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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by bachman1961 View Post
    I'd say it's default 'we' get the attention we deserve- (how I feel about most any traffic related LEO encounter I've had) and this guy was either seen drinking or his driving ablility wa a clue.
    Yeah.

    For those who know the area, it was the southern parking area at Horsetooth in Fort Collins where the Blue Sky trail meets the Inlet Bay trail. I also saw multiple groups of people at the Inlet Bay parking area who were sitting in plain view of the road, drinking a beer.

    You'd think people would try to be a bit less obvious. First big weekend of the year at a place with a huge amount of tourist traffic (every campsite at Horsetooth was full).
    Death from Below.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    No joke, after reading this thread yesterday, I was pedaling home and what did I see?

    One of the guys I saw drinking in the parking lot after his ride doing a field sobriety test.
    And I bet someone saw them and called his plate in.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Yeah.

    For those who know the area, it was the southern parking area at Horsetooth in Fort Collins where the Blue Sky trail meets the Inlet Bay trail. I also saw multiple groups of people at the Inlet Bay parking area who were sitting in plain view of the road, drinking a beer.

    You'd think people would try to be a bit less obvious. First big weekend of the year at a place with a huge amount of tourist traffic (every campsite at Horsetooth was full).
    And I know the area. Just stupidity with so many out and about doing in plain sight. All it takes is someone calling your plate in and cops are all over it.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    That's probably a lot more fair. I just think demonizing people who get together and have a beer or two after a ride now and then is a little over the top. I'm not talking about getting drunk, or alcoholism, but a few beers with good friends can be an enjoyable occasion (for some) and hurts no one.

    ymmv
    I'm not demonizing. I just stated that it does nothing positive. There is no benefit for your health, finances, If you feel you need a beer to socialize, that's a problem. You don't need one or two just to hang out. Maybe you like to drink beer like some people like to drink a shake? That's fine. But you can't honestly make the argument that drinking a chocolate shake has any positives can you? If you enjoy drinking them, fine. Luckily for me, I can't stand the taste of beer. My idea of drinking is getting totally smashed, I don't see the point of drinking alcohol if not to get fvcked up.

    I don't demonize people who drink, I just point out the flaws in their justifications. If you want to be demonized, go talk to a recovering alcoholic...those guys will really demonize you.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    But you can't honestly make the argument that drinking a chocolate shake has any positives can you?.
    Honestly, chocolate shakes taste positively delicious.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    I'm not demonizing. I just stated that it does nothing positive. There is no benefit for your health, finances, If you feel you need a beer to socialize, that's a problem. You don't need one or two just to hang out. Maybe you like to drink beer like some people like to drink a shake? That's fine. But you can't honestly make the argument that drinking a chocolate shake has any positives can you? If you enjoy drinking them, fine. Luckily for me, I can't stand the taste of beer. My idea of drinking is getting totally smashed, I don't see the point of drinking alcohol if not to get fvcked up.

    I don't demonize people who drink, I just point out the flaws in their justifications. If you want to be demonized, go talk to a recovering alcoholic...those guys will really demonize you.


    Good Lord, you must be flawless.

    JK, if your idea of drinking is getting totally smashed and you can't imagine that drinking a chocolate milkshake can be enjoyable, and therefore a positive experience then I just don't know what to say.

    I'm not attempting to justify anything, and I don't "need" beer to socialize any more I need guacamole to enjoy a burrito. Sometimes it's nice though.
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  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    My idea of drinking is getting totally smashed, I don't see the point of drinking alcohol if not to get fvcked up.
    I love beer (see the Beer & Bikes thread), but this thinking is just stupid, lm really lost with this comment.

    I typed a lot and deleted it, totally not worth the time.
    always mad and usually drunk......

  8. #108
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    There's the idiom, "you can lead a hose to water, but you can't make it drink."

    In this case, it means you can show people who drink beer and other alcoholic drinks all sorts of reasons for them to stop doing so, but you can't make them stop.

    Ask a beer drinker, "true or false: alcohol is addictive."

    That word, addictive, makes people put up their defenses, since it's related to a failure of a system that has done so much wrong about addressing addiction. It would not surprise me if a significant number said false, that they personally don't have a problem with alcohol, and/or go as far as saying there's nothing wrong with an occasional drink.

    My only real hope is that people don't have a reason to start drinking in the first place. That and I guess whatever plan higher ups got to curb fentanyl abuse, may be a breakthrough in policy/procedure to address other kinds of addiction. While they're at it, can maybe find a better fix to stupidity...

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by ninjichor View Post
    There's the idiom, "you can lead a hose to water, but you can't make it drink."

    In this case, it means ...
    Say what?!

  10. #110
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    never. I don't like beer that much, and it is probably one of the worst things to have after hard exercise. I have no idea how it became so central to the MTB community. some of the guys I ride with don't understand the idea of riding without drinking. seems dumb. I don't know many other athlete groups that drink immediately after exercise.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by ninjichor View Post
    There's the idiom, "you can lead a hose to water, but you can't make it drink."

    In this case, it means you can show people who drink beer and other alcoholic drinks all sorts of reasons for them to stop doing so, but you can't make them stop.

    Ask a beer drinker, "true or false: alcohol is addictive."

    That word, addictive, makes people put up their defenses, since it's related to a failure of a system that has done so much wrong about addressing addiction. It would not surprise me if a significant number said false, that they personally don't have a problem with alcohol, and/or go as far as saying there's nothing wrong with an occasional drink.

    My only real hope is that people don't have a reason to start drinking in the first place. That and I guess whatever plan higher ups got to curb fentanyl abuse, may be a breakthrough in policy/procedure to address other kinds of addiction. While they're at it, can maybe find a better fix to stupidity...



    My but this thread is depressing, think I'll drink a 12-pack and get raging drunk. My alcohol addiction is pretty horrible but my food addiction is even worse.
    I brake for stinkbugs

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrailGoat View Post
    I don't know many other athlete groups that drink immediately after exercise.
    You should see the skiing and snowboarding communities: Bloody Mary to start the day, beer on the chairlift, bong hit at lunch, then by mid afternoon itís apres time.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    You should see the skiing and snowboarding communities: Bloody Mary to start the day, beer on the chairlift, bong hit at lunch, then by mid afternoon itís apres time.
    Iíve see it for 40 plus years of skiing. And youíre right itís one big party. Most stay the night in a condo or lodge but there are plenty that get smashed over an 8 hour day then drive the 3 hours home. Drunk plus huge physical exertion over that length of time makes for a bad combo driving for hours home. Half of which is on mountainous roads. Definitely way more of a party scene than spending 1/2 an hour post ride mtbing with a beer or two.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Iíve see it for 40 plus years of skiing. And youíre right itís one big party. Most stay the night in a condo or lodge but there are plenty that get smashed over an 8 hour day then drive the 3 hours home. Drunk plus huge physical exertion over that length of time makes for a bad combo driving for hours home. Half of which is on mountainous roads. Definitely way more of a party scene than spending 1/2 an hour post ride mtbing with a beer or two.
    It can make for some hazardous situations while on the hill too.

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    It can make for some hazardous situations while on the hill too.
    No doubt, liquid courage and bad decision making.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    29 people a day die from DUI related accidents. Either they die, or kill someone. Its like a pretty severe mass shooting, but every single day.

    I'll flat out own up to it. I cant drink just one beer. Ill drink all the beers. I would take very serious notice of yourself if you cant have just one beer after a ride. I cant count the amount of times ive had 3 or 4 post ride IPA's and hopped straight in my car! Thats absolutely DUI territory.

    I dont drink anymore since I really cant do it responsibly. The fact is that millions of you guys can drink a beer after a ride and drive home perfectly fine and under the limit. Great. I cant. The guy in the OP's story couldnt either. If you cant too, Its kinda nice being able to learn someone elses lesson instead of having a DUI ruin your life too.

