Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded

    I've been scouring the internet and trying to gleam info on MTBR (tough given the iffy search function of this board) on these tires.

    The problem is most reviews are for the non-studded. And given the high cost, I haven't found anyone who has done back to back comparos.

    If I were to go to a studded 5" tire, it seems the Vee's are discounted fairly decently, whereas the 45Nrth's sell for $250/each all day long.

    I live in Pennsylvania, so I'm not constantly riding on snow and ice. But I was out yesterday in Delaware on some iced over singletrack, Bud up front, Ground Control out back, and I was sliding, albeit in a controlled manner, didn't go down at all, but I was wondering if I wouldn't benefit from some studded tires.

    Is the Vee studded decent for the cost?

  2. #2
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    It's no lie. Once you go studded...you never go back

  3. #3
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    I can't find the XL studded snowshoes in stock anywhere. Do they exist?

  4. #4
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    I don't believe that they've been released yet.

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    This guy found 'em...
    Quote Originally Posted by Shifty Bits View Post
    Upgrade-itis continues. Swapped out the Snowshoe for some studded Snowshoe XLs. Also, did the duct tape/gorilla packing tape rim strip swap. Did a nice shiny silver tape.. I think it looks sweet.

    Already upgraded:

    - Carbon bar (Ibis Low Rise) and Lizard Skins Peaty grips.
    - Thomson Elite seatpost
    - WTB Pure V Race
    - Azonic 420 flats (flats are definitely the ticket for fatties!)
    - Ibera frame bag.

    On the docket:

    - Swap out ridiculous stock stem with Truvativ AKA 70mm/5 degree stem.
    - 1x up front... reviewing options, but leaning towards the X9 and a direct mount 28T narrow/wide ring
    - One up treatment on the rear... 42T

    If the cash fairy decides to visit:

    - Dropper post at some point... frame is a touch on the soprano side of stand over for me... plus I just miss having a dropper on it.
    - Carbon rim/I9 hubs

    Attachment 958140
    Attachment 958139
    -F
    It's never easier - you just go faster.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by dudeist View Post
    I can't find the XL studded snowshoes in stock anywhere. Do they exist?
    I actually have no idea. I just saw this link:

    Vee Rubber Snowshoe XL Studded Fat Bike Tire: 26" x 4.8" 120tpi Folding Bead Silica Compound Black - AEBike.com

    and was working off that price and the assumption that they'd be back in stock soon. I didn't know they weren't released yet.

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    I've seen em pop up on eBay a couple times, but not at that price. The ones on AEBike have been "out of stock" at that price for months though.

  8. #8
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    Hi from Italy
    I've studded my KHS 3000 tires (snowshoe 4.8 XL) with grip studs,
    very easy as the tires have the right holes for this !
    1420 grams each (studded finished)
    I'm very happy

  9. #9
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    I want to know what the Dillinger 5 actually has in common with a 5" tire

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I want to know what the Dillinger 5 actually has in common with a 5" tire
    You mean besides the "5" moniker? Don't we all!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by XJaredX View Post
    I actually have no idea. I just saw this link:

    Vee Rubber Snowshoe XL Studded Fat Bike Tire: 26" x 4.8" 120tpi Folding Bead Silica Compound Black - AEBike.com

    and was working off that price and the assumption that they'd be back in stock soon. I didn't know they weren't released yet.
    A PR posting from about 10 days ago on Fatbike.com states that they'll be available in a month or two.

  12. #12
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    Cool. It also just occurred to me to buy a Lou and a bunch of studs and use my Bud and Lou studded in winter and my Ground Controls in summer.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vongraz View Post
    Hi from Italy
    I've studded my KHS 3000 tires (snowshoe 4.8 XL) with grip studs,
    very easy as the tires have the right holes for this !
    1420 grams each (studded finished)
    I'm very happy
    Vongrak, I think you need a new electronic scale ! I just checked my Snowshoes 4.8 XL, Silica compound, 120 TPI, Tubeless ready, NON-STUDDED and it is 1610 grams. By the way, I reinstalled the rear one in reverse and I have way much more grip on packed snow. On ice, it will probably be the same though.

  14. #14
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    You can get 2 Dillinger 5s from Universal Cycles for about $425. They have a 15% off coupon for sales over $300.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr View Post
    You can get 2 Dillinger 5s from Universal Cycles for about $425. They have a 15% off coupon for sales over $300.
    Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by kntr View Post
    You can get 2 Dillinger 5s from Universal Cycles for about $425. They have a 15% off coupon for sales over $300.
    Website says out of stock

  17. #17
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    I'm just waiting for the studs to do up my Snowshoe XL's. How many holes for studs are the in the XL's

  18. #18
    frl
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    240 holes, I use icespiker pro studs in my xl. And I made some more holes, so I got 480 studs in the rear tire.

