Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it- Mtbr.com
Results 1 to 144 of 144
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    51

    Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Hi, I've had my pug for nearly 3 years now and the old girl
    Is ageing, rear hub is pitted. My pug is setup with a sc32
    Front end and hydro brakes, carbon bar/ seat post. For
    Touring I have bob trailer, revelate bag system and omm racks.
    It has taken me on bike races to the deserts of central
    Australia without an issue. My dilemma is should I upgrade
    To newer bike like the Sasquatch or upgrade some parts
    And keep the old girl. I intend on doing more desert touring
    And need a bike that has the versatility of the pug. I use offset
    Fork when touring.
    Some upgrades if I keep the old girl is
    Bike and I need to lose weight
    Different crankset to stop tyre rub.
    Lower gear for sand riding.
    Any advice appreciated.

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: drofluf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    369
    I had a Pugsley but 'upgraded' to a Puffin. For 3 reasons really: I'm a big fan of Singular bikes, I had a big birthday coming up and, more importantly, the Pugsley was a touch too small - I'd bought it on eBay to dip my toe in the world of fatbiking, decided that I liked it but wanted something that fit better.

    Without the birthday to be honest I'd probably have stuck with the Pugsley as it's still a great bike. The two ride a little differently; the Pugsley is more stable, the Puffin a little more playful.

    So if you're happy with what you've got and don't need, for example, wider tyres etc. I'd stick with the Pugsley and replace bits as they need it.
    If you need me I'll be at the bar

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    2,271
    Just recently 'upgraded' to a Fatboy from a Pugs. I do miss the Pugs, but with the double-wall LM rims and XT hubs, the weight difference in just the wheels is night and day. The geometry is much more trail-friendly, too.

    I do miss the ability to swap wheels, use standard 135 hubs, and ability to run a front rack.

    Unfortunately, I didn't have a choice in getting a different bike, otherwise, I'd still have the Pug.

    If I were you, I'd probably keep it and get a nice wheelset for it.

    Probably the only reason I'd upgrade would be if I really wanted to be able to fit the big rubber.
    Oh noes. I'm going to drink the Kool-Aid.

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    I am at a similar point now. Finally need to start swapping some parts or upgrade the whole bike.
    So many options now....not sure
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  5. #5
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by jcaino View Post
    If I were you, I'd probably keep it and get a nice wheelset for it.
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^this

    just got new wheels for my charge. compared to the stock wheels=yowza.

    like a whole new bike. super sweet

    rog

  6. #6
    Chris Bling
    Reputation: dustyduke22's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    2,506
    I have had my Pugs for coming up on 3 years now, and couldn't see myself parting with it. I haven't upgraded many parts since I built it up 3 years ago, so I decided that I would be cheaper to build me up some new Mule Fut - Hope wheels. Like others have said, the weight difference was incredible and I am enjoying the bike as much now as I ever have.
    The obsession of wheels fused with the passion of cycling
    Affordable Custom Wheels

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,742
    Upgrading a Pugs is worth it, upgrading from a Pugs not so much. They are still amazing bikes and cover 99% of what most fat bike riders need in a fat bike. A nice set of wheels and some lighter tires transforms the Pugs greatly, and drops the weight where it matters most. Other than that, it is mostly bling (headset, stem/bars/post). A 1x10 drivetrain is nice when the original wears out, but not necessary.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    126
    Sorry dude but you can't upgrade from a Pugs. The only way you could upgrade from a Pugs is to buy a new Pugs.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,516
    The Pugs is still the benchmark and a damn fine bike. Get a new wheelset and tires, mounted tubeless, and it'll feel like a whole new ride.
    Jason
    Disclaimer: www.paramountfargo.com

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    5
    I'll end my lurking to ask, what wheel set will improve my Pugs? Seems like everyone either has Marge Lites or Rolling Darryls (I have RD).

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    95
    Definitely. Get a new wheelset (carbon) & tires (120tpi).

  12. #12
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by UlrichNQ View Post
    I'll end my lurking to ask, what wheel set will improve my Pugs? Seems like everyone either has Marge Lites or Rolling Darryls (I have RD).
    i just got a set of marge lites with a dt swiss 350 rear hub and a pauls front hub, dt comp spokes, and brass nips. waaaaaaaaay lighter and smoother than what came stock on my charge. saved a good 1.5-2lbs.

    rode em for the 1st time yesterday. a very worthy upgrade without spending ridiculous amounts of money.

    rog

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,742
    Are there carbon rims that are drilled offset? The Surly New Disc Hub is decently light and well priced if you don't want a geared hub up front. I have a Hope SS hub for the front, and it carries a few cogs just in case. I have a Chris King/Marge Lite rear wheel and a Hadley/Marge Lite rear wheel as well. The Hadley has been trouble free for years, the CK nothing but trouble.

  14. #14
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Got a mate here who rode his Pugs for a few years, he got a Fatboy a while back and the pugs has only seen a couple of rides with his bob trailer attached.

    Ive never ridden one, but can only think a lighter bike with fatter and lighter wheels can only be a good thing.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  15. #15
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    I agree with ozzy. What is all this love for a old heavy bike?

    I have a friend who just bought a 61' Corvette. He put a new motor in it, new paint, new leather, tires, brakes, etc. It still rides like a 50 year old car.

    Unlike ozzy, I have ridden one and nearly any of the newer, lighter offerings will be nicer.

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I agree with ozzy. What is all this love for a old heavy bike?

    I have a friend who just bought a 61' Corvette. He put a new motor in it, new paint, new leather, tires, brakes, etc. It still rides like a 50 year old car.

    Unlike ozzy, I have ridden one and nearly any of the newer, lighter offerings will be nicer.
    In fairness, your analogy is interesting, because your friend obviously forgot to upgrade the suspension. I have driven many resto mod vehicles that drive like new cars but still have the nostalgia and/or look of a classic....
    I think the same can be said for a classic frame. What is the weight difference between a Pugsley and a carbon fat frame? Not even noticeable by the average rider,
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  17. #17
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Pug....Weight 18" (MED) = 2570g (5.6 lbs) Fork: - uncut = 1114g (2.52 lbs) = 3864g

    Lamere... weight 1283g in size 17" (MED) , and a fork weight of 550g = 1833g

    So its OVER TWICE the weight of a carbon F&F.... what's a couple of extra kilos anyway, apart from 4.5lbs

    I have had 20+ MTB's... from a 7" Nicolai to fully rigid singlespeed, in TI, Steel, Alu, Scandium and Carbon... I ride a steel IndyFab regularly and love steel bikes.

    Nobody is attacking the pugs, all I said was that there is lighter and fatter out there. If you read the OP, its not about nostalgia or looking retro... the OP asked was it worth upgrading his pugs or getting a new one... all I pointed out was someone I know who was 100% happy with his Pugs, he stuck a leg over a more "modern" fatbike and never looked back.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    ^^i get it...wasn't trying to offend, it's just that I have a lot of experience with classic cars and thought the analogy was a bit off, if done properly. Also, I ride several thousand miles and I don't feel that a few pounds alters my riding that much, unless it is in the wheels.
    Like I said earlier in the thread, I am making a similar decision now regarding an upgrade, but my thought is more around the cost of swapping out everything that needs to be swapped vs buying a new bike. It has nothing to do with the weight of the frame.
    Again, in using the car analogy, it is implying that upgrading everything on the frame, the bike would still feel old ( like an old Corvette), and I couldn't disagree more.
    A local bike shop owner near me has an old purple Pugsley with Chris King this and XT that, and I can tell you it is a finer ride than many of the brand new bikes I have demo ridden.
    Just conversation, not arguing.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  19. #19
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    All good fat_Tires !

    My thinking is why upgrade a bike that runs 135mm hubs, is limited to 4" tyres and offset built wheels, he needs new cranks, lower gears and could benefit from wider tyres riding on sand.

    Might as well go fresh as the complete pugs is still worth a few $$$, 170mm/135mm hubs and symmetrical build wheels are getting quite readily available here in Aus now. Fatbikes are getting quite popular here so its no longer a case of ordering from the US now to replace parts.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pspycho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    288
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I agree with ozzy. What is all this love for a old heavy bike?

    I have a friend who just bought a 61' Corvette. He put a new motor in it, new paint, new leather, tires, brakes, etc. It still rides like a 50 year old car.

