Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Caution;  Merge;  Workers Ahead! Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN

    For those of you accustomed to the usual moderate, positive postings in this space, I apologize in advance. This is not one of those posts.
    The Landlocked Forest in Burlington is experiencing an ongoing outbreak of trail vandalism and rogue trail creation. Some of it may be from trail users outside the MTB community but some of it is definitely from within our community. It needs to stop.


    The latest, referenced in the attached pictures, is a trail that was cut in the last week at the east end of Bannon Hill, which is the end where the bad climb up from the bottom of Route 3 where it joins 128 South is. Someone cut a straight traverse across the hill, destroying a section of stone wall, in an attempt to bypass a problem section that is on the list for fixing. This trail that was cut isn't even singletrack - it's 6 feet wide in spots. WTF? Whoever you are - you need to stop this. Your attempt at creating a fix doesn't work on so many levels: 1. you had no permission to do this from the town; 2. what you did was badly done and not sustainable; 3. you created bigger problems for the MTB community when we go to ask for permission - you've reinforced the perception that we're a bunch of inconsiderate trail users who don't care about trails and doing things right. You may have thought your rock cribbing was good too (badly done BTW).


    I undid your work. I'll keep undoing it, too. If you have a problem with that, feel free to call me and we'll talk about your bad ideas: 781-354-7845. You have no idea how much effort it takes to get things done in the MTB advocacy world: if you did, maybe you wouldn't do this stupid stuff. Maybe you don't care, which is worse. (FYI, we've been working on a fix for that problem climb with the town that will open up a new climbing trail, hopefully your bit of stupidity wont impact our efforts.) And, we all need to remember that as far as the Town of Burlington is concerned, the LLF is still potentially something they could develop: it is NOT protected open space. So keep on doing things that show we don't care about it.


    Another example in the pictures is someone cutting trees part way and bending them in to the trail corridor. This seems likely to be someone who doesn't like MTB. The trees are designed to be at head level. This is a serious safety issue. I removed a few of these today. If anyone sees someone doing this, tell them to knock it off. Take their pic and send it to me.


    There's also someone building large jumps over in Beaver Brook North on the Mackerel Hill climbing trail. Don't worry, we'll be removing those too. If you have a problem with that, as I noted above, call me and we'll talk about why those are a bad idea.
    Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3017.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3016.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3015.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3014.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3013.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3011.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3012.jpgOngoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-img_3010.jpg

    We (the GBNEMBA Trail Crew) have a limited amount of bandwidth - we're all volunteers. We get no paychecks for this. We all have day jobs and families. Time we have to spend fixing stupid crap like this takes valuable time away that we could be spending building and enhancing great singletrack. And it detracts from the MTB community's professional trail building cred with local and state land managers.

    I'm betting someone here knows who's been doing these things - or knows someone who does. Pass the word. We all need to help getting this to stop.

  2. #2
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    It seems odd that someone would be able to build a new climbing trail on Bannon Hill without someone noticing it. On any given day there are at least a dozen cars in the parking lot.

  3. #3
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    holy crap

    that climb up the powerlines was just a perfect washed out grunt, another
    can't ride it? then walk it feature. and it was always ridable you just have
    to commit for what, a handful of seconds ?

    I haven't been in there in 4 weeks (been sick) and this is what goes on ?


    I cannot believe this BS

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    Again...game cameras, game cameras, game cameras.

    Seriously.

    Did I mention game cameras?
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    Maybe post some signs by the rogue lines as well as on the parking lot kiosk ?

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    These trees cut off and bent over at head level are just ridiculous.. even if they hate MTB they're going to go and kill trees over it? Even if it's a crazy hiker what kind of hiker wants to kill trees along the trail?

    I was in there one day last week (wednesday?) on my cross bike and walked down the washed out section, I didn't see this new cut then. I usually can ride down that on my MTB.. can't say I've ever successfully climbed up it though. It keeps getting new sally lines cut though, I have noticed that.

