Fat bike/tires buying advice, only for winter riding, mostly hardpack snow or ice- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Fat bike/tires buying advice, only for winter riding, mostly hardpack snow or ice

    There's so many threads I'm frankly overwhelmed, hoping a kind soul can just save me some time and point me in the right direction..

    I want a fat bike for putzing around on the snowshoe trails near my house (fat bikes allowed). Trails are not hilly but conditions are most often hard packed snow, or icey since we go through a lot of melt/freeze cycles in the city. I've never actually needed snowshoes on these trails because they get so much use. There are no climbs or downhills, it's just meandering rolling trail. Nothing exciting but something to do other than XC ski.

    I don't want to spend a fortune, I will only use this bike 4 months a year, the rest of the year I have a Trek Fuel EX8. It seems like to me the tires are the most important thing, ie traction. The dillinger 4 and 5 studded tires seem to be highly regarded (and super expensive). Is there are cheaper alternative? I want to feel confident on my tires, I hate hate slipping.

    As far as the rest of the bike is concerned, is there anything else that's important that I should look out for to not cheap out too much on? Because I will have to cheap out on pretty much everything to get these tires. I want to spend less than $1000 CAD total

    This is the bike I was looking at, it's $380 USD: Minelli Bikes - Echo 26

    I'm assuming since it comes with 4.9" tires it will fit any 26" tire that's similar or smaller sized?

    Thanks!!

  2. #2
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    I would suggest you ride the bike stock for awhile and see how it performs. Snow is highly variable and depending on terrain, temperature, age (of the snow)and riding style no one tire is ideal. What works for one person can be less than ideal for another, what works one day can be marginal at best the next.
    Cheers,
    Steven

    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    There's so many threads I'm frankly overwhelmed, hoping a kind soul can just save me some time and point me in the right direction..

    I want a fat bike for putzing around on the snowshoe trails near my house (fat bikes allowed). Trails are not hilly but conditions are most often hard packed snow, or icey since we go through a lot of melt/freeze cycles in the city. I've never actually needed snowshoes on these trails because they get so much use. There are no climbs or downhills, it's just meandering rolling trail. Nothing exciting but something to do other than XC ski.

    I don't want to spend a fortune, I will only use this bike 4 months a year, the rest of the year I have a Trek Fuel EX8. It seems like to me the tires are the most important thing, ie traction. The dillinger 4 and 5 studded tires seem to be highly regarded (and super expensive). Is there are cheaper alternative? I want to feel confident on my tires, I hate hate slipping.

    As far as the rest of the bike is concerned, is there anything else that's important that I should look out for to not cheap out too much on? Because I will have to cheap out on pretty much everything to get these tires. I want to spend less than $1000 CAD total

    This is the bike I was looking at, it's $380 USD: Minelli Bikes - Echo 26

    I'm assuming since it comes with 4.9" tires it will fit any 26" tire that's similar or smaller sized?

    Thanks!!
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    I would suggest you ride the bike stock for awhile and see how it performs. Snow is highly variable and depending on terrain, temperature, age (of the snow)and riding style no one tire is ideal. What works for one person can be less than ideal for another, what works one day can be marginal at best the next.
    Cheers,
    Steven
    if i only want to ride in winter conditions, on packed snow and ice, now fresh snow or deep snow, and my number one criteria is traction and not slipping.. are you saying that there's a possibility a studded tire would not be the best choice?

    i read a lot of reviews of tires in winter conditions and one thing seemed unanimous, on ice, studs are lightyears better than anything else?

  4. #4
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    I haven't used them myself but Universal Cycles has the Vee Snowshoe XL studded for $129 (Snowshoes XL's actually measure around 4.0 not 4.8) plus another 10% off with coupon code MammothHerd10 or if you have other things to buy from them you can use MammothHerd15 for 15% off orders over $300.

    I've ridden the non studded Snowshoe XL's and thought they were great for hard pack, I wouldn't recommend them for soft conditions though.

  5. #5
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    Not at all. I am saying that there are several width's of rims, there are a couple widths of tires, several different types of studs and several brands of studded or stud-able tires.

    There are so many variables involved in choosing a tire that I do not feel it can be done on advice.

