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  1. #1
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    How To Save Money Mountain Biking

    https://reviews.mtbr.com/how-to-save...ountain-biking

    This video has some good tips, but they stopped far short of really saving money.

    honkinunit's top ten tips to save cash on your MTB riding addiction:

    1) Ride your tires until they are truly worn out. Holy hell, I've seen riders toss tires that I gladly put on my rigs. Tires are a ridiculous expense these days, and 99.34756% of the time, having a tire that is just a little worn is not going to kill you.

    2) Skip the $30 multi-tool and buy a cheap set of allens/torx at Harbor Freight, throw in a cheap triangle spoke wrench and a chain tool. Done.

    3) Buy a CO2 pump that uses 12g BB gun cartridges instead of the way overpriced threaded ones. You can buy a box of 40, 12g CO2 carts from Wal Mart for $17. For the math challenged, that is 42 cents each. Who in hell pays $3 EACH for the threaded ones? That is just dumb.

    4) Shorts with a built in diaper liner are dumb. Buy some cheap road bibs, and just wear your favorite baggies over those. My favorite riding shorts consist of a $30 pair of Performance (RIP) brand bibs and a cheap pair of Columbia hiking shorts.

    5) $50 for long fingered gloves? Buy some Mechanix or other brand work gloves for $15-$20. You can't even tell they aren't "bike" gloves from 10 feet away.

    6) I have a really nice Zoic flannel riding shirt. It made me realize that *any* flannel shirt works great for riding in the mountains.

    7) If you want a breathable quarter zip jersey, Carhartt makes some awesome ones out of the same type of breathable material your $80 jersey uses. https://www.carhartt.com/products/ca...ter-Zip-102223

    8) The variety of exotic chain lubes make me laugh. Your f*ing chain is a replaceable item. If you spend $20 on chain lube, I got nothin'. TriFlow from Wal Mart or Home Depot works great in dry conditions. 0w-40 synthetic motor oil works great as an all around. You know what works great in really wet conditions? Chainsaw bar oil. Flame away as I laugh all the way to the brewery where I can actually afford something other than PBR.

    9) Riding at night? Spending $200 on lights? WTF? You can buy any number of good, solid, handlebar mounts for tactical flashlights off eBay for $5. Wake up call: Almost every high end bike light uses a CREE LED. The *same* LEDs can be found in USB-rechargeable 1000 lumen tactical flashlights for $50.

    10) Shimano SLX components work every bit as well as XT components, which is to say the stuff rocks. Look at the price differential and you wonder if the nicer finish on the XT stuff really matters. Do you really notice the 100 gram weight savings on your 32 pound enduro bike? Here is a tip, lose 400 grams by taking a dump before your next ride.

    There you have it.

  2. #2
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    I honestly don't like mechanics gloves. I wore them for decades while fixing aircraft. They felt too bulky when I used hand tools and definitely feels that way when I grip the handlebar. I like my minimalist gloves insead
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post
    https://reviews.mtbr.com/how-to-save...ountain-biking

    4) Shorts with a built in diaper liner are dumb. Buy some cheap road bibs, and just wear your favorite baggies over those. My favorite riding shorts consist of a $30 pair of Performance (RIP) brand bibs and a cheap pair of Columbia hiking shorts.
    Bingo

  4. #4
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    I follow most of these suggestions in your post. Tires last me a long time.

    As for gloves, I just always buy them on sale. Last 4 or 5 pairs I have owned were all $10-$12 on Jenson and my current pair was $10 at a TASCO warehouse sale. Same for Socks generally.
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  5. #5
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    I like moto gear for jerseys and gloves. Can usually find them on sale in the $10-20 range.

  6. #6
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    Somebody oughta post a link to this thread over in the "Where are the best deals" forum.
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  7. #7
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    ditch the co2 and get a pump.

    co2 makes zero sense unless in an unsupported or 'no pit bike' race.
    "Put your seatbelt back on or get out and sit in the middle of that circle of death." - Johnny Scoot

  8. #8
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    Lets not forget eyewear, you can get foakleys for 1/4 of the price, typically with three different lenses included.

  9. #9
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    Some good ones there for sure. I swear by a few.

    $20 polypro t-shirts aren't much different than $70 bike "jerseys."

    Drivetrain components are disposable and more likely to break and wear out than other parts - no need to buy $250 derailleurs when they can get smashed or ripped off at any time.

    Lights are also stupid expensive. I get by with the mid priced Niterider Luminas. I'm sure a 4500 lumen light is nice but not for $500+.
    Vermonter - bikes, beers and skis.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by 127.0.0.1 View Post
    ditch the co2 and get a pump.

    co2 makes zero sense unless in an unsupported or 'no pit bike' race.
    I disagree, I love my CO2 quick fill kit. The one I have uses the basic no-thread CO2 Cartridges for BB guns. It is really handy for a quick fill of a tube or to help seat a tubeless tire that needed a repair. My kit fits in the pack under my seat.
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  11. #11
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    Good tips ! I lol'd at the chain lube comments

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    Lets not forget eyewear, you can get foakleys for 1/4 of the price, typically with three different lenses included.
    100%, I should have added this one. Sunglasses are another reason I'll miss the local Performance, love 'em or hate 'em, their house brand photochromic lens sunglasses for $30 were a steal.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klurejr View Post
    I disagree, I love my CO2 quick fill kit. The one I have uses the basic no-thread CO2 Cartridges for BB guns. It is really handy for a quick fill of a tube or to help seat a tubeless tire that needed a repair. My kit fits in the pack under my seat.
    Tubeless tires are the reason you want CO2 on the trail these days. A regular pump often won't seat the tire.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post
    honkinunit's top ten tips to save cash on your MTB riding addiction:

    Well I disagree with about 9.5 out of 10 of those but to each his own. You could save the most of all by giving up recreational riding
    I brake for stinkbugs

  15. #15
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    Woodworking protective glasses rather than cycling glasses if all you need are clear.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oh My Sack! View Post
    Remember, there's always quilting and knitting if pedalling becomes too tough.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by chazpat View Post
    Woodworking protective glasses rather than cycling glasses if all you need are clear.
    Or shooting glasses from eBay, many different lens colors. Lots of options under $15, some under $10.
    ITMFA

  17. #17
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    Walmart carbon bike.
    The Steel Fleet:


    '14 All City MMD
    '12 Kona Unit Rigid
    TBA - There is a hint in the Purchase thread

  18. #18
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    That's Mechanix gloves, not mechanic's gloves.
    Do the math.