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    On the topic of jumps. How can we get some jumps added to some of the surrounding trail systems?

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    While I agree and side with your message to these folks you gotta ask yourself why these trail users (abusers in this case) are motivated enough to go building on their own in the first place? It could obviously be for a host of different reasons, none of which I think will really matter to the collective GB Nemba.

    On the rogue stuff...I've seen it in LLF and some of the terrible, TERRIBLE building in Belmont. It appeared like was their first go round at using a shovel in the woods. It could be kids with huck bikes who give zero about anyone else, or a couple guys in the 20-30s wanting to make something more interesting for their local ride. Who knows. Either way they were motivated enough to go build what wasn't there before because they felt it needed more.

    I don't think that the local Boston area xc trails necessarily need to have large features but I do think it would help if there was a little more variety, shape and depth to help interest this obviously growing group of riders. RM is a good example for our area, there is enough depth there to keep rogue stuff from popping up. That formula is good and could be applied elsewhere without being repetitive. LLF is mostly all one flavor as is Belmont.

  9. #9
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    PR used to have all sorts of fun features, did they all get sanitized away?
    Sad.
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  10. #10
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    Fitz-roy, one flavor? Not quite sure what you mean? They are cross county trails. Up, down, boardwalks, grunt climbs, flowy curvy stuff. Plenty of rocks to play on with some trials moves as needed. Expand your thoughts please.

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    What is/where are PR and RM?

  12. #12
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    The Land Locked Forest( once known as the private reserve or PR) is located in Burlington on the Lexington Line. One side is the last mile of RT 3 south before it hits 128. Russell Mill is located in Chelmsford. Great compact riding area that connects to a few other properties. The NEMBA web site, under places to ride will increase your google foo.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by slapheadmofo View Post
    PR used to have all sorts of fun features, did they all get sanitized away?
    Sad.
    Yes, all sanitized. Still a decent place to ride though.

  14. #14
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    Bummer.

    Victim of it's own popularity I guess.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    On the topic of jumps. How can we get some jumps added to some of the surrounding trail systems?
    Billerica has jumps. Nothing too polished or engineered - very natural. But fun and numerous.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by slapheadmofo View Post
    PR used to have all sorts of fun features, did they all get sanitized away?
    Sad.
    they kinda sorta did

    1) features got built on a dime

    2) was cool, wicked cool in fact, singletracks cover material

    3) others started making youuuuge stuff on bannon hill backside

    4) the bannon hill monsters got torn down by locals as danger to manifold

    5) the original stuff was kept alive only a few seasons, then it started to rot apart and eventually just ripped out as soggy wood is no one friend...just lack of maintenance took it out not really sanitization

    6) true santization are all the rocks and trees being cut off trails that have been there for ten years. some rock dies from pedal strikes but that is not what is going on today, rocks are being forked out intentionally

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    Yeah, I know wooden stuff doesn't last, but seemed like there used to be enough rock n twists n turns that the place was at least interesting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dangur View Post
    Billerica has jumps. Nothing too polished or engineered - very natural. But fun and numerous.
    It does! I think we definitely need more at some other locations.

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    Plenty of 2-3 ft places to get air @ LLF. Just have to look for them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Plenty of 2-3 ft places to get air @ LLF. Just have to look for them.
    I feel like maybe we have different ideas as to what constitutes a jump. That being said what is the best way to go about getting some jumps added to places like LLF and Beaver Brook?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fitz-roy View Post
    While I agree and side with your message to these folks you gotta ask yourself why these trail users (abusers in this case) are motivated enough to go building on their own in the first place? It could obviously be for a host of different reasons, none of which I think will really matter to the collective GB Nemba.
    Well, at LLF it's been caused by people with no skills who don't like to walk. They haven't built anything, they've sanitized it to the point of being a MUP trail.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O View Post
    Yes, all sanitized. Still a decent place to ride though.
    Quote Originally Posted by 127.0.0.1 View Post
    6) true santization are all the rocks and trees being cut off trails that have been there for ten years. some rock dies from pedal strikes but that is not what is going on today, rocks are being forked out intentionally

