Why I don't buy local- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Why I don't buy local

    I am in the process of building up my old M2 stumpy frame with newer components. It's been years since I have bought more than a tube of grease from one of the two local bike shops. I was in the one today and figured I would see if things have changed. FSA Orbit MX headset at local shop = $89.99. Exact same headset on Ebay runs between $120ish including shipping to $35.61 and free shipping. I'm all for supporting locally owned businesses but I tend to stay away from gouging.

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    Hmmm... you're probably going to be torn a new one for those comments ha ha. I'm all for saving your hard earned dollars and I think the whole "buy local" thing is kind of misguided, but I wouldn't say the shop is gouging you. They probably get most of the parts from a distributer that charged them $40 for the headset and after all the costs of running a brick and mortar business are factored in they need to sell that headset for $89 if they are going to stay in business. If you are trying to rationalize your spending preferences you could say you paid the $35 for the headset on ebay leaving you $54 to spend at the shop or some other local business.

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    This will end well.

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    Hmm, so headset is $90 at your LBS and between $36 and $120 online yet you are complaining about price gouging at your LBS? Seems like your LBS has a decent price and it's on sale/closeout some places online.

    Funny that you are worried about price but are willing to spend the extra $$$$ on bike specific grease. Most people spend money at bike shops on gear/components and head to their automotive shops to get grease since it's the same stuff at 1/4 the price.

    Have heard the fancy Phil Wood grease is just Castrol Marine grease. Bel Ray grease is supposed to be even better. Lucas grease is cheap as shit, think it was $3 a pound when I last picked up a tub. Finish Line grease is made by Dupont. Pretty sure I heard Park grease was made by Mobil but cant remember where I heard that.

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    I should add that the $120 price was including a $45 shipping charge. I live in a northern part of the country.

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    *Grabs Popcorn*

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    went into a new LBS today and they had stuff marked up 100% of their cost. They let it slip in conversation. I was looking at the AVID BB7s and they quoted me their cost first then changed it when they rung me up. I didn't buy it ofc. I normally shop at a different LBS and dont mind supporting them. 100% mark up is crazy.

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    Why I don't buy local

    Quote Originally Posted by NoBiasIntended View Post
    went into a new LBS today and they had stuff marked up 100% of their cost. They let it slip in conversation. I was looking at the AVID BB7s and they quoted me their cost first then changed it when they rung me up. I didn't buy it ofc. I normally shop at a different LBS and dont mind supporting them. 100% mark up is crazy.
    You do not know retailing. A 100% markup (50% margin) is called keystone, and is the basic pricing standard.
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    markup amounts are irrelevant. it the price is worth it to you, pull the trigger. if not, go somewhere else...


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    I paid full retail recently for a new set of pedals at my LBS. But the shop owner is the wrench. He knows me by name.

    He has my suspension sag settings written down next to my name and bike on his list. I know he treats my bike as if it were one of his own and he won't let me out the door unsafe.

    He knows I wrench a little on my own and is always ready to check my work if I ask. He provides insight for trails and isn't in my face trying to sell me the next new gizmo.

    When I came in to get a new rear flashing LED for commuting he had two on the wall. One was $40 the other $19. He didn't even offer me the $40 one because it is functionally the same as the $19 one and he's not out the gouge. He keeps the more expensive light because that's what some people want.

    All that being said, not all LBS are created equal. Some are better than others. I'm lucky in that I live up the street from a real honest to goodness bike shop. Is he more expensive than online? Sure. Is it worth it? Damn skippy!!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurkishCA View Post
    I am in the process of building up my old M2 stumpy frame with newer components. It's been years since I have bought more than a tube of grease from one of the two local bike shops. I was in the one today and figured I would see if things have changed. FSA Orbit MX headset at local shop = $89.99. Exact same headset on Ebay runs between $120ish including shipping to $35.61 and free shipping. I'm all for supporting locally owned businesses but I tend to stay away from gouging.
    I always prefer to try my bikes before I buy so buying local is the only option except if you know someone with the same bike and he lets you test it. However, I always do get my parts online, way cheaper....
    Last edited by Max24; 03-10-2015 at 12:01 AM.

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    Also beware of knock-offs on ebay. If the price is too good to be true....

