Attempted Rape Near Trace Ridge- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Attempted Rape Near Trace Ridge

    I was between the Trace Ridge Trailhead and the concrete bridge this afternoon (Wednesday around 6pm) and a guy came up asking if I had seen two young guys and an older guy with a beard. He said they tried to drag his wife into the woods and rape her. He was pretty rattled so I don't think he was making it up. Fortunately they were not successful. The husband and wife were camping at one of the designated sites down near the bridge. A few minutes before he came along I saw an 1980's model Tan van moving quickly down Wash Creek Rd. It may be nothing but it seemed out of place. If you were riding up there today and saw anything that may assist the police call the Henderson County Sheriffs office. They said that area is their jurisdiction.

  2. #2
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    that f'n sucks

  3. #3
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    what the hell is wrong with people? I hope you gave the guy your contact information so the police can get a statement of what you saw.

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    edit - that does suck azz.

  5. #5
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    Bring back public hanging!!!
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  6. #6
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    Damn, this thing seems to happen a little too frequently around here. I'd continue to spread the idea that riding or hiking alone in the woods might not be the best idea.
    My one says BRAP!

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    That, or, change the laws so at the very least women can legally carry concealed weapons in national forests and state parks.

    It's about the only way to level the playing field when you have 3 males attacking 1 female.

  8. #8
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    Last wednesday after work I rode over there from bent creek and something strange happened just before the I got to the parkway. I came up on a guy who apparently had just climbed back up the hill from the woods and seemed out of breath. As I came up to him, I had my headphones on and couldn't hear what he was saying. I stopped since he kept talking and he asked me if I smelled bleach? I told him I didn't smell anything and needed to run. I thought about it the rest of the ride and still can't figure out why he would be asking something like that, unless he was up to some weird sh!t.

  9. #9
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    So that's what was going on...

    Wow. I just got home from Mills River. I was rolling out of the Bear Branch trail at about 6:00p to meet up with some friends at that same intersection. A few minutes later a yellow S-10 with some shady looking dudes came rolling by. As we were heading up 5000 toward Spencer, the yellow truck was parked next to the tan van at the campsite near the bottom of Bad Fork.

    Didn't think anything of it at the time, there are always a few creepy characters around there. But later on in the ride we saw a few Sheriff's cruisers at another campsite along 5000 and then as I was driving out of the Campground afterwards there were two more Sheriffs in the Fee Parking area and they had the yellow S-10 pulled over. A State Trooper blew past me a few minutes later and then when I got to 280, WLOS had the remote van set up.

    Don't really have anything valuable to contribute, as I was oblivious to the situation at the time. Pisses me off though, since I ride that area alot and now I'll be suspicious of every Cletus I see now...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by cruso414
    Last wednesday after work I rode over there from bent creek and something strange happened just before the I got to the parkway. I came up on a guy who apparently had just climbed back up the hill from the woods and seemed out of breath. As I came up to him, I had my headphones on and couldn't hear what he was saying. I stopped since he kept talking and he asked me if I smelled bleach? I told him I didn't smell anything and needed to run. I thought about it the rest of the ride and still can't figure out why he would be asking something like that, unless he was up to some weird sh!t.

    Dude, bleach is used in making meth. Call the cops and tell them where that occurred at. People need to get that sh!t out of the National forests, that's my playground! Know what i mean, that chemical process is very unstable and dangerous.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikeNC
    That, or, change the laws so at the very least women can legally carry concealed weapons in national forests and state parks.

    It's about the only way to level the playing field when you have 3 males attacking 1 female.
    Agreed, +1 I hope they caught the guys.

    My wife is trying to get me to let her start riding alone some, but with this crap going on it's hard to feel comfortable about it. She does however have pepper spray she can carry.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by nitrousjunky
    Agreed, +1 I hope they caught the guys.

    My wife is trying to get me to let her start riding alone some, but with this crap going on it's hard to feel comfortable about it. She does however have pepper spray she can carry.

    pepper spray is great for dogs. I wouldn't feel OK about this with three or more deranged rednecks who are likely high on meth.
    My one says BRAP!

  13. #13
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    Plume is right. I've heard pepper spray just pisses some people off, doesn't deter them. I've heard it's especially true if they're toked up.