  19. #19
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    You can get threaded 16g CO2 cartridges in a box of 30 for $30 on eBay. Buddies are happy to make it a group buy.

    Safety glasses do work well and can be had in many colors.

    Menards often has 40g Thinsulate work gloves for $5 that are high viz. Great for 40 degree road or MTB rides. They work down to 20 or less in my Bar Mitts.

    A fork mount bike rack, like Kuat Dirtbag, mounted to my hitch haul makes a great way to haul my fatty and a deer, or cooler of beer.

    Home brew chain lube and tire sealant save some $$$

    My biggest savings have been by finding quality, near new, used bikes. I saved $3,000 on my Otso.

  20. #20
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    Swap a worn front tire to the rear and only get a new front. Continue that cycle.
    Niner WFO9, Sunday Soundwave (BMX), Nashbar CXSS (town/workout/gravel)

  21. #21
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    The mechanics I know who work on vehicles use the 9mil black nitrile gloves. The 5mil ones rip too easily. Harbor Freight has them if you don't get deliveries.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    The mechanics I know who work on vehicles use the 9mil black nitrile gloves. The 5mil ones rip too easily. Harbor Freight has them if you don't get deliveries.
    Lowe’s has then in the paint department. I carry a set in my pack in a plastic bag. Work on the drivetrain trailside my hands stay clean then I throw them [greasy now] in the plastic bag and toss them when I get home.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    The mechanics I know who work on vehicles use the 9mil black nitrile gloves. The 5mil ones rip too easily. Harbor Freight has them if you don't get deliveries.
    Those gloves are not practical for riding, too much sweat.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    Those gloves are not practical for riding, too much sweat.
    See my above post. We posted at the same time.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by eb1888 View Post
    The mechanics I know who work on vehicles use the 9mil black nitrile gloves. The 5mil ones rip too easily. Harbor Freight has them if you don't get deliveries.
    I am pretty sure they were talking about gloves to use to ride, not wrench.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    See my above post. We posted at the same time.
    They're fitting for that application, I thought we were talking about riding gear, not trailside maintenance.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    That's Mechanix gloves, not mechanic's gloves.
    Which is a brand of gloves that are great for riding. Rubber mechanics gloves not so much. Great for working on the bike though.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  28. #28
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    Mechanix gloves are cold.

    Smaller CO2 cartridges are not as cheap, and larger are not as expensive as implied. 16 gram are $30/30ea on Amazon. A 12 gram won't fill a bike tire so you use two anyhow. The Slime-branded inflator which you can find at Walmart is sold under some other brand names too and it will take 12 and 16 gram, threaded and unthreaded, so if you can find a cartridge you can use it. Just don't buy the Slime-branded cartridges hung next to it which are $5/2ea

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    They're fitting for that application, I thought we were talking about riding gear, not trailside maintenance.
    I don’t know what we’re talking about my phone screen shattered on me. I think I slept on it last night. Doh!
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    I don’t know what we’re talking about my phone screen shattered on me. I think I slept on it last night. Doh!
    The good news is, with all the money you're saving on Mountain Biking, you'll have some cash left over to get that screen replaced.

  31. #31
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    Some good tips in there, I've used nothing but WD40 on my chain for years, works well for shining the frame too (especially the brake rotors ). Kinda agree about the shorts, I usually buy cheap roadie lycra but recently splashed out on a pair of NZO riding shorts (best in the business IMO) and goddamn they're good! Based on how others have lasted I'll get good value out of them to justify the purchase cost, and they're just so damn comfy and not too baggy, which I find most regular shorts are.

    And totally agree about the Shimano SLX stuff, although I do run XT on my bike as I picked up a package deal on the drivetrain for cheaper-than-SLX price. I've got no interest in going to 12sp, SRAM or Shimano, and having $300+ cassettes to replace.

  32. #32
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    All great tips but if I'm talking to a newbie there are things I'd suggest spending a little money on and things I agree with you on.

    Agrees:
    1. Still on same tires after 1500 miles. Seeing wear but not feeling like I'm losing performance.
    3. Agree makes sense although I didn't do that.
    6. Any shirt works. I wear a lot of Nike Dri-Fit because I already had a bunch when I got into this sport. Just don't wear cotton on your base layer.
    7. Great idea for a warmer top.
    9. I'm actually shopping lights and this is definitely something I'll look into.
    10. Completely agree. I think sometimes we get bored in the winter and read about $400 hubs and decide we might as well quit the sport if we don't have that new hub by spring.
    11. I have several pairs of $5-10 safety glasses in different tints that work great.

    Disagrees:
    2. The multitool is the single greatest bike purchase I've ever made and it was pretty cheap. I have 2.
    4. A great pair of mountain bike shorts will enhance your ride. Stretch material, zippered pockets, durable. You can save huge money here for sure but if you're going to ride a lot get a good pair.
    5. Every non-bike pair of gloves I've ever tried were no where near as good as my $25 clearance bike gloves (Troy Lee).
    8. I dunno man its pretty easy to put the wrong crap on your bike, especially if you're a newbie. I think this is good advice if you really know your lub products but I'd prefer to play it safe and let the bottle tell me exactly what it is and where it goes.