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    Cool story from Mr. 3 posts. Trolling a Bieber forum is probably a better use of your time.

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    Re: Why I don't buy local

    Can't get everything from my local shop. He's a Norco retailer but I still call Norco for their parts myself. It's what he recommended anyways. Sometimes my finances are in different places and I'd rather hunt a deal instead. I know the guys at the lbs do the same behavior when buying from other places. How inhuman, how absurd.
    If you haven't had to do that, great.

    More importantly, making a big deal of it by making a thread about it typically goes nowhere.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurkishCA View Post
    I am in the process of building up my old M2 stumpy frame with newer components. It's been years since I have bought more than a tube of grease from one of the two local bike shops. I was in the one today and figured I would see if things have changed. FSA Orbit MX headset at local shop = $89.99. Exact same headset on Ebay runs between $120ish including shipping to $35.61 and free shipping. I'm all for supporting locally owned businesses but I tend to stay away from gouging.
    I don't think that you understand the definition of price gouging. If you had come in the store and explained that you need the headset desperately for a race the next day and the sales person then says "oh, okay normally $89.99 but since you are desperate I have to charge you $179.99." Now *that* would be price gouging. The $89.99 price is called retail.
    I have nothing against mail order but the irony is that mail order probably results in higher rather than lower LBS prices. When a store loses sales volume to another store it then has to raise prices to make up the difference.

  17. #17
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    What's really annoying is when I know more about the products than the stores do.

    A guy today - "well, the problem with running Shimano brakes and XX1 is you'll have all kinds of clamps on your bar. If you went all SRAM you could use Matchmaker to clean things up.

    So then I explained that Problem Solvers make a mismatch clamp to run XTR/XX1. He said he wished he knew that before he built his bike. I shouldn't know more than the guys that do this for a living.

    I knew about Di2, Di2 firmware updates, the last generation of XT, XTR, XX1, the new XTR discs, Syntace, Edge/Enve, etc etc WAY before any of my local stores did. That's annoying.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by TurkishCA View Post
    I am in the process of building up my old M2 stumpy frame with newer components. It's been years since I have bought more than a tube of grease from one of the two local bike shops. I was in the one today and figured I would see if things have changed. FSA Orbit MX headset at local shop = $89.99. Exact same headset on Ebay runs between $120ish including shipping to $35.61 and free shipping. I'm all for supporting locally owned businesses but I tend to stay away from gouging.
    Right...The LBS was in the ball park for price, yet...

    Hey, when the shop down the street goes out of business you can smile and say I was part of the reason.

    If you can't afford to support the LBS, maybe you don't belong in this sport. The LBS is part of the scene.

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    I usually go in to my LBS after I've already researched what I want and what the prices are. Generally, if I ask the owner he can come within about 10% of online prices. I think that's fair and I enjoy doing business there. I do all my own work, but I just like having a place to hang out and talk about bikes, so I figure supporting him is a good thing. If that doesn't matter to you, more power to you, go get your stuff online.

  20. #20
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    Why I don't buy local

    For something major like building a bike yourself, mail order is the way to go, no doubt. I try to stay away from eBay, just because there are so many Chinese knock offs out there. For everything else I go to my LBS. I've only really been going in for a month, and it usually small stuff(water bottle, computer, tune-up, etc.), but they know me by name already. I recently broke a shifter the day before I was traveling with a friend for a ride. They gave me the part at less than MSRP, and installed it same day. I was in and out in 15 mins. You can't get that on eBay or mail order.


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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy View Post
    You do not know retailing. A 100% markup (50% margin) is called keystone, and is the basic pricing standard.
    Actually I do, but I am not going to debate it. I used to be a Service Manager. The shops I worked at never marked anything at 100% mark up. I've seen 65% alot.

    Point is, I am not paying $120 for a single Avid BB7 and rotor only. If you can justify that, then more power too you.

    I support another shop and believe in supporting your LBS'. I personally have been going to Al's Bicycles in OKC for more than 20 years. Just wanted to try out a newer store to see how they were.

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    Why I don't buy local

    Quote Originally Posted by limba View Post
    What's really annoying is when I know more about the products than the stores do.

    A guy today - "well, the problem with running Shimano brakes and XX1 is you'll have all kinds of clamps on your bar. If you went all SRAM you could use Matchmaker to clean things up.