  19. #19
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    Dillinger 5s roll much more easily.
    --Peace

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    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded

    Quote Originally Posted by frl View Post
    240 holes, I use icespiker pro studs in my xl. And I made some more holes, so I got 480 studs in the rear tire.
    How did you make the extra holes?
    --Peace

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I want to know what the Dillinger 5 actually has in common with a 5" tire
    Hey bdundee---not sure what you mean here,but I'll offer an opinion to see if it helps. I have the Dillinger 5's. They certainly have more float than any of the 3.8-4.0 tires I have. They also have more traction than any of the tires I have in that size (I've never had Nates so can't compare). They have significantly less traction than Bud/Lou and pretty much the same amount of float. They have way more traction than a BFL and have pretty much the same amount of float. All are made by QBP and the Diilinger 5 pretty much just splits the difference between Surly's 2 offerings.

    FWIW---that tire was common at the Arrowhead 135 yesterday, from the pointy end of the field to the back...so I suppose it's also good for that. Hope that helps.
    Just get out ride it & have fun!

  22. #22
    frl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lars_D View Post
    How did you make the extra holes?
    I drilled 5 mm holes, and was very careful not to drill thru the tire.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-img_20150118_221610.jpg  


  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernMN View Post
    Hey bdundee---not sure what you mean here,but I'll offer an opinion to see if it helps. I have the Dillinger 5's.
    I like the D5 and have a couple of em but the funny parts is it's labeled as the 5 and it's not even close. The OP is looking for a 5" and these are smaller than my 4.6's and not even close to the Bud and Lou which are 4.8. Like I said good tires just not 5"

    4.37" tubeless on 90's to be exact.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I like the D5 and have a couple of em but the funny parts is it's labeled as the 5 and it's not even close. The OP is looking for a 5" and these are smaller than my 4.6's and not even close to the Bud and Lou which are 4.8. Like I said good tires just not 5"

    4.37" tubeless on 90's to be exact.
    I run them on 90mm rims, they are pretty close. When I see them on people's 80mm rims, they look significantly smaller. On 65mm rims, they are maybe 4s...
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    I run them on 90mm rims, they are pretty close. When I see them on people's 80mm rims, they look significantly smaller. On 65mm rims, they are maybe 4s...
    I'm more than happy with the size I'm really liking the mid sized tire for weight to size ratio. I remember when the Fatback tires and the original snowshoes came out and everyone screamed fraud yet they are quiet when it comes to this one, maybe because it's a damn good tire. Don't know but the dude missed me goofin with the 5" tire comment.

  26. #26
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    Oh, because I was going to say that on all the rides I've done this year, I haven't seen anyone with what look to be "significantly bigger" tires. Maybe no one is running "5s" on 100mm rims anymore, but it seems like almost no one runs those "true 5s".
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Oh, because I was going to say that on all the rides I've done this year, I haven't seen anyone with what look to be "significantly bigger" tires. Maybe no one is running "5s" on 100mm rims anymore, but it seems like almost no one runs those "true 5s".
    I ran Bud and Lou on 100's tubeless last year and for the type of riding I do it was just overkill and power sapping, never again. If I remember right they where north of 122mm wide stretched out.

  28. #28
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    I'd be running them on my Fatboy 90mm rims. That stinks if they're not a true 4.whatever they say but I guess it is what it is. 45Nrth is weird in the past year with their product offerings though- like those lightweight shoes they put out that are rebadged Louis Garneaus, and the problems with other products that I forget but I know existed. But I digress.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I like the D5 and have a couple of em but the funny parts is it's labeled as the 5 and it's not even close. The OP is looking for a 5" and these are smaller than my 4.6's and not even close to the Bud and Lou which are 4.8. Like I said good tires just not 5"

    4.37" tubeless on 90's to be exact.
    I have original Dillingers on 90's and compared them with a friend's "4.8" Bulldozers on Mulefuts. His tires are maybe 3/8" wider so the industry standard seems to be exaggeration. I am getting a set of D5's for these rims and will check back with a measurement.

    As far as traction compared to a Nate, the Nate is superior in pure snow conditions but add ice to the mix and Dillinger wins.

