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  1. #201
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  2. #202
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    https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...4f&oe=5ABD295E Then we welded on a mountain bike forks steer tube. I mounted a stem and mountain bike bar to that. This gives me a wide range of adjustability. It is also easier to play with different width bars. It might look weird keeping the old bar still in place, but this does allow me to go back to more as it originally was. It was a little easier to not relocate the electrical switches. It's less work if I switch out to another sized bar.. and I find the switches better protected where they are. This whole set up shorted the overall length of the machine.. allowing it to fit in even tighter trails. It also changes where the machine pivots as you turn it, also quickening up the handling. So far the down sides.. when folding up the assembly, it doesn't nest as well on the top of the machine. It also takes more physical effort to turn on dirt {I personally don't plan on using this on dirt, but it is also very easy to put it back to it's original handling and nesting positions]

  3. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenlason View Post
    https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...47&oe=5AF69C21

    The lower bar is the original part of the frame where the handlebar assembly rests.. or what you push down against. With the new mount location.. I needed a new spot to push down agains. Fortunately I was able to use the original handlebar assembly mount locations to bolt in another bar. [a piece of pipe with a piece of threaded rod]
    So rad!! looks like it came like that from factory.
    Great idea. ..Hope the company will learn from hardcore field testors!

    Were starting to see a good amount of solutions here! Thank you all!

  4. #204
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    Ok geniuses , another thing with the dog; strong, but too light to pull u up a steep climb in deep light snow :-D

    We were lucky enough to get nice dumps lately in Quebec (+-50cm of fluff). Best powder skiing in last couple years. In many cases I hade to step off to unweight the sled otherwise it was sinking in snow. Then realized if I get my weight on the dog it became possible to go forward again.

    What do you think of an attachment distributing body weight on the midpoint of the snowdog? Was thinking of some kind of bike hack with fork in the dog and rear wheel replaced by a cut down snowboard. Dog tracks better heavier rather than dragging weight.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by radair View Post
    I prepare my sketchiest off camber sections on snowshoes using a grain shovel. It is pretty quick and easy to do a little cut and fill with a shovel. Moving snow is far easier than digging dirt and IME can last all season.

    Put some dry lube on your rollers the next time you pull the clutch off. I had the same problem and it was bone dry in there. Thereís a good YouTube link earlier in this thread about servicing these clutches.
    I have dry lubed them a couple times now. The service manual actually calls for grease. I greased the locations listed in the service manual the last time I had it apart and I have rode it for about 30 minutes with success so far but I have had dry lube last this long as well.

    Something else to watch out for is the hitch. Mine has become quite loose. They are only using rivnuts to secure the hitch to the frame. Doesn't look like I was too far away from having to walk out of the woods. Which is what I would have had to do if it failed. Planning on drilling the rivnuts out and running two bolts all the way through the frame and adding lock nuts.

    The handle-bar relocation idea seems like it would work really well.

    In regards to traction up a hill. It is all about getting that first groom done. I am finding that with the second groom the track is able to bite into the base and pull up the hill with relative ease.

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20180101_175801.jpg

  6. #206
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    Fenlason: Thank you for sharing those pictures. They explain it all so easily. I'm preparing to modify my bar setup as well since my back can't stand fighting the machine with the deep soft snow we've gotten.

    I was going to groom today but think I will weld up stuff for the snow dog instead since it was -17 when I woke up!

    +1 for having to walk next to the snow dog up hills in deep powder. At least until the first pass is finished.

    My kids and their friends were bummed I couldn't tow 3 sleds in a train up the sled hill since the snow was too soft. At least they were getting rides up one at a time!

    Thanks for sharing tips everyone. If I find something that works I'll be sure to share.

  7. #207
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    cool to hear about all the mods and such. I am waiting on a new belt (ordered a few since they seem to be hard to come by locally)... I've learned to make the first pass up hill with the clutch side of the machine facing uphill.. for some reason that seems to work... certainly for deep snow anything over a foot, often have to walk next to it, but subsequent passes usually no problem... I added about 6 inches to each side of the handle bar, simply by shoving rebar in and then covering that with ample tape for grips. the wider bar does allow for a bit more leverage when trying to convince the machine where you want it to go at times. overall, I am very happy with it... I have to get myself comfortable with cleaning the clutch... that's the next step.

  8. #208
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    I try to set initial tracks downhill whenever possible. Sometimes "skateboarding" (pushing off with one foot) is enough to handle uphills; rarely do I have to get off to push. Snow is so variable - dry powder is tough to find traction and there are no big paddles on these tracks.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-lower-shumway-12-2017-medium-.jpg  


  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by radair View Post
    I try to set initial tracks downhill whenever possible. Sometimes "skateboarding" (pushing off with one foot) is enough to handle uphills; rarely do I have to get off to push. Snow is so variable - dry powder is tough to find traction and there are no big paddles on these tracks.
    I have been perfecting the skateboarding technique as well! That is one heck of a picture! Some great looking winter singletrack.

  10. #210
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    I have uphills from our start, there is no way around it. So the skateboard kick is utilized here also. I works and I don't really mind it. Snowdog has a rail suspension available that is supposed to substantially help with deep snow performance. I am going to give it a try. I have it on order. They say it is available now... but I haven't seen it yet.

