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Thread: Handlebar width

  1. #1
    dwt
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    Handlebar width

    Seems the western Trail and AM trend is very wide bars (along with short stem) on 5-7" travel bikes

    Unfortunately I live in the NE where we typically ride narrow tree lined single track rather than wide open rocky expanses.

    If your bars are too wide where I ride you risk two bad consequences: 1) fingers, pinkie especially, smashed into trees; 2) front wheel spun perpendicular to trail due to bar/tree collision.

    I rode today with my usual group who are all on 120mm XC bikes, two 26'ers and three 29'ers ( me included). At a paltry 26" wide, my bars were the widest in the group. One guy's bar is 24"; the other three are a tiny 23". I measured them all after the ride, since I was the only guy to suffer a bruised finger and a crash due to front wheel bumped sideways after tree collision. Nobody else had any problems. I plan to cut 1" off each side of my bar before my next ride tomorrow or Sunday.

    Comments?
    Last edited by dwt; 06-01-2013 at 10:53 AM.
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    I ride tight stuff too (VA). I've ridden a bit in the north east, so I know what you are talking about. I was hesitant to go too wide for a long time. Started with ~585mm (23") way back in the day (late 90's). Over 14 years I slowly worked up to 720mm with no problems. Now I'm at 750mm. It's getting a little tight, and very occasionally they are too wide to ride straight through something, but I like it too much the other 99.9% of the time to cut them back down.
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

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    You're spot on. The lack of dense trees - at least here in the sub-tropic deserts of socal - means being able to get away with ridiculously wide bars. The confidence and stability of wide bars on a descent is great. I'm not sure if I'd be able to get used to east coast riding, where narrow bars are necessary.

    What I don't get is how the north shore guys do it. They run super wide bars while going through northwestern forests. I guess the tree density there is still lower than on the east coast.
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    A 20" diameter steering wheel off of an old Chevy would be perfect. You could put your hands at 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock!

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    Bars at 720mm and 100% of my riding is on the tree-lined singletrack of MD and PA. Wider bars on narrower trails is no big deal, when it looks like a tight fit I just slow down and wiggle through. Those tight squeezes probably make up less than 1% of the trail, definately not nearly enough for me to ever consider cutting the bars down.

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    Once you learn which type of trees are more likely to jump into the trail you'll be OK.
    Round and round we go

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    A big benefit of wide bars is that it opens your lungs. But as stated if you risk running into trees, cutting bars is only solution.

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    I use 660mm bars and I'm satisfied with it however I found today a singletrack trail which was so narrow I couldn't descend faster than on foot. On the two sides it was full of spikey plants so the wide bar (relatively wide on an xc bike) wasn't too good there.

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    dwt
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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by Wishful Tomcat View Post
    Wider bars on narrower trails is no big deal, when it looks like a tight fit I just slow down and wiggle through..
    Slowing down is not an option when you are riding with a fast group. You would correctly be abused if you held up people behind you to cautiously wiggle between trees or overgrowth with your fashionable western AM wide bars. If you are riding in the back, you risk getting dropped- the group is riding fast and narrow is not an issue for them.

    I'm thinking function over fashion dictates narrower bars in eastern singletrack XC terrain. YMMV.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Slowing down is not an option when you are riding with a fast group. You would correctly be abused if you held up people behind you to cautiously wiggle between trees or overgrowth with your fashionable western AM wide bars. If you are riding in the back, you risk getting dropped- the group is riding fast and narrow is not an issue for them.

    I'm thinking function over fashion dictates narrower bars in eastern singletrack XC terrain. YMMV.
    I think you are blaming a lack of skill on equipment. I think you are going to find that you are just as slow and whatnot with the narrower bars. If you are clipping you hands, the issue is not the width of the bar, but a lack of awareness where your bar actually ends.

    I've ridden all up and down the east coast, and the worries over wider bars are seriously overblown. Certainly 26" should be a none-issue pretty much anywhere I have ever ridden.

