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  1. #1
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    Spawn 14 vs. 16 sizing

    Hi everyone,

    Reading through the other threads has pretty much convinced me to go with the Spawn Yoji for my son's first pedal bike. Im on the fence between the 14 vs. the 16.

    My son is about to be three and ~37.5 inches tall. I've had a bit of trouble getting an accurate inseam measurement, but it's not abnormally long for his height. The 16 has a minimum height of 37, but I'm not sure if that's for first time pedalers.

    Anyway, I've learned a lot from everyone (especially svinyard) about the 16. Did anyone go with the 14? How big was your kid before he needed a size up?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    Hi everyone,

    Reading through the other threads has pretty much convinced me to go with the Spawn Yoji for my son's first pedal bike. Im on the fence between the 14 vs. the 16.

    My son is about to be three and ~37.5 inches tall. I've had a bit of trouble getting an accurate inseam measurement, but it's not abnormally long for his height. The 16 has a minimum height of 37, but I'm not sure if that's for first time pedalers.

    Anyway, I've learned a lot from everyone (especially svinyard) about the 16. Did anyone go with the 14? How big was your kid before he needed a size up?
    The 14" is incredibly small. The seat slammed down is great. We have a friend with the 14" and I couldn't believe how small it was. We have the 16" and our daughter has been riding it since she was 3. Great buy by the way. Fantastic bike. The front is a little twitchy as it feels built more like a bmx bike.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by nwa bike dad View Post
    The 14" is incredibly small. The seat slammed down is great. We have a friend with the 14" and I couldn't believe how small it was. We have the 16" and our daughter has been riding it since she was 3. Great buy by the way. Fantastic bike. The front is a little twitchy as it feels built more like a bmx bike.
    Yeah, if you look at it...its simply a mini-Dirt Jumper with a rigid fork and sick tires. The 14" is a short little bike. Now I love little DJ/BMX bikes for kids at this age. They need those skills and not "roll down the trail" skills. Its not as bad once you think of it as a BMX. It comes with 4" riser bars and everything. Pretty cool. This Harry kid started on a tiny BMX bike. Not the same Yoji but similar. He's the best kid we've ever seen:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ2YS0golKo

    Nevertheless, a decent sized 3yro who doesn't pedal yet is served really well by the 16" as they can just sit on it and learn to pedal and shortly stand and pedal. By 4 they should be ripping it and the bike will fit perfectly as a proper rigid DJ with sick tires. Works great on the trail. I only wish I could put a fork on it and disk brakes as my 4yro is ready for some downhill stuff and that would make it safer/slacker etc.

    16" Sizing Info:

    1- The seat is a pivotal and goes down to 17.25" (the top of the seat)
    2- Usable stand over is about 17"

    My 4yro is now 42in tall and has a 16" inseam. It definitely works great for him. Last year he got it on his birthday. It worked awesome for him then too, and he was pedaling on his own in 30mins on pavement. He could reach the ground on his tippy toes. We did have to swap for the 89mm cranks and some flat bars. Ideally i would have throw a Wren 40mm stem on it (or shorter) and some ebay carbon flat bars I could cut down to 520mm or so I think. That'd cut weight and make it fit better. At the time I just got some Fly 2" bar and rolled them backwards. Not sure if that was right or wrong but it worked. Fwiw the stem has a BMX clamp diamter. I think its 22m. Now he rocks those Fly bars all the way up and is jumping little stuff. Loves it.

