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  1. #301
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    A 5" BFL will fit in on a 65mm wide rim, though 4" on any width rim fits ok, as does 29+ wheels
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
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  2. #302
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    Thanks for the info, BTW I shot you a PM

  3. #303
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjbiker View Post
    I think I have enough miles on my old Mukluk and the Wednesday to prove that the 100mm BB is not a problem in real life.

    I've actually grown to prefer 100mm BB width on my bikes. Feels more neutral, natural to my knees and ankles. On the rare days that I ride my one remaining 73mm BB bike, I immediately notice the narrowness and it takes some re-adaptation. Going back and forth between them, 100mm always feels like 'coming home'.

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    I've actually grown to prefer 100mm BB width on my bikes. Feels more neutral, natural to my knees and ankles. On the rare days that I ride my one remaining 73mm BB bike, I immediately notice the narrowness and it takes some re-adaptation. Going back and forth between them, 100mm always feels like 'coming home'.
    I was thinking exactly the same thing today. Been commuting on the Krampug for a few weeks to get some off road time in but rode to work on the Lomg Haul Trucker today. Just felt wierd. Going from 100mm bb and wide handlebars back to drops and 68mm I felt all scrunched up. Legs didn't quite work as well either.

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by Co-opski View Post
    Easy to deal with part. Just my $.02 whatevs many seem to like him.

    I'd love to know what I did wrong, and how I can make it right.

    Please drop a line to: info@lacemine29.com at your convenience.

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    I've actually grown to prefer 100mm BB width on my bikes. Feels more neutral, natural to my knees and ankles. On the rare days that I ride my one remaining 73mm BB bike, I immediately notice the narrowness and it takes some re-adaptation. Going back and forth between them, 100mm always feels like 'coming home'.
    I've switched to flat pedals on all my bikes, even the road bikes. I find myself positioning me feet toward the outer edge of the pedals. I've always battled knee pain, but it seems to be in check. I wonder if the narrow cranks and clipless pedals I used for years forced me into a stance too narrow and stressed my knees too much.

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjbiker View Post
    I've switched to flat pedals on all my bikes, even the road bikes. I find myself positioning me feet toward the outer edge of the pedals. I've always battled knee pain, but it seems to be in check. I wonder if the narrow cranks and clipless pedals I used for years forced me into a stance too narrow and stressed my knees too much.

    Lots o' variables. Sometimes just a cleat position adjustment can make the difference. Hard (impossible, really) to diagnose online.

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    Lots o' variables. Sometimes just a cleat position adjustment can make the difference. Hard (impossible, really) to diagnose online.
    Could be. When I switched from SPD to Speedplay Frogs, that made a huge improvement. I'm happy with flat pedals now, though.

  9. #309
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    Anyone know if I c a n just relace a krampus rear wheel to fit the pugs, or do you need different spoke lengths for the offset?

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by skankingbiker View Post
    Anyone know if I c a n just relace a krampus rear wheel to fit the pugs, or do you need different spoke lengths for the offset?
    You need to offset the rim by 17.5mm. The Rabbit Hole wheelset has 64 spoke holes so that it can be laced symmetrically, or entirely on one side. In the latter, the wheel is offset.
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  11. #311
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    Yes same spokes will do, i swapped a rabbit hole from symmetrical to offset and back again several times as i played around with different builds. Pug - ECR- Pug - Krampus, and back to a Pug!, I reused the spokes but replaced the spoke nipples
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
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  12. #312
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    New wheels for the pugs. Should be prove more versatile option for urban wanderings.
    SURLY KramPug thread...-2017-06-16-12.11.20.jpg

    SURLY KramPug thread...-2017-06-16-15.18.41.jpg
    38° 54' -77° 15

  13. #313
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    KramPug; Commuter bike, shops bike, pub bike, trail bike,
    Some detour off road commuting home...

    http://<iframe width="425" height="2...reen></iframe>
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
    http://coastkid.blogspot.com/

  14. #314
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    If your fat bike doesn't use an off-set rear wheel and the hub width matches up, should you be able to put the stock Krampus RH/Knards on a fat frame?

    Thanks!

