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  1. #1
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    Truth or Epiphany I cant decide?

    Which one for general XC use, want something reasonably light...no racing, jumps etc.

  2. #2
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    Good job!

    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    Which one for general XC use, want something reasonably light...no racing, jumps etc.
    The Epiphany should really blow you away. I've had mine since December and everytime I go out I love it even more...My wife is fed up with hearing about it (the true indicator I've found the right bike).

    If you haven't ridden a really efficient long travel 4 bar like the Epi or the Moment, I can see how you'd be leaning towards the Truth - Before my Epi, I've been riding hard tails for over 15 years and was really concerned about the climbing characteritics of the longer travel bikes, so I went and test rode the Moment and was BLOWN away by how easily it pedaled and climbed. The fact that the Moment pedaled so efficiently was a shock to me, so I immediately knew that the Epi would be perfect (at 2 pounds lighter, how could you go wrong?!)

    Plus, once you ride a 5", it is such a let down (IMHO) going back to a 4". My wife has a 4" bike that just feels so XC Racer, where my 5" just feels FUN.

    Truthfully though, no one should be able to help you answer this question until you give us more beta on the terrrain you ride. If it is flat, and smooth, then the Truth may be the better choice, but if you have a mix of terrain, don't you dare buy that Truth, the Epi is just WAY TOO FUN not to buy.
    Hydrate or Die Trying

  3. #3
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    The Epiphany should really blow you away. I've had mine since December and everytime I go out I love it even more...My wife is fed up with hearing about it (the true indicator I've found the right bike).



    I think Painpusher may have just written our next ad!

    way to go

  4. #4
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    I agree with the Epiphany recommendation. If you aren't racing, the extra inch of travel at almost no weight penalty will be a big advantage.
    {Principal Skinner} Hmm. Whoever did this is in very deep trouble.
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  5. #5
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    Hey Porn,

    I think you should go with the Epi. I have a Truth and eventhough it's a very plush bike, once you try 5", you won't go back to 4. I haven't ridden an Epi myself, but if it pedals anything like the Truth or Moment, which I believe it will, you'll love the ride. I've ridden a Moment and it's a fantastic bike for All Mountain. The Epi should feel even quicker and efficient.

    Good luck and if possible, try to ride both bikes. You might want to contact Ells or your local Ells dealer to see if they have a demo bike.

  6. #6
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    why go 4" when you can go 7 or 8" with the Rogue, more cushion for the pushing!

    But in reality go with the Ephinany!

  7. #7
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    I have to agree with everyone else here. Go with the Epi. You will love the extra 1"+ of travel and will have no extra weight to deal with. Should be a great general all around fun bike.

  8. #8
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    Thanks for all the replies...

    What about for climbing as the steeper head angle & increased travel forks (125-150mm) should make it a bit more difficult?

    Cheers

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    What about for climbing as the steeper head angle & increased travel forks (125-150mm) should make it a bit more difficult?
    Climbing may be a bit more difficult on the Epi, but I hardly think that you will notice it. The geometry on the Epi (HA of 70) is still relatively steeper than other 5"+ travel bikes. That along with the light weight should make a very nimble climbing machine.

  10. #10
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    Dude - you must have missed my comments in previous posts where I discussed that the Epi climbs better than my Litespeed hardtail...No worries, you're gonna be a rockstar on the Epi - Now get it and ride, your wasting valuble ride time here trying to decide between a racer boy 4" bike and a 5" all around fun bike!!
    Hydrate or Die Trying

  11. #11
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    I'd like to put in a vote for the Truth! Is 25mm going to make a MAJOR difference to this guy? Probably not...

    Two reasons...overall, it will be lighter, yet will be as durable as the Epiphany. The new frames and asymetrical stays look promising. Secondly, at least in the US, you're going to save about $400 which could go to some really nice wheels or disc brakes (requisite for those wet English seasons)

    I've read a lot of British bike mags and most of the folks over there seem ride HTs or short travel FS, unless they're going to France or Switzerland. Even then, if you're XC riding, the Truth would be great for extended climbing. The Epiphany will be a better decender because of the more stable geometry.

    Either bike will pedal efficiently. Yeah the Epiphany is shiny and new, but the Truth is time tested and proven. Good luck! At least you know either decision is a good one!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by PAINpusher

    Truthfully though, no one should be able to help you answer this question until you give us more beta on the terrrain you ride. If it is flat, and smooth, then the Truth may be the better choice, but if you have a mix of terrain, don't you dare buy that Truth, the Epi is just WAY TOO FUN not to buy.
    Terrain would be pretty easy trails, singletracks with loads of tree roots etc, some quite rocky sections.

    I know I dont need the Epi, but its the newest model....

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by chad1433
    I'd like to put in a vote for the Truth! Is 25mm going to make a MAJOR difference to this guy? Probably not...

    Two reasons...overall, it will be lighter, yet will be as durable as the Epiphany. The new frames and asymetrical stays look promising. Secondly, at least in the US, you're going to save about $400 which could go to some really nice wheels or disc brakes (requisite for those wet English seasons)

    I've read a lot of British bike mags and most of the folks over there seem ride HTs or short travel FS, unless they're going to France or Switzerland. Even then, if you're XC riding, the Truth would be great for extended climbing. The Epiphany will be a better decender because of the more stable geometry.