    Of course, I've heard this is true for small caliber firearms as well. If you gonna pop a cap in dey ass, make sure it's a big cap.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by motoenth
    Plume is right. I've heard pepper spray just pisses some people off, doesn't deter them. I've heard it's especially true if they're toked up.

    Of course, I've heard this is true for small caliber firearms as well. If you gonna pop a cap in dey ass, make sure it's a big cap.
    Do you think 3 determined methheads can't disarm an armed female (or male for that matter)?

  15. #15
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    Yes, 3 determined methheads can disarm an armed female or male in the right circumstances. They can also use the weapon against her or him.

    But now we're getting into "what ifs", Luis. In every situation, the circumstances determine the outcome. Am I saying the outcome here would've been better if she had been armed? No, it could've just as easily been worse.

    As per usual, you gotta be aware of what's going on around you. This doesn't mean I blame the victim here! It just means that the best defense is keeping your eyes open.... again, whether armed or unarmed.

    No matter the circumstances..... armed, unarmed, whatever..... this incident sucks all the way around.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by motoenth
    No matter the circumstances..... armed, unarmed, whatever..... this incident sucks all the way around.
    No doubt!

  17. #17
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    We need the Three Amigos!!!

    They will save our goats and our women!!

    (This is a joke but in no way am I trying to make light of the situation, luckily she is ok and hopefully they will be caught. Careful out there folks, there are freaks amongst us.)
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by plume
    pepper spray is great for dogs. I wouldn't feel OK about this with three or more deranged rednecks who are likely high on meth.
    I completely agree, wish she could LEGALLY carry the other protection device I bought her.
    However I just prefer she doesn't go alone. Although, guess what she is doing right now. I bet she hasn't heard this news either though.

    Its sad that we have to worry about that around here!

  19. #19
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    There is no way I would ride in Pisgah alone. Crazy hillbillies and meth heads are out there but it is also a place you want someone around in case you need an air lift.
    I get nervous riding at Camp Croft / Southside solo because there are so few people there.
    Bad things can happen to men in the woods but more common for it to happen to women.

  20. #20
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    Yeah, I am pretty much done riding alone in Pisgah. I am not worried about crazies, but the injury/getting stranded thing. I broke my hand on Pilot Rock last year and I was alone and had parked in Bent Creek! I was on a BIG ride alone and it could have been a major personal disaster. Luckily I walked down Pilot and peddled dirt/pavement all the way back to my car. It sucked! It was mid day on a Wed & I don't really like to think about if I had been knocked out or seriously mangled. Granted, with mobile phone & GPS technology it's hard to be totally stranded, but still......

    Standard equipment in my pack now includes a space/emergency blanket. It weighs NOTHING and can save a life. It also has first aid instructions printed on the outside. Come to think of it, I keep meaning to add some "fire" and a first aid kit to my pack.

    Finally.....please don't let FEAR ruin Pisgah for us. Communicate, be visible, work WITH the authorities, and have fun!
    "Big Gulps huh?...Allllriggghhht....Welp, See ya later!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by kkjellquist
    Standard equipment in my pack now includes a space/emergency blanket. It weighs NOTHING and can save a life. It also has first aid instructions printed on the outside. Come to think of it, I keep meaning to add some "fire" and a first aid kit to my pack.
    Definitely - a space blanket, bic lighter/magnesium starter, spyderco, small LED headlamp, and small FA kit weigh next to nothing and would give you a lot of mileage in most bad situations.

  22. #22
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    What you do is pack for TMHTE at the beginning of the year, then just never clean your bag out and you will be fine.
    BS'ing less, riding more.

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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikeNC
    Definitely - a space blanket, bic lighter/magnesium starter, spyderco, small LED headlamp, and small FA kit weigh next to nothing and would give you a lot of mileage in most bad situations.
    The PMBAR "required gear" is with me all the time in the woods. Just get used to riding with a pound or two extra and you forget it's there - until you need it! I like pine fat-lighter sticks for the fire starter.

    many gears, some pies

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ridn29s
    The PMBAR "required gear" is with me all the time in the woods. Just get used to riding with a pound or two extra and you forget it's there - until you need it! I like pine fat-lighter sticks for the fire starter.


    so you stole Mike Brown Green watch?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikeNC
    That, or, change the laws so at the very least women can legally carry concealed weapons in national forests and state parks.
    I do believe you can carry in National Forests, just not National Parks. NF are subject to state laws and in NC it's ok to carry.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkjellquist
    Finally.....please don't let FEAR ruin Pisgah for us.

