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Thread: Martial arts

  1. #1
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    Martial arts

    Who's into what and how hardcore ?

    I started nin-jutsu about 2 years ago, passed my 9th kyu and stopped for a year due to time restrictions and now going back into training. I plan to reinforce my structural strength and pain tolerance over the summer to be able to be back into the dojo when I leave my summer home. Plus I met a guy the other day who was still kicking it at 60 years old after making the top ranks into karate championships.

    Be strong.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    I'm an Arnis instructor. I think they call it Kali or Eskrima here. I used to compete in stick fighting. Since I was born in Thailand (but I am Filipino-Chinese), I think it is natural that I am also a Muay practitioner. I was a taekwondo blackbelt until I realized it is not ideal translating it to a real fighting environment (don't flame me, that's just me). I trained briefly with the Hybrid YawYan MMA team until I also realized that a grappling curriculum is not for me. I have been in different martial arts for 30 years. I am 42.

    Hmmm... Ninjitsu siunds interesting. Do they teach being stealth like hiding in shadows?

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    I have a black belt in Tae Kwon Do.
    Not as active as I once was but still enjoy it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by littlebadboy View Post
    Hmmm... Ninjitsu sounds interesting. Do they teach being stealth like hiding in shadows?
    It's the main rule. Be fast and silent. You should not even notice the kill and be taken by surprise if you try to assault.

    It's pretty much the learning and mastering of the fatest kill action and complete stealth execution. The US Marines and mostly the Navy Seals and Special Operation commandos have translated this art into their core training and combat techniques.

    But nin-jutsu isn't an assault art, it's a survival and low-profile martial art where you have to hide all weakness and never even think about giving up no matter what.

    Kung Fu and nin-jutsu are the 2 hardest martial arts to master. Because you can't master the art of nin-jutsu unless you dedicate your way of life to being a ninja and understand the real meaning of nin-jutsu. It's the spirit that make the difference between an expert and a master.

    Otherwise it's fun for pulling out a prank on your friends and navigating trough a crowded place full of drunk people without even being noticed.
    Last edited by David C; 07-08-2012 at 01:08 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Got my Karate black belt at the age of 14, 24 years ago. Competed and have a bunch of plastic gold to show for it. Got burned out, and started riding freestyle BMX.

    Never looked back.

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    Not to thread jack ... but, what type of art form would you guys recommend for kids and what age should they start? I have no experience as you can see.

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    I have a moderate interest in martial arts.

    I practiced some tae kwon do as a kid and I enjoyed it then, but my parents only ever enrolled me in classes that didn't go anywhere...no building on foundations or any of that.

    I practiced a little aikido for some time and in general I liked it but the repetitive ritual kneeling involved with that did NOT work for me. I have a history of bad knees and it seriously inflamed them for days after a practice session.

    I tried qigong once (only partially related to martial arts) and did not like it much at all.

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    What would you recommend for a old guy to get into? I would
    just like not to get my ass kicked by someone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Not to thread jack ... but, what type of art form would you guys recommend for kids and what age should they start? I have no experience as you can see.
    I'd say anything made for under 10-12 years old kids will pretty much be useless (better spend their time doing gymnastic).

    But it really depend on the kid itself and what's the reason to learn martial arts.

    If you want fitness and healthy, go nin-jutsu.

    If you just want your boy/girl to learn some self-defense bases "just in case", karate is pretty nice.

    If you're looking for a military type martial art lesson, juta´-jutsu and jut-jitsu are pretty straight forward, but also requires dedication and a lot more training and self-control than karate and judo.

    I'd say don't waste your time and send them into a nice nin-jutsu dojo once they are 14-15 and keep supporting them and they'll never get lazy and fat. And be ready to dedicate even more time into this art than you'll be doing if they were playing soccer in a league.

    But the ultimate combat art is Kung Fu and is very hard to learn and master, but is also very spiritual and make for a more relax and peaceful personality where fighting is the last resort they should ever think about. And you should get them started as soon as possible.

    There is also a whole bunch of other martial arts out there, but I don't know them all. Just remember that nin-jutsu is the original martial art way of life and kung fu the spiritual guide to peace martial art.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Not to thread jack ... but, what type of art form would you guys recommend for kids and what age should they start? I have no experience as you can see.
    How old are they? Usually, they don't know what they want yet. They just want to do it for fun and competition. I would say, choose any school nearest to you who are active in mainstream competitions like Karate, Taekwondo, Judo, and Brazilian Jujitsu. Just make sure that they are a legitimate member of the recognized organizations of whatever martial arts you choose.
    Last edited by littlebadboy; 07-09-2012 at 06:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Kuhl View Post
    What would you recommend for a old guy to get into? I would
    just like not to get my ass kicked by someone.
    I have had the same thoughts; my research has indicated that Krav Maga might be the ticket. No spiritual/religious bs or fancy rehearsed moves that look cool. It is the Isreali military fighting style that focuses on how to fight to survive and to never give up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Kuhl View Post
    What would you recommend for a old guy to get into? I would
    just like not to get my ass kicked by someone.
    I would recommend Ms. Smith and Wesson. They are always polite and never miss their point when engaging a discussion.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Kuhl View Post
    What would you recommend for a old guy to get into? I would
    just like not to get my ass kicked by someone.
    Any practical martial art will be good for you. Arnis/Kali/Eskrima, Krav Maga, or you could go boxing or Muay Thai.

    As for self-defense, your best bet is practice running and just run away from trouble. I'm serious. I am trained in the blade arts (Filipino knife and sword) but the truth is, there is no best defense against a person charging at you with full intent to kill you with a knife or club. Just run away. Martial Arts is just there if you are cornered and have no other choice. In fact, I would even recommend Judo or wrestling. Throw him down and stun him, and then run.

