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  1. #1
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    Idea! Platform shock on an Id... is this heresy?

    I'm about to trade my Moment for an Id (wanna buy it?)... I need something that will climb better. And it dawned on me: what if I stuck a stable platform shock on an Id? Something thatt'll let me stomp out of the saddle without sucking energy into bouncing around?

    Anyone tried it? Does thinking this way mean I'm going to hell?

    I'm pulling the trigger on this Id Thursday night, so any ideas would be awfully helpful...

  2. #2
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    ID w/ RP3

    I bought my ID sans shock and installed a PUSHed RP3 on it. Rides fantastic - I think it climbs better than my old Turner O2. To be honest, I rarely switch between the 3 platform settings. Set the sag, dail in the rebound and forget it.

  3. #3
    Amphibious Technologies
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    Quote Originally Posted by SnowPup
    I bought my ID sans shock and installed a PUSHed RP3 on it. Rides fantastic - I think it climbs better than my old Turner O2. To be honest, I rarely switch between the 3 platform settings. Set the sag, dail in the rebound and forget it.
    I have a PUSH'd RP3 on my Id too (7 7/8"x 2.0"). Works great and platform helps a bit on long climbs. I agree that the Id climbs so well for a 5+" travel bike. I've been looking for an upgrade but can't seem to find other models that compare. I kinda like the relatively tall BB height. Keeps me from hitting my pedals on techy climbs.
    "The best you've ridden is the best you know" - Paul Thede, Race Tech

  4. #4
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrMountainHop
    I'm about to trade my Moment for an Id (wanna buy it?)... I need something that will climb better. And it dawned on me: what if I stuck a stable platform shock on an Id? Something thatt'll let me stomp out of the saddle without sucking energy into bouncing around?

    Anyone tried it? Does thinking this way mean I'm going to hell?

    I'm pulling the trigger on this Id Thursday night, so any ideas would be awfully helpful...
    You're going to a slightly lighter bike (maybe a pound lighter with the frame), but at the same time, a higher BB and center of gravity. You probably aren't going to see any improvement with your climbing. Doesn't the Id have shorter chainstays, or are they the same? If the stays are shorter you may also have a tougher time keeping the front end down on real steep climbs. I noticed a big difference in this when I switched from the shorter foes FXR to the longer turner 6pack. Other things like the weight made it a little harder to climb, but the front end staying down more made it easier. The problem doesn't seem to be the bike, but the rider. You've got to build up and get more powerfull, from the seated position. Too often we convince ourselves that we can't improve and that a certain climb is not possible except for in granny gear. Ride with a good singlespeeder and you'll see what is possible, if he can do it in 2:1 or 1.8:1, you can surely do it in the middle ring. Going to the Id doesn't sound like it's going to help your climbing much, too small of a weight change and the geometry might not be as good for climbing.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  5. #5
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    More than just climbing, handling too

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    You're going to a slightly lighter bike (maybe a pound lighter with the frame), but at the same time, a higher BB and center of gravity. You probably aren't going to see any improvement with your climbing. Doesn't the Id have shorter chainstays, or are they the same? If the stays are shorter you may also have a tougher time keeping the front end down on real steep climbs. I noticed a big difference in this when I switched from the shorter foes FXR to the longer turner 6pack. Other things like the weight made it a little harder to climb, but the front end staying down more made it easier. The problem doesn't seem to be the bike, but the rider. You've got to build up and get more powerfull, from the seated position. Too often we convince ourselves that we can't improve and that a certain climb is not possible except for in granny gear. Ride with a good singlespeeder and you'll see what is possible, if he can do it in 2:1 or 1.8:1, you can surely do it in the middle ring. Going to the Id doesn't sound like it's going to help your climbing much, too small of a weight change and the geometry might not be as good for climbing.
    I appreciate your analysis. This rider's ability to climb is pretty good. If anything, I need help with the descent, and here the Moment's stability and plush suspension has shown me I'm capable of much, much hairier speeds and drops than I ever thought. My desire for a bike that climbs well isn't to compensate for my shortcomings, but to allow me to enjoy a facet of the ride that I really like. I like to climb. Hammering out of the saddle is a useful tool, regardless of leg strength.

    The chainstays on the Id, according to Ellsworth's published specs, are in fact .15 inch shorter than the Moment's, with equivalent top tube length and head tube angle. So the geometry of the Id wouldn't seem substantially different in the climbing department.