  30. #30
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    https://45nrth.com/files/chronicles/...etry_hires.jpg Maybe 45Nth should've called the (4" and up to 4.4") D5 "Dillinger 4.5" . Then they would be able to make a 4.8" and call it "Dillinger 5".

  31. #31
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    I bought my XL snoweshoe at AEbike non-studded and studded myself with the T-handle from 45nt. I put little less then 500 studded bought from amazon and ebay.
    This Vee rubber with studded are FANTASTIC and the Sillica coumpound make a HUGE difference compare to my Specialized Ground Control. I run ice condition and packed snow confident....I'm STOCKED with these tire. Any regret!!!!!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by frl View Post
    I drilled 5 mm holes, and was very careful not to drill thru the tire.
    DAMN!!!!! That looks awesome.

    I can't wait to get my studs in the mail. What size drill bit did you use? Did you leave the tire mounted on the rim to do the studding?

    Also, where did you order your icespiker pro studs from?

    Thanks.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    DAMN!!!!! That looks awesome.

    I can't wait to get my studs in the mail. What size drill bit did you use? ...
    Just a wild guess, but I'll say 5 mm drill bit

  34. #34
    frl
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    5 mm drill bit I used. I drilled the side knobs, when it was mounted on the rim. The side knobs are 7 mm, good clearance. The center knobs are 5 mm and drilled them off mounted rim. I bought the studs in Norway. I did the same with dillinger 4 last year. It worked good, but the xl is wow.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I like the D5 and have a couple of em but the funny parts is it's labeled as the 5 and it's not even close. The OP is looking for a 5" and these are smaller than my 4.6's and not even close to the Bud and Lou which are 4.8. Like I said good tires just not 5"

    4.37" tubeless on 90's to be exact.
    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I'm more than happy with the size I'm really liking the mid sized tire for weight to size ratio. I remember when the Fatback tires and the original snowshoes came out and everyone screamed fraud yet they are quiet when it comes to this one, maybe because it's a damn good tire. Don't know but the dude missed me goofin with the 5" tire comment.
    I get what you're saying. I also agree
    Just get out ride it & have fun!

  36. #36
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    Vee Snowshoe XL Studded has an ETA of 2/4/15 for QBP's Milwaukee warehouse. My LBS put them on item watch for me to snag me a pair. Please don't make me regret sharing this info! I will have a sad if this causes me to lose out.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by XJaredX View Post
    Vee Snowshoe XL Studded has an ETA of 2/4/15 for QBP's Milwaukee warehouse. My LBS put them on item watch for me to snag me a pair. Please don't make me regret sharing this info! I will have a sad if this causes me to lose out.
    I believe that date is QBP's "2 weeks from now" mystery date.....they use that when there is no ETA.
    Those tires have had a "2 weeks" date since they showed up in the system last fall.
    You might want to buy yourself a set of unstudded XLs and spend 2 hours doing them up
    They are great tires

  38. #38
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    Ohhh dang it! I thought I had a hot lead.

  39. #39
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    I can't wait for my studs to come from china. I already have a new pair of XL's waiting for them. I might check some car tire studs and see if they fit.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    I can't wait for my studs to come from china. I already have a new pair of XL's waiting for them. I might check some car tire studs and see if they fit.
    Bicycle studs ARE car studs.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor View Post
    Bicycle studs ARE car studs.
    actually car tire studs are considerably larger.
    these are the smallest car tire studs I could find
    Passenger Studs: T.S.M.I #11 - Bruno Wessel - Tire Studs, Studding Equipment
    I bought these. They're almost half the size.
    Bicycle Tire Stud 45NRTH Replacement Steel Body with Carbide Tips 300pcs | eBay

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    actually car tire studs are considerably larger.
    these are the smallest car tire studs I could find
    Passenger Studs: T.S.M.I #11 - Bruno Wessel - Tire Studs, Studding Equipment
    I bought these. They're almost half the size.
    Bicycle Tire Stud 45NRTH Replacement Steel Body with Carbide Tips 300pcs | eBay
    Look harder. Google small car stud....
    (hint: I do consulting in the tire industry)

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor View Post
    Look harder. Google small car stud....
    (hint: I do consulting in the tire industry)
    If you know, than why not tell? What do I need?