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    I feel like maybe we have different ideas as to what constitutes a jump. That being said what is the best way to go about getting some jumps added to places like LLF and Beaver Brook?
    Show up at trail work days and chapter meetings? For GB Nemba? Also depends on the user groups and land mangers. And if it would be a good trail use at these places.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Show up at trail work days and chapter meetings? For GB Nemba? Also depends on the user groups and land mangers. And if it would be a good trail use at these places.
    Yup. Been to plenty of trail days and more meetings than most.

    Sounds like maybe I should start becoming more involved again. Shake things up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Fitz-roy, one flavor? Not quite sure what you mean? They are cross county trails. Up, down, boardwalks, grunt climbs, flowy curvy stuff. Plenty of rocks to play on with some trials moves as needed. Expand your thoughts please.
    I'm surprised you went straight for that one comment instead of anything else in my post.

    My thoughts are this; while there are trail maintenance days to help build, maintain and fix sections of existing trail all the work seems to net the same result. There is no updating or moving on with the times. Yes the work does improve what's there but when you look around Nemba or even broader with New England as a whole I can't help but feel the Boston area is a bit in the dark with trail building. IMHO, this is particularly true with LLF and BBN. The terrain is good, the dirt is good but the potential is much better than what is currently there.

    Getting back to the main thought behind my original post...I think GB has people out there that in some capacity have the same thoughts as what I stated above. They see all the mtb media (vids, contests, races, shredits) and want experiences just like it. Unfortunately nothing like that exists within a stones throw so they go out there and make it happen themselves. This is a difficult thing for GB Nemba to inhibit.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitz-roy View Post
    There is no updating or moving on with the times. Yes the work does improve what's there but when you look around Nemba or even broader with New England as a whole I can't help but feel the Boston area is a bit in the dark with trail building.
    Can you share some specific examples of what you're talking about as far as 'in the dark' trails and what it is you think should be being built instead?
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitz-roy View Post
    I'm surprised you went straight for that one comment instead of anything else in my post.

    My thoughts are this; while there are trail maintenance days to help build, maintain and fix sections of existing trail all the work seems to net the same result. There is no updating or moving on with the times. Yes the work does improve what's there but when you look around Nemba or even broader with New England as a whole I can't help but feel the Boston area is a bit in the dark with trail building. IMHO, this is particularly true with LLF and BBN. The terrain is good, the dirt is good but the potential is much better than what is currently there.

    Getting back to the main thought behind my original post...I think GB has people out there that in some capacity have the same thoughts as what I stated above. They see all the mtb media (vids, contests, races, shredits) and want experiences just like it. Unfortunately nothing like that exists within a stones throw so they go out there and make it happen themselves. This is a difficult thing for GB Nemba to inhibit.
    I'll speak to LLF for now. It is Burlington open space, not even protected from development. Open to all users. Not just a shred crowd. Not going to build doubles in the middle of a trail. We build as to what the land managers need, and we have the capacity to do. Like get access across a swamp with boardwalks. The area is not a mt bike stunt park, but open space for all to enjoy. Done any trail work anywhere recently? The DCR is the same way. Not going to see 3 ft berms or big table tops. Ever been to the NEMBA property, Vietnam? Plenty of air time to be had. And to improve the trails? Show up and dig dirt. Boots on the ground get to vote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by slapheadmofo View Post
    Can you share some specific examples of what you're talking about as far as 'in the dark' trails and what it is you think should be being built instead?
    I'll share some specific examples. Anything managed and maintained by the Fellowship of the Wheel, Stowe MTB and Kingdom Trails.