    Unlike ozzy, I have ridden one and nearly any of the newer, lighter offerings will be nicer.
    Comparing a '61 Corvette to an older PUGs is well...ridiculous.
    2015 Specialized FATBOY EC70 Seatpost & Bars SRAM X7/Wolf 42T 1x10
    2016 Specialized DIVERGE Expert X1 SRAM 1x11 Force

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Now that certainly makes sense, and is something I have also considered. I'm not sure I need 5 inch tires, but having the option is nice.
    Also, I certainly am not defending the Pugsley frame, just giving my personal input that the weight of the frame is probably near the bottom of my list of considerations when deciding.
    With the options that BD has rolled out, it is tough to logically conclude that my Pugsley is worth upgrading, simply based on cost, unless I find a great deal on some used wheels, and maybe fork.
    Ti is my favorite frame material, so I really like the idea if a Moots, Carver, etc...but then starting from scratch.
    I will likely upgrade only what is necessary and roll the Pugsley this winter.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation: vikb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    13,151
    Quote Originally Posted by saron View Post
    Hi, I've had my pug for nearly 3 years now and the old girl
    Is ageing, rear hub is pitted. My pug is setup with a sc32
    Front end and hydro brakes, carbon bar/ seat post. For
    Touring I have bob trailer, revelate bag system and omm racks.
    It has taken me on bike races to the deserts of central
    Australia without an issue. My dilemma is should I upgrade
    To newer bike like the Sasquatch or upgrade some parts
    And keep the old girl. I intend on doing more desert touring
    And need a bike that has the versatility of the pug. I use offset
    Fork when touring.
    Some upgrades if I keep the old girl is
    Bike and I need to lose weight
    Different crankset to stop tyre rub.
    Lower gear for sand riding.
    Any advice appreciated.
    Based on what you want to do with it I would keep the Pugs and upgrade as makes sense. It's a great remote touring bike especially with the swappable wheels.

    Depending what the current parts are cranks/BB and wheels/tires are the two places you can lose a lot of weight.

    The other is a carbon fork for non-touring missions if you can live without suspension.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation: 69tr6r's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    784
    To the OP, have you thought about drilling your LM rims? I spent a night with a hole saw and some hand files and yes, it was a lot of work, but it was worth it for the weight (cost) savings. Do that, and get some lightweight tires and tubes and it makes a difference.

  24. #24
    bigger than you.
    Reputation: Gigantic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    3,068
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    Got a mate here who rode his Pugs for a few years, he got a Fatboy a while back and the pugs has only seen a couple of rides with his bob trailer attached.

    Ive never ridden one, but can only think a lighter bike with fatter and lighter wheels can only be a good thing.
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I agree with ozzy. What is all this love for a old heavy bike?

    I have a friend who just bought a 61' Corvette. He put a new motor in it, new paint, new leather, tires, brakes, etc. It still rides like a 50 year old car.

    Unlike ozzy, I have ridden one and nearly any of the newer, lighter offerings will be nicer.
    +2 rode a pugs for a year- i loved it until i rode something else. Many other bikes are lighter, made better and have better geometry for handling and traction in the snow. Frankly, the Pugsley is more or less an $800 bike that costs $1800. Where else would you pay that much for a bike with Deore or X5-level components?

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    ^^agree with some of this, in the sense that if I were buying my first fat bike now, I think there are better options for the money than the Pugsley.
    Not sure, though, what you mean by there are bikes made better. I guess Geometry is subjective, but my Pugsley fits great.
    Agree in the components, but That has nothing to do with the frame.
    Are there better complete bikes? Of course. Could someone, if they so choose, make the Pugsley rival most any if them? Of course.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    68
    The OP has stated:

    I intend on doing more desert touring
    And need a bike that has the versatility of the pug. I use offset
    Fork when touring.


    Not a lot of choices if he wants the offset fork with the ability to have a single speed front wheel to backup the cassette in the rear. If he wants front rack ability for touring that excludes most if not all of the carbon fork models. He already has frame bags and racks that fit the Pugs.

    If he is considering the $2500 Sasquatch as a possible replacement, that buys a lot of Pugsley upgrades. Not sure what the crank/chain rub issue is, but a new crankset could provide the lower gearing he desires. Lighter rims/hubs/tires would be a good value. Lefty front suspension could be considered to replace the SC32. He could make it look new with a fresh powdercoat in whatever color he chooses.

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    40
    If you're not interested in the infinite fat bike arms race, the Pugsley is a great bike.

  28. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation: vikb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    13,151
    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantic View Post
    Frankly, the Pugsley is more or less an $800 bike that costs $1800. Where else would you pay that much for a bike with Deore or X5-level components?
    Read the BD thread and see what $800 gets you. I could care less what dérailleur you hang on a bike if the rest of the bike is a POS
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  29. #29
    bigger than you.
    Reputation: Gigantic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    3,068
    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    Read the BD thread and see what $800 gets you. I could care less what dérailleur you hang on a bike if the rest of the bike is a POS
    The Lurch is very similar to the Pugsley and better equipped in almost every aspect, for quite a bit less than a Pugsley, almost $800 less. Save up to 60% off new Fat Bikes and Mountain Bikes - MTB - Motobecane Lurch X9 SRAM

    i wouldn't buy one because A: I hate 4130 cromo, B. I don't like the geometry and C. I'd prefer to support my local bikeshop, but the Lurch effectively proves my point: the pugsley is overpriced for old, low-tech.

  30. #30
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Teton29er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    421
    I love my pugs ops and ride it hard year round. But it's one bike that isn't going to see a penny of upgrades. Especially wouldn't do a wheelset--that would be nice, but with the offset rear, it couldn't be moved to anything else and wouldn't do much for the resale. ("For sale: heavy steel bike with carbon wheels...").

    I'm saving all pennies for a better bike in a year or two.

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation: vikb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    13,151
    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantic View Post
    The Lurch is very similar to the Pugsley and better equipped in almost every aspect, for quite a bit less than a Pugsley, almost $800 less. Save up to 60% off new Fat Bikes and Mountain Bikes - MTB - Motobecane Lurch X9 SRAM

    i wouldn't buy one because A: I hate 4130 cromo, B. I don't like the geometry and C. I'd prefer to support my local bikeshop, but the Lurch effectively proves my point: the pugsley is overpriced for old, low-tech.
    The reality of owning a Lurch and the fantasy you are espousing based on a cursory look at a geo chart and what dérailleur is hung on the frame are not the same thing.

    This is worth a read: 26InchSlicks

    You can argue that a Pugsley isn't worth Surly's MSRP, but comparing it to a $800 BD bike is ridiculous. And some of that higher MSRP supports the LBS that you care about and is not related to the cost of frame/parts.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: ianick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    1,197
    As a Pugsley owner I often ask myself "What can those other fat bikes do that my Pugsley can not".

    They have wider tires. Not something I need. For the last 3 years I've ridden everywhere my 5" tired friends have.
    They have suspension. Yep I'd like that (so I ordered a Busksaw!). But the OP already has that covered.
    They have lighter bikes. I'd like that too so I drilled out my RD's to make them HRD's and went to 26x2.6 tubes. What a difference!

    As far as upgrading I would look at the Surly MWOD crank(or OD crank). It offers better tire clearance than a standard crank and a 20t small chain ring.

    If you have undrilled rims I would recommend you drill them out. It saved a bunch of rotational weight. I drilled out my rims and switched to lightweight tubes at the same time. It made a huge difference! Next up is 120tpi tires.

  33. #33
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by Teton29er View Post
    Especially wouldn't do a wheelset--that would be nice, but with the offset rear, it couldn't be moved to anything else
    Being a shop guy i can ep many bikes like fatboy, kona, salsa, surly, etc, but at the end of the day i decided to keep my charge (same offset 135 rear as pugs) and get sweet wheels as i just love how the bike fits/feels and it was a small investment to begin with.

    All these new bikes cone with wheels/tires i don't really want, nor do i want alu, carbon, or ti.

    I would happily move all my stuff over to a pugs at some point tho. Especially if they offer one in pink. And the frames are like 300 bux. Sweet

    rog

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    95
    Maybe I m crazy. I have a 12.5kg medium size 2x10 & 80mm wheelset Pugsley, but I still want to upgrade the OD crank to Tune Fat Black Foot (if available), the moonlander fork to carbon fork and Schwalbe Jumbo Jim tires to save every grams.

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation: schnee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,797
    How much of a difference do the new wider hubs make?
    What about through axles?
    How about tapered steering?

    I noticed the difference in through axles + tapered steerers immediately on my mountain bikes. How much of a difference does it make on a fattie? I'd imagine not so much if you mainly tour and ride on flat sand and snow, and a lot if you aim for rougher territory.

    Think Surly would ever make a bike with the newer, wider hubs + through axles with swappable front and rear wheels?

  36. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BoogieMang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    286
    I'm torn on the same decision. I've had a great run with my Pugs, which has had quite a few upgrades, and I'm mostly happy with it as is. Upgrades include: Lefty Max 140, Clownshoe laced to a Cannondale Lefty hub up front, Holy RD laced to an XT hub in the rear, Shimano XT Hydros with Icetech Rotors, Bud(F), Nate(R), Thomson 70mm stem, Spank Spoon Risers, and more... The lure of all the new fatbike gear though has me thinking about selling it to upgrade.