    So then I explained that Problem Solvers make a mismatch clamp to run XTR/XX1. He said he wished he knew that before he built his bike. I shouldn't know more than the guys that do this for a living.

    I knew about Di2, Di2 firmware updates, the last generation of XT, XTR, XX1, the new XTR discs, Syntace, Edge/Enve, etc etc WAY before any of my local stores did. That's annoying.
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    Last edited by mbmb65; 05-17-2013 at 03:30 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty $anchez View Post
    Cool story from Mr. 3 posts. Trolling a Bieber forum is probably a better use of your time.
    were you talking to me or the OP?

  24. #24
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    2013 XT Crankset:

    LBS: $400
    Ebay: $214 + $15 shipping
    CRC: $156 + free shipping (5 days)

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    Quote Originally Posted by NoBiasIntended View Post
    went into a new LBS today and they had stuff marked up 100% of their cost. They let it slip in conversation. I was looking at the AVID BB7s and they quoted me their cost first then changed it when they rung me up. I didn't buy it ofc. I normally shop at a different LBS and dont mind supporting them. 100% mark up is crazy.
    No, it's not. You have to pay electricity, gas, employees, insurance, keep a certain amount of stock in that doesn't always sell, offer a few promotions like free water bottles/cages and a tune up, sponsor races or at least contribute in some small way to the community, pay to replace tools and every once and a while get a new tool, and so on. This stuff isn't free and it doesn't come out of fairy land. This is the reality of owning a bike shop. Usually the cheaper stuff like tubes are marked up to 400% or more, while more expensive things like XTR cranksets may be more like 130% (or not even close to "2x" wholesale). That is a pricing schedule, and it's fairly common.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoBiasIntended View Post
    Actually I do, but I am not going to debate it. I used to be a Service Manager. The shops I worked at never marked anything at 100% mark up. I've seen 65% alot.
    I call total BS on this. I would bet your shop had plenty of items marked up beyond 100% (200% of wholesale). How much were tubes? How about slime? How about water bottles? How about little tools? All of the little stuff is usually marked up well beyond double.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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    The rub and the notion of being gouged comes from me having worked in the manufacturing industry for more than a few years so I do have a good notion of how much the products are worth to make en masse. The area I live in has a long and well earned reputation for overcharging for services and goods. One of the negatives of living in the energy sector.

    That headset I was talking about would cost my shop around $15 to make if we did a batch of a hundred or so. What we would charge the customer would be around double that. And I can bet wages paid here are a hell of alot higher than where the parts are actually made (Taiwan).

    Worst thing about the whole fiasco is from everything I have heard is sporting goods stores make most of their profit off of clothing sales and not hardware.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dirty $anchez View Post
    Cool story from Mr. 3 posts. Trolling a Bieber forum is probably a better use of your time.
    I would like to thank you for adding valuable insight to this topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by GTscoob View Post
    Hmm, so headset is $90 at your LBS and between $36 and $120 online yet you are complaining about price gouging at your LBS? Seems like your LBS has a decent price and it's on sale/closeout some places online.

    Funny that you are worried about price but are willing to spend the extra $$$$ on bike specific grease.....
    Thank you for the great education on grease!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smudge13 View Post
    I paid full retail recently for a new set of pedals at my LBS. But the shop owner is the wrench. He knows me by name.

    He has my suspension sag settings written down next to my name and bike on his list. I know he treats my bike as if it were one of his own and he won't let me out the door unsafe.

    He knows I wrench a little on my own and is always ready to check my work if I ask. He provides insight for trails and isn't in my face trying to sell me the next new gizmo.

    When I came in to get a new rear flashing LED for commuting he had two on the wall. One was $40 the other $19. He didn't even offer me the $40 one because it is functionally the same as the $19 one and he's not out the gouge. He keeps the more expensive light because that's what some people want.

    All that being said, not all LBS are created equal. Some are better than others. I'm lucky in that I live up the street from a real honest to goodness bike shop. Is he more expensive than online? Sure. Is it worth it? Damn skippy!!

    The one place in the world I actually like spending money is my local bike shop. They order most of my parts and they don't charge me too much more than I could get for new parts online. Since I'm only a so-so mechanic they take good care of my bikes for me. I haggle everywhere else including my vets (100 bucks for some doxyclycline I could get for four bucks at Wal Mart...I don't think so) but their prices are reasonable and their fees for repairs are way too low.

