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  1. #101
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    Lol ^^

  2. #102
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    59, still happily married, 2 kids (22, 25). I've always been main bread winner. I've been lucky enough to have a job that pays well with great benefits although it's not what I would consider 'fun' by any stretch. We've been able to make things work so I could be a good dad but still 'do my thing' every now and then without pissing her off. I sometimes screwed up but in the end, that's what every guy needs to try to figure out.

    Looking back I was able to do lots of things that some consider risky for a family man but I made adjustments and got my thrills while keeping myself relatively healthy and staying true to my 'duties' as a responsible parent and spouse. I mountain biked, I skied and ski raced, took short annual trips out West snowcat skiing in the back country, rode motorcycles in NH for a few days, etc. Sometimes a dance recital or a ballgame took priority...no biggie.

    Things change over time. When my kids were young, they LOVED skiing...I have not skied with either of them for 3-4 years. My son LOVED to mountain bike with me...he has not ridden for 2-3 years. 3 years ago he bought a motorcycle and we LOVE riding together...just a different kind of riding.

    My point is, everyone needs to figure out that balance that will work for you and your family. Don't be selfish but don't sell yourself short. There's a happy medium...go find it, be flexible and work it out.
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  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Ha ha, I can pretty much guarantee you that showing a video of Gwin or Gee shredding a trail will not convince my daughters to go send it off some jumps.
    NAT, show them some race runs of Rachel Atherton then. Female riders inspire girls

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    That works until your kids get a little older and decide that mountain biking is for lame middle aged men. Sigh...
    I am ecstatic to say that I get to spend LOTS of time in the mountains with my 18 year old daughter. 3 days a week for 7 months of the year biking, and the other 5 months we spend in the mountains skiing together. I suspect that maybe the appeal of hanging with dear old dad may grow old and tired pretty soon, but it hasn't yet!!!

    I made my daughter watch the 2018 Red Bull Rampage start to finish with me on Saturday. That was pushing it.

    OP - your's is a very tricky situation. I read you opening post and a bunch of responses to my significant other. She was as stymied as I was in terms of a clear response. We talked about it for about 45 minutes. I will leave it to people who are much smarter than me to sort out. That said, biking has been a very special bond for my daughter and I. I would never want to give it up, for that reason alone. But if I was injuring myself to the point of it interfering with my ability to provide for my family, I would dial shit way back. WAY BACK.

  5. #105
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    1. Don’t take marriage advice from anyone. Usually those who have had bad relationships / divorces are the first to offer and list all the things you should not put up with.

    2. If you want real marriage advice see a therapist.

    3. My 2 cents. (Married happily 20 years, while I am the bread winner she is my better half by a mile - and is right 99% of the time) She is right, there is no argument at the current time that will help. Sell your bikes, recuperate, get back to work. Earn your points back with your wife. Once there start with a cruiser or road bike or gravel bike or trail running or hiking. Eventually working your way back to MTB. You’ve got to ride like you can’t get hurt. I’m 44 and my body just does not heal the way it used to, simple falls leave me hurting for months. I can not afford to be out of work. My goal is to be able to enjoy this sport when I am 75. The only way to do that is to minimize risk. Its not so much what you do but keeping well within your comfort zone. If you come across something that you’ve cleared 10 times before but your not feeling it today just walk it. Your tired - walk it. Accept you are past your prime when it comes to jumps and tech and look for the other wonderful things in this sport. For me I have replaced the search for adrenaline with a search for “flow”, you can look up definitions but basically its you are riding challenging enough terrain that it takes your full focus but not pushing your limits and reaching fear. You are in the zone, one with the bike, and the rest of the world slips away. I also love just being out in nature, even a day where I can’t clear anything and have no energy I just stop and enjoy my surroundings. Fitness/ climbing - you can certainly improve that. It’s weird how as I get older I get a bigger sense of accomplishment by the amount I can climb rather then how fast I can go down. Adventure - I love seeing new trails.

    Good luck- from the way you talk it sounds like a lot of your life is shitty right now and you have a wife and child that mean the world to you and who care about you. Don’t **** that up, because then you will be truly miserable.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    NAT, show them some race runs of Rachel Atherton then. Female riders inspire girls
    You’re just going to have to come to terms with the fact that my kids have other interests.

    Cripes, now I regret even joking about it because you guys are making it weird.

  7. #107
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    Go see the documentary, "Free Solo", about Alex Honnold free soloing El Capitan. That ought to put things in perspective... Or if you can't catch that one (since it is just now appearing in limited release), try Jimmy Chin's previous documentary, "Meru". Jimmy's wife is his partner on these two documentaries, and as a non-climber., she brought in the perspective of the climber's partners/wives. ("Meru" includes the story of Alex Lowe and his widow, as mentioned earlier).

    It all boils down to values. The couples that stay together value the same things in life. If you have a partner that is afraid of risk and it's what makes you feel alive - then you might have a problem.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    If any kid views mountain biking as lame or for middle aged men, show them AARON GWIN or Gee Atherton. There's no reason any kid shoukd view mountain biking in negative light like that.
    I think you are projecting your passion for the hobby onto others. Kids have different personalities and different inherent interests. Expose them to the hobby but don't consider it a parenting failure if they end up not liking it (or even hating it).

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    I think you are projecting your passion for the hobby onto others. Kids have different personalities and different inherent interests. Expose them to the hobby but don't consider it a parenting failure if they end up not liking it (or even hating it).
    Thank you for getting it.