  37. #37
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Mr.Snakebite's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    62
    "need a bike that has the versatility of the pug"

    you must be looking for a frame with 135mm front & rear wheels i guess?
    Then keep the pugs...
    I would upgrade rims (or wheelset) if you have RD's try Marge Lites & 120 tpi tires

  38. #38
    bigger than you.
    Reputation: Gigantic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    3,068
    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    The reality of owning a Lurch and the fantasy you are espousing based on a cursory look at a geo chart and what dérailleur is hung on the frame are not the same thing.

    This is worth a read: 26InchSlicks

    You can argue that a Pugsley isn't worth Surly's MSRP, but comparing it to a $800 BD bike is ridiculous. And some of that higher MSRP supports the LBS that you care about and is not related to the cost of frame/parts.
    he didn't describe anything that i didn't experience with the Pugsley, but i also encountered a bent fork, cracked frame and stripped free hub, not to mention a seat that made my taint numb and the horrible bars, grips and stem that came along with it and a seat post that bent on my 2nd ride, all of which were replaced. Ultimately, the only thing that i kept was the front wheel and rear rim, i replaced pretty much everything else when i built my 9:Zero:7, because it was almost all junk.

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    When you upgrade, hang on to your Pug because you'll keep finding uses for it. It's what I did, and I don't regret it. I'm about to clear out my surplus fatbikes (just got a carbon fantastic) and I'm keeping the Pug.

    You can always simply stick lighter components on it, especially carbon rims. So look at the lightest carbon bike, add about 2lbs, and there's your Pug's potential weight.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  40. #40
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantic View Post
    for old, low-tech.
    Because what's important in a bicycle is always having the newest "tech". Versatility, functionality, ride quality, simplicity, those are all bunk. Its all about having the latest designer handbag.

    That's why I replace my entire fleet of bikes with brand new ones every year. I couldn't be caught dead with "old tech", after all.

    Also, the lurch is a tarted up POS with a slightly nicer rear derailleur.

  41. #41
    bigger than you.
    Reputation: Gigantic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    3,068
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    Because what's important in a bicycle is always having the newest "tech". Versatility, functionality, ride quality, simplicity, those are all bunk. Its all about having the latest designer handbag.

    That's why I buy all new bicycles every year. I couldn't be caught dead with "old tech", after all.

    Also, the lurch is a tarted up POS with a nice rear derailleur.
    for me, the pugsley had none of the qualities that you mentioned.

  42. #42
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    In fairness, your analogy is interesting, because your friend obviously forgot to upgrade the suspension. I have driven many resto mod vehicles that drive like new cars but still have the nostalgia and/or look of a classic....
    I think the same can be said for a classic frame. What is the weight difference between a Pugsley and a carbon fat frame? Not even noticeable by the average rider,
    Nope, suspension was upgraded. I would beg to differ about people not noticing the weight of a bike that is 1/3 heavier. My large Borealis is 23 pounds and I would say that EVERYONE would notice the difference in ride and weight.

    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    ^^i get it...wasn't trying to offend, it's just that I have a lot of experience with classic cars and thought the analogy was a bit off, if done properly. Also, I ride several thousand miles and I don't feel that a few pounds alters my riding that much, unless it is in the wheels.
    Like I said earlier in the thread, I am making a similar decision now regarding an upgrade, but my thought is more around the cost of swapping out everything that needs to be swapped vs buying a new bike. It has nothing to do with the weight of the frame.
    Again, in using the car analogy, it is implying that upgrading everything on the frame, the bike would still feel old ( like an old Corvette), and I couldn't disagree more.
    A local bike shop owner near me has an old purple Pugsley with Chris King this and XT that, and I can tell you it is a finer ride than many of the brand new bikes I have demo ridden.
    Just conversation, not arguing.
    Well, you can disagree, but we disagree. I had a Moonlander that I switched every part I could for the best parts money could buy, it felt better, but in the end, it was still a Moonlander.

    Quote Originally Posted by pspycho View Post
    Comparing a '61 Corvette to an older PUGs is well...ridiculous.
    In what way? They are both outdated. I remember building the first production mountain bikes that we received in our shop back in the early 80's. They were a giant step towards what we have today but there wouldn't be many who would buy one today. Surly has had it's day, but as Ford found out, not everyone wants a black car.

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pspycho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    288
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    In what way? They are both outdated. I remember building the first production mountain bikes that we received in our shop back in the early 80's. They were a giant step towards what we have today but there wouldn't be many who would buy one today. Surly has had it's day, but as Ford found out, not everyone wants a black car.
    Well let's see. How about a 1961 'Vette has $ Value. According to Hagerty Classic Cars Mag a decent one is worth $47K to $75K depending on build out:

    1961 Chevrolet Corvette | Hagerty ? Classic Car Price Guide

    Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it-61red2.jpg

    That's a huge multiple over what it sold for originally. Can you say that with an older PUGs?
    2015 Specialized FATBOY EC70 Seatpost & Bars SRAM X7/Wolf 42T 1x10
    2016 Specialized DIVERGE Expert X1 SRAM 1x11 Force

  44. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    68
    (In what way? They are both outdated.)

    What superior options are there for the OP's intended purpose which includes an offset fork and the ability to have a backup freewheel on the front. The Pugs is not outdated for his purposes.

  45. #45
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Well the "OP" asked this question 3 days ago and hasn't been back, so don't get all agro about it.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  46. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    1,742
    I missed all the comparison of a Pugs to a Corvette while I was at work. I think it should be a comparison to a Jeep instead. Both are low-tech and have spotty reliability, are based around ancient designs and technology, and are over-priced for what you get. That doesn't deter people from buying them though, given how useful and iconic they can be. People upgrade both frequently, but it the end it is the better rider/driver who comes out on top.

  47. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    51
    Hi, thanks for the feedback. I'm going to keep the old girl.
    I have ordered a new marge lite for the rear and now looking at
    Replacing the cranks to 2 x 10 or 1 x10 setup, I have also bought
    The gear to go tubeless. Is the surly od crankset the only crank
    Setup designed to move chainring away from frame.
    Cheers

  48. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    1,144
    Quote Originally Posted by pspycho View Post
    Comparing a '61 Corvette to an older PUGs is well...ridiculous.
    You're right.... A '85 Vette would be a more accurate comparison.

  49. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by deuxdiesel View Post
    I missed all the comparison of a Pugs to a Corvette while I was at work. I think it should be a comparison to a Jeep instead. Both are low-tech and have spotty reliability, are based around ancient designs and technology, and are over-priced for what you get. That doesn't deter people from buying them though, given how useful and iconic they can be. People upgrade both frequently, but it the end it is the better rider/driver who comes out on top.
    A Pugsley has spotty reliability It's probably the simplest fatbike around with redundancy designed right into it.

    The sheer amount of dumb in this thread is making my head hurt. Go back to your weight weenie gram counting plastic bike threads, you pussies. And I say that with the utmost respect.

  50. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    Surly has had it's day, but as Ford found out, not everyone wants a black car.
    Yeah, Surly is bound to close up shop and go out of business any day now.

  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    96
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    A Pugsley has spotty reliability? What are you smoking?
    There has been reports of certain generations of pugsley frames developing cracks.

    I prefer the comparison of a pugs to a Jeep much more than a Corvette anyways. Not because of reliability or whatever but rather it's just a more suitable comparison. It's rugged, and fun both on road and off road.

    Quote Originally Posted by saron View Post
    Is the surly od crankset the only crank
    Setup designed to move chainring away from frame.
    Cheers
    Do you actually need to replace the crank for 1x10?

    For 2x10, I thought most of the fat cranks (e-thirteen, raceface) have fairly wide chainlines. The MWOD chainring is maybe also another option.

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I would beg to differ about people not noticing the weight of a bike that is 1/3 heavier. My large Borealis is 23 pounds.
    huh? You realize a Pugsley is a frame, not an entire bike...
    Put the same parts on the Pugsley and the difference will only be a couple pounds. What do you mean by 1/3?
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  53. #53
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    A Pugsley has spotty reliability It's probably the simplest fatbike around with redundancy designed right into it.

    The sheer amount of dumb in this thread is making my head hurt. Go back to your weight weenie gram counting plastic bike threads, you pussies. And I say that with the utmost respect.
    i tried to rep you again. the "man" wouldn't let me!

    well said!

    rog

  54. #54
    Stubby-legged
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    1,158
    After an affair with aluminimum...I went back to my pugs, apologized, bought it some bling and she forgave me!

  55. #55
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    The sheer amount of dumb in this thread is making my head hurt. Go back to your weight weenie gram counting plastic bike threads, you pussies. And I say that with the utmost respect.

    Quote Originally Posted by newmarketrog View Post
    i tried to rep you... well said!
    Its ok, I neg repped him for you... sad when you cant have a discussion here without calling people names, If it hurts your head so much, stay out of it.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  56. #56
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    1,626
    op
    do you turn your pugs into a pugs op?