    Do what you want, but to chop a 26" bar down to 24" just to avoid trees sounds pretty silly to me.
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by kapusta View Post

    I think you are blaming a lack of skill on equipment. I think you are going to find that you are just as slow and whatnot with the narrower bars. If you are clipping you hands, the issue is not the width of the bar, but a lack of awareness where your bar actually ends.
    Is that what you think? HTF would you know? Who appointed you the all knowing god of bicycle skills?

    Here's what I think: I've been riding the same terrain for over 20 years and never had a problem hitting my pinkies against trees or getting my bar twisted until I decided go for wider bars last year for no other reason than fashion. Did the terrain I ride change, or was there any other objective reason to change them? Hell no.

    My new bars started out @ 700mm and were cut back to 660 after my first tree encounters. Yesterday after a few more incidents and after lagging behind my usual pack after a handlebar twisted induced crash, I caught a ration of shyte from them for being a "fashionista."

    Personally, I think it makes infinitely more sense to conform my equipment to the terrain I ride and what my peers use than to listen to or be influenced by shyte from anonymous know it alls on the internets.

    I've ridden all up and down the east coast, and the worries over wider bars are seriously overblown. Certainly 26" should be a none-issue pretty much anywhere I have ever ridden. Do what you want, but to chop a 26" bar down to 24" just to avoid trees sounds pretty silly to me.
    I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am by you, though doubtful as much as you are self impressed. It takes a lot of balls to give anonymous unsolicited riding instruction online to people you don't know, based upon a post to a forum.

    Why not come over to my area and show us all how gods ride? We can't wait.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Is that what you think? HTF would you know? Who appointed you the all knowing god of bicycle skills?

    Here's what I think: I've been riding the same terrain for over 20 years and never had a problem hitting my pinkies against trees or getting my bar twisted until I decided go for wider bars last year for no other reason than fashion. Did the terrain I ride change, or was there any other objective reason to change them? Hell no.

    My new bars started out @ 700mm and were cut back to 660 after my first tree encounters. Yesterday after a few more incidents and after lagging behind my usual pack after a handlebar twisted induced crash, I caught a ration of shyte from them for being a "fashionista."

    Personally, I think it makes infinitely more sense to conform my equipment to the terrain I ride and what my peers use than to listen to or be influenced by shyte from anonymous know it alls on the internets.



    I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am by you, though doubtful as much as you are self impressed. It takes a lot of balls to give anonymous unsolicited riding instruction online to people you don't know, based upon a post to a forum.

    Why not come over to my area and show us all how gods ride? We can't wait.
    Hmmm, sounds to me like you haven't gotten used to your new wider bars yet...
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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by ajd245246 View Post
    Hmmm, sounds to me like you haven't gotten used to your new wider bars yet...
    Handlebar width-imageuploadedbytapatalk1370142692.419225.jpg
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    I'm riding an 09 trance x (5 inch travel) that came with 640mm (25.2 in.) bars and a 100mm stem that I switched to 785mm (30.9 in.) bars and a 50mm stem. At first I kept catching the bars on trees but I got used to it after a while. I almost cut them down but I love the stability with the wide bars so they're still at 785mm. The trails I ride are pretty open so I can get away with it. The thing I hate about cutting stuff down is that its a lot more expensive to make it longer if I cut it too short

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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Is that what you think? HTF would you know? Who appointed you the all knowing god of bicycle skills?


    Personally, I think it makes infinitely more sense to conform my equipment to the terrain I ride and what my peers use than to listen to or be influenced by shyte from anonymous know it alls on the internets.


    I can't begin to tell you how impressed I am by you, though doubtful as much as you are self impressed. It takes a lot of balls to give anonymous unsolicited riding instruction online to people you don't know, based upon a post to a forum.

    Why not come over to my area and show us all how gods ride? We can't wait.
    Quit being such a pansy. Get your chainsaw and cut down the offending trees.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Slowing down is not an option when you are riding with a fast group. You would correctly be abused if you held up people behind you to cautiously wiggle between trees or overgrowth with your fashionable western AM wide bars. If you are riding in the back, you risk getting dropped- the group is riding fast and narrow is not an issue for them.
    To quote you "Who appointed you the all knowing god of bicycle skills?"

