700 DS headset size/specs?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
    Bushwacker
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    700 DS headset size/specs?

    I bought a replacement headset, 1 1/8", sealed angular bearings, etc...all psyched up and then I popped the cup/race out and discovered it didn't fit. Can anyone advise the type, measurements, etc for the correct size and/or links for the correct headset? Thanks.
    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  2. #2
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    What do you mean did not fit?

    It does not just slide in. You need to press it in. I just use a large washer covered with tape, hammer and a lot of grease - but I would not advice this method unless you are sure you know what you do..

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    What do you mean did not fit?

    It does not just slide in. You need to press it in. I just use a large washer covered with tape, hammer and a lot of grease - but I would not advice this method unless you are sure you know what you do..
    This is what I picked up. I understand how the headset on the bike is removed/installed. I removed one of the cups on the head tube no problem. The Mongo is 1 1/8" size but doesn't seem compatable at all. Where am I missing the boat here?

    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starkonian
    The Mongo is 1 1/8" size but doesn't seem compatable at all. Where am I missing the boat here?
    I have a hard time imagining incompatibility. Could you photograph the headset cup right next to the head tube?

  5. #5
    Bushwacker
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    I don't have the fork off but here's some pics of the head set broken down. The bearing cartridge on the right goes on top of the head tube. Right now there's just a cup pressed into the top of the head tube and a bearing cage rides in it. The bearing cartridges on the Mongo are completely different than what's mounted now and are much smaller than the head tube, both top and bottom.

    IMG_1576_small.jpg

    IMG_1577_small.jpg
    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  6. #6
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    This appears to be the same type that came with the bike, shallow pressed cup. There's no way the Mongo I bought will fit this.

    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starkonian
    This appears to be the same type that came with the bike, shallow pressed cup. There's no way the Mongo I bought will fit this.
    Yep, it look like an internal headset.
    Bikesdirect site identifies it as such: "Cane Creek Internal Sealed bearing VP A42E 1.125 inch"

    Here is a good write up on headset types: http://chrisking.com/files/pdfs/Int2...sExplained.pdf


    If your current one works, I would just keep it.

  8. #8
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    Well, mine's an open bearing cage, not sealed as advertised. That's BS. The bottom cage rusted up some. I cleaned it up and switched it to the top temporarily. I suppose I can order another bearing cage. It works OK but obviously will require more regular maintenance in the future and I was hoping to just upgrade to a sealed system and be done with it. I might have to fire off an email to BD and see if they'll step up to the plate in some fashion since this appears to be false advertising.
    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starkonian
    Well, mine's an open bearing cage, not sealed as advertised. That's BS. The bottom cage rusted up some. I cleaned it up and switched it to the top temporarily. I suppose I can order another bearing cage. It works OK but obviously will require more regular maintenance in the future and I was hoping to just upgrade to a sealed system and be done with it. I might have to fire off an email to BD and see if they'll step up to the plate in some fashion since this appears to be false advertising.
    What is the exact model that you got? Any markings on it?

    Sometimes they refer to "sealed" as in an external seal, not an integrated seal on the bearing cage.

    They are sloppy on that website. I have nearly ordered 27.2 Masterpiece for my Fly Ti. It came with 31.6.

  10. #10
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    I'll try to pull it this weekend and check.

    Since I've been researching this the last few days, all the sites refer to sealed bearings as sealed units. If BD is refering to a tube gasket seal of some sort it seems that is not consistant with the industry definition of sealed bearing. I can live with a size typo error but an out right mislable of a part, particulalry if a lesser quality part is actually used, is bogus. I'm definately going to email them and see what they have to say about this.
    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  11. #11
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    My Crank Brother opium is referred as sealed on there website - and it has some loose balls and some rubber gasket and an o-ring thre, and that's about it.

    Could you post a picture of the lower unit? I am curious.

  12. #12
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    The Crank Brothers Opium SL Direct Set 1 1/8 listed on the BIke Stop page describes the bearing set as "Upper and lower bearings are sealed 34-ball cartridges." This is your unit and it has loose balls? If so this may be a poor description issue throughout the industry. I've been thinking sealed bearings are like those on the Mongo III above, damn, I was psyched about being able to mount that Mongo.
    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  13. #13
    Motobey
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    bearings

    You may want to measure it with a set of calipers, to see how much is off. I can not tell from the upper part, but you may also want to measure the depth on the up side.
    Sealed bearing should have some form of gasket by nature. the seal may be in the race or may come together by pressing some parts together.
    I would get a caliper and measure it for radius and depth on the head tube.
    Hope that helps. I would be interested on the follow up.
    "Si todos saben lo que ay que hacer por que tenemos problemas" Choose xpst.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmy
    My Crank Brother opium is referred as sealed on there website - and it has some loose balls and some rubber gasket and an o-ring thre, and that's about it.

    Could you post a picture of the lower unit? I am curious.
    +1 on the opium. I just installed it on my fantom to replace the cheap OEM ritchey unit. It has a 5 year warranty.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by tj90
    +1 on the opium. I just installed it on my fantom to replace the cheap OEM ritchey unit. It has a 5 year warranty.
    Opium probably would not work on this bike - it is not an integrated unit - even as it looks tiny. I am not sure how deep is the machined out portion of the head tube. Some chasing and facing may help to fit a regular one - but I have no idea if that is a good idea.

  16. #16
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    Bikes Direct responded to my email saying this,

    "This is a common confusion
    in the bike industry SEALED BEARING means there are dust / water seals
    on the outside but some people think it means PRECISION BEARING - which
    is like in a skate board wheel {also sometimes called a CARTRIDGE
    BEARING. Open ball bearing are actually 'sealed bearing' [ seal is the ring that
    isloates the bearings from the outside ]

    This is confusing terminolgy - I wish the industry had a better set of
    terms."

    They didn't know the specs on the headset and just told me to contact Cane Creek

    Anyways, I think this would be a cartridge headset that would fit.

    FSA No. 23 integrated headset, 1-1/8" - black
    Quick Overview
    FSA No. 23 IS Headset
    - Serviceable angular contact cartridge bearings press directly into frame
    - 9mm aluminum bearing cap. 30.0mm crown race ID
    - IS-CC: Integrated System threadless headset for Cane Creek compatible frames with 41.0mm headtube ID



    When I'm not windsurfing, I'm mountain biking

  17. #17
    Motobey
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    head problem

    get the measurement of the bike frame off-set and use that measurement. you can use it for the new bearings (headset). If you can get cup that fit and your shock is not cut to short, that should fix the issue.
    "Si todos saben lo que ay que hacer por que tenemos problemas" Choose xpst.

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