    If you cant have just one, Its seriously time to stop drinking in the parking lot.
    ^ My story as well, and I appreciate this post.
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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Good Lord, you must be flawless.
    I'm pretty good, humble too

    I didn't say a milkshake isn't enjoyable, but I don't need one after my riding while chatting with my friends. If you like the drink, fine (which I already put in that clause to begin with). But I also said that neither actually does anything positive, I don't need a shake to feel good. It doesn't do anything positive in my life, except maybe a very short pleasure response. But I have a problem with eating too much junk for that same reason, short term pleasure for no benefit.

    Quote Originally Posted by cmg View Post
    I love beer (see the Beer & Bikes thread), but this thinking is just stupid, lm really lost with this comment.
    Because my idea of drinking alcohol is to feel the full effects of alcohol? Why is that more stupid than drinking alcohol to only kinda feel the effects? I stated that I don't like beer. Is it socially acceptable to sip tequila (I kinda like the flavor of that)? I think the fact that you got defensive about me not enjoying beer shows more the issue on your side, not mine. I don't like beer, so I don't drink it. But let me point out a couple of things you are advertising, while being defensive about your drinking:

    Quote Originally Posted by cmg View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg View Post
    always mad and usually drunk......
    I understand JB's beer after a ride, I know a lot of people that do that. I don't do it because I don't like the flavor, and I'm not interested in getting intoxicated.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by ninjichor View Post
    In this case, it means you can show people who drink beer and other alcoholic drinks all sorts of reasons for them to stop doing so, but you can't make them stop.

    Ask a beer drinker, "true or false: alcohol is addictive."

    That word, addictive, makes people put up their defenses, since it's related to a failure of a system that has done so much wrong about addressing addiction. It would not surprise me if a significant number said false, that they personally don't have a problem with alcohol, and/or go as far as saying there's nothing wrong with an occasional drink.

    I don't get it,, are you saying my one beer a day (an average that could be 8 -9 in a busy week or 4 or 5 in another as sipped , enjoyed for flavor not effect and purposefully not consumed in short order to get a buzz fits your idea of drinking problem, an addict or an alcoholic ?

    Aren't you the same person that said you hang around folks you are not comfortable with because (you believe) they drink too much to share the roads safety ?

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjichor;
    Always did bother me how people would drink beers post-ride, then drive. Just knew that I'd face the wrath of many if I spoke too strongly about it.

    I just figure that when people are left to make their own choices, all there is to stop them from making questionable decisions is their own conscious/morals*, and conformity bias. I'm just glad that I socialize with people who don't "hammer down the nail that sticks out" (proverb about how peers pressure others into conformity), and respects my individual choice to not participate
    I hike and bike with guys who are fun to get out with and good friends. Some have a beer , some don't. Iced coffee , soda and water are all popular choices. No judgement or pressure, we were there to meet for the Hike or the Bike Ride.
    The only thing ever mentioned is an offer of beverage by those that bring or have extra.
    There are times we don't plan for a cool down chat afterward or have time for it. It's all play it by ear and no pressure.

    Also, this :

    I dont drink anymore since I really cant do it responsibly. The fact is that millions of you guys can drink a beer after a ride and drive home perfectly fine and under the limit. Great. I cant. The guy in the OP's story couldnt either. If you cant too,

    Its kinda nice being able to learn someone elses lesson

    instead of having a DUI ruin your life too.


    Amen.
    Learn from experience - Someone Else's !!
    Last edited by bachman1961; 4 Weeks Ago at 07:39 PM.
    bachman must spread some Reputation around before giving it to himself again.


  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    blah blah blah
    yeah you got me, profiles & sigs l made when I joined, but life has changed for me drastically, and since l havent used a computer to view MTBR in a long long time l dont see them, l use Tapatalk, either way maybe you should view my posts to see how "passed out" and "drunk" l am

    Whereas you stated when you drink you do it to excess, because thats the "point"

    I also didnt put you down for not liking beer (that would also be known as homophobic ), you not liking beer is irrelevant to me, its better you dont like it cause it means more for me

    Have fun with my post, but know this: l dont g.a.f and would ride with you anyday (might just limit the alcohol after the ride)
    always mad and usually drunk......

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    If I got a DUI or DWI, I'd lose my job. So, I don't drink after riding. Or at all, really. Whether it's in a parking lot or a local pub/eatery. I'd rather ride for 3 hours than ride for 2 and drink beers for an hour and a half.

    But, I also don't understand the connection that some people have between riding a bicycle and consuming alcohol in general. Some of the threads on this forum, or some of the regional sub-forums, make me think that there are some people that can't make it through a ride, from leaving their house to getting back home, without a couple of drinks in them. The two have no connection to me. I don't "get it".
    Quote Originally Posted by mik_git View Post
    This


    and this...

    I just don't get it. Just done a big ride, am knackered, the last thing I want is a beer.
    I noticed this drinking tied in with an activity too. In golf, or softball, or bowling.
    I'm not knocking alcohol consumption, but more on the insistence on performing an activity impaired.

    It's more semantics really, one should say, "I'm going out drinking with my friends, but we might toss a ball around and run some bases too" or "going out drinking, might roll a ball down to knock some pins over"

    I get that the OP's situation was more of a post workout celebratory drink. Unfortunately, driving home was still on the agenda.

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    I didn't say a milkshake isn't enjoyable
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    But you can't honestly make the argument that drinking a chocolate shake has any positives can you?
    On my planet, a milkshake that is enjoyable is something that is considered to be positive.

  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrailGoat View Post
    I don't know many other athlete groups that drink immediately after exercise.
    Ummm. Bowling, golf (don't know if either of those count as athletic), every adult soccer league I have played in, ultimate frisbee, in my experience runners.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    in my experience, nothing positive for anyone else either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    My idea of drinking is getting totally smashed, I don't see the point of drinking alcohol if not to get fvcked up.
    Maybe the reason that you see nothing positive in drinking is cause you don't see a point of drinking if not to get fvcked up....

    Granted alcohol doesn't really have positive health affects (although supposedly some red wine is good for you) but at the same time I think there is something to be said for having a little treat for yourself every now whether it is alcohol or a milkshake. There are much worse things to do to your body that many people do daily.

    I personally enjoy craft beers and I find that they bring joy to my life. I like trying new ones and savoring an old favorite. That being said I only have one unless I am going to be somewhere for a long time.
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  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by og-mtb View Post
    On my planet, a milkshake that is enjoyable is something that is considered to be positive.

    Mine too. Also chocolate milkshakes are considered by many as a great recovery drink, so there's that too.

    https://www.webmd.com/fitness-exerci...-after-workout
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  24. #124
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    I don't drink at the trail heads. I do take an oil can with me on my favorite trail that is 7 miles up hill and then 9 miles downhill. I crack it at the top of the climb to reward myself.

    I ride from my house most of the time so there are very few trail heads involved in the sport for me.

  25. #125
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    There's beer drinking, and then there's what you decide to be before it. The pre-drinking activity is kinda like foreplay in that it enhances the eventual beer consumption. One pre-beer activity I've tried is looking at the clock and declaring, "It's after noon somewhere." The subsequent imbibing was not very gratifying. Drinking while sitting on the couch watching professional team sports wasn't much better. Eventually I came to realize, as I think many of us here have, that the best lead-up to a couple of beers is a good bout of strenuous physical activity, with friends or in a group, preferably outdoors, and especially with a healthy dose of eustress. There are quite a few activities that qualify, and of course, mtbing is one of the best.

    This is somewhat OT, as the OP is about post beer drinking activities (i.e. driving) and the decisions and consequences surrounding that.
    Do the math.

  26. #126
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    I used to drink frequently, but really have never imbibed after a ride. Donít know why, but none of my riding partners drank post ride, either.