  11. #211
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    regarding snowdog...I went through my last belt, guessing that the 20 inches of snow and working it a bit too hard did her in....I have watched the youtube video of disassembling and cleaning the clutch..... but wanted to ask here,,,, anything I should watch out for.... is this a DIY type of thing.... or are there special tools and skills needed...

  12. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by twright205 View Post
    regarding snowdog...I went through my last belt, guessing that the 20 inches of snow and working it a bit too hard did her in....I have watched the youtube video of disassembling and cleaning the clutch..... but wanted to ask here,,,, anything I should watch out for.... is this a DIY type of thing.... or are there special tools and skills needed...
    It's easy enough getting the clutch off the machine; just one bolt on the outside IIRC. From there you need a decent (but not too big) bench vise to hold the base of the drive clutch while you loosen the retaining nut. My vices were not the right size so I ended up buying one with 4" wide jaws - it needs to fit inside the circumference of the clutch base. Once you get the top nut loosened up it's all quite simple. I should have taken a few photos, sorry!

    Where did you get the belts? Were they breaking? The alignment of the primary to secondary drives is not very good, so that has to contribute to it.

    Edit - I tried attaching the CVT drive clutch manual but the file is too big. If anyone wants it, PM me your email address.

  13. #213
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    radair- thanks for the advice and info.. I've had the snowdog for over a year. probably over 30 hours run time... burned up the belt.. I was being to hard on it... a friend ordered one on ebay but don't think it was a true gates. and within 30 min. it totall delaminated. top strip off, all the threads like spagetti.... but also I was told ( i didn't know) that the clutch surface needs to be quite clean, or else will get belt burn or they will wear out quick...
    link below, racingplanetusa.com is where I found the one that came with the snowdog
    Drive Belt Gates Powerlink Premium CVT 918-22.5-18 | Scooter Parts | Racing Planet USA |

  14. #214
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    I took my homegrown groomer out yesterday (shown in post #116 of this thread, page 2). I did 3.5 miles in 40 minutes just before sunset in an attempt to smooth out the dents and divots from the bare booters (and deer). It handled really well in the tight twisty stuff and did a decent job cleaning things up. We rode it this morning and the fine corduroy was really good - it was especially obvious when going from touched up to raw trail that I didn't have time to hit. More snow due tomorrow so another round begins...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-corduroy-1-3-18-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-snowdog-grooming-sled-medium-.jpg  


  15. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by radair View Post
    I took my homegrown groomer out yesterday (shown in post #116 of this thread, page 2). I did 3.5 miles in 40 minutes just before sunset in an attempt to smooth out the dents and divots from the bare booters (and deer). It handled really well in the tight twisty stuff and did a decent job cleaning things up. We rode it this morning and the fine corduroy was really good - it was especially obvious when going from touched up to raw trail that I didn't have time to hit. More snow due tomorrow so another round begins...
    Radair - nice looking unit. How did you attach the grate and the angle at the front to the wood blocking below? The draw bar, is that 2" by 2" stock?

  16. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by wgerow View Post
    Radair - nice looking unit. How did you attach the grate and the angle at the front to the wood blocking below? The draw bar, is that 2" by 2" stock?
    Hi Warren - there's some photos on page 2 of this thread, posts #114 & 115 and attached here. The Grip Strut is welded to the angle top & bottom and the 2x6 blocks are screwed on through the bottom flanges of the Grip Strut and bolted to the angle. Yes, that's a 2" square tube steel connecting arm with a funky extension that allows the eye bolt to swivel. I took the angle steel skegs off for the soft conditions we have currently.

    This is definitely a finish sled, not for use in fresh snow. The stock sled works quite well in fresh pow.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-grooming-sled-hitch-final-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-grooming-sled-bottom-final-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-grooming-sled-top-final-medium-.jpg  


  17. #217
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    Cool thanks......grip strut looks to be 20"x20"?
    What are you guys using to scarify hard snow, anything? or you just plowing the duff off once you establish a hard tread?

  18. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by wgerow View Post
    Cool thanks......grip strut looks to be 20"x20"?
    What are you guys using to scarify hard snow, anything? or you just plowing the duff off once you establish a hard tread?
    Platform is 2' x 2', which worked perfectly with two of the Yellowstone Track System 12" combs.

    No scarification, I've just been running more passes with the sled as we get more snow. Today's storm with high winds should make for a challenging effort over the weekend!

    I can look to see what I have for scrap around but may not be in CV for a while.

  19. #219
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    the sled or stand on groomer that I have is the same width of the 20 inch Snowdog track. so unless there are really deep footprints, the track itself chews up the marks, and then the sled or platform lays it back down... I just ordered the snowcomb. to help make the groomed surface uniform and freeze back up quicker.. something about more surface area I guess. it we get a lot of foot traffic, will have to dream up some blades to run to help deal with those.

  20. #220
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    POV video

    Here is a video of grooming singletracks with the Snowdog and two axis groomer hitch. Note how easy the off-camber section is...
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...id=78510558785

  21. #221
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    Awesome! Thanks... I am sold!