    If it is for defense against muggers, well... they are armed with guns nowadays... so what's the use?

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    I would recommend Ms. Smith and Wesson. They are always polite and never miss their point when engaging a discussion.
    I totally agree! I think Mr. Glock is a favorite choice nowadays though.

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    Two words KRAV MAGA

    Brazillian Jiu Jitsu is also a crazy martial art. Those guys are probably some of the most strongest guys in the world. They can snap all your limbs like if they were twigs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    I'd say anything made for under 10-12 years old kids will pretty much be useless (better spend their time doing gymnastic).

    But it really depend on the kid itself and what's the reason to learn martial arts.

    If you want fitness and healthy, go nin-jutsu.

    If you just want your boy/girl to learn some self-defense bases "just in case", karate is pretty nice.

    If you're looking for a military type martial art lesson, juta´-jutsu and jut-jitsu are pretty straight forward, but also requires dedication and a lot more training and self-control than karate and judo.

    I'd say don't waste your time and send them into a nice nin-jutsu dojo once they are 14-15 and keep supporting them and they'll never get lazy and fat. And be ready to dedicate even more time into this art than you'll be doing if they were playing soccer in a league.

    But the ultimate combat art is Kung Fu and is very hard to learn and master, but is also very spiritual and make for a more relax and peaceful personality where fighting is the last resort they should ever think about. And you should get them started as soon as possible.

    There is also a whole bunch of other martial arts out there, but I don't know them all. Just remember that nin-jutsu is the original martial art way of life and kung fu the spiritual guide to peace martial art.
    My kids are only 13 months, but this is helpful for the future. They teach Kung Fu in the town I live in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by littlebadboy View Post
    How old are they? Usually, they don't know what they want yet. They just want to do it for fun and competition. I would say, choose any school who are active in mainstream competitions like Karate, Taekwondo, Judo, and Brazilian Jujitsu. Just make sure that they are a legitimate member of the recognized organizations of whatever martial arts you choose.
    Thanks! The kids are still babies, but I want them to know how to defend themselves later on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Thanks! The kids are still babies, but I want them to know how to defend themselves later on.
    The best way to help them is to teach how to stay ahead of trouble. And how to handle nunchakus.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Addict View Post
    Two words KRAV MAGA

    Brazillian Jiu Jitsu is also a crazy martial art. Those guys are probably some of the most strongest guys in the world. They can snap all your limbs like if they were twigs.
    BJJ is great! It doesn't matter if your opponent is bigger than you. But... it's a one-on-one combat style.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    My kids are only 13 months, but this is helpful for the future. They teach Kung Fu in the town I live in.
    Hmmm... I'm half Chinese, the birthplace of Kungfu. But, I don't support it. It's too complicated to learn. I have high regards to Wushu (Sanda format) and Wingchun though. Taichi is a great fitness regimen. But, Kungfu does not have much tournament opportunities for the kids to have fun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Kuhl View Post
    What would you recommend for a old guy to get into? I would
    just like not to get my ass kicked by someone.
    When I was 34 I went back to martial arts (Pankration, BJJ, MMA). It was "interesting", but interfered with my riding/lifestyle. I had to choose: ride 3-5X a week, or dedicate to the martial arts? With a 60 hour a week, commission-based job, I sided with riding. MMA was 2-3X a week and the classes were $100/month.

    I love riding more than anything else - it is the way I connect spiritually to the earth. I love training for racing, even though I'm not at all close to the podium. I love wrenching on my bikes, maintaining them, and I love alternative (to MTB) riding styles like trials, flatland BMX (which I grew up on) and cyclocross. I like riding in downpours. I like dieting for riding, tracking my progress through my Garmin, and constantly window shopping for my next bike.

    Riding is my life, and it's how I identify myself.

    So, I hung it (MMA) up. It just took away from too much of my time and away from my one, true passion. If I'm training in martial arts, it's taking away from my riding - period. Unless you are young with zero responsibilities, I had a very hard time trying to balance my life with so much trying to do at once.

    I know how to defend myself pretty damn well (I was a bar bouncer in my college years) and I avoid conflict. I have good street smarts (something I picked up while street riding in BMX where we always seemed to find trouble) and just stay low key.

    99% of "not getting your ass kicked" is not being there in the first place. If you find yourself in that situation, you have to ask yourself how a grown man wound up there.

    If your state issues CCW permits, get that. 7 rounds of .40 caliber is the best defense.

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    Martial arts is my other personal indulgence besides riding the MTB.

    I've been training in American kenpo for 8-9 years. It is a great discipline and I enjoy it very much.

    Right now, it also fits my schedule better as I can train 2-4 times per week, whereas getting out for a 2+ hour ride is harder to pull-off with work/family/other responsibilities.

    As my kids get older and start to ride, however, that balance is fortunately going to shift in favor of MTB.

    R

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    I know how to defend myself pretty damn well (I was a bar bouncer in my college years) and I avoid conflict. I have good street smarts (something I picked up while street riding in BMX where we always seemed to find trouble) and just stay low key.

    99% of "not getting your ass kicked" is not being there in the first place. If you find yourself in that situation, you have to ask yourself how a grown man wound up there.
    Perfectly said! Important keywords I noticed are being "street smart", "stay low key", and "not being there (trouble) in the first place".