    If two people of exact height and weight are riding the same exact bike with the same exact tires with the same studs there experience will undoubtedly not be the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    if i only want to ride in winter conditions, on packed snow and ice, now fresh snow or deep snow, and my number one criteria is traction and not slipping.. are you saying that there's a possibility a studded tire would not be the best choice?

    i read a lot of reviews of tires in winter conditions and one thing seemed unanimous, on ice, studs are lightyears better than anything else?
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  6. #6
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    I've been happy with the D5's, they're perfect for icy hardpack conditions, fast rolling and great grip on the icy sections.
    '18 Ithaqua, '16 Bucksaw, '14 Mukluk, '07 Enduro

  7. #7
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    I would highly suggest a decent used Fat bike. Take a look at kijiji or Pink bike classifieds. It might even come with good tires for snow. If not, used ones pop up every now and again. You'll need to make sure you also have some good warm, breathable clothing.
    Good luck with the search. You might even find you might ride it come spring too!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterhours View Post
    I haven't used them myself but Universal Cycles has the Vee Snowshoe XL studded for $129 (Snowshoes XL's actually measure around 4.0 not 4.8) plus another 10% off with coupon code MammothHerd10 or if you have other things to buy from them you can use MammothHerd15 for 15% off orders over $300.

    I've ridden the non studded Snowshoe XL's and thought they were great for hard pack, I wouldn't recommend them for soft conditions though.
    I've been ridingstudded Vee Snowshoe XL tires(4.8") all winter and like them. I found that running the rear tire in reverse is better in snow.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterhours View Post
    I haven't used them myself but Universal Cycles has the Vee Snowshoe XL studded for $129 (Snowshoes XL's actually measure around 4.0 not 4.8) plus another 10% off with coupon code MammothHerd10 or if you have other things to buy from them you can use MammothHerd15 for 15% off orders over $300.

    I've ridden the non studded Snowshoe XL's and thought they were great for hard pack, I wouldn't recommend them for soft conditions though.
    I ride studded snowshoe XLs and they are great on hard pack and ice, but wet soft snow they are not great, but since I am more worried about slipping rather than speed I don't mind having to slug along on soft days. As the treads have worn down a touch(about 100 miles on them) the studs are working even better. The best thing about these Vee tires is you can get two for the price of one Dillinger.

  10. #10
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    You only have 1k CDN to spend, so buying tires and a bike is not in your budget.

    Get an inexpensive bike, ride it, learn from experience, upgrade once you can amswer your own questions.

    Air pressure is more important than tire brand/review.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    You only have 1k CDN to spend, so buying tires and a bike is not in your budget.

    Get an inexpensive bike, ride it, learn from experience, upgrade once you can amswer your own questions.

    Air pressure is more important than tire brand/review.
    That is just awful advice, he already stated he intends to ride on relatively flat hard pack / icy trails so tire selection trumps pretty much everything else. He could throw studded tires on a walgoose and assuming it fits have a great time.

  12. #12
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    Based on the riding conditions you describe you may be better served buying a set of Ice Spiker Pro's for your EX8.

    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    if i only want to ride in winter conditions, on packed snow and ice, no fresh snow or deep snow, and my number one criteria is traction and not slipping.. are you saying that there's a possibility a studded tire would not be the best choice?

    i read a lot of reviews of tires in winter conditions and one thing seemed unanimous, on ice, studs are lightyears better than anything else?
    Lucky neighbor of Maryland's Patapsco Valley State Park, 39.23,-76.76 Flickr

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoo View Post
    Based on the riding conditions you describe you may be better served buying a set of Ice Spiker Pro's for your EX8.
    Yeah well the problem with that is its hard pack or icey a lot of the time, but during/after a snowfall it's tracked out but soft and when it warms up it gets soft/slushy, so neither of those conditions would be fun on my ex8 with 2.2 tires as the tires would sink too much. And I also don't want to take it out in the winter/wet/salt on the roads

  14. #14
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    I'd agree with most of the Snoeshoe XL recommendations...probably suit your need just fine and be the most economical. They really are good on ice and packed snow, but don't have big lugs for deeper stuff. You can stud them yourself with studs from Bikestud.com and maybe save a few more $...think I've only got around 120-150 per tire, which has worked fine over the past year (didn't put them in the smallest).

