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  1. #1
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    Ensuing mudfest on the way!

    This weekends forecast is shaping up to be the nicest in weeks. It's an almost certainty that outdoor enthusiasts will be filling the trailheads. But please know this melting snow coupled with the freeze/thaw effect, will surely make the trails an unsustainable mudfest. Any cycling will be doing damage, (to your drivetrain) as well as the tread. Ride the gravel or just go hiking, but please be considerate and wait until more favorable conditions to ride the trails. This is meant for the visitors, the locals know better ...right?
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  2. #2
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    Hell even the gravel is going to be gnarly when itís this soft.

    Never really understood riding trails when theyíre this nasty. I hate cleaning my bike... thatís enough to do it for me.

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    I don't clean my huffy after shredding the mud bro

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    Unfortunately your sound advice will fall on deaf ears. The bottom line is many people are just really ignorant, just don't give a fu*k, or a combination of both. I think this holds true for locals and visitors alike.

    My personal solution this weekend is to grab my road bike and head down the hill to SC and put in some road miles in decently warm weather. Not ideal but I am pretty happy just pedaling.

  5. #5
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    Yah and Iím not sure hiking will be any better.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by pryde1 View Post
    Unfortunately your sound advice will fall on deaf ears. The bottom line is many people are just really ignorant, just don't give a fu*k, or a combination of both. I think this holds true for locals and visitors alike.
    Well hopefully if they read this first, they'll feel like shit for doing it. Or even better, join a club and do some trailwork!
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    Quote Originally Posted by FatTireGoose View Post
    Well hopefully if they read this first, they'll feel like shit for doing it. Or even better, join a club and do some trailwork!
    We can only hope. I am originally from the Midwest where there was long periods of freeze/thaw and VERY muddy, sticky, clay-based trails that would just get destroyed every year by morons who just couldn't wait.

    It always amazes me how anyone could remotely enjoy slogging on shit trails with caked-on mud that would clog up every moving part on a bike.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by pryde1 View Post
    It always amazes me how anyone could remotely enjoy slogging on shit trails with caked-on mud that would clog up every moving part on a bike.
    Word
    Pisgah Forest NC

  9. #9
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    As I post every year- this is why I still own a road bike. Will be a perfect weekend for said.

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    "but...but I'm on vacation so that means I can trash your trails then leave"...

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Brown View Post
    As I post every year- this is why I still own a road bike. Will be a perfect weekend for said.
    I have some pavement exploring to do in my new neighborhood. Lots of quiet rural roads, and a few gnarly hills. My neighbor is a roadie who has a loop he rides through the area. Sunday looks like it'll be a great day to check the area out.

  12. #12
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    Just got back from a road/gravel ride... Its pretty soupy out there with plenty of slush and ice on the gravel. Most of the places catching sun are pudding.

    I am sure the trails are sloppy joes...

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    On your left!

  13. #13
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    Don't forget about Bailey Mtn and Windrock. Both will be open this weekend if you want to mtb.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by matty22c View Post
    Don't forget about Bailey Mtn and Windrock. Both will be open this weekend if you want to mtb.
    How will they be any better?

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    We will be trail running Saturday and road riding Sunday. Mtb'ing will have to wait.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    How will they be any better?
    They are private entities and maintain their trails in-house, so its business as usual.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by motomike View Post
    They are private entities and maintain their trails in-house, so its business as usual.
    Yah, I realize itís private, but I donít think freeze/thaw cares about that. Still gonna be a sloppy mess. Or does their maintenance prevent that?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Yah, I realize itís private, but I donít think freeze/thaw cares about that. Still gonna be a sloppy mess. Or does their maintenance prevent that?
    No, freeze/thaw doesn't discriminate. But that doesn't mean they can't try to capitalize on that by opening their trails while all others are closed. Heck, Windrock even advertises as such, they encourage users to go ride regardless of the conditions, which I think is cool. Riding in the mud is really fun if you are prepared for it and its ok with the trail keepers.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by motomike View Post
    Riding in the mud is really fun
    Maybe I've become an old fart, but no, riding in the mud is NOT fun. I might have thought so when I was 20, but then all that mud (and the incessant bike washing) cost me a whole helluva lot of money in replacement parts when I didn't have the money for it. Nowadays, it's more frustrating than anything. The reduced functionality of everything during the muddy ride, all the extra cleanup time, the reduced durability of everything (and the extra expense of buying bearings and servicing suspension more frequently) is definitely not fun.