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    Tom, somewhat surprised by your comments. Kingdom trails are mostly on private property. Beverly farms, Lynn woods, Willowdale? We here in MA are limited by the public parks and forests we work in. And the trail guidelines and land managers policies. Most trails are multi use, horses too sometimes. How are you comparing a private trail system in the boonies of VT to a public park/ forest/state land in crowded MA ? Try western MA out by thunder mt. Tons of trails and designated flow trails and downhill stuff.
    Last edited by leeboh; 10-26-2016 at 03:34 PM.

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    Fitz Roy , where do you ride mostly? Coming to the wicked ride on Sunday? Dark ages, please elaborate. Lots of constraints by land use policies, terrain, and bedrock. Plus rocks. So many places to shred, jump and get air. And before you say it, flow is where you find it. I'll be slinging chili Sunday, come by and chat me up. And check out lock n load @ HP+ Black Ops. The hardest part is fighting illegal trail building that takes us any from new trail building. Volunteers only have so many weekends and bandwidth. Plenty of races around. Cross, some mt bike. Rt 66, EFTA. Keep up with the times? So, red bull rampage in the Fells? Where we don't even have full mt bike access. The point is most land mangers really don't have that much time to deal with trails. So in comes NEMBA. And fixes washouts, old fall line trails and puts us in the good for stuff more bike friendly. Sometimes we propose stuff, sometimes the land manager needs a reroute for wetlands or vernal pool issues, etc. Go ride Beverly Farms, all maybe 10 miles. World class stuff. Also check out our work on the front side of Boston Hill. Swoops with some boardwalks to get over drainage. And what places do you do the most trail work, rake, clean up sticks, trim branches, cut out logs and branches, clean and repair drainage, fix boardwalks and such?
    Last edited by leeboh; 10-26-2016 at 06:00 PM.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    I'll share some specific examples. Anything managed and maintained by the Fellowship of the Wheel, Stowe MTB and Kingdom Trails.
    I wouldn't consider any of those examples to be in the Boston area.
    Are you specifically looking for more technical riding that what those places offer?
    There's no shortage of it around (as I'm sure you're aware of).
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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Fitz Roy , where do you ride mostly? Coming to the wicked ride on Sunday? Dark ages, please elaborate. Lots of constraints by land use policies, terrain, and bedrock. Plus rocks. So many places to shred, jump and get air. And before you say it, flow is where you find it. I'll be slinging chili Sunday, come by and chat me up. And check out lock n load @ HP+ Black Ops. The hardest part is fighting illegal trail building that takes us any from new trail building. Volunteers only have so many weekends and bandwidth. Plenty of races around. Cross, some mt bike. Rt 66, EFTA. Keep up with the times? So, red bull rampage in the Fells? Where we don't even have full mt bike access. The point is most land mangers really don't have that much time to deal with trails. So in comes NEMBA. And fixes washouts, old fall line trails and puts us in the good for stuff more bike friendly. Sometimes we propose stuff, sometimes the land manager needs a reroute for wetlands or vernal pool issues, etc. Go ride Beverly Farms, all maybe 10 miles. World class stuff. Also check out our work on the front side of Boston Hill. Swoops with some boardwalks to get over drainage. And what places do you do the most trail work, rake, clean up sticks, trim branches, cut out logs and branches, clean and repair drainage, fix boardwalks and such?
    You ever ride Pine Hill Park?

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    Nope, what town?

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    GB area has some of the finest and most difficult riding. Period. There is a ton of stunts too although most are natural and LW even has some modest but fun jump lines. What the area does not have is sculpted flow trails with big berms. Highland for that or a little bit at RM. I personally have little use for the XC type trails like reservoir in the fells and I live there or these flow trails at KT. I also do wonder sometimes though why all trail maintence building efforts seem to go into these XC type trails in the posh towns especially LLF. I have been waiting to see one for LW and I'd certainly show up. Do I wish there was more riding like old B&T with skinnies, barn drop and all the crazy stuff? YES. Maybe once my kids are older and I have more time I'll try to get involved more. In the meantime I stay grateful to nemba for all their hard work and keep riding LW.