  15. #15
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    +1 on studs for your EX8. That's the route practically everyone where I live in PA went for decades. Because its either icy and hard or too muddy to ride. We just don't get enough deep, sustained snow, let alone groomed trails, to justify fat tires. That said, I love mine for sand and swampy ATV trails the rest of the year.


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    He mentioned not wanting to take it in the winter elements. Otherwise regular studded mtb tires would be more than adequate for road/compacted trail; I rode studded Nokians for many years. But the fat tires are def more fun to just plow through and over stuff, and on semi-compacted stuff they won't rut in as much...plus, new bike! Oh, the 4.8 XLs measure 4.5" exactly on 80mm rims (reference to someone mentioning 4.0" above).

  17. #17
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    be careful

    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    This is the bike I was looking at, it's $380 USD: Minelli Bikes - Echo 26

    I'm assuming since it comes with 4.9" tires it will fit any 26" tire that's similar or smaller sized?
    That Kenda 26 x 195 ATB appears to be 1.95" and not at all fat.

  18. #18
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    I like turtles

  19. #19
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    Your studded tires will last for many seasons. I am on my third season with mine.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim208 View Post
    Your studded tires will last for many seasons. I am on my third season with mine.
    same here
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    I want a fat bike for putzing around on the snowshoe trails near my house (fat bikes allowed). Trails are not hilly but conditions are most often hard packed snow, or icey since we go through a lot of melt/freeze cycles in the city. I've never actually needed snowshoes on these trails because they get so much use. There are no climbs or downhills, it's just meandering rolling trail. Nothing exciting but something to do other than XC ski.

    As far as the rest of the bike is concerned, is there anything else that's important that I should look out for to not cheap out too much on? Because I will have to cheap out on pretty much everything to get these tires. I want to spend less than $1000 CAD total

    This is the bike I was looking at, it's $380 USD: Minelli Bikes - Echo 26

    I'm assuming since it comes with 4.9" tires it will fit any 26" tire that's similar or smaller sized?

    Thanks!!
    I am looking at the specs on that bike, and I feel like it would be cheaping out too much. Not to mention, I see way too many inconsistencies. The spec list says suspension fork, but the pic shows a rigid fatbike. Huh? I agree that the spec list looks like it's showing 26x1.95" tires, too. Looks like they are showing the specs of some other bike. A company that makes that big of a mistake with their product page doesn't instill trust. But even then, if you're just looking for a relatively inexpensive bike, that one is too cheap, IMO.

    High tensile steel means it's going to be an absolute tank. That's going to take some of the fun out of it. The drivetrain on it isn't really very upgradeable. That megarange cassette pretty much sucks for actual mtb use, and it's not even that great for casual neighborhood use because of the huge jump between the two lowest cogs on it. The tires on it look like a decent summer tread, so yeah, you'd have to replace 'em no question. I wouldn't go there. If I was looking for an inexpensive fatbike, my bottom would be an 8spd drivetrain, which means if you wore it out or destroyed it, you could upgrade it to 9, 10, or 11spd without changing the hubs.

    It's also worth asking you about the ice you're talking about. Does the trail get really well-packed to the extent that the ice is pretty smooth? Or do people use it when the slush is freezing, giving the ice a really chewed up and jagged texture? It matters. If the ice is smooth, then yeah, studs are almost a necessity. But if you rarely see that smooth ice, and things are mostly jagged ice, or otherwise well-textured, then you might be fine without studs. Where I live, conditions with smooth ice that pretty much requires studs MAYBE exist for a couple of days per winter. Makes me wish I had studded tires for the couple of days where those conditions exist, but after that, I do fine with just a deep, knobby tire. Surly Nates are my winter tire of choice right now. They do pretty awesome with traction.

    That Moonlander linked above is a fantastic bike. Those tires are going to handle a lot of nasty winter conditions and everything about that bike is leaps and bounds better than the one you put in your OP. You could even put GripStuds or Kold Kutters in them if you felt like studs were still necessary. Even though it is a good bit outside your budget, it is definitely worth it. With your other bike being a decent FS, you're going to really notice being on what essentially amounts to a box store beater. And not in a good way.