    Fjear will be the ruin of Pisgah.
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    I get paid 3 every time I post on MTBR.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob
    I do believe you can carry in National Forests, just not National Parks. NF are subject to state laws and in NC it's ok to carry.
    Correct, but only 22 cal. Might as well carry a stick.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by brado1
    so you stole Mike Brown Green watch?
    well it just layin' there on the picnic table with all that other stuff.....
    many gears, some pies

  29. #29
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    I know that steri-pen purifier thing you have saved a few guys butts a couple of weeks ago.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by brownieinSC
    There is no way I would ride in Pisgah alone. Crazy hillbillies and meth heads are out there but it is also a place you want someone around in case you need an air lift.
    I get nervous riding at Camp Croft / Southside solo because there are so few people there.
    Bad things can happen to men in the woods but more common for it to happen to women.
    I mostly ride alone and always have here and all over the U.S. Every ride is a hammerfest, so I usually don't prefer to ride with others mtn biking, except a few select friends who all have moved away from the area. I guess I've been lucky, but I've only felt unsafe twice.... once was when a Mormon kinda freaked me out in Northern California, and the other was just a month ago at Alexander Park when a guy on a bike rode past me and I asked him, "any riders behind you" and he said, "what the f- are you talking about? why the f' are you talking to me?" and then mumbled a lot of curse words. I definitely felt like there was a murderer around every corner! However, in 12 years riding in western North carolina I'd say it is very safe around here and I'm not gonna be scared to ride alone.

    I haven't heard anything about this on the news nor can I find anything else on the internet, is this confirmed true or a ghost tale? Anybody who's been in WNC a while can attest to this......you should've seen it when people were allowed to camp at Bent Creek! Yikes! Some people would be there for the whole summer. Remember the guy in the tan pickup with "jesus" stuff written all over the side? I swear to god even one time when Rudolph was on the loose, I saw a truck come out right at dark and drop off a guy with a rucksack who took off hiking through the woods, who I thought could very well be Rudolph. heck, I even called Crimestoppers about it.....no shiznit. Remember when they found the dead body at Bent Creek? How about the one on Azalea road in East Asheville? That's where the soccer complex is now. Or when Sandy Bottoms was a hangout where homosexuals would proposition people in the restrooms? or how about "Satans circle" on Town mountain, between TM and chunns cove? That place was crazy in the early '90's. Pentagrams, bonfires, death metal, deer skulls and god knows what else! we used to go up there during the day and pack bowls. I remember the day we drove up there and someone had bought the land and construction had began on a house. I couldn't believe it! Today someone is living at Satan's circle. Awesome.

    Just be careful out there and hopefully we'll all be alright.

  31. #31
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    "...you should've seen it when people were allowed to camp at Bent Creek! Yikes!"

    Oh yeah... my solo weekday rides were very cautious to the point of not going at all back then - and we didn't even have the meth issue.

    Not every "character" out there has dangerous intentions and could possibly help you in an emergency.

    Considering the increase in homelessness, we'll probably see a lot of new folks roughing it this summer. From my experience, most of the Rural Route Residents are nice people who feel the same way we do about protecting the Home Place.

    eatmorecarp: you're gonna get slammed for that moniker

    You might recall the fella who moved every two weeks, but would put a "joke" mail box on the road. I called him Tarp Man. He was really funny and rode an old Raleigh to town for work. There was also a guy with a camo-trailer (often seen at Mills) who also rode a bike and was really cool - once you got to know him and didn't laugh at his pet rabbit in the kid hauler.

    Report something that seems odd (a guy asking if you can smell bleach!?!) - no way would I have let that slide.