  15. #315
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    I don't think any fatbikes use a symmetrical 135mm hub. That's the whole reason offset or super-wide hubs were made in the first place. With a regular hub like the Krampus has, the chain can't clear a 4-5-inch tire in low gear.

    So, the answer is, if you have a 135mm spaced dropout and its symmetrical, yes, a Krampus wheel will fit, but no fatbikes have that so it's irrelevant.
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  16. #316
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    That makes sense. The guy I bought my bike from had posted this picture of my bike with plus tires on it. I was hoping it might just be a simple swap, but apparently it's more complicated than that.

    Thanks sincerely for your reply. Also, I just followed your blog link - what a great resource that is! Strong work!

    SURLY KramPug thread...-bully-plus.jpg
    Last edited by Magicscreen; 07-12-2017 at 06:30 PM.

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magicscreen View Post
    That makes sense. The guy I bought my bike from had posted this picture of my bike with plus tires on it. I was hoping it might just be a simple swap, but apparently it's more complicated than that.

    Thanks sincerely for your reply. Also, I just followed your blog link - what a great resource that is! Strong work!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Not simple, but not too complicated either! You can have a rear wheel made. 29+ wheels are super fun and it's a great way to get two bikes out of one.

    You can also put a regular fork on a fatbike most of the time to make use of a premade Krampus front wheel. Just make sure the axle-to-crown and rake match up. I think a stock Krampus fork fits a lot of fatbikes well. But, you can always have a 29+ whee made on a fatbike hub in the front, too, if you don't want to buy another fork.
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  18. #318
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    If I had another wheel built then I would REALLY have no excuse for hanging on to my Krampus! Thanks for taking the time to answer my question, Max. I really appreciate it.

  19. #319
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    Oh, ok, I'm glad you have a Krampus You can get your 29+ fix. No problem! Enjoy~
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  20. #320
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    Big Wheel Krampug

    I tried something that I haven't seen anyone discuss yet:

    Threw on a Karate Monkey fork (+21 mm vs. the stock Pugs offset fork) and a Rabbit Hole laced (non-offset) to a 100mm XT hub (thanks, MikeSee!). Picked up a used Innova Transformer 29x3.0 for $10 and created what I am dubbing the "Big Wheel" Krampug.

    I didn't have high hopes for matching the Spray Tan orange fork to the snow white frame, but I actually dig it and think it jives well. The front end feels way more slack (and lighter, though not by much). The 29x3 is probably 1"+ taller than the 26x4 I kept on the back. I still get the traction/large volume benefits of having a full fat rear end, but now enjoy an even larger (and almost as wide) front end.

    I've only put ~20 miles on the new setup, but really like it so far. SURLY KramPug thread...-img_0777.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-img_0779.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-img_0781.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-img_0782.jpg
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails SURLY KramPug thread...-sidebyside.jpg  

    SURLY KramPug thread...-htanglesidebyside.jpg  


  21. #321
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    Good job! Karate-Krampug

    Sweeeeeeet spray tan fork! I similarly just made the switcharoo to a Karate-Krampug and really enjoy the slightly slacker front-end (and the speed of 29+ wheels)! I owned a Krampus years ago, and sold it because I just loved my Pugs more... but with the wheel swap (after 6000+ miles and two frames of pedalling 26 fat on my favorite bike) my Pugsley is a whole new animal! I'd strongly recommend it for a summer speedy option if you're waffling out there!SURLY KramPug thread...-_dsc4252.jpg
    Once you go fat, you'll never go back...

    Some words and photos from wandering: www.zacharystephenmiller.wordpress.com

  22. #322
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    Krampug brain trust,

    I am wondering aloud if the Surly ECR 27.5+ fork would accept a Knard/RH 29+ combo. The Surly website suggests NO since the max tire size advertised is 29 x 2.5. ANyone out there try to shove a 29+ into an ECR 27.5 fork? The reason I am considering it is that I want to run a 100mm dynamo hub and I like the braze-ons on the ECR.
    Responds to gravity

  23. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak View Post
    Krampug brain trust,

