12 speed eagle cassettes and fat bikes?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    12 speed eagle cassettes and fat bikes?

    Getting ready to buy a new drivetrain for the fatty. Wanting max options for low and high gearing.

    Don't care if it's 11 or 12 speed, but was intrigued when researching 12 speed options.

    10t to 50t and a 36 up front seems to give me the range I want.

  2. #2
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    Good lord, a 36 up front, even with the 50 in back, seems like way to much gear to me, for a fat bike. If you do this, I'll be curious how long it will be before you wonder if you should go smaller up front...

  3. #3
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    Not really. In fat bike racing i can pedal away from the 1x crowd with my 2x10 gears right now on long fast downhills. Looking to keep that range and not lose the easy gears for when the powder gets really heavy.

  4. #4
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    Delete. Misinformation.
    Last edited by Shinkers; 07-01-2016 at 04:16 PM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkers View Post
    50/36 is still way lower than a lot of setups out there. It's lower than my 36/22 which will let me climb anything out there.
    A 36/22 is about an 18" gear and a 50/36 is about a 21" gear. So the 50/36 may be way lower than a lot of setups out there but it is not lower than the 36/22 you are now riding.
    Latitude 61

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    Whoops, just redid the math and realized that. Disregard me.

  7. #7
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    Yes with a 36 front and a 10-50 cassette, I will lose 3 to 4 teeth on the granny, but it's a fair trade off to gain a one on the top.

    I can always get a smaller chainring if it's not low enough.

    But back to my question about 12 speeds on fat bikes.....good or bad?

  8. #8
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    There isn't a good and bad, it's what works and doesn't. A fat bike is NO DIFFERENT than any other bike. The bike is build with added spacing for clearance. But adding cogs means at some level added width, so may cause an issue depending on hub spacing, chainline, and desired rear tire.

    Just like trying to squeeze a 4.7 tire in a 170 frame. May fit the frame but the chain becomes the issue. If you have the clearance, then do it.

    But be advised, something these companies don't want people to realize:

    Bigger the rear cog to mate up to bigger front chainring, the the faster your going to eat rings, cassettes and chains. Mostly chains. The bigger the rings and cogs, the more lateral stress is put on the chain. And it's not little amounts, it'll be noticed very soon by riders adopting this retarded 1x setup (I ride 1x on 2 of my bikes, largest rear cog is 40 and largest chainring is 32, 42 I could consider but that's my limit)

    The other thing is, your added now measurable rotational weight. So your literally beginning to cancel out all benefits of 1x EXCEPT simplicity. So what's the point???? A good 2x system would give more range and be more durable. Do believe me, make a mental note and check back in 1-2 years when we see how fast chains and such have to be replaced compared to before this "phase" of putting massive cogs on a cassette and calling it an upgrade.


    One more thing, your willing to sacrifice climbing gear for more top end? If you get totally spanked on the climbs that top end coming down isn't going to save you in a race. Plus that 1 tooth is going to due next to jack crap cause all the guy next to you has to do is spin a tiny bit faster and hes right back in front.

    Unless it's flat ground or a downhill race, races are mostly won on the climbs. If your last in the climbs or more taxed at the top than the other guys, their going to have a gap on you a fast down hill where your a fair bit faster will do you no good.

    Ive raced, learned the hard way fast. I could hold my own for my skill level on the flats and downs, which there were more of, but the couple climbs I got spanked and by the end... well I'll leave it at that.

    So think about all this before choosing your gearing and ditch the marketing bs. Look at what's really going to make the most of you as a riser, not what marketing is trying to say will give you and edge. Cause it's the rider 95% over the bike.
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  9. #9
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    Some people need a 22/50 to ride a fatbike. Some people dont. YEMV.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  10. #10
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    22/50..... better have some awesome balance lol cause you might as well be standing still

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  11. #11
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    Nobody wants a 22x50 gear unless you got a 36" fat bike. If you do i want one too!

    Will check out e13 cassette

  12. #12
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    Crap, I think I'd be going about 35mph before I spun out a 36x10. On a fatbike? Seriously?