  10. #110
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    Considering most of my friends either have kids that ride MX or MTB and love it, I don't think its come on projecting. Start them off young, teach them how to really ride and they will come to love it. While kids may have different personalities, I heavily disagree with having different interests. I know 2 that are very fast and talented. One is 15 and races with Pros in MTB and the other rides a 85cc racing dirtbike.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    Considering most of my friends either have kids that ride MX or MTB and love it, I don't think its come on projecting. Start them off young, teach them how to really ride and they will come to love it. While kids may have different personalities, I heavily disagree with having different interests. I know 2 that are very fast and talented. One is 15 and races with Pros in MTB and the other rides a 85cc racing dirtbike.
    Well, I guess that proves that...



  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    I heavily disagree with having different interests.
    What???

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dropper View Post
    Anybody that has bills to pay and mouths to feed should check their ego at the door and ride within their limits.
    Agreed. I used to be a downhill junkie. Only had minor crashes with bruises. Never broke a thing. I am now riding with my hands on the brakes more than ever. Go slow and be careful. As of today, my wife is a SAHM. I can't get hurt!

  14. #114
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    Thank you for opening up. Some really good advice here! And some awful ones. But it shows the spectrum of freedom that we all live with and our different approaches.

    Some things to consider:
    How much do you love biking? Is it just some escape time or is who you are? If it's what makes you feel alive, then you have to pursue it. Every minute you spend makes you a better and happier person and that is key to who you are and how you are around your wife and kids.

    Talk, talk, relate - You're at the crossroads now and you have to talk and express what it means to you and what you're gonna do about it. Compromise, be around, help others understand

    Mitigate risk - If risk is a big problem, do everything in your power to minimize it. Get better gear, knee pads, armor and make sure it is tuned perfectly. Get bike lessons. Understand why you crash get all the tools to avoid it. Really increase your abilities and then ride at 80% of your abilities.

    For me, loving your family and owning up to responsibilities does not mean giving up your freedom and what makes you feel alive. It means doing what makes you a better, happier person. Minimize and control risk. And when it's time for your family, be there for them, 100%.
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  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dropper View Post
    Anybody that has bills to pay and mouths to feed should check their ego at the door and ride within their limits
    But what if I can't slow down, I can't hold back
    Though you know, I wish, I could?
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  16. #116
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    Existential (mtb) crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by the one ring View Post
    But what if I can't slow down, I can't hold back
    Though you know, I wish, I could?
    Ain’t nothin’ in this world for free...

  17. #117
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    "My relationship with my wife has been strained since the accident. She has had to take on more responsibility in caring for our two children and she is angry with me for causing this problem in our family unit.......
    Her argument is that apart from the money I spend on it, apart from the time it separates me from my family she considers it selfish of me to put a hobby over my own safety and responsibility to my family."

    She's right you're a selfish pr*ck. Your family should come first.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Not even for your kids? I'd say it depends.
    When my kids were young I certainly adjusted my riding schedule but never gave it up. Why would someone do that?
    Stick around if you're housebroken...

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    I think you are projecting your passion for the hobby onto others. Kids have different personalities and different inherent interests. Expose them to the hobby but don't consider it a parenting failure if they end up not liking it (or even hating it).
    I found that with my son. As much as I wanted him to embrace riding as much as I do, it just never took off for him. I admittedly felt like a failure at one point watching other friends' take to it. Then I realized that my son is his own being.
    Stick around if you're housebroken...

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    What???
    I'm guessing that may be sarcasm. It has to be.
    Stick around if you're housebroken...

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    Why would someone do that?

    Maybe because someone's wife says to give it up or they're done? At that point someone might have to decide whether riding is more important than being with family.

    I did similar to you but I'm not in the op's situation.
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  22. #122
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    Nature vs nurture.
    I've always been interested in the role of the father/child dynamic or even extended family and friends/community influence on a child vs a kids own independent nature. Personally I tend to lean much more toward the nurture aspect but there may be limited ways to control for that as evidenced here. Then again I'm a 46 year old virgin without a worry in the world so
    It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

  23. #123
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    If you are happy then (insert passion/hobby here) will make you happier. If not then (insert passion/hobby here) will just make you temporarily forget your unhappiness.

    When I was younger, I thought I can't possible live without my passion/hobby, well my kids sure proved me wrong.

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by formica View Post
    Biking he's had:
    Separated shoulder
    Broken pelvis and collarbone, same crash, two collarbone surguries put him in a wheel chair for a month.
    Cracked ribs two or three times.
    Broken wrist and ribs in the same year.
    Is he crashing on stuff that you can ride?

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    I'm guessing that may be sarcasm. It has to be.
    It's not. he's 100% serious. I'm glad he's toned things down here somewhat...

  26. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dropper View Post
    Ain’t nothin’ in this world for free...
    Until we close our eyes for good (a.k.a. until death do us part). Full-circle.
    All Li es Matter

  27. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    Considering most of my friends either have kids that ride MX or MTB and love it, I don't think its come on projecting. Start them off young, teach them how to really ride and they will come to love it. While kids may have different personalities, I heavily disagree with having different interests. I know 2 that are very fast and talented. One is 15 and races with Pros in MTB and the other rides a 85cc racing dirtbike.
    You have friends with kids AND know two kids? You truly are an expert on the subject, thanks for your input. /sarcasm

  28. #128
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    My father was into golf. Like, really into it and he was really good at it too. He got me started young and I played with him a lot up until middle school but then I realized it just wasn't for me. I liked bikes way more. I'm glad he didn't force me to continue golfing instead.

  29. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    My father was into golf. Like, really into it and he was really good at it too. He got me started young and I played with him a lot up until middle school but then I realized it just wasn't for me. I liked bikes way more. I'm glad he didn't force me to continue golfing instead.
    I have a (very) young daughter and I hope she is excited to MTB with me someday and will absolutely nurture that possibility... But what I hope far more is that she finds something, anything that she is as passionate about as I am MTB. I don't care what it is, I just want her to find it for herself and give it her all.