    Weird, maybe trail head beers isnít a Massachusetts thing.

    These days post ride drinks consist of leftover coffee and Gatorade.




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    Quote Originally Posted by ravewoofer View Post
    I used to drink frequently, but really have never imbibed after a ride. Donít know why, but none of my riding partners drank post ride, either.

    Weird, maybe trail head beers isnít a Massachusetts thing.

    These days post ride drinks consist of leftover coffee and Gatorade.




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    I think with the onset of craft beer in the last decade the areas with a lot of breweries enhance the amount of mountain bikers who connect the two together. Look at the OPís friend. They are from Northern California, a Mecca for craft beer. My area of Northern Colorado is as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    I started this same topic in a regional forum but wanted to bring this up here as well:

    So I was at the local trail - club ride on Wednesday. A good friend said he was not drinking beer and I asked why. He said he got a post-ride DUI on Highway 85 on Dec 27. Two and half good beers for his 170lb body got him to .08 blood/alcohol level.

    His life has been turned upside down with $7k expenses so far, jail, pending trial and 20 days of labor possible. I talked to him for 20 minutes and got all the details.

    Things I learned:

    - 2 .5 IPAs, post-ride got him to .08 level

    - 6 months of misery until it's all behind him

    - about 20 days of duty, usually labor clean-up. Community service will be around double that since easier work

    - CHP treated him like a career criminal

    - the longer you wait for the breathalyzer test, the more your blood alcohol rises for about 3 hours

    - after Jan 1, 2019, they need to install an expensive breathalyzer device on your car to start it.

    - can take away your license on the spot, before trial

    - Just because you're under .08, doesn't mean you're in the clear.

    So this is just a share of what I learned a couple days ago. If you have more info to add/correct, please do so. It is a tough subject since it's part of what we do... ie, me.

    We try to drink responsibly and this is the first-case (that I know of) in my circle. The shame/guilt is intense so I'm glad he shared with me.

    Thoughts? You have a post-ride beer at the parking lot, brewery or not at all?Attachment 1247561



    You're not so subtly trying to paint this person as a "victim" of some sort of Orwellian police state witch hunt. It's not. He chose to drink and drive. Now he's facing the consequences. It's just that simple.

    I see the same types of posts with regards to ticketing on the UCSC trails and elsewhere.

    Many posters believe they are above the law. They are not.

  29. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by ravewoofer View Post
    Weird, maybe trail head beers isnít a Massachusetts thing.

    Not much of a thing where I'm at either, I generally go to a proper facility. Generally that's home for me but sometimes a restaurant/bar.


    Gatorade? Now that stuff will kill you
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  30. #130
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    And letís not forget the drinking that goes on at the golf courses.

    The post-ride DUI-542576a7-9f66-4ff3-9b1c-d6cdebea37b3.jpeg
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  31. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    And letís not forget the drinking that goes on at the golf courses.
    ever been to a Darts tournament?
    always mad and usually drunk......

  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg View Post
    ever been to a Darts tournament?
    Aiming fluid

  33. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg View Post
    ever been to a Darts tournament?
    Lol
    Yes, I stood way in the back behind the contestants.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  34. #134
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    Closed for review

  35. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVL-MTB View Post
    Closed for review
    I went through and removed all the off-topic posts by OG and DJ. Seriously, both of you... knock it off. you both drug this conversation way off-topic for no reason.

    I am re-opening this thread.


    My Tuesday group meets at my house and we ride to the trail head, do our ride and end back at my place. We then spend a few hours sharing some brews and snacks. I have some very small mason jar looking mugs, like 3-4oz tops per fill. We generally have a few bombers or a few 12oz cans and share them using the tiny glasses. This helps the group to keep better track of how much they are drinking. I trust them to know what their own limits are before they get in a vehicle and go home. In the 10 years I have been doing that no one has had a DUI or anything close. Perhaps the small tasting glasses help curb over consumption?

    It is a tricky thing because every person is different. I am 217lbs right now and it takes more for me to feel the effects than others who are much lighter in weight than me. Everyone in my group is an adult and has to make their own choices.


    Also to think the police don't break the same laws they enforce is foolish. My ex-brother in law showed up at my house for the first family dinner my newlywed wife and I held. He IS a Bakersfield PD Officer. He brought a 6 pack with him, Drank half of it and was bummed I did not have more beer for him in the house(I was 19 years old), so he asked me to go with him to the store to get more. I was young and wanted to get to know him, this was really my first time hanging out with him. He brought his 4th beer with him and put it in the cup holder of his truck and drank it on the way to the store. It was a real eye-opener to me. Turns out that was a very good representation of the type of human being he was, so glad my sister-in-law divorced him. I can't stand that guy, he eventually was promoted to a Detective and is still serving on the force. I doubt anything has changed.

    I am not sure I would engage in a habit of drinking at the trail-head.
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  36. #136
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    Up until recently, I frequently had one beer after the ride with whomever I rode with, if they wanted, then went home. Never more than one.

    But my living situation changed a couple months ago, and I have stopped even the one beer thing. I wait to get home if I am going to have a beer.

    Many would say even one beer is too much before getting behind the wheel, and I would not argue the point with them. The statistics related to alcohol related fatalities and injuries are too much to ignore.

  37. #137
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    Thanks, K. I just got in the house.

  38. #138
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    Iíd like to plead the fifth on who took this thread way off topic but I canít. I would hope you looked deep and saw how it went off topic and who kept instigating it to continue.

    Iíve never been one to drink post ride at the trailhead, Iíve seen plenty do it. I have on occasion met up with fellow riders at a restaurant for some grub an a brew or two. Not a wise choice and after having friends get DUIís and seeing what theyíve been put through itís something I try not to do. Iíll stop and meet up for some food but the alcohol can wait until I get home.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  39. #139
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    Iíll let you guys in on a little secret; I actually drink far less than I let on here.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    Iíll let you guys in on a little secret; I actually drink far less than I let on here.
    Iíll let you in on a little secret...I drink more than I let on. You guys sound like lightweights...especially Klurejr

  41. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    Iíll let you guys in on a little secret; I actually drink far less than I let on here.
    lol ,,, No doubt many of our posts or adventures we write about take on a bit more interest and fun when we can be a bit boastful about details.


    Also of note;
    One of the 'exchanges' here on this thread was a sort of literal interpretation of one's signature line. Many of the sigs are just plain funny or somewhat baiting but I think that commentary was in jest.


    Klurejr- Good real-world example of how to do up a get together with beers or whatever and be smart about it. After all, there are simply no guarantees about anything.

    DJ - If time were not a constraint, I like the idea of a burger and a beer after riding.
    -No worry of being seen in the lot having a post ride beer
    -Beer goes well with almost any food I eat, I've worked up an appetite and never ride on a full stomach anyways and lastly, having food on the tummy with a beer is a better scenario. I'm truly a lightweight, know it and account for it.
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  42. #142
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    Idea: Pack two beers in the Camelbak as well as all your riding buddies can pack theirs. Stop a mile before the trailhead and hike-A-bike off trail out of sight and have a party where no other hiker or rider will see you call the cops. Or just donít drink after riding.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  43. #143
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    Quote Originally Posted by ninjichor View Post
    There's the idiom, "you can lead a hose to water, but you can't make it drink."

    In this case, it means you can show people who drink beer and other alcoholic drinks all sorts of reasons for them to stop doing so, but you can't make them stop.

    Ask a beer drinker, "true or false: alcohol is addictive."

    That word, addictive, makes people put up their defenses, since it's related to a failure of a system that has done so much wrong about addressing addiction. It would not surprise me if a significant number said false, that they personally don't have a problem with alcohol, and/or go as far as saying there's nothing wrong with an occasional drink.