    Its easy to say you and your group are fast. There is always someone faster. For all you know, Tomcat wiggling past a tight spot might be only spot in an entire ride where you gained ground on him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Slowing down is not an option when you are riding with a fast group. You would correctly be abused if you held up people behind you to cautiously wiggle between trees or overgrowth with your fashionable western AM wide bars. If you are riding in the back, you risk getting dropped- the group is riding fast and narrow is not an issue for them.
    I ride solo, I only have to keep up with myself.

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    Is that what you think? HTF would you know? Who appointed you the all knowing god of bicycle skills?

    Here's what I think: I've been riding the same terrain for over 20 years and never had a problem hitting my pinkies against trees or getting my bar twisted until I decided go for wider bars last year for no other reason than fashion. Did the terrain I ride change, or was there any other objective reason to change them? Hell no.
    Then why did you ask for comments?

    I've ridden in Maryland, California, and now Mississippi, and Mississippi has the tightest trees (wetter and warmer than MD or CA) IME. Up until January I was riding with 550 mm bars on a 26er. In January I bought a 29er with 700 mm bars. On the same trails I was suddenly pinballing off maybe half a dozen trees. But after a couple of rides I got faster, and I realized that I could fit between the trees, I just had to be more accurate in my line.

    My suggestion is to do some rides by yourself on your group ride trails. SLOW DOWN when you come up to your narrow trees and look at the spacing between trees and at the line you need to take to not hit the trees. My bars got almost 6" wider, but I still have 1" clearance between every set of tight trees.

    I still think about cutting my bars down to 650 mm like yours, but I haven't done it yet.

    And for reference, my skill level is such that I can keep up with the Cat 1 racers when they're out for a fun ride and I'm riding hard.

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    Handlebar width



    This thread went downhill fast. I have tight trees where I am at and you get used to it in about the same time it takes to get used to clip less pedals

    You NE'ers are so damn defensive. Does not make me miss working up there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jkidd_39 View Post


    This thread went downhill fast. I have tight trees where I am at and you get used to it in about the same time it takes to get used to clip less pedals

    You NE'ers are so damn defensive. Does not make me miss working up there.
    What the hell did you just say about us NE'ers, huh, HUH?!
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    Handlebar width

    Haha. If your from the NE and know what I'm talking about you won't be offended. You will just chuckle at the clarity if my statement.

    I couldn't ride with 660s it would drive me crazy. Love my wide bars

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    Quote Originally Posted by jkidd_39 View Post
    I couldn't ride with 660s it would drive me crazy. Love my wide bars


    660's aren't wide? Now I feel inadequate.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gregon2wheels View Post

    And for reference, my skill level is such that I can keep up with the Cat 1 racers when they're out for a fun ride and I'm riding hard.

    When I drive my Honda Civic 80 mph it can keep up with a Bugatti Veyron going 80mph.

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    Do what fits YOU and YOUR terrain best. I have ridden anything from 22" flat bars all the way to 28" 1"riser bars. Right now I have 26" riser bars that fit my body perfectly. Some of the singletrack trees get really tight but you adapt over time and soon the bars become more like an extension of your hand compared to another object.

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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    When I drive my Honda Civic 80 mph it can keep up with a Bugatti Veyron going 80mph.
    Yep. But the Bugatti and the Civic are only riding together so long as the Bugatti driver wants to. I'm just trying to give the OP a point of reference for my riding skills/speed - my all out is about the speed of a Cat 1 rider who is riding fast enough to have fun but not fast enough to push the pace.

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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    660's aren't wide? Now I feel inadequate.
    I'm using 730s now. I will prob go 760s on my next bike.

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    Handlebar width

    I'm from MD and just upgraded to 750mm bars and love them! I only have one spot I have issues with. If I'm precise with my line I have absolutely no issues.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gregon2wheels View Post
    Yep. But the Bugatti and the Civic are only riding together so long as the Bugatti driver wants to.

    and.........?


    I'm only kidding (sort of), but in my defense that was a pretty blatant setup you delivered.

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    What is the real advantage of wide bars? I have always felt more comfortable and more in control with my narrow bars. hence this wide bar trend has left me a bit confused.