  29. #29
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    So your comparing manufacturing prices to retail prices ? LOL wow , it doesnt matter how much it costs to make. What matters is what the LBS pays then has to set a price in order for them to make a profit after all bills are paid for . You do know that the owners have bills at home they need to pay as well right ? There is too many variables to sit there and claim that a LBS is trying to rip you off cuz you dont like the price . Theres a middle man as well in some cases . If you want quality and service , you gotta pay for it or you can go to a cheapo place and get garbage service , pick your poison .

    Ordering online is different since most places " online " dont stock everything or have a store front sometimes . Or some places stock so much in bundles where they get crazy pricing due to "bulk " orders .

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    Quote Originally Posted by shiggy View Post
    You do not know retailing. A 100% markup (50% margin) is called keystone, and is the basic pricing standard.
    Taking this a little further, MSRPs are often 'keystoned' a great deal more than the 'standard' 100%, simply because people are much more price conscious nowadays, greatly due to the fact that they can quickly use internet tools to cross-reference prices from many places, and are always expecting a deal. Resalers will often keystone substantially more than 100% just so that they can sucker a few, then be able to offer what looks like an amazing deal at a later date, but without losing out too much.
    Your LBS is not out of the ordinary here. They more usually will offer a more consistent price than the internet resalers, but they do have their overheads to factor into the deal, hence their inability to offer those sometimes 'killer' deals. It is a tricky juggling act for them, but a good LBS will offer something a great deal more valuable than any online retailer is able. Anyone who is lucky enough to have a good LBS in their orbit will know exactly what I am talking about.
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  31. #31
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    oof.

    I mostly buy used stuff except bottom brackets, cassettes, rings, chains, and tires. I get all of that at my LBS except tires which has retail prices that I can't wrap my head around. Although nowadays, lightly used 26" tires are cheap.

  32. #32
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    thread title should be "Here's an illogical reason why I don't by local"
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    The LBS is great for buying bikes and some wear parts but for the rest, I prefer ordering online due to better prices. The best LBS in town sell Stroker Ryde brake pads for 30$+tx a set while I can get them for under 20$ online. If you're in a pinch, a LBS is the best bet.

    They also sell Magura MT4 brakeset for 499$ + tx while it's possible to get for under 400$ online.

  34. #34
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    You don't have to support your local bike shop. Honestly, we dont care. However you want to spend your money is your business.

    All that we ask is that you stop being a TOOL and posting stupid thread such as this.

    Good day, Sir.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    No, it's not. You have to pay electricity, gas, employees, insurance, keep a certain amount of stock in that doesn't always sell, offer a few promotions like free water bottles/cages and a tune up, sponsor races or at least contribute in some small way to the community, pay to replace tools and every once and a while get a new tool, and so on. This stuff isn't free and it doesn't come out of fairy land. This is the reality of owning a bike shop. Usually the cheaper stuff like tubes are marked up to 400% or more, while more expensive things like XTR cranksets may be more like 130% (or not even close to "2x" wholesale). That is a pricing schedule, and it's fairly common.
    I am pretty sure I never said that its not common for places to mark up product 100 or even 200% or even more. I just said its crazy for the particular item I was browsing, which is my opinion. I understand charging 5 dollars for something that cost them 1 dollar can be normal.

    You guys are arguing like I am saying all LBSs are bad and should not mark their products up. I am not. I am saying in this particular instance, that A particular product IS overpriced. I never said that every store in the world has matched the price of this store. Like I previously stated, I go to a different LBS, I just wanted to check out the newer one on the way to a trail I was going too. I noticed a big difference in pricing. If you think 120 dollars is fair for a single Avid BB7 and rotor, then by all means, spend your hard earned money. I don't and won't at THAT store.

    Anyway, I am done, you guys are basically trolling yourself on the issue, like I am talking smack about all LBSs, i am not. Is it possible that there are a few bad LBSs in this world?