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    If you know, than why not tell? What do I need?
    That Ebay deal shows 3 different studs. And they are steel bodied. You want alloy.But they are cheap...you get what you pay for. Good luck with that deal.
    Any shop can get you alloy/carbide studs if you can't source them yourself

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee View Post
    I like the D5 and have a couple of em but the funny parts is it's labeled as the 5 and it's not even close. The OP is looking for a 5" and these are smaller than my 4.6's and not even close to the Bud and Lou which are 4.8. Like I said good tires just not 5"

    4.37" tubeless on 90's to be exact.
    Bud and Lou and D5 are very close to the same width on 90mm rims, granted the bud and Lou casing is much taller=more cushion. They are all under 4.5", but then again most 4" tires are less as well.

    D5


    Lou


    Bud
    19 Fargo Ti
    '17 Cutthroat
    '15 Fatboy Expert

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor View Post
    That Ebay deal shows 3 different studs. And they are steel bodied. You want alloy.But they are cheap...you get what you pay for. Good luck with that deal.
    Any shop can get you alloy/carbide studs if you can't source them yourself
    I actually got the aluminum body ones. sorry for the wrong link. Aluminum Bicycle Tire Stud 45NRTH Replacement Carbide Tips 300pcs | eBay

  47. #47
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    Paochow are those measurements with tubes or tubeless? My D5 and Bud are a bit wider on LB 90s, tubeless. This is at ~8 or 9 psi.

    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-bud.jpg

    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-d5.jpg

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Bud and Lou and D5 are very close to the same width on 90mm rims, granted the bud and Lou casing is much taller=more cushion. They are all under 4.5", but then again most 4" tires are less as well.

    D5


    Lou


    Bud
    Yeah these are close to some of the same the same measurements I have had in the past. It is tubeless that makes a huge difference on Bud and Lou, not so much on the d5. Your Bud and Lous come out to about the same as my Ground Controls and in real life B&L dwarf them. My results for B&L on UMA 90's tubeless where right around 118mm and right around 113 if I had Bontrager 2.8 tubes in and even little smaller with q tubes. I have played around with these more than most for the last few year trying to cram them in frames they don't belong in. B&L really shine on 100mm rims tubeless and like I said once before I had around 122mm wide but I believe that was at 18psi and the d5 will never get close to that no matter what it says on the side of it.

  49. #49
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    Yeah my measurements are tubes- as I switch tires a lot. The measurement s were also taken on new tires so they have likely expanded a few mm. In person the Bud and Lou do look substantially bigger, due to the bigger casing.
    19 Fargo Ti
    '17 Cutthroat
    '15 Fatboy Expert

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    I actually got the aluminum body ones. sorry for the wrong link. Aluminum Bicycle Tire Stud 45NRTH Replacement Carbide Tips 300pcs | eBay
    Be interesting to see if you actually get carbide tips.
    I didn't notice the huge shipping price added to the cheap price.
    For anyone looking for alloy/carbide studs....go to Facebook and find the "fat bike trader" page and search studs.
    A guy, Andrew Tubsing, is selling them are very good prices in the US

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor View Post
    Be interesting to see if you actually get carbide tips.
    I didn't notice the huge shipping price added to the cheap price.
    For anyone looking for alloy/carbide studs....go to Facebook and find the "fat bike trader" page and search studs.
    A guy, Andrew Tubsing, is selling them are very good prices in the US
    I'll check that out. Thanks.

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by XJaredX View Post
    Cool. It also just occurred to me to buy a Lou and a bunch of studs and use my Bud and Lou studded in winter and my Ground Controls in summer.
    Studded my Nates with Grip Studs and they are bomber. Spendy, but cheaper than Dillingers, for sure.

    Have not had them on much pavement, and it looks like the studs will be reusable if I want to try something different in the future.

    Studs of some kind will open up a lot of riding for you. Have fun.

    Cheers
    Kevin.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by ADKMTNBIKER View Post
    I'll check that out. Thanks.
    found his page but no stud link.

  54. #54
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    I my just go with screws like shark
    http://forums.mtbr.com/fat-bikes/diy...l#post11740275

  55. #55
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    I studded up a pair of the Snowshoe XLs about a month ago. I picked up a package of the steel carbide studs off of ebay since that was all that was available at the time. I partially studded up both pairs (down the middle for the rear and on the outsides for the front). My XLs without studs were a bit porky (1610 and 1650) and add another 100 grams each for studs. The work out great in all conditions but are definitely a bit slow (and heavy). You won't be seeing anyone on the podium with these. I run them on a set of Mulefut rims which I consider my "fun" wheels. They're wide, grippy, studded, and relatively cheap so I consider these a win.