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    LLF hasn't seen anywhere near as much work as Billerica/Chelmsford/Lowell/Carlisle/Groton/HP, which all have quite a bit more tech than what it sounds like LLF has been left with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by shrink View Post
    GB area has some of the finest and most difficult riding. Period. There is a ton of stunts too although most are natural and LW even has some modest but fun jump lines. What the area does not have is sculpted flow trails with big berms. Highland for that or a little bit at RM. I personally have little use for the XC type trails like reservoir in the fells and I live there or these flow trails at KT. I also do wonder sometimes though why all trail maintence building efforts seem to go into these XC type trails in the posh towns especially LLF. I have been waiting to see one for LW and I'd certainly show up. Do I wish there was more riding like old B&T with skinnies, barn drop and all the crazy stuff? YES. Maybe once my kids are older and I have more time I'll try to get involved more. In the meantime I stay grateful to nemba for all their hard work and keep riding LW.
    Well, LLF is cross country trails. Multi use trails for all to enjoy. The thing is it is not even protected open space. Or conservation land. 12 acres are being developed up on grove st Lexington. Where all those big pine trees are. Do you think a flow trail is going to be good for hikers , bird watchers and dog walkers? Bruce and toms was on private land and most was illegal stuff for the rest. Been to Beverly commons or the Nemba parcel in Milford? Nice stuff. Must deal with the land managers trail ideas, policies and use for all. Not going to see flow trails any time soon. Most of what we have to deal with is rocks. Going to get permission,rent bobcat and import clay content dirt? And then build and maintain? Count your blessings, I have endless miles of great cross country trails I can ride to from my house.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    It seems odd that someone would be able to build a new climbing trail on Bannon Hill without someone noticing it. On any given day there are at least a dozen cars in the parking lot.
    I've been building trails for over a decade and have only been asked on one work session if we had permission to do what we were doing and that was by a city employee. Some days are big build days with trailers and a lot of people, but many are just a handful of scruffy people out on a wed night digging dirt after work. If you act like you belong, no one GAF. The irony is that if anything, people probably thanked them for working on the trails.

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    What is Beverly Farms? Is that the same as Beverly Commons? Just started riding there this year. Great stuff. I would say Tom wants to go hit Vietnam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by idbrian View Post
    What is Beverly Farms? Is that the same as Beverly Commons? Just started riding there this year. Great stuff. I would say Tom wants to go hit Vietnam.
    Same place. Great rock exposure and lines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harryman View Post
    I've been building trails for over a decade and have only been asked on one work session if we had permission to do what we were doing and that was by a city employee. Some days are big build days with trailers and a lot of people, but many are just a handful of scruffy people out on a wed night digging dirt after work. If you act like you belong, no one GAF. The irony is that if anything, people probably thanked them for working on the trails.
    The issue is rogue trail building. They tore down a 200+ year old stone wall and in some spots the trail was like 4-5 ft wide. With poor slope and no thought for drainage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by idbrian View Post
    What is Beverly Farms? Is that the same as Beverly Commons? Just started riding there this year. Great stuff. I would say Tom wants to go hit Vietnam.
    I've ridden Vietnam quite a few times.

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    The only way to learn how to find the real jumps is to get in tight with your local BMXers IME.
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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    The issue is rogue trail building. They tore down a 200+ year old stone wall and in some spots the trail was like 4-5 ft wide. With poor slope and no thought for drainage.
    I'm not saying it's a good idea, I'm just pointing out that unless there's a ranger or member of the local trail org cruising by that know there's no work planned, no one will ask. Everyone assumes you're legit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Nope, what town?
    LMGTFY

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    Looks sweet!
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    I'll share some specific examples. Anything managed and maintained by the Fellowship of the Wheel, Stowe MTB and Kingdom Trails.
    Pine hill park, looks nice. 300 acres, 10's of thousands of man hours to build. Great if you can get both. Happening in MA? Not likely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    Pine hill park, looks nice. 300 acres, 10's of thousands of man hours to build. Great if you can get both. Happening in MA? Not likely.
    Not with that attitude, it wont.