    Here is him on his 3rd Birthday (he's not a big kid):
    Note: pad them up with Strider pads and ZippyRooz Gloves (they actually fit tiny hands)...this makes the falls no big deal instead "We done!". Must have. Kid's confidence at this age is SUPER fragile for some. It only take a couple crashes for some kids to totally bag out for a year. Also a FF helmet is a must in our house for everyone. This little guy got distracted on a PumpTrack and ate it on his face in a corner berm (he was just going nice and slow etc). A tooth nearly died and there was a lot of blood; it was a super bad moment. He got a FF the next day (Bell Super 3r). If he had that on, it'd be literally no big deal other than a tear or two I'm guessing. There is no downside to those Bell or other really light helmets and they will use them for the next 4 or 5 yrs assuming no big crashes. Find them for 160$-90$ in size small. It doesn't fit tight enough for DH racing (silly at this age) but enough to protect most of their face and you can tighten it down in the back. Our whole family wears them. MTB is likely the most dangerous sport they will ever do; good to establish good safety habits now and not make the mistake I did thinking only my grom older son needed it cause he was shredding. Not true.
    Spawn 14 vs. 16 sizing-aidanbike.jpg

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by nwa bike dad View Post
    The 14" is incredibly small. The seat slammed down is great. We have a friend with the 14" and I couldn't believe how small it was. We have the 16" and our daughter has been riding it since she was 3. Great buy by the way. Fantastic bike. The front is a little twitchy as it feels built more like a bmx bike.
    Yep, I get the feeling that the 14 is pretty darn small. It's a shame that these aren't in stores where I could just go see the different sizes. i would actually be willing to pay retail for once.

    Thanks!

  5. #5
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    Our oldest is almost 4 -- we got him a 12" Joovy Bicycoo BMX balance bike after his 3rd birthday in mid-April last year & a 14" Yoji in mid-May based on his sizing at the time.

    He spent most of the summer riding the balance bike with occasional attempts at the pedal bike. Pedaling seemed to "click" around August -- after that we used the Yoji for longer rides & the balance bike at the skatepark & pump track.

    The 14" size was great for building confidence since he could plant his feet firmly on the ground and not have to balance on his toes.

    We ordered a 16" around December and I spent a month or so tinkering with it to add a 20" suspension fork, which makes the standover slightly higher than the base 16", but still lower than a 20":
    https://forums.mtbr.com/families-rid...k-1096130.html

    Here's a shot that includes both the 14" and 16" (before modifications) to get a better idea of the size difference:
    Spawn 14 vs. 16 sizing-img_20181219_081253095.jpg

    No regrets starting with the 14", but we also have a 2 year old who's next in line to have bikes passed down to him, so everything is going to get used twice.

    My suggestion would be to consider the 16" if your son is already confident on a balance bike (riding stuff like ramps / skateparks / singletrack and coasting longer distances with feet off the ground).

    If he's just starting out and doesn't have much confidence on a balance bike already, the 14" might be a little easier to learn on.

  6. #6
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    One tip for sizing that I recently discovered -- if you're trying to measure a kid's inseam, a ratcheting clamp like this works great when you set it up as a spreader:
    https://www.menards.com/main/storeit...=1444439535159

    Just have your kid stand over it and ratchet it up until they're sitting on the clamp pad, then have them step off and measure the distance.

    Seems to give a more accurate measurement than trying to use a tape measure on its own.

  7. #7
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    Thanks! That's a really cool build on the 16.

    My son is pretty darn good at on his strider bike. We don't have a skatepark nearby, but he cruises down accessibility ramps and our grass slanted yard no problem. He pushes and glides with his feet up for a good bit. My hesitation with the 16 is that he probably couldn't sit on the seat and do a bit of push biking to familiarize himself with the brakes.

    How tall is your son?

    Svinyard has very kindly agreed to measure seat height for me though, so I'm going to set the seat of his strider at that level and see how he does. If he is too small, oh well, I'll get the 14, sell it for a hopefully small hit after a year, and buy the 16 when he's ready. He just seems so close that the trouble is somewhat annoying if he could start on the 16.

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    I listed the seat height above in my post fyi.

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    Man, I'd totally missed it. Thanks a ton, you've provided so much awesome info!

  10. #10
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    Our son was about 39.5" last spring when we got the 14".

    Thinking about your situation some more, consider what your next move is going to be if you do get the 14". It's a big jump to try to ride it until he's ready for a 20", so you'd probably want a 16" as the next step within the next year or so.

