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  1. #1
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    Huck Finn

    Dare we discuss this?

    Political correctness gone too far? Violation of the first amendment? Rewriting history?

    Who's next? Hip-hop artists or black comedians? Are we going to become the United States of China?

    As an American, I'm embarrassed! This is liberty?

    Lule

  2. #2
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    I'm of mixed minds on this. My instinct is to dislike the changes - it's not what he Twain wrote. I'd rather see it presented and discussed for what it is - a satire and mockery of an ugly truth. Let it wait until college, where it presumably will have a more mature audience.

    But I'm not so quick to condemn it either. What if, instead of ni**er, it was k!ke or sp!ck, or d*go or whatever ugly term was applied to your ancestors or contemporaries or even yourself. And if your ancestors have always been on the long end of the stick, then use your imagination.

    Incidentally, the fellow who published it reportedly did so in order that it could be read by high school classes without all the controversy - not because he felt is should be that way.

    BTW - is there some way this can be construed to have anything to do with mountain biking?
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  3. #3
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    I read it in 10th grade and found it written relative for the time. American history isn't all roses. The book may be for more mature audiences, just like movies, but shouldn't be re-written to satisfy the politically correct. Will our culture continue to evolve with censureship?

    General discussion. I made sure there were other non-bike posts on here before I posted. The F-88 area has been closed, which is where I would have put it otherwise. If this is inappropriate, I'm sure the mods will take care of it.

    Lule

  4. #4
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    It will get deleted.
    Great literature gets censored, but Its ok to call each other ****** in songs and movies.
    I guess my cornbread ass doesnt get it..

  5. #5
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    It's just a phase. There's a long history of people censoring great works for what they see as the best of reasons. Dr Bowdler's improvements to Shakespeare gave the rather wonderful "Bowdlerisation" to the English language.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gasp4Air
    I'd rather see it presented and discussed for what it is - a satire and mockery of an ugly truth. Let it wait until college, where it presumably will have a more mature audience.
    I agree. Huck Finn isn't a racist book, it is an anti-racist book.

    Satire using not just controversial ideas but offensive ideas to make its point won't be understood by the average high school student, so don't push your luck. Higher level high school English classes will probably be more mature, and college english classes even more so, but either way the teacher or professor should probably understand their class enough to know whether that particular group will handle it well or not.

  7. #7
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    Don't dumb-down the content

    instead use it as a teachable moment.

  8. #8
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    Political correctedness rocks. How else could our current administration forbid uttering the phrase "Islamic terrorist" by the government while demanding that grandma and grandpa Smith get frisked at the airport in response to terrorist threats.....from Islamisc terrorists?

    It shouldn't be surprising that every other word in rap songs is the "N" word and that is called "culture", while classic literature is censored for including the same word.

    I am, however, encouraged that some people are starting to ask questions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2wheelsnotfour
    Political correctedness rocks. How else could our current administration forbid uttering the phrase "Islamic terrorist" by the government while demanding that grandma and grandpa Smith get frisked at the airport in response to terrorist threats.....from Islamisc terrorists?

    It shouldn't be surprising that every other word in rap songs is the "N" word and that is called "culture", while classic literature is censored for including the same word.

    I am, however, encouraged that some people are starting to ask questions.
    Was the most recent person to fly a plane into a federal building in violent (terrorist) protest of US policy Muslim?
    http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE61H4JI20100218

    Huck Finn is important because it makes us uncomfortable, and makes us confront our past and our present.
    The symbolic reading of the Constitution also glossed over the politically incorrect- Slaves count as 3/5ths of a human being to determine congressional seat allotment.
    That's how the founding fathers wrote it, that's how it should have been read.
    Almost a hundred years later, the Constitution was amended, but the original language remains, and needs to be remembered.

  10. #10
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    It is about time someone wrote a Politically Correct version of the Bible.



    (enough smilies?)

    "it IS possible that you are faster or slower than anybody else who is having at least as much if not more or less fun"

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellav8ted
    Was the most recent person to fly a plane into a federal building in violent (terrorist) protest of US policy Muslim?
    http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE61H4JI20100218

    ...
    who cares if it's most recent? C'mon man - Tim McVey was an US Christian

    bad leap...

    No books should be censored IMO
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  12. #12
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    So if kids from the US aren't to know their history, will they be condemned to repeat it?

    I remember reading HF as a young (Australian) kid, and, while many of the references went over my head at the time, coming away from it with an overwhelming sense of the injustice and inhumanity of slavery.

    Seriously, **** censorship.

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    Oops--forgot I was on an American forum! 'Seriously, make consensual love to censorship' doesn't have quite the same ring to it, though.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by disfocus
    Oops--forgot I was on an American forum! 'Seriously, make consensual love to censorship' doesn't have quite the same ring to it, though.
    Point well made! Clemens chose his words very carefully.