  22. #22
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    If we are talking about 1k to spend I think a Framed Wolftrax would be the ticket. You can pick up a used one on eBay or Craigslist for under $750 then throw some studded snowshoes on and voila studded fat bike with a set of summer sneakers to boot all for under a grand. I rode a Wolftrax before I switched to A Blackborow and the Wolftrax is a fast bike that rips on flat to slightly undulating inclines. The 32 front to 36 rear ratio makes hills a little tougher, but it will ride anywhere.

    And as far as skinny tires with studs go, every time it gets warm and soft the skinny tires tear the trails up and leave ruts that last till the next storm. Do everyone a favor and go fat in the winter, more fun for all.

  23. #23
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    How much more money is this one? Minelli Bikes - Grind
    Looks like a better choice,possibly even upgradable once you realize all you ever want to ride is a fatbike (-:

  24. #24
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    I often use my regular MTB on hard packed snow , lots of fun !

    No danger for the bike : it's even cleaner than in summer time , snow will melt , bike is gonna be sparkling clean.

    I started my 25th MTB winter this year , having a lot of fun with the Fat bike but I still prefer my regular MTB when the conditions are good.
    (Frankly , Not very often around here I must say)
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by afterhours View Post
    That is just awful advice, he already stated he intends to ride on relatively flat hard pack / icy trails so tire selection trumps pretty much everything else. He could throw studded tires on a walgoose and assuming it fits have a great time.
    ... and you think he should drop to drop $3-400 on studded tires to go on a $300 bike.

    A guy who has never owned or ridden a fat bike, with no experience on ice or snow.

    Yeah, your suggestion is waaay less awful than mine

    To the OP:

    Look at Pinkbike, get something used for $500-$750, ride it, learn about riding in the snow, continue reading the cubicle rider chronicles. Then, when you can tell right from BS, you spend a little more and get what you need.

    I ride 2-3x week, no studs, nor do I want studs.

  26. #26
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    I'm running a Framed Alaska, I'm on the 3rd set of tires this year-
    First were the original 4.0" Wolftrax, great all terrain, okay in the snow, but I wanted tubeless- so I went to the Vee Bulldozer 4.8"- Lighter, faster, better in the loose stuff, but then we got 1" of rain on Christmas and the trails were better for skates.
    Enter the Vee Snowshoe XL 4.8" with studs. If the trail is down to ice, studs are important, but they won't give you velcro traction on glare ice- just an advantage. I've made plenty of sideways scratches when I pushed too hard. If you're on a good snow surface, you don't notice the studs at all. They don't matter.
    As an above poster said, tire pressure is most critical. In deep slush, everything sucks. I've run as low as 2psi just trying to find traction. I almost wanted a paddle/rib setup. On a loose snow trail, about 4 psi gets me the hookup. Nice packed/ loose surface I run 6 psi and enjoy the ride. The key is to experiment, see what gives you what you need.
    I second the used bike theory, get someone else's first bike, the one they rode twice before they went back to ice fishing.
    This summer, I'll go back to a non-studded tire and continue playing.
    Good luck and have fun!

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    There's so many threads I'm frankly overwhelmed, hoping a kind soul can just save me some time and point me in the right direction..

    I want a fat bike for putzing around on the snowshoe trails near my house (fat bikes allowed). Trails are not hilly but conditions are most often hard packed snow, or icey since we go through a lot of melt/freeze cycles in the city. I've never actually needed snowshoes on these trails because they get so much use. There are no climbs or downhills, it's just meandering rolling trail. Nothing exciting but something to do other than XC ski.

    I don't want to spend a fortune, I will only use this bike 4 months a year, the rest of the year I have a Trek Fuel EX8. It seems like to me the tires are the most important thing, ie traction. The dillinger 4 and 5 studded tires seem to be highly regarded (and super expensive). Is there are cheaper alternative? I want to feel confident on my tires, I hate hate slipping.