    But don't listen to me because I'm a dumbass and just spent $90 to put a new riser bar on my bike that raised my hands 1". Thats right....$90 for 1". "30mm" sounded so impressive and life changing. Screw this sport.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDHutch View Post



    Disagrees:
    .
    4. A great pair of mountain bike shorts will enhance your ride. Stretch material, zippered pockets, durable. You can save huge money here for sure but if you're going to ride a lot get a good pair.
    5. Every non-bike pair of gloves I've ever tried were no where near as good as my $25 clearance bike gloves (Troy Lee).

    It is pretty easy to find cycling specific gloves on clearance, I always go with those. As far as shorts go, I've always done what dude recommends because I prefer bib shorts, and its easy to just throw shorts over those if you're too embarrassed to be seen in spandex. I've looked at baggy shorts specific to mtb and they're just way to expensive for me, one pair is cool, but if you're riding every day and that's all you have then you're either washing your shorts every day, or you're wearing used shorts, that's pretty disgusting...and I don't even have the highest sanitary standards.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post

    9) Riding at night? Spending $200 on lights? WTF? You can buy any number of good, solid, handlebar mounts for tactical flashlights off eBay for $5. Wake up call: Almost every high end bike light uses a CREE LED. The *same* LEDs can be found in USB-rechargeable 1000 lumen tactical flashlights for $50.
    .
    Nope
    LEDs might be the same but the batteries are certainly not, neither is how well they are build and dissipate heat. Lots of cheap light are not even close to what they say they are in lumens. A quality light is certainly worth the expense.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon Fat View Post
    Nope
    LEDs might be the same but the batteries are certainly not, neither is how well they are build and dissipate heat. Lots of cheap light are not even close to what they say they are in lumens. A quality light is certainly worth the expense.
    I agree with you. I've had a cheap tactical flashlight before... It was a recommendation I got from this forum. But the batteries didn't hold up and started causing issues mid-ride. Out in the dark and the cold is the last place I want to rely on the cheapest possible option for something so important to my safety.

  36. #36
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    Agree for the most. The only thing I disagree with is lights. The $5 ebay lights are junk. The last thing I want is for a light to go out at 20 mph on a steep technical downhill. Spending $200 on a light is way cheaper than a trip to the ER.
    Plus the form factor limits battery life, heat dissipation, and how easily it mounts to a bike or helmet.

    The one advantage I've found with bike jersey's is that they tend to be a bit longer in the back. Which is important as most normal t-shirts aren't long enough for my tall thin frame to begin with. However last night I rode in a cotton t-shirt so I don't even follow that all the time.

    From my experience, learning how to maintain your bike yourself instead of bringing to your LBS every time something small goes wrong seems to be the best way to save money. Derailleur out of alignment? Disc brake rubbing? Need to replace a chain? All very simple things, but can cost a lot having someone else do it.

  37. #37
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    I don't think honk was advocating $5 flashlights, that was for handlebar mounts.

    There are pros & cons to both approaches (dedicated bike lights or flashlights). At the end of the day you can have reliable, or unreliable setups with either. That's a discussion better taken to the dedicated lighting sub-forums.

    +1 on learning basic maintenance. You don't need to spend a lot on tools.
    ITMFA

  38. #38
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    Ghetto tubeless on standard rims and tires using homebrew sealant, that is if you don't give a damn about your safety.

  39. #39
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    Riding more saves money. When I don't ride I'm here on the forum and think about all the upgrades I NEED to be able to ride. While not riding I perceive all kind of fitting and gearing problems i need to fix.

    If I don't ride soon, I actually buy those upgrades. But when I ride, I totally forget about that perceived problem that upgrade is supposed to fix and decide to not buy it.
    2018 Motobecane Sturgis NX
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeDee View Post
    homebrew sealant.
    you had me at ghetto....Whats your blend? Elmers glue and olive oil?

  41. #41
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    Where are the real dirtbag tips? Like ride with people who carry tools, co2, tubes and mooch off of them!
    Find the sandwich shops that have peanut butter and jelly/jam packets out on tables and squirrel those when you get a sandwich from them. Makes decent gel/gu substitute. You could sneak in and just grab some, but i consider that below dirtbag and into homeless territory.

  42. #42
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    Oh and like rotating tires, you can rotate grips.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    you had me at ghetto....Whats your blend? Elmers glue and olive oil?
    Hmmm, never thought about that!

    With all due consideration, I'd probably follow Bontrager's formula. Orange Seal is expensive!

  44. #44
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    Don't get wasted, trip over the transition between hardwood and tile and smoke your head on the edge of a fridge glasses first!

    ...Though it was probably a personal best but I usually get more than a month out of a pair of glasses!

  45. #45
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    spending the least amount of money is not always (usually is not) the best way to save money.

    I will gladly spend more money for a product that will last longer or function better than the cheapest option. Saving money has 2 components. Amount and frequency. Frequency is a much larger component of that.

    Midpriced usually offers the best balance of purchase price and durability.

    Unless you're buying something used/refurbished, ebay is not where you go to "save money", it's where you go to buy cheap shit and pretend to save money.

    Example: I buy chain lube in bulk bottles. I think I last bought chain lube 4 or 5yrs ago. Cost - negligible at this point.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    Walmart carbon bike.

    lol you learn quickly.

    How to save money mountain biking is how to avoid most of the expensive trends, like full-suspension and 1x.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  47. #47
    2x is underrated
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Well I disagree with about 9.5 out of 10 of those but to each his own. You could save the most of all by giving up recreational riding

    Actually, you could save the most of all precisely by doing recreational riding, and not the more serious riding most of the dudes on here do.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDHutch View Post

    But don't listen to me because I'm a dumbass and just spent $90 to put a new riser bar on my bike that raised my hands 1". Thats right....$90 for 1". "30mm" sounded so impressive and life changing. Screw this sport.