    My race wheels are carbon with studded Dillinger 4s which are way faster and lighter than the XLs. Pick the right tool for the right job.

  56. #56
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    Got my snowshoe xl studded tires this week from Flea Bay and took em for a test run today on snow-covered trails. Awesome! Conditions were a mixed bag of hard pack crusted and icy, rutted crusty, glazed ruts, or unridden deep crusty. These tires absolutely rock. There is no way I could have ridden much of what I rode today with my Spesh Ground Controls. No excuses for me not to be out there in whatever from now on!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-image.jpg  


  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    I run them on 90mm rims, they are pretty close. When I see them on people's 80mm rims, they look significantly smaller. On 65mm rims, they are maybe 4s...
    A review said they were 4.3" on 80mm and 4.4" on 100mm. In my mind, a tire would have to be at least 4.8 inches to be sold as a 5. And even then, I would not personally call them a 5.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
    A review said they were 4.3" on 80mm and 4.4" on 100mm. In my mind, a tire would have to be at least 4.8 inches to be sold as a 5. And even then, I would not personally call them a 5.
    113mm on 90 according to: http://fcdn.mtbr.com/attachments/fat...tire-sizes.pdf

    Yeah, not truly 5, I think the name was to differentiate between the smaller dillinger, but on a 100mm rim, the max intended, probably makes it close...
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  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    ]I think the name was to differentiate between the smaller dillinger, but on a 100mm rim, the max intended, probably makes it close...
    Still only 4.4 inches on a 100mm rim according to one test. 4.45 on a 90mm according to another.

    I think the name was to help sell tires to people who are no doubt amazed at how light they were for being 5 inch tires.

  60. #60
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    Just checked the width of my Snowshoe XL and Dillinger 5.
    Both tubeless on Clownshoes(100 mm).
    Snowshoe XL is about 8 mm wider for the casing.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
    I think the name was to help sell tires to people who are no doubt amazed at how light they were for being 5 inch tires.
    Doubtful, except for people who don't bother doing the bare minimum of research. It clearly says on 45North's Tire Geometry page that the max width of the D5 on a 100mm rim is 114mm (4.5").

    But yeah, I'm sure they're just trying to fool people..
    "The only way we can truly control the outcome of a ride is not going on it, which is a choice I'm unwilling to make." -K.B.

  62. #62
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    I have them on my Cogburn . both front and rear. Got them last fall . I prefer them to the D5 that I put on my wife's bike. All factory studded . the SS XL has more traction . I get less side slip with the ss on the front than the D5. There is a bit more self steer at low pressure with the ss than the D5 . on hard surface. But not a lot.

  63. #63
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    I did a ride yesterday on a snow/ice surface that was pock marked with footprints on a set of non-studded Snowshoe XLs and was pleasantly surprised with their traction. They seldom slide at all, and when they did it was predictable, and they quickly found traction again.

    My theory is that it's due to the silica compound that everyone complains about making the tire slow rolling, and the textured rubber that folks say packs up with snow. OK, I'll admit that at lower pressures on hardpacked surfaces they do feel like you're pulling a boat anchor, and the textured rubber does in certain conditions collect snow. I don't feel like the snow collection is hendering traction in anyway though, and the same low pressures that suck on pavement are where its at in the snow, and in 6" of powder you're not going fast on any tire.

    Anyways, just a quick report that the non-studded version of the Snowshoe XL is a respectable tire for ice conditions.
    "Trails? Where we're going we don't need, trails!"


  64. #64
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    Vee Snowshoe XL

    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-20151222_202456_006_01.jpgVee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-snowshoe-xl.jpg

    I took the best of both worlds. Vee Snowshoe XL pure Sillica, mixed with 45Nrth studs. Grip for days.

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smithhammer View Post
    Doubtful, except for people who don't bother doing the bare minimum of research. It clearly says on 45North's Tire Geometry page that the max width of the D5 on a 100mm rim is 114mm (4.5").

    But yeah, I'm sure they're just trying to fool people..
    I get it. By 5 they mean 4.8. And by 4.8 they mean 4.5. And by 4.5 they mean 4.35 - the actual largest size I have seen anyone measure. I am against government regulation, but there should be a law. This is called lying. That being said, I do want these tires just because they are probably the best for not slipping in the winter. Do I wish they were wider? Not necessarily as then they would be heavier. I just want them to be called 4.35s.

    Also the technobabble on their website was written by someone who doesn't know anything.

    "The micro-glass rubber is made by magnetically aligning small glass filaments so they are oriented vertically within the rubber."