  30. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    When my kids were young I certainly adjusted my riding schedule but never gave it up. Why would someone do that?
    Because riding without a clear grasp of one's skill limits can lead to crashes and injuries that cause one to have to abrogate their responsibilties to their family and their co-workers. I'd say that if the OP can identify where his skills end and the potential for injury begins to escalate, he should keep riding. If he can't...he should hang it up.

  31. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    My father was into golf. Like, really into it and he was really good at it too. He got me started young and I played with him a lot up until middle school but then I realized it just wasn't for me. I liked bikes way more. I'm glad he didn't force me to continue golfing instead.
    Exactly the same for me. Golf lessons and clinics at the country club 4 days a week during the summer. It became a chore. I gave it up in college and haven't picked up a club since. Don't miss it a bit.

  32. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    I have a (very) young daughter and I hope she is excited to MTB with me someday and will absolutely nurture that possibility... But what I hope far more is that she finds something, anything that she is as passionate about as I am MTB. I don't care what it is, I just want her to find it for herself and give it her all.
    That's what I want for my kids too. I hope they find something that inspires them, both in terms of career and hobbies. When they were little I took them biking, skiing, and snowboarding with me but it doesn't get them excited like it does me.

  33. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    That's what I want for my kids too. I hope they find something that inspires them, both in terms of career and hobbies. When they were little I took them biking, skiing, and snowboarding with me but it doesn't get them excited like it does me.
    The way I see it you are still providing that model of what passion looks like. Who knows what it will be for them, but they will attack it with their full ability and get involved deeply because they saw you do that with your hobbies. That's my hope anyway.

  34. #134
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    I don't think the problem is the mountain bike or crashing the mountain bike. I think the wife is stressed out and worried about money and raising the kids. She feels like she has a partner that is not being a partner. She wants more effort in helping with the kids and making money. I see it all the time. If you are kicking butt in a career and or at home with the kids (homework, laundry, cooking, etc. etc) the mountain bike and crashing the mountain bike wouldn't be that big of an issue. I do wish you and your family the very best.

  35. #135
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    Paging Dr.Phil!
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  36. #136
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    I've been injured twice playing golf. Once I was hit by an errant shot off an adjacent tee, which caused my left forearm to go numb and I couldn't finish the round. The other time I split my eyebrow open with my own club when I was attacked by a swarm of June bugs. So I had to give it up.
    All Li es Matter

  37. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    My father was into golf. Like, really into it and he was really good at it too. He got me started young and I played with him a lot up until middle school but then I realized it just wasn't for me. I liked bikes way more. I'm glad he didn't force me to continue golfing instead.
    I have a similar story. My dad was into Hiking and Camping, he also dabbled in Scale Model Building and occasionally played golf. He tried MTB when I was very young and ended up with a compound fracture on his first ever big ride out and he stopped riding after that.

    I picked up model building and it was one of my escapes in my teenage years, I would disappear to the garage to go listen to music and build models to help with teenage angst. I still love model building, but for me now it has transition to miniature painting for boardgame parts, something I get to do on occasion at the moment because I have a 2 month old and a 2.5 year old. Funny that he got me interested, but I pursued the hobby separate from him.

    I still enjoy camping and have an amazing wife who also loves to camp, my dad's second wife prefers to camp via their 5th wheel luxo-trailer. But he still "camps" I guess.

    I got into Dirtbikes in my teenage years as well, but my father was not interested in doing that with me.

    I just don't think he was as interested in hanging out with his sons at that point in his life and we drifted apart for many years after that. My intentions as a father is to do the opposite, I love my son, he is basically a clone of me. Right now he loves watching MotoGP with me, riding bikes with me, playing with his hot wheels(I will play with him as well), etc, etc.

    I plan to introduce him to my other hobbies as he grows, Boardgames, Models and Mini painting, video games, reading, working on cars, etc.

    If he seems to gravitate towards only some of those and not the others I will just adjust what I do with him so I can focus on spending time with him. I plan to do the same with my daughter as well.

    My wife plans to teach him some of her loves, specifically cooking.

    Parents can always choose to embrace what their kids find interesting and participate, or not.
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  38. #138
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    You made some vows, then you got your wife pregnant and made some kids, to whom you have a responsibility until they reach 18.

    She made vows, and also bore your children and took on the same responsibilities of a parent.

    It appears that she is the more mature and responsible person in your family. Her commitment to her children's welfare is obvious.

    She has also previously TWICE demonstrated her commitment to you through two previous serious life-threatening injuries that you incurred because of your hobby, your sport.

    Where is your commitment to HER? To your kids? I'm not seeing it. Your injuries and burden on her is selfishness.

    Your wife's ultimatum is perfectly understandable. It's also reasonable, in the context of your marriage. You vowed for forsake all others. You promised to be faithful and true. You promised to honor and respect her.

    I'm sure when your wife married you, that the topic of the bike coming first, BEFORE her, before your family, before your kids, never came up.

    She sees the writing on the wall. You are not extremely talented as a rider, you take chances and get seriously injured. AGAIN. You don't learn from your mistakes. You don't moderate your activity so you can be there for her, instead you make HER cover for you because you have dumped your recovery and care on her.

    It's time to grow up, and act like an adult in an adult relationship, and to honor your vows to your wife. You blew it. Game over man.