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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    who cares if it's most recent? C'mon man - Tim McVey was an US Christian

    bad leap...

    No books should be censored IMO
    The link posted is about Joe Stack, a non Muslim white guy, who flew into the IRS building in Texas, on February 18, 2010.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellav8ted
    Was the most recent person to fly a plane into a federal building in violent (terrorist) protest of US policy Muslim?
    http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE61H4JI20100218

    Huck Finn is important because it makes us uncomfortable, and makes us confront our past and our present.
    The symbolic reading of the Constitution also glossed over the politically incorrect- Slaves count as 3/5ths of a human being to determine congressional seat allotment.
    That's how the founding fathers wrote it, that's how it should have been read.
    Almost a hundred years later, the Constitution was amended, but the original language remains, and needs to be remembered.
    To deny that the main terrorist threat is from Islamic extremists is laughable.

    The Constitution, indeed, The Declaration Of Independence, forced the US to eventually confront slavery. The Declaration Of Independence practically made a confrontation over and repeal of slavery inevitable.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by perttime
    It is about time someone wrote a Politically Correct version of the Bible.
    OT, I know, but this made me think of a National Lampoon piece many Christmas's ago that had the Three Stooges as the Three Wise Men, written in biblical style. Most passages ended with "And Moe smote him upon the head".
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gasp4Air
    OT, I know, but this made me think of a National Lampoon piece many Christmas's ago that had the Three Stooges as the Three Wise Men, written in biblical style. Most passages ended with "And Moe smote him upon the head".
    That is historically inaccurate. Moe never smote himself on the head. That would be Curly or Shemp. Maybe Larry once or twice.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja
    That is historically inaccurate. Moe never smote himself on the head. That would be Curly or Shemp. Maybe Larry once or twice.
    Doesn't say 'himself'.
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

    George Orwell

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch Platte
    Doesn't say 'himself'.
    Aww.. leave me alone. I read it twice and saw "himself". My grandkids are right, I am getting senile. About time!

    Woo Hoo! Now I have an excuse for everything!
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja
    Aww.. leave me alone. I read it twice and saw "himself". My grandkids are right, I am getting senile. About time!

    Woo Hoo! Now I have an excuse for everything!
    Maybe you've been smote upon the head one time too many! Nyuk nyuk. (Or maybe one endo too many)
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  22. #22
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    Ah, a wise guy eh?

    I'd start wearing a helmet, but what's the point. The damage has been done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja
    Ah, a wise guy eh?

    I'd start wearing a helmet, but what's the point. The damage has been done.

    You're obviously a victim of circumstance.

    By the way, editing Huckleberry Finn is like painting a mustache on the "Mona Lisa".

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2wheelsnotfour
    The Constitution, indeed, The Declaration Of Independence, forced the US to eventually confront slavery. The Declaration Of Independence practically made a confrontation over and repeal of slavery inevitable.
    Are you smoking crack?
    The same crack Michelle Bachman's smoking?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg8kD...yer_embedded#!

    Declaration of Independence 1776
    13th Amendment (end of slavery) 1865
    19th Amendment (women's right to vote) 1920
    Brown v Board of Education ('separate but equal' is not equal) 1954

    It wasn't the platitudes on a piece of paper that ended slavery, it was the work and sacrifice and death of hundreds of thousands of people that ended slavery.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bleedin' Bill
    You're obviously a victim of circumstance.
    I believe the word you meant to say is coicumstance.
    Use it, use it, use it while you still have it.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellav8ted
    Are you smoking crack?
    The same crack Michelle Bachman's smoking?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg8kD...yer_embedded#!

    Declaration of Independence 1776
    13th Amendment (end of slavery) 1865
    19th Amendment (women's right to vote) 1920
    Brown v Board of Education ('separate but equal' is not equal) 1954

    It wasn't the platitudes on a piece of paper that ended slavery, it was the work and sacrifice and death of hundreds of thousands of people that ended slavery.

    We clearly differ significantly in what stature we each hold The Founding Fathers, The Constitution, and The Declaration Of Independence. While you refer to The Declaration Of Independence as mere platitudes, I hold that they where magnificently innovative given the types of government prevalent in their day. When The Founding Fathers declared that all men (referring to all American citizens, both male and female) were created equal, that set the stage for eventually abolishing slavery. If this new philosophy was to survive, eventually there would come a time when the nation would be forced to reconcile the difference between the rights afforded white males, females, and blacks. I am not saying The Declaration Of Independence caused this reckoning. I am saying the frame work was put in place by those founding documents. The stage was set such that it was virtually assured that a day would come when serious debate would occur regarding the rights of women and blacks. Indeed, today, we are witnessing the next phase. The debate on gay rights.