    It's like being on a sport bike, then getting on a cruiser with ape hangers. It just makes you feel vulnerable and slow.

    maybe i just haven't spent enough time with them as i've only used them when borrowing friends bikes. or maybe it's just my style, i guess now that i think about it, I tend to keep my elbows closer to my body than most, thus anything much wider than my shoulders would feel strange.

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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by SAthirtythree View Post
    What is the real advantage of wide bars? I have always felt more comfortable and more in control with my narrow bars. hence this wide bar trend has left me a bit confused.

    It's like being on a sport bike, then getting on a cruiser with ape hangers. It just makes you feel vulnerable and slow.

    maybe i just haven't spent enough time with them as i've only used them when borrowing friends bikes. or maybe it's just my style, i guess not that i think about it, I tend to keep my elbows closer to my body than most.
    I feel better on the DHs with my wide bars. I love the direct feeling of my short stem and bars. I feel like I can really manhandle the bike.

    Also, being 6'4" I breathe a whole lot better with the bars.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SAthirtythree View Post
    What is the real advantage of wide bars? I have always felt more comfortable and more in control with my narrow bars. hence this wide bar trend has left me a bit confused.

    It's like being on a sport bike, then getting on a cruiser with ape hangers. It just makes you feel vulnerable and slow.
    Not at all. It more like being on a sport bike with clip-ons and then switching to a a supermoto with a wider but still flat bar -- it's still an aggressive bike, but you benefit from the leverage compared to narrow clip-ons on the sportbike.

    Ape hangers or tiller bars seriously change the relationship and angles between your arms and the forks. Wider bars are still (mostly) flat like your narrow bars, they're just wider.

    You turn the bar more to deflect the wheel, but (1) a small change at the bars = a small change at the wheel so they're more precise and (2) a wheel direction change requires less effort.

    You're probably noticing that you do need to move your hands along a longer path to turn the wheel the same degrees. That's true, but, to me anyway, the difference is so small that the benefits are worth it.

    I'm not convinced that (for me) a 700 mm bar is the best width. Narrower might be better. But between 700 mm and 550 mm, 700 is so much more comfortable.

  31. #31
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    Well, you did ask for comments on the idea that riding in tight east coast forests requires narrower bars, and then seemed (to me, at least) to imply that one could not keep up with riders on narrower bars if you are riding bars 660mm (26") or wider.
    Here's what I think: I've been riding the same terrain for over 20 years and never had a problem hitting my pinkies against trees or getting my bar twisted until I decided go for wider bars last year for no other reason than fashion.
    My new bars started out @ 700mm and were cut back to 660 after my first tree encounters.
    I clipped a few trees at first when I went up to from 685's to 720's (whacked my pinky up pretty good one time) and then again when I went to 750's. It happened a few times until I re-adjusted to where my hands were. Just like people often get pedal strikes when they first ride a bike with a BB a bit lower than they are used to. Most people adjust to it over time and stop smacking their pedals. FWIW, going from 585 to 610 to 660 to 685 all took a little time to mentally adjust to, but never involved suddenly clipping more trees.

    I was not suggesting that you ought to be riding wider bars, ride whatever you like. However, I am suggesting that narrow trees do not automatically necessitate 610mm bars to keep up. That fact that plenty of people do not have an issue with wider bars on tight East Coast should be some indication of this. No, I am not some riding "god", that's the whole point: you don't need to be.

    Sure, at some point bar width becomes an issue. But for most people, 660mm is not an issue, even in the tight stuff. I can see where 750mm could be in some areas.

    Of course, if (as you say) fashion was the only reason you went with wider bars, that was kind of silly. I certainly would not ride wider bars just for the way they look.
    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Yesterday after a few more incidents and after lagging behind my usual pack after a handlebar twisted induced crash, I caught a ration of shyte from them for being a "fashionista."
    Well, you did just put them on for fashion, so they have a point. However, I hope this was just good-natured ribbing, otherwise I'd be riding with someone else.