    Give up your mistress and renew your commitment to your wife and your family. Put your family first. Find another safer outlet for your energy. There are many to chose from.
    "...So forget all your duties, oh yeah! Fat bottomed girls, they'll be riding today..." Freddie Mercury

  39. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    I'm kind of interested in knowing if each person commenting on this thread is single, happily married, begrudgingly married, divorced, etc. just to see where you're all coming from.

    I'm in the happily married camp, 20 years.
    Happily married 15 years, 3 kids ages 3-10. I think the OP is irresponsible. Doing jumps that he is scared of and breaking his neck is ridiculous. I have trails on my property that have 10 ft drops that I will never ride, and Im ok with that.

    After the first kid I didnt really have to give up anything. I played ultimate frisbee (going to tournaments), windsurfed, hockey, plus ad hoc hobbies.

    After the second kid I cut field sports, but mainly because I kept spraining my ankle. I switched to kitesurfing, added mountain biking, cut hockey. Mountain biking was good because I didnt need to schedule the time and could do it whenever there wasnt wind. It was mainly to keep in shape for kitesurfing. I love hockey and have played my whole life, but it is a specific time a few days a week and I was constantly having to miss. I also stopped trying new hobbies.

    The 3rd kid was a big change. My wife struggled to handle all the kids by herself so it was much harder for me to go out. I didnt kitesurf for 2 years and mainly did mountain biking here or there. Im slowly starting to add back kitesurfing and picked up shooting.

    Each kid reduced my free time, but it is the choice that I made. Kitesurfing requires a minimum of 4 hours, more if I have to drive to chase wind, which means it is really hard to get free time for it. During regular days Im getting an hour or two of mountain biking a few days a week (total of 3-5 hours of riding). I bought a trainer a month ago to keep my fitness since Im not riding that much.

    If I had put myself out of commission like you had there is no way I would still be mountain biking. I owe it to my family to keep myself in one piece. I mainly do cross country riding on technical trails, I would rather climb a technical ascent than descend a technical descent.

    My wife did let me sell our old house and use the money to buy acreage with bike trails. We rented a crappy place for a year and then bought a house bordering the property. She was a saint for letting me do that.

    I have a very large insurance policy and I own my own company so money will come in even if Im only incapacitated. I would say if I became a quadraplegic or died from mountain biking, or any hobby, it wasnt worth it because of the devastation it would cause to my family.

    I dont have any advice, just the story of what I have given up (2-5 hours/week instead of 10-12 hours/week) and our relationship is solid. Hopefully this is a reasonable counterbalance to all the guys saying **** everyone else, no one is going to stop them from biking.

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by goodmojo View Post

    My wife did let me sell our old house and use the money to buy acreage with bike trails. We rented a crappy place for a year and then bought a house bordering the property. She was a saint for letting me do that.

    .
    I want to do that so bad. Sounds amazing.
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  41. #141
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    TLR You've got a family, it's time to stop being a selfish ****.
    What a perfect waste of time

  42. #142
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    Stop biking and take up heavy drinking.

    In no time, she'll be trying to get you back on the bike.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  43. #143
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    Reminds me of the "Ultimate Fighter" episode on Friends.

    OP, I definitely sympathize with your wife. The ultimatum approach is harsh, but at some point it's better to just be direct. She of course wants to buy a house and make a nice home for your family. But if you are jeopardizing your income and health with these injuries, how can she have confidence to sign on a mortgage she might be stuck paying for it all herself? Then there is the whole issue of time away from your family. I can't say if she is right there, but were you doing your full share with the kids and chores before the latest accident?

    One serious injury with time off work in ten years...stuff happens. Now another? Married with children, plus presumably not rich? Game over. Yeah if you had been careful and just rode XC, you could probably have kept riding. Apparently that's not your interest. Now you are in a hole where if you crash it's going to be holy hell.

    Sounds like if you stop riding, you are going to hold it against her. That's toxic. I'd suggest doing some soul searching and getting over it if at all possible. Sorry for the sermon, and seriously I wish you the best with your recovery and family.

  44. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    Stop biking and take up heavy drinking.

    In no time, she'll be trying to get you back on the bike.
    Lol!
    I'm trying to find holes in this advice but can't.
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  45. #145
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    OP, do you and your wife do stuff together? How about considering talking to her about that?..maybe starting to walk or hike or whatever, together. You can use this time off the bike to spend more time with her. Look at this is a great opportunity for you guys to grow closer. Maybe at some point you can ride again with her support, who knows..but don't even think about that. Let this time be about your wife. You seem like a good guy and you clearly love her. Best wishes.

  46. #146
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    As the OP hasn't posted for 3 days on MTBR I suspect we're all talking to an empty chair, maybe a new poll is needed;

    Do you think VP

    1 Is in hospital after going to the bike park for more jump training
    2 Is in hospital after telling his wife he was going to the bike park
    3 Is in hospital after offering to buy his wife a bike and take her to the bike park
    What a perfect waste of time

  47. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackWare View Post
    As the OP hasn't posted for 3 days on MTBR I suspect we're all talking to an empty chair, maybe a new poll is needed;

    Do you think VP

    1 Is in hospital after going to the bike park for more jump training
    2 Is in hospital after telling his wife he was going to the bike park
    3 Is in hospital after offering to buy his wife a bike and take her to the bike park
    Or
    D) Drinking heavily and in the hospital with alcohol poisoning.
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  48. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackWare View Post
    As the OP hasn't posted for 3 days on MTBR I suspect we're all talking to an empty chair, maybe a new poll is needed;

    Do you think VP

    1 Is in hospital after going to the bike park for more jump training
    2 Is in hospital after telling his wife he was going to the bike park
    3 Is in hospital after offering to buy his wife a bike and take her to the bike park
    I think his original question has been answered and thrashed about ad nauseum, with everybody here wanting to lob in their advice on marriage, riding technique, and parenting. The whole thread (inevitably) has drifted off-topic, my guess is that he finally rolled his eyes and disengaged as the discussion (inevitably) became increasingly irrelevant and redundant.