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoBiasIntended View Post
    Is it possible that there are a few bad LBSs in this world?
    Oh yes! And I know a couple close to me. Strangely, they mostly cater for the huge road bike market here, and their attitude, very generally speaking, is entirely different to the shops that cater more for the MTB trade. But THAT's a whole different kettle of fish for another thread...
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    Do online businesses not have a building, employees, taxes, insurance and over head just like an lbs? Things don't magically appear at your front door for free when you click the button. As far as I know parts manufacturers don't sell directly to the public. A storefront vs a warehouse should have similar costs in operation. I have a couple ideas as to why the price differences but I fully respect the small business owner putting his neck on the line to have a business.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by menusk View Post
    Do online businesses not have a building, employees, taxes, insurance and over head just like an lbs? Things don't magically appear at your front door for free when you click the button. As far as I know parts manufacturers don't sell directly to the public. A storefront vs a warehouse should have similar costs in operation. I have a couple ideas as to why the price differences but I fully respect the small business owner putting his neck on the line to have a business.
    You can run a 1 man show right out of your house but some companies require you to have a storefront and some dont. Some companies dont even have items in stock , once you order then they send it out from location X to your house. Smartass

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmb65 View Post
    Dude, you're awesome. It's hard to be humble, ain't it?
    No, I'm not awesome. I have a computer and an internet connection. All of this information is available to anyone that wants it. All they have to do is check bikerumor once a day and they're up to date.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
    Right...The LBS was in the ball park for price, yet...

    Hey, when the shop down the street goes out of business you can smile and say I was part of the reason.

    If you can't afford to support the LBS, maybe you don't belong in this sport. The LBS is part of the scene.
    Support? Are they running a business or a PBS affiliate? Listen, I give plenty to my LBS because many times I need something NOW, and they have it in stock (tires, tubes, chains....). And I'll gladly spend at a place that has good service (no, they don't all).

    But trying to guilt and shame someone into buy from them?

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by aedubber View Post
    Ordering online is different since most places " online " dont stock everything or have a store front sometimes . Or some places stock so much in bundles where they get crazy pricing due to "bulk " orders .
    Oh, they have employees some even have honest bike shops as part of their business, but there are significant reasons why the local shops can not compete.

    The big shops are able to buy OEM take-offs, basically over-stock that the bike manufacturers are left with, this is cheaper than buying from any distributor, so the price per unit for many things is a lot lower at the big mail order places. These big stores actually have their OWN bike brands most of the time, so they have easy access to OEM parts, which is cheaper than you'll get from any distributor that the bike shops have to go through (QBP, BTI).

    No tax on orders, lets face it, yet another area where the local shop can't compete. Why do I want to pay 8% sales tax in AZ rather than order somewhere else for free. Huge difference.

    The big mail order places can cut their prices on stuff to generate interest, so while it may not be a sustainable price, they may decide to sell a hundred units at some price that helps attract business and sell other stuff.

    Now, there are ways that local shops can compete, but it's not in the above areas. They have to be active and offer stuff that the mail order shops can not.

    I don't think local shops should have "charity buys" from us, the only constant in business is change. You have to find new markets, change your production, find new processes, find new ways to be efficient, etc. To that extent, many shops want to just sit back and do what they've always done, which is a recipe for disaster sooner or later. What they need to do is find ways to get involved, sponsor local rides or work days, small things when they can, maybe have "shop rides" on the weekend posted to show new people around, basic bike maintenance classes at a high school or other places, get a good website, keep it updated with your stock. Get into QBP and BTI and take advantage of the sales they have from time to time if you can move the merchandise. There are many ways to do this, but it takes innovation and imagination. This is where a local bike shop can be better than a mail order shop, but life isn't easy and it takes effort.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  42. #42
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    One problem here is entitled people think that if it costs "x" dollars to manufacture at the factory in china, it should cost the same price on the shelf.

    I live in Alaska, where EVERYTHING is more expensive, even the salmon and king crab in the stores. That has to do with the entire cost of living and what it takes a business (or person) to survive. It's all more expensive because most things have to be shipped up or driven through Canada and we need all of those things for the most part (or at least to have a quality of life similar to other places). Real quick, you get used to the cost of living, but you also realize what it takes to survive.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  43. #43
    U sayin' Bolt ?
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    The online shop is local to someone though, right? CRC does a lot more to stimulate its local economy than any amount of shops who only serve local markets. We should be supporting our local economy by fostering businesses which function in the new economy, not by clinging to ones whose low volumes necessitate 50% margins.