    For what, getting some mud on my face? I've got a seasonal pond behind my house that's pretty muddy (with some lingering ice, too) right now where I could just jump right in if that's what I wanted. No thanks.

  20. #20
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    Did a 40 mile road ride down in SC today, climbed up and flew down the escarpment and had a good suffer-fest in nice weather.

    Driving on the way back through Dupont, both CMS and Lake Imaging parking areas where FULL of mtn bikers. Go figure...hope those idiots had a great time

  21. #21
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    Anyone get out today and can report on trails or gravel? I'm considering same as pryde ^^^^ - an escarpment NC/SC pavement pounding for tomorrow.

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  22. #22
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    Conditions on Saturday

    I attempted to do a gravel ride at DuPont, starting at Fawn Lake. The parking lot was a disaster. Lots of water, and extremely soft conditions. I walked up to the gravel road, and it looked OK, so I unloaded and started toward Fawn Lake. Before I got to where Mine Mountain comes in, I knew it wasn't going to be good. I went as far as where Fawn Lake Trail forks left before the lake, took some pictures, and started back to the parking lot. It didn't look like anyone had come down Mine Mountain, so at least that is good.

    Ensuing mudfest on the way!-img_20180120_134109627.jpgEnsuing mudfest on the way!-img_20180120_135629748.jpgEnsuing mudfest on the way!-img_20180120_135831840.jpg
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lithified View Post
    Anyone get out today and can report on trails or gravel?
    The rocky side of Daniel's Ridge was fine yesterday, no mud, frozen sections, and only light snow near the top. The only wet spots were those that are normally wet (e.g. creek crossings). The only section to be careful on is the new staircase at the Farlow intersection, not because you'll damage it (it's all waterbars) but because it'll be really sketchy wet wood. The rest was fine, the trick will be getting there, I'd either do an out and back or take Headwaters/Cove Creek Rd up there. I'd probably avoid Cove Creek Trail and definitely avoid the bridge side with all the new work that was done.

    Davidson River Trail, being mostly gravel, was fine, but much of it was still frozen when we were out there.

    The road leading to the Daniel's lot from the bottom of Cove Creek was really gross and, TBH, was the worst part of the ride. I don't think I'd base the condition of the trails on a fire road, after seeing that.

    I rode Sycamore on Friday and it was fine, also. Anywhere with sunlight was dry, anywhere without was frozen or still covered in snow. I suspect it was mucky in parts yesterday, probably today too, but should clear up soon. Most of the spots that were frozen or had snow were spots that rarely stay wet. I don't recall seeing any mud, just dirt and snow. It MIGHT be ok today, with the exception of the climb out from the intersection, just basing that on what it was like after the last thaw (it was still frozen when I was there). I'd probably give the lower section another day or so, but just basing that on prior experience, I didn't ride it.

    Given what I saw after the last thaw, I'd probably leave Black, N Slope, etc alone. I'd definitely avoid Bent Creek and N Mills, based on the pictures I've seen.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    How will they be any better?
    They won't be. Point being that if folks feel the urge they should go to pay for play instead of pisgah, dupont, et al.

    And I agree with Moto, riding in mud is fun. Plus it is like practising driving on snowy roads. It is a good skill to hone. Never know when you might catch a dump while out, especially in places like pisgah.

    Though I also agree with Harold about the cleaning/maintenance part. Two rainy days at SS left me with a lot of crunchy bearings and other sundries. But it was end of season anyway.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by matty22c View Post
    They won't be. Point being that if folks feel the urge they should go to pay for play instead of pisgah, dupont, et al.

    And I agree with Moto, riding in mud is fun. Plus it is like practising driving on snowy roads. It is a good skill to hone. Never know when you might catch a dump while out, especially in places like pisgah.

    Though I also agree with Harold about the cleaning/maintenance part. Two rainy days at SS left me with a lot of crunchy bearings and other sundries. But it was end of season anyway.
    Lol. Hone your mud riding skills. Thanks. A ďdumpĒ in pisgah, does not equal a freeze/thaw. Especially this one, as itís worse than most. Riding in mud is stupid, and best left for adolescence. Tell me, what is the attraction? Does the fact that itís private property really make much difference? Youíre still fukkin shit up. Do tell. Full disclosure, I rode my bike today.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Lol. Hone your mud riding skills. Thanks. A ďdumpĒ in pisgah, does not equal a freeze/thaw. Especially this one, as itís worse than most. Riding in mud is stupid, and best left for adolescence. Tell me, what is the attraction? Does the fact that itís private property really make much difference? Youíre still fukkin shit up. Do tell. Full disclosure, I rode my bike today.
    Sorry, I really can't explain it to you if you are of that mind set. Not like it would matter, I don't think you would ever truly listen anyway. No other way could possibly coexist with the way you see it.