  49. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    I think his original question has been answered and thrashed about ad nauseum, with everybody here wanting to lob in their advice on marriage, riding technique, and parenting. The whole thread (inevitably) has drifted off-topic, my guess is that he finally rolled his eyes and disengaged as the discussion (inevitably) became increasingly irrelevant and redundant.
    It was irrelevant the moment he posted it.

  50. #150
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    Likely number 1, unless his wife is a psycho. I haven't heard of anyone 'assaulting' another for their own safety since the medieval era. Now in 2018, attacking someone because they want to ride or offers to buy you a race bike actually makes them a threat and dangerous

  51. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragracer88 View Post
    Likely number 1, unless his wife is a psycho. I haven't heard of anyone 'assaulting' another for their own safety since the medieval era. Now in 2018, attacking someone because they want to ride or offers to buy you a race bike actually makes them a threat and dangerous
    Damn dude, it was a joke.

  52. #152
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    Or she's sold the bike and his computer, but hey, it shouldn't stop our enjoyment of this thread
    What a perfect waste of time

  53. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    Damn dude, it was a joke.
    dragracer88 doesn't joke - think of him as the Stig of bike racing.
    What a perfect waste of time

  54. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackWare View Post
    Or she's sold the bike and his computer, but hey, it shouldn't stop our enjoyment of this thread
    I'm pretty sure the OP, while on the mend and unemployed, decided to kill some time streaming Rampage on redbulltv. She walks in, catches him in the act, draws certain conclusions, and then asks him to leave. This is all pure conjecture, but still, I'm pretty sure I'm right.
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  55. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOJO K View Post
    I'm pretty sure the OP, while on the mend and unemployed, decided to kill some time streaming Rampage on redbulltv. She walks in, catches him in the act, draws certain conclusions, and then asks him to leave. This is all pure conjecture, but still, I'm pretty sure I'm right.
    She had a point, she found the kids playing on the freeway.
    What a perfect waste of time

  56. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    Because riding without a clear grasp of one's skill limits can lead to crashes and injuries that cause one to have to abrogate their responsibilties to their family and their co-workers. I'd say that if the OP can identify where his skills end and the potential for injury begins to escalate, he should keep riding. If he can't...he should hang it up.
    Agreed, and I had suggested dialing it back a bit, but continue riding.
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  57. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Maybe because someone's wife says to give it up or they're done? At that point someone might have to decide whether riding is more important than being with family.

    I did similar to you but I'm not in the op's situation.
    I guess it depends how important biking is in his life.

    It is very important to me to the point that I'd not find myself with anyone using it as a bargaining chip.
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  58. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    I guess it depends how important biking is in his life.

    It is very important to me to the point that I'd not find myself with anyone using it as a bargaining chip.
    I think it's too hard to make absolute statements here. Ultimatums and bargaining chips on important hobbies don't come up in balanced and reasonable relationships. Both parties find ways to make it work by being considerate of the other person.

    But what about unbalanced situations? I can think of many situations where I would not consider it unreasonable at all if one partner issued an ultimatum. Gambling, cheating, alcoholism, abuse, video game (or other hobby) addiction, and neglect. Neglecting family responsibilities to pursue a hobby falls into the latter category.

    In fact in some cases an ultimatum might be merciful. Me, if I was in a shitty situation, I'd probably just walk and not even give the person a chance because it might just be prolonging the inevitable and id just want to be done with it.

  59. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Maybe because someone's wife says to give it up or they're done? At that point someone might have to decide whether riding is more important than being with family.

    I did similar to you but I'm not in the op's situation.
    I think it's more about being married to someone who feels that such an ultimatum is a valid way to conduct a marriage.

  60. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    I think it's more about being married to someone who feels that such an ultimatum is a valid way to conduct a marriage.

    Maybe, what do I know. Like everyone else here almost nothing but based on the small amount of info from the op it sounds to me like his wife may have a point.

    I do know that raising a family is challenging and time consuming, and that sacrifices must sometimes be made.
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  61. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by J.B. Weld View Post
    Maybe, what do I know. Like everyone else here almost nothing but based on the small amount of info from the op it sounds to me like his wife may have a point.

    I do know that raising a family is challenging and time consuming, and that sacrifices must sometimes be made.
    Absolutely. Everybody makes sacrifices to some degree in order to sustain a successful marriage. IMHO, in this case, the limited way that the OP described the situation indicates someone who views their spouse as a resource whose value to the relationship is the money they bring in and whose value is diminished if they increase the workload. It suggests that, if the OP were to contract some kind of illness, or become disabled in any way through no fault of his own, his wife would show him the door since he could no longer meet her expectations, contribute to the family, and in fact that disability or illness would impose an unacceptable level of inconvenience to her. Some may find that reasonable. I personally would consider that to be a failed marriage.

  62. #162
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    It's hard to fathom an ultimatum being given in a healthy relationship. I know my personality and I would absolutely push back and that wouldn't be good for anybody!

    I'm fortunate in many ways and not the least of which being that I have a wife who understands that riding is my best shot at fully unwinding and staying sane in my daily life. In fact, she'll tell me, "you need to go for a ride" when she recognizes me getting stressed and uptight. It's also helpful that my boys are grown (28 and 30) and call me to ride whenever they (we) can.

    Good luck OP. I don't envy your situation. I hope you work something out that benefits you all.
    You're entitled to your own opinion, but you're not entitled to your own facts.