    Didn't know glass was magnetic.

    They also say that carbide is the second most "dense" material after diamond. They are trying to stress their technology prowess but instead they seem technologically illiterate.

  66. #66
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    Dillinger 5 Footprint

    Looks pretty close to 5 inches....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded-dillinger-5-footprint.jpg  


  67. #67
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    Here are some D5 measurements I can find photos of online:

    109.37mm/4.31in
    113.11mm/4.45in
    110.59mm/4.35in

    Not sure of the rim width or pressures.

  68. #68
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    Lots of slight variations depending on rim width and whether running tubed or tubeless, all great for determining frame clearance, but the actual tread contact patch seems to be pretty close to 5 inches.

  69. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat-in-Fundy View Post
    Looks pretty close to 5 inches....
    This a is a good point, I've never seen manufacturers specify wether the listed size is on the contact patch to the ground or the tire unweighted on the bike.

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    Comes out pretty wide on my 90s, but I don't think many/most people run 90-100, I think most people are 65-80.
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  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegard View Post
    This a is a good point, I've never seen manufacturers specify wether the listed size is on the contact patch to the ground or the tire unweighted on the bike.
    There is a post from a tire rep somewhere on one of the 32 different tire threads that said the standard is to measure at max psi.
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  72. #72
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    If using Amazon knock off carbide studs, not concave, but round tip, would a D5 be still a lot better overall winter tire than SS XL? I can get stud less XL for almost 1/2 price of stud less D5.
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  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by kryten View Post
    If using Amazon knock off carbide studs, not concave, but round tip, would a D5 be still a lot better overall winter tire than SS XL? I can get stud less XL for almost 1/2 price of stud less D5.
    Nope, rolling resistance on the snowshoe is very high (unless you get the PCS snowshoes).
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  74. #74
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    I see, that is what I keep reading. I'll be replacing my Dillinger 4's with 5's then.
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  75. #75
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    Just bought a barely used 9:zero:7 with Dillinger 5s (hairs still on) ready for studs but putting B/Ls on 100 mm CS rims. My Fatboy Pro Trail already has B/Ls on Clownshoes.

    Thinking about studding the D5s for icy conditions. Where I live is mud and slimy leaves one moment, powdery snow the next, sleet crust/glaze ice other times and pure frozen dust now and then.

    Jealous of those with consistent winters . . . .

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor View Post
    For anyone looking for alloy/carbide studs....go to Facebook and find the "fat bike trader" page and search studs.
    A guy, Andrew Tubsing, is selling them are very good prices in the US
    Here's where you can get those: bikestud.com - studs for bicycle tires

  77. #77
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    I'm wanting to buy roughly 4.8" studded tires for winter trail and frozen lake riding. Is the Snowshoe XL still a very good tire for the money in 2017 or are there better options to consider.

  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff_L View Post
    I'm wanting to buy roughly 4.8" studded tires for winter trail and frozen lake riding. Is the Snowshoe XL still a very good tire for the money in 2017 or are there better options to consider.
    I had them. They have grip and stuff. But the rolling resistance of the Vee tires is too high, and talking to the company, it was clear that they don't make an effort to design for rolling resistance. I wouldn't buy them again. They may be hundreds less, but they make your bike slower than the difference between a $600 and $6000 bike, so just spend the money on something better.

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsilvers View Post
    I had them. They have grip and stuff. But the rolling resistance of the Vee tires is too high, and talking to the company, it was clear that they don't make an effort to design for rolling resistance. I wouldn't buy them again. They may be hundreds less, but they make your bike slower than the difference between a $600 and $6000 bike, so just spend the money on something better.
    I'm new to fatbiking so forgive me for asking. Is any tire all that good at rolling resistance through 3-6 inches of snow? Where I live our snow conditions don't stay very good for long. We have no groomed trails nearby. Between wind or a quick thaw the typical trail conditions on any given ride will be anything from bare ground, to crusty snow, to pure ice to 6 inches of powder through a tree covered section. I'm just looking for a good all round winter fatbike tire for typical conditions. I wasn't planning to do much serious racing on them. I'm willing to pay a bit more for a better tire but $250 a tire for studded D5s is a bit above what I'm willing to pay. What are some good alternatives to the Snowshoe XLs?