    -Walt

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Crap, I think I'd be going about 35mph before I spun out a 36x10. On a fatbike? Seriously?

    -Walt

    Closer to 28-30. Remember that you can't spin too fast at that speed on slippery snow.

    We are reaching these speeds at races on the downhills. Worlds champs in ogden, 2 at frostys and 2 in Idaho.
    In ogden i got a huge gap because the 1x crowd had to coast and pedal and coast and pedal. I could pedal alot of it.

    Its ok if your scared. Some of us are not. This is not normal snow trail speed, but i dont want to be limited on the top or bottom when our snow gets deep.


    Plus if i throw on some summer wheels i will be going that fast on some long straight stretches of trail or roads.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flucod View Post
    LOL, yep, I have a customer I am working that wants this combo.
    I feel bad for that RD. It will be thinking "what in the actual fawk is going on here, first you stretch me to the point of breaking, now I am barley holding on".

    I run a 34t w/ 42t in the rear and do well on most climbs. It would be fun to experiment w/ a 28t for some off trail fun. But I found that for the majority of the riding I do a 34t puts me in the middle of the cassette the majority of the time.

  15. #15
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    An addendum

    Clyde reliability of the 12x drive train. I realize it's all very new, but what is the likelihood of it being Clyde safe.
    I am 6 foot 4, and 240 (going down but 220 is likely the lowest) . The contact patch of a fat bike has been death on drive train. It's time to upgrade and 1x11 or 12 would be awesome but I fear destroying a thin little chain.

  16. #16
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    ^Early adopters pay to play my friend. Might be best to stick with 1x11 or 1x10 for a season or two until the bugs get worked out.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Comfisherman View Post
    Clyde reliability of the 12x drive train. I realize it's all very new, but what is the likelihood of it being Clyde safe.
    I am 6 foot 4, and 240 (going down but 220 is likely the lowest) . The contact patch of a fat bike has been death on drive train. It's time to upgrade and 1x11 or 12 would be awesome but I fear destroying a thin little chain.
    The chain shouldn't be a problem if you learn to shift appropriately.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    Not really. In fat bike racing i can pedal away from the 1x crowd with my 2x10 gears right now on long fast downhills. Looking to keep that range and not lose the easy gears for when the powder gets really heavy.
    Races are won on the flats and climbs, unless it's a DH only race, but even then I've won those on my 1x10 fat bike
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  19. #19
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    Re learning shifting

    Yeah, shifting wasn't an issue for about ten years. The contact patch of the fat bike highlights my error in pedaling. Hard to change 2 decades of riding style. 3 caskets a coupled derailed, more chains than I want to count and it's improving. Seems most of what is on my bike now is a combo of x9 , kmc, with a Shimano cassette.

    On my new bike it would be cool to go 12x, but I cannot afford to destroy that much drive train at xx1 prices.

  20. #20
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    Nobody knows anything real about 12spd because they haven't been released yet. Bikerumor just reviewed a pre-production version: SRAM XX1 Eagle 1x12 mountain bike group - Actual weights, install & first ride - Bikerumor

    A less obvious downside to being an early adopter is that there are no third party parts yet (chains, chainrings, etc.). Sram seems to have been sort of lenient with their patents on their other 1x systems. Not sure if that will hold true for Eagle. It uses new chain and tooth profiles. No idea if they're patented. As for your direct question of whether they'll work with fatbikes, I see no reason why they wouldn't as long as they make a crank with the proper spindle width. If the cranks and chainring mounting interface are backward compatible, then no problem.

  21. #21
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    GX 1x11 is approximately 11/12ths as good, for a lot less money.
    "The only way we can truly control the outcome of a ride is not going on it, which is a choice I'm unwilling to make." -K.B.

  22. #22
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    12 speed eagle cassettes and fat bikes?

    I cant see the point. The wear on the parts would make it fn expensive. Lots in my group run stock 30t with 10-42 11 speeds and it rips on the pave paths and climbs like a goat. Not sure why you would all that range unless you had one bike and you want to motor on pavement in the summer and climb fresh snow hills at a snails pace in the winter

    For substantially cheaper run a 28 or 30 front in winter and change to a 32 or 34 with your 11 speed in summer
    Fatbike, XC bike, Gravel Bike....