    Trenztek 0-60 Degree 90 mm Adjustable Bicycle Handlebar Extender MTB Bike Stem Riser Head Up Raiser
    $18 on Amazon

    Can raise it up to 90mm at 60 degrees. I have mine set at 40 degrees right now (60 mm raised from handlebars); I also did a 2 inch stem riser TOGETHER with this and now my old-geometry 26" is finally comfortable to ride. It just looks like a motorcycle chopper now...
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    Actually, you could save the most of all precisely by doing recreational riding, and not the more serious riding most of the dudes on here do.
    Um... methinks you're being quite generous with your conjecture.
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  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    lol you learn quickly.

    How to save money mountain biking is how to avoid most of the expensive trends, like full-suspension and 1x.

    lol, I wonder how my 1x10 costs more than my previous 2x10?
    I brake for stinkbugs

  51. #51
    2x is underrated
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bacon Fat View Post
    Nope
    LEDs might be the same but the batteries are certainly not, neither is how well they are build and dissipate heat. Lots of cheap light are not even close to what they say they are in lumens. A quality light is certainly worth the expense.

    I agree, I have some $12 flashlights and while they work, if you are near traffic and their headlights, the light will be completely bleached out and you can't see anything in front of the bike. I've almost hit pedestrians because of weak bike lights. The best time for them is if you are casually going along a fire road at night with plenty of space on each side. A real downhill trail can be pretty scary with them.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    lol you learn quickly.

    How to save money mountain biking is how to avoid most of the expensive trends, like full-suspension and 1x.
    Yup. For those who prioritize saving money over enjoying the benefits of things like full suspension &/or 1x.

    Not personally a member of that club, but to each his own.
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  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    Actually, you could save the most of all precisely by doing recreational riding, and not the more serious riding most of the dudes on here do.


    You missed my point (again!), if you want to save money sell your car and use your bike for utilitarian purposes.

    And "serious" riding is usually recreational riding.
    I brake for stinkbugs

  54. #54
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    Some of the suggestions in this thread hurt my head...

  55. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93EXCivic View Post
    Some of the suggestions in this thread hurt my head...
    12. Big bottle of vitamin I from Costco.
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  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    lol you learn quickly.

    How to save money mountain biking is how to avoid most of the expensive trends, like full-suspension and 1x.
    You mean full suspension is just a trend?

    And my 1x1 was pretty cheap. Hey…

    How To Save Money Mountain Biking: buy a rigid SS.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oh My Sack! View Post
    Remember, there's always quilting and knitting if pedalling becomes too tough.

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by VTSession View Post
    Some good ones there for sure. I swear by a few.

    $20 polypro t-shirts aren't much different than $70 bike "jerseys."

    Drivetrain components are disposable and more likely to break and wear out than other parts - no need to buy $250 derailleurs when they can get smashed or ripped off at any time.

    Lights are also stupid expensive. I get by with the mid priced Niterider Luminas. I'm sure a 4500 lumen light is nice but not for $500+.
    I buy jerseys on sale 95% of the time. Occasionally there’s one I want that’s not.

    I’ve been running the same derailleurs, brakes, and shifters until they wear out. I run 11 speed XT/XTR mix depending on what I got on sale, and it lasts me 3-4 years right now. Chains and cassettes and chainrings get replaced regularly.
    Guerrilla Gravity BAMF, Colorado Front Range

  58. #58
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    I am with the people who are skeptical of cheapo amazon lights. I also do not want my lights failing my 20 miles from my truck in sub freezing weather with eight hours until sunrise.

    That said, I have had great luck rigging up my climbing/mountaineering lights to fit my helmet/handlebars. These lights peform great but tend to be much cheaper than equally bright "cycling" lights.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparticus View Post
    Yup. For those who prioritize saving money over enjoying the benefits of things like full suspension &/or 1x.

    Not personally a member of that club, but to each his own.
    =sParty

    Speaking of 1x, I took my $500 hardtail in to a new LBS for a 2x9 'upgrade' today, just the crankset, the rest besides the rear derailleur will stay 8-speed. The manager looked at the Shimano Alivio crankset box like it was a rare dinosaur egg. So I said "Yeah I bet this will be the last 9-speed installation you do", he immediately replied "Yes, it will be". Two different shops admitted they are already forgetting how to work on 7-9 speeds. But hey, I got the 'good' hollowtech one with bb for $91, that should be a lot nicer to shift with than 3x8. With an 11-40t cassette in back the range is a whopping 5.9.

    The long-term plan is to completely skip 1x10 and 1x11 and go straight to 10-50 or 10-51 1x12. 10 and 11 simply do not have enough range for me.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93EXCivic View Post
    Swap a worn front tire to the rear and only get a new front. Continue that cycle.
    +1 That's been how I roll for years.

    Lots of good tips on here. One thing I disagree with is TriFlow in dry conditions. When I lived in Seattle, it's all I used and I loved it. Once I moved to Phoenix, all it did was gunt up the works.

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  61. #61
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    Maybe you don't ride aggressively, especially in the loose dry conditions we have out West, but I will never ride with worn tires. One hard crash will set you back thousands in ER bills especially with high deductible plans. This is mainly for the front tire but I don't let my rear wear super much either. I also don't want to miss time riding.

    The biggest thing that saves me a ton of money - BUY USED BIKES. There are so many great bikes just a couple of years old going for $2K to $3K when the newest models are $5K. My last new bike was in the mid 1990s.

    ALSO - DO ALL OF YOUR MECHANIC WORK YOURSELF. In almost 30 years of riding I have never brought my whole bike to a shop (although I agree on sending shocks to the experts).

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    Speaking of 1x, I took my $500 hardtail in to a new LBS for a 2x9 'upgrade' today, just the crankset, the rest besides the rear derailleur will stay 8-speed. The manager looked at the Shimano Alivio crankset box like it was a rare dinosaur egg. So I said "Yeah I bet this will be the last 9-speed installation you do", he immediately replied "Yes, it will be". Two different shops admitted they are already forgetting how to work on 7-9 speeds. But hey, I got the 'good' hollowtech one with bb for $91, that should be a lot nicer to shift with than 3x8. With an 11-40t cassette in back the range is a whopping 5.9.