    Edit: tan pickup with "jesus" stuff written all over the side - actually the trailer - that was the guy with the rabbit. He used to "work" and guard the overnight shift workers at Hot Spot. Eventually got a new truck and - last I heard - is alive and well in Florida.
    Last edited by M-U-M; 04-23-2009 at 07:33 PM.
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by MtnBikeNC
    Correct, but only 22 cal. Might as well carry a stick.
    Come on now.....this always cracks me up. Shoot someone with a .22 and see if they get pissed or if they hit the dirt. You can keep the stick.....I'll take the .22

  33. #33
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    On the weird people in the woods note - riding up old toll today I see some movement in the brush about 30 feet below the road. I thought to myself - oh cool it's a bear..but as I got closer realized it was a mexican, wearing all dark green and down on all fours doing something on the ground (I guess picking galax). As I rode by just above him I yelled "what's up dood!" He looked up very surprised to see us riding by and didn't say a word - just staring back.

    The crazy part is - this guy was WAY the hell up there about 20 yards south of the big spring on the backwards "C" part of the trail not too far before you get to old man toyotas crib.

    We actually stopped and talked to old man for a bit - that guy is awesome and seemed to appreciate the conversation (as he was just sitting on one of the stumps in front of the trailer staring into the woods when we rolled up)..

  34. #34
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    the same 2 mexicans were there (almost the same place) last time I was up there. They hide when they here you coming and they both have 2 big duffels full of galax. I told them that they didn't need to hide, rangers don't ride mountain bikes and I don't give a sh!t.

  35. #35
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    I emailed the sheriffs office to see if they made an arrest since I read on the thread they had cars pulled over. The yellow truck was the husband. They said "we cannot comment on an ongoing investigation." Who knows, maybe the dude has some weird fantasy game he was playing. He sure seemed legit at the time when he described what happened.

  36. #36
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    Hate to read these stories but they're out there. Crime has been encroaching into the outdoors (parks, NF, Rec. zones) for years. I do a lot of hiking all over the country and it is getting worse and worse. You just about cannot hike in parks in the border states - you go to Sauguro NP in AZ and the rangers will tell you to drive through but do not get out of the car.

    One of the biggest problems in NC is the legislature. For years they have funded more D.A. positions and judgeships all the while they have been underfunding a woefully inadequate corrections system. More people are put on probation today for offenses that would have landed them in jail years ago. Probation officers are completely overwhelmed and in 2008 there were 14,000 persons on probation whom there whereabouts were unknown. Building prisons and funding them is not a sexy political strategy but the #1 job of the government is to protect the people - and in this state that has not happened for years - you could argue decades - and it is catching up to us. Instead of building prisons we've been closing them.

    Now, I dont know who these people are but my point is there are more violent criminals and derelicts on the streets (and woods) now than at any time. And the meth / oxycontin issue in western NC is bad - that epidemic brings all sorts of crime (robbery, B and E, rape, assault, larceny, murder, etc.). Won't help in the short run - but I'd urge everyone to demand a tougher corrections system from their representatives.

    Stepping off my soapbox.....

  37. #37
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    Well, since you dragged out the soapbox....

    I think the problem isn't the lack of prisons, its the emphasis on DA's and judges that comes at the expense of street (forest) level law enforcement and treatment programs for drug offenders. An old riding budy of mine worked as a prison guard and told me plenty of times how the big house is a great place for drunks and pot heads to learn how to commit real crimes. If we have more police on the streets and in our public lands their presence will do more to reduce crime then building more hotels. Its my tax money and yours, but I'd rather fund an ounce of prevention then a pound of cure.

    In my neck of the woods I've heard we have 2 full time rangers to patrol the 340,000 acres of the northern cherokee national forest. I'm sure pisgah and the surrounding public lands have a similarly dismal ratio. I think my tax dollars are better spent paying for more law enforcement presence then paying some private prison corporation to run a revolving door training ground for thugs.
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  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by thumpduster
    Well, since you dragged out the soapbox....

    I think the problem isn't the lack of prisons, its the emphasis on DA's and judges that comes at the expense of street (forest) level law enforcement and treatment programs for drug offenders. An old riding budy of mine worked as a prison guard and told me plenty of times how the big house is a great place for drunks and pot heads to learn how to commit real crimes. If we have more police on the streets and in our public lands their presence will do more to reduce crime then building more hotels. Its my tax money and yours, but I'd rather fund an ounce of prevention then a pound of cure.