  63. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    Absolutely. Everybody makes sacrifices to some degree in order to sustain a successful marriage. IMHO, in this case, the limited way that the OP described the situation indicates someone who views their spouse as a resource whose value to the relationship is the money they bring in and whose value is diminished if they increase the workload. It suggests that, if the OP were to contract some kind of illness, or become disabled in any way through no fault of his own, his wife would show him the door since he could no longer meet her expectations, contribute to the family, and in fact that disability or illness would impose an unacceptable level of inconvenience to her. Some may find that reasonable. I personally would consider that to be a failed marriage.
    I'm not sure I see it that way. She issued an ultimatum after 8 years (so she has put up with a lot before issuing it). She is both the primary bread winner and has to take care of the kids. He takes unreasonable risks for his skill level and appears to have neglected his family in order to ride at other times. She has been carrying him across multiple dimensions not just money. I mean seriously - what needs to happen here for her to be the reasonable one? Does he need to be an explicit abuser? A felon? Would that do it in your eyes?

    I can definitely understand if he was a professional mountain bikers and taking risks is your job. But we are talking about a weekend warrior here.

  64. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOJO K View Post
    I'm pretty sure the OP, while on the mend and unemployed, decided to kill some time streaming Rampage on redbulltv. She walks in, catches him in the act, draws certain conclusions, and then asks him to leave. This is all pure conjecture, but still, I'm pretty sure I'm right.
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  65. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmtb View Post

    I can definitely understand if he was a professional mountain bikers and taking risks is your job. But we are talking about a weekend warrior here.
    This is what I was thinking... there has got to be a balance in life and that balance is defined differently between a pro and a family guy.

    A pro's job is to take chances and produce race results, but that has to be balanced with needing to be healthy in order to win. This balance often results in somewhat frequent injury, but this is figured into the big picture and expected.

    For a family guy recreating and not getting paid, with significant responsibility for his own family and kids, the balance is much different and what would be an appropriate risk for a pro just isn't for a family guy. Family guy can mitigate by purchasing insurance, but this isn't going to cover everything...

    Life it's self is risky and some injury is expected no matter what we do, but imo OP's riding a bike park while not mentally or physically up to the challenge is a failure to properly assess risk and take his commitment to the family seriously. So while an ultimatum is bad news we don't know enough to judge. It may be totally appropriate or she may be a controlling *****, we just don't know. What we do know is a counselor needs to be involved for the relationship to have a chance as it's come too far at this point to be worked out on their own.

  66. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmtb View Post
    I'm not sure I see it that way. She issued an ultimatum after 8 years (so she has put up with a lot before issuing it). She is both the primary bread winner and has to take care of the kids. He takes unreasonable risks for his skill level and appears to have neglected his family in order to ride at other times. She has been carrying him across multiple dimensions not just money. I mean seriously - what needs to happen here for her to be the reasonable one? Does he need to be an explicit abuser? A felon? Would that do it in your eyes?

    I can definitely understand if he was a professional mountain bikers and taking risks is your job. But we are talking about a weekend warrior here.
    With the necessary details apparently not forthcoming, too much assuming is really just pissing into the wind. You're certainly assuming one potential extreme of the situation. Cuyuna is making some different assumptions. You could both possibly be wrong, depending on the details. Or, I could even see some scenarios where you could both be right.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cuyuna View Post
    Absolutely. Everybody makes sacrifices to some degree in order to sustain a successful marriage. IMHO, in this case, the limited way that the OP described the situation indicates someone who views their spouse as a resource whose value to the relationship is the money they bring in and whose value is diminished if they increase the workload. It suggests that, if the OP were to contract some kind of illness, or become disabled in any way through no fault of his own, his wife would show him the door since he could no longer meet her expectations, contribute to the family, and in fact that disability or illness would impose an unacceptable level of inconvenience to her. Some may find that reasonable. I personally would consider that to be a failed marriage.
    This kind of shit happens a lot when serious illnesses come up. It's horrible how often they do. I am forever grateful what my wife did for me when I went through a serious illness. But I also lost friends who just couldn't handle MY illness. I'm not even talking about people who were uncertain how to behave around me, or didn't come to visit when I was sick. I'm talking about people who became hostile, who berated me, who I had to actually CHOOSE to cut out because they started treating me poorly in an active way. Every cancer survivor and every other person I know who has dealt with serious/chronic health issues has had it happen to them. One of my best friends has a chronic health problem, and she's had the same thing happen to her. I make it an even bigger point to be there for her when she needs it, because I have a better idea than most what it's like to have a long term health problem, but also because she made it a big point to be there for me. If anything, it's made us better friends.

    The loss of a spouse/significant other under these circumstances is less common, but not UNcommon. While it's true that they all result in a failed relationship, I think what it reflects is a personal failure of the person who leaves the sick/injured person. From what I have been told from people who have been through this, it absolutely seems to have a lot to do with the "inconvenience" factor. The loss of or change in social life seems to be a big part of it.

    I have seen some weird shit split up marriages. Involvement in quasi-cults was probably the weirdest. So far, this doesn't sound like a weird situation. It reads to me like a relationship where communication is not very good. If both want to fix it, getting into couples therapy and being serious about it should be able to fix everything without OP completely giving up riding (but no question he's going to have to modify his riding).

  67. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Pig View Post
    I almost broke my shoulder on a gravel path and I know a guy who did. Just sayin'.

    Well that about seals the deal on him not riding anymore...

    You know what, while we are on the subject, I kept telling people that I'm not comfortable going over 15 mph downhill. And then I looked at my Strava segment top speeds, and they are usually 18-22 mph peak speed. I'm thinking, huh...oops? I did that? I didn't even know I was going that fast. No crashes at that speed yet. Yet.