    I agree with you in prioritizing. Studying a martial art needs time and dedication too. Somebody gave me a negative rep for my comment on having a gun. Should I get a negative comment for my opinion? I have been in the martial arts for a majority of my life and has been exposed to real life situations. I just have to say that nowadays thugs nowadays are armed to the teeth. So, I just have to say that you need to be armed in some way too. I would even consider a small knife. But but but, I only advocate guns to only those who are responsible and to use it only for the sake of self defense. I did not say use it to kill somebody for your defense but to at least give you a chance to survive or to, most importantly, defend your loved ones. Things change when you have a family.

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    13 years in Tae Kwon Do. 3rd Dan
    4 Years in Okinawan Kenpo Kobudo (weapons). 1st Dan
    1 year Kung Fu
    2 Years Shorin Ryu

    Haven't done anything for 5 years now, several of those styles overlapped where i was doing more than one during the same period of time. I hope to start again in something this winter.
    "Any wheel size is better than sitting at a computer all day." -Myself

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    Quote Originally Posted by littlebadboy View Post
    Perfectly said! Important keywords I noticed are being "street smart", "stay low key", and "not being there (trouble) in the first place".

    I agree with you in prioritizing. Studying a martial art needs time and dedication too. Somebody gave me a negative rep for my comment on having a gun. Should I get a negative comment for my opinion? I have been in the martial arts for a majority of my life and has been exposed to real life situations. I just have to say that nowadays thugs nowadays are armed to the teeth. So, I just have to say that you need to be armed in some way too. I would even consider a small knife. But but but, I only advocate guns to only those who are responsible and to use it only for the sake of self defense. I did not say use it to kill somebody for your defense but to at least give you a chance to survive or to, most importantly, defend your loved ones. Things change when you have a family.
    To get a CCW permit, it takes quite a bit of paperwork and training. Some states allow "open carry" (openly carrying a firearm with the magazines out and open). By law, and I know it sounds weird, you can carry an AR15 through a mall as long as the magazine is open and somewhat away from the firearm. I wouldn't do it, though.

    Certain locking blade knives and fixed blades are also not allowed to be carried concealed in certain states. Concealed means putting them in your pocket - open means in a sheath, outside of your belt.

    I open carry my knife in my car with a can of pepper spray and I also have a Bug Out Bag with a field stripped .410 shotgun in my truck. I'm in sales and I travel a bit, so I'm always worried (and prepared) for bad situations. However, I keep my cool on the road and let things slide with d-bag drivers. Last traffic altercation I got into was because I flipped somebody off and it escalated. I should've just let it go, like a grown man with good sense should always do. My wife is always telling me to "honk your horn at that a-hole!" and I'm, like, "No... there's no need for that."

    People illegally carry all kinds of weapons on them. Whoever gave you the neg rep needs to get a reality check. It's just not thugs and criminals - that disgruntled desk surfer sitting in 2 hours of traffic may be carrying a .38 and is ready to snap. That woman, having had an altercation 3 years ago and is deathly afraid of everything, my have that Ruger PC9 in her purse with a nervous trigger finger. That meth head who hasn't slept for 4 days is looking at you like a gold mine. You never know what people have on themselves - so this is why traditional martial arts, although good for body awareness, fitness, and "just in case" is great - but if you truly need to defend yourself against the reality of what is circling around in the world, you have to understand what you're up against.

    It would be sweet if you could Steven Seagal your way through a group of gang bangers - but that just isn't reality. At least not in 2012.

    CCW permit. Last time I checked, bullets are faster than humans and they go through kicks, punches and submission attempts. Depending on where you live, there are a lot of defensive handgun classes that take you through the basics of conceal carry, presenting and fighting with a handgun.

    Martial arts is great for the reasons I stated above, but again, I love riding too much to have something distract me from it. For self defense, I would rather go straight to the most effective method against the dangers of today - unfortunately, that is handgun training. And even that is totally last resort. Just don't be in that position to begin with.

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    Funny how even in OC forum riding get back into discussion even when the discussion has nothing to do with bikes.

    Back on topic, if you're mastering martial arts to the level where you can easily disarm someone pointing a gun to your head, I think you should not try to then pull out a gun or run away from bullets, but just take down the dudes and be smart enough to bail out when they get an hold on you. Unless you like shooting people or get shot, you should not even get a gun in your hand after disarming the guy, but instead GTFO ASAP before it gets worst.

    Or play it wise and learn how to deal with any possible situation.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    To get a CCW permit, it takes quite a bit of paperwork and training. Some states allow "open carry" (openly carrying a firearm with the magazines out and open). By law, and I know it sounds weird, you can carry an AR15 through a mall as long as the magazine is open and somewhat away from the firearm. I wouldn't do it, though.

    Certain locking blade knives and fixed blades are also not allowed to be carried concealed in certain states. Concealed means putting them in your pocket - open means in a sheath, outside of your belt.

    I open carry my knife in my car with a can of pepper spray and I also have a Bug Out Bag with a field stripped .410 shotgun in my truck. I'm in sales and I travel a bit, so I'm always worried (and prepared) for bad situations. However, I keep my cool on the road and let things slide with d-bag drivers. Last traffic altercation I got into was because I flipped somebody off and it escalated. I should've just let it go, like a grown man with good sense should always do. My wife is always telling me to "honk your horn at that a-hole!" and I'm, like, "No... there's no need for that."

    People illegally carry all kinds of weapons on them. Whoever gave you the neg rep needs to get a reality check. It's just not thugs and criminals - that disgruntled desk surfer sitting in 2 hours of traffic may be carrying a .38 and is ready to snap. That woman, having had an altercation 3 years ago and is deathly afraid of everything, my have that Ruger PC9 in her purse with a nervous trigger finger. That meth head who hasn't slept for 4 days is looking at you like a gold mine. You never know what people have on themselves - so this is why traditional martial arts, although good for body awareness, fitness, and "just in case" is great - but if you truly need to defend yourself against the reality of what is circling around in the world, you have to understand what you're up against.