    Either bike will pedal efficiently. Yeah the Epiphany is shiny and new, but the Truth is time tested and proven. Good luck! At least you know either decision is a good one!
    Good point, though I still suggest that, regardless of the extra 1", the more lax geometry of the Epi could make it a more "overall" enjoyable ride than the Truth, at least for longer epic rides. This sort of falls into a fit issue though, and while on that topic - the Truth actually offers 4 sizes to choose from rather than the 3 sizes of the Epi which could make the Truth a easier bike to fit depending on his set-up preferences.
    Hydrate or Die Trying

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    Terrain would be pretty easy trails, singletracks with loads of tree roots etc, some quite rocky sections.

    I know I dont need the Epi, but its the newest model....
    Like Chad says, either way you can't go wrong.
    Hydrate or Die Trying

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    Terrain would be pretty easy trails, singletracks with loads of tree roots etc, some quite rocky sections.

    I know I dont need the Epi, but its the newest model....
    You do need to match the bike to the terrain. If you get something that is too much for your terrain it makes the ride too easy and almost boring, you'll be constantly looking for obstacles to go over. That is what I've experienced when I rode the same trails with a Moment that I used to ride with the Truth.

    The Epi may only have a little more than 1" than the Truth but I think that adds a lot to smoothing out the terrain. You will be able to do more with the Epi.

    Don't get me wrong, the Truth is also very capable. Lots of people ride it off good size drops and jumps. Unfortunately, not too many of us have had the opportunity to ride both of them at this time to reallly see the difference. You may want to check the Turner forum for numerous threads on "Flux vs. Spot" and see what Homers said. The Flux and the 5-Spot are in the same class as the Truth and Epiphany, respectively.

  16. #16
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    Thanks for the input guys, decided to go for the Epiphany. Build spec at the moment as follows what do you think?

    Frame Ellsworth Epiphany Small
    Wheels Chris King ISO Disc with Mavic 717 in black
    Tyres Panaracers XC pro
    Skewers Hope Titanium
    FR Derailer Shimano XTR
    Rear Derailer Shimano XTR
    Cassette Shimano XTR
    Chain Shimano XTR
    Brakes Hope Mini Mono
    Shifters Shimano XTR
    Cranks RF Dues XC
    Headset Chris King No Threadset
    Stem RF Dues XC
    Bar RF Next SL
    Grips ODI Ruffian
    Seatpost RF Next SL Carbon
    Seatclamp DMR QR
    Seat Selle Italia
    Pedals Crank Bros Ti
    Forks Fox TALAS RLC

    Not too sure about the use of carbon seatpost as Ive noticed most of the pics on here everyones using a Thompson. Would have liked the F100X forks instead but theres not enough travel for the Epiphany. I cant be bothered stopping to change travel nor using lockout? any better alternatives?

    Cheers

  17. #17
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    Sram

    You could try a Float 130 XTT fork 130 mm travel, terralogic internals. Or save yourself some money and get a Minute series fork, they are better, cheaper, and more tunable. While on the subject of saving money, why shimano xtr??? Go SRAM XO, better shifting, better chain, better ergos on the shifters and way better looking. You might want to use an XTR front der. though, that is something that shimano has perfected. By not using the shimano you also free up your brake choices.

  18. #18
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    SRAM is more expensive than XTR though?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    SRAM is more expensive than XTR though?
    On this side of the pond, top-end SRAM is generally somewhere between XT and XTR prices. Lets you get away from those terrible pod shifters, too

  20. #20
    Time is not a road.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pornstar69
    Thanks for the input guys, decided to go for the Epiphany. Build spec at the moment as follows what do you think?

    Not too sure about the use of carbon seatpost as Ive noticed most of the pics on here everyones using a Thompson. Would have liked the F100X forks instead but theres not enough travel for the Epiphany. I cant be bothered stopping to change travel nor using lockout? any better alternatives?

    Cheers
    You could go for an XTT fork or the Rock Shox Revelation with its Motion Control and Pop Lock would give you bar mounted control over the lockout. You could get the U-Turn option or not, just set it at 130mm. The damping of this fork is excellent and it offers more features than the Fox at a less expensive price point. It's just as close to the perfect fork as you can find.

    I use a Marzocchi All Mountain 1 on my Moment. It should come in a 110-130 model as well. An equally good fork with excellent features. I think the cost is more competative on that side of the Pond, too.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by chad1433
    You could go for an XTT fork or the Rock Shox Revelation with its Motion Control and Pop Lock would give you bar mounted control over the lockout. You could get the U-Turn option or not, just set it at 130mm. The damping of this fork is excellent and it offers more features than the Fox at a less expensive price point. It's just as close to the perfect fork as you can find.

    I use a Marzocchi All Mountain 1 on my Moment. It should come in a 110-130 model as well. An equally good fork with excellent features. I think the cost is more competative on that side of the Pond, too.
    Thx Chad, will look into the Revelations & the AM1's.

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