    As time goes on, the LBS will shrink in size to relieve rental overhead and become more focused on wrenching rather than gaudily showrooming parts that provide quick effortless revenue.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by knutso View Post

    As time goes on, the LBS will shrink in size to relieve rental overhead and become more focused on wrenching rather than gaudily showrooming parts that provide quick effortless revenue.



    And then all the Spodes will complain about the lack of selection.

  45. #45
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    How is this thread still going? Has anybody's mind changed?

    Sometimes it takes a little effort, but find a good LBS and, with a case of beer, awesomeness happens.
    Last edited by girlonbike; 05-18-2013 at 08:38 PM.

  46. #46
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    Re: Why I don't buy local

    Every shop is a local shop somewhere. If a shop wants to be successful, increase their sales online with better prices.

  47. #47
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    I fail to comprehend how anyone thinks a local bike shop that has to pay rent, utilities, employees, insurance, etc etc and has customer base of the town he lives could ever compete with a guy that has a customer base as big as the internet sits behind a computer in his underwear and drop ships products to you.

    An internet retailer can make a dollar and be profitable.
    A LBS can make a $100 and still go out of business.

    Now I am not saying not to buy stuff online as I purchase both online and locally.
    However, we don't need a thread pointing out the obvious which is prices are generally higher at a LBS and bashing them for it.
    Just stick it in granny and start grinding.

  48. #48
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    i don't buy everything at my LBS but jason has the coolest shop dog in the world...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Why I don't buy local-mojo.jpg  


  49. #49
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    Why I don't buy local

    Just this week paid $259 plus tax for XTR pedals and I feel pretty good about the value. The five bucks they didn't charge me to install will almost cover the cost of the six pack I'll bring when I pick up my bike, but still, I'm pretty sure I paid at least $80 more than could have online. And heck, even I can install pedals.

    The only guys who complain about the prices at LBS don't have a long term working relationship with their LBS.

    If you don't understand this, I'm not trying to convince you. If you do understand this, I don't need to convince you.

  50. #50
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    Re: Why I don't buy local

    Sorry, I have to look out for my family and mortgage payment, not the "scene". I buy parts from where I get the best deal, sometimes buying from a LBS is, most the time it is not.

    Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

  51. #51
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    I don't buy local because we only have the 1 shop and the fact when I walk in their the shop keeper try's to sell me a new bike

  52. #52
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    Why I don't buy local

    Josh- That's a good reason.
    Moto - that's a good reason too. But the point I'm making is that $259 from LBS is, in the long run, and all things considered, a much better value to me than $179 from online dealer, most of the time, even for pedals. I can't recall a single time something I bought from LBS wasn't exactly what I needed, and wasn't installed perfectly. YMMV.

  53. #53
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    My local shop 3 min away GARBAGE...still trying to sell 2 to 3 year old crap to people. That's why i drive 45 min away to get greeted with a smile and actually have people know what they're talking about.
    SWING YOUR LEG OVER IT AND PEDAL:cool:

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by menusk View Post
    Do online businesses not have a building, employees, taxes, insurance and over head just like an lbs? Things don't magically appear at your front door for free when you click the button. As far as I know parts manufacturers don't sell directly to the public. A storefront vs a warehouse should have similar costs in operation. I have a couple ideas as to why the price differences but I fully respect the small business owner putting his neck on the line to have a business.
    Rent in a storefront location could run you $2-4 per sq ft in most locations....even higher in very desirable locations.

    Office/warehouse location could be under $1 pr sq ft and could be anywhere.

    Storefronts generally need more space to display product.....non-storefront/warehouse/office sellers can just pile product up.

    Just as an example:

    LBs has 5000 sq ft shop @ $4 sq ft to have all these great bikes and parts on their floor so you can come in and touch/feel/try....so rent is $20k a month.

    Internet guy is selling out of 1000 sq ft industrial spot @ $1 per sq ft...so rent is only $1000 a month.

    Considering nothing else....who needs to charge more just to keep the doors open?
    Bicycles donít have motors or batteries.:nono:

    Ebikes are not bicycles :nono:

  55. #55
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    "I knew about Di2, Di2 firmware updates, the last generation of XT, XTR, XX1, the new XTR discs, Syntace, Edge/Enve, etc etc WAY before any of my local stores did. That's annoying."