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    Thanks for the inspiration Knucklehead6. I'm welding stuff up these next few days with some scrap steel and some new bar stock. If I was a better fabricator I'd be done already!

  23. #223
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    here is a short video of my attempt to rework a pull behind groomer that I had for my Alpine.. to make it a sit on roller groomer for the snowdog... only tested around the house.. hope to get it to the trails sometime this week. ugly yes.. but might work..

    https://youtu.be/_oCmRwAVJKs

  24. #224
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    I just made a bumper/snow deflector today and tested it tonight in some powdery snow. I made it to help push some snow to the side of the snowdog instead of having it bury itself in powder. Obviously it only works when starting off on a solid surface but for re-grooming a trail after a big storm it seems to have worked well. Now I need to take some pictures and share them. It's basically a curved 2.5" strip of industrial plastic that mounts to the frame at track axle height.

  25. #225
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    My clutch problems appear to be fixed after using grease on the primary. I drilled through the riv nuts that were used for the hitch and put bolts straight through the frame. I did hit a good sized rock while grooming and not sure if that is the reason but the frame where the hitch is mounted is now starting to bend. Going to leave it for now and see if it gets worse before deciding if I will reinforce it or not. Off-camber is killing me on this thing. Have resorted to flipping the handlebars back on to the machine and standing in front of it while operating the throttle. Sounds like a bad idea but it does help a lot.

  26. #226
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    A little grooming action by one of our guys today....still using the sled, but thanks to radair we are in the process of building a copy-cat version of his drag.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/BdtOhbTh...ken-by=crnemba

  27. #227
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    Hello wgerow,

    Nice snowdog up there in Sugarloaf ME. I'm in Windham and am grooming down here. We should share drag build ideas and tips for what works.

    Here's something that worked pretty well here. I built a front bumper/plow for the deep powdery snow we got here. It actually helps push some snow away from the track and keeps it from digging in as much.

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1192.jpgBest Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1193.jpgBest Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1194.jpg

  28. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by surlyobs View Post
    Hello wgerow,

    Nice snowdog up there in Sugarloaf ME. I'm in Windham and am grooming down here. We should share drag build ideas and tips for what works.

    Here's something that worked pretty well here. I built a front bumper/plow for the deep powdery snow we got here. It actually helps push some snow away from the track and keeps it from digging in as much.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Cool idea, good to know.
    I actually work in Falmouth, where are you grooming at?

    Thus far I haven't done any of the grooming up in CV, just trying to help those guys out getting a drag of sorts together.....something to tinker with at least.

  29. #229
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    SnowDog mods

    Because my bikes are never "stock" and I can't help but try to make things better, I've made some changes to my SnowDog even though I've only owned it about 18 days...

    #1 Goodbye cold hands: I was going to add some pogies but I'm constantly removing my hands from the grips to maneuver and adjust things. The stock grips are cold and hard so I ditched them and replaced them with ESI chunky silicone foam grips. They do not transmit cold and are nice and cushy. I also insulated the throttle lever since at least one finger is always on it. A little foam and hockey tape fixed that.

    #2 I adjusted the bars: The stock setup was in the middle hole of the frame. I moved the bar pivot to the lower hole and it helped a bit. I also moved the levers and control box inwards on the bar (the control box is pinned into the bar so it doesn't rotate. You will need to re-drill the bar)
    Finally, I added some old school bike bar-ends for more torque on the handlebars.

    #3 I made a bumper/snow pusher: I thought that adding some device for getting snow away from the groomer and compactor would make things easier for packing in the trail and also easier on the snowdog. Turns out it did help.

    #4 Storage: Those hip packs that were the rage in the 1990's? They work great on the back of a snowdog. I've got spare fuel, dry and warm clothes and other things like stuff for trimming tree branches that get in the way.

    #5 Fabbing up a low pivot swing arm: I'm in the process of copying some other users ideas to build a swing arm that allows the snowdog to be steered by leaning. I can't wait to try that one out. Not done yet, but I have some photos of progress. (the rusty steel was scrap that I am re-using) After I get the bugs worked out I'll paint it.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1102.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1103.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1104.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1105.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1149.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1150.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_1151.jpg  


  30. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by surlyobs View Post
    Hello wgerow,

    Nice snowdog up there in Sugarloaf ME. I'm in Windham and am grooming down here.
    Yeah, where are you grooming in Windham? Lots of people down here would love to know.

  31. #231
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    Mdlman,

    I've been out grooming trails almost every day since Dec. 20th. I've groomed Clifford Park in Biddeford, a few personal trails in my Windham area (single track, not snowmobile width) and also behind Congin School in Westbrook. I'm currently waiting to hear back from Gorham trails and some other places about letting me groom their trails. I'm available for hire if anyone is looking for single track grooming.

    NEAT & Tidy Trail Grooming
    Send a PM to: Mike G.

  32. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by surlyobs View Post
    Mdlman,

    I've been out grooming trails almost every day since Dec. 20th. I've groomed Clifford Park in Biddeford, a few personal trails in my Windham area (single track, not snowmobile width) and also behind Congin School in Westbrook. I'm currently waiting to hear back from Gorham trails and some other places about letting me groom their trails. I'm available for hire if anyone is looking for single track grooming.