    It would be sweet if you could Steven Seagal your way through a group of gang bangers - but that just isn't reality. At least not in 2012.

    CCW permit. Last time I checked, bullets are faster than humans and they go through kicks, punches and submission attempts. Depending on where you live, there are a lot of defensive handgun classes that take you through the basics of conceal carry, presenting and fighting with a handgun.

    Martial arts is great for the reasons I stated above, but again, I love riding too much to have something distract me from it. For self defense, I would rather go straight to the most effective method against the dangers of today - unfortunately, that is handgun training. And even that is totally last resort. Just don't be in that position to begin with.
    Some counties in some states give these out like parking tickets. My relatives all have them living in Colorado and never lock cars or houses ... my dad doesn't even own keys to his house (they're lost). Yet they have no crime at all. Of course my dad has no problem firing at trespassers with his 30-30 just for fun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    Funny how even in OC forum riding get back into discussion even when the discussion has nothing to do with bikes.

    Back on topic, if you're mastering martial arts to the level where you can easily disarm someone pointing a gun to your head, I think you should not try to then pull out a gun or run away from bullets, but just take down the dudes and be smart enough to bail out when they get an hold on you. Unless you like shooting people or get shot, you should not even get a gun in your hand after disarming the guy, but instead GTFO ASAP before it gets worst.

    Or play it wise and learn how to deal with any possible situation.
    On my 9mm, my finger has to travel 1cm before a bullet leaves the chamber at 900 feet per second. I have 16 more 900fps killers waiting in the magazine and can empty that very, very fast.

    If you're at gun fighting/defensive handgun range of 5-7 yards, I don't care if you're a Kung Fu god, there is no way you're going to move faster than that. Whenever I watch martial arts gun take-away youtube videos, I laugh. The reason why anybody would fight with a gun is to keep as far away as their opponent as possible. Criminals often don't act alone, so, you'll have 2-3 assailants 5-7 yards away with weapons pointed at you from 2-3 different directions.

    Like I said, I am not foreign to hand-to-hand. I fought tournaments as a teen, won a bunch, and got back into it in my 30's. I was also tossing people out the back door of a bar in my 20's. I saw some pretty brutal fights, and most of the time, they happened when nobody was expecting it. I've seen people get bottles broken over their head from behind, liver shots from behind, and bar stools cracked upside their head from behind - I'm sure a 10th degree black belt wouldn't have been able to do much with that. I don't have a false sense about myself, and always had my back to the wall so I didn't get hit from behind.

    I've been at parties where guns were drawn, and I didn't get into a horse stance and yell "KIAI!". We all got the f* out of dodge. If all you have is survival and the two choices are life or death - I guess trying to do your best at not getting shot would be good, but you're probably going to end up with a piece of hot lead in you anyway.

    Here's a very real life situation. If the store owner didn't have a firearm, he was facing two men, both armed with semi-auto hand guns, ready to kill. The store owner, ever after detaining the guy in the white sweatshirt, had an empty magazine and the assailant had his gun underneath him. Super scary, super fast... very deadly. Martial arts wouldn't have saved him, even if he somehow took the guy in the black using hand-to-hand.

    Gunfight Caught on Tape: Store Owner vs. 2 Armed Robbers - YouTube

    I think martial arts is great, especially for children. They are all very beautiful in their own right. Please, keep practicing/progressing and I'm not trying to flame it... I'm just saying that having a false sense of fight is not healthy. I always cheer when somebody does take down a gun assailant with hand-to-hand, too. That is just crazy. But, in my home, of you're coming in with a crowbar, I'm coming at you with a 12g. #00 buckshot, not kicks and punches.

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    Again unless the guy pointing a gun at you is there to kill you, best way is just to give him what he wants, then you can always shoot him down when he's walking away

    But I didn't made this thread to discuss about guns and bandits. Let's get back to what make you like martial arts and what you can tell about your training.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    In my experience, the best real-world combat martial arts is wrestling, grappling, submission. I have a client (whom I'm seeing tonight) who is a Federal Police officer and a former staff sergeant, and also served two tours in Afghanistan. He says that most of the guys are doing MMA style martial arts.

    The cops actually have built a grappling dojo, and he's invited me to check it out.

    I think Kenpo, Karate, Kung Fu, etc. are great as physical arts, especially for children to grow up on (I started when I was 7).

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    I just came back from training.

    100's of punches on concrete wall, 100 set-ups with 2 punches on the same concrete wall each times up, push-ups on the wrists, fists and 3 fingers (+thumbs) all on concrete floor, kicks on concrete post and punches again.

    Come back home, stretch again and practice sword handling and combat. Long sword (ninja sword) and shorter one for 1 or 1 and a half hand. Practice blocking, counter-attack and attacks, combos and deplacements, then all again but using both swords.

    This is what makes nin-jutsu interesting. Not only you get super flex and quick, you get agile, accurate and deadly with anything that can be used as a weapon. More important it's the mind. You are not allowed to fail. No matter what, your mind must not fail before your body do. See the tv show American Ninja Warriors ? Never you had a single competitor from America succeed the final stage in Japan. A lot of the contestant are super fit and strong, but almost none of them are spiritually ready to really complete the course.