  68. #168
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    Mountain biking is cult-like.
    It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society.

  69. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    With the necessary details apparently not forthcoming, too much assuming is really just pissing into the wind. You're certainly assuming one potential extreme of the situation. Cuyuna is making some different assumptions. You could both possibly be wrong, depending on the details. Or, I could even see some scenarios where you could both be right.
    Absolutely. No one has enough detail to comment specifically. What I said, or at least what I meant, is that ultimatums in general tend to be an indicator of an unhealthy marriage. I also stated that the OP taking risks beyond his skill level and subsequently getting laid up was an abrogation of his family responsibilities, and selfish.

    There has to be a happy medium in there somewhere, but that's going to vary a lot from relationship to relationship. Personally, I've compromised a lot over the years as it became clear to me that I am no longer as skilled as I once was. My mountain biking today would be unrecognizable and sneer-worthy to a me from 25 years ago. That younger me would make fun of the older me for riding like a 67 year-old man. In turn, I could sneer back at that younger me for not being nearly as smart as that 67 year-old man. It all evens out. I still have a blast on my mountain bike...I just have a lot less need or desire to prove anything than I used to.

  70. #170
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    He's now homeless without internet access and awaiting divorce papers.
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  71. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    With the necessary details apparently not forthcoming, too much assuming is really just pissing into the wind. You're certainly assuming one potential extreme of the situation. Cuyuna is making some different assumptions. You could both possibly be wrong, depending on the details. Or, I could even see some scenarios where you could both be right.
    You are right of course. We don't have a real time window into their marriage. I was just confused about how, given the info we have so far, it can make him look favorable over her.

    And that sucks about your illness and the friend abandonment. Wouldn't wish that on anyone.

  72. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by midwestmtb View Post
    You are right of course. We don't have a real time window into their marriage. I was just confused about how, given the info we have so far, it can make him look favorable over her.

    And that sucks about your illness and the friend abandonment. Wouldn't wish that on anyone.
    It takes two to tango. I assume both have things they need to work on unless proven otherwise.

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  73. #173
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    Marriage advice on a mountain bike forum... Priceless.....
    No wait, worthless...

  74. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by life behind bars View Post
    He's now homeless without internet access and awaiting divorce papers.
    I know a guy who's almost there. My sister's husband screwed the pooch hardcore. Problem is, he believes that she will never serve him with divorce papers, and that she won't kick him out. But, when he's not completely ignoring their 2 daughters or neglecting the house, he's got them pretty afraid of him and it's hanging over their heads even when he isn't around.

  75. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcd46 View Post
    Paging Dr.Phil!
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to jcd46 again.
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  76. #176
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    VERY happily married to the woman of my dreams for 22 years now.

    Doesn't qualify me to give any real advice to the OP though. However, now in my mid 40's and still pushing my limits AND reading about the burden being placed on the OP's spouse, supplemental accident insurance like Aflac will be purchased at my next opportunity. Aflac comes to my workplace once a year so enrollment should be coming up.

    To the OP, I've taken breaks from the MTB and usually running/trail running has been my go to. Trail running is not the same BUT if you involve some climbing and jumping over obstacles and such, you may find it an acceptable option.

    Best of luck.

  77. #177
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    Move to the mountains, get in shape, and do long trail rides. Stay out of the bikeparks and get into the back country.

  78. #178
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    Yeah, his wife should like that. "Honey, quit your job. We're moving. I gotta ride."

  79. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Yeah, his wife should like that. "Honey, quit your job. We're moving. I gotta ride."
    My wife said that to me. Music to my ears.

  80. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    My wife said that to me. Music to my ears.
    Ha!

  81. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harold View Post
    This kind of shit happens a lot when serious illnesses come up. It's horrible how often they do.
    Wow, I had no idea...

    A friend of mine has had some serious injuries, first a degenerative disease that left him unable to work and will require shoulder surgery on both shoulders. Then an accident with a big truck that caused a bad TBI as well as leg injuries. He has recently had both knees replaced along with a dozen other surgeries previous to that, including a fusion of vertebrae in the cervical spine.

    His wife is not a very conscious person and harbors a lot of resentment but neither of them can afford to break up as the settlement for the accident was horrifically poor since he was already permanently disabled. IMO his lawyer needs to be shot for accepting the deal.

    I try to help as much as I can and give him rides to dr's appts but there's only so much I can do besides offer moral support and suggestions to move forward with his life he's not willing to consider right now.

    It's upsetting to hear these issues are so common... I have a hard time believing his wife can act how she does, let alone anyone basically blaming people for injuries and diseases they have no control over.

  82. #182
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    Life is so uncertain. OP could give up MTB only to have some other serious injury or illness happen: car accident, get run over while crossing the street, slip and fall in the shower, get an anal probe by aliens, you name it. He could continue riding but tone it down practicing good risk management and be taken out by some freak unpredictable crash. Or he could continue riding as normal and never have a serious injury again. You just never know.

    I ride my share of high consequence / risky stuff yet most of my bad injury crashes have been slow speed or on easy trails, things like having a front wheel wash out that could happen even if I were to tone my riding down.

    Hopefully OP can work it out with the wife and keep riding. Life is too short to not be happy.

  83. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to jcd46 again.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to DIRTJUNKIE again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by evdog View Post
    Life is so uncertain. OP could give up MTB only to have some other serious injury or illness happen: car accident, get run over while crossing the street, slip and fall in the shower, get an anal probe by aliens, you name it. He could continue riding but tone it down practicing good risk management and be taken out by some freak unpredictable crash. Or he could continue riding as normal and never have a serious injury again. You just never know.
    Interesting thought... If he gets into a car accident and is laid up for a while from that will she treat it differently? Seems like the answer is likely no, which for me would mean it's time to walk.