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    If you are talking Pine Hill Park in Rutland , VT. then thumbs up. Have been there 3 overnighters and loved it. Great work in rough terrain. And right in a small city, a few blocks from downtown, which is pretty vibrant for VT. Lots of cheap lodging, both in town and on Rt. 4 heading up to Killington. Rideable for a long season. Rocky yes but it has that Vt. clayey soil...not so sandy and death cookies. They have a huge volunteer building base and it shows. Worth a ride or two....

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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    Not with that attitude, it wont.
    I do at least 8-10 trail days per year, yourself? Not attitude, but more of being realistic. I love all the trails I build and ride. All over MA and NH. Just buy 300 acres and get back to me, I'll show up with my saw, loppers and Mcleod. Vietnam, Highland and Thunder mt are not that far away.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    I do at least 8-10 trail days per year, yourself? Not attitude, but more of being realistic. I love all the trails I build and ride. All over MA and NH. Just buy 300 acres and get back to me, I'll show up with my saw, loppers and Mcleod. Vietnam, Highland and Thunder mt are not that far away.
    Pfft... 8-10? I do 10-15.

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    ^^^^ Those are chapter scheduled ones. Many more on my own.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    ^^^^ Those are chapter scheduled ones. Many more on my own.
    I didn't include all the trail days I do on my own either. I'm actually on the trail right now doing some maintenance. Thank God for Verizon. Amiright?

  52. #52
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    Nice!
    I put in 200 hours easy last year, not even half that this year.
    Slacking big time!

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  53. #53
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    just saw the huge bypass that was carved on bannon hill

    wow that was crap ! I also put more debris in the way when I went by


    folks, this is not KT...you want berms and flow the hike your ass out of Ma
    and go North. leave the stuff here in Ma alone.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by 127.0.0.1 View Post
    just saw the huge bypass that was carved on bannon hill

    wow that was crap ! I also put more debris in the way when I went by


    folks, this is not KT...you want berms and flow the hike your ass out of Ma
    and go North. leave the stuff here in Ma alone.
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  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomB15 View Post
    I didn't include all the trail days I do on my own either. I'm actually on the trail right now doing some maintenance. Thank God for Verizon. Amiright?
    Where do you do most of your work? I'm with the North Shore Nemba chapter, so it's Harold Parker, Ward Hill, Georgetown Rowley, Beverly Commons, some other TToR and well as Essex County Greenbelt. And then LLF because its close by as well as the Fells sometimes. Jumping ship to the MV chapter I get up to Lowell Dracut, Russel Mill and some of the new stuff last year at Gilson Hill.
    Last edited by leeboh; 11-04-2016 at 05:44 PM.

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    Tom, Berms? Got no skills for our great, local east coast rocks and roots? Every area of the country has different terrain, topography and local soils in which to build trails. Rocks, sandstone, loam, decomposed granite, etc. Check out our stuff at the front side of Boston Hill, it is a TToR property at the top of Ward Hill in N. Andover. Swoops, rollers, some low berms, and a "few" board walks to get across drainage. Need to work with the local flavor of what the land manager will allow, what is appropriate for the usage and trail population. Going rogue will just get trails closed, don't be that guy. Have you biked all the great stuff at Harold Parker SF? One of the gems in the area. Flow is where you find it. Rock walls, rollers, connecting moves. Just need the vision and skills to see it and ride it. Anyone can have fun in Kitchel at KT. Great riding on private land that charges fees with a full time trail care crew. Great business plan with support from all the local store owners, lodging and eating places. As well as everyone living there. Chat up Mike at the Tiki bar next time you're up there carving berms. Solid citizen. Or go to Thunder mt or our Vietnam fun park. LLF and Belmont trails, not going to see berms anytime soon. Embrace all the great variety of terrain and opportunities we have to ride so close in the cities and towns right here. In Wilmington,from my driveway, I can pedal to more than 75 miles of trails, some with just short pavement connectors. Instead of whining about" It's better in Vermont", Dude.