    Nin-jutsu gives you the power and motivation you need to face any challenges and always be ready to bounce back either you're in a fight or in a competition. Learn to take the hits and use them to understand how your opponent fight. Then you can end the fight in a single strike.

    I'm not a big guy at all and certainly not above average when it comes down to brute force, but if you come at me to try to fight, I'll be able to grab anything close by (like a broom, small knife, golf club, newspaper/magazine, etc) and open a can of ass-whooping in a matter of seconds and serve it hot'n spicy to ya. If you pull out a knife, then you better be fast coz I'll be already taking off my shirt to use it as a net and get that knife out of the way. If you pull out a gun, unless your intention is to kill me, I'll play it safe and do as you order (like giving you my money/wallet or letting go your friend), but you better not sleep for the next weeks, coz I'll be on the hunt and you'll get a correction at the moment you're the most exposed.

    Never fail, but stay alive for another day. In the dojo, our motivation is : suffer in the dojo, smile on the battlefield.

    And I'd like to add that no matter how trained you are, it's better to never show it till the last moment.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    If you pull out a knife, then you better be fast coz I'll be already taking off my shirt to use it as a net and get that knife out of the way.

    If someone had the intention to kill you with a knife there is almost a 100% chance that they would succeed despite all the training you have. You've obviously never been in an altercation involving a knife. A knife is a much more lethal weapon than a firearm at close range.

    If someone wants to kill you with a knife they would not pull it out and show you it. They would simply walk up to you with the knife hidden and then unleash a Hell storm of slashes and stabs upon you. Shock would overtake you and you would be on the floor in a matter of seconds. Disarming someone with a knife is not as easy as the movies or your Nin Jitsu classes portray it. Trust me on this subject I know every thing and more there needs to be known about knives.

    Check out these videos. The first one is of a crazed man in Nicaragua who kills several police officers armed with AK-47's using a knife.

    The second one is of an altercation in a bus that ends up in the assailant slashing the victim's throat in a matter of seconds.

    POLIC═AS AGREDIDOS CON CUCHILLO EN NICARAGUA.mpg - YouTube

    Fight in a bus - YouTube

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    Honestly if someone was to come to me with the intention of killing me, no matter what weapon he got, I would simply get the **** out of the country and find my way to kill the guy who ordered my killing.

    But really, I understand in a situation were to kill is the main factor that you just better have a bigger gun or GTFO.

    But in an let's say a bar fight, the rage factor is probably more to whoop ass than intentionally kill. And in this case martial art comes into matter. I never talked about being Steven Seagal all over the place, but to be able to deal with high intensity combats situation.

    And once I complete my sword mastering, I'd be carrying one
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    Back on topic, if you're mastering martial arts to the level where you can easily disarm someone pointing a gun to your head, I think you should not try to then pull out a gun or run away from bullets, but just take down the dudes and be smart enough to bail out when they get an hold on you. Unless you like shooting people or get shot, you should not even get a gun in your hand after disarming the guy, but instead GTFO ASAP before it gets worst.
    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    If you pull out a knife, then you better be fast coz I'll be already taking off my shirt to use it as a net and get that knife out of the way.
    Sorry to tell you, but coming from a practical martial art, all of the above is a myth.

    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    See the tv show American Ninja Warriors ? Never you had a single competitor from America succeed the final stage in Japan. A lot of the contestant are super fit and strong, but almost none of them are spiritually ready to really complete the course.
    The title is "American Ninja", but most of the competitiors are actualy Par Kour practitioners.

    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    Again unless the guy pointing a gun at you is there to kill you, best way is just to give him what he wants, then you can always shoot him down when he's walking away
    Now now now... that is not responsible gun ownership... tsk tsk...

    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    This is what makes nin-jutsu interesting. Not only you get super flex and quick, you get agile, accurate and deadly with anything that can be used as a weapon. More important it's the mind. You are not allowed to fail. No matter what, your mind must not fail before your body do.
    I think that is not unique to Ninjutsu. Most martial arts practices this philosophy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    On my 9mm, my finger has to travel 1cm before a bullet leaves the chamber at 900 feet per second. I have 16 more 900fps killers waiting in the magazine and can empty that very, very fast.

    If you're at gun fighting/defensive handgun range of 5-7 yards, I don't care if you're a Kung Fu god, there is no way you're going to move faster than that. Whenever I watch martial arts gun take-away youtube videos, I laugh. The reason why anybody would fight with a gun is to keep as far away as their opponent as possible. Criminals often don't act alone, so, you'll have 2-3 assailants 5-7 yards away with weapons pointed at you from 2-3 different directions.
    I agree to this. But, I would like to also refer you to this video which we also tested since I am from a blade art (FMA).

    Gun vs. Knife Fight | Mythbusters - YouTube

    <iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/cGzeyO3pGzw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

    To some extent and paramters, knife may win over gun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Addict View Post
    If someone had the intention to kill you with a knife there is almost a 100% chance that they would succeed despite all the training you have. You've obviously never been in an altercation involving a knife. A knife is a much more lethal weapon than a firearm at close range.

    If someone wants to kill you with a knife they would not pull it out and show you it. They would simply walk up to you with the knife hidden and then unleash a Hell storm of slashes and stabs upon you. Shock would overtake you and you would be on the floor in a matter of seconds. Disarming someone with a knife is not as easy as the movies or your Nin Jitsu classes portray it. Trust me on this subject I know every thing and more there needs to be known about knives.

    Check out these videos. The first one is of a crazed man in Nicaragua who kills several police officers armed with AK-47's using a knife.

    The second one is of an altercation in a bus that ends up in the assailant slashing the victim's throat in a matter of seconds.