    Its similar to the idea that the invention of the wheel set the stage, and virtually ensured the invention of the bicycle. When thinking about such things it is often helpful to consider the long term. The time between the invention of the wheel and the advent of bicycles was significant. However, the stage was set for the eventual invention of the bicycle. Focusing solely upon time lines lacks insight. Resorting to insults belittles your argument. Referring to The Declaration Of Independence as mere platitudes, lacks perspective.
    Last edited by 2wheelsnotfour; 01-26-2011 at 06:15 PM.

  27. #27
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    Most underrated comedian of all time: Shemp. Guy was true genius. As funny as Curly? Coitenly not, but no one was, is, or will ever be. No one took a beating better than Shemp. When some bad dude started punching his head in and his hair is flopping in the wind, that was just liquid comedy gold. How bout when he passed out drunk and Moe and Larry put his feet in concrete to dispose of the body in the river? Punjab diamond anyone? So speaking of censorship, I think it's blasphemous that A&E inserts commercials right in the middle of Stooges episodes. Sickening.


  28. #28
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    I might be incorrect on this, but wasn't the N word common to use in normal conversation then? The intent was not derogetory in the book, it was the same as calling someone Big Bill because Bill is a tall guy.

    I hate book censoring, you can choose not to read the book, but don't change the words so it doesn't make you uncomfortable to read them.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O
    Most underrated comedian of all time: Shemp. Guy was true genius. As funny as Curly? Coitenly not, but no one was, is, or will ever be. No one took a beating better than Shemp. When some bad dude started punching his head in and his hair is flopping in the wind, that was just liquid comedy gold. How bout when he passed out drunk and Moe and Larry put his feet in concrete to dispose of the body in the river? Punjab diamond anyone? So speaking of censorship, I think it's blasphemous that A&E inserts commercials right in the middle of Stooges episodes. Sickening.

    Compared to Curly Joe Derita(sp) or Joe Besser, I'd pick Shemp but to me the 3 Stooges were always Curly, Larry and Moe.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

  30. #30
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    No way they should have changed it. It was not meant to be derogatory when it was written. People really need to get a hold of reality.... Hey guess what... Slavery was abolished in 1865... how much longer do we need to revisit this??

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hellav8ted
    Are you smoking crack?
    The same crack Michelle Bachman's smoking?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg8kD...yer_embedded#!

    Declaration of Independence 1776
    13th Amendment (end of slavery) 1865
    19th Amendment (women's right to vote) 1920
    Brown v Board of Education ('separate but equal' is not equal) 1954

    It wasn't the platitudes on a piece of paper that ended slavery, it was the work and sacrifice and death of hundreds of thousands of people that ended slavery.
    I hate to break it to you but slavery has not ended.

    It did not start in America and it did not end here. In fact it lived a very short life in The U.S. of A.

    PS: HF has not been censored in the U.S., I think you guys are thinking about what is going on in Canada.
    Nobody cares...........

  32. #32
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    oh no he dint. bigot...

    The annual MLK observance at the state house in Columbia SC had an interesting twist this year. The event is held on the north side steps of the statehouse. Prominent at that location is a large bronze statue of George Washington. This year, the NAACP constructed a "box" to conceal the Father of His Country from view so that participants would not be offended by his presence

  33. #33
    M8 M12 M15 deez nuts
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    This is actually a very intellectually stimulating thread, and has avoiding any mudslinging or unsavoury comments…*unlike the politically-retarded dunderheads who start flame wars on the roadbikereview.com forums. I hope this thread does not get deleted.
    Don’t frail and blow if you’re going to Braille and Flow.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leopold Porkstacker
    This is actually a very intellectually stimulating thread, and has avoiding any mudslinging or unsavoury comments….
    Yeah, until Trail Ninja started bad mouthing Shemp! You ever hear the guy snore? Genius!

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott O
    Yeah, until Trail Ninja started bad mouthing Shemp! You ever hear the guy snore? Genius!
    I very carefully tiptoed around badmouthing Shemp. Trying to be politically correct.

    Although I have no problem with cutting up the two Joes. They don't have any advocacy groups to stand up for them.

    Leopold's right, there's nothing more intellectually stimulating than a good discourse on the Three Stooges.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

  36. #36
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    BTW, Where is Finn exactly and how much travel do I need to Huck it?
    Honestly... ahh I give up

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by highdelll
    BTW, Where is Finn exactly and how much travel do I need to Huck it?
    I'd explain it but I'm Canadian so screw you.



    Aw. I can't stay mad at you.
    It's on the back of a fish & you could huck most of them with a road bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trail Ninja's Son
    You may be happy to hear that my dad has kicked cancer's ass. Now he's looking for whoever sent it.

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