    NEAT & Tidy Trail Grooming
    Send a PM to: Mike G.
    Thatís amazing! So great youíre doing that on your own. The Congin trails are super fun in the summer, sounds awesome in the winter. Thatís a big bonus, lots of people winter ride Sunset Ridge snow mo just past Congin, makes a great connection.

    The dream single track groom would be to get the Sebago to Sea from the Westbrook side back to Forest Ave / Dunkins, then River 2 from Corsettiís on the north side of the Presumpscot all the way to Falmouth. Those are lost connections in the winter for sure. River 2 bridges are in bad shape though, might be tricky getting a valuable machine through there safely.

    But if you had those connections you could ride the river trails out of Portland all the way to Congin, then up the sno mo to Prides and all the way to Blackstrap. Mega!

  33. #233
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    For FB users, I started a group. Might be good to host some of this information there.

    SnowDog Users Group

    Mark.

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    Great idea on the user group on Facebook, request sent!
    Jason
    Disclaimer: www.paramountsports.net

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    surlyops---let me know how that front bumper goes. with the differing conditions the other night, it seems if the Snowdog got into too deep of wet snow it was trying to plow through... and a lot of packing buildup a few feet infront of the machine... granted, temps were too warm to really be out there ... but some kind of cow catcher, bumper, or for deep snow something to move it to the side a bit intrigues me.

  36. #236
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    I've been trying to stay in the -5F to 25F window for grooming. What temps do you groom in? I've never had packing/buildup issues.
    Jason
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    we were getting a warm up, and then a freeze, so was trying to groom in less than ideal conditions. the first 16 inches from the ground up was chaulky unpackable dry snow. the top 4 inches were wet snow... not a good combination, going along previous packed areas not bad... but I got greedy and tried to get some more that we have not yet groomed... so I was thinking about some kind of snow "pushbar" for those instances..

  38. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knucklehead61 View Post
    Here is a video of grooming singletracks with the Snowdog and two axis groomer hitch. Note how easy the off-camber section is...
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...id=78510558785
    No way! Get back to your shop and start mass producing that off camber demon for us!

  39. #239
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knucklehead61 View Post
    Here are some shots of the two axis hitch that i designed for the Snowdog.
    It attaches to the mid-point of the frame using the existing bolts. It pivots in the X axis at this point. At the rear of the "U" shaped bar is an attachment point that moves only in the "Y" axis and is connected with a 3/4" pin. I have tossed around the idea of producing these if there was enough demand..
    Hey KnuckleHead61, could you post a parts list when you get a chance? Things like the bushings or bearings used for the U-bar to tracksled joint and maybe tubing size and thickness. A few more shots of the drag would be awesome as well, maybe what the bottom looks like.
    Thanks
    Tedsti
    =========================================
    Minnesota Off Road Cyclists www.morcmtb.org

  40. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by tedsti View Post
    Hey KnuckleHead61, could you post a parts list when you get a chance? Things like the bushings or bearings used for the U-bar to tracksled joint and maybe tubing size and thickness. A few more shots of the drag would be awesome as well, maybe what the bottom looks like.
    Thanks
    Tedsti
    Go to post #175 in this thread (page 2). Click on the photo and a pdf with some fab details will pop up.

  41. #241
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    This video highlights a whole range of groomers. Pretty cool.

    https://gearjunkie.com/fat-bike-trai...te-michigan-up

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    I received a letter today from my dealer, looks like the state (MI) has decided to treat Snow Dogs as an ORV/ATV. This means that all ATV/ORV rules apply including trail permit stickers (first-year can be reimbursed). This decision is extremely frustrating.

  43. #243
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsbiker View Post
    I received a letter today from my dealer, looks like the state (MI) has decided to treat Snow Dogs as an ORV/ATV. This means that all ATV/ORV rules apply including trail permit stickers (first-year can be reimbursed). This decision is extremely frustrating.
    Like it or not sounds like it meet's there criteria no different than a Snotucker grooming snowmobile trails requires a permit.

    "ORV" means any motor vehicle designed for or capable of cross-country travel on or immediately over land, water, sand, snow, ice, marsh, swampland, or other natural terrain.

    ORV vehicles include, but are not limited to, a multi-track or multi-wheel drive vehicle; an ATV; a motorcycle or related 2-wheel, 3-wheel, or 4-wheel vehicle; an amphibious machine; or other means of transportation deriving power from a source other than muscle or wind.
    Blaine, Mn

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    hmm, troubling... hoping my State doesn't head that way.... so would a self propelled wheelbarrow, mower, garden tractor, excavator ??? just typing out loud...

    we have permission from Land manager to use atv, mini ex, tractor, and skid steer... so I think we are good, but this development is something to watch.

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    Think it would come down to when a state permit is required when on private property vs state, federal, county property.
    Blaine, Mn

  46. #246
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsbiker View Post
    I received a letter today from my dealer, looks like the state (MI) has decided to treat Snow Dogs as an ORV/ATV. This means that all ATV/ORV rules apply including trail permit stickers (first-year can be reimbursed). This decision is extremely frustrating.
    Exemption maybe for trail grooming equipment? Is it in fact a vehicle if you walk/snowshoe/ski behind it? I know standing on the sled behind it is preferred.