    In my neck of the woods I've heard we have 2 full time rangers to patrol the 340,000 acres of the northern cherokee national forest. I'm sure pisgah and the surrounding public lands have a similarly dismal ratio. I think my tax dollars are better spent paying for more law enforcement presence then paying some private prison corporation to run a revolving door training ground for thugs.
    Your friend is right to a point - I've been in the corrections game (street side) state and federal for 20 years. Police departments are for the most part staffed accordingly. Municipalities and counties do a very good job of addressing need. The state, however, is another matter. Prisons have forever been a breeding ground for criminal education - many hone their skills in there and learn from their peers. But the fact remains that judges, cops, and DA's want to put people who deserve to be in there away - and they cannot do it. It is underfunded. You specifically mention the rural enforcement and it goes without saying that on multiple levels those entities are underfunded. What they do get is divided amongst a dizzying array of requirements and needs - medical, law enforcement, and emergency needs in the outback pale to those handled my municipal and county services. The dollar is stretched thin in parks, national forrests, etc. - no doubt. They deserve more. We deserve more. Law enforcement cannot be everywhere all of the time - if a target isn't ripe a perpetrator moves on to a more inviting and less risky target - they have to be right once - cops have to be right all of the time. Ask anybody in law enforcement - more prisons are drastically needed. Oh, big picture, the money spent in the justice system and the insurance system on recidivists far outweigh the costs of housing that individual (generally $120 per day per inmate). There is a small population that repeatedly commit the worst offenses. NC decided to adjust sentencing guidelines years ago making it harder to put people in prison, they bolstered the judicial system, they talked about the savings to the coffer by putting people on probation (around $20 per day depending on intensive treatment and verficiation technology) but then didn't fund the probation departments for the massive influx of probationers who were once destined for time for what they did. Then the state closed several prisons. I"m all about saving money, but it has become a joke. Again, the gov. #1 job is to maintain order amongst the people and to protect its citizenry. They're not doing it.

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    That is awful I hope the couple is alright now and that they catch the sobs.

  40. #40
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    I'm all for more cops on the street, but do you really think drug treatment programs work? I have a family member who married a guy w/ a problem and a LOT of money has been thrown at his treatment, and it's all just gone in a hole. I'm told his case is typical. We have plenty of holes for our tax dollars to pour into already.

    Van-Go, nice posts. Do you have any advice, particularly for females, riding in the forest? I never have worried much about that sort of thing, thinking that criminals would search out weaker, slower victims than someone riding a bike. My husband lectured me the other day about stopping to give directions to some dude in a car on one of the gravel roads. it's a pity.

  41. #41
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    Lack of personal pride and loss of hope causes the majority of crime. Do recessions create more evil people or do they create more desperate people who lack hope and then resort to crime?

    Without GOOD jobs and education, this situation will never improve. People here, who used to have options in manufacturing or farming, now find that their jobs are either gone or worth too little for the physical abuse required.

    There is a political philosophy that encourages an ever-greater prison population. More felons means less voters and fewer high-paying jobs, which means a cheaper labor force. Prison workers are one source of cheap labor, and after their time is served, their prospects are near zero. More prisoners means greater income for the Prison industry, coming and going.

    Listen, some people are irreversibly mentally ill and need to be separated from society. Most just need a better alternative to crime.

  42. #42
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    People are lazy. Lots of people choose the path of least resistance. Your explanations assume that these scumbags have the motivation but haven't been given the opportunity?

    Puh-leez....

    For rapists and attempted rapists, child molesters and the like......
    You wanna cut down on crime?
    Hang 'em high!




    Clears up the gene pool too!
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  43. #43
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    So you're saying that people are getting lazier thanks to our declining condition? (where is that 'rolleyes' key? )

    People who have hope and pride in themselves tend to conform to societal norms. They are less likely to commit any crime. Mental illness is a different issue, as I previously noted.

    But then again, if everyone were in prison, then I guess crime would drop...

  44. #44
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    No, I'm saying that we have a declining condition due to people's laziness. This, combined with the growing tendency to overlook, accept, rationalize, etc. etc. people's behavior.

    We're talking rape here - Forcibly dominating another human being. Did this perp consider the victims rights? Of course not! Yet when it comes to the penal system, it's the rights of the perp that seem to get a ton of attention.
    "How can we fix him/her?"
    "What can we do to improve our societal conditions?"
    "Better education leads to better society"

    I'm sorry but I don't think anything will work as well for this particular crime as a $2 piece of rope.