    With that in mind, given that he's already comfortable on the balance bike, I'd go ahead and order the 16". If it works out, you only needed 1 bike now. If it doesn't, you could get another 14" and just put the 16 aside until he's ready.

  11. #11
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    Hmm, that might be a good plan. Though I was planning on stalking Pinkbike's Buy/Sell something fierce to see if I could pick up a used 16 if I got the 14.

    Still, given the resell, we're probably talking ~$100 this way or that way. Which is just a bit under what I spent for seasonal rental skis which my son was only interested in wearing in the house. So, I've spent money on things I'm less sure he'll like. ha

  12. #12
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    Another possible approach if you did need to drop lower would be to try putting a little smaller wheels on the 16".

    Just dropping the rear wheel down to 14" would likely give you close to 1" lower standover.

    I see 14" Islabikes rear wheels on ebay for ~$35 shipped:
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Islabikes-R...e/123697039537

    For the tire, you could pick up an extra 14" tire from Spawn when you order for $25.

    Dropping down to the 89mm cranks could compensate for less ground clearance to the pedals (another $50). Being on the edge of sizing, the cranks might be a change you'd want to make anyway.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by TimTucker View Post
    Another possible approach if you did need to drop lower would be to try putting a little smaller wheels on the 16".

    Just dropping the rear wheel down to 14" would likely give you close to 1" lower standover.

    I see 14" Islabikes rear wheels on ebay for ~$35 shipped:
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Islabikes-R...e/123697039537

    For the tire, you could pick up an extra 14" tire from Spawn when you order for $25.

    Dropping down to the 89mm cranks could compensate for less ground clearance to the pedals (another $50). Being on the edge of sizing, the cranks might be a change you'd want to make anyway.
    I was actually thinking about that. I wondered if I created a Spawn 16 miniaturizer kit (14in wheelset, shorter cranks, little riser bar turned back a la svinyard) I could basically just sell it on to someone on this forum/Pinkbike when my kid moved up and they could do the same when theirs did, with everyone only taking a little hit each time.

    The problem would be I'd need to move the brake mounts as they're rim brakes, so not as easy to just throw a different wheelsize on than with discs. Also, this is moving very much into my standard "complicated plan for questionable gain" modus operandi when i could just buy the 14 and sell it on.

    A guy on Pinkbike is selling a 12in Cleary Hedgehog. I was considering buying it and using it as the transition bike from push bike to pedals and assuming that in a few months with a bit of pedaling/braking experience (and growth) under his belt, my son would be fine to just go straight to the 16 (with maybe the smaller bars).

    In any case, I'm really liking this stage of parenting. :-)

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    The problem would be I'd need to move the brake mounts as they're rim brakes, so not as easy to just throw a different wheelsize on than with discs. Also, this is moving very much into my standard "complicated plan for questionable gain" modus operandi when i could just buy the 14 and sell it on.

    A guy on Pinkbike is selling a 12in Cleary Hedgehog. I was considering buying it and using it as the transition bike from push bike to pedals and assuming that in a few months with a bit of pedaling/braking experience (and growth) under his belt, my son would be fine to just go straight to the 16 (with maybe the smaller bars).
    Can't believe I forgot about the brakes -- that was definitely the thing that complicated the modifications I did the most.

    For a 14" wheel on the 16" frame you might be able to get away with a BMX-style U-brake, since those rely on the posts being higher than the rim rather than lower.

    In our case, I wasn't too worried about the adjustment to using brakes since my son was coming from a balance bike that had a rear brake.

    The Cleary you mentioned does seem like a much simpler option and would probably make a decent BMX bike if you put on a riser bar later. If you were to get it along with the 16" Yoji, you might be able to get a little lower saddle height by swapping the pivotal seat & post over to the Cleary (assuming it also uses a 25.4mm post).