    I am wondering aloud if the Surly ECR 27.5+ fork would accept a Knard/RH 29+ combo. The Surly website suggests NO since the max tire size advertised is 29 x 2.5. ANyone out there try to shove a 29+ into an ECR 27.5 fork? The reason I am considering it is that I want to run a 100mm dynamo hub and I like the braze-ons on the ECR.
    Probably won't fit. Do you already have a wheel with a dynamo? What are your options here? I'm asking because I've built a few generator wheels for Krampus and Pugs. MAYBE I can help.
    I like turtles

  24. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYrr496 View Post
    Probably won't fit. Do you already have a wheel with a dynamo? What are your options here? I'm asking because I've built a few generator wheels for Krampus and Pugs. MAYBE I can help.
    No, I don't have the wheel yet. I like to marinate on stuff like this long before I take the plunge and order parts. In the end I have to decide which is more important to me: the proper A-C of the Pugsley non-offset fork, or the neat braze-ons of the longer ECR 29 fork. The 27.5" ECR would have been the ideal solution if it would clear a 29x3.0 tire.

    Thanks. I like turtles, too.
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  25. #325
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    A few years late to the party, but I finally build me a Krampug. Decided to get 2 bikes in 1 instead of getting a Stache.

    So far only been on railtrail gravel but the handling is much improved. It really is a whole new bike. Having trouble setting up the rabbits tubeless though....Do people remove the surly rim strip when using gorilla tape?

    Can't wait to get it on some singletrack


    20180303_112155 by T_MB, on Flickr

    2018-03-12_01-29-12 by T_MB, on Flickr
    Veni Vidi Biki

    I came, I saw, I biked.

  26. #326
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    I'm thinking about going the krampug route also. Did you get your wheels set up tubeless?

  27. #327
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    I do Rabbit Holes split tubeless.
    I like turtles

  28. #328
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    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
    http://coastkid.blogspot.com/

  29. #329
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    Unlacing and lacing the wheel with the tire in place. My hat's off to you, sir.
    I like turtles

  30. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by dezzrat1 View Post
    I'm thinking about going the krampug route also. Did you get your wheels set up tubeless?
    Yes.... the problem was the valve stems. I had trouble getting the stans stems to work--i.e. they wouldn't sit tight in the valve hole. I used cut-up stems from old tubes...they worked like a charm.

    I also initially experimented with Scotch webbed packing tape, but that didn't seem to work well, so I went back to the tried and ture 2 layers of gorrila tape.
    Veni Vidi Biki

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  31. #331
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    Been riding a pugs since 2012. I just got a warranty replacement for the frame from Surly - long story. Anyway, they sent me a 2018 orange frame. I've decided to pull the trigger and have a set of rabbit holes built up for the bike. I'm stoked reading through this thread. Love the pugs, but the krampug sounds like the shiz.

  32. #332
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    Silly, but fun, wheel!! Polished Roval 32 hole hub with DT swiss internals, laced to a polished rabbit hole. I've got 2 of these wheels actually, but can only use one. PM me if want the spare.SURLY KramPug thread...-030.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-031.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-032.jpgSURLY KramPug thread...-034.jpg

    With the pugsley offset, these came out to 306mm straight pull spokes both sides. Being DT swiss, can swap stuff around, so the newer pugsleys could run a 142x12mm thru axle, can run XD drivers, etc etc etc. I believe this older Roval hub has the same dimensions as a newer DT 350 straight pull hub and I have a giant pile of the 306mm straight pull spokes, so if I'm bored, I may build up several of these.
    Deflated - buy parts to sell parts to buy more parts.. bikes are my drug of choice

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  33. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Rides Bikes View Post
    Silly, but fun, wheel!! Polished Roval 32 hole hub with DT swiss internals, laced to a polished rabbit hole. I've got 2 of these wheels actually, but can only use one. PM me if want the spare.Click image for larger version. 

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    With the pugsley offset, these came out to 306mm straight pull spokes both sides. Being DT swiss, can swap stuff around, so the newer pugsleys could run a 142x12mm thru axle, can run XD drivers, etc etc etc. I believe this older Roval hub has the same dimensions as a newer DT 350 straight pull hub and I have a giant pile of the 306mm straight pull spokes, so if I'm bored, I may build up several of these.
    Interested,. Plz email me at dezzrat1@yahoo.com

  34. #334
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    Been away for a while, but thought I'd share some picks of the built up KramPugs:SURLY KramPug thread...-inflight.jpg

    SURLY KramPug thread...-saturday-ride.jpg

    SURLY KramPug thread...-semifat-friday.jpg

    SURLY KramPug thread...-img_20180729_122421200.jpg

    SURLY KramPug thread...-img_20180729_125133294.jpg

    I like it quite a bit. However, it does seem to be a bit slow to respond on the front end on fast, tight corners.