    And, for the record, DFL - I consider you a rational human bean. You've got good points. However, please remember that you can't cast your life experiences on someone else and expect that they will make the same choices in life as yourself. These guys were scum, plain and simple. Get rid of 'em. Good riddance. Let's get on with our day and let the victim get on with hers.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  45. #45
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    [QUOTE=D.F.L.]

    People who have hope and pride in themselves tend to conform to societal norms. They are less likely to commit any crime. QUOTE]

    Not always true, ever hear of the Boston Tea Party? The Civil War? Southern Pride!!!!

    It was because of hope and pride that we came from England, ignored the law, and raped and pillaged to take this land we call home...

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by litespeedchick
    I'm all for more cops on the street, but do you really think drug treatment programs work? I have a family member who married a guy w/ a problem and a LOT of money has been thrown at his treatment, and it's all just gone in a hole. I'm told his case is typical. We have plenty of holes for our tax dollars to pour into already.

    Van-Go, nice posts. Do you have any advice, particularly for females, riding in the forest? I never have worried much about that sort of thing, thinking that criminals would search out weaker, slower victims than someone riding a bike. My husband lectured me the other day about stopping to give directions to some dude in a car on one of the gravel roads. it's a pity.
    litespeed:

    As with most things - and especially in corrections - there are no absolutes. Drug treatment is the best thing for some and works great for diverting them from undeserved detention. For the most part, however, unless the client themselves is dedicated to rehabilitation they will fail. Nobody can MAKE a person get clean. Prison is the closest thing to it. I'd say that about 75% of persons on probation who are in drug treatment re-offend with a positive test. About 1-2% of person in prison come out and test positive for a prohibitive substance (yes, you can get drugs in jail and prisons but it is hard - unless you have a connection you pay a steep price - the nature of which can vary - for your indulgence). Jails/prisons oftentimes test the inmates and many (most) have access to treatment while in custody - and they're captive audience (joke). I've had so many people tell me that their experience with treatment has been poor - like an earlier poster mentioned about prisons being a place to learn from one another - same for many treatment centers. Many of these people expand their clientele by contact with persons of the same ilk, many score new leads on drugs, they share information about how to defeat drug tests, etc. I don't want to be a downer on rehab. - but non-custodial rehab is not as affective as custodial rehab in my experience.

    You asked about safety. I'm no expert - perhaps close - but I can tell you what I know works and is a deterrent. I'll skip the argument about arming oneself - I'd fain say there are probably a plethora of threads on this or any hiking website about arming oneself in the outdoors. Thing is - it may be illegal for you to have it. If you do have it you had better be prepared to use it. And if you have it and can't retain it - it can be used against you.

    My $.02 worth - about as good as any others: (these in no particular order) - oh, not to scare anyone or you - just food for thought...