  85. #185
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    Did we scare Vopplants away? Boi....
    Stick around if you're housebroken...

  86. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    Yeah, his wife should like that. "Honey, quit your job. We're moving. I gotta ride."
    They work in the mountains too.

  87. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by endo_alley View Post
    They work in the mountains too.
    So you're saying that he should ask his wife, who's already pissed off at him because she has to take care of not only their two kids but also him while financially supporting the family, to uproot her career and move so he can ride more?

  88. #188
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    I agree with evdog. Life is unpredictable. There's no such thing as safe in life. There's safer, but everything still has a risk, no matter the precautions you take. Rally Racing, just watch any video or Pastranas early runs in his rally career. Same with mtb and mx. Same with work in general. People don't plan on crashes, it just happens. Even driving or riding in the winter has its risks. I can say From experience that I was riding in Feb or March and lost it on black ice. Went down but I was fine, minus bruises. Cars are no exception to this scenario either, as rain and black ice affects traction just the same. Matter of fact, I had to take an alternative route to Concord for Good guys Autocross and car show on the 20th last month, due to a 2 hour long delay due to a crash

  89. #189
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    Oh yeah! Like a week ago lol
    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    Did we scare Vopplants away? Boi....
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  90. #190
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    Maybe the OP went off the grid to live.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

  91. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIRTJUNKIE View Post
    Maybe the OP went off the grid to live.
    Moved to his analog cabin?
    The Orange Fleet:

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  92. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nat View Post
    So you're saying that he should ask his wife, who's already pissed off at him because she has to take care of not only their two kids but also him while financially supporting the family, to uproot her career and move so he can ride more?
    That seems reasonable to me. As a matter of fact, I think I'll suggest this to my wife. We could move the family into the Cascades and start a chinchilla farm. Or maybe a cult. I hear those pay fairly well.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  93. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crankout View Post
    Did we scare Vopplants away? Boi....
    It doesn't matter. We're well into tangents at this point anyway.
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  94. #194
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    I find it interesting that people on here are saying that he has been reckless with 2 injuries in 8 years.

    He may in fact be very risk adverse and just been unluckly. Every one of us here could have had the same injuries if luck was not on our side!

    Or he is one of those injury prone guys who is likely to injure himself..... who knows.
    I have a buddy like that. When he crashes he crashes like a dolpin. Its terrible to watch!

    In my group of riding buddies the risk adverse have been injured as much as the risk takers. The most server injuries by the most risk adverse guys......


    Shit happens when mountain biking.

  95. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    It doesn't matter. We're well into tangents at this point anyway.
    Co-sign.
    All Li es Matter

  96. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by plummet View Post
    I find it interesting that people on here are saying that he has been reckless with 2 injuries in 8 years.

    He may in fact be very risk adverse and just been unluckly. Every one of us here could have had the same injuries if luck was not on our side!

    Or he is one of those injury prone guys who is likely to injure himself..... who knows.
    I have a buddy like that. When he crashes he crashes like a dolpin. Its terrible to watch!

    In my group of riding buddies the risk adverse have been injured as much as the risk takers. The most server injuries by the most risk adverse guys......


    Shit happens when mountain biking.
    It's not just 2 injuries in 8yrs. It's 2 injuries he's telling us about that have resulted in significant time off work. There may be others.

    Avoiding injury isn't entirely about being "risk averse" either. It's about assessing the risk you're presented with and making intelligent decisions. Part of that assessment process is knowing your own skills well and being honest about them. Included in those skills is the ability to read and assess the trail.

    I've been riding mtb for 20yrs. I have never missed work or school because of an injury sustained in a crash. Plenty of little scratches, scrapes, and bruises, but nothing has ever even required a visit to the doctor. I've been to the doctor, and hospitalized, for other things during that time. I'm not entirely risk averse, either.

    But I know myself well. I'm honest about my skills, and I don't cave to pressure from people I'm riding with when I'm not comfortable with something. I read the trail pretty well, I think. At least well enough that I don't often fail to see something that sends me to the dirt. I ride within my abilities. If I'm hesitant, I don't ride it. I know enough to know that being hesitant and still riding something is bad news.

    We know that OP's most recent wreck occurred because he was riding something that he was nervous riding. That's reckless.

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    My advice, PITB.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curveball View Post
    That seems reasonable to me. As a matter of fact, I think I'll suggest this to my wife. We could move the family into the Cascades and start a chinchilla farm. Or maybe a cult. I hear those pay fairly well.
    Those sound like wonderful options. But I'm sorry to burst your bubble. The only people making money in the Colorado mountains are either selling real estate (condos built by illegal aliens) or shop owners selling recreational marijuana. Prolly similar in Oregon and Washington. But at least one can ride singletrack.

  99. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by endo_alley View Post
    Those sound like wonderful options. But I'm sorry to burst your bubble. The only people making money in the Colorado mountains are either selling real estate (condos built by illegal aliens) or shop owners selling recreational marijuana. Prolly similar in Oregon and Washington. But at least one can ride singletrack.
    At this point, I'm leaning more towards the cult. A cult lends itself to remote areas so that your followers can't escape so easily (or be tracked down by concerned family members) and I think I can work some tax advantages there. Are you interested in learning the teachings of Gothsoroth by chance?
    Riding Washington State singletrack since 1986

  100. #200
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    Punch her in the cooter.

    Last edited by DIRTJUNKIE; 1 Week Ago at 09:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by mileslong View Post
    I passionately remove rocks and corners and other stuff I find too hard to ride.

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