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    The Cleary turned out to have the coaster brake rather than free hub, so I'm not sure if I'm going to go with it. I personally wouldn't want to be unable to set my cranks on a bike that low, but maybe that's someone set in his ways riding.

  16. #16
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    I bought the 14" Yoji for my 3yr old b-day who was ~37.5" and could stride well, his inseam was exactly 14in at the time; at least by my measurement. Cut the seatpost so it could bottom out and flipped the stem over his feet just barely touched the ground. It took him about ~2.5months more to feel comfortable pedaling and he rides it today 11 months later on a pump track and trails. I'm about to put the spacers under the stem and flip the stem back over to rise the handlebars up to max. I'm thinking he is going to get 2 summers out of the bike.

    I bought the 14 because I wanted to make it as possible for him to excel in the first summer at 3yrs old, the whole family rides. I think ultimately this became the deciding factor.

    yoji 16, the 16" stand over is not much more but it could be the difference of 6months and then possibly that first year depending on weather.

    I have a 5.5yr old who was taller and he has a 16" specialized hard rock that he has been riding for 2yrs destroys on, jumps sprints goes to the trails on; i think he tried throwing a leg over it at 3.5yrs but wasnt till almost 3.75yrss he could actually ride it and at 4.5 he was a little ripper.

    Who will they be riding with and where will he be riding needs to be part of the question. Possibly how often they ride. The rate at which they excel and the terrain they try to accomplish can be greatly increased by having the right sized bike. it's important if they or you expect a lot out of them.

    I expected the bike to ride as a bmx, small and maneuverable. stand up, sprint, climb or take the pumps of a track and have the bike move around underneath them when in the bumps. So even though the 16 may fit them they may not be able to maneuver the bike like they want.

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    +1 on the Hedgehog. My less than 5 percentile youngest rode one from 3-4 years. Used it as a balance bike with pedals initially - having dual hand brakes (you don't want the coaster version) allowed him to ride real trails. Pick up pedaling pretty quickly and then went straight to a 16". We put Vee Tire Crown Gems 2.25" tires on - makes it look like a mini fat bike!

  18. #18
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    I guess it was the Gecko not the Hedgehog I was talking about (their 12 in bike) but it sounds like you understood me. If the used on had been a freewheel model, it would be on it's way here.

    One place online does have a gecko freewheel model for 265, but it bright pink. I don't mind at all, but I feel like it might be harder resell if he grows out of it in a few months.

    I've given this probably too much thought, but at least it prevents me from planning to buy myself new bikes.

    Thanks for all the advice/shared experience!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    I guess it was the Gecko not the Hedgehog I was talking about (their 12 in bike) but it sounds like you understood me. If the used on had been a freewheel model, it would be on it's way here.

    One place online does have a gecko freewheel model for 265, but it bright pink. I don't mind at all, but I feel like it might be harder resell if he grows out of it in a few months.

    I've given this probably too much thought, but at least it prevents me from planning to buy myself new bikes.

    Thanks for all the advice/shared experience!
    Not sure if you'd seen, but Cleary does have the 12" rear freewheel for $45 ($55 shipped) if you wanted to go with the used Gecko on Pinkbike:
    https://www.clearybikes.com/collecti...18702844362850

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by TimTucker View Post
    Not sure if you'd seen, but Cleary does have the 12" rear freewheel for $45 ($55 shipped) if you wanted to go with the used Gecko on Pinkbike:
    https://www.clearybikes.com/collecti...18702844362850
    I did see that. They don't come with the freewheel sprocket though, so that's another $22. I liked the riser bars as well on that page. If I was going to make it into a micro bmx, those seemed good.

    I'm probably going to try to get one more good measurement of my son tonight and then decide on the Gecko/Yoji 14.

    Or if he's really close, I will buy the Yoji 16, assemble it, and see how it compares to the strider bike seat height he can handle. I'd probably then buy one of the others, but I'll be buying the 16 soon enough anyway, so might as well get it now and take a look. The idea was for this to be his 3rd birthday present, but we'll see if I manage to wait that long given he's pretty gung ho about bikes right now and the weather is getting nice.

