Tracer questions (yet again)- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Tracer questions (yet again)

    Does anyone know what the lower pivot bolt torque should be?
    I know this has been discussed before, but nobody seem to have an answer.
    The problem I see is the lower pivot bearings inner race is not resting against anything which puts a great deal of side stress on the bearings.

    Thanks,
    Phil

  2. #2
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    I got this response from Nick a year ago in an email:

    "All the bolts will be good to go hand tight, (about 15 ft lbs). If you have an issue with a bolt that likes to walk on you, blue loctite works wonders!!"

    I've been using less torque myself (~8 ft lbs), but do use the blue loctite. It's worked well for me.

  3. #3
    I already rode that
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Elvis
    "All the bolts will be good to go hand tight, (about 15 ft lbs).
    I told my cusion that once when he was tightening a bolt on his bike, needless to say he stripped it from tightening it "hand tight"

  4. #4
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    hand tight?

    I'm really concerned about that lower pivot bolt.
    If you only tighten it hand tight you will have side play when pedaling.
    I tried 12ft/lbs and it was plenty tight, but I'm affraid the bearings will be destroyed.
    Does intense have a definitive answer?
    I guess I should try them.

    Thanks,
    Phil

  5. #5
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    That message was from intense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer
    I'm really concerned about that lower pivot bolt.
    If you only tighten it hand tight you will have side play when pedaling.
    I tried 12ft/lbs and it was plenty tight, but I'm affraid the bearings will be destroyed.
    Does intense have a definitive answer?
    I guess I should try them.

    Thanks,
    Phil
    Yeah, I was confused by the hand-tight and 15 ft-lbs bit myself. I guess it's handtight if you have a foot long allen wrench. I wouldn't worry about damaging the bearings, they're sealed bearings and I don't think the torque of the bolt puts any added stress on them. They aren't like headset or cup-and-cone hub bearings, where you have to be careful to set the right pre-load on them. Just use the loctite. One thing that I do is I draw a few lines across the bolt onto the frame with a sharpie so that I can tell if the bolt is loosening at all during riding. It hasn't been a problem with the loctite. If you do this before you ever remove the pivot bolt, it makes it easy to tighten the bolt back up to the pre-set factory torque level.

  6. #6
    Black Lion
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer
    I'm really concerned about that lower pivot bolt.
    If you only tighten it hand tight you will have side play when pedaling.
    I tried 12ft/lbs and it was plenty tight, but I'm affraid the bearings will be destroyed.
    Does intense have a definitive answer?
    I guess I should try them.

    Thanks,
    Phil
    when you say "lower pivot bolt" what specifically are you refering to? Are you talking about the main pivot or a pivot on the linkage?

    It is all about blue loc-tite. Apply it on all bolts that should stay tight, and you never have to worry. Tighten untill there is no play what-so-ever. You will not damage the bearings, by sticking to the hand tight or lower torque specs. No worries!

    Greg
    Voltron

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer
    I'
    If you only tighten it hand tight you will have side play when pedaling.
    Really? Have you seen or felt this happen?

    - Arve

  8. #8
    I already rode that
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer
    I'm really concerned about that lower pivot bolt.
    If you only tighten it hand tight you will have side play when pedaling.
    I tried 12ft/lbs and it was plenty tight, but I'm affraid the bearings will be destroyed.
    Does intense have a definitive answer?
    I guess I should try them.

    Thanks,
    Phil
    I tightened my pivot bolt hand tight and never had it come loose or have any side play develop.

    I dont go reefing on the allen keys either when going hand tight, something ppl like my cusion do or not enough of.

  9. #9
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    Bolt torque

    I'm talking about the main pivot bolt, the long bolt that attached the swingarm to the frame, right above the bottom bracket.

    I agree that on all the other bolts (the short upper pivots and dropout pivot)you can tighten the bolts without a worry. As long as you dont tighten then enough to strip out the threads. However, they are shimed which allows the inner bearing race to make contact with the part it is being bolted to. This is fine as the torque of the bolt is not meing applied to any of the bearings.

    On the lower pivot bolt this is not the case.
    Because the two bearngs are pressed into the frame there is no center sleeve to support the inner race. So when you tighten the lower bolt you are forcing the two inner races of the bearings together. This is applying force to the ball bearings.

    If you only tighten the bolts finger tight and use loctite you are going to have side play.
    Intense should have supplied a sleeve to prolong the bearing life, or am I mistaken?
    Are the bearings designed to handle this type of load?

    Thanks,
    Phil

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer


    On the lower pivot bolt this is not the case.
    Because the two bearngs are pressed into the frame there is no center sleeve to support the inner race. So when you tighten the lower bolt you are forcing the two inner races of the bearings together. This is applying force to the ball bearings.


    Thanks,
    Phil
    You should have a spacer in between the swingarm and the bearings on both sides of the main pivot, just like the little spacers on the dropout pivot.

  11. #11
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    ?????

    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Elvis
    You should have a spacer in between the swingarm and the bearings on both sides of the main pivot, just like the little spacers on the dropout pivot.
    Please explain?
    This would make sense, maybe my bike was never shipped with it!
    If you take out one of the bearings, is it a long sleeve that comes out?

    I was always thinking I should make one, that's why I'm so concerned abut the torque.

    Thanks,
    Phil

  12. #12
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    When you remove the pivot bolt and lower the swingarm, there should be a silver looking washer stuck to each of the bearings (or possibly stuck to the swingarm, or rolling around on the floor under your workbench). These washers prevent the swingarm from grinding against the frame, and I believe also prevent the bearings from being smooshed by the swingarm in the event that the bolt is over-torqued. I really wouldn't worry about the bearings being damaged by the torque of the bolt. Just use some loctite to prevent the bolt from loosening. I think that having the bolt come loose is probably the main concern.

  13. #13
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    Right - Elvis I have those washers.

    But that only addresses the swingarm to bearing.
    There is the space between the two bearings that goes unsupported.

    Oh well, maybe I'm just looking for an excuse to buy a Turner Flux!

    Thanks,
    Phil

  14. #14
    Black Lion
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomtracer
    But that only addresses the swingarm to bearing.
    There is the space between the two bearings that goes unsupported.

    Oh well, maybe I'm just looking for an excuse to buy a Turner Flux!

    Thanks,
    Phil
    Mine just came.
    My 02 swingarm is broke.

    Greg
    Voltron

  15. #15
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    Where did it break?

    Quote Originally Posted by yogreg
    Mine just came.
    My 02 swingarm is broke.

    Greg
    Got any pics?

    Bummer.
    Astigmatic Visionary

  16. #16
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    Nice!

    Quote Originally Posted by yogreg
    Mine just came.
    My 02 swingarm is broke.

    Greg
    Does Intense still offer a replacement?

    How does the Flux ride compare to the Tracer?

  17. #17
    Black Lion
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    [QUOTE=Phantomtracer]Does Intense still offer a replacement?

    [QUOTE]


    Just got off the phone with Intense. They have three swing-arms and one happened to be an annodized grey same as the frame.

    I am very relieved, as I love my Tracer.
    Voltron

  18. #18
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    Three Left!!!!!

    [QUOTE=yogreg][QUOTE=Phantomtracer]Does Intense still offer a replacement?



    Just got off the phone with Intense. They have three swing-arms and one happened to be an annodized grey same as the frame.

    I am very relieved, as I love my Tracer.

    I hope they make more!
    I would think they would support the Tracer for a few more years.

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