    Not everyone has all the time in the world to sit at the computer and research new products. Most bosses don't want to pay there mechanics to surf the net, and most mechanics would rather be riding when not wrenching.

  56. #56
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    Who do you mean, the consumer or the store? Either way you're just lazy. I like being informed whether I'm buying a bike part or a lawnmower and if I know more than the store that's lame on their part.

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmeldrum26 View Post
    Not everyone has all the time in the world to sit at the computer and research new products. Most bosses don't want to pay there mechanics to surf the net, and most mechanics would rather be riding when not wrenching.
    Maybe not all the time, but you have to do your due diligence. I'm not going to blindly walk into a random bike shop and say "hook me up." I want to know what the going price is, and at least attempt to negotiate. If I tell the shop that part X is selling for $100 online, and they want $200, I'm going to ask if they will meet somewhere in the middle.

  58. #58
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    I paid $950 for the XX1 group. It would have costs me hundreds more to buy locally and I'd have to wait for it.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by limba View Post
    Who do you mean, the consumer or the store? Either way you're just lazy. I like being informed whether I'm buying a bike part or a lawnmower and if I know more than the store that's lame on their part.
    don't be retarded. we're talking middle-men here, not the actual manufacturer...

    most shop employees know much more than the mom and pops they make their money off of. it's not their fault you have endless amounts of time to be an internet nerd and be up on all the latest and greatest, they probably actually have lives...


  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmeldrum26 View Post
    "I knew about Di2, Di2 firmware updates, the last generation of XT, XTR, XX1, the new XTR discs, Syntace, Edge/Enve, etc etc WAY before any of my local stores did. That's annoying."

    Not everyone has all the time in the world to sit at the computer and research new products. Most bosses don't want to pay there mechanics to surf the net, and most mechanics would rather be riding when not wrenching.
    Every store I've been to has a website, they have a Facebook site, they have a Twitter site. I see guys/mechanics checking their phones, Ipads, laptops constantly. I don't have any of that. Everyone thinks they're busy but they spend their time doing nothing.
    As far as being an internet nerd. I want to deal with a totally obsessed bike geek if I'm buying parts. I want to deal with a nerd that knows everything about whatever I'm into. If I ask the shop guy about X and he has no idea what I'm talking about that's not good. If you want my business you better know more about the products you sell then I do. I shouldn't be telling you there's an update for Di2. You should know that. That's your job.

  61. #61
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    I try to buy local. but one LBS I now refuse to go to always marks their inventory above MSRP. They put their own UPC decal with the higher price on the tag. They will not ever budge on the price. And they always try to up-sell me without answering my questions.

    Point in fact, I went to go look at a new 2012 road bike, that was the same price as this years model (no discount). when I asked about a very specific bike and model, the clerk grabbed a $6000 road bike from the rack and started telling how great THIS bike was without even talking to me about the other bike, no comparison. Nothing.

    I then asked if there was going to be a discount or sale on last years bikes, he replied: "if we have any left in inventory". I pointed at a entire rack of bikes some were from 2011. I literally received no answer from the guy, he just looked confused like a "where did these come from?" look. So I left. every time I walk into that store it's just so frustrating.

  62. #62
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    Re: Why I don't buy local

    Started reading this thread and had to giggle a bit. I support lbs all I can. It nice too cause their prices are close to avg online pricing, usually max of 10% maybe 15% higher. Like i got '13 slx 2/3x10 shifters and they charged me like $8 more than I could find them online for. Personally if at all possible I buy lbs even with counting pennies cause money is tight.

    Now its possible obviously to get places that rape u on parts prices but that's why u do your homework first. Don't judge all lbs on one dude with insane prices.

    Sent from my HTC Sensation Z710e using Tapatalk 2

  63. #63
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    Like I said, there are some really lame LBSs out there... a couple near me are just so bad that I have even stopped going there in an emergency. I would rather drive to the good ones way downtown than get frustrated in those.
    It's all Here. Now.