  57. #57
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    31,678
    Is it ok to ride my pugsley in the summer on dirt?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  58. #58
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    huh? You realize a Pugsley is a frame, not an entire bike...
    Put the same parts on the Pugsley and the difference will only be a couple pounds. What do you mean by 1/3?
    I guess you missed where I said I tried that with my Moonlander and that at the end of the day, it was still a Moonlander.

  59. #59
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    A Pugsley has spotty reliability It's probably the simplest fatbike around with redundancy designed right into it.

    The sheer amount of dumb in this thread is making my head hurt. Go back to your weight weenie gram counting plastic bike threads, you pussies. And I say that with the utmost respect.
    Ultra, it would be great if you were to follow the conversation in the thread without calling people names. People, like the OP, asked for opinions. Your opinion isn't the only valid opinion. There was a comment about weight and I responded to it, giving my opinion. The negative rep will be for the vulgar name calling. I think it is uncalled for and should be censored by the moderators. I am guessing from your post that you don't agree that it is easier, and possibly more fun to ride a lighter and better functioning bike. It was hard to get your honest opinion within your respectful post.

    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    Yeah, Surly is bound to close up shop and go out of business any day now.
    Did I say anything about Surly going out of business? And in my analogy with Ford, Ford didn't go out of business either. Ford did have to change with the times. We have already seen Surly make some changes and certainly they will have to make more to stay competitive.

  60. #60
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    506
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Is it ok to ride my pugsley in the summer on dirt?
    Do people drive old CJs on the highway?

  61. #61
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    31,678
    Quote Originally Posted by johnlh View Post
    Do people drive old CJs on the highway?
    That's dangerous as hell!
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  62. #62
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    I think the comparison of a Pugsley to a Jeep is a good one. This is a bike that will take you anywhere you want to go. Properly specced, it is fixable anywhere.

    There's new blood coming into the fatbike market with different ideas of mountainbiking. People who are less into adventure on the bike and more into thrills.

    They want a bike they can jump, that's fast downhill, that will take a suspension fork, and that's what the manufacturers are going to build because that is a much bigger market.

    A bit like the difference between the battered old Jeep you'd take down rough trails without a care of dents or scratches, and the shiny accessorised SUV that rarely goes off the highway.

    Both are perfectly valid vehicles to their owners.

    And so I say, hang on to your Pugsleys, they will never wear out, if they break, they can be welded, and they will always be ready to take you deep into the the land of wherethehellami, but these new fatbikes are also fun, so get one of them too.

    Remember the N+1 rule!
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  63. #63
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I guess you missed where I said I tried that with my Moonlander and that at the end of the day, it was still a Moonlander.
    Again....what do you mean by 1/3? Im trying to understand the math
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  64. #64
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    I think the comparison of a Pugsley to a Jeep is a good one. This is a bike that will take you anywhere you want to go. Properly specced, it is fixable anywhere.

    There's new blood coming into the fatbike market with different ideas of mountainbiking. People who are less into adventure on the bike and more into thrills.

    They want a bike they can jump, that's fast downhill, that will take a suspension fork, and that's what the manufacturers are going to build because that is a much bigger market.

    A bit like the difference between the battered old Jeep you'd take down rough trails without a care of dents or scratches, and the shiny accessorised SUV that rarely goes off the highway.

    Both are perfectly valid vehicles to their owners.

    And so I say, hang on to your Pugsleys, they will never wear out, if they break, they can be welded, and they will always be ready to take you deep into the the land of wherethehellami, but these new fatbikes are also fun, so get one of them too.

    Remember the N+1 rule!
    Some good points here. At the end of the day, it is important to understand what you are trying to do on your bike. I dont look at bikes for pure speed, especially not a fat bike.
    If you want race geometry and feather light, go fast styling, then the Pugsley probably feels like a dinosaur.
    I use a fat bike to mostly ride mud, snow, sand that would not be rideable on one of my regular bikes. If I want to go fast on singletrack, I certainly wont choose my fat bike that day to ride.
    I guess it would matter more if your fat bike was your only bike, but I try to use the correct tool for the job.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  65. #65
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    Some good points here. At the end of the day, it is important to understand what you are trying to do on your bike. I dont look at bikes for pure speed, especially not a fat bike.
    If you want race geometry and feather light, go fast styling, then the Pugsley probably feels like a dinosaur.
    I use a fat bike to mostly ride mud, snow, sand that would not be rideable on one of my regular bikes. If I want to go fast on singletrack, I certainly wont choose my fat bike that day to ride.
    I guess it would matter more if your fat bike was your only bike, but I try to use the correct tool for the job.
    You are nearly answering the question yourself. Ride a "light" fatbike and you'll find it's pretty close to the correct tool for a lot more jobs than a heavy one.

    It can be as quick as regular bikes on singletrack, quicker on sand that a heavy fatbike, you are less fatigued that on a heavier fatbike and therefore you can ride further than on a heavier fatbike.

    The issue with fatbikes is (if you call it an issue)... they can only get to a certain weight then you dump approx 2.2kg of tyres on them. A lot of people here have spent a whole lot of money getting these bikes down to a weight where they are at equal weight of an "off the peg" top end 29er HT.

    Labelled weight weenies and recently "Pussies", they (we) are making these bikes more versatile. I race my fatbike on endurance races, solo/team and have won both against regular MTB's, short course XC and 18h/24h events. If it wasn't around the 24lb mark I might be thinking about using one of my other bikes.

    Its entirely up to each individual if they want to spend $2k on a Pug then blow over $3k on it trying to bring it down to within 2kg of a plastic fatty, quite frankly I would swallow the "hipster label" that some here like to hand out and buy plastic/Ti.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  66. #66
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    ...The issue with fatbikes is (if you call it an issue)... they can only get to a certain weight then you dump approx 2.2kg of tyres on them. A lot of people here have spent a whole lot of money getting these bikes down to a weight where they are at equal weight of an "off the peg" top end 29er HT.

    Labelled weight weenies and recently "Pussies", they (we) are making these bikes more versatile. I race my fatbike on endurance races, solo/team and have won both against regular MTB's, short course XC and 18h/24h events. If it wasn't around the 24lb mark I might be thinking about using one of my other bikes...
    Fair enough point. However, there's nothing wrong with the weight weenie approach to a Pug unless you are a competitive racer. The reality is that very few of us are that.

    But seeing as we are talking in grammes, here are a few advantages of a Pug, eg 135mm rear hubs are lighter than equivalent quality 190mm hubs, 100mm front hubs are lighter than equivalent 135mm and 150mm front hubs. They are also more readily available.

    On other WW stuff, I would prioritise carbon rims before a carbon frame. If you can build a 22lb carbon fatbike, you can build a 24lb Pug.

    Now before I get flamed by the racers, I should add I race my Pug in 24 hour races rather than my much lighter 907. This is because I have found the Pug's geometry is much more forgiving at stupid o'clock a.m. when you wish you were dead rather than riding (I'm not an elite racer, so I make tons of mistakes, but I want to stay in one piece).

    There's also an admission. I have just bought a carbon frame and wheels for my ride at the World 24 Hour Solos next month. I haven't bought this in the hope of gaining a better place, but to try to delay the feeling of utter exhaustion by saving that 2lbs of frame weight.

    But I'll be taking the Pug as a backup.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  67. #67
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    But seeing as we are talking in grammes, here are a few advantages of a Pug, eg 135mm rear hubs are lighter than equivalent quality 190mm hubs, 100mm front hubs are lighter than equivalent 135mm and 150mm front hubs. They are also more readily available.
    Just throw more cash at it... want some Tune Fat Kings at 370g a set, only costs half a pug

    Agreed on the carbon wheels before frame upgrade... be it carbon, Ti or whatever. The hassle of tubeless and sealing is completely gone with a set of carbon tubeless compatible wheels, best $$ I have spent on any fat upgrade.

    Good luck in the 24 solos !
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  68. #68
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    ...Good luck in the 24 solos !
    Won't need luck. My position is pre-ordained - DFL.

    I think I'm the oldest rider, and just to improve my prospects I'll be riding single speed...

    (I'm praying for really bad weather. A blizzard would be nice - slow everyone down to my pace)
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  69. #69
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    There's a 60+ woman here who rides endurance races, I reckon she has been either 55-59 or 60+ World 24h Solo Champ on 2 occasions now... putting out 12 laps.

    You'll do fine, the buzz of the event will keep the feet spinning !
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  70. #70
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Welnic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    883
    I like the comparison to a jeep. I had an old CJ5 for long enough to find out what the hood latches are really for. When you first get one you think that they hold the hood down. After you have one long enough you find that in addition to that their more important job is to hold the fender up after what originally attaches it mostly rusts away. It still worked fine, and I was able to use my fiberglass skills from kayaking to patch the floor boards.

    (not a picture of my jeep)

    Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it-jeep.jpg

  71. #71
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    I totally agree with ozzy. If carbon fat bikes weren't available but rims were, I'd have them on my Surly. Call it a weight weenie thing if you want, but I think they are a game changer. Tubeless, weight savings, performance of the tire, and fewer flat issues make any bike more fun to ride. It doesn't have to be in a race to notice the difference. If I were riding a pugs and didn't want a different frame, I'd buy carbon rims.