    As far as the rest of the bike is concerned, is there anything else that's important that I should look out for to not cheap out too much on? Because I will have to cheap out on pretty much everything to get these tires. I want to spend less than $1000 CAD total

    This is the bike I was looking at, it's $380 USD: Minelli Bikes - Echo 26

    I'm assuming since it comes with 4.9" tires it will fit any 26" tire that's similar or smaller sized?

    Thanks!!
    Because the bike is listed having a hi-ten steel frame it will likely be very heavy and that will take away a lot of fun. Bikes Direct has tons of better quality bikes for really good prices. Framed also makes good quality, decent priced bikes. You could go either route and still buy a set of factory studded fat bike tires for your budget. My wife's first fatbike was a Framed Minnesota and it's a nice bike.

    I'd ride your trails for the rest of this winter without studs to determine if you need them or not. I rode my first winter without studs and there were only a few rides where I really needed them. But, those rides where I needed studs were not fun and I wrecked several times. I now run studs in a set of winter tires. I bought grip studs and installed them myself.

    If if you want to spend a little more the KHS 1000 can be set up to fit 5.05" tires, the largest currently available and it comes with 4.9" tires. It's listed for $1100. I bought one because i thought it was a heck of a good value.

  28. #28
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    Like some others have said, I run my fat bike with Surly Bud and Lou tires and have not yet needed studs.
    I do not commute on icy roads, either. I haven't yet seen trail snow get slick. YMMV.
    I like turtles

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ak-rider View Post
    Because the bike is listed having a hi-ten steel frame it will likely be very heavy and that will take away a lot of fun. Bikes Direct has tons of better quality bikes for really good prices. Framed also makes good quality, decent priced bikes. You could go either route and still buy a set of factory studded fat bike tires for your budget. My wife's first fatbike was a Framed Minnesota and it's a nice bike.

    I'd ride your trails for the rest of this winter without studs to determine if you need them or not. I rode my first winter without studs and there were only a few rides where I really needed them. But, those rides where I needed studs were not fun and I wrecked several times. I now run studs in a set of winter tires. I bought grip studs and installed them myself.

    If if you want to spend a little more the KHS 1000 can be set up to fit 5.05" tires, the largest currently available and it comes with 4.9" tires. It's listed for $1100. I bought one because i thought it was a heck of a good value.

    Thanks everyone, I'm in Montreal so ebay doesn't really work, cross border shipping and exchange rate often a deal breaker, not a lot of used fat bikes for sale here either, i think demand is outstripping supply.

    What about the Norco Bigfoot 6.3 2016? A couple of places have them on sale new for $950 CAD after tax which is about $730 US?

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post

    What about the Norco Bigfoot 6.3 2016? A couple of places have them on sale new for $950 CAD after tax which is about $730 US?
    Looks pretty solid. Certainly better than the first bike you linked up.
    I like turtles

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    ... and you think he should drop to drop $3-400 on studded tires to go on a $300 bike.

    A guy who has never owned or ridden a fat bike, with no experience on ice or snow.

    Yeah, your suggestion is waaay less awful than mine

    To the OP:

    Look at Pinkbike, get something used for $500-$750, ride it, learn about riding in the snow, continue reading the cubicle rider chronicles. Then, when you can tell right from BS, you spend a little more and get what you need.

    I ride 2-3x week, no studs, nor do I want studs.
    i was going to sleep hangry, sorry for being rude.

    That said my first fat bike set me back $350 (bullseye monster from bikeisland) + $100 for non studded vee snowshoes an i had a freaking blast on it. For someone that "hate hate slipping" and plans to ride on a relatively flat trail that is icy... i think it would be hard to go wrong with those studded snowshoes and then whatever decent bike he can afford to go with it, tires can always be moved between bikes.

    Once again, sorry for the rudeness, totally uncalled for.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by marving View Post
    Thanks everyone, I'm in Montreal so ebay doesn't really work, cross border shipping and exchange rate often a deal breaker, not a lot of used fat bikes for sale here either, i think demand is outstripping supply.

    What about the Norco Bigfoot 6.3 2016? A couple of places have them on sale new for $950 CAD after tax which is about $730 US?
    I couldn't find a 2016 model to look at but checked out the 2017 model on their website and it looks like a solid bike. I like the low stand over clearance and price. I think it would be a great choice.

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