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by solarplex View Post
    I cant see the point. The wear on the parts would make it fn expensive.
    I think I read that Sram is claiming the drivetrain will last 4 times longer (than what?). Supposedly due to carefully machining away all sharp edges from the chain, cogs and chainring teeth. I'm not in the market for a new drivetrain at the moment, so I'm more than willing to let others be the guinea pigs for this.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    Closer to 28-30. Remember that you can't spin too fast at that speed on slippery snow.

    We are reaching these speeds at races on the downhills. Worlds champs in ogden, 2 at frostys and 2 in Idaho.
    In ogden i got a huge gap because the 1x crowd had to coast and pedal and coast and pedal. I could pedal alot of it.

    Its ok if your scared. Some of us are not. This is not normal snow trail speed, but i dont want to be limited on the top or bottom when our snow gets deep.


    Plus if i throw on some summer wheels i will be going that fast on some long straight stretches of trail or roads.
    Unless your name is Alex Grant or Emma Maaranen, sorry, maybe you should have pedaled harder going up hill and on the flats.

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  25. #25
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    Alex is a neighbor, ride with him occasionally. He said the same thing. A little more top end would be nice sometimes, but not at the sacrifice of the bottom end.

  26. #26
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    Riding with WC pros and you've gotta come on MTBR to ask basic drivetrain questions?

    Love it.

    -Walt

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Riding with WC pros and you've gotta come on MTBR to ask basic drivetrain questions?

    Love it.

    -Walt

    Information is power. The net allows access to more opinions that are not always appearent to ones self. But when opinions become negative or staight out trolling, the thread has ceased to become relevant

    Attacks on people instead of commenting on the post is not great forum etiquette. If only a moderator could come on here and see negative comments.....oh wait....

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    Information is power. The net allows access to more opinions that are not always appearent to ones self. But when opinions become negative or staight out trolling, the thread has ceased to become relevant

    Attacks on people instead of commenting on the post is not great forum etiquette. If only a moderator could come on here and see negative comments.....oh wait....
    So you and the WC cup pro are in agreement that more gearing would be nice, but have no interest in the simple and obvious answer of just sticking with a 2x?

    Yeah, quit trolling Walt.

  29. #29
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    There are no light weight 2x options for fat bikes. I already run a 2x. The new, not yet released 12 speed coould be an option.
    It was opened for discussion. Not to try to change my way of thinking...

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    There are no light weight 2x options for fat bikes. I already run a 2x. The new, not yet released 12 speed coould be an option.
    It was opened for discussion. Not to try to change my way of thinking...
    Hollowgram double with a RaceFace fat bike spindle, running 2x11 XTR Di2.

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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    There are no light weight 2x options for fat bikes. I already run a 2x. The new, not yet released 12 speed coould be an option.
    It was opened for discussion. Not to try to change my way of thinking...
    Well, it's not released, so that kinda puts a damper on it being an 'option'.
    But I'll leave you alone to whatever it is you are doing here...

  32. #32
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    I think at the speeds you're riding, an aero helmet/skinsuit/shoe covers would be a better use of money than trying to save 100 grams of drivetrain weight.

    Or get someone to make you a fatbike disc wheel or two! Now *that* would be rad...

    -Walt

  33. #33
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    If your races aren't too picky about UCI rules, a fairing over at least the front tire would give pretty huge gains in speed too.

    -Walt

  34. #34
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    ^I think Walt has been drinking.

    You are drunk Walt, go to bed.

  35. #35
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    This thread is awesome.

  36. #36
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    "the net"
    You change your own flats? Support your LBS and pay them to instead.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    Attacks on people instead of commenting on the post is not great forum etiquette. If only a moderator could come on here and see negative comments.....oh wait....
    Quote Originally Posted by ascarlarkinyar View Post
    Its ok if your scared. Some of us are not.
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