  57. #57
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    Willowdale is pretty flowy. Not many miles though.

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    RM also flowy. Or come ride with us in LW for the ultimate flow. We are certainly spoiled with great and unique trail systems. My only gripe is that there is not more woOden features, elevated skinnies, more drops and other technical features just interspersed within the trails. Would be easy if land managers would be cooperative. What we don't need is more shared use XC trails where the lycra bros blast past me and my kids while we hike or bike the fells. Slow and techy shared use and no one gets hurt or scared. Vietnam is great but almost the same distance as Highland and traffic is a challenge too weekdays coming back from early morning rides. So great for those living west, for us north it's a once in a while treat.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by idbrian View Post
    Willowdale is pretty flowy. Not many miles though.
    Like 15 is not a lot? Connect 4 other properties right there with less than a mile of pave to get 40 miles. Usually around 8 hrs with lunch and big crew. Willowdale, Cleveland pond, Hood pond, Georgetown/ Rowley, Bradley Palmer and Appleton farms I think?

  60. #60
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    I was referring to the Willowdale loop, which about 9 miles. I've only ever ridden Georgetown Rowley separately. I'll have to look into the others. I've been having too much fun at HP. It just really suits my style.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GBNEMBA View Post
    I undid your work. I'll keep undoing it, too..
    They're back. I rode there Tuesday and didn't see anything that I recall, but today we found all the stones and branches on the craptacular new "trail" had been thrown over the edge with some landing in the middle of the real trail. A bit dangerous since they're covered in leaves and I almost hit them. I cleared the real trail, but after spending most of the summer dragging logs/rocks out of the woods to block these morons I just didn't have it in me to close their trail again. Sorry.

  62. #62
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    ha!
    good!

    I am moving ten miles away. ten miles from living on the edge of the LLF
    and to the edge of GB. LLF will no longer be my local stash
    and will no longer vex me as hard this recent year.

    let it rot, I done my 25 years in that place keeping
    it cleaned up. now I can roll out of bed and be in thanksgiving forest
    and only hit LLF when I am looping it in on a death march

  63. #63
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    ^^^ Checked out all the great new stuff @ Gilson hill?

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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    ^^^ Checked out all the great new stuff @ Gilson hill?
    YES! Many thanks to those responsible.

  65. #65
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    I haven't been anywhere in this area except estabrook/cranberry/carlise town hall trails/GB/turk/russell

    so am looking
    forward to finding the other local nuggets and how to link them up on my own

    and doing new blowdown maintenance since I don't leave home without my saw
    I will never cut or remove stuff that is there as part of the trail

  66. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by car_nut View Post
    YES! Many thanks to those responsible.
    Joe from my NS chapter and Kirk from the MV chapter have given it many nice hours with skilled tools and trail mojo. Billerica SF, by rangeway rd and winning rd.

  67. #67
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    Just came back from a lunch ride. Animals.


    Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-llf-vandals.jpg

  68. #68
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    HS punks.

  69. #69
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    are you kidding me ?
    unreal.

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    I guess there were two high school age girls sitting there chain smoking prior to the painting. Assuming it was them.

  71. #71
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    That dick really stands out.
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  72. #72
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    When I saw that I thought it was just the new trail marking system. "Yeah, next time you're in Burlington, make sure you check out the new Blue Dick Trail at LLF!"

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    Kind of amazing high schoolers have the motivation to hike that far in.

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    I rode LLF yesterday, the male bits graffiti is somehow gone without being painted over. The SJ is still there.