    Thanks again everyone!

  21. #21
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    We went with the Commencal Ramones for my son. It's really good. Great hand brakes, free wheel. It's light! (which is a real issue for the little guys). I'd check em out.

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    The Yoji are special bikes. Pass on the Cleary stuff. The Yoji are lighter and better built. The wide wheels and gnarly tires are game changers and make single track riding a good option. The cleary stuff is skinny wheels with slick tires and heavy. Not ideal in my opinion. There are other things about it that are great as well like the Shimano compatible free hub etc. Plus Spawn is a legit mtb bike company and has pushed the envelope for a while. Good to support.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by svinyard View Post
    The Yoji are special bikes. Pass on the Cleary stuff. The Yoji are lighter and better built. The wide wheels and gnarly tires are game changers and make single track riding a good option. The cleary stuff is skinny wheels with slick tires and heavy. Not ideal in my opinion. There are other things about it that are great as well like the Shimano compatible free hub etc. Plus Spawn is a legit mtb bike company and has pushed the envelope for a while. Good to support.
    Oh I'm definitely getting a Yoji 16. I was just considering a smaller bike to make the transition easier and the used Clearly looked like it might work well for learning to use brakes then pedal. The Yoji 14 would probably work t0o, it's just twice as expensive as the used, somewhat local Cleary.

  24. #24
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    I am curious for people who have had both. I currently have a Woom 1 (and was planning on getting a Woom 2). It seems like the Spawn is a better MTB bike (at the very least the tires are.)

    Anyone moved from the Woom 1 to the Spawn 14? my kid is 2.5 and handles the Woom 1 fine. Understands what the brake is, but has to be reminded to use it.

    No issues balancing / riding down wheelchair ramps on it.

    The 16 sounds like it would last a long time, but unsure how much he would hate a bike that is potentially too big.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassieno View Post
    I am curious for people who have had both. I currently have a Woom 1 (and was planning on getting a Woom 2). It seems like the Spawn is a better MTB bike (at the very least the tires are.)

    Anyone moved from the Woom 1 to the Spawn 14? my kid is 2.5 and handles the Woom 1 fine. Understands what the brake is, but has to be reminded to use it.

    No issues balancing / riding down wheelchair ramps on it.

    The 16 sounds like it would last a long time, but unsure how much he would hate a bike that is potentially too big.
    We don't have anything other than Spawn kid bikes and BMX stuff but have bunches of friends that we ride with who have younger kids and live in a big mtb town. Oldest boy rides with both of the local teams. My buddies 3yro has the 14" Yoji.

    I don't have direct experience riding with Woom kids bike (could there be a worse name?) but have ridden with a bunch of kids on Islabike which Woom copied/improved on. Woom/Islabikes are staightup road bikes while the Yoji are a rigid DJ bike through and through. It's that simple and it's very close to adults riding a road bike on the trails VS a DJ bike with some gnarly tires.

    The Islabike kids struggle at everything other than sitting and pedaling and it's downright scary watching them crash on the singletrack when it's dusty or loose with those razor thin tires. They are wonderful for sitting and pedaling on black top. Oh and the poor kids on these at the BMX park...it's not a versatile bike. The BMX coaches loathe them.

    Now I did help a friend whose girl was wanting to ride more but was crashing on the trails. First she can't stand and pedal (Yoji and a bit of practice fix this in a heart beat because it's a skill dev bike not a road bike). Second the tires and geometry with a high seat etc screwed her up. Nevertheless we threw some Yoji tires on it and they just barely fit and it helped. But damn that was like a 500$ with new tires. Expensive and far from ideal other than neighborhood stuff.