    Welnic, did you also find out as I did that if you plow into a big snow drift that the front fenders bend? Yes, the old jeeps were great. They don't come close to what is available now for off road travel.

  72. #72
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    31,678
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    I think the comparison of a Pugsley to a Jeep is a good one. This is a bike that will take you anywhere you want to go. Properly specced, it is fixable anywhere.
    Taking an Army Humvee up to 60mph on highways (in convoy) was one of the scariest things I did in the army That vehicle was not meant to go fast.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  73. #73
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Welnic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    883
    I worked at Snowshoe ski resort in WV one winter and drove in a little snow. Then the next two years I worked at Killington VT where it didn't snow at all. I didn't even put it in 4 wheel drive either winter. So I never got to do any serious snow plowing with it.

    Jayem, how fast could you drive a Humvee off road though. At the same time I had my jeep I sometimes drove a Scout owned by the company I worked for. It had road visibility issues compared to the CJ5 but being someone else's vehicle I was able to drive it faster off road.

  74. #74
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    You are nearly answering the question yourself. Ride a "light" fatbike and you'll find it's pretty close to the correct tool for a lot more jobs than a heavy one.

    It can be as quick as regular bikes on singletrack, quicker on sand that a heavy fatbike, you are less fatigued that on a heavier fatbike and therefore you can ride further than on a heavier fatbike.

    The issue with fatbikes is (if you call it an issue)... they can only get to a certain weight then you dump approx 2.2kg of tyres on them. A lot of people here have spent a whole lot of money getting these bikes down to a weight where they are at equal weight of an "off the peg" top end 29er HT.

    Labelled weight weenies and recently "Pussies", they (we) are making these bikes more versatile. I race my fatbike on endurance races, solo/team and have won both against regular MTB's, short course XC and 18h/24h events. If it wasn't around the 24lb mark I might be thinking about using one of my other bikes.

    Its entirely up to each individual if they want to spend $2k on a Pug then blow over $3k on it trying to bring it down to within 2kg of a plastic fatty, quite frankly I would swallow the "hipster label" that some here like to hand out and buy plastic/Ti.
    Maybe, but to play devils advocate, why are people/companies trying to get fat bikes to be almost as light as regular mtb's, and then use them for purposes where an mtb is suitable?
    In other words, why would someone race or ride on terrain where a regular mtb is fine, but choose a fat bike? Maybe the answer is "its more fun". If that is the case, I can dig it, but then I would say, why get caught up in the ounces? Just have fun. If going super fast on singletrack is your thing, choose a different bike altogether.
    It just seems that lately many people are spending time and money trying to make fat bikes appropriate for situations where there is already a more appropriate bike available.
    To me it is similar to trying to use a lightweight xc bike for a road race....again, there is already a more appropriate tool available...a road bike.
    I tend to use a fat bike for situations where a regular mtb just would not do the job, which also means I am probably going ~3 mph. In these situations I am not too concerned about the weight of the bike.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  75. #75
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131
    Because if you can go fat and light it is the best of both worlds. If you can go even fatter and ultralight (er), well, even better yet.

    But I enjoy reading this thread. Just look how durable the Pugs still is today. Even with all of this talk of replacement and obsolescence she's still there ready to go for a ride....

  76. #76
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    40
    ...
    Last edited by kapow!; 05-12-2018 at 04:16 PM. Reason: not relevant

  77. #77
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131
    I think Fatbikes should be 50lbs minimum. Singlespeed and fixed suspension only. And Mauve....

  78. #78
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Quote Originally Posted by kapow! View Post
    Seems the roadie racer boy attitude has arrived in fat bikes, which is too bad. $2300 for an Asian carbon frame? You gotta be kidding me. If I paid that much I'd be talking down on Surly bikes too.
    Have you actually ever threw a leg over one of the new carbon fat bikes, it's not all about weight they ride and handle sweet. It might not be for all but some know what I am talking about.

  79. #79
    mtbr member
    Reputation: schnee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,797
    Yes, why would anyone ever want a bike that is lighter?
    The nerve of those people.
    The mind *boggles*.

    /sarcasm

    PS I had an all-steel rigid 29er, I replaced it with an aluminum/carbon one and shaved off ten pounds, absolutely no regrets. It's SO much more fun to ride on and throw around.

  80. #80
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    I'm having a really hard time understanding why anyone would be opposed to a bike being lighter, more responsive, quicker, and at the same time being more versatile, like being able to run every tire and rim combination made.

  81. #81
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I'm having a really hard time understanding why anyone would be opposed to a bike being lighter, more responsive, quicker, and at the same time being more versatile, like being able to run every tire and rim combination made.
    It's reverse bike snobbery, been running rampant for quit awhile on here now.

  82. #82
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    I'm having a really hard time understanding why anyone would be opposed to a bike being lighter, more responsive, quicker, and at the same time being more versatile, like being able to run every tire and rim combination made.
    OK, try it from this angle.

    You want an adventure bike, it's hard to beat the Pugsley. Now by adding some lightweight components, eg carbon wheels, you are not compromising the bike, merely making it a better lighter adventure bike. If you've ever lifted a Pug over a 7' high deer fence or shouldered it over a mountain, I'm sure you'll agree with me.

    As for the new trend of light, responsive trail fatbikes, I don't think anyone is against that. That's their purpose, and they're good for short blasts through the trails. They're great. After several hours I get tired and I find "responsive" gets me into trouble, I want steamroller then, but up to then I'll take responsive.

    Simply, there's now 2 different types of fatbikes, and we should own both.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  83. #83
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    How is it hard to beat ? If I ride my sub 25lb fatty slower, then its still got the weight advantage, with its 4.8" tyres... the flip/flop front 2 back ? 2 rear hubs worth of weight, maybe they failed back then but the new Spech Fatboy hub failures aside, they are pretty reliable now.

    Look, Im all for retro/old skool but apart from the Surly name and the fact it was the original first production fatty... you would be better comparing it to a bikes direct fatty than a blinged up carbon fatbike, its 2005 technology.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  84. #84
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andy74's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    226
    Because if your plastic bike was loaded down like this, it would snap in half
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it-image.jpg  

    It's all about the firecuts

  85. #85
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    It's funny how people keep speaking about the Pugsley as being outdated, and old technology....it's a frame!
    My Pugsley doesn't have Pugsley shifters and Pugsley brakes.
    It's a frame. Maybe you don't like the offset or geometry, but the only thing different about this bike compared to the newest carbon bike you can find, is the frame and geometry.
    If you don't like that, it is understandable, but I can't see how people feel it is this old
    Model T type of bike.
    A lot of fuzzy math in this thread.
    By the way, I own a gorgeous piece if titanium, hand built goodness, and have had a carbon race bike as well. I am not a "steel is what's real" kind if guy, and certainly not a snob or hipster. I just find it increasingly funny that people whose skill levels are not at the top of the sport, have been convinced by the marketing geniuses that they need the latest technology to ride their local trails.
    I like getting new bikes and trying new stuff, but I don't think a two pound weight savings in the frame makes me a better rider.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  86. #86
    mtbr member
    Reputation: schnee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    1,797
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    As for the new trend of light, responsive trail fatbikes, I don't think anyone is against that.
    Sorry, look at 'Andy74' AND 'fat_tires_are_fun' just between your post and mine.

    Plenty of grognards in this thread making up all sorts of nonsense to say lighter bikes are not legitimate.

    I appreciate your measured view but you definitely don't speak for everyone.

  87. #87
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by schnee View Post
    Sorry, look at 'Andy74' AND 'fat_tires_are_fun' just between your post and mine.

    Plenty of grognards in this thread making up all sorts of nonsense to say lighter bikes are not legitimate.

    I appreciate your measured view but you definitely don't speak for everyone.
    Please don't speak for me...
    If you follow this thread from the beginning, my discussion is centered around upgrading an existing Pugsley, and I am saying that weight of the frame is very low on my priority list. I already own one...I am not saying everyone should run and buy one.
    I also openly say that if I did not already own a Pugsley, it would not be my first choice at this point. I would likely get a BD model for less money.
    I don't want this to turn in to me looking like a Surly fanboy...that is certainly not the case.
    I support people's decisions to buy whatever they feel makes their ride more enjoyable. I am doing nothing more than offering my opinion as to what works for me. The "advancement" of fat bikes is great, with manufacturers jumping in and offering better choices. I just find it counterintuitive to spend money trying to make a fat bike light, then ride it on terrain where I could ride my Moots, which is likely lighter than any Fat bike I could purchase.
    If people get pleasure from riding a light fat bike on a hard packed dirt trail....great.
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  88. #88
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    Quote Originally Posted by schnee View Post
    ...Plenty of grognards in this thread making up all sorts of nonsense to say lighter bikes are not legitimate...
    This has turned into a horses for courses argument, but no-one in their right mind goes show-jumping on a Clydesdale, or ploughing with a race horse.