    Bottom line, I came on here to keep folks off the trails, just like you. I decided to do this by suggesting places they could ride instead. Places that welcome them in these type of conditions. Sorry you did not see this as helpful.

    Where did you ride btw?

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by matty22c View Post
    Sorry, I really can't explain it to you if you are of that mind set. Not like it would matter, I don't think you would ever truly listen anyway. No other way could possibly coexist with the way you see it.

    Bottom line, I came on here to keep folks off the trails, just like you. I decided to do this by suggesting places they could ride instead. Places that welcome them in these type of conditions. Sorry you did not see this as helpful.

    Where did you ride btw?
    Whatís to explain, silly? You remind me of a girl at the Taco Bell in pisgah forest, maybe 15 years ago, when I asked her what was in a fiesta burrito. Her response,Ēitís hard to explain. Itís got like, fiesta stuff in it.Ē Was that you?

  28. #28
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    Holy smokes guys it sure is deep winter in here ain't it. Mbm give the guy a break. Bailey's and Windrock are big boys and they make their own decisions. If they want to close they'll close, otherwise.... CAPITALISM

    That said, while I won't ride in the mud anymore because now I'm an "adult" with responsibilities taking a lot of my paycheck, I hate destroying bearings and drivetrains, THAT SAID, riding in the mud is stupid fun. Hand raised on that one for sure. Braaaaap.

    Now more rain today......but not hard freezes this week so hopefully late week shredding will be on!

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  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lithified View Post
    Mbm give the guy a break.
    No worries, if he wants to be a douche I say have at it. I'm sure we see who is acting like an adolescent here.

    mbm, did you forget to say where you rode?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    I asked her what was in a fiesta burrito.
    What a dumb question...its a tortilla with meat, cheese, and vegetables.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by matty22c View Post
    No worries, if he wants to be a douche I say have at it. I'm sure we see who is acting like an adolescent here.

    mbm, did you forget to say where you rode?
    Parkway to gravel to parkway. Thanks for asking. Sorry I hurt your feelings. I was just messin. Jeez.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lithified View Post
    Holy smokes guys it sure is deep winter in here ain't it. Mbm give the guy a break. Bailey's and Windrock are big boys and they make their own decisions. If they want to close they'll close, otherwise.... CAPITALISM

    That said, while I won't ride in the mud anymore because now I'm an "adult" with responsibilities taking a lot of my paycheck, I hate destroying bearings and drivetrains, THAT SAID, riding in the mud is stupid fun. Hand raised on that one for sure. Braaaaap.

    Now more rain today......but not hard freezes this week so hopefully late week shredding will be on!

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    he started it.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaXCarp View Post
    What a dumb question...its a tortilla with meat, cheese, and vegetables.
    How do you know? Did you get one?

  34. #34
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    We rode the Isaqueena Trails in Clemson yesterday and they were bone dry.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanchez View Post
    We rode the Isaqueena Trails in Clemson yesterday and they were bone dry.
    Hells yes. Good to know. Would also imagine then that Paris is running good......barely rained here in Saluda today, maybe a tenth of an inch.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Parkway to gravel to parkway. Thanks for asking. Sorry I hurt your feelings. I was just messin. Jeez.
    No worries. I have no hurt feels. I found your viewpoint and even your delivery intriguing, at least.

    Glad you got out. Seemed like you needed it.

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    Its only dirt/mud in a narrow ribbon in the woods. At most its stays visible for a couple weeks, not an epoch. Some would have you believe riding a bike in mud is destroying the Earth irreparably. Said "gravel" and "pavement" are way more of an eyesore than some mud ruts that will wash away or be covered in leaves by Fall.