    So the Yoji is money because it fosters their skills a lot better and rides like a DJ bike making it easy to learn to jump and pump and corner while still working on mild trails. It does have limitations for doing some light DH stuff as there is no fork, the HTA is 69 and I wish it had hydro disk brakes. Fwiw the Prevelo 16" is a sick bike too! New one for them. My buddy has one and it's bigger than the Yoji and a tad longer/slacker and has hydro disk brakes. It's a better mtb, but I don't think kids need to be mtb'ing at this age but instead learning how to handle a bike. I do wish my little guy had a hardtail 16" on some days tho.

  26. #26
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    If I had infinite money, I'd also buy a Woom for a bike path bike. As excited as I am to hop curbs and ride trails with my son, my wife is almost as excited to ride her road bike with him on the bike path.

    It's a good think that the Prevelo Zulu 14 is out of stock and the Zulu 16 is definitely too big for my son to start. I would be even more indecisive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by svinyard View Post
    We don't have anything other than Spawn kid bikes and BMX stuff but have bunches of friends that we ride with who have younger kids and live in a big mtb town. Oldest boy rides with both of the local teams. My buddies 3yro has the 14" Yoji.

    I don't have direct experience riding with Woom kids bike (could there be a worse name?) but have ridden with a bunch of kids on Islabike which Woom copied/improved on. Woom/Islabikes are staightup road bikes while the Yoji are a rigid DJ bike through and through. It's that simple and it's very close to adults riding a road bike on the trails VS a DJ bike with some gnarly tires.

    The Islabike kids struggle at everything other than sitting and pedaling and it's downright scary watching them crash on the singletrack when it's dusty or loose with those razor thin tires. They are wonderful for sitting and pedaling on black top. Oh and the poor kids on these at the BMX park...it's not a versatile bike. The BMX coaches loathe them.

    Now I did help a friend whose girl was wanting to ride more but was crashing on the trails. First she can't stand and pedal (Yoji and a bit of practice fix this in a heart beat because it's a skill dev bike not a road bike). Second the tires and geometry with a high seat etc screwed her up. Nevertheless we threw some Yoji tires on it and they just barely fit and it helped. But damn that was like a 500$ with new tires. Expensive and far from ideal other than neighborhood stuff.

    So the Yoji is money because it fosters their skills a lot better and rides like a DJ bike making it easy to learn to jump and pump and corner while still working on mild trails. It does have limitations for doing some light DH stuff as there is no fork, the HTA is 69 and I wish it had hydro disk brakes. Fwiw the Prevelo 16" is a sick bike too! New one for them. My buddy has one and it's bigger than the Yoji and a tad longer/slacker and has hydro disk brakes. It's a better mtb, but I don't think kids need to be mtb'ing at this age but instead learning how to handle a bike. I do wish my little guy had a hardtail 16" on some days tho.
    Spot on post. The Yoji is an amazing bike. It is pretty twitchy for some downhill stuff and doesn't have gears for climbing if that is what you are wanting. My kid is barely 5 and tall for her age. Slam the seat and go ride. Amazing skill development bike.

  28. #28
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    So, I decided to call Prevelo just to check when the Zulu One (the 14 in bike would be in stock). It actually wasn't sold out, they just hadn't updated their website after changing to shipping it with an attached coaster brake wheel) so as to be law compliant. The include the actual correct free hub wheel with the brake disk and tire in the standard package.

    So I bought it. Being a bit bigger than the Yoji 14 and a bit smaller than the Yoji 16, it seems to be pretty much a perfect fit. I also don't mind the slacker head angle as my son learns, though I love the Yoji's BMX geometry for once he has a bit more. I suspect that he will end up with a BMX in any case (if not the Yoji 16) in a few years in any case.

    Thanks to everyone for all the advice (especially svinyard and TimTucker)!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    If I had infinite money, I'd also buy a Woom for a bike path bike. As excited as I am to hop curbs and ride trails with my son, my wife is almost as excited to ride her road bike with him on the bike path.

    It's a good think that the Prevelo Zulu 14 is out of stock and the Zulu 16 is definitely too big for my son to start. I would be even more indecisive.
    From our experience, I think I'd rather have the Yoji for bike paths than the Woom.

