involves maps, mapping computer software, cell phone apps, and such. I think that title fairly concisely (in a future proof way) conveys the full breadth of navigation and tracking options (high tech or not) that exist now, and also other things that may crop up in the future. When that forum was named, smartphone mapping and tracking apps weren't a thing. Consequently, new users often post phone app questions all over the place. Even though it doesn't get a ton of traffic, it is a useful place to collect such discussions.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
    Good suggestion on Bike Computers.

    On the 29er forum, can't really kill that. It has a lot of action, community and regulars. Get rid of it and half that traffic and users will go away.

    One solution is to keep
    26er
    27.5er
    29er

    As is and tell them we'll merge these forums with the rest in a year. The real objective is to remove 29er components.
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  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    One solution is to keep
    26er
    27.5er
    29er

    As is and tell them we'll merge these forums with the rest in a year.
    I dunno if a full year is necessary, but I think this is better than squashing 26er and 27.5 but leaving 29er alone. Remember that one issue I have been pointing out is a lack of consistency.

    I have a feeling that a lot of that traffic will start to naturally migrate to other bike style oriented forums, anyway. Especially if you set cutoff dates that specific discussion types will start getting moved, and phase that process in over a period of time.



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  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    I dunno if a full year is necessary, but I think this is better than squashing 26er and 27.5 but leaving 29er alone. Remember that one issue I have been pointing out is a lack of consistency.

    I have a feeling that a lot of that traffic will start to naturally migrate to other bike style oriented forums, anyway. Especially if you set cutoff dates that specific discussion types will start getting moved, and phase that process in over a period of time.



    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
    Yep, the time is variable. Should be shorter. We kind of need:
    Cross Country Bikes
    Trail Bikes

    then maybe kill all those racing forums. They're all cross country!
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  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    On the 29er forum, can't really kill that. It has a lot of action, community and regulars. Get rid of it and half that traffic and users will go away.
    Not sure I understand the logic here. I never understood why there were separate forums for wheel sizes other than segregation and/or keeping separate tribes. Surely there is not THAT much discussion on the merits of different wheel sizes to warrant separate forums. This whole forum is supposed to be the community. Why can’t these “regulars” that will go away learn to use a more organized forum? I wonder how many of these regulars just picked the 29er forum because they were overwhelmed with the choices of forums...so they picked what they rode.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Yep, the time is variable. Should be shorter. We kind of need:
    Cross Country Bikes
    Trail Bikes

    then maybe kill all those racing forums. They're all cross country!
    Maybe just merge all the race disciplines into "racing" considering traffic levels would be super low with too much subdivision. There should still be a nutrition & hydration forum....maybe add training/fitness to that. Maybe call it Training, fitness, nutrition, & hydration. Should get decent traffic with the extra subjects.

    One thing that recently occurred to me (and emphasized by your mention of cross country and trail categories) is how to define or set cutoffs for bike/riding styles. I think xc/trail can be one category. But considering that there are regularly questions from new riders about what those terms mean, I think those forum headings will need to specify the cutoffs.

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  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockadile View Post
    Not sure I understand the logic here. I never understood why there were separate forums for wheel sizes other than segregation and/or keeping separate tribes. Surely there is not THAT much discussion on the merits of different wheel sizes to warrant separate forums. This whole forum is supposed to be the community. Why can’t these “regulars” that will go away learn to use a more organized forum? I wonder how many of these regulars just picked the 29er forum because they were overwhelmed with the choices of forums...so they picked what they rode.
    I think that likely has a lot to do with it.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockadile View Post
    Not sure I understand the logic here. I never understood why there were separate forums for wheel sizes other than segregation and/or keeping separate tribes. Surely there is not THAT much discussion on the merits of different wheel sizes to warrant separate forums. This whole forum is supposed to be the community. Why can’t these “regulars” that will go away learn to use a more organized forum? I wonder how many of these regulars just picked the 29er forum because they were overwhelmed with the choices of forums...so they picked what they rode.
    Good point.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Good point.
    Once upon a time, when I still had hair, different sized wheels were radical. Not so much anymore. Lose the wheel size forums, including 29er, which I still ride (mostly, besides my 26er, 27.5er, gravel bike, fat bike, etc)

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    baker

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by baker View Post
    Once upon a time, when I still had hair, different sized wheels were radical. Not so much anymore. Lose the wheel size forums, including 29er, which I still ride (mostly, besides my 26er, 27.5er, gravel bike, fat bike, etc)

    Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk
    And another good point. Some good points in here so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  78. #78
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    I still think you have too many categories. I just think bikes are bikes--you can have different interpretations, but you don't have to pigeon hole every type of bike into a sub-category. Let the threads themselves sort out the discussion....