    POLIC═AS AGREDIDOS CON CUCHILLO EN NICARAGUA.mpg - YouTube

    Fight in a bus - YouTube
    A group of Hell's Angels, armed with knives, once attempted to steal my Grandpa's classic Indian motorcycle. They stopped rather quickly after he held a Colt 45 to one guy's head and pulled the hammer back. All parties left on good terms. Never bring a knife to a gun fight as the saying goes. Now, perhaps this case was an exception. One thing to note is that you should never pull a weapon of any kind unless you'll be willing to kill. My grandpa, after years of making moon shine during probation, had no problem at all taking out a scumbag.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    My kids are only 13 months, but this is helpful for the future. They teach Kung Fu in the town I live in.
    13 months and they teach kung fu? Wow. Over achievers I see.
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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    I just came back from training.

    100's of punches on concrete wall, 100 set-ups with 2 punches on the same concrete wall each times up, push-ups on the wrists, fists and 3 fingers (+thumbs) all on concrete floor, kicks on concrete post and punches again.
    Poor walls and posts. They never fight back.

    I also wish pine boards would stick up for themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by littlebadboy View Post
    I agree to this. But, I would like to also refer you to this video which we also tested since I am from a blade art (FMA).

    To some extent and paramters, knife may win over gun.
    I can see that, but the Myth Buster guy probably 1) doesn't have a CCW permit and 2) completely not trained in defensive handgun. I watch the defensive handgun guys at my local range - complete noobs coming in, and 45min. in, they are drawing fast and unloading magazines in dummies.

    Part of the CCW certification is to be able to draw, present and fire in a very limited time. It's pretty damn fast. I've also seen defensive handgun training from a driver's seat of a car.

    Also, who in their right mind would square up with a charging knife wielder? Not me. I'd move to the side and blast him, and not just one shot.

    But, who knows, when the adrenaline is pumping and you're scared, what would happen? Like I said, I was a bar bouncer back in my 20's and seen some stuff go down that was very scary. My friend, who was a 3rd degree blackbelt and Karate instructor was, like, "F that". When bottles are being cracked over people's heads from behind and they're laying there in seizures, laying in blood and puke, you know your limitations.

    SS Hack was dead on. If I have my home defense shotgun at defensive gun distances, with my laser sight pointed right at the chest, it's a lose for my opponent.

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    Ive only been in a handful of fights, but Ive seen quite a few. Ive seen a weapon get pulled only once. You're kinda more likely to be out on the town and some drunk idiot wants to get bad. I dont think pulling out a gun and killing someone is exactly the best call. Decking them quickly is though.

    Especially talking about young kids growing up, knowing unarmed defense of some sort is probably going to come in handy, more than once. The chances you'll have to kill someone with a gun to protect yourself is really very low.

    If I had kids, I would like them to have the training to lay out a school bully, or protect themselves at a party when someone gets dumb. It happens very frequently. It doesnt always have to come down to death.

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    which one to learn first would be based on your preference for punch/kick( tae kwon do) vs hold/throw ( judo/akido) vs whatever works (krav maga).
    and then there's weapon training.

    as for the CCW: every class i've ever attended ( used to work at a gun range) the 1st thing beat into peoples heads was how fast a determined attacker can cover 15 feet vs drawing and firing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    Ive only been in a handful of fights, but Ive seen quite a few. Ive seen a weapon get pulled only once. You're kinda more likely to be out on the town and some drunk idiot wants to get bad. I dont think pulling out a gun and killing someone is exactly the best call. Decking them quickly is though.

    Especially talking about young kids growing up, knowing unarmed defense of some sort is probably going to come in handy, more than once. The chances you'll have to kill someone with a gun to protect yourself is really very low.

    If I had kids, I would like them to have the training to lay out a school bully, or protect themselves at a party when someone gets dumb. It happens very frequently. It doesnt always have to come down to death.
    You know what martial arts gave me? Confidence and discipline.

    As does football, boxing, or any other sport where a scary man is telling you to push yourself. I think this is the most important part of it all, being humbled and respectful - more than having the ability to fight. The kid will take this discipline and apply it to all things in their life.

    I definitely have a problem with Karate schools that give out black belts and a million gi patches to 4 yr. olds. To me, at that point, it's really about running a business and less about what the black belt actually is.

    When I got my black belt at such a young age, it was pretty rare. I remember being so intimidated, but man... after I got that I was probably even more humbled than I was when I was a white belt.

    My wife and I decided that if we are ever so blessed to have children, we'd like for them to get into MMA, boxing and/or football. We live right near American Kickboxing Academy, and it's cool to have so many UFC fighters walking around (I met Cain Velasquez at Target ).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    I can see that, but the Myth Buster guy probably 1) doesn't have a CCW permit and 2) completely not trained in defensive handgun. I watch the defensive handgun guys at my local range - complete noobs coming in, and 45min. in, they are drawing fast and unloading magazines in dummies.

    Part of the CCW certification is to be able to draw, present and fire in a very limited time. It's pretty damn fast. I've also seen defensive handgun training from a driver's seat of a car.
    We did the experiment in our club and at an actual demonstration at an arms and guns exhibit with a licensed gun shooter competitor. I am not sure about how "expert" he is, but that would be one of the factors to consider. It is not conclusive but it is something to think about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    My wife and I decided that if we are ever so blessed to have children, we'd like for them to get into MMA, boxing and/or football. We live right near American Kickboxing Academy, and it's cool to have so many UFC fighters walking around (I met Cain Velasquez at Target ).
    Wow... I wished I lived next to a martial arts gym... but then, I'm not sure if I could afford the fees nowadays...