    The long-term plan is to completely skip 1x10 and 1x11 and go straight to 10-50 or 10-51 1x12. 10 and 11 simply do not have enough range for me.
    Not enough range with 10 and 11 speed? I am running 3x10, and 3x11 with 11-42t cassettes on my mountain bikes and I have plenty of range (729%)!

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porkchop_Power View Post
    Maybe you don't ride aggressively, especially in the loose dry conditions we have out West, but I will never ride with worn tires. One hard crash will set you back thousands in ER bills especially with high deductible plans. This is mainly for the front tire but I don't let my rear wear super much either. I also don't want to miss time riding.
    I considered posting similar sentiment inasmuch as where I live (PNW), having aggressive knobs is critical during about 2/3rds of the year. I can get by on semi-worn rubber during the driest months, but most of the time we need tires that hook up out here.

    Good tires are expensive. And worth it. At least where & how I ride.
    =sParty
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  64. #64
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    [QUOTE=David R;13938209]Some good tips in there, I've used nothing but WD40 on my chain for years, works well for shining the frame too (especially the brake rotors ).

    I hope you are also joking about using it on your chain. WD40 is a water displacement spray and has virtually no lubricating properties after it dries. I have some actual chain lube I use occasionally, but usually use cheap ACE hardware silicon lubricant spray.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Porkchop_Power View Post
    Maybe you don't ride aggressively, especially in the loose dry conditions we have out West, but I will never ride with worn tires. One hard crash will set you back thousands in ER bills especially with high deductible plans....
    In my experience, the better my tires, the faster I'm going when I crash.
    Do the math.

  66. #66
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    Long gone are the days that all of the bikes in my garage were XTR equipped. Anyone who rides with me now knows I am super cheap, so this thread and the video both hit close to home for me. My own mother calls me "fiscally retentive."

    I agree with most everything here and feel that my riding experiences are not degraded by my stinginess. I keep my bike spending low to put money toward travel by building my bikes to be inexpensive to ride and maintain and still perform well for my riding needs. My last brand new bike was a 1993 model and the several dozen since have all been used, most of which I have made money on when I sold them. All of my cycling clothing, gloves, and shoes were bought on closeout or given to me. I am a frequent customer of the local bike co-op and a local shop that sells used parts. I learned what works well for me in my 17 years in the bike industry and learned how to do everything I need to save money on maintenance and repairs.

  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by sgltrak View Post
    My own mother calls me "fiscally retentive."
    lol. My own mother calls me, "your father."

    Depression-era upbringing.
    ITMFA

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    You missed my point (again!), if you want to save money sell your car and use your bike for utilitarian purposes.

    And "serious" riding is usually recreational riding.

    OK smartypants, what is non-serious riding? What is the definition of casual, 6-8 mph riding off-road?
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by YeahWhatever View Post
    Not enough range with 10 and 11 speed? I am running 3x10, and 3x11 with 11-42t cassettes on my mountain bikes and I have plenty of range (729%)!

    BTW cool Vivian photo. You are doing 3x11? I thought I was weird.

    Not enough range with 1x10 and 1x11. If I did a Sunrace 11-50t cassette that would probably be enough range. But that cassette is $100 extra, which means Shimano SLX 11-speed groupset $340 + $100 cassette = $440, and the SRAM GX 10-50t groupset is only $10 more at $450 total, with the cassette I already want (I'd prefer 30t chainring, the GX comes with 32t, but that will be 'acceptable').

    Yes, I'd have to buy a rear wheel with the XD driver, but that's only $143 and I need wider rims anyway, so I personally don't count that in the groupset's total price. This will not happen for at least two years anyway. Plenty of fun now on my cheaper bikes.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  70. #70
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    If you really want to save money just don't pay any attention to what other people are doing or saying. I have no idea what the trends are.
    MERCY! MERCY! MERCY!

  71. #71
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    These are the gloves I got and I love them. Way cheaper and good quality.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    You're going to want to buy accessories, but once you do, they should last a while. The main issue here is all the upgrade itches we get. Stop upgrading everything.

  72. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOJO K View Post
    If you really want to save money just don't pay any attention to what other people are doing or saying. I have no idea what the trends are.
    FWIW being unaware of trends is trending right now. You're riding the crest!
    =sParty
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    We get old because we quit riding.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by richj8990 View Post
    BTW cool Vivian photo. You are doing 3x11? I thought I was weird.
    Yes it works very well. The front derailleur is super reliable, and 11-42 cassettes are less than $60.

  74. #74
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    Keep riding and trying cheap options and you will start to discover which attempts to save money are and aren't worth it to you. These things aren't all universally great and can potentially come with trade offs in comfort, performance, time spent researching, time spent mucking about, time or money wasted on things that didn't work out, etc. But some may stick for you if you are willing to experiment.

    Chain lube is a good example for me:
    I've tried a number of chain lubes and some alternatives. For my conditions, most were messier or needed to be applied too often compared to Dumonde that was the local recommendation I started with. One $12 bottle of that will last me a couple years and do a better job keeping my chain from being a disposable item. Maybe there is some other lube I haven't tried that works even better, but I've already spent enough time and money on failed alternatives that I prefer the easy confidence of knowing what to buy again without wasting another minute thinking about it.

    Also, I've realized that I am fine with Target wicking t-shirts for riding but I wouldn't ride without proper biking shorts.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparticus View Post
    I considered posting similar sentiment inasmuch as where I live (PNW), having aggressive knobs is critical during about 2/3rds of the year. I can get by on semi-worn rubber during the driest months, but most of the time we need tires that hook up out here.

    Good tires are expensive. And worth it. At least where & how I ride.
    =sParty
    I ride my rear tire until it starts to lose grip. That's typically not very long down here as the rocks and cactus eat tires, hence why I do it. I lived and rode the PNW for 8 years and was definitely replacing both tires at the same time. I don't ride them until they're bald, just until I continually start to slip.

    I ride everything from road to gravel to buff singletrack to crazy rocky $h!t so it's not a terrain thing.