    My only real hope is that people don't have a reason to start drinking in the first place. That and I guess whatever plan higher ups got to curb fentanyl abuse, may be a breakthrough in policy/procedure to address other kinds of addiction. While they're at it, can maybe find a better fix to stupidity...
    This just sounds like what you hear in AA, everyone is an alcoholic that drinks, anything, anytime. Just because you have a problem does not mean we all do. It is about making you put up your defenses and blame everyone for your failures. We that drink a few beers a week or after a ride are not the problem, you are.
    I'm sick of all the Irish stereotypes, as soon as I finish this beer I"m punching someone

  44. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    If I got a DUI or DWI, I'd lose my job. So, I don't drink after riding. Or at all, really. Whether it's in a parking lot or a local pub/eatery. I'd rather ride for 3 hours than ride for 2 and drink beers for an hour and a half.

    But, I also don't understand the connection that some people have between riding a bicycle and consuming alcohol in general. Some of the threads on this forum, or some of the regional sub-forums, make me think that there are some people that can't make it through a ride, from leaving their house to getting back home, without a couple of drinks in them. The two have no connection to me. I don't "get it".
    If I get a DUI I'd have to go into a program for "impaired physicians" and probably have my license to prescribe or order controlled substances suspended for the duration.

    I have also seen many of the more dire consequences of impaired driving and my sympathy is modulated somewhat. Yeah, 0.08 is not a huge amount of alcohol and it's a long way from the guy I saw a few months ago driving with a BAC of 0.45.

    To be fair I had my last alcoholic drink in 1988.

  45. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kolchak View Post
    What if you are involved in an accident on the way home but still below the limit? If someone claims injury and that it's your fault you could wind up spending a lot of money defending yourself for a long time over a beer. It's just not worth it anymore. People sue if they think they have any chance of getting money. With a good lawyer it doesn't matter who's fault it is because they get paid either way so it's in their best interest to keep the case going, and if you had alcohol in your system you have to work twice as hard to defend yourself.
    This is so true.

    My post-ride drink is chocolate milk. Occasionally an iced-coffee.

  46. #146
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    I don't mean this in a flippant way, I think there is something to it.

    I'm starting to think the thing I'm missing is a lack of understanding like the flip side of those in AA. I've heard time and time again and I DO believe it, alcoholics say you can't understand it unless you've been there or went through it. ie; It's not one drink or a few beers or glasses of wine, there is just no stopping or wanting to quit, drink til it's gone or consumer is passed out.

    It's apparent that for some, (not specific to anyone or group or AA) it may be incomprehensible to think of someone having a beer or a drink for the pure simplicity of flavor and enjoyment in that the love or quest for alcohol or a buzz just simply isn't there.
    Alcohol as part and parcel / ingedients has proven to me it's flavor benefit by a simple blind taste test of 6% abv verses the 3.5 with something as slim in flavoring as a Bud Light Platinum.

    I'll take a guess a 'foodie' takes gormet to a level of enjoyment and some prefer quality cigars or wines in the same way. That mental vacation where you just want to savor the moments and enjoy something premium. Out in nature under a bright or dark blue sky with a slight breeze and time for your body to rest ? Sure why not. Food and bev always tastes better outside.

    The fact that I can enjoy a beer I like in that way it's safe and not harming me in a health or medical way (that I know of) is good enough.
    My bike ride isn't better, more fun or in need of a post ride beer. That enjoyment stands on it's own and needs no connection. This is why I belive everyone else can (and hopefully does) enjoy their bike rides or the entire experience just as much. It's what you make of it. If someone is defining it for you, it's time to GiddyUp.


    btw, Please don't think my mention of that enjoyment is throwing it in anyone's face, especially those that have had run in's or any problems with drink. I sincerely appreciate the candid posts and honesty in the spirit it's intended and shared.
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  47. #147
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    no beers for me after a ride, usually have an hour or so to drive so if I want a beer or two it can wait.

  48. #148
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    Quite a few critters in the wild like alcohol...some rodents, birds, insects... Perhaps they evolved a taste for it consuming it incidentally in fermented plant matter. Whatever the cause, they will go after it if available. A taste for it has deep evolutionary roots.
    Do the math.

  49. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    Quite a few critters in the wild like alcohol...some rodents, birds, insects... Perhaps they evolved a taste for it consuming it incidentally in fermented plant matter. Whatever the cause, they will go after it if available. A taste for it has deep evolutionary roots.
    Going on 40+ years ago, we had a Japanese beetle invasion in SoCal. We were advised to set out beer traps. One day found one of the dishes completely dry and our cat sleeping it off nearby.

    Can't really confirm he drank it, but sure looked funny.
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  50. #150
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    The OP's buddy may get 20 days hard labor? That's still a thing??
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  51. #151
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    Let's take this insanity line by line:

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Umm no, you trust those charts?
    They are a basis for understanding, not a hard and fast rule.

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    A couple of sips and you are on the edge of being over that low .08 level. A beer, a glass of wine, a shot or a mixed drink and you are over. A couple of sips is pretty much a drink, no?
    This is just wrong. No a couple of sips is not a drink, unless it's straight liquor. I've had the opportunity to use a breathalyzer while drinking on several occasions and it takes me about three to four normal beers to get to over that limit. Some friends went close to six.

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Besides most cops only need smell it on you and you are treated like a criminal. Out in the street taking all their tests. Questioned repeatedly, calling for a backup cop to come because the cop doesnt have a portable breathalyzer. Hauled in and given another breathalyzer at the station. Yes .08 is nothing and it doesnít take much to get there. And it doesnít even take for a cop to witness bad driving.
    Sounds like they're treating you like someone who may have committed a crime, that's their job.

    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Another citizen can call your plate in and the cops will be waiting on your street for you to arrive. Even the people serving the alcohol can get your name off your credit card and call it in to the cops and the cops will be on your street waiting for you to come home.
    Again you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. I've called about drunk drivers on a few occasions and I can promise you they were not waiting for those people when they got home... I don't think they even looked for them at all.

    And now to perhaps the most ridiculous assertion of all - bartenders are calling in your name off a credit card so the police can arrest you when you get home... You do realized that bar tender would be criminally and civilly liable because they knowingly over-served a customer and allowed them to drive. I can't believe you typed out such a ridiculous, demonstrably false claim.

    Sorry, you make lots of great posts on here, but this whole post is just nonsense.

  52. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Idea: Pack two beers in the Camelbak as well as all your riding buddies can pack theirs. Stop a mile before the trailhead and hike-A-bike off trail out of sight and have a party where no other hiker or rider will see you call the cops. Or just donít drink after riding.
    I much prefer a beer after the big climb and before the big descent to one in the parking lot... Partially because I know I'll digest it a bit more before driving that way.

  53. #153
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    I wonder what the OP's buddy did to get pulled over (swerving, speeding, etc.). Or did someone at the trail head call the cops after watching him drink a beer?

    Granted, Montana has some "permissive" attitudes about drinking (resulting in some horrible ratings by MADD and other watchdog groups) but I doubt our cops would even follow up on a report of someone drinking at a trail head - it's just a given that that happens.

  54. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by dir-T View Post
    I wonder what the OP's buddy did to get pulled over (swerving, speeding, etc.). Or did someone at the trail head call the cops after watching him drink a beer?
    It's been covered, he pulled over to take a leak in a pull out...unfortunately the same pullout that an officer was at taking a break.

  55. #155
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    Over the last several years as DUI/DWI has become such a talked-about thing and penalties have apparently gotten so severe, I've been wondering about roadside bars with large numbers of cars, trucks, and motorcycles parked outside on weekends. Roadhouses, some call 'em. You guys know the place - neon beer signs in all the windows, happy hour specials, deep-fried bar food to go along with draft beer in plastic cups, etc. - the kind of place a freshly-arrived Terminator might visit to obtain clothes, boots, and a motorcycle.