    Seeing as the Epiphany is spec'd with a stable platform shock, I've got to think a stable platform shock would enhance my bike's climbing ability, Id or Moment. Reviewing these specs, I don't know that the Id would handle any quicker than the Moment.

    Thoughts?

  6. #6
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    The DHX air/coil are platform shocks. Those are perfect for your Moment.

  7. #7
    Time is not a road.
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    Right, don't you already have a platform shock on your Moment? In what way do you think that a platform will enhance climbing? The design is already pretty stable as it is. Going to custom valving, like with a Push mod, would have some benefits and losing some weight would as well. One of the best attributes of an RP3 is its low weight. It also has a micro-circuit that gives it more small bump compliance, so in that right it's superior to say a Float with Pro Pedal.

    It seems to me like you could simply change the build of your current bike to enhance it's climbing prowess or perhaps get a Truth so that you have two bikes that do different things (or wait for the Epiphany?). Many on here, I would imagine, will say that the overall geometry of the Moment is better than the Id and changing might not be the best option.

  8. #8
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    Duh! Pop a platform onto the [I]Moment...[/I]

    Quote Originally Posted by chad1433
    Right, don't you already have a platform shock on your Moment?

    It seems to me like you could simply change the build of your current bike to enhance it's climbing prowess... Many on here, I would imagine, will say that the overall geometry of the Moment is better than the Id and changing might not be the best option.
    My Moment came spec'd with the Float Custom Tune - no platform dampening. Last night was like a big duh! I thought, "Why not stick a platform shock on the Moment?" Duh!! My fork is too short, too (a Marz Marathon XC, 120mm). Last night I was dropping stairs and loading docks and bottoming the fork pretty hard.I'm gonna swap it for an Ellsworth-spec 130 or more - possibly a Vanilla. It stuck me that, counter-intuitively, a longer travel fork may steer quicker, for being a little "lighter" at the bar. Any thoughts?

    I have decided against "downgrading" to an Id. I am considering an Epiphany.... especially as my totally kick-ass LBS is working with me to knock some $$ off MSRP, seeing as I just completed an Ellsworth purchase.

  9. #9
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrMountainHop
    a longer travel fork may steer quicker, for being a little "lighter" at the bar. Any thoughts?
    It wont steer quicker. It will "feel" a bit ligher at the bars sometimes, making it easier to do wheelies and things like that, it will also make it wander a bit more on real steep climbs.

    If you are bottoming your marzocchi, you need to raise the oil level a bit, although a marathon is not the right fork for a moment
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  10. #10
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    For the Record Since I have both Frames!

    Don't be fooled!

    Both are awesome climbers no doubt about it, I can kick almost anyones butt esspecially when it gets technical steep and narly! And now I have my AM1 whew nothing stops me!

    But ya have to put it all in perspective, some climbing is all about technique, skills and just plain enjoying the climb, some definitely about the bike and then there is setup!

    The ID is way quicker handler than the Moment and is more responsive, this does not make the Moment bad just different the Moment is stable but needs more input but this dosen't make it slower either, maybe faster for some.

    The ID for me is a technical riders dream, its not for eveyone it rewards a skilled pilot with some stick, and isn't as forgiving when the shiat hits the fan but thats what makes it an exciting machine! It rewards the srong and punishes the weak

    Where as the Moment will save your bacon if ya get it wrong most times, but the Moment can climb with the best of them. The ID will be faster on any smooth long climbs like a fire road its lighter and snappier so tranlates to faster uphill no doubt about it, I jhave compared it many times.

    Technical slow climbing where traction is needed with the right fork (e.g ETA Marz) both these puppies will climb to the clouds if ya have the legs.

    The higher BB is dependant on the i2i shock you spec on the ID pre 04 came with the 7.785 i2i this produced quite a high BB compared to the competion in this catagory.
    Someone like myself saw this as a benefit not as a negitive its not for everyone and is a matter of rider style and confidence.

    The Moment can be built to shine in most areas the ID may have an advantage over but as a one bike the Moment is darn hard to beat in IMO and is probably a better option than the ID if you also like to go big some days she has more versatility and will last the test of time.

    For climbing it really comes down to how ya spec these bikes, component choice is critical and can change the personality of these machines big time, Ive gone through 3 major changes on my ID.

    Anyways its all realitive now the Epiphany is here so enjoy, my ID is a classic and I like it that way myself, less is more in this case!

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