    1) Never ride alone if you can help it. Ride with a partner or a riding group. This is safe not only to avoid being a victim but in case you're injured. But if you do ride alone....
    2) Tell someone where you're going and when you should be expected to return. Do not deviate from your route unless you call and change. Leave with a reliable person that information as well as contact information for rangers/sheriff's dept. in the area riding. Call that person as soon as you come out - sets a precendent on your riding times (stamina).
    3) get a dog who can/will protect you if you ride alone.
    4) bring your cell and leave it on - your position can be triangulated by authorities in an emergency (if signal works). You can also quickly call 911 if in danger or injured.
    5) take a defensive tactics class - learn basic strike and escape moves, pressure points, etc.
    6) most crimes in the outdoors for hikers occur within 3 miles of the trailhead (or civilization or busy road) - that is the most dangerous place along with the parking lot. Be mindful of that but do not let your guard down anywhere.
    7) trust your gut - if your "Spidy Sense" is tingling there is probably a reason. if someone looks out of place or acts out of place they probably are and have an other-than-normal reason for being where they are. Most people you see in the outdoors are dressed alike - certain clothes, water, hiking staff, with family - someone out of place is probably out of place for a reason.
    8) speak to a stranger from afar. It's a big forrest out there - person doesn't need to be in your shorts to chat with you - just speak up. Tell them to keep their distance - most will respect that if for anything b/c you may seem weird for asking that. If they don't - and keep approaching - be wary.
    9) Avoid pissing people off for no reason.
    10) if you see someone at the trailhead who unnerves you leave and come back later or go another route (with the change to your reliable person at home).
    11) I'm riding in Pisgah in a couple of months - were it not for this thread I would not have heard of this incident - follow these boards for information or call ranger office before a trip to a place our of your backyard to see if there are any dangers, high water levels, bear activity, etc. - they usually know.
    12) if threatened get ready to defend yourself - lots of sticks and rocks and some can use their bike as a deterrent. Stay on the trail though - good chance someone can come along and help you eventually.
    13) if attacked all the rules go out the window - scream, punch, kick, act crazy. Don't wind yourself though - you're at a disadvantage already b/c you're tired - address the threat. Avoid and flee if you can. You've got nails and teeth - use 'em. Treat his nads as your own personal punching bag. It's your life - there are no Marcus of Queensbury rules here. Disfigure him for life. If the going gets bad and it's a sexual assault tell him your pregnant, have an STD, are HIV+ and see how willing he is. Urinate and deficate on yourself if you can and put your fingers down your throat and throw up on yourself - we'll see how willing he is to cozy up to that.
    14) don't go with him - I've always told my wife - make them kill you right there - you don't want them to take you away. Buy as much time as you can though - but don't go down without a fight.
    15) give this topic some thought and think about what you would do if attacked. When you go into a fight or flight mode your brain goes into self-preservation. It sends adrenaline to your extremeties, increases your perceptions, but narrows your focus. You won't think clearly and will rely upon idiosycracies - what you've trained for or what you've thought about in the past. Normally your body will react to what is knows and has experience with - including scenarios you've introduced to your own mind.

    Again, don't want to scare anyone. It's a lot to think about. You and I and everyone else on these boards just want to go for a ride. The emergency list above is excellent but how many of us think about bringing it? I'm new to this sport and have never brought that stuff until I read about it here and thought - what in the world am I doing - I should bring that - I would if I were hiking. So I have the past couple of long trips I have done. Be prepared, be diligent....but relax....better chance of getting struck by lighting twice than being the victim of a crime in the outdoors (statistically speaking).

  47. #47
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    Ok - I'm going to share an unusual weapon that has worked for me on occasions when I felt the need for Legal Personal Self Defense and hope that no methhead-galax filching-ramp digging-predatory mountain bike riders (moto) read this board.

    A big fat rubber band.

    Look 'em dead in one eye, assume the "sling shot" position and state with authority:

    DON'T MAKE ME USE THIS!


    If they don't immediately run away, go for that eye and take off in an odd direction.

    Van-Go: Thanks for listing the standard ops.

    Now you're cast of steel and cast aside. Broken dreams maybe, but you haven't died

  48. #48
    zod
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van-Go
    9) Avoid pissing people off for no reason.
    10) if you see someone at the trailhead who unnerves you leave and come back later or go another route.
    Both of these made me think of motoenth..........

  49. #49
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    'The Gift of Fear' is a good read on this subject. As far as your 'spidey sense' goes that is your subconscious recognizing that something is not the way it should be. You don't realize it but your brain has picked up on it.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by zod
    Both of these made me think of motoenth..........
    Aww, zoddler...... you know how to make me blush.
    I owe you a great big hug the next time I see you.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by zod
    Both of these made me think of motoenth..........

    My point is there are people out there who need little encouragement to do something to you. Don't put a target on yourself.

    The other one is particularly pointed at the female who asked me about staying safe on the trail. Should you be able to just park and go ride - the guy lurking behind the tree be damned? Yes. I was mad as hell in Saguaro NP when I wanted to get in some dayhiking and the ranger implored me to remain in my vehicle and take in the park by vehicle. That just pissed me off. I did get out and take some photos of those cacti, but I heeded his warning (a year later a ranger was killed in Organ Pipe nearby by drug smugglers). I just think if you're this gal, riding alone, you do not take that chance. Give it 15 minutes and come back. This reminds me of that Bud Light commercial where the guy is picking up hitchhikers who have hockey masks and chain saws but he feels the guy is OK b/c he's holding a six of beer. Sometimes you heed the warning signs - even if you want to have that beer (in this case start your ride) -especially if you're a female and alone.