    Everyone knows people are sitting in these bars drinking and watching sports on TV and shooting pool and whatnot on Saturday and Sunday afternoons.

    Why don't the cops just set up DUI/DWI checkpoints a mile or two away from these places every Saturday and Sunday late afternoon/evening? It seems to me that those people are being almost as obvious about drinking and driving as post-ride MTBers described in this thread, such as...

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke
    I also saw multiple groups of people at the Inlet Bay parking area who were sitting in plain view of the road, drinking a beer.
    Cops would probably also fill a paddy wagon or two if they'd set up near boat ramps at lakes on weekend afternoons and pull over every pickup with a still-dripping boat on the trailer.

    And I'm not shouting for more DUI/DWI enforcement, but just sort of wondering at the whole situation. I mean, do they want to eliminate drunk driving, or just keep a lot of people doing community service and paying higher insurance premiums?

    For what it's worth, I'm old enough to remember when people would drink beer WHILE driving. Guys drove around with half-full beer cans held between their legs (before cupholders in cars were common) and threw the empties under the bench seat, down there with the lap-belt-only seatbelts that were never worn and empty cigarette packs. Guys in pickup trucks would toss their empty beer cans into the back of their pickup truck beds before popping open another or pulling into the nearest roadside gas station to buy another ice-cold tallboy.

    I'm not saying a return to those days are desirable, but it seems like enforcement is somewhat random, rather than targeted at places and times where everyone knows drinking and driving is occurring on a regular basis.

  56. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by og-mtb View Post
    This is nonsense.

    Folks who decide to drive after drinking too much are not any type of victim, let alone the victim of a "police state."
    That is a matter of perspective and opinion.

    What cannot be rightly denied is there are drivers with 10+ DWI who go through a revolving door and back on the road because they don't have enough assets to be worth fining and the prisons are at full capacity so it isn't worth keeping them behind bars. As time progresses the system acts more like a for-profit entity who is more interested in extracting all it can from the occasional line crosser while ignoring the habitual menaces to public safety.

  57. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeeze View Post
    Cops would probably also fill a paddy wagon or two if they'd set up near boat ramps at lakes on weekend afternoons and pull over every pickup with a still-dripping boat on the trailer.
    For realz.

  58. #158
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    You can hurt someone as an occasional line crosser.

    Just saying..

    As a disclaimer, like Finch said, I got very luck when I was younger, very. At almost 54 is not worth the risk.

    We had 1 beer after the OC ride in Vegas, but that was it.
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  59. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeeze View Post
    For what it's worth, I'm old enough to remember when people would drink beer WHILE driving. .
    I'm only 44 and I remember when that was LEGAL in my state. The state finally realized how much federal highway $ they were missing out on so made a law against is in the early 2000s.

  60. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeeze View Post
    Over the last several years as DUI/DWI has become such a talked-about thing and penalties have apparently gotten so severe, I've been wondering about roadside bars with large numbers of cars, trucks, and motorcycles parked outside on weekends. Roadhouses, some call 'em. You guys know the place - neon beer signs in all the windows, happy hour specials, deep-fried bar food to go along with draft beer in plastic cups, etc. - the kind of place a freshly-arrived Terminator might visit to obtain clothes, boots, and a motorcycle.

    Everyone knows people are sitting in these bars drinking and watching sports on TV and shooting pool and whatnot on Saturday and Sunday afternoons.

    Why don't the cops just set up DUI/DWI checkpoints a mile or two away from these places every Saturday and Sunday late afternoon/evening?
    The CHP does this in the small mountain town I live in and townspeople call the bar and let the bartender know, who then yells out a warning to those in the saloon. If someone drives by and honks twice, that's code for "CHP" skulking around. I walk there if I want a beer outside the house so my licence isn't affected, but on the other hand I sold my road bike mainly because of the drunk drivers, and soccer moms rushing little Jonny to practice.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

  61. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    I've called about drunk drivers on a few occasions and I can promise you they were not waiting for those people when they got home... I don't think they even looked for them at all.

    And now to perhaps the most ridiculous assertion of all - bartenders are calling in your name off a credit card so the police can arrest you when you get home... You do realized that bar tender would be criminally and civilly liable because they knowingly over-served a customer and allowed them to drive. I can't believe you typed out such a ridiculous, demonstrably false claim.

    Sorry, you make lots of great posts on here, but this whole post is just nonsense.
    Iím not even going to address the ones above this one, these two I will address. I know for a fact that when a license plate is called in the cops go straight to the residence and wait for the person to come driving down the street. I know of someone this happened to and he got a DUI right down the street from his residence. I live in a pretty small town and the cops are way overzealous to catch anyone doing anything wrong. Talk about embarrassing, many of his neighbors drove by as he was taking the drunk driving tests. Handcuffed and put in the back of a patrol car while a tow truck hauled his vehicle away. The cops wouldnít even allow it to sit on his own street. This town also lists arrests that happened around town and what they were charged with in the local newspaper every day, they just donít include names. So all his neighbors had to do was just look in the paper the next day to find out what he was charged with. As far as a bartender or waiter / waitress calling in a name off a CC of a patron who drank too much. I have no proof and I get what you are saying putting them liable for over serving. But whoís to say they couldnít call in anonymously. Itís rare that a bar is held accountable for over serving in a drunk driver arrest. If thereís a huge crash with innocent victims killed, then yes, it would be looked into.
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  62. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    The OP's buddy may get 20 days hard labor? That's still a thing??
    Picking up trash on the freeway or at a county park. They're known as the Weekend Warriors.
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  63. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by dir-T View Post
    I'm only 44 and I remember when that was LEGAL in my state. The state finally realized how much federal highway $ they were missing out on so made a law against is in the early 2000s.
    Itís still legal for passengers.

  64. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by evasive View Post
    Itís still legal for passengers.
    In CA you get a ticket for an open container.
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  65. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    In CA you get a ticket for an open container.
    I imagine itís that way in most states, but here a container in the immediate possession of a passenger is specifically excluded from the code. The statute also says it canít be tracked on your license or reported to insurance companies. That gives you an idea of how much foot dragging there was over it.

  66. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by evasive View Post
    I imagine itís that way in most states, but here a container in the immediate possession of a passenger is specifically excluded from the code. The statute also says it canít be tracked on your license or reported to insurance companies. That gives you an idea of how much foot dragging there was over it.
    Got it. If your profile is correct, its a place I want to visit.
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  67. #167
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    I believe in NV not only can the driver be ticketed for the passenger having an open container but the passenger can as well.

    Been reading through this and watching as things transpire. I have never been one to have a "road pop" regardless of at the trailhead or not. However, I am like some of the other riders in here that I know that especially after a ride I need food. While a good beer, I like IPAs, tastes fantastic afterwards, I ALWAYS do so with food. However, I also work with Law Enforcement and getting any sort of DUI would be an instant dismissal from my position. I may be able to appeal the dismissal but at that point the embarrassment would be more than I would want to handle.

    Just don't do it. Not worth it and NO BEER takes that good to jeopardize your livelihood. At dinner I may have one, on the rare occasion two, but for the most part I opt to be the driver and leave the fun to be had by others. Would rather have everyone able to ride with me again than risk the consequences.