    Personally, I think it makes infinitely more sense to conform my equipment to the terrain I ride and what my peers use than to listen to or be influenced by shyte from anonymous know it alls on the internets.
    Then why did you ask for comments on the subject on the internet?
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

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    Re: Handlebar width

    Skills...get some

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    I just started riding mountain bikes last year (upstate NY), . My skills still suck, but are getting better. I am riding a Cannondale Trigger-1 with very wide bars and I occasionally clip a tree. I clipped one a few weeks ago on a fast down hill with a tight right hand turn at the bottom that sent me into a bad crash. My riding friends keep telling me to cut my bars but I just say no. Eventually I will learn how to get around the tree's just like I finally got over that big log on the steep uphill that used to scare the crap out of me. I am getting better all the time. I just hope I learn how to get around the tree's before I'm to old to ride.

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    Quick question for you guys currently running wide bars.

    Do you have flat, small rise, or large rise bars; and why?

    Just looking to add some more info into the mix while we are on the subject.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajd245246 View Post
    Quick question for you guys currently running wide bars.

    Do you have flat, small rise, or large rise bars; and why?

    Just looking to add some more info into the mix while we are on the subject.
    I have used them all. The rise itself is not the important part, it's how high the grips are. A flat bar with a bunch of spacers could end up in the same spot at a high-rise with no spacers.

    Fork length, head tube length, spacers under the stem, stem rise, and bar rise all add up to the position of the grips.

    So the "why" part of your question is just that whatever rise I use gets the grips where I want them. In the end, if the grips are in the same place, they all work the same.
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ajd245246 View Post
    Quick question for you guys currently running wide bars.

    Do you have flat, small rise, or large rise bars; and why?

    Just looking to add some more info into the mix while we are on the subject.
    I use 785mm bars with a 1/2 in. (12mm) rise and a 50mm stem with a 0 degree rise. Basically for the same reason as kapusta. It puts the grips right where I want them, which for me is riduculously far apart from each other and fairly low down.

    Edit: Fixed rise on bars

  37. #37
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    Handlebar width

    Quote Originally Posted by Gregon2wheels View Post
    Then why did you ask for comments?

    I've ridden in Maryland, California, and now Mississippi, and Mississippi has the tightest trees (wetter and warmer than MD or CA) IME. Up until January I was riding with 550 mm bars on a 26er. In January I bought a 29er with 700 mm bars. On the same trails I was suddenly pinballing off maybe half a dozen trees. But after a couple of rides I got faster, and I realized that I could fit between the trees, I just had to be more accurate in my line.

    My suggestion is to do some rides by yourself on your group ride trails. SLOW DOWN when you come up to your narrow trees and look at the spacing between trees and at the line you need to take to not hit the trees. My bars got almost 6" wider, but I still have 1" clearance between every set of tight trees.

    I still think about cutting my bars down to 650 mm like yours, but I haven't done it yet.

    And for reference, my skill level is such that I can keep up with the Cat 1 racers when they're out for a fun ride and I'm riding hard.
    My skill (and fitness) level is not close to keeping up with Cat 1's, anytime.

    I'n not racing or trying to impress anyone, just trying to stay in the pack. I don't like getting dropped by or holding up my usual riding compadres. Who does?

    So the fast & easy solution for me is to cut the bars to the length they use. The learning curve for wider too steep for me. I admit it. No patience for that. And maybe not enough skill. Whatever. Just want to keep up without getting banged up.
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  38. #38
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    When you went with wider bars, did you use a shorter stem? What's your stem length? I ride the NE, mostly so NH and MA, I don't have issues with wide bars. I'm running 750s, but I've been messing with grip placement for the last month plus (can't add length once I cut... I think there at 730 or 740 right now). I've also tried 65, 50, 40 stems with the same bar. There are a few trails that I've had to slow down to squeeze between two trees, but that's rare.

    I have seen a drawback to wide bars, a buddy was cruzing along at a decent speed, it was dusk, he tried to fit between two trees and his bike came to a complete stop... He was/is running 750 bars. He gouged the trees, the bike was slightly stuck, and he was a little rattled.