  47. #247
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    Looking through the Michigan ORV handbook, it seems clear they are not talking about grooming equipment. It could be argued that the purpose of a groomer is not as a vehicle, but rather as a tool to improve the trail. There is a specific exemption for agricultural equipment, could one argue that a groomer is similar in function to a rototiller or lawn tractor?

    This seems to be a grey area. The intent of operating the equipment is not in and of itself for "recreation", but rather to "work the land" by improving the snow on top of it.

    I would think a respectful discussion with a DNR officier would at worst result in a warning. This equipment is so rare that they would be confused by it too and not know what to do.

    Just my hunch, no legal background here.

    All that said, looking at the Snow Dog website, they market it as a vehicle to get you from here to there. In that case I can see why they are considering it an ORV. Pay the $26 or 36/year and be on your way.

  48. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsbiker View Post
    I received a letter today from my dealer, looks like the state (MI) has decided to treat Snow Dogs as an ORV/ATV. This means that all ATV/ORV rules apply including trail permit stickers (first-year can be reimbursed). This decision is extremely frustrating.
    New here but going to chime in on this. Our club in nh just got a snodog and ran into similar reg. Issues....we ended up registering it as a "groomer", being that is the sole purpose of its ownership.

    Any other clubs in your area using one, and what r they doing?

    Good luck

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

  49. #249
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    So a few of us took this around for a rip this afternoon. It was a demo on mostly flat ground in a city park, but with an eye towards potentially using it on singletrack in the future.

    Electric tracksled made by Lockwood Electric in Seeley Lake, Montana. 18 HP.

    We liked it. Thereís a definite learning curve, and it takes some commitment. Speed is your friend. The builder says he prefers a sled to a plate, because he has more options, and commonly rides with a knee on the seat or both feet in one side of the sled. It has a very low center of gravity, and the electric motor just rips when you open it up. It has a 20:1 and makes about 10 mph. I definitely wouldnít want it to be faster on single track.

    This one is owned by MTB Missoula. He makes them to order. It has ~1500 hours and has never been serviced, and never needed to be dug out. Hard to imagine how it would get stuck. Itís all drive.






  50. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by evasive View Post
    So a few of us took this around for a rip this afternoon. It was a demo on mostly flat ground in a city park, but with an eye towards potentially using it on singletrack in the future.

    Electric tracksled made by Lockwood Electric in Seeley Lake, Montana. 18 HP.

    We liked it. Thereís a definite learning curve, and it takes some commitment. Speed is your friend. The builder says he prefers a sled to a plate, because he has more options, and commonly rides with a knee on the seat or both feet in one side of the sled. It has a very low center of gravity, and the electric motor just rips when you open it up. It has a 20:1 and makes about 10 mph. I definitely wouldnít want it to be faster on single track.

    This one is owned by MTB Missoula. He makes them to order. It has ~1500 hours and has never been serviced, and never needed to be dug out. Hard to imagine how it would get stuck. Itís all drive.
    That thing is wild! Any idea how heavy it is and how long the battery lasts?

  51. #251
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    Quote Originally Posted by woodsbiker View Post
    That thing is wild! Any idea how heavy it is and how long the battery lasts?
    Itís not light. I rolled it on its side a few times while getting the feel for it. Batteries and an electric motor are pretty dense, but that was an intentional part of the design. Youíd be better off loading it with a ramp than lifting it.

    He said it has a functional life of about 4 hours in deep snow and hills. Where they use it, they commonly have really deep powder, and it just goes. Recharges overnight (6-8 hours).

  52. #252
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    The lower CG of the electric looks interesting.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNw4u49MWT0
    Blaine, Mn

  53. #253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iffykid View Post
    The lower CG of the electric looks interesting.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNw4u49MWT0
    It'd be interesting to see a video of the experienced operators using it now. They're much more dynamic than in the first test runs, and stand up more frequently. For his next tracksled, he intends to have an adjustable height handlebar so that it's easier to muscle it when you're standing.

  54. #254
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    Picked up a Snow Dog grooming plate. I will be sticking to our homemade plate though for all but deep snow conditions. Which we have not had this winter. The paint is not durable and the metal is thin so I don't think it would hold up well to low snow abuse.

    It is different then Snow Dog shows on their site and different from the pictures they posted here. It does not have runners on the bottom but instead has edges on both sides. The comb also stretches the entire length. The arm is pretty long and may need to be shortened if you want to stand closer to the bars. It came with the extensions to make it wider but I am loving the 20" width we have been using. Pretty pricey piece of metal, but not many people are making something for fat bikes yet so hats off to them.


    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20180221_000338.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20180221_000252.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20180220_191131.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20180221_000321.jpg
    Last edited by woodsbiker; 02-21-2018 at 12:53 PM.

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    Woodsbiker... I just picked up Snowdog's groomer this morning. Mine has a runner at each segment. Mine is as they show it on their website.. excepting mine has a toothed section the whole width of the drag. I found my hitch a little long also, although had altered the mounting position of the bars assembly on my sled.