    This would be my suggestion... But please gather more input

    Bikes of all kinds (1000 Viewing)
    General Discussion - (359 Viewing)
    Clothing, Apparel and Protection - (91 Viewing)
    Cars & Racks- (90 Viewing)
    Frame Building - (55 Viewing)
    Electronics: GPS, HRM and Cameras - (23 Viewing)
    Components and Tools (112 Viewing)
    Lights and Night Riding - (110 Viewing)
    Bikepacking - (42 Viewing)
    Commuting - (45 Viewing)
    Singlespeed - (112 Viewing)
    Vintage, Retro, Classic - (136 Viewing)
    Beer, Wine and Spirits - (70 Viewing)
    Beginner's Corner - (221 Viewing)
    Injuries, Recovery, and Injury Prevention - (59 Viewing)
    Families and Kids - (65 Viewing) - FAMILIES AND KIDS
    Off Camber - (off topic) - (38 Viewing)
    Passion - (76 Viewing) - MOVE
    Women's Lounge - (12 Viewing)
    Trail Building and Advocacy - (56 Viewing)
    Everything Racing – (2 Viewing)

    Since this is the 'Passion' forum....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Forum improvements - feedback?-img_6798.jpg  

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  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    Maybe just merge all the race disciplines into "racing" considering traffic levels would be super low with too much subdivision. There should still be a nutrition & hydration forum....maybe add training/fitness to that. Maybe call it Training, fitness, nutrition, & hydration. Should get decent traffic with the extra subjects.

    One thing that recently occurred to me (and emphasized by your mention of cross country and trail categories) is how to define or set cutoffs for bike/riding styles. I think xc/trail can be one category. But considering that there are regularly questions from new riders about what those terms mean, I think those forum headings will need to specify the cutoffs.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
    Agreed. XC and Trail are becoming more similar now and in the future.
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  80. #80
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    how about, instead of a 26er forum, how about a not old enough for vrc forum, but too new to to be able to get new parts for forum... as all the 26er stuff will end up in vrc, and the vrc guys will start killing people as "that bike is from '99 so get out"... and peopel will get all confused on where to post.
    All the gear and no idea.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by baker View Post
    My unsolicited opinion, whack all manufacturer forums

    less active regional forums
    Just no. It's been the best place to find specific info/tech specs/mods/issues/etc for a given bike. OK, so I've only gone into a couple of the brands but that's what I had questions about. They're alphabetical so it's not hard to understand the organization.

    If the regions were consolidated a bit it'd help, but don't just delete them.

  82. #82
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    Technical Discussions still needs a subforum for components and another for drivetrain (which should include internally geared hubs).

    And kill the 29er forum already. Nothing but duplicate conversations in there about things that fit in other subforums.

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by noapathy View Post
    Just no. It's been the best place to find specific info/tech specs/mods/issues/etc for a given bike. OK, so I've only gone into a couple of the brands but that's what I had questions about. They're alphabetical so it's not hard to understand the organization.

    If the regions were consolidated a bit it'd help, but don't just delete them.
    Yep!
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  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    Yep!
    Double yep, is that even legal to say? “Double yep”.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  85. #85
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    I've been on here since 2004 and I've never reported a thread, person, or post, but I've had plenty of mine moved, deleted, edited, etc. No more. I'm fighting back. #resist #triggeredpassion #notmymtbr #buffalowings

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Comes down to control freaks basically. If a thread doesn't belong in a certain forum folks won’t reply to it. Guess where it ends up pretty quick? Two pages back. If it’s a worthy thread and people enjoy it then they reply. That's what this site should be all about, entertainment and enjoyment. Controlling what others post is, well I don’t want to get political but I think you know what I’m referring to.
    "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to DIRTJUNKIE again."

  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by mik_git View Post
    how about, instead of a 26er forum, how about a not old enough for vrc forum, but too new to to be able to get new parts for forum... as all the 26er stuff will end up in vrc, and the vrc guys will start killing people as "that bike is from '99 so get out"... and peopel will get all confused on where to post.
    I know. 26er is going to become it's own subculture with folks sharing info about the good ole days, parts and availability.

    It's not VRC though.
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  88. #88
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by noapathy View Post
    Just no. It's been the best place to find specific info/tech specs/mods/issues/etc for a given bike. OK, so I've only gone into a couple of the brands but that's what I had questions about. They're alphabetical so it's not hard to understand the organization.

    If the regions were consolidated a bit it'd help, but don't just delete them.
    Yeah, manufacturer forums are safe. That's where the industry participates a lot too and contribute. At the minimum, they all read their forums.

    fc
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  89. #89
    fc
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    Quote Originally Posted by amish_matt View Post
    Technical Discussions still needs a subforum for components and another for drivetrain (which should include internally geared hubs).

    And kill the 29er forum already. Nothing but duplicate conversations in there about things that fit in other subforums.
    I'll float the idea there in that forum. Start giving them a runway perhaps.

    fc
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  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O View Post
    I've been on here since 2004 and I've never reported a thread, person, or post, but I've had plenty of mine moved, deleted, edited, etc. No more. I'm fighting back. #resist #triggeredpassion #notmymtbr #buffalowings
    yep, yep, yep.