    Run what's comfortable to you, but I would suggest playing with grip placement before cutting. Who cares what your riding buddies ride for width, there are too many variables between bikes and people to say X length is the appropriate width. I dont measure my friends bars, I experiment until I feel comfortable on my bike

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    Handlebar width

    I ride 660's in the wooded midwest. No trouble whatsoever. I know where the ends of my bars are and adjust to compensate. The bar twitch maneuver can be done pretty quickly so you don't need to slow that much unless the trees really are narrower than your bars.

    I clip my bars occasionally but rarely and it's always because of a mental lapse. It has nothing to do with my bar width. I just chose the wrong line.

    I know people who feel the need to ride with much narrower bars on the same trails. Whatever. But if you ask me, it is not necessary to be so picky about bar length. I could probably manage with wider bars but I am a smaller guy and feel my chest open up well on what I have. I don't feel a need to go wider. I already feel weird on my city bike with narrower bars after riding my mtb.

    I am riding with On One Fleegle Pros to get the grips where I like. Comfy.

  40. #40
    fly on the wall
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    Using wider bars is more than just a fashion or regional matter. When paired correctly with a stem, wider bars cause your torso to be further back on the bike compared to a narrow bar. This means your CG is further back - even by a little - to make steep descents more manageable.

    Wider bars are meant to be paired with a short stem, just like narrow bars are meant to be paired with a longer stem. The distance from the fork steerer to the end of the bars is a torque arm. The shorter the torque arm (narrower bar), the harder it is to maintain wheel stability in rough terrain. To compensate for this, running a long stem with a narrow bar puts the torque further ahead of your fork's axis of rotation (I forget the technical name for this), which brings back stability. But this also brings your CG far forward. Running a short stem would put your CG back nicely, but now you loose the stability brought on by the distance from the steerer. To regain that stability, you can increase the torque arm, which means increasing the length of the bars.
    ~Always avoid alliteration.

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  41. #41
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    Take a proportional approach.
    Went to a skills clinic yesterday; the suggestion was to assume a normal pushup position and note the distance between the outsides of your hands. The would be about the right width for your handlebars. Alternately, sitting or standing, bend your arms at a 45 degree angle and note this neutral position; translate to handlebar width.
    For me, that means I'm running my handle bars about an inch short on either side.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by June Bug View Post
    Take a proportional approach.
    Went to a skills clinic yesterday; the suggestion was to assume a normal pushup position and note the distance between the outsides of your hands. The would be about the right width for your handlebars. Alternately, sitting or standing, bend your arms at a 45 degree angle and note this neutral position; translate to handlebar width.
    For me, that means I'm running my handle bars about an inch short on either side.
    I have always though that basing bar width on where you place your hands for some activity other than biking is a little half-baked. Though I must admit that when I tried this just now I got within 10mm of what my bars are (750mm).

    The 45 degree method gives me 860mm
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

  43. #43
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    I used to have 23" bar. Sold the bike to a friend. My new Yeti has wide bars. I've been on it for two years now. I switched with the guy who bought my old bike so he could try it out. Those short bars are really twitchy and I hated them although they seemed fine at the time.

  44. #44
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    I recently set my Karate Monkey up for some road/trail riding with my old 23" bars and bar ends. Felt great on the road, but holy crap, I can't believe I used to ride technical trails that way! And before that I was riding 22" bars (with a 135mm stem)!
    15mm is a second-best solution to a problem that was already solved.

  45. #45
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    Did my first road ride with my new 17.5" drop bars. What an improvement over 16.5" drop bars.

    As far as rider/flat/etc. I had flat bars with a slight sweep back. The bars are just slightly higher than the seat. I would say a baseline for most people just riding (i.e., not dedicated DH or XC racing) is to put the bars at the same height as the seat and then adjust up or down for comfort and performance, regardless of whether you use riser bars or not.

  46. #46
    dwt
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    Handlebar width

    Cut the bar to 610 mm and installed 90mm stem. MUCH happier camper now.

    As always, YMMV.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Handlebar width-imageuploadedbytapatalk1370377805.311623.jpg  

    Old enough to know better. And old enough not to care. Best age to be.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwt View Post
    Cut the bar to 610 mm and installed 90mm stem. MUCH happier camper now.
    And that's all that matters.
    "The sound of a car door opening in front of you is similar to the sound of a gun being cocked."

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