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  76. #76
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    just sell weed on the side, then you can buy whatever you want

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by nauc View Post
    just sell weed on the side, then you can buy whatever you want
    Times have changed, its practically legal everywhere and its pushing the street hustlers out of business. There's more dispensaries in my town than starbucks.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    Times have changed, its practically legal everywhere and its pushing the street hustlers out of business. There's more dispensaries in my town than starbucks.
    thats good! it should be legal. a lot of the big beer companies are investing into weed. funny how that works. theyre were all against it at first, now they cant afford to not invest in it

  79. #79
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    I'm going to be the one voice of dissent here. With the understanding that I look for bargains for what I want, I don't really mind spending money on bikes, parts and accessories.

    When you consider the massive amounts I am forced to spend on things I don't particularly like such as alimony, taxes, and professional fees I positively enjoy buying a Lauf fork or a Rohloff speedhub.

    Cheap is not always the way to go. I spent a hundred bucks for three Tubolito inner tubes and, as I carry two spare tubes on my bike packing/expedition rig, I immediately dropped almost two pounds from my gear weight.

    This is pretty significant. I spent some money to get my sleeping kit weight down to three-and-a-half pounds (tent, pad, and sleeping bag) and, when you add up a couple of other things I've spent some money on I've dropped about eight pounds from the weight of my kit without losing too much capability. My tool-kit with pump and tubes is about a pound and a half. My goal is 15 pounds total (cold weather gear, etc) not counting water and food which is variable.

    That's a lot of weight I don't have to grind up mountain passes and it's worth the money. On the Tour Divide I felt every pound. I'm on my way to losing thirty pounds for my next attempt in 2020 but every pound counts in something like this.

    Take something like rain gear: I could get some el-cheapo water-resistant jacket which will keep the rain out for an hour or so but instead I spent 300 bucks on a Shower's Pass jacket that breathes well, has great venting, and stays waterproof indefinitely. It really sucks to be cold, wet, and miserable seventy miles from the nearest town. At times like that you're not thinking, "I wish I had cheaper gear."

    Generally I flashback to the time I got hypothermia and feel pretty good about the money spent.

    And, while SRAM now has NX and GX levels for Eagle and 11-speed drivetrains, when they first came out with 1x11 XX1 or XO1 were your only options. I spent the money for an XO1 group and was blown away. It was exactly what I wanted in a drivetrain and I have never regretted the money I spent (even if I did upgrade the race bike to the GX level Eagle system to save some money).

  80. #80
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    I think a better topic would be; how to save money on other things so you can afford proper bike stuff.
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  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cornfield View Post
    I think a better topic would be; how to save money on other things so you can afford proper bike stuff.
    That is the best comment here. I do pretty well at my job but I'm not rich. I drive a cheap car but have expensive bikes.

  82. #82
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    If I need a part I just Google it. Easiest way to find the lowest price. As for #1, I can't remember the last time I wore out a tire because of ripped sidewalls or bead failures. Stupid Contis.

    Oh yeah I miss Chainlove.
    CRAP... I'm in the wrong gear

  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ailuropoda View Post
    drive a cheap car but have expensive bikes.
    That would be #1 on the list, lol!
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  84. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by langster831 View Post
    Lets not forget eyewear, you can get foakleys for 1/4 of the price, typically with three different lenses included.
    1/4? Mine were $20, they are over $200 for real pushing $300

    1/10th the price


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  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOJO K View Post
    If you really want to save money just don't pay any attention to what other people are doing or saying. I have no idea what the trends are.

    There is/was a moderator on here named Shiggy that up to at least 2014 rode a bike that had a 2x6 drivetrain. 2x6!!! I give him a lot of credit for having the balls not to care about the dozens of posts that ridiculed his drivetrain choice.



    An article by a Brit off this site was talking about the differences between beginner, intermediate, and expert riders. He had some very interesting comments:

    Difference between a beginner and an intermediate --- the intermediate rider will take a jump larger than two feet and will have no problem predicting exactly what will happen at the bottom.

    Difference between an intermediate and expert --- the intermediate thinks they have to have the best bike possible; the expert already has the best skills, so in their spare time they experiment with riding all kinds of weird, eccentric bikes when they are not racing.
    Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres: quod Belgiae, quod Celtae, et quod Aquitainae.

  86. #86
    the discerning hooligan
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarplex View Post
    1/4? Mine were $20, they are over $200 for real pushing $300

    1/10th the price

    If you ride enough, you'll just find a pair of Oakleys ( okay, usually Smiths ) and a multi tool trail side...just make sure to pack out the blown tube, spent CO cartridge, and empty Gu pack that are there too.
    MERCY! MERCY! MERCY!

  87. #87
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    I get the 3 pair/$10 gloves at Home Depot and cut the ends of the fingers off. They work really well and you cannot tell they are not made for biking.

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ailuropoda View Post
    I'm going to be the one voice of dissent here. With the understanding that I look for bargains for what I want, I don't really mind spending money on bikes, parts and accessories.

    When you consider the massive amounts I am forced to spend on things I don't particularly like such as alimony, taxes, and professional fees I positively enjoy buying a Lauf fork or a Rohloff speedhub.

    Cheap is not always the way to go. I spent a hundred bucks for three Tubolito inner tubes and, as I carry two spare tubes on my bike packing/expedition rig, I immediately dropped almost two pounds from my gear weight.

    This is pretty significant. I spent some money to get my sleeping kit weight down to three-and-a-half pounds (tent, pad, and sleeping bag) and, when you add up a couple of other things I've spent some money on I've dropped about eight pounds from the weight of my kit without losing too much capability. My tool-kit with pump and tubes is about a pound and a half. My goal is 15 pounds total (cold weather gear, etc) not counting water and food which is variable.

    That's a lot of weight I don't have to grind up mountain passes and it's worth the money. On the Tour Divide I felt every pound. I'm on my way to losing thirty pounds for my next attempt in 2020 but every pound counts in something like this.