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff_L View Post
    I'm new to fatbiking so forgive me for asking. Is any tire all that good at rolling resistance through 3-6 inches of snow? Where I live our snow conditions don't stay very good for long. We have no groomed trails nearby. Between wind or a quick thaw the typical trail conditions on any given ride will be anything from bare ground, to crusty snow, to pure ice to 6 inches of powder through a tree covered section. I'm just looking for a good all round winter fatbike tire for typical conditions. I wasn't planning to do much serious racing on them. I'm willing to pay a bit more for a better tire but $250 a tire for studded D5s is a bit above what I'm willing to pay. What are some good alternatives to the Snowshoe XLs?

    The Snowshoe XL's are great tires. The people that don't like them are generally riding more groomed surfaces, or at least hardpack, where speed happens.

    I *never* get fast conditions -- I'm usually just happy to be riding instead of walking. D5's are useless where I live and ride.

    Given what you've written I think the Snowshoe XL's will work great.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff_L View Post
    I'm new to fatbiking so forgive me for asking. Is any tire all that good at rolling resistance through 3-6 inches of snow? Where I live our snow conditions don't stay very good for long. We have no groomed trails nearby. Between wind or a quick thaw the typical trail conditions on any given ride will be anything from bare ground, to crusty snow, to pure ice to 6 inches of powder through a tree covered section. I'm just looking for a good all round winter fatbike tire for typical conditions. I wasn't planning to do much serious racing on them. I'm willing to pay a bit more for a better tire but $250 a tire for studded D5s is a bit above what I'm willing to pay. What are some good alternatives to the Snowshoe XLs?
    Personally, it isn't the rolling resistance when grinding though fresh snow, it is the rolling resistance when the snow is firm and fast. Riding (for me) is always a mix of both.

    The white/cream colored ones are a lot less slow, but still slower than the 45n tires in the snow conditions I have.

    If I was looking to save money on studded tires, and didn't need the extra wide tires, I would look at the lower tpi, wire bead studded 45n tires. If you want something wider, then I would look at the cream/white v studded tires, assuming you can find them.

    If you find a deal on the v tires, I wouldn't hesitate to get one and try it out. It could work fine for you, depending on the snow conditions you have.

  82. #82
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    Snowshoe xls turn to plastic in the cold and thus turn slow as shit. Too bad for how supple they are warm.
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    Has somebody tried Bontrager studs with a D5? Are they compatible?

    https://www.milltownsports.com/produ...ide-tire-studs

    Thanks.

    F

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    Those look like pocket studs, so I would think they would fit, given you have the proper tool.

  85. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarplex View Post
    all pneumatic bicycle tires turn to plastic in the cold and thus turn slow as shit.

    Clarified that for you.

  86. #86
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    Im still puzzled how people keep buying Snowshoe XLs. They are one of the worst winter tires Ive ridden. The silica compound causes snow to stick to it under a wide range of conditions, turning it into a white, heavy slick, washing out in the front and spinning at anything more than 2 psi. The studs are too short and small, and are clearly inferior to a grip stud or the 45NRTH studs.

    Perhaps they perform better in 30-40 degree winter, but in anything resembling a real winter they are crap.

    A few years ago, a few of my friends and I bought each bought a pair to try when they were cheap. We all sold them during that first year and two of the guys that bought them had them posted on Facebook Fatbike Trader within a few months.
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  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Im still puzzled how people keep buying Snowshoe XLs.

    If you could, somehow, adopt the understanding that not everyone lives in Minneapolis, you might come closer to getting it.

    Maybe.

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    If you could, somehow, adopt the understanding that not everyone lives in Minneapolis, you might come closer to getting it.

    Maybe.
    Id guess that most people spending $300-500 to buy a set of studded winter tires would be in similar conditions. A lot more fat bike buyers in WY, MT, ND, MN, WI, MI, IL, IA, NY, NH, ME and Canada than Colorado.
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  89. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Id guess that most people spending $300-500 to buy a set of studded winter tires would be in similar conditions. A lot more fat bike buyers in WY, MT, ND, MN, WI, MI, IL, IA, NY, NH, ME and Canada than Colorado.

    You're both right and wrong here. Right in that conditions are similar for us, across the northern hemisphere. Wrong in that they are not identical, and in that not everyone wants the same things you want, living precisely where you do.

    I don't fault you for liking/wanting to ride what you do. Why do you have such a chip on your shoulder for others determining what works for them, where they live and ride?

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Id guess that most people spending $300-500 to buy a set of studded winter tires would be in similar conditions. A lot more fat bike buyers in WY, MT, ND, MN, WI, MI, IL, IA, NY, NH, ME and Canada than Colorado.
    I do about 1000-2000 miles per year on snow in New England, NY and Canada. The XL is a go to tire in the right conditions for me....it gets the most use out of my 3 winter tire set ups.