  68. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Iím not even going to address the ones above this one, these two I will address. I know for a fact that when a license plate is called in the cops go straight to the residence and wait for the person to come driving down the street. I know of someone this happened to and he got a DUI right down the street from his residence. I live in a pretty small town and the cops are way overzealous to catch anyone doing anything wrong. Talk about embarrassing, many of his neighbors drove by as he was taking the drunk driving tests. Handcuffed and put in the back of a patrol car while a tow truck hauled his vehicle away. The cops wouldnít even allow it to sit on his own street. This town also lists arrests that happened around town and what they were charged with in the local newspaper every day, they just donít include names. So all his neighbors had to do was just look in the paper the next day to find out what he was charged with. As far as a bartender or waiter / waitress calling in a name off a CC of a patron who drank too much. I have no proof and I get what you are saying putting them liable for over serving. But whoís to say they couldnít call in anonymously. Itís rare that a bar is held accountable for over serving in a drunk driver arrest. If thereís a huge crash with innocent victims killed, then yes, it would be looked into.
    I was driving home from work and accidentally drifted into another lane. Some lady lost her shit and was honking and flashing her lights. About 10 miles later a cop was parked in the center divide, pulled me over and said he got a call I was drunk.
    It happens


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    By the the way, everybody here in Michigan drinks and drives. I work in Bay City where there is a bar on every corner with packed parking lots on the weekend. These folks are certainly getting in their cars over the legal limit.

    Laws and harsh penalties have certainly cut down on drinking and driving but people still risk it all the time and generally, if you think about it, are not caught.

    People smoke a lot of weed up here now also and are definitely impaired when they get in their cars.

    I'm see a lot of potheads and drunks coming to the ER with substance related problems and telling me that they can handle their alcohol and, lately, that Marijuana is healthy and has no health consequences.

  70. #170
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    I had the occasion to use breathalyzers years ago relative to healthcare situations and not for legal purposes. For just over 4 years, I dealt with a lot of the inner city type issues and alleged DUI, problem drinkers and the occasional OOPS !!
    Seen big folks that can't handle much drink and fly-weights that can.

    Depending on the variables of YOUR TOWN, USA, patrol and LEO resources may be somewhat aggressive or lacking. Timing how long a car is parked at a tavern sounds like different things to different people. Smart. Entrapment. Aggressive. LEO baring down on your bumper as if causing you/forcing you to speed sounds "nutty" but things happen in various locales defining a basis for understanding in those areas by locals who'd know.
    Definitely no hard fast rules on most of this stuff when it plays out somewhat inconsistently with what is familiar to us.

    As for this;

    As far as a bartender or waiter / waitress calling in a name off a CC of a patron who drank too much. I have no proof and I get what you are saying putting them liable for over serving. But whoís to say they couldnít call in anonymously. Itís rare that a bar is held accountable for over serving in a drunk driver arrest.

    A patron like that can easily mouth-off, make a scene or offend other customers or staff in a bar / lounge setting. Having that followed up by a caller to report it seems fairly likely if they jump in their car to drive away or are escorted out.

    I don't know what the 'machine' would show if I was tested 15 minutes after drinking a 1/2 of beer as 7% abv or two beers within 1 hour that were 5%. I do try to be safe about it and within .08 or newer standards pushing for .05 , we all need to be very careful.
    bachman must spread some Reputation around before giving it to himself again.


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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Iím not even going to address the ones above this one, these two I will address. I know for a fact that when a license plate is called in the cops go straight to the residence and wait for the person to come driving down the street. I know of someone this happened to and he got a DUI right down the street from his residence. I live in a pretty small town and the cops are way overzealous to catch anyone doing anything wrong. Talk about embarrassing, many of his neighbors drove by as he was taking the drunk driving tests. Handcuffed and put in the back of a patrol car while a tow truck hauled his vehicle away. The cops wouldnít even allow it to sit on his own street. This town also lists arrests that happened around town and what they were charged with in the local newspaper every day, they just donít include names. So all his neighbors had to do was just look in the paper the next day to find out what he was charged with. As far as a bartender or waiter / waitress calling in a name off a CC of a patron who drank too much. I have no proof and I get what you are saying putting them liable for over serving. But whoís to say they couldnít call in anonymously. Itís rare that a bar is held accountable for over serving in a drunk driver arrest. If thereís a huge crash with innocent victims killed, then yes, it would be looked into.
    That is more of a jurisdictional item/requirement/practice than anything else. If one person calls, dispatch normally will find an officer in the area to see if they see what is going on and can confirm what has happened. Hence why people get pulled over passing an officer on the street. If the plate is run and an officer is near the residence or there is an officer covering that area, they "MAY" go and wait to see if the person drives by. The reason I say MAY is because there is little to no guarantee that the person is driving to the residence listed on the plate. Plate can be registered to a complete different address, person could be headed elsewhere. There is just no guarantee. This is where small towns are different simply based on the "available" crime rate. In the first case listed, it sounds like the person you know was obviously in the wrong and we are back to the "don't do the crime if you can't do the time." With technology today, it is easy to call an Uber/Lyft or taxi to take you. Shit, it is better to call and wake and piss-off a friend to drive your drunk ass home.

    In most jurisdictions, if you are believed to be drunk (probable cause) and an officer witnesses you getting into a vehicle they have the right and authority to detain you at that point. Plain and simple this is to keep people that SHOULD NOT be driving off the road. Example of this would be an officer passing by a bar/restaurant and witnessing you staggering to your vehicle, keys in hand. The moment your key enters the lock they then have probable cause to detain you. MOST will wait to see if you get into the drivers seat as you potentially could be just grabbing something out of your vehicle. But that moment you walk towards a vehicle with keys in hand, you are then suspect. Again, the officers NUMBER 1 PRIORITY is to keep the public and themselves SAFE. This means that if there is a question in THEIR MIND as to the possible compromised abilities you may have due to close proximity of a bar/restaurant and you exhibit signs of being drunk, YOU WILL BE STOPPED.

    Perfect example, Few months ago the wife and I were having a nice dinner at around 9pm at a local pub. The pub is right on the main drag in town and the entire front of the pub is glass. We see a gentleman that is somewhat well dressed but acting very strange, dancing on the sidewalk, pacing up and down in front of the building, talking to himself, dancing more, having a conversation with a light pole, etc. We thought this was very odd and while all this happened a family friend that is part of the local SO drives by in his patrol vehicle. He stopped and came around the backside of the building to view what was going on. As he came around the other direction and the front of the building he noticed us, waved and then came in. We chatted for a moment while he observed the man doing the same things above for a few minutes before he bid us goodbye for the moment and went outside.

    After about 20 minutes he came back in to talk with us some more and say goodbye for the night. Turns out that there had been a couple calls from people on the road about the guy acting strange. Our friend witnessed it, though he was head to his normal patrol route and decided to stop and see what was going on. The initial summary was that the gentleman was either drunk or high. After going out and talking to him he found that he was neither, or at least exhibited no signs of either, the story that was given to him was that he had been in the car for 10+hrs and just got into town and was walking around, listening to some music to get the shakes out from the long car ride. His hotel was two blocks away and thus was not driving. After he complied with being asked for his ID and a quick name check was run that didn't yield any wants/warrants he was bid farewell, have a good night and that was it.

    This was nothing more than ensuring not only Public Safety but also his own. Since the main drag was right there, still semi busy they were just ensuring that A) he was not a danger to himself by walking out into traffic or falling and hurting himself, B) that he was not a danger to the public by potentially walking out into oncoming traffic and causing an accident, or causing a scene that could distract drivers and cause an accident, and C) was not doing anything else malicious like stalking a person, casing a local business, etc.

  72. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    Example of this would be an officer passing by a bar/restaurant and witnessing you staggering to your vehicle, keys in hand. The moment your key enters the lock they then have probable cause to detain you. MOST will wait to see if you get into the drivers seat as you potentially could be just grabbing something out of your vehicle. But that moment you walk towards a vehicle with keys in hand, you are then suspect.
    For the past several years I've been wondering about the above part specifically. Now that a lot of cars have "smart keys" where you leave the key fob in your pocket and just touch the door handle to unlock it, and you don't need a physical key to start the motor, is there still probable cause if there's no visible key (because it's in your pocket)? Could a person argue that he or she was just getting in the car to "sleep it off?"
    Last edited by Nat; 4 Weeks Ago at 06:08 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    For the past several years I've been wondering about the above part specifically. Now that a lot of cars have "smart keys" where you leave the key fob in your pocket and just touch the door handle to unlock it, and you don't need a physical key to start the motor, is there still probably cause if there's no visible key (because it's in your pocket)? Could a person argue that he or she was just getting in the car to "sleep it off?"
    Technically, in most jurisdictions if you are in the drivers seat that shows intent to drive which is considered probably cause. Many jurisdictions will actually go as far as if you enter the vehicle period. The whole "sleeping it off" in the vehicle is left to the interpretation of the officer(s) at hand, best bet is to not do it period.