    Lighter bikes are always legitimate in my view.

    My philosophy is no more weight than is necessary to do the job, and sometimes that translates into using a heavier component. The important thing is to be realistic about what job the bike has to do.

    So back to the OP's question. It is definitely worth upgrading a Pugsley with lighter parts, though it will still be a Pugsley, but one that is easier to use.
    Last edited by Velobike; 09-21-2014 at 08:38 AM.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  89. #89
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    So back to the OP's question. It is definitely worth upgrading a Pugsley with lighter parts, though it will still be a Pugsley, but one that is easier to use.
    I agree completely if you really like the frame do it!! I remember a few years ago I posted a pic on the Pugsley owners FB page and I got ripped a new one because I had it blinged out and why would someone spend money on a Pugs, boy have times changed. I still have a very nice Pugs sitting in the shed but I really don't care for the head angle on it so it sits.

  90. #90
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131

    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    It's funny how people keep speaking about the Pugsley as being outdated, and old technology....it's a frame!
    My Pugsley doesn't have Pugsley shifters and Pugsley brakes.
    It's a frame. Maybe you don't like the offset or geometry, but the only thing different about this bike compared to the newest carbon bike you can find, is the frame and geometry.
    If you don't like that, it is understandable, but I can't see how people feel it is this old Model T type of bike.

    A lot of fuzzy math in this thread.

    I like getting new bikes and trying new stuff, but I don't think a two pound weight savings in the frame makes me a better rider.
    Well then, OP, sounds like you answered your own question contained in the thread title?

    Fact is current tech has moved beyond the Pugs. Tech will continue to evolve past this point too. It's a death spiral to any sane bank account. Required? NO! Desired? Up to you..

    I am a Surly fanboy having never owned one and am 50 years old.


    If 2 pounds made someone a better rider enemas would be standard practice. Question is if adding 5" tires and still shaving 2 lbs would help you or not.

  91. #91
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,516
    The Pugsley is still a relevant fatbike in today's market. Not for steel, Surly, or nostalgia. It's extremely versatile, tough as nails, and handles great in a variety of situations. It can become a 27lb race bike easily, and it can become a 40lb touring/adventure rig easily. It can crash off of and into things and survive, and it's not so damn expensive that you're afraid to scratch it or ride it like it's meant to be ridden. If something should happen, you can contact Surly and they'll take care of you. If you're an average sized rider, you won't notice the traits larger riders have annoyances with.
    Jason
    Disclaimer: www.paramountfargo.com

  92. #92
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    1,675
    All of this talk about old tech, new tech is riduculous. Nothing has really changed, people are serious suckers for marketing. 135mm or 190mm rear hub spacing, big effing deal. Other than weight and geometry there are no real differences between old and new. It's a bicycle with two wheels and fat tires, that's it.

    Things like electronic shifting, active suspension that's new technology. Carbon has been used in bicycle frames for well over twenty years, they build a fat bike frame out of the stuff and suddenly it's new tech.

    It's really no different in the road bike world. Fat people with big asses walk in to bike shops everyday thinking that new light weight carbon bike is going to make all the difference, suddenly they are going to be fast on a group ride.

    Most people caught up spending money on new tech would be better off if they put half as much thought and effort in to improving the engine. I don't care enough about what other people do to really give a rat's ass either way, truth be told, spending large amounts of money is good for the economy and good for bike companies' bottom line. I worked in a big bike shop for 6 years, "new tech" paid for my rent. Carry on.

  93. #93
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    126
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Is it ok to ride my pugsley in the summer on dirt?
    F**k yeah it is. My Pugz is my only bike.

  94. #94
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131
    So I gotta ask this.

    The OP obviously thought he would be "upgrading" to something other than a Pugs. The thread title said so.

    Do you still feel that something other than a Pugs is an upgrade? Could you elaborate?

    Geometry, weight and materials.....the only discerning factors in a frame. If the Pugs is only a frame, like was stated here, doesn't changing materials and geometry constitute a change in technology? Does a 5" tire qualify as new technology? How about front suspension on a fatbike? How about interchangeable dropouts? Full suspension? All on a fatbike vs others.

    Heck, aren't fatbikes a technology?

    One thing's for sure. I'll reconsider paying 20% more at my LBS vs online shopping from here on out...heh..

  95. #95
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    So, if I take every component off of a Pugsley and replace them with some of the most expensive components I can find, do I still have a Pugsley? Things like carbon rims, XX1, and other fancy stuff.

  96. #96
    bigger than you.
    Reputation: Gigantic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    3,068
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    So, if I take every component off of a Pugsley and replace them with some of the most expensive components I can find, do I still have a Pugsley? Things like carbon rims, XX1, and other fancy stuff.
    apparently, you CAN polish a turd.

    Mythbusters Polishing a Turd - YouTube

  97. #97
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    All of this talk about old tech, new tech is riduculous. Nothing has really changed, people are serious suckers for marketing. 135mm or 190mm rear hub spacing, big effing deal. Other than weight and geometry there are no real differences between old and new. It's a bicycle with two wheels and fat tires, that's it.

    Things like electronic shifting, active suspension that's new technology. Carbon has been used in bicycle frames for well over twenty years, they build a fat bike frame out of the stuff and suddenly it's new tech.

    It's really no different in the road bike world. Fat people with big asses walk in to bike shops everyday thinking that new light weight carbon bike is going to make all the difference, suddenly they are going to be fast on a group ride.

    Most people caught up spending money on new tech would be better off if they put half as much thought and effort in to improving the engine. I don't care enough about what other people do to really give a rat's ass either way, truth be told, spending large amounts of money is good for the economy and good for bike companies' bottom line. I worked in a big bike shop for 6 years, "new tech" paid for my rent. Carry on.
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    rog

  98. #98
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    So, if I take every component off of a Pugsley and replace them with some of the most expensive components I can find, do I still have a Pugsley? Things like carbon rims, XX1, and other fancy stuff.
    Yes, but it will be 1/3 lighter!!
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  99. #99
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    Yes, but it will be 1/3 lighter!!
    I disagree, and it will still be a bike that I can't run the wide room and tire combinations.

  100. #100
    mtbr member
    Reputation: fat_tires_are_fun's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    520
    ^^ohhh, that must have been a rhetorical question. Sorry, I was using your math. Carry on
    - MOOTS Mooto X
    - Salsa Fargo
    - Niner RLT9

  101. #101
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    80
    Wouldn't you know it. The first time I stop by in months and the race boyz are still hating on the Pugs.

    I take my Jeep far off road, then I get on my old heavy low tech Pugs ..... and I just keep going. It's never let me down.

    ...and yes it's worth upgrading your Pugs

  102. #102
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Let's all ask a bunch of riders that don't even like steel bikes what they think of the Pugsley. Great idea.

    Next time I'm in the mood for Thai food, I'll make sure to run it by my friend that hates anything spicy.

    For many riders, the Pugsley represents everything that THEY like in a bicycle. For you "latest designer handbag must-havers", this is obviously not the case.

    As Velobike mentioned, you can make a Pugsley as light as you want. 2 lbs of non-rotational frame weight going to be a deal breaker for you? But most likely, that won't be the end all, be all for a rider that likes Surly bicycles in general. I'm sure I could find a lot more non-rotational weight on your ass, and around your waist, but you don't seem to be too concerned about that weight, eh?

    Also, if you're built like an offensive lineman and want to get rad, perhaps another bike will be a better fit for you ...until it isn't. Then you can start another holy crusade against that particular brand because their bicycle broke when a 300lb gorilla tried to do something that it wasn't designed to do.

    To the OP: From one Surly fan to another Surly fan, an actual relevant opinion that actually applies to your tastes, the only good reason to buy a different fatbike is if you want 5" tires on 100mm rims. Otherwise, stick with the Pugsley. It rides great, you can build it up a million different ways, and it is the most versatile fatbike made.

    Now, I'm thinking about getting into country music, guys. Where are all the metalheads at, so I can get their opinions on some good country albums to start with?

  103. #103
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    I am a Surly fan heck I have one and had another but what makes it the most versatile frame?

  104. #104

  105. #105
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    166
    ...munching popcorn while I watch the show...

    Spinymouse

    11 KM SS
    13 CC Rando-Check
    13 Pugsley

  106. #106
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    1,675
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    Now, I'm thinking about getting into country music, guys. Where are all the metalheads at, so I can get their opinions on some good country albums to start with?
    Dude that's easy.. Hank 3
    Hank Williams III "I'm Drunk Again" - YouTube

    Hank3 Crazed Country Rebel - YouTube

  107. #107
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    Let's all ask a bunch of riders that don't even like steel bikes what they think of the Pugsley. Great idea.

    Next time I'm in the mood for Thai food, I'll make sure to run it by my friend that hates anything spicy.

