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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    I am saying that it is not harder. It is just different.

    Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
    Yes to this too. I can't agree with mtb24 comment of "---quick changes and reactions more difficult". I may move around more now, but it's easy and fun, and I often feel like I have pin-point accuracy with line choice coming out of blind corners.
    The reoccurring comment of 'new geo works better on DH' is missing the point. It simply works everywhere. I just rode my pals Spark (115mm DS race bike) So much faster than my old race bikes.
    Came back 2hrs later to edit. I was thinking about how the trails have changed too. Even if the change has been incremental, the corners HAVE opened up a bit with wider exits. I always blamed the growth of our user base, lots more riders than a decade ago. Maybe however, these longer/slacker bikes play a role. My not so slack 68*HTA will easily follow the inside/tight line, but it IS easy to let it go wide too.
    Last edited by jim c; 1 Week Ago at 12:58 PM.
    oops I wasn't clipped in

  2. #102
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    Doesn't having a steep seat angle put more weight on the hands?

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGrr View Post
    Doesn't having a steep seat angle put more weight on the hands?
    Yeah, there's no free lunch. The steep STA is great for climbing because it keeps your weight forward. It's not so great for more flat terrain because it keeps your weight forward. Also, to keep the same saddle to pedal distance you have to raise the seat more; which means your saddle to bar drop increased (which places more weight on the hands also). To correct this you could get a bike with a longer reach and higher bars but then you're also losing some of the benefits of having the steep STA and there are other downsides.

    I can definitely feel the extra weight on my hands on my new bike with a 75 STA. It's enough to cause a bit of discomfort. Other people might not have an issue with it.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGrr View Post
    Doesn't having a steep seat angle put more weight on the hands?
    My bike do put more weight on my hands, but not enough to be uncomfortable. I sometimes ride 1.5+ hours on road and flat trails to get to another riding area and my modern geometry with steep STA is a non issue. If I rode only flat trails and roads my saddle could be more rearward.
    I got some bad ideas in my head.

  5. #105
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    Fun facts:

    From a 1987 Cannondale catalog
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails your thoughts on new geometry?-1987.jpg  

    "There is a big difference between kneeling down and bending over" -FZ

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGrr View Post
    Doesn't having a steep seat angle put more weight on the hands?
    I got a chance to demo a Ripmo this weekend. Its got a 76 degree STA and a 446 reach on a medium. I'm 5'8" with a 30 inch inseam. When I rode it...it didn't really feel like I had more pressure on my hands.

    What I didn't really like about the steeper STA...is that my reach feels cramped...and my pedaling position felt strange. It feels good when I'm climbing something steep...but for more moderate grades like 5 to 8 percent...I don't like it.

    The saddle on my bike is 74 degrees and the saddle is centered. I had the saddle on the Ripmo centered too. If I got the Ripmo...I would move the saddle back from center. It's an excellent bike...but when I got back on my bike...I wasn't too terribly upset.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by RS VR6 View Post
    The saddle on my bike is 74 degrees and the saddle is centered. I had the saddle on the Ripmo centered too. If I got the Ripmo...I would move the saddle back from center.
    Much easier to do that or run an offset post than it is to make a too-slack STA steeper. Or if the seated position is too cramped on a med maybe you could try a large Ripmo too?

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by ashmtb View Post
    your thoughts on new geometry?
    Overrated...


  9. #109
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    Chris Akrigg did something similar on a gravel bike. That hardtail 1-upped things in terms of gnarliness. His FS bike videos were even gnarlier and faster through chunk.

    People are more interested in something more comparable to their peers. Their choice should depend on who/what their peers are: BMXers, dirt jumpers, trials riders, downhillers, slopestyle, etc.

    Modern geo lately is more focused on gravity and enduro racing lately. The new steep seat angle bikes feel like SUVs rather than compact sports cars, considering the position they put you in. It's more upright, in sort of a "commander's" position. I don't think a steep STA is a "must-have checklist item"; I think it's just one piece of the juggling act to find something balanced. In the case of new designs, it's to balance the longer front centers.

    I'd like to say okay with any bike as long as it doesn't behave poorly and require excessive rider skill to compensate, but I've been spoiled by much better and don't want to risk injury. What I consider to be "poorly behaved" and "require excessive rider skill to compensate" is quite strict. Why make myself uncomfortable because I chose a bike poorly, among the many choices out there? xD

  10. #110
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    This geometry isn't new. Many of us we're having custom frames built in the early 2000s with the geo that's now mainstream.

    It really started with Super D racing and events like Downiville with riders taking six inch travel freeride bikes and slapping short stems and DH wheels on them. It bacame apparent that what you needed was a steep seat angle for climbing, a slack HA for decending. Bottom brackets were high at the time too. Some riders like Mark Weir were riding DH frames with single crown forks.

    I think these days, things have got a little out of control. A 65 HA and 76 seat angle is just too much for trail riding.

    At the end of the day it's all about having fun. Today, for me, that was riding a 26" steel single speed down a boulder field. Best ride in a long time. Goat Camp in the White Tanks west of Phoenix in case you're wondering.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by fokof View Post
    Fun facts:

    From a 1987 Cannondale catalog
    Ha!

    SM500 was my first mtn bike
    Riding: '91 Carbon Epic Stumpjumper w/1" Slicks and a Rack on the Back

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