    Sorry about that.

    Better organization, better messaging and less police-ing is good. But you all have to post more!
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  91. #91
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    We'll start by moving Passion down the dropdown list and un-moving some of the posts. That's an easy one.
    IPA will save America

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Double yep, is that even legal to say? “Double yep”.
    Yep, yep!
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  93. #93
    Candlestick Maker
    Reputation: baker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O View Post
    I've been on here since 2004 and I've never reported a thread, person, or post, but I've had plenty of mine moved, deleted, edited, etc. No more. I'm fighting back. #resist #triggeredpassion #notmymtbr #buffalowings
    #mustreportscotto ;-)

    I didn't even know this was a thing til recently (besides the obvious spam issues)
    baker

  94. #94
    CEO Product Failure
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    Quote Originally Posted by baker View Post
    For me, Mtbr is losing it’s relevancy. Over moderation and 100 separate forums don’t seem to help. I still occasionally check in, but have other places to go and things to do. This is life. Ever changing. Best of luck figuring it out!
    Agreed. The Passion forum seems micromanaged.

    Is there a way to stone two birds at once? (yes, a Ricky-ism!) Why can't a thread reside in multiple directories/forums at the same time? A post/thread is just a dynamically generated web page. Seems like the easiest way to satisfy everyone and could grow content.

  95. #95
    Professional Crastinator
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    It's been a long time since I posted this rant about 29-specific hubs, handlebars, saddles, stems, grips, etc.:
    Maybe I Don't Know What "29er" Means
    ...but it is the reason we don't really need a separate 29er forum.
    ...and I ride a 29er most of the time.

    I think there are similar reasons to not have the other wheel-size forums.
    Although, probably one reason there are so many sub-cat's is to avoid using the MTBR search function.

    -F
    It's never easier - you just go faster.

  96. #96
    mtbr member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O View Post
    I've been on here since 2004 and I've never reported a thread, person, or post, but I've had plenty of mine moved, deleted, edited, etc. No more. I'm fighting back. #resist #triggeredpassion #notmymtbr #buffalowings
    You forgot #nomorechunk
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  97. #97
    BOOM goes the dynamite!
    Reputation: noapathy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    It's been a long time since I posted this rant about 29-specific hubs, handlebars, saddles, stems, grips, etc.:
    Maybe I Don't Know What "29er" Means
    ...but it is the reason we don't really need a separate 29er forum.
    ...and I ride a 29er most of the time.

    I think there are similar reasons to not have the other wheel-size forums.
    Although, probably one reason there are so many sub-cat's is to avoid using the MTBR search function.

    -F
    Wait, so there is no 29er specific grip? *gasp*

    Totally agree that most of what falls into the wheel size sections doesn't really fit. Noobs put stuff there since that's the size of their wheels. When the 29/27.5 was new and people had questions/debates/discussions it made a bit of sense, but some of that is "history" of a sort, so what to do with it? The irrelevant threads could be moved and the "discussions" kept, but it'd be a pain to parse it all out. Then there's the question of where to put said history. MTBR archives? Tech history?

    Either way, people should be weaned off the 29er bottle.

  98. #98
    since 4/10/2009
    Reputation: Harold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noapathy View Post
    Wait, so there is no 29er specific grip? *gasp*

    Totally agree that most of what falls into the wheel size sections doesn't really fit. Noobs put stuff there since that's the size of their wheels. When the 29/27.5 was new and people had questions/debates/discussions it made a bit of sense, but some of that is "history" of a sort, so what to do with it? The irrelevant threads could be moved and the "discussions" kept, but it'd be a pain to parse it all out. Then there's the question of where to put said history. MTBR archives? Tech history?

    Either way, people should be weaned off the 29er bottle.
    I'd put those relevant wheel size debates in wheels & tires.

    I'm in the process of building a 29er right now (first one for me, believe it or not), and I haven't visited any of the 29er forums, except for many months ago, I browsed some threads about AM hardtails and long travel 29er hardtails. I've done most of my discussion/research in the manufacturer forums.

    It hurts less if you just rip it off quickly...

  99. #99
    Self Appointed Judge&Jury
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    Who’s the head nurse in charge of this operation these days? I stopped by the nursing station several times and was confronted with a dumbfounded look when I asked that question.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  100. #100
    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ SuperModerator
    Reputation: Klurejr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    I'd put those relevant wheel size debates in wheels & tires.

    I'm in the process of building a 29er right now (first one for me, believe it or not), and I haven't visited any of the 29er forums, except for many months ago, I browsed some threads about AM hardtails and long travel 29er hardtails. I've done most of my discussion/research in the manufacturer forums.

    It hurts less if you just rip it off quickly...
    I like that idea.

    I think we also need a forum, perhaps a sub to the beginners corner called "Help me choose a bike", where people can post all the bike comparison help me choose threads. We can probably move many of the threads in the 26/27.5 and 29er forums there.
    Ride Bikes, Drink Craft Beer, Repeat.

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