    For many riders, the Pugsley represents everything that THEY like in a bicycle. For you "latest designer handbag must-havers", this is obviously not the case.

    As Velobike mentioned, you can make a Pugsley as light as you want. 2 lbs of non-rotational frame weight going to be a deal breaker for you? But most likely, that won't be the end all, be all for a rider that likes Surly bicycles in general. I'm sure I could find a lot more non-rotational weight on your ass, and around your waist, but you don't seem to be too concerned about that weight, eh?

    Also, if you're built like an offensive lineman and want to get rad, perhaps another bike will be a better fit for you ...until it isn't. Then you can start another holy crusade against that particular brand because their bicycle broke when a 300lb gorilla tried to do something that it wasn't designed to do.

    To the OP: From one Surly fan to another Surly fan, an actual relevant opinion that actually applies to your tastes, the only good reason to buy a different fatbike is if you want 5" tires on 100mm rims. Otherwise, stick with the Pugsley. It rides great, you can build it up a million different ways, and it is the most versatile fatbike made.

    Now, I'm thinking about getting into country music, guys. Where are all the metalheads at, so I can get their opinions on some good country albums to start with?
    Ultraspontane, your response is as ridiculous as you giving me neg feedback and calling me stupid in the feedback because you don't agree with me. I don't recall anyone saying they didn't like steel bikes. I don't mind Thai food, but I'm not going to eat it if it's 6 years old. What's wrong with the latest stuff if it's good. Many fight this only because they can't afford it and so speak badly about anything new. I'm not for something new if it isn't better. I have probably put more miles on a Surly than most (most likely that includes you) but yes, I was ready for lighter and quicker, even if it was while fully loaded. As far as finding "rotational weight in my ass", sorry, you're talking to the wrong guy and if we rode together you'd probably be able find that out for yourself. So, you ride a Pugsley and you are willing to offend others to defend riding one? There are only two reasons to still be riding a Pugsley at the end of 2014. Do you ride a Pugsley because you bought one and can't afford to get anything else, or because you actually think it's better than anything else made? Oh, and, the only bike I rode today was made of steal although I still might take the carbon fatty out tonight.

  108. #108
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    126
    Pugsley. Pugsley. Pugsley. Pugsley.
    Drink beer. 'Merica!

  109. #109
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andy74's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    226
    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    Haha!
    Well I think everyone has to be in agreement, these would certainly appear to be the the recommended country albums by metalheads
    It's all about the firecuts

  110. #110
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    There are only two reasons to still be riding a Pugsley at the end of 2014.
    hey [email protected], the clue phone's ringing and it's for you.

    how bout this for a reason?: folks ride pugs at the end of 2014 cuz they like them.

    rog

  111. #111
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Quote Originally Posted by Saddle Up View Post
    That's awesome and I'm a metal head!!

  112. #112
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    I know this might sound weird coming from me but can we please try to keep this a little civilized.
    <a*href="https://www.freesmileys.org/free-big-smiley.php"><img src="https://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/big/big-smiley-001.gif" alt="Big Smileys" border="0" /></a>

  113. #113
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by newmarketrog View Post
    how bout this for a reason?: folks ride pugs at the end of 2014 cuz they like them.
    Ayuh.
    Spinymouse

    11 KM SS
    13 CC Rando-Check
    13 Pugsley

  114. #114
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    2,516
    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I am a Surly fan heck I have one and had another but what makes it the most versatile frame?
    Hub options? Can't think of another fat bike with even 10% of the hub options the Pugsley has.
    Jason
    Disclaimer: www.paramountfargo.com

  115. #115
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    51
    Hi, I'm the OP for this thread.
    Thanks for all the feedback, I'm keeping the pug and just upgrading components as they fail/ break. I think it's time now to move on and go riding instead of typing.
    Cheers

  116. #116
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Light-Bicycle and Sarma (more $$) make carbon rims that people seem to like, with offset drilling options for a Pugsley, if you must have carbon rims. Otherwise, Marge Lites are very good quality and light weight rims, for not a ton of $$$.

    There are several options out there for you.

  117. #117
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    Ultraspontane, your response is as ridiculous as you giving me neg feedback and calling me stupid in the feedback because you don't agree with me.
    I never called you stupid. I did call a stupid thing that you posted, stupid, however. There is a big difference there. I had problems with specific (and incorrect) things that you posted.

    Also, you left neg rep first, so perhaps you should take your own advice. Who cares about rep, anyway?

    Quote Originally Posted by alphazz View Post
    There are only two reasons to still be riding a Pugsley at the end of 2014. Do you ride a Pugsley because you bought one and can't afford to get anything else, or because you actually think it's better than anything else made?
    Dumb post, Exhibit B.

    Have you ever considered that people ride their bikes because they ...like them? And that your definition of an ideal bicycle isn't the same as everyone else's on planet Earth? I don't get why you're trying to extrapolate your own tastes onto everyone. I've already mentioned several times why I think the Pugsley is great, I think you're just clueless.

  118. #118
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131
    Quote Originally Posted by saron View Post
    Hi, I'm the OP for this thread.
    Thanks for all the feedback, I'm keeping the pug and just upgrading components as they fail/ break. I think it's time now to move on and go riding instead of typing.
    Cheers
    Thanks for answering, saron. Best of luck on the upgrades!

  119. #119
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    More negs handed out... thanks for your silly message Ultra, happy to trade negs with anyone who thinks insults and name calling is they way to get your point across here !
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  120. #120
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Ozzy shouldn't you be starting a race pretty soon? I can't wait to hear/read about it!!

  121. #121
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    ozzy's proving himself to being a little light in the loafers. nttawwt. wanna neg rep me again? tough guy. lol!

    my gawd.....

    rog

  122. #122
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Ozzy shouldn't you be starting a race pretty soon? I can't wait to hear/read about it!!
    Oh yeah excitement has kicked in, leave on Friday for the 4 day journey to the start, Tuesday morning at 6am we ride out into the desert on stage 1, looking like 40°C+ and easterly headwinds for all 5 days. Only 130km a day of soft red sand... even know I have all the info on the weather and other extremes, I still don't know what to expect... cant wait.

    Loaded with cameras and will be running a gopro on my bars, hopefully I'll get a short vid and pics up when I get back (If I survive )

    3 day countdown...

    Cheers Bob !
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  123. #123
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by newmarketrog View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by newmarketrog View Post
    ozzy's proving himself to being a little light in the loafers. nttawwt. wanna neg rep me again? tough guy. lol!
    Try getting your point over without being offensive.

    Rep again ? You'll have to wait till I rep 100 more people, so at 5 per day, it will be 20 days minimum.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  124. #124
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    80

    Negative Rep

    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    More negs handed out... thanks for your silly message Ultra, happy to trade negs with anyone who thinks insults and name calling is they way to get your point across here !
    My negative rep comment to you..... You're a total a$$hole.

    Your negative rep comment to me..... Yes indeed (!)

    Glad we got that straight. My suggestion is to negative rep this guy right out of the forum

  125. #125
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    So you called me names, now you are ganging up on me... just like being back in the playground when I was 6yrs old.
    Now the only thing was, when I returned the neg... you lost 2 green squares in one hit.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  126. #126
    aka bOb
    Reputation: bdundee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    8,683
    Quote Originally Posted by I'm suba View Post

    Glad we got that straight. My suggestion is to negative rep this guy right out of the forum
    Sorry dood Ozzy has been a great resource here, ain't going to happen. Actually right up at the top of the list as a stand up guy.

    I know you have an awesome Pugs that you have stuck a boat load of money in and I know it's very easy to take things personal, hell I've been there on the defense as well, I guess my point to all including myself (especially) is we need to let things bounce off of us and not take it so personal after all we are all entitled to out opinion and we all are really here for the same reason right? I remember my Mom telling me before she passed that my opinion was wrong, is that even possible?

  127. #127
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy74 View Post
    Because if your plastic bike was loaded down like this, it would snap in half
    How do you like this version of the Pug (2014 Special ops...right?)? LBS near me has one on clearance...can probably get it for around $2k....would use almost entirely on paths/trails in winter/snow....

  128. #128
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    80
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    So you called me names, now you are ganging up on me... just like being back in the playground when I was 6yrs old.
    Now the only thing was, when I returned the neg... you lost 2 green squares in one hit.
    Glad you're keeping count of my rep Chief

  129. #129
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    80
    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    Sorry dood Ozzy has been a great resource here, ain't going to happen. Actually right up at the top of the list as a stand up guy.

    I know you have an awesome Pugs that you have stuck a boat load of money in and I know it's very easy to take things personal, hell I've been there on the defense as well, I guess my point to all including myself (especially) is we need to let things bounce off of us and not take it so personal after all we are all entitled to out opinion and we all are really here for the same reason right? I remember my Mom telling me before she passed that my opinion was wrong, is that even possible?
    For a stand up guy he sure seems like an ass hat.