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    The other day I drug a wooden pallet down my snowmobile trail to a creek to make a pallet bridge and was surprised by how well it smooth out the trail. After reading through this thread I dug out some old, full size truck tires I had lying around and tied them together in tandem with some rope. The past two days Iíve drug them behind my snowmobile and packed down my trail. I was pleased by how well they worked and liked that if they swung and hit anything they just bounce off. The setup cost me nothing and I was surprised by how easily they towed. Iím thinking of adding a third tire in tandem just to see if the trail gets even better.

  57. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowfat View Post
    The other day I drug a wooden pallet down my snowmobile trail to a creek to make a pallet bridge and was surprised by how well it smooth out the trail. After reading through this thread I dug out some old, full size truck tires I had lying around and tied them together in tandem with some rope. The past two days Iíve drug them behind my snowmobile and packed down my trail. I was pleased by how well they worked and liked that if they swung and hit anything they just bounce off. The setup cost me nothing and I was surprised by how easily they towed. Iím thinking of adding a third tire in tandem just to see if the trail gets even better.
    the problem with tires is they tend to sway, and when the bounce of trees, that's where your sending riders. They also blow off on off-camber sections. We use a rokon and drag a tire, but I am working on building a track with runners on the bottom, so it tracks in line with the rokon. Trust me, the tire thing will get old after awhile.

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    Yeah, I can definitely see what you are saying about the sway but Iím thinking that has more to do with the rigging of the tow set up more than anything else. But thatís just me hypothesizing on the couch with an iPad so Iíll have to do some real world experimenting. I think the ideal groomer set up would be some type of tracked snowbike. Not the current kits that convert dirt bikes but something lower, slower and more utilitarian. Off cambers would be much easier to negotiate with such a set up and having the front, single ski inline with the track would help to pack things down quicker and better. Have it tow something to smooth out the track footprint and I think it would be perfect.

  59. #259
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    Snowdog - not just for grooming. It did an awesome job skidding lumber for a bridge replacement.


  60. #260
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    I also made this little texture drag that i hook on the back of the sled. It does NOT pack anything, just leaves a nice corduroy finish. It's made of a 2" square tube tongue pulling a 4" channel with a 2x4 tapered to fit, which holds the YTS combs.

    This machine is so versatile!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_0471-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_0550-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_0472-medium-.jpg  

    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_0549-medium-.jpg  


  61. #261
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    Are most of you running the compact model? We are looking at the compact 10hp model and plan to make a 2 axis hitch with a roller packer and a separate cheese grater drag as well. We have some tight terrain and usually never get more than 12 inches of snow at once.
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    I'm running the compact 10hp. most folks consider some of the trails at HHE very tight and twisty. the snowdog has done a good job the last 2 winters. after a snowfall I typically go over with the sled first... and then again with a fabbed up stand on groomer. I tried making a roller.. but it failed, so back to trying again..

  63. #263
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    Quote Originally Posted by twright205 View Post
    I tried making a roller.. but it failed, so back to trying again..
    What happened?

    I saw (and can not find on any forums again) a roller for a tracksled that used 2 garden tractor tires side-by-side with a standing platform behind them. (I assume the tires were foam filled.) Under the standing platform was a compressor plate.

    Personally, I've always wondered if a roller would world better than a sled.

  64. #264
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    10hp compact model here as well. Haven't had anything it couldn't handle in lower Michigan. Even a wet heavy snowfall it was able to make it through. Granted it worked harder but no problems. Snowfall was lower last year but I don't see it not having enough power. Compact model was a necessity for the twisty terrain it is used on and the smaller the motor the less weight there is to battle.

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    well, it really didn't fail, but our trails are too twisty with some quick ups and downs, could have used a seatbelt to strap on in, I may play around with a stand on roller...
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/EJB4oKFerGCiK81KA

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    if you buy one, get 2 extra belts. keep the clutch nice and clean. I burned up a belt after neglecting it, and trying to run through some really deep snow. I should have known better, tried getting a belt off of ebay, that lasted about 20 min.. just enough to be far enough away from my truck....

    make sure original Gates belt.

  67. #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by twright205 View Post
    well, it really didn't fail, but our trails are too twisty with some quick ups and downs, could have used a seatbelt to strap on in, I may play around with a stand on roller...
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/EJB4oKFerGCiK81KA
    That thing has some potential, Thom! I don't think a roller in deep snow is feasible but for 3"-6" +/- dumps it would probably be more efficient than a sled. Snow consistency, texture and temperature are critical of course.

    I'm also rockin' the 10 HP compact model and feel it is the right choice for our trails.

  68. #268
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    Does anyone have a good source for the big corrugated plastic tube used to make a roller compactor?
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  69. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by tedsti View Post
    Does anyone have a good source for the big corrugated plastic tube used to make a roller compactor?
    Any earthwork contractor will have off-cuts of plastic culvert. That's all those rollers are.

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    call up your city or town, County department of public works, chances are they have 3-4 foot sections laying around.

  71. #271
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    Can anyone with a Snowdog drag give me a measurement from the back of the Snowdog chassis to the front and back of the standing area? It is hard to guess what a comfortable distance behind the bars will be when operating this thing.
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  72. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by tedsti View Post
    Can anyone with a Snowdog drag give me a measurement from the back of the Snowdog chassis to the front and back of the standing area? It is hard to guess what a comfortable distance behind the bars will be when operating this thing.
    The front of my drag platform is 30" from the hitch eye. The platform is 27" front to back. There's a photo in post #214 of this thread.