    While the Woom is slightly lighter, being able to easily go down to a lower cog with the Yoji's cassette hub makes a world of difference in being able to ride uphill on pavement, meaning he can navigate most of the paths in our area without needing to get off the bike and walk.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    So, I decided to call Prevelo just to check when the Zulu One (the 14 in bike would be in stock). So I bought it. Being a bit bigger than the Yoji 14 and a bit smaller than the Yoji 16, it seems to be pretty much a perfect fit.

    Thanks to everyone for all the advice (especially svinyard and TimTucker)!
    Hope you and your son enjoy the bike!

    The Prevelo bikes are pretty nice -- my only gripe with them is that their single-speed bikes use freewheels rather than cassettes, which means a little more cost / effort if you want to swap things out.

    It looks like the Zulu One uses a 25T 64 BCD chainring, so if you did want to drop things down you have room to go down to 22T without needing to worry about the freewheel:
    https://usamade.myshopify.com/collec...tain-chainring

  31. #31
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    Hmm, good to know. I will definitely consider that if he needs more oomph at the low end.

    The freewheels from Prevelo also look pretty reasonably priced ($18), but the cost and effort is a bit more as I don't have the right patterned freewheel tool.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by TimTucker View Post
    From our experience, I think I'd rather have the Yoji for bike paths than the Woom.

    While the Woom is slightly lighter, being able to easily go down to a lower cog with the Yoji's cassette hub makes a world of difference in being able to ride uphill on pavement, meaning he can navigate most of the paths in our area without needing to get off the bike and walk.
    For bike paths, we bought a 20" HT Flow early and that's what she uses for pavement. It has gears and now she can climb almost everything. The seat slams pretty low and if its pavement, she's just going to sit and spin. The stand over height is fine for that. Our area is pretty hilly and the ability to shift is huge so I don't have to get off and help push her up the hills. Plus, we get an extra year out of the 20" MTB. She is 5. She rides the 16" Yoji for some trail, skate parks, skills lines, pump track and the 20" when she will sit and spin mostly and climb. Anything where skill development is the goal.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusBrody View Post
    Hmm, good to know. I will definitely consider that if he needs more oomph at the low end.

    The freewheels from Prevelo also look pretty reasonably priced ($18), but the cost and effort is a bit more as I don't have the right patterned freewheel tool.
    I wouldn't bother with the freewheels directly from Prevelo -- the only one larger than stock is just a 15T vs. the stock 14T.

    I'd tried going 1T up with the cassette cogs on the Yoji, but found it didn't seem to make much difference. With the extra cost of the freewheel, I'd probably only consider changing if you're going to go up by 3-4T or more.

    When I ran the numbers to figure out what cog & chain ring to run, here's what I did:
    - Put my bike in a comfortable gear for riding across grass
    - Calculated the gain ratio in that gearing
    - Worked backward to figure determine what gave the closest gain ratio to that on my son's bike

    For calculating gain ratios I used the calculator on Sheldon Brown's site (note that I did have to use the developer tools in Chrome to hack the html for the form to calculate for 14" wheels):
    https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gear-calc.html

  34. #34
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    Good find on the Prevelo! This might be a special year for them. They make maybe the only legit MTB for kids that young. Disk brakes and a 66d HTA on a rigid bike with 2.1in tires 15-ish lbs. Pretty insanely nice. I wish I had their 16" version for my 4yro as there are days where he could ride some of the downhill stuff. Braking is kind of the main issue...and might fine with his v-brakes but its not ideal.

    You might start looking for a used 12" BMX soon too now that you have a MTB dialed in. Should be able to find something for 150$-ish.

    Nevertheless, its cool to see so many of the Dad's dialed into kids biking and investing in good stuff. You are doing the rest of the community a favor by supporting kid-focused companies while also providing solid used bikes for the next round of kids who maybe couldn't afford the expensive stuff. We need more of that for sure.

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