  35. #335
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    Building a B Fat wheelset was the best thing I ever did for my Pugs.

    Until I built a 29+ wheelset for it.

    I'd never, ever, for any reason go back to the stock 26" fat wheels now that I've tried the alternatives on the Pugs.

    I use the B Fats when float is needed. 29+ for speed and efficiency.

    A bit of a writeup on when I first went to B Fat here: https://lacemine29.blogspot.com/2017/12/opp.html

  36. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikesee View Post
    Building a B Fat wheelset was the best thing I ever did for my Pugs.

    Until I built a 29+ wheelset for it.

    I'd never, ever, for any reason go back to the stock 26" fat wheels now that I've tried the alternatives on the Pugs.

    I use the B Fats when float is needed. 29+ for speed and efficiency.

    A bit of a writeup on when I first went to B Fat here: https://lacemine29.blogspot.com/2017/12/opp.html
    The 29+ wheels work real well with the new Pug 2.0, BB height is not raised as much and the geometery is a nicer ride with the longer head tube, slightly slacker head angle and dare i say it the longer rear end!
    Old regular medium on the left, new Large frame set on the right

    IMG_2507 by Bruce, on Flickr

    This 29+ KramPug 2.0 is way better than the ECR i owned as has a 4" wide frame bag having the 100mm wide BB and loads of tyre clearance for mud and if you manage to bust two spokes with a branch etc then the warped wheel won`t rub the frame, and reversable wheels to allow have a bail out option, i have used that twice on Pugs when i seized an Alfine IGH and trashed a free hub,
    if you don`t mind a 100mm BB which after 11 years using i find perfectly natural then a Pugs frame set be it the new or older options covers all bases of many other Surly models,
    Long live the Pug!
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
    http://coastkid.blogspot.com/

  37. #337
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    coastkid71, I have also had two sizes of pugs'. L & XL but both of them were pre-2.0 geometry.
    I would be interested to know what you feel of the slight geo changes and why you are on a Large frame now rather than the medium of the past bikes? Thanks!
    Deflated - buy parts to sell parts to buy more parts.. bikes are my drug of choice

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  38. #338
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Rides Bikes View Post
    coastkid71, I have also had two sizes of pugs'. L & XL but both of them were pre-2.0 geometry.
    I would be interested to know what you feel of the slight geo changes and why you are on a Large frame now rather than the medium of the past bikes? Thanks!
    Just two rides so far on thr KramPug 2.0 but i do like the ride, it feels like the frame was designed for these wheels and the steering is planted. i chose a size Large of a size Medium as previously one Pug i built up then sold on was a Large and i had more room with the sweep back of the Jones loop bars. I`m 5ft 11" tall so kind of fall into both camps for either of these sizes.
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
    http://coastkid.blogspot.com/

  39. #339
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    CK...is it safe to assume that the 460 CS length is taken from the foreword position?

    Thanks
    "Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway" John Wayne

  40. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by SADDLE TRAMP View Post
    CK...is it safe to assume that the 460 CS length is taken from the foreword position?

    Thanks
    Hi, yes it`s 460 with the wheel foreward as mine is
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
    http://coastkid.blogspot.com/

  41. #341
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    Anyone know if Duro Crux 29x3.25 (or Vee Bulldozer 3.25") fits on the Pug? If not the rear, I hope at least the front.

  42. #342
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    Should fit ok as 3/4" clearance with most 29 x 3" tyres

    Good to see the thread resurected!, my KramPugs number 3 now with a new Pugsley 2.0 now added to the fleet

    9 by Bruce, on Flickr

    13 by Bruce, on Flickr
    3 by Bruce, on Flickr
    2 by Bruce, on Flickr
    5 by Bruce, on Flickr
    IMG_0257 by Bruce, on Flickr
    plan it...build it....ride it...love it....
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