  64. #64
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    I like deals, (who doesnt?) , 90% deals are online..so i buy most of my stuff online and i wrench my own bike like 95%.
    I do like to read about mtb online, so many times, I know better than the guy that work at lbs. not everybody hv much time reading mtb online, so maybe those people mostly go to lbs.
    also many times my lbs dont hv the stuff I want, hv to wait a week or so, and price is a bit higher too. online is just so convenience. from bike, to bike rack, to stan, wheelset, shorts, even chainlube i got from online. some small stuff I got from lbs, on their clearance racks.

  65. #65
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    let me clarify. I was a service manager that serviced motor vehicles. the premise is still the same as far as mark up. like I said, i get it that a 1 dollar product can be upcharged 200-400%or more. So I understand tubes, slime, and other small dollar items can be upcharged that much.

    I can see the majority of the people only read the first line of any comment and definitly have that elitest snobby attitude on this website nt just from this thread but many others. So far I have enjoyed the sport, however, I have not enjoyed the community as a whole.

  66. #66
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    I do not support any local bike shops and I have no problem with that. I'm a former mechanic so I do all my own work in my own shop and I get almost all my parts online. I've don't know how many thousands of dollars I've saved avoiding bike shops. I'll only go to a bike shop if I'm in a bind and need a part immediately. Otherwise, I steer clear of local shops.

    I worked in outdoor retail for a while and it turned me off to the whole industry.
    Vermonter - bikes, beers and skis.

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by limba View Post
    I shouldn't be telling you there's an update for Di2. You should know that. That's your job.
    I'd never make it in the business because I'd be telling you the update for Di2 is to revert back to good old reliable cables.
    Chasing bears through the woods drunk with a dull hatchet is strongly not advised

  68. #68
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    It should really be only about a 40-50% markup. Anything more than that, you might as well just tell them to shop online.

  69. #69
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    It took a half an hour for me to get these prices from my local store yesterday. It wasn't their fault, it's summer and they were busy but ... anyway ...

    Local XT discs $375 Online $220
    Local XTR discs $599 Online $406

    Easy choice for me.

  70. #70
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    I just checked the receipt from when I had my bike built in March by a LBS.

    They charged me $40 for a 1/2" aluminum stem spacer.

  71. #71
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    Why I don't buy local

    Quote Originally Posted by VTSession View Post
    I do not support any local bike shops and I have no problem with that. I'm a former mechanic so I do all my own work in my own shop and I get almost all my parts online. I've don't know how many thousands of dollars I've saved avoiding bike shops. I'll only go to a bike shop if I'm in a bind and need a part immediately. Otherwise, I steer clear of local shops.

    I worked in outdoor retail for a while and it turned me off to the whole industry.
    Same. I've learned to do all my own work, and I scour the web for the best prices. Otherwise, I couldn't afford to ride the bikes I ride.

    I appreciate the LBS and there's nothing better than a cool shop. I love it. Unfortunately many aren't so cool. I worked at a shop for a number of years, and 100% markup (retail=double wholesale) was pretty standard as a baseline, margins were smaller far more often then they were bigger. The higher cost hardgoods often only had 35 or 40% profit if we sold them at retail, which we rarely could. The margin on bikes was especially bad. Any real money was made on softgoods and service. Owning a bikes shop frankly, is a crappy way to make a living if you're after money.

    Lastly, one disadvantage for small shops is volume. The more you buy and sell, the cheaper you can purchase product for and the higher your margins. Smaller shops pay more for product because they can't buy and sell the higher volume.

  72. #72
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    I am all for finding a local business and establishing a working relationship. We all need the occasional part or service NOW and utilizing these business for that purpose is great. But don't tell me I need to SUPPORT my LBS. I live in an area with probably 25+ bike shops. Nobody forced those shops to go into business and they do so knowing that they have to compete with the Internet as well as the shop down the street. Most shops order parts from the same places, BTI being the biggest I think, and therefore pay about the same for the parts they stock or special order. Larger multi-location shops may get a better deal from the "middleman" due to volume purchasing. Knowing that, I shopped at a LBS years ago that would charge me 15% over what they purchased for on special orders just to have my business. It was no skin off their back and they were making a few bucks just to order the part. This was before the Internet.

    I buy where I get the best deal...period! I don't feel an obligation to buy at a LBS just because they are in business. But if they have the best deal, they get my $$.

  73. #73
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    Damn! My ass would have walked right on out laughing

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