    It used to be that the officer(s) would watch you with key in hand to see if you had difficulty putting the key into the door cylinder to operate the lock and open the door. Doing so would demonstrate an impaired capacity. However, with automatic door locks, keyless entry, etc. that has become more difficult. So many times, again based on the judgement of the officer(s), they will make the call before you enter the vehicle. In POST you are trained what to look for and how to make a judgement quickly. It takes mere seconds for someone to get into their vehicle, start it and be on the move, so an officer much make the judgement as quickly as possible. This seems to be a situation that most public/civilians/joeschmo don't understand and thus get pissed off as the officer is "harassing" them.

  74. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    Technically, in most jurisdictions if you are in the drivers seat that shows intent to drive which is considered probably cause. Many jurisdictions will actually go as far as if you enter the vehicle period. The whole "sleeping it off" in the vehicle is left to the interpretation of the officer(s) at hand, best bet is to not do it period.

    It used to be that the officer(s) would watch you with key in hand to see if you had difficulty putting the key into the door cylinder to operate the lock and open the door. Doing so would demonstrate an impaired capacity. However, with automatic door locks, keyless entry, etc. that has become more difficult. So many times, again based on the judgement of the officer(s), they will make the call before you enter the vehicle. In POST you are trained what to look for and how to make a judgement quickly. It takes mere seconds for someone to get into their vehicle, start it and be on the move, so an officer much make the judgement as quickly as possible. This seems to be a situation that most public/civilians/joeschmo don't understand and thus get pissed off as the officer is "harassing" them.
    Several years ago, I had a couple living two doors down that both had suspended licenses for DUI. His for sleeping in the car with the keys in his pocket in front of a house party. He hadn't been driving. Her's was for going out to a friend's car to grab a pack of smokes in the parking lot of a club. She had keys in her hand and was cuffed and stuffed. The car was not towed and the keys were returned to the owner. This was in So Cal.

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  75. #175
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    Greg, good info. thanks for chiming in. We live in great time when we have Uber and Lyft to call if there are any plans of any recreational drinking away from home.
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  76. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    Technically, in most jurisdictions if you are in the drivers seat that shows intent to drive which is considered probably cause. Many jurisdictions will actually go as far as if you enter the vehicle period. The whole "sleeping it off" in the vehicle is left to the interpretation of the officer(s) at hand, best bet is to not do it period.

    It used to be that the officer(s) would watch you with key in hand to see if you had difficulty putting the key into the door cylinder to operate the lock and open the door. Doing so would demonstrate an impaired capacity. However, with automatic door locks, keyless entry, etc. that has become more difficult. So many times, again based on the judgement of the officer(s), they will make the call before you enter the vehicle. In POST you are trained what to look for and how to make a judgement quickly. It takes mere seconds for someone to get into their vehicle, start it and be on the move, so an officer much make the judgement as quickly as possible. This seems to be a situation that most public/civilians/joeschmo don't understand and thus get pissed off as the officer is "harassing" them.
    Very interesting. Thanks for replying. I suppose with modern ďvan lifeĒ type rigs one could claim to be crawling in the back to sleep more convincingly than in a sedan. Again, subject to interpretation by the officer.

  77. #177
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    Most cops aren't monsters. If you're napping in the back seat of your car in a bar parking lot, they get it. That's substantially different than being passed out on the side of the freeway.

    The cops also know if youre shit canned, keys in hand, obviously drunk and wide awake, you're probably not headed to sleep it off.

  78. #178
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    I'd rather talk to a Uber driver than an Lawyer.

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    You're not talking about probable cause. You're talking about reasonable suspicion. Different legal theories. Generally, officers need only reasonable suspicion to make a traffic stop or a vehicle contact.

    States set laws for driving offenses, not municipalities in a general sense. There's a concept called "actual physical control." Commonly, a person would need to be in actual physical control of a vehicle in order to be charged with DUI. In Arizona, that would mean inside the vehicle with the vehicle running.

    In an above example, any good cop would certainly contact a person who appeared intoxicated and was attempting to get into a vehicle. That person generally could not be prosecuted for DUI. However, if that person could not understand common logic and pushed the issue, he or she could easily find himself arrested for some other charge, mostly to prevent him from driving away and killing himself or others.

    This is known as "talking yourself into jail."
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  80. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by ravewoofer View Post
    Weird, maybe trail head beers isnít a Massachusetts thing.
    Trailhead as well as trailside beers are most definitely a Massachusetts thing.
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  81. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    I'd rather talk to a Uber driver than an Lawyer.
    Wayyyy cheaper.

    Realistically though whoís going to call an Uber to get you and your bike from the trailhead after a beer? Best to not drink right before heading home.

  82. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    I much prefer a beer after the big climb and before the big descent to one in the parking lot... Partially because I know I'll digest it a bit more before driving that way.

    That I can't do but more power to you, for me cracking a beer means work or play is done and it's time to kick back and relax.


    Quote Originally Posted by natas1321 View Post
    no beers for me after a ride, usually have an hour or so to drive so if I want a beer or two it can wait.


    By the time I get home, shower, and fix a little food it's usually at least an hour. I still consider that having a beer after a ride but I guess it disqualifies me from a potential post-ride DUI.
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  83. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Pivot View Post
    Most cops aren't monsters. If you're napping in the back seat of your car in a bar parking lot, they get it. That's substantially different than being passed out on the side of the freeway.

    The cops also know if youre shit canned, keys in hand, obviously drunk and wide awake, you're probably not headed to sleep it off.
    It depends on where you are. Here in Taxifornia, I don't bring keys with me if I walk down for tacos and beer.
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  84. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Iím not even going to address the ones above this one, these two I will address. I know for a fact that when a license plate is called in the cops go straight to the residence and wait for the person to come driving down the street. I know of someone this happened to and he got a DUI right down the street from his residence. I live in a pretty small town and the cops are way overzealous to catch anyone doing anything wrong. Talk about embarrassing, many of his neighbors drove by as he was taking the drunk driving tests. Handcuffed and put in the back of a patrol car while a tow truck hauled his vehicle away. The cops wouldnít even allow it to sit on his own street. This town also lists arrests that happened around town and what they were charged with in the local newspaper every day, they just donít include names. So all his neighbors had to do was just look in the paper the next day to find out what he was charged with. As far as a bartender or waiter / waitress calling in a name off a CC of a patron who drank too much. I have no proof and I get what you are saying putting them liable for over serving. But whoís to say they couldnít call in anonymously. Itís rare that a bar is held accountable for over serving in a drunk driver arrest. If thereís a huge crash with innocent victims killed, then yes, it would be looked into.
    That's wild, but you should recognize that your town is the exception and not the rule. I live in an area with millions of people, I can promise you if I call in your plate to the cops they ARE NOT going to be waiting for you at your home. I've called several times and they just don't care. They'll get a general area and say that there's an officer nearby who will be on the lookout, but that's it.

    Same goes for if a bartender anonymously called it in, they're just not gonna waste their time on that... But again, why didn't the bartender just call a cab and ask the person not to drive - which is considered their responsibility in that situation.

  85. #185
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    Then there's this guy:

    Buxton police say a Waterboro man was charged with drunken driving after he backed into another vehicle and inadvertently began towing it behind his truck.

    https://www.centralmaine.com/2019/04...ent-in-buxton/
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  86. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    I'd rather talk to a Uber driver than an Lawyer.
    I don't really see the difference.