  91. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by fthefox View Post
    Has somebody tried Bontrager studs with a D5? Are they compatible?

    https://www.milltownsports.com/produ...ide-tire-studs

    Thanks.

    F

    Yep, they work just fine.

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Im still puzzled how people keep buying Snowshoe XLs.
    I'd be interested in a cheap seat to stud and mount on a budget fatbike I'm working on now if anyone is getting rid of theirs.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    Yep, they work just fine.
    I'd like to find someone in Canada or site that ships to Canada that does stock the 225 pack instead 25 pack.
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  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    You're both right and wrong here. Right in that conditions are similar for us, across the northern hemisphere. Wrong in that they are not identical, and in that not everyone wants the same things you want, living precisely where you do.

    I don't fault you for liking/wanting to ride what you do. Why do you have such a chip on your shoulder for others determining what works for them, where they live and ride?
    I don't know Paochow or even if he is really my neighbor in Mpls. But, we get all sorts of weather and if I had read his comment about how bad the tires were (even at $100 a piece) I may not have purchased them for my kid a few weeks ago.

    I guess I'll find out.
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  95. #95
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    Mike hates the D5s in fresh snow.

    So I'm going to go ride mine right now.
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  96. #96
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    I agree the Snowshoe silica is awful in cold conditions (Wyoming) as the snow just sticks. I used an earlier version and not sure if it has improved but were terrible.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unbrockenchain View Post
    I agree the Snowshoe silica is awful in cold conditions (Wyoming) as the snow just sticks. I used an earlier version and not sure if it has improved but were terrible.
    Ive heard the white rubber ones are better.... how much? No idea. Black ones suck.
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    Took some black silica Snowshoe 2XLs for the Rovaniemi 300 last winter in northern Finland. First problem was the front not holding air - slow leak due to stiffening rubber. The temperature dropped below -20C and the tyres got noticeably hard to turn, particularly on a fully-loaded bike. The guys running the white rubber 2XLs had it a lot easier. I sold them immediately on my return.

  99. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paochow View Post
    Im still puzzled how people keep buying Snowshoe XLs. They are one of the worst winter tires Ive ridden. The silica compound causes snow to stick to it under a wide range of conditions, turning it into a white, heavy slick, washing out in the front and spinning at anything more than 2 psi. The studs are too short and small, and are clearly inferior to a grip stud or the 45NRTH studs.

    Perhaps they perform better in 30-40 degree winter, but in anything resembling a real winter they are crap.

    A few years ago, a few of my friends and I bought each bought a pair to try when they were cheap. We all sold them during that first year and two of the guys that bought them had them posted on Facebook Fatbike Trader within a few months.
    30- 40 degrees, up and down, 20's over night. That would be the Boston, MA winter. And yes we have real winter, dude. Put some 45 north studs in the xl snow shoe, perfect for my conditions, here. Maybe everyones winter is not yours. Ugg.

  100. #100
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    Finally broke down and bought the Snow Shoe XLs. I found a new studded PSC set for $235. Decent improvement over the 4 inch JJs that came with my bike for my current riding conditions. They are 3 lbs heavier and definitely have more rolling resistance but the improved traction on snow and ice is a reasonable trade off. I'm not a fan of the pointed studs and if I were to do it again I would get an unstudded version and install flat studs myself. I replaced 80 of them on the rear tire and it made a noticable improvement.

  101. #101
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    Vee Snowshoe XL studded versus 45Nrth Dillinger 5 studded

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff_L View Post
    Finally broke down and bought the Snow Shoe XLs. I found a new studded PSC set for $235. Decent improvement over the 4 inch JJs that came with my bike for my current riding conditions. They are 3 lbs heavier and definitely have more rolling resistance but the improved traction on snow and ice is a reasonable trade off. I'm not a fan of the pointed studs and if I were to do it again I would get an unstudded version and install flat studs myself. I replaced 80 of them on the rear tire and it made a noticable improvement.
    They will round over to if you ride on pavement at all. Gripstud.com and 500 square tip studs for $80
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  102. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarplex View Post
    They will round over to if you ride on pavement at all. Gripstud.com and 500 square tip studs for $80
    I think you meant Bikestud.com. Bought 100 from them for now . Also the stud tool. Maybe more in the future. I believe gripstuds are the expensive screw in type if your tires are not desinged for studs.

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