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    Hi Twrignt,
    We are thinking about welding up a groomer like yours through a welding program at the college where I work. What would be the dimensions of the groomer and angle of the top part. We were thinking to go 34 inches wide. Is the groomer working to your exceptations? Anything you would improve? Fred

  74. #274
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    Quote Originally Posted by FRED-CPAC View Post
    Hi Twrignt,
    We are thinking about welding up a groomer like yours through a welding program at the college where I work. What would be the dimensions of the groomer and angle of the top part. We were thinking to go 34 inches wide. Is the groomer working to your exceptations? Anything you would improve? Fred
    Fred, here and on facebook there are a pile of folks that have created some great things.

    for mine. it's 20 inches wide, just like the snowdog track... I'd worry if you go 34 inches wide. it will really bog down if you are trying to groom through several inches of snow.. just my worry.... you can.. and i do make a few passes and you can always run outside the track the second or third pass to widen the track... if you go that wide, you also might be decreasing the lbs per sq inch.. so might not get the same degree of compression of the snow than if you stayed narrower...

    anyway, so mine is 20 inches wide.. 28 inches long for the "standing plate".allows for my staggered stance (for me better balance). the front angle on the slant is 40 degrees.. , as I said at first we just had the angle iron on bottom for runners... but the drag from the metal plate did slow things down quite a bit.. so we snagged some toss away skis from local ski shop and added them to the bottom, much better glide... I did buy a portion of a grooming comb,, but I think folks can easily make their own.... and with the skis on the bottom I already get a corduroy effect... (i'm told the increased surface area allows for the snow to more quickly freeze/set up....) on the 2x2 tube connecting it ,, you could always do some slotted thing that might allow for customizing the distance between dog and sled......

    when first grooming anything more than 5 inches of new snow, i'll do a pass with the sled (any deer/hunting ) sled would works as well, if you perhaps stiffened up the bottom, and do a solid arm hitch to it... I tow the metal groomer behind the sled if I am doing trails farther out... we have a system of stacked loops... so we can get about 7 miles of our summer singletrack groomed.... some of the more gnarly stuff, that drop in and back out of ravines, or cross streams, I don't try grooming.... if you are going through 5 inches of new snow. you will likely have to scooter kick yourself to get up some hills... but then after the first pass things can get a lot easier (the snow dog likes to follow it's path) and things can get fast.... watch out for trees, saplings. I bring a small folding snow shovel with me, (if you need to turn it around, easier to do not fighting snow.. and also nice to help build up snow over recently blown down logs and such...

    sorry for the length... I tried a roller groomer.. sit on ... did not work well, might try to create a stand on or strattle over, but not sure if it 's worth the effort. also working on a pop on scarification tool, for when we have the rude winter walkers post hole our nice trail. I can help break that up and get it reset.. and maybe use it to scratch the hoods of their cars so they remember to be.... considerate..

    grooming later evening or night to allow it to set up,, tell your public .. not to ride right after you groom...)

    pics of groomer https://photos.app.goo.gl/2xitgJDpi7eawTTS8

  75. #275
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    Thanks for the information and pics.
    Could you share some more pics with mesurements of the attachment assembly?

  76. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by twright205 View Post
    Fred, here and on facebook there are a pile of folks that have created some great things.

    for mine. it's 20 inches wide, just like the snowdog track... I'd worry if you go 34 inches wide. it will really bog down if you are trying to groom through several inches of snow.. just my worry.... you can.. and i do make a few passes and you can always run outside the track the second or third pass to widen the track... if you go that wide, you also might be decreasing the lbs per sq inch.. so might not get the same degree of compression of the snow than if you stayed narrower...

    anyway, so mine is 20 inches wide.. 28 inches long for the "standing plate".allows for my staggered stance (for me better balance). the front angle on the slant is 40 degrees.. , as I said at first we just had the angle iron on bottom for runners... but the drag from the metal plate did slow things down quite a bit.. so we snagged some toss away skis from local ski shop and added them to the bottom, much better glide... I did buy a portion of a grooming comb,, but I think folks can easily make their own.... and with the skis on the bottom I already get a corduroy effect... (i'm told the increased surface area allows for the snow to more quickly freeze/set up....) on the 2x2 tube connecting it ,, you could always do some slotted thing that might allow for customizing the distance between dog and sled......

    when first grooming anything more than 5 inches of new snow, i'll do a pass with the sled (any deer/hunting ) sled would works as well, if you perhaps stiffened up the bottom, and do a solid arm hitch to it... I tow the metal groomer behind the sled if I am doing trails farther out... we have a system of stacked loops... so we can get about 7 miles of our summer singletrack groomed.... some of the more gnarly stuff, that drop in and back out of ravines, or cross streams, I don't try grooming.... if you are going through 5 inches of new snow. you will likely have to scooter kick yourself to get up some hills... but then after the first pass things can get a lot easier (the snow dog likes to follow it's path) and things can get fast.... watch out for trees, saplings. I bring a small folding snow shovel with me, (if you need to turn it around, easier to do not fighting snow.. and also nice to help build up snow over recently blown down logs and such...