    Well wait, One gets paid by the mile and one by the hour.

    bachman must spread some Reputation around before giving it to himself again.


  87. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    For me cracking a beer means work or play is done and it's time to kick back and relax...
    I used to travel to the EU on business fairly regularly. Pretty standard for them to have beer/wine with lunch, even served in the cafeterias of big companies. For me, staying awaking in meetings after lunch was hard enough without it.
    Do the math.

  88. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by bachman1961 View Post
    I don't really see the difference.


    Well wait, One gets paid by the mile and one by the hour.
    The Uber driver gets paid by the mile whether he's talking or not. On my last ride (Lyft) the driver was on his hands-free in a language I didn't recognize for the entire 2+ hour drive.
    Do the math.

  89. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by bachman1961 View Post
    I don't really see the difference.


    Well wait, One gets paid by the mile and one by the hour.

    And they both take you for a ride?

    Kidding. I like my lawyer.

  90. #190
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    In Pisgah, it's pretty much a ritual for me, everytime I descend something burly (Black, Bennett, Farlow, etc.), I always pop an IPA can beforehand. Helps quell me nerves...

    But, I've never had beers at the trailhead at the end of a ride. That just doesn't sound good to me. It's always water or Powerade, etc.

    As far as post-ride beers - the only times I've done it, and I can count them on one hand, is when I got finished riding Pisgah with my girl and we hit The Hub or Ecusta to grab one.

    I typically don't like to drink alcohol after a ride, my inclination is to re-hydrate properly, and grab a shower immediately afterwards.
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  91. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    Picking up trash on the freeway or at a county park. They're known as the Weekend Warriors.
    Seems I used to see that out here but not in a long time. I have no issue with it!
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  92. #192
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    post ride beers, but in the hotel

    always mad and usually drunk......

  93. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blatant View Post
    You're not talking about probable cause. You're talking about reasonable suspicion. Different legal theories. Generally, officers need only reasonable suspicion to make a traffic stop or a vehicle contact.

    States set laws for driving offenses, not municipalities in a general sense. There's a concept called "actual physical control." Commonly, a person would need to be in actual physical control of a vehicle in order to be charged with DUI. In Arizona, that would mean inside the vehicle with the vehicle running.

    In an above example, any good cop would certainly contact a person who appeared intoxicated and was attempting to get into a vehicle. That person generally could not be prosecuted for DUI. However, if that person could not understand common logic and pushed the issue, he or she could easily find himself arrested for some other charge, mostly to prevent him from driving away and killing himself or others.

    This is known as "talking yourself into jail."
    Thanks for correction and you are correct. I was talking about Reasonable Suspicion, not probable cause.

    Like I said, things are different per state. For Nevada, if you are in the vehicle, that is where your "physical control" statement starts from what I have understood. The engine does not have to be running, basically officers are on "high alert" once they see you milling around a vehicle with keys in hand. But you are also correct, in that most will not automatically go to DUI. However, the main difference I have found was in those areas around Universities, usually within a certain block/mile radius, where campus police (in NV they are true LEA) will nail you for a DUI as soon as you touch your vehicle. Seen it as well on the "strips" where if you are parked just off the main drag but nearby patrols will nail you quickly there. Main reasoning behind that is you are talking about high pedestrian areas.

    Ultimately though it does come down to the interpretation of the officer(s) at hand.

  94. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    The OP's buddy may get 20 days hard labor? That's still a thing??
    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    Picking up trash on the freeway or at a county park. They're known as the Weekend Warriors.
    Does picking up trash count as hard labor nowadays? Man, humans have gotten soft.

  95. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    That's wild, but you should recognize that your town is the exception and not the rule. I live in an area with millions of people, I can promise you if I call in your plate to the cops they ARE NOT going to be waiting for you at your home. I've called several times and they just don't care. They'll get a general area and say that there's an officer nearby who will be on the lookout, but that's it.

    Same goes for if a bartender anonymously called it in, they're just not gonna waste their time on that... But again, why didn't the bartender just call a cab and ask the person not to drive - which is considered their responsibility in that situation.
    That is really an incorrect perception of the situation. It is not that the officers or dispatch "don't care" it comes down to what they have the man power for. This is a HUGE misunderstanding that many people have, especially if they do not have any LE experience. I urge you to go on a ride-along with your local agency, call and ask to do one for a "typical busy" night and you will be amazed at the number of calls you hear come over. Even in small towns, locals are running ragged all night long on busy nights trying to handle calls, when you get into a town/city with a population over 75-100k things can get crazy if there are not enough officers on hand. Highest priority calls are handled first and foremost, and that priority is usually given to DV, crashes, discharge of firearms, etc. that would be considered more of a public safety concern than a call on a potential "lane weaver" that could be anything from someone intoxicated to an older person that just can't drive.

    I know that doesn't necessarily sound kosher or right but when you have loads of calls coming in, there is only so much you can do with the staff on hand.

  96. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregnash View Post
    That is really an incorrect perception of the situation. It is not that the officers or dispatch "don't care" it comes down to what they have the man power for. This is a HUGE misunderstanding that many people have, especially if they do not have any LE experience. I urge you to go on a ride-along with your local agency, call and ask to do one for a "typical busy" night and you will be amazed at the number of calls you hear come over. Even in small towns, locals are running ragged all night long on busy nights trying to handle calls, when you get into a town/city with a population over 75-100k things can get crazy if there are not enough officers on hand. Highest priority calls are handled first and foremost, and that priority is usually given to DV, crashes, discharge of firearms, etc. that would be considered more of a public safety concern than a call on a potential "lane weaver" that could be anything from someone intoxicated to an older person that just can't drive.

    I know that doesn't necessarily sound kosher or right but when you have loads of calls coming in, there is only so much you can do with the staff on hand.
    exactly
    always mad and usually drunk......

  97. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Does picking up trash count as hard labor nowadays? Man, humans have gotten soft.
    It's the soft generation.
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    Beer is about the last thing I ever yearn for, so this is an easy call for me.

    Rare exception was on my first hike in the Grand Canyon, upon arrival at Phantom Ranch. Those shitty overpriced (but ICE COLD) cans of Tecate were amazeballs. Three of them, combined with mild dehydration, made for a lotta blurry photos afterwards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    I= If you want to be demonized, go talk to a recovering alcoholic...those guys will really demonize you.
    Lol wut.

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    Wow. This thread is an eye opener. A few thoughts:

    1. 2.5 IPAs and you blow a .08 is very real if you are drinking a double IPA (my go to is Bells Hopslam).
    2. Washington DC has a ZERO tolerance. If you blow anything other than a 0.00, you have won yourself a DUI. Wish this weren't true but it is.
    3. Up until the last 3 years, I would commonly bring a cooler of beer to EVERY ride. Yeah I was THAT GUY. Stupid, stupid, stupid in hindsight. Fast forward to today, I no longer drink a the trail head. If we go to dinner, I am one and done. At home, I limit myself to 2-3 beers; most nights its 1-2 beers. Fortunately for me, I never had a DUI. I cut my drinking for weight loss. I am some 45+ lbs lighter today than 3 years ago. Drinking was my achiles; I eat well, I ride a ton but consumed way too many kcals in beers. FYI, the average IPA has 160-250 kcals per 12 oz bottle. For me, one beer at the TH lead to 2, 3, sometimes 4 beers at the TH. And then, what the heck-keep the party rolling it would lead to several more beers at home or at a restaurant. No more.
    4. In IL (where I used to live), you can get a DUI/DWI while riding a bike. In IL, (specifically Peoria and Tazewell counties) riding your bike while buzzed/drunk does not provide you with loophole to avoid a DUI/DWI.

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