    I saw the cut at the end of the power lines that is ridiculous, although the original trail is eroding like crazy so who knows which line is actually more sound.

    I also removed a car tire/rim from the yellow arrow trail. There is/was a braid there, I'm not sure which line is the original line. The line I've always taken has a "whoop" in it that you could catch air on and/or jump the little gap before it. The other line lets you skip the dip/whoop. The tire was placed on the top of the whoop, if someone came at speed and was planning on taking the line they might not have been able to see the tire and could have had a bad accident. I was going slow due to the snow so had plenty of time to stop, but I'm hardly extreme and I always ride over that dip/whoop. I only moved the tire a few feet off the trail so if it's really supposed to be there someone can put it back but it seems awfully dangerous to put it there without additional trail work. I should have taken a picture.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by leeboh View Post
    ^^^ Checked out all the great new stuff @ Gilson hill?
    Just did. will be going there a ton ! as I can ride in near Brick Kiln road /Warren Manning and pop into the woods near CasaBlanca and the exercise loop, cut through across Rangeway, to Gilson hill, pop back out and hit old middlesex tpke stuff (carbon force), circle RM and be back home under 1 mile from RM.

    perfect loop with a little road warmup

  76. #76
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    ^^^^ Awesome.

  77. #77
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    So the trail *******s are back out at LLF. Both look like cases of dumbing down the trails to fit their lack of skills.
    The first is on the trail that's closest to 3 running parallel. New trail trying to go around an fairly easy rock.
    Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-50212aa6-8e2c-4597-88b9-584c9e05138d_zpsldp0vlrd.jpg

    The second one really pisses me off. Someone took out a small tree on the out and back trail that's on the north end of the woods. With wide bars you needed to do a swim move to get through it, but it was rideable.
    Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-3caa7cd1-23f5-41e6-8dab-2389d5798e5c_zpseghppjzq.jpg
    Ongoing trail vandalism, rogue trails at LLF and BBN-4167892b-ddc0-43eb-a75e-f8e992be8c4e_zpscgphw1o4.jpg
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  78. #78
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    Pussies.
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    I'm truly amazed at how these people are so dedicated and hardworking at being lazy.

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    I suggest you block the sissy braids with as much large brush and big limbs as you can place there, then tie it all together with heavy gauge bailing wire. That's what we do at my backyard trails and it works like a charm.

  81. #81
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    I spent countless hours last season hauling deadfall trees as big as I could lift to stack at similar bypasses. I'd do that all week long. Monday morning, they were all gone and 5 more sissy braids/rogue trails/trees cut at knee length appeared. Every damn weekend. Like I said, their level of dedication and work ethic towards being lazy is remarkable.

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    Even though one time I almost fell off that rock and down on to RT 3, I would still never even considering going around it. This trail modification BS is crazy. It seems like LLF has been hit particular hard with this nonsense.

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by car_nut View Post
    I spent countless hours last season hauling deadfall trees as big as I could lift to stack at similar bypasses. I'd do that all week long. Monday morning, they were all gone and 5 more sissy braids/rogue trails/trees cut at knee length appeared. Every damn weekend. Like I said, their level of dedication and work ethic towards being lazy is remarkable.
    That's where the heavy gauge bailing wire comes in! Unless they are VERY industrious and have a pair of diagonal cutters on them, the piles stay put.

  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by pulsepro View Post
    That's where the heavy gauge bailing wire comes in! Unless they are VERY industrious and have a pair of diagonal cutters on them, the piles stay put.
    Agreed.

    Or just get some jersey barriers. Either way would probably work.

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    Really, really frustrating. Some very simple rock up and downs. Not that tech.

  86. #86
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    seems they should stick to road riding

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    Lot's of the newer riders (last 10 years) seem to think MTB trails should look like all the trails the see in videos - hand build, berms,......a pump track through the woods. goddamn brah/bros!

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