    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    You know what martial arts gave me? Confidence and discipline.
    Once again, very well said! Same here, I believe that first and foremost, this is what they should learn and what should martial arts schools teach: humility, confidence and discipline.
    Last edited by littlebadboy; 07-09-2012 at 05:01 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    I just came back from training.

    100's of punches on concrete wall, 100 set-ups with 2 punches on the same concrete wall each times up, push-ups on the wrists, fists and 3 fingers (+thumbs) all on concrete floor, kicks on concrete post and punches again.

    Come back home, stretch again and practice sword handling and combat. Long sword (ninja sword) and shorter one for 1 or 1 and a half hand. Practice blocking, counter-attack and attacks, combos and deplacements, then all again but using both swords.

    This is what makes nin-jutsu interesting. Not only you get super flex and quick, you get agile, accurate and deadly with anything that can be used as a weapon. More important it's the mind. You are not allowed to fail. No matter what, your mind must not fail before your body do. See the tv show American Ninja Warriors ? Never you had a single competitor from America succeed the final stage in Japan. A lot of the contestant are super fit and strong, but almost none of them are spiritually ready to really complete the course.

    Nin-jutsu gives you the power and motivation you need to face any challenges and always be ready to bounce back either you're in a fight or in a competition. Learn to take the hits and use them to understand how your opponent fight. Then you can end the fight in a single strike.

    I'm not a big guy at all and certainly not above average when it comes down to brute force, but if you come at me to try to fight, I'll be able to grab anything close by (like a broom, small knife, golf club, newspaper/magazine, etc) and open a can of ass-whooping in a matter of seconds and serve it hot'n spicy to ya. If you pull out a knife, then you better be fast coz I'll be already taking off my shirt to use it as a net and get that knife out of the way. If you pull out a gun, unless your intention is to kill me, I'll play it safe and do as you order (like giving you my money/wallet or letting go your friend), but you better not sleep for the next weeks, coz I'll be on the hunt and you'll get a correction at the moment you're the most exposed.

    Never fail, but stay alive for another day. In the dojo, our motivation is : suffer in the dojo, smile on the battlefield.

    And I'd like to add that no matter how trained you are, it's better to never show it till the last moment.
    This is hilarious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbnoobadam View Post
    This is hilarious.
    I know, I really enjoy it. Hope you do the same
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    I know, I really enjoy it. Hope you do the same
    I would have enjoyed it if you would just throw smoke bombs when you are in a hostile situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by littlebadboy View Post
    I would have enjoyed it if you would just throw smoke bombs when you are in a hostile situation.
    I personally like the ninja star belt buckle.

    Back before everything was illegal in California, my buddy had one (now remember, we were 8 years old). He thought he was going to be slick, disengage it and throw it at a tree.

    Well, he sucked.

    It went right past the tree into the woods.

    I am intrigued to go back to martial arts, but I love riding too much. Like you said, it's a TON of dedication time, and 80% of my free time is dedicated to mountain bikes. In fact, if I was going to "get back" into anything, it would be flatland BMX - which requires extreme ninja skills.

    My friend travels to Japan and rides there. He says that the "Samurai Spirit" is in everything, and the culture applies it to everything, even BMX. He says the level of practice, training, and discipline they apply is unmatched in the States. I guess that's why a Japanese rider won the 2012 JomoPro (a top level flatland BMX contest).

    Interesting how a martial art philosophy applies to other things.



    I personally like Moto Sasaki

    Last edited by Dion; 07-10-2012 at 07:49 AM.

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    Those guys are excellent Dion! I haven't seen a bmx demo or tournament in a while and those are awesome! It's almost like their dancing... or like doing a figure skating routine! So beautiful to see!

    I like Bas Rutten's martial arts demonstration:

    Bas Rutten - The lighter side of martial art - YouTube
    <iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/nnQY3hLJ4S4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warner2012 View Post
    Are you one of those guys that I see at the park sometimes that wears the duck tape and cardboard knight uniforms fights your buddies with plastic swords?
    Lol no. I know who you're talking about, we got the same thing back home. Nah, you'll see me dressed in black, with nun-chunks and ninja swords. And no fake death. We'll fight to the death.

    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    I know drunken white boy. Its super effective.
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    I just got back from brushing my teeth. 24 reps on my right side, 26 reps on the left side, 20 reps in front.

    Then I got into mouthwash combat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dion View Post
    I just got back from brushing my teeth. 24 reps on my right side, 26 reps on the left side, 20 reps in front.

    Then I got into mouthwash combat.
    White teeth belt
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by David C View Post
    . Just remember that nin-jutsu is the original martial art way of life and kung fu the spiritual guide to peace martial art.
    Not to thread hijack or be a dick, but Ninjutsu is not the original anything in terms of martial arts. It developed as a way to practice espionage by the shinobi and as a combat method for people fighting against the ruling samurai class in Feudal Japan starting around the 1200s. It is said to be derived from the teachings of a Chinese monk trained in kung fu.

    Shaolin Kung Fu is one of the earliest recorded developments of martial arts from 200+ BC. It is said to have developed simultaneously with the Buddhist movement between India and China of that time. While it is closely tied to Buddhism, it is no more "peaceful" than any other subsequent styles of martial arts.

    While these histories are not very clear due to their age, this information is well established among historians.
    Last edited by jtmartino; 07-18-2012 at 11:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    Not to thread hijack or be a dick, but Ninjutsu is not the original anything in terms of martial arts. It developed as a way to practice espionage by the shinobi and as a combat method for people fighting against the ruling samurai class in Feudal Japan starting around the 1200s. It is said to be derived from the teachings of a Chinese monk trained in kung fu.