    Take something like rain gear: I could get some el-cheapo water-resistant jacket which will keep the rain out for an hour or so but instead I spent 300 bucks on a Shower's Pass jacket that breathes well, has great venting, and stays waterproof indefinitely. It really sucks to be cold, wet, and miserable seventy miles from the nearest town. At times like that you're not thinking, "I wish I had cheaper gear."

    Generally I flashback to the time I got hypothermia and feel pretty good about the money spent.

    And, while SRAM now has NX and GX levels for Eagle and 11-speed drivetrains, when they first came out with 1x11 XX1 or XO1 were your only options. I spent the money for an XO1 group and was blown away. It was exactly what I wanted in a drivetrain and I have never regretted the money I spent (even if I did upgrade the race bike to the GX level Eagle system to save some money).
    Nope I'm with you.
    I've been lucky, while I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination, I own my house and car, don't have huge expenses and I like quality gear. Not saying every should be buying the latest and greatest, buy what you want/can afford/can justify. Bikes are my passion, I may be crap at riding them, but I enjoy them anyway, I don't want to be scrimping and saving (I've had times of being cash strapped and had to go the savings route), if I can get a bargain great, but I did the loose allen keys for $5, but they are a pain to carry when you can get a multi tool with all the allen keys, a chain breaker, tyre levers and a few other tools for $20 that compact, organised, well made and excellent. Tyres are the things that attach you to the ground, I want damn good ones and replace when needed, bibs, that's my arse, I'm buying the most comfy, el cheapo's arn't (I've had them).
    If saving money is you bag, I say have at it. But for me mtbing isn't about saving, its about enjoying, and I like nice stuff.
    All the gear and no idea.

  89. #89
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    ^apologies thats come across as a rant more than anything! geez its a craptastic day at work!
    All the gear and no idea.

  90. #90
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    Life is short. When it comes to biking, I buy exactly what I want.

  91. #91
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    Don't buy a new bike every year.

    Make sandwiches/snacks instead of buying popular energy bars. Buy powdered drink mix instead of Gatorade from the gas station.

    "Last year's"carbon parts are usually discounted heavily. (Used to find Easton bars for cheap compared to retail)

  92. #92
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    1) I ride in varying conditions, so tyres need to be ready for most things, most of the time, not scrabbling for grip.

    2) Cheap tools are false economy, see when they break, or break the things you are fixing.

    3) For the amount of times I need them, ill by CO2 one or two at a time (once every year or two?) and use a track pump at home.

    4) Nothing ruins a ride like chafing or sweaty, uncomfortable balls, so I use bibs under baggies, but good quality ones (Rapha lightweight, classic or 3/4 depending on temps)

    5) I have poor circulation in my fingers, so cheap gloves often mean I cant brake as my hands are frozen solid. Warm breathable gloves ain't cheap.

    6) I've ridden in pretty well everything over the years, you know what works best? MTB kit...

    7) see 6

    8) I'd rather buy decent chain lube twice a year than chains. Most folk slosh waaaay too much on, so there's a saving to be made.

    9) Those '1000 lumen' $50 lights are closer 600 on the trail, as opposed to in theory. While the LED might be broadly similar, more expensive, higher quality stuff will have better electronics, better sealing, better/bigger batteries, better QC and isn't actually bad value my setup is around $4-500 but has 10 LEDs and decent batteries that mean I can always see where I'm going (even dry the trails out as i ride along ;-) ).

    10) Why not take a dump AND save 100 grams? That shiny new kit might well be the thing that motivates you to get out and ride, plus whatever placebo effect you get when you are out riding? that way youll ride more, and lose even more weight...

    To conclude, life is too short for s*** bikes and kit.

    My tip for saving money is to use your local bike shop, for work and parts. Be nice to them and over time you'll notice your bills get smaller and smaller... Plus, you know, making friends, keeping the industry going, giving back etc.

  93. #93
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    Buy used, learn to work in your own bike, try to find non bike specific clothes.
    I bought long johns from Eddie Bauer instead of Pearl Izumi, 1/3 the price


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    Last edited by sfgiantsfan; 1 Week Ago at 09:35 AM.
    I'm sick of all the Irish stereotypes, as soon as I finish this beer I"m punching someone

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Howard View Post
    To conclude, life is too short for s*** bikes and kit.
    Damn straight.

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by honkinunit View Post

    1) Ride your tires until they are truly worn out. Holy hell, I've seen riders toss tires that I gladly put on my rigs. Tires are a ridiculous expense these days, and 99.34756% of the time, having a tire that is just a little worn is not going to kill you.
    Depends, after a certain point they get dangerous and will not carve a turn safely or they might strand you on a long ride. The more cost effective solution is don't buy fast-wearing tires except for situations where you are willing to take the hit, like racing. Don't use those tires everywhere and switch out for your "normal" tires for the normal stuff.


    2) Skip the $30 multi-tool and buy a cheap set of allens/torx at Harbor Freight, throw in a cheap triangle spoke wrench and a chain tool. Done.
    I don't find this to be cheaper, a set of hexs, torxs, spoke tool and chain tool are undoubtely going to cost more than a decent topeak multi-tool. More cost effective is to find stuff at the hardware store to substitute for "bike-specific" stuff for your home tool-set, there are quite a few things that you can get that work well, t-handle hexs, pipe-cutters, PVC pipe for setting crown races bearings and seals, etc.


    3) Buy a CO2 pump that uses 12g BB gun cartridges instead of the way overpriced threaded ones. You can buy a box of 40, 12g CO2 carts from Wal Mart for $17. For the math challenged, that is 42 cents each. Who in hell pays $3 EACH for the threaded ones? That is just dumb.
    The only reason I have a CO2 is for XC racing, and I don't want to be fumbling with multiple cartridges, plus those 12g ones are not threaded, they don't come close to filling modern tires either. Unless you are XC racing and need to throw in a tube and quickly fill, I do not recommend a CO2, use a good reliable pump (again, topeak makes some good stuff). The pump has unlimited air, which is a far better solution except for something like XC racing. I still run into fools on the trail that don't carry a pump (with flat tires). Using 12g cartridges to fill tires is just wasteful. You can also pick up a high volume floor pump for about that same amount at Wal-Mart, if it's filling at home that you are using those CO2s for.