    sorry for the length... I tried a roller groomer.. sit on ... did not work well, might try to create a stand on or strattle over, but not sure if it 's worth the effort. also working on a pop on scarification tool, for when we have the rude winter walkers post hole our nice trail. I can help break that up and get it reset.. and maybe use it to scratch the hoods of their cars so they remember to be.... considerate..

    grooming later evening or night to allow it to set up,, tell your public .. not to ride right after you groom...)

    pics of groomer https://photos.app.goo.gl/2xitgJDpi7eawTTS8
    Hi Twright,
    Thanks for the information and pics. Our grommer is presently in the welding shop. We went for a 32 wide groomer.
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-plan.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20181206_153412.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20181207_163018.jpg
    Best Tracksled Grooming Experience?-img_20181207_163309.jpg
    Could you share some more pics with mesurements of the attachment assembly which hooks on the snowdog?
    Fred

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    Iím building out a custom groomer based off some designs Iíve seen on this very helpful thread and had an idea I wanted to float out there. My design is quite similar to Snowdogís groomer but with a shallower angle on the front panel (as others have modified).

    The trails I need to groom see a lot of foot traffic and I was thinking about having a removable attachement that would basically be a simple rake with tines that extend several inches below the groomer plate to break up boot tracks. This ďrakeĒ would slide in and out of brackets mounted to the front panel of the groomer and follow that same angle on the leading edge.

    My plan would be to make a pass to first break up the tracks and then remove the rake attachment and follow up with a pass with the groomer alone. My biggest concern would be whether the rake attachment would create too much drag on the machine or get hung up.

    Has anyone tried something like this with success? Or is there another strategy that has worked for others in trying to remove footprints that sit below the level of the groomed track? Thanks for any thoughts/insight.

  78. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by playinVT View Post
    Has anyone tried something like this with success? Or is there another strategy that has worked for others in trying to remove footprints that sit below the level of the groomed track? Thanks for any thoughts/insight.
    As to your question about post-holing, its not an issue for our trails, we ban boots.

    Your detachable bar sounds like a great idea. Detachable bits seems to be the "killer" app for tracksled grooming. If I was recommend tine for your rack, it would the lawn and ag types for pull behind rakes. Like this: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/pr...s?cm_vc=-10005 They are pretty spry and can have the count of tines lowered or increased easily. Plus at $4 a piece, you aren't going to break the bank.

    The other thing I would recommend is to place HPDE sheets between the skegs and on the front board of the groomer. Plastic is less friction than steel and certainly steel that has rusted, been scraped and banged around. You can cut/drill HDPE with wood working bits.

  79. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by CycleKrieg View Post
    As to your question about post-holing, its not an issue for our trails, we ban boots.

    Your detachable bar sounds like a great idea. Detachable bits seems to be the "killer" app for tracksled grooming. If I was recommend tine for your rack, it would the lawn and ag types for pull behind rakes. Like this: https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/pr...s?cm_vc=-10005 They are pretty spry and can have the count of tines lowered or increased easily. Plus at $4 a piece, you aren't going to break the bank.

    The other thing I would recommend is to place HPDE sheets between the skegs and on the front board of the groomer. Plastic is less friction than steel and certainly steel that has rusted, been scraped and banged around. You can cut/drill HDPE with wood working bits.
    Thanks so much. Those are some great tips and I never wouldíve found those agricultural tines. They look perfect for the task and I especially like that theyíre easily replaced. Will get to work.

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    Fred cpac. sorry never got back you you with the measurements... phone went on the blink, and slipped my mind.... looks like you got a good one there... I am actually stopping at LBS which is also a ski shop. to buy some "dead skis".... to mount on the bottom.

    I'll toss up the measurement once I get home, in case you have yet to make it... like I said before... if you incorporate a sliding shaft. with a lock pin.. you could taylor the length of the attachment arm for your groomer guy.

    cyclekrieg.... like your idea. I picked up a handful of those spring rakes a few years ago.when designing my drag box (for summertime trail work).... but never put them to use.. thinking if I mount them to a block which then might just attach to the underside of the front nose and attachment bar... maybe a nice quick strapping device...

    although we put out signs asking folks to be considerate of our grooming efforts. along comes someone who either can't read, or figures it won't do much harm,.. I've found after 2 years, the snowdog, just with the face that the whole groomed surface is run under the track, helps mitigate some of the postholing,, but it wouldn't hurt to have that raking device you speak of as an option.

  81. #281
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    Quote Originally Posted by twright205 View Post
    thinking if I mount them to a block which then might just attach to the underside of the front nose and attachment bar... maybe a nice quick strapping device...
    Quick strapping device you say: https://www.zoro.com/fabory-safety-p...waAqyqEALw_wcB

    Drill holes, sling these through. You sir, now have more time for beer.

    In my head, I'm envisioning the comb/scratcher on the nose of ramp, with tines straight down. This would allow them to bend pretty far back without jamming against anything. For drifts and like, this should also break them up, getting more air in them and making them easier to get under the plate.

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