    For the record, riding in mud is a blast.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lithified View Post
    Hells yes. Good to know. Would also imagine then that Paris is running good......barely rained here in Saluda today, maybe a tenth of an inch.
    Rode Paris tonight, and it is in a lot better shape than I expected. A few areas were a little wet, but nothing showing ruts or damage. Only 1 or 2 puddles in the normal spots. There is a tree down at the creek crossing on North lake Loop.
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    Quote Originally Posted by profro View Post
    Its only dirt/mud in a narrow ribbon in the woods. At most its stays visible for a couple weeks, not an epoch. Some would have you believe riding a bike in mud is destroying the Earth irreparably. Said "gravel" and "pavement" are way more of an eyesore than some mud ruts that will wash away or be covered in leaves by Fall.

    For the record, riding in mud is a blast.
    None of that matters. It's the opinions of the forest service and land managers that matter, because they determine when and where mountain bikes may use trails. If a bunch of people ride muddy trails, that narrow ribbon of dirt widens as bogs and puddles are avoided, ruts form because of slipping and skidding tires, and trails get closed. Not to mention that those ruts and widened sections dry out and cement like that.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by mountainbiker24 View Post
    None of that matters. It's the opinions of the forest service and land managers that matter, because they determine when and where mountain bikes may use trails. If a bunch of people ride muddy trails, that narrow ribbon of dirt widens as bogs and puddles are avoided, ruts form because of slipping and skidding tires, and trails get closed. Not to mention that those ruts and widened sections dry out and cement like that.
    It happens all the time, horses do it, FS trucks do it, humans do it. At this point bikes are still outsiders and doing the exact same behavior, as other well established users, is just viewed differently. Unfortunate as it may be for us mountain bikers.

  41. #41
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    Rode mostly gravel at Bent Creek today. Hit a couple trails that looked like they were in decent shape and could see a few spots that were pretty sloppy not long ago that got beat hard. Most of those spots were firm enough this afternoon that riding over the ruts tended to pack them down.

    There were definitely some pretty wet spots on the gravel still, so I did not push my luck on the trails.

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  42. #42
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    It is as dry as it has been in a while. Go ride before the next winter weather event keeps you off the bike for another few weeks. Trails are actually in better shape than the gravel, unless you can "surf" this type of gravel condition.

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    Everywhere in Pisgah I've ridden this week has been fine, the only iffy spot for me was the top of Grassy Trail where there were a few muddy sections, but nothing terrible. Even North Slope, which is usually the last to dry out, was largely alright except for one or two spots. I obviously can't speak for the whole forest, but it all seems to handle it fine.

    DuPont, most of it was really dry and fine (even spots that normally hold a lot of water were dried out), but Ridgeline was an absolute mess. I assumed it would be in the same state as the rest of the forest (dry and clear), but I was very wrong. It was flat out horrible in spots, mainly at the bottom, but a few at the top, as well. The new work done a few weeks ago is particularly bad and has made a huge mess of those two berms at the bottom, which normally dried out fine, the new dirt has just been destroyed. I posted this in another thread, but I really wish they had left those alone, because the work they did made them a lot worse (although, arguably this could be because people rode them when they shouldn't have and the dirt didn't have time to settle in).

    I'm normally the one advocating that people are too aggressive about not riding when it's wet, especially in Pisgah and DuPont, but this is one of the few cases where I think it was actually merited. Most of the ruts and tracks will clear in a few weeks of dryness, but the damage done to the work at the bottom is gonna probably require intervention.

  44. #44
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    I rode Pisgah on Monday and DuPont today to see how things were drying up. Well quite the opposite from normal, Pisgah was the one in better shape. I guess since DuPont normally is the one that soaks it all up, it's now the one that needs more time to ooze. And ooze it is, Ridgeline has some spots that remind me of grease on a mirror. With more winter weather coming in for the weekend, I think I'll resign to gravel once more but glad I had a couple trail rides during the in-between. Choose wisely my friends.
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    ^^^ Yeah the timing this winter has been terrible for trying to trail ride. Y'all think Paris will be g2g today?

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    I rode mountain creek lower sulphur springs, and turtle Monday, later in the afternoon (trails had been closed earlier). They were fine, but there was very little traffic on them. With the wind we've had since then, I expect they should be good to go. Of course this is just before the rain comes in again.

  47. #47
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    Rode there today - was fantastic. Expect tomorrow to be good too! Tacky dirt!!!!!!!!!!

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    For everyone dying to ride. Tomorrow morning early looks to be about 20f so get out and ride before the thaw (around 11 it will be 32f with some sun poking through so it will all turn to sh!t. Gear up and get out early! Saturday night and Sunday look like more crap weather

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