  52. #52
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    I appreciate the responses. Trust me, I've met plenty of people who will never change and will never be better. I've wished death to many for much less than attempted rape.

    Then I start thinking: are things really getting worse, or am I just getting old and crusty, reminiscing the days when I WASN'T AWARE of all the bad things in the world? ...

    (Just yesterday, I directed a lone woman from out of town to Jackson Falls, at the base of Daniel, where the last (?) rape occurred. Sorta brought things back. On the plus side, it was a good ride and Farlow rides really well backward.)

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by D.F.L.
    Farlow rides really well backward

    I officially take back my "level-headed" comment.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  54. #54
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    I am completely on board with this. If you are doing drugs then hopefully you are just destroying your own life and I feel for your family.
    Once you start raping, especially when it comes to children, the rest of the world is better off with you dead. I know several women that have had this happen and the guys are just out there living their normal lives while it is something that will always have to live with.
    I am pretty much a liberal in my views, except the death penalty!

    Quote Originally Posted by motoenth
    People are lazy. Lots of people choose the path of least resistance. Your explanations assume that these scumbags have the motivation but haven't been given the opportunity?

    Puh-leez....

    For rapists and attempted rapists, child molesters and the like......
    You wanna cut down on crime?
    Hang 'em high!




    Clears up the gene pool too!

  55. #55
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    What happens when the wrong guy is put to death? What would stop you from wrongly accusing me of raping you? It would be your word VS mine. With a good laywer on your side, I could end up dead. The very nature of capitol punishment makes it extremely dangerous.

  56. #56
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    Unless you have DNA evidence I don't think anyone could be put to death. I am pretty sure most rapist aren't stopping to put 'protection' on.
    Some women have lied about being raped, this is true. You would have to have solid evidence.

  57. #57
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    backward meaning you went down it?
    doing things the hard way since, well, forever...

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maida7
    What happens when the wrong guy is put to death? .

    God will forgive the hangman.
    Move along.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by motoenth
    God will forgive the hangman.
    Move along.

    classic

  60. #60
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    Does anybody know what, if anything, happened in the Daniel Ridge assault case?

    I didn't find anything on the Internets.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cruso414
    the same 2 mexicans were there (almost the same place) last time I was up there. They hide when they here you coming and they both have 2 big duffels full of galax. I told them that they didn't need to hide, rangers don't ride mountain bikes and I don't give a sh!t.

    Why would they be getting galax?

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrkmind
    Why would they be getting galax?
    It gives you a killer buzz when you get down on your knees and pick it. . . so i've heard.
    BS'ing less, riding more.

    Supporting PAS
    Upstate SORBA
    SORBA

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by singletrkmind
    Why would they be getting galax?
    I wondered the same thing myself so I did some googling......

    Turns out, it's used in floral arrangements. So, they pick it to sell.

    (From "Latinos in the new South By Heather A. Smith")
    Go to books.google.com for more information.
    Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  64. #64
    zod
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    Wouldn't growing Galax be easier and more cost efficient than prospecting for it?

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    So was there really a rape attempt or what? I don't think I believe it. I'm thinking it was all over some crack or crank, and it was all BS.

    About growing galax...... it'd be pretty hard b/c it prefers to grow in a moist, shaded environment. this is a very similar situation to the hippies picking morel mushrooms in Montana or the rednecks around here searching for ginseng. You don't think they do.....they do. I work with a guy who's whole family is from Black mountain and they go out in the Ridgecrest/montreat area and have some ginseng spots.....won't tell me where though.....

  66. #66
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    Possibility of being able to carry in national parks:

    http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/20...al_parks_guns/

  67. #67
    rob
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    That's great.

    Since Pisgah is a National Forest, you can already carry there.

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob
    That's great.

    Since Pisgah is a National Forest, you can already carry there.
    As I mentioned earlier, you can only carry a .22 in NF in NC.

    The Fed law re carry in NPs won't apply to NC as you can't carry in State parks - you would be able to carry in NPs in VA, WVA, PA and so forth as you can already carry in State Parks in those States.

    The State law as it applies to carry in State Parks will determine whether the Fed law will apply to NPs in that State - if that makes sense..NC is really behind the times on this one (and a number of other carry laws).

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