    Shaolin Kung Fu is one of the earliest recorded developments of martial arts from 200+ BC. It is said to have developed simultaneously with the Buddhist movement between India and China of that time. While it is closely tied to Buddhism, it is no more "peaceful" than any other subsequent styles of martial arts.

    While these histories are not very clear due to their age, this information is well established among historians.
    Oh he's just messing with you. But be careful, he might be lurking around near you in stealth mode and throw some deadly shurikens at you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

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    David C.


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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Not to thread jack ... but, what type of art form would you guys recommend for kids and what age should they start? I have no experience as you can see.
    To learn how to defend themselves properly and for live training, I'd recommend BJJ or a wrestling discipline.

    Striking should only be taught to adults, imo. Kids shouldn't be getting hit in the head.

    **EDIT to add to the post**

    I trained muaythai for five years before having to give it up due to knee problems that began to surface. This was after training in Systema for a year. Systema turned out to be some good LARPing with a bit of useful information. After having done muaythai, I realized what 'live' training is and what it really takes to be able to fight. Most arts don't train in how to fight because frankly, fighting hurts and most people aren't willing to suffer enough to acquire such skill. Even though I spent five years at the gym, training and sparring, I still wouldn't consider myself a fighter and I sure wouldn't instigate situations simply because I've done some training.

    The first rule of confrontation is to defuse. If you can't defuse, run. If running doesn't work, then you have to consider actually fighting but only as a last resort.

    Finally, I laugh at those who claim they can take on multiple opponents barehanded. Try it with a group determined to kick your ass and I guarantee you will end up in the hospital.
    Last edited by scorchedearth; 07-19-2012 at 10:40 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scorchedearth View Post
    To learn how to defend themselves properly and for live training, I'd recommend BJJ or a wrestling discipline.
    BJJ is awesome. Builds a lot of flexibility and overall wrestling-oriented strength. Judo helps with the grappling and learning how to fall.

    I also highly recommend Aikido, which emphasizes smooth counterattacks and redirecting the force of the attacker. A great way to learn evasion (and it works well with larger bullies picking on your kids.)

    Good comments about defense - the best way to win a fight is to walk away without fighting at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jtmartino View Post
    BJJ is awesome. Builds a lot of flexibility and overall wrestling-oriented strength. Judo helps with the grappling and learning how to fall.

    I also highly recommend Aikido, which emphasizes smooth counterattacks and redirecting the force of the attacker. A great way to learn evasion (and it works well with larger bullies picking on your kids.)

    Good comments about defense - the best way to win a fight is to walk away without fighting at all.
    Thanks to all for the thoughts on kids. I doubt my kids will need anything for defense, but I'm sure they'll savagely use whatever they learn against each other as they're wild twin boys.

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    Just tell your kids once they are old enough to understand it. If they are ever involved in a situation where the other person is going to hurt them if they dont do something, dont be afraid to fight dirty.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Thanks to all for the thoughts on kids. I doubt my kids will need anything for defense, but I'm sure they'll savagely use whatever they learn against each other as they're wild twin boys.
    Just make sure they don't start teasing other kids saying "my dad's stronger than yours" and have yourself to deal with an angry 200lbs redneck dude knocking at your door...

    And regarding the comment made about "real world" fighting in your training, I don't know for other dojo, but in ours we do fight at the end of each sessions 1vs1, and only 2 rules; no direct hit to the face and no grasping. You better harden the **** off real quick coz you won't be able to keep up.

    Isn't nothing extreme, I mean we're all doing it in a fairly manner, but when you kick, expect to be blocked and bones against bones can be quite unpleasant sometimes. It's also a good exercise in terms of learning how your opponent think and react, and how to take the hits and know when to dodge. You don't want to miss dodging a side kick and taking it directly to the face or trying to punch and get ko instead.

    And like they said, try to avoid any fight. A few times back in school I wished I had some sort of martial training to be able to have valid arguments against the bullies, but when you think about it, unless you really mastered them, you'd probably run into even more problems trying to fit a bigger guy who's looking for trouble.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    Just tell your kids once they are old enough to understand it. If they are ever involved in a situation where the other person is going to hurt them if they dont do something, dont be afraid to fight dirty.
    Always. That's the only fighting skill I ever had ...

    Back in high school a group of Cambodian kids used to get picked on by a group of jocks/rednecks and the teachers didn't seem to care either. One day I guess they'd had enough and came to school ready to fight back with chains, nunchucks and even sand to throw in their eyes ... let's just say we had one really demoralized and beat up football team after that. I remember being rather pleased.

  62. #62
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    Honestly... ahh I give up

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by scorchedearth View Post
    The first rule of confrontation is to defuse.
    all this time i thought the 1st rule was "take off and nuke em from orbit, its the only way to be sure."

  64. #64
    Huckin' trails
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slozomby View Post
    all this time i thought the 1st rule was "take off and nuke em from orbit, its the only way to be sure."
    That's for zombies and hipsters.
    Quote Originally Posted by NicoleB28 View Post
    topless. that's what all mtb girls do. we go ride, get topless, have pillow fights in the woods, scissor, then ride home!

  65. #65
    No known cure
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    Kung Foo San Soo for more than half my life. It's dirty street fighting but I wouldn't know. I'm a lover, not a fighter and have been know to run away from a fight. But I don't hurt in the morning.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

  66. #66
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    Im more one of those "i dont get into fights, but if i do im not the only one that will be sore in the morning" kind of guys.
    2010 Giant Yukon FX
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