    4) Shorts with a built in diaper liner are dumb. Buy some cheap road bibs, and just wear your favorite baggies over those. My favorite riding shorts consist of a $30 pair of Performance (RIP) brand bibs and a cheap pair of Columbia hiking shorts.
    Road bibs aren't very cheap, neither are decent chamois shorts. While I like the separate liner shorts, I don't have much against the built-in ones either.


    5) $50 for long fingered gloves? Buy some Mechanix or other brand work gloves for $15-$20. You can't even tell they aren't "bike" gloves from 10 feet away.
    I too do not like the mechanix gloves, but I've been buying Fox "motorcycle/atv" gloves for years and they work great, they aren't padded and they are made for grabbing bars that are essentially the same diameter, they can usually be found for $20-30. I don't think most riders buy $50 gloves, $25 is about my limit.


    6) I have a really nice Zoic flannel riding shirt. It made me realize that *any* flannel shirt works great for riding in the mountains.
    Wicking moisture and quick-drying are the most important features in my experience. Flannel has little use to me, except for cruising slow and looking fashionable. I ride hard though and the clothing has to be functional. Things like packable jackets are awesome, wicking and quick-drying jerseys, long and short sleeve. This is where you can save money, you don't need to buy brand names with huge logos on em, you can get great quick-drying/wicking stuff at Target and other places on the cheap. Sometimes things like zippers on jerseys are a nice feature, but again, not absolutely necessary, so some money can be saved, but I sure as hell wouldn't be buying flannel, lol.

    7) If you want a breathable quarter zip jersey, Carhartt makes some awesome ones out of the same type of breathable material your $80 jersey uses. https://www.carhartt.com/products/ca...ter-Zip-102223
    This isn't a new thing, you can get this stuff at most department stores.


    8) The variety of exotic chain lubes make me laugh. Your f*ing chain is a replaceable item. If you spend $20 on chain lube, I got nothin'. TriFlow from Wal Mart or Home Depot works great in dry conditions. 0w-40 synthetic motor oil works great as an all around. You know what works great in really wet conditions? Chainsaw bar oil. Flame away as I laugh all the way to the brewery where I can actually afford something other than PBR.
    I find most dry lube to be trash, even in dry environments, the one creek or wet spot you pass washes it away too easily. It works great in the winter here with snow, but so does everything else. Yes, synthetic motor oil or bar-oil works great for sloppy conditions. That said, I find Dumonde Tech to be "in between" wet and dry lubes, with some of the good properties of both, while avoiding the negatives, wet lubes usually attract gunk and dry lubes don't last well in wet environments. I do agree that people tend to rave about the latest and greatest lube, only to find out it's just another dry lube or whatever. I've tried most of them and do not find any significant differences. Again, I find a better idea on my 50-100 mile rides is to take a very small bottle of some synthetic motor oil, because nothing lasts forever and being able to add some lube mid-ride makes a huge difference on a muddy ride. No normal lube is going to protect that far in real nasty conditions.


    9) Riding at night? Spending $200 on lights? WTF? You can buy any number of good, solid, handlebar mounts for tactical flashlights off eBay for $5. Wake up call: Almost every high end bike light uses a CREE LED. The *same* LEDs can be found in USB-rechargeable 1000 lumen tactical flashlights for $50.
    Most of those tactical flashlights typically do not approach the lumens that we use for night riding, and those that do have a similar cost associated with them. The cheap stuff does not last, may of us have tried that too. We also want something that will last for at least a few hours, that means more lumens and battery that you can step down to lower brightness for longer burn. Quality 1000 lumen lights for bikes are now around $70, with stuff from nightrider and light n motion, but those are more supplemental than what I'd want as my primary. Getting a quality light like a cygolite or gemini is worth it, I've tried flashlights and the cheaper stuff. Sorry, I can't agree here, it's way off base.


    10) Shimano SLX components work every bit as well as XT components, which is to say the stuff rocks. Look at the price differential and you wonder if the nicer finish on the XT stuff really matters. Do you really notice the 100 gram weight savings on your 32 pound enduro bike? Here is a tip, lose 400 grams by taking a dump before your next ride.
    Sometimes. I will freely admit that a $80 crankset works just as well as a $450 carbon fiber one, so in many cases this is done for weight. In other areas, the more expensive part does work significantly better. Sometimes there are differences that you may not be aware of, even when the parts look similar or the same. The $500 I paid for a set of D5 studded tires was worth ever penny. So in some cases, the function is worth the price. For the other stuff, yes, I do notice a bike that weighs 26lb vs 32, or whatever, but the only way I get there is by making sure every part isn't carrying excessive weight. Is it the biggest concern in the world? No. Is it a concern if you race? Is it a concern elsewhere? It can be, and every gram adds up, it's easier to ride and maneuver a lighter bike all day long. There's no correct answer. Durability, function and weight all come together to form a purchase decision.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Howard View Post

    5) I have poor circulation in my fingers, so cheap gloves often mean I cant brake as my hands are frozen solid. Warm breathable gloves ain't cheap.
    Good point, I really like the wind-blocker pearl izumi gloves for cool temps, any more and my palms overheat while my fingers stay frozen (so I move to pogies), but wind-blocking makes a big difference.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  97. #97
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    I volunteer my time at the shop helping with online sales of vintage gear (since I have the idiot savant knowledge) and also step up as the mechanic for programs with the CHP and Sheriff's Dept's bike rodeos for the kids. In return, I'm kicked down tubes, tires, steep discounts on components, freebies like gloves, shop time. I could go on. Shit, I'd do it for free.
    Ripping trails and tipping ales

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