    True I put a lot of money and time into my Pugs, and I'm not taking anything personally here. If someone doesn't like a Pugs no worries at all. I love mine. That's all that matters to me...

    What I don't like is self imposed internet bullies. I stand up for people who I think are getting picked on. This place was once the coolest site on the internet. Now it's one of the strangest IMO. I give you and a few others credit for adapting here but I couldn't. Time for me to move on again. Sorry I stopped by....

  130. #130
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    34
    This discussion is interesting to me as I might be in the market for a fat bike (I dont need one, but I WANT one), in so far as it has opened my eyes that there are other fat bikes out there apart from the Surly Pugsley, and that I should do a bit more research as to my actual needs (re: want!!!) when it comes to purchasing a fat bike.
    N+1 = the correct equation for the number of bikes...............

  131. #131
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andy74's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    226
    Quote Originally Posted by zaxmalloy View Post
    How do you like this version of the Pug (2014 Special ops...right?)? LBS near me has one on clearance...can probably get it for around $2k....would use almost entirely on paths/trails in winter/snow....
    I use mine mostly on sand. I like that it has the wider Rolling Darryl rims
    They offer more float on the sand / snow than the Marge Lites
    This is my first go round with hydraulic brakes so I'll have to get back to you on that
    But I never had a problem with BB7s
    I also liked the friction shifters that come on the standard pug
    Basically the selling point for me was the wider rims
    It's all about the firecuts

  132. #132
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    There is no bullying... 2 of you blokes started throwing insults. Its a topic that turned into a pug v plastic and people came out defending the pug. You were the one saying the "racer boyz hating" pugs.

    None of us said they weren't a great bike (read back through the thread) they will be around when the plastics are smashed, cracked or whatever.

    My only argument here, IMO is that lighter is always better. Its a throw away world and people change bikes regularly... there is no Ti for life or bike for life anymore.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  133. #133
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Andy74's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    226
    Hey ozz
    Chill brother , take a deep breath
    How'd you do in your desert race anyway?
    It's all about the firecuts

  134. #134
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    So you called me names, now you are ganging up on me... just like being back in the playground when I was 6yrs old.
    ^^^^^^^^^^^that explains everything. once a whiny victim, always a whiny victim.

    desert race? so that's how the sand got in yer vag.

    rog

  135. #135
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,133

    Re: Why upgrade from a Pugsley is it worth it

    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    There is no bullying... 2 of you blokes started throwing insults. Its a topic that turned into a pug v plastic and people came out defending the pug. You were the one saying the "racer boyz hating" pugs.
    You know, when you start firing out neg rep because your feelings got hurt, don't whine when someone gives it back to you.

    The fact that you're even bringing rep up at all is pretty sad. Either get over it, or take your own advice and don't give it out in the first place.

  136. #136
    mtbr member
    Reputation: efuss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    266
    I will upgrade my Pugs when I feel like it is holding me back, or otherwise not meeting my needs (I would like to try a suspension fork someday). Until then, I will happily ride it, and smile knowingly at riders who buy a new bike every year because they think it makes them a better rider / cyclist. Marketing hype really works, I guess.

  137. #137
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by ultraspontane View Post
    You know, when you start firing out neg rep because your feelings got hurt, don't whine when someone gives it back to you.

    The fact that you're even bringing rep up at all is pretty sad.
    Quote Originally Posted by newmarketrog View Post
    i tried to rep you again. the "man" wouldn't let me!

    well said!

    rog
    Now starting to think you's 2 trolls are plain stupid... read your mates comments on YOU, post #53... you's brought up the rep, not me or anyone else.

    I just handed out negs to 3 of you's for abusing people on this forum unnecessarily. If you cant debate an issue without insults, you are not wanted here.

    You are also going the right way to get this topic closed by mods.

    Whiny victim.
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  138. #138
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,807
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    Now starting to think you's 2 trolls are plain stupid... read your mates comments on YOU, post #53... you's brought up the rep, not me or anyone else.

    I just handed out negs to 3 of you's for abusing people on this forum unnecessarily. If you cant debate an issue without insults, you are not wanted here.

    You are also going the right way to get this topic closed by mods.

    Whiny victim.
    don't worry, sally, gigantic is whiny too. neg rep throwin and all.

    it's pretty clear who takes the innanets way too seriously round here.

    rog

  139. #139
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy74 View Post
    I use mine mostly on sand. I like that it has the wider Rolling Darryl rims
    They offer more float on the sand / snow than the Marge Lites
    This is my first go round with hydraulic brakes so I'll have to get back to you on that
    But I never had a problem with BB7s
    I also liked the friction shifters that come on the standard pug
    Basically the selling point for me was the wider rims
    Thanks for the input (among the other noise in here) good info...

  140. #140
    Laramie, Wyoming
    Reputation: alphazz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,941
    Quote Originally Posted by fat_tires_are_fun View Post
    huh? You realize a Pugsley is a frame, not an entire bike...
    Put the same parts on the Pugsley and the difference will only be a couple pounds. What do you mean by 1/3?
    This thread has gotten way out of control. I had unsubscribed and I don't know why I'm reading in here again. Probably because of the rain and cold. Fat, I think you have misunderstood my 1/3 comment. 1/3 heavier is much different than 1/3 of the weight and I think the 1/3 heavier comment was pretty accurate.

    On a different note, Ozzy and I dislike the name calling. I think it's totally unnecessary and I think he agrees. Speaking for myself, I don't see the logic in name calling.

  141. #141
    mtbr member
    Reputation: BoogieMang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    286
    I'm not much for throwin' about negative rep, but it's tempting after reading through the $hit show that this thread has turned into. There are a few new posters around here with different opinions that seem to think having a differing opinion entitles you to being an a$$hole about it. It was great when the discussion on this forum was civilized and informative. For those of you that have been around for a while, please take the high road and don't feed it any further.

  142. #142
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Velobike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    7,171
    Quote Originally Posted by ozzybmx View Post
    Oh yeah excitement has kicked in, leave on Friday for the 4 day journey to the start, Tuesday morning at 6am we ride out into the desert on stage 1, looking like 40°C+ and easterly headwinds for all 5 days. Only 130km a day of soft red sand... even know I have all the info on the weather and other extremes, I still don't know what to expect... cant wait.

    Loaded with cameras and will be running a gopro on my bars, hopefully I'll get a short vid and pics up when I get back (If I survive )

    3 day countdown...

    Cheers Bob !
    What with it being a race in Oz, it's surely going to be mainly blinged up carbon/Ti fatbikes this year (a guess) and no doubt some wiry racing whippets on 1.9" tyres.

    So make sure you take plenty pics for our delectation.

    I would take my Pug to the race and make all you carbon/Ti boys eat my dust apart from one small hitch in my preparations - I can't find a frame bag big enough to conceal the Honda XR650 assist system I have designed.

    Good luck.
    As little bike as possible, as silent as possible.
    Latitude: 57º36' Highlands, Scotland

  143. #143
    Fat & Single
    Reputation: ozzybmx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    4,111
    Quote Originally Posted by Velobike View Post
    What with it being a race in Oz, it's surely going to be mainly blinged up carbon/Ti fatbikes this year (a guess) and no doubt some wiry racing whippets on 1.9" tyres.
    Up until this year there has been loads of regular bikes, fatbikes only appeared a few years back with Fatback, Pugs and Mukluks... I believe this year will be the first with 100% fatbikes. If you run a regular mtb, there is a lot of pushing involved on dunes and even flat sections.

    There are 10 of the massive field of 22 crazy people riding Muru Witjira Ti bikes which is an Australian brand started 2 years ago to specifically make fatbikes (Also the Simpson Desert Challenge's major sponsor), also a couple of Salted SandFlys which is another new Australian brand bringing in carbon frame/forks and doing full builds.

    I like the Salted bikes... might go plastic later this year myself.

    Cheers velo, good luck in the 24 too
    Santa Cruz Hightower LT Evil Following Trek 9.9 Superfly SL IndyFab Deluxe 29 Pivot Vault CX Cervelo R3 Disc

  144. #144
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    131
    I read that saron is now going to replace all the parts with lighter ones as they wear out instead of "upgrade from a Pugsley" entirely, as the title states.

    Works for me.

Similar Threads

  1. Original purple Pugsley - what's it worth?
    By radair in forum Fat bikes
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 08-29-2014, 12:57 AM
  2. Upgrade or just not worth it?
    By Manic9 in forum All Mountain
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 03-02-2014, 03:09 PM
  3. Should I upgrade wheels? What makes the upgrade worth it?
    By stygz1 in forum Wheels and Tires
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 11-04-2013, 10:34 AM
  4. Fox 34 - worth the upgrade?
    By LCW in forum Shocks and Suspension
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 04-11-2013, 03:42 PM
  5. Is this upgrade worth it?
    By Raptrox in forum Shocks and Suspension
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 10-13-2012, 07:39 PM

Members who have read this thread: 1

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.